[07:38] <knightwise> morning everyone
[07:45] <knightwise> they big day today eh !
[08:11] <bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
[08:55] <bigcalm> In Thunderbird, is there a quick way to turn on threading in all folders? I don't want to have to do it manually for several hundred folders myself
[08:56] <andylockran> morning sportsfans!
[08:57] <bigcalm> Hi andylockran
[08:57] <andylockran> how goes things?
[08:57] <bigcalm> Trying out a wrist brace, so hopefully a less painful day ahead :)
[08:57] <bigcalm> You?
[09:08] <andylockran> Cycled in for the first time in over a week; London was looking particularly 1880s this morning
[09:08] <andylockran> fog on the water and very cool
[09:09] <bigcalm> I'm a fan of foggy mornings. Travelling to work is something that I miss. Making do with looking at it out of my window
[09:18] <JamesTait> Good morning, people! :-D
[09:18] <bigcalm> Morning JamesTait
[09:18] <JamesTait> bigcalm, and in one simple sentence you've convinced me that you're insane. :-P
[09:19] <JamesTait> Actually it was three sentences, but whatever. ;)
[09:20] <JamesTait> How are you, bigcalm? Apart from bonkers, that is. :-P
[09:20] <bigcalm> JamesTait: I'm trying to work out which 3 sentences make me insane :)
[09:20] <JamesTait> 09:09 < bigcalm> I'm a fan of foggy mornings. Travelling to work is something that I miss. Making do with looking at it out of my window
[09:21] <JamesTait> I'm looking at it out of my window and thinking "I'm glad I don't have to go out in that to get to work". ;)
[09:21] <bigcalm> Hehe
[09:21] <bigcalm> I drove to work in a warm car in the past :)
[09:21] <JamesTait> Horses, courses, etc.
[09:22] <JamesTait> And now?
[09:25] <bigcalm> JamesTait: I work from home
[09:26] <JamesTait> bigcalm, I gathered that much. ;) I was expecting you to say something like "Instead of my warm car, I work from a cold shed with no heating." :-P
[09:27] <bigcalm> Heh
[09:27] <bigcalm> I do indeed enjoy my cosy office. Helps having a cat to keep your lap warm now and then
[09:32] <knightwise> crap
[09:32] <knightwise> anyone know how "reconfigure" sendmail ?
[09:33] <knightwise> like "re-run" the wizzard screen you get in the beginning ?
[09:33] <directhex> you don't. sendmail is an abomination from the 1980s
[09:33] <dwatkins> knightwise: dpkg --reconfigure sendmail?
[09:33] <directhex> however, if you insist, dpkg-reconfigure -plow sendmail
[09:33] <dwatkins> ah yes
[09:37] <knightwise> unknown option reconfigure ? ? ,
[09:39] <dwatkins> sorry, my bad - I misremembered the syntax
[09:39] <dwatkins> directhex is correct, knightwise
[09:39] <knightwise> thanx.
[09:41] <JamesTait> bigcalm, I do appreciate the odd visit from my cats, but not when it's the litter tray they're visiting.
[09:41] <bigcalm> Heh
[09:42] <bigcalm> JamesTait: we're still renting, otherwise I'd have a cat flap installed. Kitties should be free to come and go I think
[09:42] <JamesTait> The triumphant look as they turn away, no doubt thinking to themselves "I'll just leave that with you then."
[09:44] <JamesTait> bigcalm, I totally agree, they're outdoor animals. But we did it wrong somewhere along the way, and our cats like the indoors, get curious about the outdoors, but get lost and scared when they go out there. :(
[09:44] <dwatkins> bigcalm: could you install one temporarily with cable-ties or something?
[09:44] <directhex> we have an exclusively indoor cat
[09:45] <bigcalm> dwatkins: eh? How would that work? One has to cut a hole in the door
[09:45] <bigcalm> Have Valve been adding more games to the Linux discount section?
[09:46] <dwatkins> bigcalm: just musing about using a window or something
[09:46]  * bigcalm grumbles as he forks out another 16 quid
[09:46] <dwatkins> heh
[09:47] <JamesTait> directhex, we have five exclusively indoor cats (well, exclusive apart from the occasions when they sneak out of on open door, whereupon the aforementioned "lost and scared" routine kicks in) and one outdoor cat, who has commandeered the garage.
[09:48]  * dwatkins wonders how long it'll be until there are games exclusively for linux on Steam and how much of an uproar this might cause
[09:48] <bigcalm> That's a lot of kittie litter!
[09:48] <bigcalm> dwatkins: Tux Racer?
[09:48] <bigcalm> Aww, not on steam ;)
[09:49] <dwatkins> bigcalm: games which people would pay for :-p
[09:49] <directhex> dwatkins, it won't happen unless someone is trying to make a statement
[09:49] <directhex> dwatkins, there are some games with linux but not mac ports though
[09:49] <dwatkins> directhex: yeah, true - I hope it doesn't in a sense, and that Wall three OSs can compete fairly and on an exual footing
[09:49] <dwatkins> *equal
[09:49] <directhex> but the only game on steam not available for windows is Call of Duty: Black Ops - Mac Edition
[09:50] <dwatkins> that's kinda understandable
[09:50] <dwatkins> not sure why they had to make a separate version, mind
[09:50] <directhex> money.
[09:50] <directhex> it's the only non-steamplay game for mac
[09:51] <directhex> the game, and the dlc for it, cost different amounts to the PC game
[09:51] <dwatkins> silly DLC
[10:02] <bigcalm> At 3.8MB/s, this is obviously the right time of day to be installing games on Steam
[10:02] <bigcalm> My storage does not look forward to the day VirginMedia upgrades my cable connection
[10:05] <BigRedS> it is never the right time of day to install games on steam
[10:05] <BigRedS> the steam servers are connected to the internet with a bit of wet string.
[10:06] <bigcalm> It's maxing my connection while fetching Serious Sam 3
[10:06] <BigRedS> oh!
[10:06] <BigRedS> It took about a week for me to get serious sam
[10:06] <bigcalm> I wonder at what point VirginMedia will cap my ass. I mean bandwidth
[10:06] <mungbean> virgin media fail
[10:06] <bigcalm> How?
[10:07] <directhex> i get a good 8M down via wired, and 200k via wireless
[10:07] <directhex> i don't think steam linux linux wireless
[10:07] <BigRedS> just by being on Virgin I'd imagine
[10:09] <bigcalm> When it works, it works well. I complain a lot less about VM these days :)
[10:09] <bigcalm> Oh no. Sudden urge for a sausage and egg bap with brown sauce
[10:09]  * bigcalm looks at his banana
[10:09] <neuro> NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
[10:10] <neuro> mad craving for roll and square sausage initiated!!
[10:10] <bigcalm> Is the urge infectious?
[10:10]  * Myrtti makes poached eggs, scrambled eggs, warms up some baked beans, fries some mushrooms with garlic, pops the kettle on, slaps some sausages on the Foreman and puts the toasts down
[10:10] <neuro> THE URGE
[10:10] <neuro> Myrtti: pics or it didn't happen
[10:10] <bigcalm> Heh, odd
[10:11] <Myrtti> neuro: might skip mushrooms and beans today tbh
[10:11] <neuro> all i've had this morning is a bowl of froot loops about 4 hrs ago
[10:11] <neuro> Myrtti: i believe you are food trolling us
[10:12] <Myrtti> okok, hold on, I'll finish what I'm doing now and go make it and put some pictures up
[10:12] <neuro> NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
[10:14] <neuro> right, that's it, don't care if my phone says it's -3C outside, i'm going to out to get some sausages!!!
[10:14] <popey> Morning
[10:14] <neuro> is it?
[10:14] <neuro> IS IT?
[10:14] <neuro> oh, it is
[10:14] <neuro> SAUSAGES!
[10:15] <SuperMatt> Does anyone think the unity messaging menu would be a good place for a nagios monitor?
[10:15] <popey> i see steam now has an indicator \o/
[10:15] <andylockran> woop
[10:16] <SuperMatt> yuppers
[10:20] <popey> pffft, Lume is a flash game
[10:20] <bigcalm> Yup
[10:20] <popey> ah well, at least they bothered to """port""" it ☺
[10:22] <andylockran> IS zombies versus plants available?
[10:23] <SuperMatt> not yet
[10:23] <SuperMatt> at least, not that I've seen
[10:23] <mungbean> is plants/zombies the same game as that flash one?
[10:24] <SuperMatt> I think so
[10:24] <mungbean> i.e. lame after 1 minute
[10:24] <SuperMatt> I don't know about that
[10:24] <SuperMatt> it's kinda fun
[10:24] <mungbean> must be a different game then
[10:25] <SuperMatt> http://static-www.ec.popcap.com/www.popcap.com/sites/www.popcap.com/files/games/pvz/screenshots/pvz3.jpg < this one
[10:27] <mungbean> yeah that one :S
[10:30] <directhex> i don't know if popcap will get on board
[10:30] <directhex> iirc ea own them now
[10:30] <dwatkins> EA are just in it for the money
[10:31] <directhex> which means they need a business case for every "port" no matter how trivial
[10:34] <dwatkins> Their customer service is legendary in its awfulness.
[10:35] <dwatkins> Perhaps if they move to subscription-based gaming it'll improve...
[10:36] <SuperMatt> but didn't ea say two years ago that they're dedicated to bringing games to linux?
[10:36] <SuperMatt> I mean, sure, they only release two html games into software centre, and did nothing after that, but surely their words speak louder than their actions
[10:37] <directhex> EA will not be the first current gen AAA publisher to ship linux binaries.
[10:37] <directhex> i reckon activision will be.
[10:38] <directhex> meanwhile the scale of the indies releasing to steam will get bigger, and there'll be some B-tier publishers like paradox doing linux a lot more
[10:38] <directhex> sega will be on board soon
[10:38] <directhex> in a small way anyway
[10:39] <popey> maybe my prediction will be right then ☺
[10:39] <directhex> hm?
[10:39] <directhex> which prediction?
[10:39] <popey> I predicted at the end of last year that "Number of Linux Games on Steam will increase from 1.8% to 20% of Windows games by end of 2013"
[10:40] <directhex> i don't see 20% by the end of 2013
[10:40] <directhex> but i guarantee 50% of the top 10 most popular games by the end of 2013
[10:40] <andylockran> just over 5h to the tablet announcement
[10:41] <popey> \o/
[10:41] <andylockran> is there an #ubuntutabletreleaseparty channel?
[10:41] <directhex> indies will continue to show interest. many existing games won't get shipped there though, e.g. trine 1
[10:41] <popey> #ubuntu-tablet has existed for about a year
[10:41] <dwatkins> an Ubuntu table? that would be awesome... ;)
[10:41] <SuperMatt> has anyone in here checked the ubuntu subreddit this week?
[10:41] <bigcalm> I wonder if it'll be an HTC tablet ;)
[10:41] <SuperMatt> since thursday the number of posts EXPLODED
[10:41] <directhex> i'd like dungeon defenders to ship, it's useless without the ability to play with my steam friends
[10:42] <mungbean> SuperMatt: was thuyrsday the steam client release?
[10:42] <SuperMatt> yup
[10:42] <dwatkins> exploded? Became very popular?
[10:43] <SuperMatt> yup
[10:43] <andylockran> anyone fancy a spread on how long it'll take (from release) for the ubuntu phone image to work on devices other than the pre-announced 2?
[10:43] <popey> depends..
[10:43] <popey> you talking about additional images from us, or external community ports?
[10:44] <SuperMatt> I would love to use it on my s3
[10:44] <daubers> andylockran: Which are the 2 pre-announced?
[10:44] <popey> daubers: GN and N4
[10:45] <daubers> Ah, the google phones then
[10:45] <SuperMatt> yuppers
[10:45] <mungbean> does anyone (directhex) know if the HP touchpad can display on a HDMI monitor via the usb port?
[10:46] <daubers> I'm tentativley waiting to see what it's like to see if its worth me shifting my (very android embedded) phone/tablet platform
[10:46] <directhex> doubt it
[10:46] <popey> yeah not yet
[10:46] <popey> its a developer preview
[10:46] <popey> not a daily use phone OS yet
[10:47] <popey> although I believe Mark has it as his daily phone
[10:47] <SuperMatt> it's be rude not to
[10:47] <popey> hope he doesn't leave it in a bar
[10:47] <SuperMatt> hah
[10:47] <SuperMatt> but then you could sue gizmodo
[10:48] <daubers> If it means I can ditch java, I'll be a happy bunny indeed
[10:48] <dwatkins> Java is used on too many servers, imho.
[10:49] <SuperMatt> I think java is going to die a death, like flash, but it's going to be a lot slower
[10:49] <SuperMatt> and we all know that the flash death has been painfully slow already
[10:49] <mgdm> I don't think they're the same at all
[10:49] <mgdm> sure, flash in browsers is dying
[10:49] <mgdm> err, Java
[10:49] <mgdm> but it never really took off. On server-side apps though Java and especially the JVM is still very much a hot topic
[10:50] <SuperMatt> agreed
[10:50] <AlanBell> java on servers will die like windows on servers
[10:50] <SuperMatt> I was mostly refering to in the browser
[10:50] <directhex> with java and flash gone, vrml will rise!
[10:50] <dwatkins> SuperMatt: yeah, it's just a shame it's still there
[10:50] <AlanBell> very very very slowly, everyone will know it is a bad idea, but a bit too invested in it to change
[10:50] <dwatkins> I'm a bit concerned that HTML5 will end up being ridden with binary issues due to DRM, too.
[10:51]  * AlanBell likes vrml
[10:51] <mgdm> until people figure out a replacement for, say, Lucene based stuff like Solr and ElasticSearch, Java is not going anywhere
[10:51] <SuperMatt> You know, I don't mind DRM being put in to HTML5. As long as chrome or firefox support it, I'll be able to see DRMed content without having to install a plugin and/or dropping in to windows
[10:52] <bigcalm> But what language should Minecraft be ported to?
[10:52] <dwatkins> SuperMatt: I suspect most DRM will be Windows and Mac only even with HTML5.
[10:52] <dwatkins> and there's no change of an ARM port
[10:52] <dwatkins> *chance
[10:52] <SuperMatt> dwatkins: but how? If the browser has stuff built in for handling the drm, then everything *should* be fine
[10:52] <dwatkins> SuperMatt: the problem is the DRM stuff can't be open source
[10:53] <AlanBell> l
[10:53] <AlanBell> oops
[10:54] <SuperMatt> dwatkins: of course, you're right there
[10:54] <SuperMatt> but I imagine that any work google or firefox would do ensure their browsers work, would be ported to linux
[10:55] <AlanBell> it isn't about open source or software freedom
[10:55] <popey> bigcalm: objective c!
[10:55] <dwatkins> for the larger providers, I imagine so, but there will be other sites which require DRM which will not bother porting to Linux
[10:55] <popey> (already done for Minecraft PE on iOS)
[10:55] <AlanBell> compiling stuff is just for obfuscation
[10:55] <AlanBell> for DRM
[10:55] <AlanBell> it could be written in javascript, the only problem is that more people understand javascript than assembler
[10:56] <dwatkins> yeah, and the keys are easier to extract
[10:57] <dwatkins> ultimately it comes down to the rights owners insisting their content be protected from being given away, played after a certain time etc.
[10:57] <dwatkins> so even the BBC has to implement DRM so that doesn't happen
[10:57] <popey> directhex: do you have any experience of using console controllers with steam games?
[10:58] <SuperMatt> I do
[10:58] <popey> also, on linux
[10:58] <SuperMatt> the xbox one works nicely
[10:58] <dwatkins> popey: I've used my xbox 360 controller on a few Steam games
[10:58] <SuperMatt> I haven't tried 6axis
[10:58]  * popey has a gamecube one on usb
[10:58] <popey> how do you hook up the xbox one?
[10:58] <davmor2> Morning all
[10:58] <mgdm> Xbox ones are USB with a different connector, IIRC - I thnk you get adapters
[10:58] <SuperMatt> my xbox one is usb
[10:58] <popey> eh, 360 is wireless
[10:58] <directhex> popey, i use a 360 controller on windows
[10:58] <Paladine> popey, I launched my podcast, my god it is hard work, how long does it take to get the process down pat?
[10:59] <SuperMatt> popey: you can buy wired ones, that's what I use
[10:59] <popey> ahhh
[10:59] <popey> directhex: how is it connected?
[10:59] <popey> Paladine: there's four of us which makes it easier
[10:59] <dwatkins> popey: yeah, sorry - I use a wired one
[10:59] <popey> Paladine: and we do it live, and don't edit after
[10:59] <Paladine> took me a full day to do a 33 minute episode
[10:59] <brobostigon> morning everyone.
[11:00] <popey> Paladine: yeah, our first episode took all day to record and another day to edit
[11:00] <BigRedS> good morning!
[11:00] <popey> which is why we don't do that anymore
[11:00] <davmor2> popey: there is a nice ps3 remote app on lp that will connect a remote
[11:00] <Paladine> yeah mine is pre-recorded so I have to do a lot of post recording editing
[11:00] <popey> we pre-record interviews, but "as live"
[11:00] <popey> i.e. if you fluff your line, just carry on
[11:00] <Paladine> I had a 17 minute interview in my first episode
[11:01] <Paladine> and I have committed myself to releasing a new ep each week, which may have been a mistake lol
[11:01] <bigcalm> So this is likely to work with Steam games? http://www.amazon.co.uk/Microsoft-Xbox-Common-Controller-Windows/dp/B004JU0JSK/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1361271670&sr=8-3
[11:02] <SuperMatt> for sure
[11:02]  * popey adds to wishlist
[11:02] <SuperMatt> I would definitely suggest an official xbox controller
[11:02] <popey> thanks chaps
[11:02] <bigcalm> popey: There's a wireless version http://www.amazon.co.uk/Microsoft-Xbox-Wireless-Controller-Windows/dp/B004JU0JSA/ref=pd_cp_vg_h__2
[11:02] <bigcalm> popey: don't know if that'll work without faffing though
[11:02] <popey> been mashing the keyboard playing Titan Attacks
[11:03] <bigcalm> Titan Attacks doesn't work for me :'(
[11:03] <popey> should work, it's got a dongle with it
[11:03] <popey> prefer one without wires
[11:03] <mungbean> my joulo came today
[11:04] <popey> Paladine: we're moving to recording every other week, and putting a show out weekly
[11:04] <popey> so record for 1 hours, but put out half our each week
[11:04] <popey> mungbean: yay
[11:04] <mgdm> popey: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xbox_360_accessories#Wireless_Gaming_Receiver
[11:04] <Paladine> popey, cool. I am doing an extended one at the end of each month with a co-presenter
[11:05] <Paladine> the hardest part for me was deciding what issues to cover, certainly no danger of not being enough content
[11:05] <Paladine> I had to cut 3 issues from the final recording
[11:05] <bigcalm> Rjd2 \o/
[11:08] <directhex> popey, the specific "xbox 360 wireless controller for windows" boxes contain a wireless pad, and a USB dongle (capable of tracking up to 4 pads), for the same price as a wireless pad on its own
[11:11] <Myrtti> neuro: http://www.flickr.com/photos/myrtti/8487962247/
[11:12] <dwatkins> AlanBell: there's an article on hackaday right now relevant to our previous discussion in a sense
[11:12] <dwatkins> the HDMI one
[11:12] <popey> thanks directhex
[11:12] <SuperMatt> ok, since the indicator whitelist has been removed, how do we get a skype indicator?
[11:16] <mungbean> directhex: see my question about hp touchpad?
[11:19] <popey> skype works here SuperMatt
[11:19] <popey> it's right next to my steam indicator :D
[11:20] <SuperMatt> are you on u+1?
[11:20] <popey> I am on raring
[11:20] <SuperMatt> what method did you use to install it?
[11:20] <popey> install what?
[11:20] <SuperMatt> skype
[11:20] <SuperMatt> software centre or download?
[11:20] <popey> well, I have a deb installed
[11:20] <popey> ii  skype          4.1.0.20.0-0 amd64        client for Skype VOIP and instant
[11:21] <brobostigon> i suspect skype is in the partner repos.?
[11:21] <popey> alan@deep-thought:~/Downloads$ ls -ltrha skype*
[11:21] <popey> -rw-rw-r-- 1 alan alan  28M Jun 14  2012 skype-ubuntu_4.0.0.7-1_amd64.deb
[11:21] <popey> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1681424/
[11:22] <popey> ^^ partner repo
[11:23] <SuperMatt> huh, partner repo wasn't enabled for me
[11:23] <popey> once the car is MoT'd I have permission to buy a new telly
[11:23] <SuperMatt> \o/
[11:23] <brobostigon> as in "deb http://archive.canonical.com/ubuntu buntycodename partner"
[11:24] <SuperMatt> yup
[11:24] <brobostigon> missed out a / after ubuntu.
[11:25] <popey> well, you can just search for skype in usc and it should do all that for you
[11:26] <SuperMatt> now I have a proper indicator \o/
[11:26] <SuperMatt> thanks dudes :>
[11:26] <popey> \o/
[11:26] <brobostigon> o/
[11:26] <bigcalm> Hazzar
[11:26] <brobostigon> \o/
[11:28] <popey> http://eu.fab.com/sale/5490/product/83564/
[11:28] <popey> bet sophie would like one in her room
[11:29] <popey> but not at 150 notes
[11:29] <mgdm> IIRC, IKEA do something sort-of similar
[11:29] <mgdm> probably not quite 150 notes
[11:33] <neuro> Myrtti: i just had two rolls with square and links sausage, and a lovely mug of fresh soup
[11:34] <neuro> but your cup of tea looks nice :)
[11:34] <dwatkins> mmm, tea
[11:35] <popey> oh golly Myrtti looks nom
[11:36] <popey> is that a poached egg?
[11:36] <neuro> popey: just reading back about joypads
[11:36] <neuro> you defo want the windows one with the usb>wireless doobrie
[11:36] <Myrtti> popey: indeed it is.
[11:36] <neuro> i'd recommend getting a play'n'charge kit
[11:36] <neuro> a rechargeable battery pack with a 3m usb charging cable
[11:37] <popey> ooh
[11:37] <neuro> if you don't care about wireless, there's a wired windows x360 joypad with a similarly long usb cable
[11:38] <neuro> if you ever find yourself playing windows games, you may find they have specific modes to cater for the x360 pad
[11:38] <neuro> i noticed crisis 3 actually brings up the A/B/X/Y buttons on screen when using it
[11:40] <kaushal> Hi
[11:40] <kaushal> is there a way to remember subject line in chrome browser for gmail?
[11:40] <neuro> remember the subject line?
[11:40] <kaushal> i have enabled autofill but somehow it does not cache the subject line
[11:40] <kaushal> neuro: yeah
[11:40] <neuro> autofill is for regularly used personal details
[11:41] <kaushal> meaning similar subject content
[11:42] <kaushal> For example when i raise a support email which has constant subject line has "Cust ID :- 1424 ....."
[11:42] <neuro> just hit reply?
[11:42] <kaushal> neuro: can it be handled in chrome or firefox browser on Ubuntu 11.10
[11:42] <neuro> or am i missing something
[11:42] <kaushal> neuro: I am composing a new email
[11:43] <neuro> knowing the context might be useful in suggesting a solution :)
[11:43] <kaushal> neuro: ok
[11:44] <kaushal> neuro: so usually i write email to Data Center support team with the same subject line ""Cust ID :- 1424 PIN xxxx"
[11:44] <neuro> oh, i see
[11:44] <kaushal> i do not have to keep writing again and again
[11:44] <mgdm> 'plz to reboot server kthx'
[11:45] <mgdm> 'plz to reboot correct server this time kthx'
[11:45] <kaushal> if it is cached it saves time
[11:45] <neuro> go to settings
[11:45] <neuro> click labs
[11:45] <neuro> enable Canned Responses
[11:45] <kaushal> neuro: ok
[11:45]  * popey wondrs if that was a neuro canned response
[11:45] <popey> +e
[11:45] <neuro> :)
[11:46] <neuro> I don't know what you're talking about
[11:46] <popey> neuro: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Duracell-Play-Charge-Kit-Black/dp/B003ZUPLGK/ref=pd_ecc_rvi_cart_4
[11:46] <popey> that?
[11:46] <neuro> I don't know what you're talking about
[11:46] <popey> 11:36:35 < neuro> i'd recommend getting a play'n'charge kit
[11:46] <neuro> I don't know what you're talking about
[11:46] <popey> ahhh
[11:46] <popey> i see
[11:47] <neuro> :)
[11:47] <neuro> http://www.amazon.co.uk/Play-Charge-Kit-Black-Xbox/dp/B003VD56K2
[11:47] <neuro> that's the kosher one
[11:47] <neuro> you probably want that
[11:47] <neuro> it's cheaper too
[11:47] <popey> ta
[11:47] <dwatkins> thanks for reminding me, I need a new battery/play'n'charge kit
[11:47] <neuro> i only got mine last year after rattling through AAs for five years
[11:48] <dwatkins> My C3PO controller uses up AA batteries, which is probably slightly worse for the environment than a rechargeable battery.
[11:48] <neuro> also got myself a 3m USB>Mini-USB cable for my PS3 controller
[11:48] <neuro> does your c3po controller get all prissy and upset when you change batteries?
[11:49] <neuro> "wait, what have you done, you great furry oaf, you've put the batteries in BACKWARDS!"
[11:52] <bigcalm> Heh
[12:08] <davmor2> So I got skyfall, it reminds me of from russia with love, lots of guns and fights very little tech.  I loved it :)
[12:09]  * mungbean waits for it to be on telly
[12:10] <MartijnVdS> davmor2: also, the actor who plays Bond now looks a lot like Putin imho
[12:11] <MartijnVdS> davmor2: http://www.sofeminine.co.uk/celebrities/album882056/celebrity-look-alikes-stars-and-their-doppelgangers-22026454.html
[12:12] <andylockran> ooh, the ubuntu page has switched to a ticking timer
[12:12] <andylockran> davmor2: I hated skyfall
[12:13] <andylockran> :(
[12:13] <popey> http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn23183-3dprinting-pen-turns-doodles-into-sculptures.html
[12:13] <popey> cunning
[12:13]  * bigcalm turns noodles into lunch
[12:14] <popey> http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1351910088/3doodler-the-worlds-first-3d-printing-pen
[12:16] <davmor2> popey: oooohhhhhhhh
[12:19] <popey> haha, trending towards half a million USD
[12:19] <popey> http://www.kicktraq.com/projects/1351910088/3doodler-the-worlds-first-3d-printing-pen/
[12:24] <BigRedS> Anyone know where Zimbra stores its list of banned file extensions? My google-fu is failing
[12:26] <MartijnVdS> AlanBell will know
[12:26] <AlanBell> no idea, don't use zimbra
[12:27] <AlanBell> we don't really support email systems, people get all upset about them failing, and they want it all to be free
[12:27] <BigRedS> haha
[12:27] <BigRedS> yeah, we get a lot of that "But Gmail is free!" "okay, use Gmail"
[12:30] <DJones> I'm getting fed up with the MS info emails/spam (delete as applicable) about hotmail becoming outlook.com and messenger being rolled into skype, its a good job I only use my hotmail account for signing up to things I expect to get spam from
[12:31] <popey> i used mailinator the other day for that, works well
[12:34] <DJones> Thats quite a good idea
[12:36]  * DJones checks cia@mailinator.com
[13:19] <awilkins> I had expected this channel to be a hotbed of tablet speculation
[13:19] <andylockran> paracetamol/ibuprofen?
[13:19] <awilkins> Tick, tock, tablet time!   http://www.ubuntu.com/
[13:19] <popey> we did that yesterday awilkins ☺
[13:19] <awilkins> Bah
[13:20] <awilkins> Yesterday I had to pick up the exploded pieces of servers
[13:20] <popey> feel free to continue the speculation
[13:20] <popey> less than 3 hours to go
[13:21] <awilkins> ICT have also decided it's a great idea for our windows desktops to only listen to localhost for services
[13:21] <awilkins> Including Remote Desktop
[13:21] <awilkins> (d'oh)
[13:21] <mgdm> haha
[13:21] <awilkins> Also including IIS, file sharing, NAT ports on virtual servers
[13:21] <awilkins> And the TCP ports on our desktop management tools and remote support VNC servers
[13:21] <mgdm> :-D
[13:22] <mgdm> do you get to explain why that's really not that great an idea?
[13:22] <awilkins> I get the security angle. But it's like the adage that the only secure computer is one that's powered off in your filing cabinet. It's not useful.
[13:23] <popey> http://techcrunch.com/2013/02/19/htc-one-final-press-images-leak-ahead-of-todays-launch-event/
[13:23] <awilkins> I filled in a support ticket. I suppose my opinion probably carries a bit more weight now so when that fails to bear fruit I can make disgruntled noises at the security manager
[13:24] <awilkins> Ooh, 64GB storage option
[13:24] <awilkins> Wonder how rootable it is
[13:24]  * awilkins is in the market for a new phone because his N900 is lovely but the software doesn't really cut it anymore
[13:28] <funkychic> funkychic
[13:29] <funkychic> hey
[13:29] <mgdm> http://i.imgur.com/ABBpg64.png oh hello :-)
[13:30] <dwatkins> now only 2.5 hours to go :)
[13:30] <awilkins> Ubuntablet! Tabluntu!
[13:30] <dwatkins> htcbuntu!
[13:31] <awilkins> Take one letter out of that and you have a dangerously bad product name
[13:32] <dwatkins> touchbuntu would be pretty bad too, combining the HTC Touch interface with Ubuntu
[13:35] <awilkins> I was hoping it was just "Ubuntu for Nexus 7". Which would give me an excuse to get one.
[13:35] <awilkins> But I think someone already did that
[13:37] <andylockran> awilkins: can you run an ssh tunnel out of the machine for rdp?
[13:37] <dwatkins> it might be specifically modified for a tablet, though, which would be neat
[13:37] <awilkins> andylockran, Dunno. Synergy works fine - so it's not all servers
[13:38] <awilkins> Actually, Synergy is the client in this case
[13:38] <awilkins> Doh
[13:39] <DJones> The one thing that puts me off having an Ubuntu tablet is that if I had a tablet, one reason to use it would be to have SkyGo on it, but SkyGo doesn't work on Ubuntu, but does on selected Andrid tablets
[13:39] <popey> ..yet..
[13:40] <awilkins> Is SkyGo Skype Wifi?
[13:40] <popey> same could be said for (insert_name_of_killer_app) by anyone really
[13:40] <popey> no, Sky TV
[13:40] <awilkins> Ah.
[13:40] <Myrtti> DJones: or Netflix, or whatnots
[13:40] <dwatkins> Angry Birds
[13:40] <awilkins> Netflix would be nice
[13:40] <ubuntubhoy> I want ubuntu Tablet to finally get touchscreen working as it should on my netbook
[13:40] <awilkins> My main motivation for any tablet would be Netflix
[13:40] <dwatkins> a tablety isn't considered ready for the mainstream until Angry Birds runs on it
[13:40] <dwatkins> *tablet
[13:41] <SuperMatt> rofl
[13:41] <bigcalm> I thought Angry Birds ran on everything
[13:41] <SuperMatt> technically yes
[13:41] <dwatkins> everything people buy in large numbers, bigcalm ;)
[13:41] <popey> everything that currently exists on the market, yes
[13:41] <mgdm> it doesn't run on my C64 :(
[13:41]  * DJones hopes popey's ..yet.. is a sign that Sky & Canonical are working on something
[13:41] <popey> mgdm: sounds like a challenge
[13:41] <dwatkins> mgdm: perhaps not, but Doom does
[13:41] <bigcalm> Hehe
[13:42] <shauno> it really needs a netbsd port so I can install angry birds on my microwave
[13:42] <popey> DJones: no, a sign that I wouldn't write off a tablet platform _before_ it's out
[13:42] <dwatkins> as does Guitar Hero ;)
[13:42] <awilkins> I'm guessing it's more of a political challenge than a technical one
[13:42] <popey> Note Unity3D now exports to Linux, Android (as well as iOS, Xbox, wii, PS3, Windows)..
[13:42] <awilkins> Like Netflix clearly works on Linux because Android runs it, but they won't release a Linux desktop client
[13:42] <SuperMatt> and chromebooks can run it
[13:43] <mgdm> dwatkins: \o/
[13:43] <popey> AIUI chrome browser can use it too
[13:43] <popey> not just chromebooks
[13:43] <dwatkins> this reminds me, I should install Mame and get my Competition Pro joystick out of storage
[13:43] <DJones> popey: Ah, I'm not writing it off, it would be a difficult choice of which to get in an Android/Ubuntu tablet
[13:44] <DJones> I would prefer an Ubuntu tablet by choice for consistency
[13:44] <popey> \o/ mame
[13:44] <dwatkins> I've not used Mame in a while, will it run ok on 64-bit Ubuntu on my core2duo quad-core machine? ;)
[13:44] <awilkins> MAME with Marble Madness as the killer app for tablet accellerometers
[13:44] <dwatkins> seriously, will it be alright on a 64-bit system?
[13:45] <popey> hmm, nope, netflix doesn't work in chrome on ubuntu ☹
[13:46] <DJones> !netflix
[13:46] <awilkins> popey, There's a PPA which bundles all the Wine gubbins you need to make it work
[13:46] <dwatkins> popey: even with wine?
[13:46] <awilkins> The Wine thing uses Xulrunner AFAIK
[13:46] <awilkins> Or maybe just firefox
[13:47] <DJones> The bots link uses a customised version of wine from memory
[13:47] <popey> yeah, i was trying without wine
[13:47] <dwatkins> I thought Netflix required Silverlight.
[13:47] <DJones> I can't remember seeing anybody mention having any success without wine
[13:47] <dwatkins> I'm guessing there's no native Silverlight for Ubuntu.
[13:47] <mungbean> dwatkins: how does it work on chromebook?
[13:48] <dwatkins> mungbean: oh, didn't know it did, interesting...
[13:48] <popey> it uses flash on a chromebook
[13:49]  * dwatkins is saying nothing about Flash 
[13:49] <funkychic> hey
[13:49] <dwatkins> hi funkychic
[13:49] <popey> hello
[13:49] <funkychic> hey
[13:49] <davmor2> popey: I'm betting it is a heavily moded version which would explain google taking ownership of it for them and errrrr linux
[13:49] <funkychic> what are u doing
[13:49] <funkychic> guys
[13:50] <mungbean> not sure if hexxeh's chromium builds support it
[13:50] <ubuntubhoy> nope
[13:50]  * dwatkins is working, honest
[13:50] <ubuntubhoy> no mp3 in his builds now
[13:50] <ubuntubhoy> or any external plugins
[13:50] <funkychic> bye
[13:50] <dwatkins> was it something we said?
[13:50] <funkychic> im going now to add more chat stuff
[13:54] <AlanBell> bug 1130121
[13:54] <AlanBell> ooh, title is backwards
[13:55] <AlanBell> no, that is right
[14:02] <awilkins> There is Moonlight for Ubuntu, but MS refuse to license the DRM component
[14:02] <awilkins> Hence no Netflix compatible *light plugin
[14:02] <dwatkins> sounds like the shape of things to come with HTML5 DRM.
[14:04] <directhex> moonlight died years ago
[14:05] <awilkins> Probably because it had no DRM :-)... Silverlight is pretty dead also
[14:05] <awilkins> Only Netflix and MS Press Releases use it AFAIK
[14:05] <popey> nope
[14:05] <dwatkins> probably why they're trying to get DRM into HTML5
[14:05] <popey> lots of people use it
[14:05] <popey> sadly
[14:06] <awilkins> popey, I guess I just don't frequent those kinds of websites :)
[14:06] <dwatkins> thing is, there's not much of an alternative as far as I can tell
[14:06] <dwatkins> for DRM'ed content, that is - although personally I think they should just stop using DRM entirely
[14:06] <directhex> awilkins, silverlight largely failed to take off. but it didn't help that it was basically a half dozen paid employees and zero open source community people trying to reimplement the work of hundreds
[14:07] <mungbean> "That’s because while Netflix is a web app (just like YouTube and Amazon Instant Video), the company relies on Google Native Client software to stream video to Chrome OS devices. But right now Native Client doesn’t support ARM-based chips."
[14:07] <popey> it uses flash on the arm chromebook
[14:10] <mungbean> why can't we get the google client running on ubuntu then?
[14:10] <directhex> special libnetflixlala.so plugin
[14:11] <directhex> locked to chomebook devices
[14:11] <mungbean> scumbag netflix
[14:11] <dwatkins> Netflix are just doing what they can to adhere to the licenses they have with the content providers.
[14:12] <awilkins> Indeed. Scumbag MAFIAA
[14:12] <dwatkins> i.e. restrict access
[14:12] <awilkins> I'm sure Netflix would LOVE more customers
[14:12] <awilkins> They don't lose out from having 5% larger potential customer pool
[14:12] <mungbean> whats the difference between ubuntu client and chromebook client?
[14:13] <awilkins> There isn't an Ubuntu client
[14:13] <dwatkins> indeed, awilkins - I had a similar discussion recently about the youtube 'Smurf' bug, in that the Linux desktop market is too small for it to get fixed
[14:13] <mungbean> "potential" ubuntu client
[14:13] <mungbean> dwatkins: its fixed
[14:13] <mungbean> it was a nvidia bug
[14:13] <awilkins> dwatkins, Yes, I think it's fixed too
[14:13] <dwatkins> mungbean: it was? wow
[14:13] <awilkins> Although I may not have re-enabled hardware accel yet
[14:14] <mungbean> only affected nvidia proprietary driver
[14:14] <awilkins> Aha, my /etc/adobe/mms.cfg file is still named "mms.cfg-f**k"
[14:14]  * awilkins flips it over and tries it out
[14:15] <awilkins> Hooray, Nixie-pixel is still pink, but only eating 15% CPU time
[14:16]  * awilkins flips back to see what CPU impact is
[14:18] <dwatkins> excellent, I'm really glad to hear it's working, awilkins
[14:19] <dwatkins> slightly embarassing for NVidia, and a shame no-one from Adobe in the relevant team chimed-in to say they'd looked into it and found it was a driver problem, much as I tried to get the product manager to spend some time on this
[14:19] <awilkins> Hmm, not sure it's actually working
[14:19] <dwatkins> html5 video?
[14:19] <awilkins> Definitely flash
[14:19] <mungbean> which version ?
[14:19] <awilkins> The Smurf thing only happened on certain encodings as well
[14:19] <awilkins> Flash 11.2.202
[14:19] <mungbean> nvidia viersion?
[14:20] <mungbean> it was a recent one that fixed it
[14:20] <mungbean> experimental for sure should be ok
[14:20] <awilkins> I think I'm on "OMG! Kitten Murder!"
[14:20] <awilkins> I have Steam installed
[14:21] <awilkins> nvidia-experimental-310
[14:22] <popey> now is a good time to buy linux titles on steam
[14:22] <mungbean> whic ones?
[14:22] <popey> lots of discounts
[14:22] <awilkins> All 47 of them!
[14:22] <mungbean> logs in
[14:22] <awilkins> Actually, now it's 108
[14:22] <popey> i bought 9 games for ~25 quid last week
[14:22] <popey> blimey, was 100 the other day
[14:23] <awilkins> Hmm, do they bump things to the top of list when they are on offer
[14:23] <awilkins> Sure Osmos isn't a new release
[14:23] <awilkins> I do like that my Windows version of Osmos means a nice free Linux copy
[14:24] <dwatkins> I'm looking forward to global thermonuclear warfare this evening (Defcon)
[14:24]  * awilkins wonders if his keys will work on Steam
[14:24] <popey> numberwang!
[14:24] <dwatkins> 42
[14:24] <awilkins> Zen Bound 2 looks like a relaxing bondage game for wooden toys
[14:25] <popey> heh, yeah, it is
[14:25] <mungbean> puddle looks like cataclysm whic i used to play on archimedes - anyone played puddle?
[14:25] <dwatkins> I bought Puddle, too, as it looks neat.
[14:25] <dwatkins> I was busy building a new desk yesterday, so havn't played Puddle yet, mungbean.
[14:26] <awilkins> Hmmph, flash still has that bug where you can't manipulate the settings window from the vide
[14:26] <awilkins> It annoys my daughter
[14:26] <awilkins> She likes to play on CBeebies and lots of the games want local storage
[14:27] <awilkins> I could configure it to permit that but I hate those games. Mental junkfood.
[14:27] <dwatkins> don't ever clear your flash cache if you play flash-based games, you'll lose your score and level
[14:27] <popey> Titan Attacks is a nice Space Invaders clone
[14:28] <awilkins> I've played Revenge of the Titans from a HumbleBundle
[14:29] <popey> directhex: is there a thing that tracks numbers of games per platform?
[14:29] <awilkins> http://store.steampowered.com/browse/linux/
[14:29] <awilkins> There's a table under "Find More"
[14:30] <directhex> popey, on steam?
[14:30] <popey> yeah
[14:30] <directhex> windows: 1870
[14:30] <popey> yeah, but thats just numbers
[14:30] <popey> I was thinking something that got those numbers daily
[14:30] <popey> so we could see a trend
[14:31] <awilkins> http://steamcommunity.com/dev
[14:31] <awilkins> Hmm
[14:32] <directhex> popey, i don;t know if there's a simple export of the nbumbers. try looking at steamkit2, the library used by steamdb.info
[14:33] <awilkins> Mmn, C#, frosted goodness
[14:35] <directhex> so who has a tf2 linux t-shirt? http://store.valvesoftware.com/product.php?i=CTFL01
[14:39] <funkychic> hey im back
[14:39] <funkychic> is any one gonna talk to me
[14:40] <popey> we talk to anyone
[14:40]  * AlanBell is introverted
[14:40]  * awilkins just waits for you to expose a weakness he can exploit
[14:40]  * daubers inverts AlanBell 
[14:41] <popey> blimey
[14:42] <andylockran> any php developers want an interview?
[14:42] <andylockran> London, central.
[14:42] <andylockran> Opportunity to work with me
[14:42] <andylockran> :D
[14:42] <BigRedS> My brother probably does
[14:42] <BigRedS> I keep telling him to get a proper job and stop bloody freelancing
[14:42] <awilkins> Isn't interviewing people over IRC for a geographically tied role an oxymoron?
[14:43] <BigRedS> andylockran: got an a fuller description somewhere?
[14:44] <BigRedS> Oh. Apparently he's quite happy with his freelancing
[14:45] <andylockran> No worries; job is what anyone makes of it on whatever salary they think is suitable for the job in their head :)
[14:45] <awilkins> Ooh, Droid Assault looks a bit like a combo of Quazatron and Robotron
[14:45] <awilkins> http://store.steampowered.com/app/219200/?snr=1_230_linux__103
[14:45] <awilkins> Winner
[14:45] <BigRedS> His actual words were "I'd do 2 days a week in central probably, If I didn't have to catch the tube before 9:30"
[14:46] <awilkins> Smart man, valuing his lifestyle
[14:46] <awilkins> I use to have a job I could get up at 0830 for and drive for 2 miles
[14:46] <awilkins> Now I have a 50 mile commute each way and work for the government.
[14:47] <awilkins> A government that seems to be doing it's level best to become Government PLC
[14:48] <BigRedS> 50 mile commute? Blimey
[14:48] <awilkins> Wigan <-> Leeds
[14:48] <awilkins> Happily I only do this 3 days a week
[14:49] <BigRedS> oh, that doesn't even look particularly pleasant. Is it basically sitting in traffic on the motorway for a few hours?
[14:49]  * awilkins wonders if Droid Assault will work OK with XBOX controller on Linux
[14:49] <awilkins> Yeah, it's about 1hr 20
[14:49] <BigRedS> awilkins: that's exactly what Popey was asking earlier
[14:50] <BigRedS> I *think* the consensus was 'yes' but I wasn't paying much attention
[14:50] <bigcalm> Titan Attack
[14:50] <awilkins> The motorway near Leeds has a whole bunch of roadworks with "Don't kill the roadies" speed limits
[14:50] <awilkins> Have yet to see any roadies on the road when I commute through it
[14:50] <awilkins> The train takes 2 hours and costs £33 return
[14:50] <BigRedS> the road my work's on now is like that. It goes one-way with a 10mph convoy thing, and I've never passed anyone in the road
[14:51] <awilkins> The car consumes £60 worth of diesel a week doing 4 days commutes
[14:51] <BigRedS> Fortunately it's a 4m long road and we'rein the middle of it, so I only ever need to do 2miles at 10mph
[14:51] <awilkins> Which is much better than the train. The hospital makes my wife pay for her parking space >-<
[14:52] <awilkins> I quite fancy a Lit C-1
[14:52] <awilkins> But they are not out yet
[14:52] <awilkins> An electric car that looks a bit like a tron lightcycle with a 200m range? Yes please.
[14:53] <awilkins> Hmm, soundtracks for games on steam I don't get
[14:53] <awilkins> Especially games that probably use Vorbis assets anyway
[14:54] <awilkins> I did go through a large amount of hassle to convert the soundtrack assets for Homeworld to WMA once
[14:55] <awilkins> Shame that Linux audio players seem to hate WMA and make it click and stutter
[14:55] <awilkins> (not a shame that WMA is as acceptible as bacon at a barmitzpah though)
[15:03] <dwatkins> awilkins: which electric car is this which looks like a Lightcycle? :)
[15:04] <popey> awilkins: which also makes a huge amount of noise with those twin gyroscopes
[15:04] <popey> dwatkins: http://techcrunch.com/2013/02/18/tc-cribs-lit-motors-where-sleek-electric-cars-and-more-are-built-from-scratch/
[15:07] <dwatkins> neat
[15:19]  * skybinary needs one of those usb modems you connect to your landline, still having issues with the devices i have
[15:27] <mungbean> rather cheesed off that so many steam games are not 64 bit
[15:29] <dwatkins> I guess they wanted to have a wider audience.
[15:29] <bigcalm> They still work on 64bit
[15:29] <popey> why cheesed off?
[15:29] <skybinary> can you help direct me to maybe a website that can list linux supported cable modems?
[15:29] <skybinary> plz :D
[15:29] <mungbean> i have a list of my games in steam, but cannot install supermeat boy etc etc on my "current platform"
[15:30] <popey> thats not a 64-bit issue
[15:30] <mungbean> really?
[15:30] <mungbean> what is it@?
[15:30] <popey> ask directhex ☺
[15:31] <mungbean> i thought he told me the other day and it was 64 bit realted
[15:31]  * popey tries
[15:31] <mungbean> they haven't uploaded those builds to steam yet
[15:31] <popey> hmm, i dont see it listed
[15:31] <bigcalm> Me neither
[15:31] <bigcalm> I think it was there but has been removed
[15:31] <mungbean> all games: then choose bit trip runner, SMB, etc
[15:31] <mungbean> cortex command
[15:32] <bigcalm> Same for that wonderful black and white game that I can't remember the name of
[15:32] <mungbean> limbo
[15:32] <popey> limbo
[15:32] <davmor2> bigcalm: limbo
[15:32] <bigcalm> Ta
[15:32] <bigcalm> Heh
[15:32] <mungbean> lugaru, machinarium
[15:32] <popey> odd, limbo did work
[15:32] <mungbean> machinarium is flippin flash
[15:32] <popey> oh, i have that installed via humble bundle
[15:32] <bigcalm> popey: limbo wouldn't install in steam for me
[15:32] <skybinary> linux-drivers.org
[15:32] <popey> skybinary: what modem do you think doesn't work with Linux?
[15:33] <ahayzen> Hi, anyone know where this announcement in ~27min will be?
[15:33] <popey> the website
[15:33] <AlanBell> ahayzen: on the ubuntu.com website
[15:33] <skybinary> hey popey i have two here
[15:33] <mungbean> ahayzen: try putting your clock forward 28 mins
[15:33] <bigcalm> Hehe
[15:33] <ahayzen> AlanBell: Will an article appear or video stream or do we not know yet
[15:34] <AlanBell> we do not know yet
[15:34] <bigcalm> ahayzen: wait and see :)
[15:34] <ahayzen> Mungbean: i'll try and see wht happens ;)
[15:34] <directhex> mungbean, many games have linux ports, but not steam for linux ports
[15:34] <mungbean> yes. which is a bit weird
[15:34] <skybinary> popey, 047e:2892 Agere Systems, Inc. (Lucent) Systems Soft Modem is the first one
[15:34] <ahayzen> bigcalm: i'm too excited though :(
[15:34] <bigcalm> Running in various versions of wine
[15:34] <mungbean> so also 32bit ports neither directhex ?
[15:34] <popey> skybinary: thats a cable modem?
[15:34] <directhex> mungbean, well if the port was subcontracted, they'd need to re-contract to get it into steam. they may not deem the cost worth the reward.
[15:34] <bigcalm> ahayzen: excited about what though?
[15:34] <mungbean> not sure where i got 64bit from
[15:35] <skybinary> popey, yes
[15:35] <directhex> mungbean, you're imagining 64-bit as an issue here. except for harvest massive encounter which has a buggy way of assuming you're on i386
[15:35] <ahayzen> bigcalm: I don't know yet...probably the same thing i'm excited about for tommorrow
[15:35] <mungbean> directhex: so i have steam redeem keys from HIBundle but they don't let me redeem them for linux..
[15:35] <skybinary> well it is a usb to rj11 modem
[15:35] <mungbean> 30-40% of them work
[15:35] <mungbean> e.g. VVVVV, uplink
[15:36] <popey> i have redeemed all my HIB steam keys
[15:36] <popey> thats where half my games came from
[15:36] <directhex> mungbean, steam for linux is newer than any HIB, so any HIB games working is a bonus
[15:36] <bigcalm> Same here
[15:36] <popey> skybinary: thats not a cable modem..
[15:37] <mungbean> thank. seems i've been a bit naive about how steam works :D
[15:37] <AlanBell> ahayzen: at the end of the countdown your browser will stop for 30 seconds then refresh the page
[15:37] <popey> thats a broadband dongle isnt it?
[15:37] <ahayzen> AlanBell: Ok thanks :)
[15:37] <popey> skybinary: http://askubuntu.com/questions/106647/trouble-with-an-usb-modem-on-ubuntu-11-10
[15:37] <mungbean> need to find my HL1 key
[15:37] <AlanBell> popey: looks more like a pots modem
[15:37] <einonm> popey: is that including the HIB game CaveStory+? that's the only one I've tried, and I get an 'executable not found' issue with it.
[15:38] <skybinary> popey, what type of modem would you say it is?
[15:38] <ahayzen> AlanBell: Ah yes see tht in the source code nice :) Thanks
[15:38] <popey> skybinary: what are you hoping to do with it?
[15:38] <AlanBell> skybinary: is that for dialup? 56k modem old style?
[15:38] <popey> AlanBell: yes
[15:38] <skybinary> popey, alan_bell the idea is to use kermit
[15:39] <skybinary> to transfer log files to base
[15:39] <popey> via a phone line?
[15:39] <skybinary> from one of our mobile operatives
[15:39] <skybinary> yes
[15:39] <popey> right, so "modem" is the term I'd use ☺
[15:39] <popey> ok, so I haven't tried a modem for years
[15:40] <popey> sorry
[15:40] <skybinary> sok
[15:40] <popey> yeah, missing executable einonm
[15:40] <skybinary> i have rebuilt the kernel and no joy, i have make'd several vesrion from source and still no joi
[15:40] <AlanBell> skybinary: that isn't a cable modem, it is a dialup modem
[15:40] <einonm> popey: ah, no worries
[15:40] <directhex> mungbean, owning a game on steam gives it to you on all platforms on steam (well, with one exception). that doesn't mean every game is *available* on every platform, just that if it were, you#d already own the port
[15:40] <skybinary> thanks AlanBell
[15:41] <AlanBell> skybinary: when you plug it in you should get a device /dev/ttyUSB0 or something
[15:41] <skybinary> not with these two, i have no tty at all
[15:41] <AlanBell> you can use minicom or similar to connect to that device and then do AT commands
[15:41] <mungbean> directhex: thanks, i think i made a bit of an assumptive jump
[15:41] <skybinary> i have experience with minicom sz rz and kermit seems the best
[15:41]  * bigcalm gets a tear in his eye as he remembers the days of wvdial
[15:42] <mungbean> i knew HL2 and oblivion would not work, but because HIB were linux builds, i kind of expected them automatically
[15:42] <popey> Trumpet Winsock!
[15:42] <AlanBell> skybinary: plug it in, wait a few secs, and type dmesg in a terminal
[15:43] <skybinary> ok
[15:43] <AlanBell> the last few lines might give you a clue about what is happening
[15:43] <bigcalm> sudo tail -f /var/log/syslog and then plug in the modem
[15:43] <AlanBell> that too
[15:44] <popey> (with a stock kernel)
[15:44] <popey> (i.e. the one the distro ships)
[15:44] <bigcalm> After being bloomin' cold this morning, this afternoon is a touch toasty
[15:44] <directhex> mungbean, let's say runic games had a fixed contract with out of order games to port torchlight, for HIB purposes. the port includes working and X hours of bugfixing. those hours are all spent (and some major bugs remain, e.g. missing heads). now runic need to either pay for more developer time to re-integrate with steam (e.g. achievements, all the general gardening involved in submitting binaries to steam) or they don't
[15:44] <directhex> mungbean, that work will cost them X tens of thousands of dollars. will they make back X from increased sales?
[15:45] <popey> probably not if all the customers already bought the game via HIB
[15:46] <skybinary> AlanBell, http://pastebin.com/X7w5vKQz
[15:47] <skybinary> i will now go and do what bigcalm  suggested
[15:47] <popey> you'll get the same result
[15:47] <skybinary> oh
[15:47] <skybinary> thanks
[15:50] <skybinary> my tests are costing a fortune £25 a day using the dongle, so i have to reduce costs before i am sacked, by using a dialup
[15:50] <AlanBell> I think that is a winmodem, so you are basically out of luck
[15:50] <AlanBell> why on earth would a broadband dongle cost £25/day?
[15:51] <skybinary> its minutes i suppose, not broadband, dialup
[15:51] <skybinary> i do have another one, lenovo, let me plug that in
[15:51] <directhex> who works on one of those rumour-based ubuntu-centric blogs, like omgubuntu?
[15:52] <neuro> TRRRRRRRRRRRRRUMPET WIIIIIIINSOOOOOOOCK!!!!
[15:53]  * popey points directhex at d0od
[15:53] <andylockran> ooh
[15:53] <andylockran> HTC One is out on the HTC site
[15:53] <andylockran> and I thought their countdowns were sync'd with the ubuntu one ?
[15:54] <andylockran> & the HTC One is showing screenshots of Android?
[15:54] <neuro> another htc one?
[15:54] <AlanBell> not running Ubuntu phone then
[15:55] <directhex> why would one of the world's biggest smartphone companies make a *flagship* phone with no app store?
[15:55] <directhex> sure, they might make an ubuntu phone, and give it the same billing as the wildfire s. but a flagship device? c'mon
[15:55] <skybinary> popey, allanbell here is the dmesg from modem #2 http://pastebin.com/nMiZu3Qz
[15:56] <popey> skybinary: see http://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-508010-view-next.html?sid=eadc8bcfb6241f4a372dfef3e8a43e55
[15:56] <skybinary> :) thanks popey
[15:57] <neuro> directhex: biggest smartphone company?!
[15:58] <neuro> they've dropped off the top five
[15:58] <neuro> they have less than 4.3% market share
[15:59] <AlanBell> directhex: I didn't think it would be running Ubuntu phone :)
[15:59] <directhex> neuro, better than blackberry
[15:59] <kvarley> 30 seconds
[15:59] <neuro> and? :)
[16:00] <kvarley> Oh, lol the timer is broken on ubuntu.com
[16:00] <mungbean> htc desire is still in top 5 for common phones
[16:00]  * kvarley had a desire
[16:00] <mungbean> they have lasted well
[16:01] <directhex> wife still has an htc sensation
[16:01] <kvarley> popey: what am I meant to be seeing on ubuntu.com - the timer has broken at 00:00:00
[16:01] <mungbean> www.ubuntu.com not responding
[16:01] <mungbean> :S
[16:01] <neuro> not exactly a good advertisement
[16:01] <directhex> popey,  https://twitter.com/TimOfLegend/status/303587498934800384 :p
[16:01] <popey> blah blah blah
[16:01] <kvarley> mungbean: I was on it when it hit 0 and it is just showing a spinning loading icon for me
[16:02] <skybinary> ok, now i know a winmodem wont work
[16:03] <directhex> all usb modems are winmodems. tey work fine, but the documentation for them is all ancient, since it's 2013 and srsly dialup
[16:03] <neuro> at some point, someone will realise that when you have a big announcement to make, you scale your web infra to cope with demand at the time of the announcement ... or am i just being stupid?
[16:03] <popey> you're a) telling the wrong people, b) not telling us anything we don't already know
[16:03] <popey> skybinary: why not using a 3g dongle?
[16:03] <popey> or a wifi dongle
[16:04] <neuro> popey: why so serious?
[16:04] <kvarley> The announcement on ubuntu.com is meant to be saying that Ubuntu is coming to Tablets - download for developer preview on Thursday
[16:04] <DJones> neuro: Maybe they have doubled/trebled it etc, but theres 4 times as much interest :)
[16:04] <neuro> http://www.ubuntu.com/devices/tablet
[16:04] <kvarley> Thanks neuro
[16:04] <popey> i see a tablet ☺
[16:04] <mungbean> i blame the juju
[16:04] <skybinary> the cost popey, £25 a day for my tests, i cant afford one penny of that
[16:04] <mungbean> i see white screen
[16:04] <DJones> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h384z7Ph0gU&hd=1 Might help
[16:05] <mungbean> now i see a tablet
[16:05] <skybinary> the company phone line on the other hand, they can pay and i can eat
[16:05] <neuro> it's basically ubuntu phone, but for tablets
[16:05] <andylockran> aww, it can't cope with demand :(
[16:05] <neuro> there's no hardware announced
[16:05] <kvarley> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h384z7Ph0gU&hd=1
[16:05] <skybinary> but if it cant be done i understand
[16:05] <AlanBell> skybinary: why is it costing so much?
[16:06] <mungbean> i don't see a tablet, i see an article about tablets for OEMs
[16:06] <popey> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5_4fXQcxFRs
[16:06] <kvarley> Mark Shuttleworth has a really nice voice
[16:06] <AlanBell> modem is going to be a *lot* more expensive for data than a broadband dongle
[16:06] <skybinary> AlanBell, payg it costsa around £1 per test
[16:06] <awilkins> OPinion : the unity "Show Desktop" is annoying because i) it shrinks all the windows on all the workspaces and ii) it doesn't have a "Now uncollapse them all back to where they were"
[16:06] <neuro> i'm not sure this was something worth counting down to
[16:06] <mungbean> i have the bug where youtube is2x as fast
[16:07] <neuro> it should just have been punted on the website and a press release put out
[16:07] <mungbean> i would def use this if it worked on my tablet
[16:07] <kvarley> mungbean: I'm considering buying whatever device they are releasing it on
[16:07] <neuro> would work nice on a nexus 7 methinks
[16:07] <awilkins> The only cases I can think of for analog modems now are i) Communications with someone that mandates them (not entirely impossible)
[16:08] <awilkins> or ii) third world nations (who probably have at least GPRS)
[16:08] <kvarley> Wow, having the phone app slide out is awesome! yes yes yes!
[16:08] <mungbean> not sure about marky marks new hair
[16:08] <kvarley> Finally good multitasking
[16:08] <neuro> awilkins: data access during power outage, since PSTN carries voltage
[16:08] <awilkins> neuro, True, but what about cellular?
[16:08] <awilkins> Cell towers usually also have good UPS
[16:08] <skybinary> you know what would be cool, knowing which (modem) to buy, as i have bought 2 modems and £25 on credit#
[16:09] <AlanBell> awilkins: not third world places, people nick the copper wires. Wireless all the way.
[16:09] <neuro> awilkins: data access during power outage when you have poor/no cellular coverage then :)
[16:10] <kvarley> I see Gimp on the tablet video, is that even possible?
[16:10] <skybinary> so we are agreed dialup modems dont work on linux
[16:10] <AlanBell> yes, they do
[16:10] <AlanBell> winmodems don't
[16:10] <Myrtti> skybinary: winmodems don't usually work, no.
[16:10] <AlanBell> real modems do - however you really really don't want to use one
[16:10] <skybinary> what about the lenovo one
[16:11] <neuro> USR Sportsters, baby, now *those* were modems
[16:11] <skybinary> the second one i bought after i found winmodems were no go
[16:11] <AlanBell> how much data are you putting over it skybinary?
[16:11] <skybinary> not alot about 4k
[16:11] <AlanBell> and do you have a phone line on the server or are you hoping to find an ISP who still knows what dialup is?
[16:12] <skybinary> is this lenovo modem a winmodem in disguise?
[16:12] <awilkins> Oops, watching vid
[16:12] <skybinary> there is a phone line, there is a computer, i thought linux, and there is modems
[16:13] <awilkins> Marky Mark Shuttleworth lost me in the first sentence
[16:13] <awilkins> "One unified experience for all personal computing"
[16:13] <awilkins> No,no,no,no,no
[16:13] <neuro> lol
[16:13] <awilkins> That's why Windows 8 tanked
[16:13] <neuro> "no, mark, WAT R U DOING!"
[16:13] <andylockran> I like it
[16:13] <kvarley> awilkins: I think the crucial point is that they aren't screwing with desktop users by making them use the tablet or phone interface
[16:13] <kvarley> The interface adapts so it is fine
[16:14] <mungbean> i like it more for tablet than anything
[16:14] <awilkins> kvarley, Only 16 s in
[16:14] <mungbean> however my tablet spec is a little low
[16:14] <neuro> hey, you guys talking about winmodems, do none of you remember linmodem drivers?
[16:14] <skybinary> so were agreed, dialup modems dont work on lnux
[16:14] <awilkins> I shall watch rest and try not to kneejerk as much :p
[16:14] <neuro> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/DialupModemHowto
[16:14] <popey> wise
[16:14] <neuro> skybinary: no, dialup modems work great on linux
[16:14] <popey> people have preconceptions about what "unified experience" means
[16:15] <kvarley> popey: What tablet are they releasing Ubuntu for on Thursday?
[16:15] <mungbean> i think it means purple wallpaper
[16:15] <neuro> lol
[16:15] <popey> images for the n7 and n10
[16:15] <neuro> PURPLE BOKEH!
[16:15] <kvarley> popey: Thanks :) Now to find somewhere that does next day delivery :)
[16:16] <mungbean> pizza for lunch = 4pm bellyache
[16:16] <skybinary> thank neuro, i asked yesterday what modems work on linux and was told any, today i found winmodems dont and this lenovo modem does not
[16:16] <neuro> don't say pizza
[16:16] <neuro> i really really really want to try domino's hot dog and mustard stuffed crust :)
[16:16] <skybinary> food :),
[16:16] <awilkins> Anyone with lactose intolerance now provokes my brain to narrate them in the voice of Leonard Hofstader
[16:17] <popey> skybinary: because you didnt say dial-up modems yesterday, we assumed 3g modems, sorry
[16:17] <skybinary> oh ok, fair enough
[16:17] <skybinary> sorry
[16:17] <daubers> popey: When are they releasing the ubuntu for tablets image?
[16:17] <skybinary> i hate my life
[16:17]  * mungbean isn't lactose intolerant..just have random bellyache
[16:18] <bigcalm> Just watched the video. Everything looks good. Mark could do with a new hair style though :S
[16:18] <popey> 21st daubers
[16:18] <neuro> noo, cover flow :(((
[16:18] <mungbean> bigcalm: +1 needs ruffling
[16:19] <kvarley> Nexus 7 vs Nexus 10 anybody?
[16:19] <bigcalm> At the beginning I thought it was close to being a comb over :(
[16:19] <daubers> Hmmm........ might grab another nexus 7 (pennies depending) and play
[16:20]  * mungbean wishes he had money/spare money
[16:20] <mungbean> new baby arrives next month
[16:21] <daubers> mungbean: s/baby/moneypit/g
[16:21] <awilkins> Ooh, voxhud
[16:21] <awilkins> (well, that's what they should call it)
[16:21] <kvarley> popey: If you were buying a tablet today would you pick the Nexus 7 or the Nexus 10? (With the sole intention of running ubuntu on it) :)
[16:21] <neuro> so wait
[16:21] <mungbean> daubers: converts money->poo
[16:21] <neuro> if i take an ubuntu phone/tablet
[16:22] <neuro> and connect a bt keyb/mouse
[16:22] <neuro> it displays the regular unity interface?
[16:22] <kvarley> neuro: On high end models yes
[16:22] <neuro> "high end"
[16:22] <neuro> you mean intel?
[16:23] <kvarley> neuro: Not necessarily. The specs were floating about after the phone unveiling. I think it was 2GB RAM+ and quad core recommended
[16:23] <neuro> the implication seems to be phone + touchscreen + keyb + mouse = unity
[16:23] <popey> kvarley: i already have a nexus 7 ☺
[16:24] <kvarley> popey: Pretend you don't have that for a minute, which would you pick? :)
[16:24] <mungbean> click the partners page, there are specs
[16:24] <popey> kvarley: both ;)
[16:24]  * neuro admits he uses his ipad more than his nexus 7, kindle fire hd and playbook combined
[16:25] <neuro> tempted to get shot of the kindle, actually
[16:25]  * awilkins uses his eInk Kindle more than the iPad he doesn't have
[16:25] <kvarley> popey: Thanks for being so helpful :P I was leaning towards a 7. :)
[16:25] <neuro> awilkins: i use my macs more than the ubuntu desktops i don't have ;)
[16:26] <einonm> Is it true that you can only run 2 apps at a time on the tablet?
[16:26] <neuro> and more than my NeXT Cube that i don't have as well
[16:26] <awilkins> einonm, From that video, no
[16:26] <kvarley> einonm: Where did you hear/see that?
[16:26] <awilkins> einonm, One shot was of the "switch between the humungous number of apps I'm running" UI
[16:26] <popey> kvarley: I dunno, I have an ipad, a 10" tablet, two nexus 7's.. I kinda have enough ☺
[16:27] <mungbean> 2 nexi 7s?
[16:27] <popey> einonm: no
[16:27] <neuro> popey: what's the second one?
[16:27] <larryo__> Hello, is there any better java plugin apart from icedtea?
[16:27] <neuro> the best thing to do with java plugins is uninstall them as fast as you can
[16:27] <einonm> awilkins: didn't get that far in the vid, probably just a misunderstanding, but - http://www.ubuntu.com/devices
[16:27] <kvarley> popey: Ok, thank you :) I think I'm gonna go with the Nexus 7. Thursday will be an exciting day! :)
[16:27] <popey> neuro: one is mine, one is family
[16:27] <awilkins> Question about inotify - do you really need to grab a handle to every file in a filesystem, or can you just watch the root folder?
[16:27] <neuro> popey: sorry, i meant what's the 10" tablet? asus?
[16:28] <popey> no, a cheapo chinese one
[16:28] <awilkins> einonm, Ah, it's referring to the "run another app stuck to the side for multitask productivity" feature
[16:28] <neuro> nice
[16:28] <popey> I used to have an asus, not any more
[16:28] <andylockran> is there any news on the ubuntu for android 'docking' being available on the ubuntu phone ( and now tablet) ?
[16:28] <larryo__> @neuro why?
[16:28] <awilkins> einonm, Can multitask, but you can have 2 apps onscreen as long as one supports phone layout
[16:29] <neuro> larryo__: because java is evil and must be purged
[16:29] <einonm> awilkins: ok. Kinda cool.
[16:29] <kvarley> popey: Oh but the Nexus 10 has mini hdmi output ... hhhmmm
[16:29] <neuro> the phone layout thing looks interesting
[16:29] <kvarley> popey: *micro HDMI
[16:29] <popey> side stage
[16:29] <neuro> as long as it's better than the stupid split screen thing in win8, which is useless
[16:29] <larryo__> so what would you use in place of that? @neuro
[16:29] <awilkins> Java isn't evil
[16:29] <neuro> larryo__: anything that isn't java
[16:30] <neuro> java IS evil, and MUST be purged!
[16:30] <popey> helpful help would be helpful here neuro
[16:30] <popey> larryo__: what's the problem you're having?
[16:30] <neuro> BUT IT MUST BE PURG... oh, ok
[16:30] <awilkins> I like Java, because it means I can use Ubuntu for all my productive work and not want to kill myself because I'm trapped in the corporate build of Windows
[16:30]  * neuro feels the glare of the popey
[16:30] <larryo__> @neuro if you have no help to offer, don't offer anY!
[16:30] <neuro> well.
[16:31] <popey> ok.. lets get helpful.
[16:31] <popey> larryo__: what apps are you having problems with?
[16:31] <ubuntubhoy> popey: will the tablet UI run on a Desktop install ?
[16:31] <neuro> larryo__: you asked a rather subjective question ... the answer would depend on what your metrics are for "better" ... have you had problems with the kosher oracle install?
[16:32] <larryo__> I am running a "live terminal" for accesing shares prices and that requires java @ popey
[16:32] <neuro> or are you just trying to stay clear of proprietory softare?
[16:32] <neuro> s/softare/software/
[16:32] <larryo__> I have only tried icedtea @ neuro
[16:33] <neuro> ok, so you're just cadging about for opinions on what others are worth trying
[16:34] <neuro> and your options really are icedtea 6, icedtea 7, oracle 6 or oracle 7
[16:34] <neuro> unless i've missed something here
[16:34] <larryo__> well the iced doesn't run all athe fields in the table. fore xample I can see the names of the  shares but not the prices in the next field
[16:35] <neuro> you should probably try kosher oracle java
[16:35] <larryo__> ok thank you
[16:35] <neuro> i apologise for my randomness
[16:35] <popey> yeah, I'd be inclined to agree, sadly
[16:35] <larryo__> cool, no problems
[16:36] <neuro> i do usually follow up the randomness with actual advice, honest :)
[16:36] <neuro> larryo__: have you read https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Java ?
[16:37] <neuro> erk
[16:37] <neuro> nasa has lost full comms with ISS
[16:38] <neuro> they can only contact them every 90 minutes
[16:38] <awilkins> That's a bit less erk
[16:38] <SuperMatt> neuro: source?
[16:38] <neuro> but still
[16:38] <mgdm> neuro: eep
[16:38] <neuro> SuperMatt: cnn notification on my phone
[16:39] <SuperMatt> I know they're doing a systems upgrade at the moment
[16:39] <mgdm> neuro: I blame Reddit
[16:39] <SuperMatt> hah
[16:39] <SuperMatt> sounds about right
[16:39] <AlanBell> communication is now only via twitter
[16:39] <neuro> oops, forgot my phone goes all James Earl Jones every time i start the cnn app
[16:40] <neuro> "THIS ... IS CNN"
[16:41] <awilkins> THey should make a plugin that does that for every website
[16:41] <neuro> http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/station/expeditions/expedition34/e34_021913.html
[16:41] <neuro> SuperMatt: looks like you nailed it re the systems upgrade
[16:41] <SuperMatt> I did :D
[16:41] <neuro> so they only have ground comms, no TDRS
[16:42] <SuperMatt> well, some comms is better than no comms
[16:42] <SuperMatt> and I'm sure that they're pretty damn safe up there
[16:42] <neuro> yeah
[16:42] <SuperMatt> probably many orders of magnitude safer than being down here
[16:42] <neuro> well
[16:42] <awilkins> So - VoxHud - does it run locally or does it ship your audio to the cloud like Siri
[16:43] <neuro> if a micrometeroid comes through my window, i'm sure i'll survive ;)
[16:43] <awilkins> SuperMatt, Ooooh, no, not nearly as safe as being down here
[16:43] <neuro> awilkins: ooh, interesting
[16:43] <SuperMatt> but there are murderers and rapists and bronies down here :(
[16:43] <AlanBell> I am guessing locally awilkins
[16:43] <neuro> yeah, but they're not in my house *right now*
[16:43] <awilkins> SuperMatt, Yes, but they don't demineralize your bones and bombard you with cosmic radiation
[16:44] <neuro> THEY MIGHT!
[16:44] <SuperMatt> for the daily mail tells me so!
[16:44] <neuro> nooooooooo!
[16:44] <awilkins> WE should form a secret society of Daily Mail baiters
[16:45] <awilkins> Make up progressively more ludicrous stories with a conservative bent
[16:45] <AlanBell> awilkins: the local device knows what menu options are available in the HUD so can assemble a vocabulary to pass to pocketsphinx to recognise against
[16:45] <neuro> we should form a public society of Daily Mail ignorers
[16:45] <AlanBell> the server would have to be recognising against a much bigger vocabularly set and I can't see the server infrastructure for that paying for itself for the hud
[16:45] <awilkins> AlanBell, Groovy. I like HUD, even if I have to tinker with the libraries to make it work with Eclipse (where it's really useful because of the 20,000 menu items)
[16:46] <AlanBell> yeah, I like it in concept, not very keen on the UI implementation of it
[16:46] <awilkins> 'tis a shame that not more of the widget toolkits have been ported to global menus
[16:46] <awilkins> Yeah, it has it's weaknesses
[16:46] <neuro> awilkins: https://twitter.com/utterben/status/303859517618274305/photo/1
[16:46] <awilkins> Like the one where it's early guesses are better than more fully spelt ones
[16:46] <neuro> awilkins: only 20,000?
[16:47] <AlanBell> I have been wanting to voice control it for a while, but it was one of those things that would be a pointless project for me to do for fun as Canonical were obviously going to do it their way later
[16:47] <awilkins> And of course, if you work in an open plan office you look like a dork talking to your computer
[16:47] <neuro> that's my main concern
[16:47] <popey> "Computer!"
[16:47] <neuro> i don't want to look like a doofus
[16:48] <popey> "Main screen on!"
[16:48] <neuro> "Just use the keyboard"
[16:48] <AlanBell> I would have to put a microphone in a mouse ;)
[16:48] <popey> "Escape!"
[16:48] <popey> "Control C!"
[16:48] <popey> etc
[16:48] <awilkins> The "Just use the keyboard" error would have to be in Montgomery Scott's voice (no, it wasn't him in the movie, yes, James Doohan is dead, etc)
[16:48] <neuro> rumours kicking around about the next gen xbox are saying it can be switched on/off by voice
[16:49] <awilkins> What do you say? "I want to play a second hand game." ?
[16:49] <neuro> "I'm sorry, Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that"
[16:49] <popey> "download abandonware"
[16:49] <neuro> and what you do mean, "it wasn't him in the movie"?
[16:49] <awilkins> He didn't have that line in the movie
[16:49] <mgdm> neuro: did you see that Far Cry 3 review th eother day? I'd love to see it work for that guy's voice
[16:49] <neuro> oh right
[16:49] <awilkins> It was the manager of the plastics factory
[16:49]  * Dave2 stares at neuro 
[16:49] <neuro> well it was *said* to him :)
[16:50] <neuro> mgdm: no?
[16:50]  * neuro stares at Dave2
[16:50] <mgdm> neuro: http://kotaku.com/5983826/this-scottish-far-cry-3-video-review-is-the-funniest-thing-ever-if-you-can-understand-it - nsfw audio, and actually is just a relatively stanard central accent, but you get what I mean
[16:51] <neuro> the internet has everything: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v9kTVZiJ3Uc
[16:51] <neuro> (sfw)
[16:51] <neuro> mgdm: watching now
[16:52] <neuro> mgdm: LOL at the titles
[16:59] <AlanBell> o/ Dave2
[16:59] <andylockran> ma, this is like old times.. where's Daviey
[17:00] <neuro> mgdm: that was crackin
[17:00] <awilkins> Hmm, now tempted by Far Cry 3
[17:01] <neuro> those guys (whose name i cannot repeat here) are mates with @bitsocket
[17:01] <mgdm> neuro: aye
[17:01] <awilkins> Curse you, fat Scottish Ginger Bloke
[17:01] <mgdm> Oi
[17:01] <mgdm> I resemble that remark
[17:01] <awilkins> Only cursing that *specific* FSGB in a tongue in cheek manner
[17:01] <neuro> loved the game songs bit
[17:02] <awilkins> I enjoyed his ribaldry and down to earth review
[17:02] <neuro> "gonnae chib every **** in the land of skyrim!"
[17:02] <awilkins> I really enjoyed Skyrim when I installed the Dragon Shouting mod
[17:03] <awilkins> But it petered out before I finished it
[17:03] <neuro> so tempted now to do an nsfw linux podcast in a similar vein
[17:03] <neuro> i did a couple of recordings years ago pretending to be a ned (chav) talking about ubuntu
[17:03] <neuro> realised it was a bit poo and didn't publish :)
[17:05] <mgdm> heh heh
[17:05] <neuro> maybe we should try and do slugradio again, but just remove the "lugradio" element
[17:05] <awilkins> Even the teaser video for FarCry3 is really slick and epic
[17:05]  * Dave2 waves back at AlanBell form his horribly laggy machine
[17:45] <BigRedS> Is there a more elegant way to resolve an IP address into a mac address than a ping followed by an arp -a?
[17:47] <einonm> BigRedS: a ping and an arp -a wrapped in a script called 'resolve_ip'? :)
[17:47] <redtape-renegade> Terrific day today ...
[17:48] <MartijnVdS> BigRedS: resolve IP to mac = arp :)
[17:48] <BigRedS> einonm: haha, yeah, that might end up being it
[17:48] <BigRedS> I'm modifying an already-inelegant script and don't want to add to the mess too much :)
[17:48] <MartijnVdS> ♫ Hackity hack
[17:49] <BigRedS> MartijnVdS: yeah, but arp only seems concerned with changing things or showing a cache. Seems odd that I first need to find some other means of getting the ip/mac into a cache
[17:49] <BigRedS> I want arp's dig
[17:50] <einonm> break out the script into little scripts connected together? Unix rule of modularity and all that...
[17:50] <redtape-renegade> The Manx budget came out and There has been a 10% Tax on profit for PC World and all other retailers ( which means they will **actually pay tax** here) .. hopefully this means that all of the Smaller computer traders won't be put out of business.. Hurrah  for the little man !! \o/
[17:51] <redtape-renegade> Waltons-Digital-World being the little Man ;)
[17:53] <BigRedS> bah. you need to be root to run arp...
[17:53] <BigRedS> wait. no
[17:53] <BigRedS> it's just in /usr/sbin
[17:53] <BigRedS> whoo!
[17:54] <redtape-renegade> BigRedS: Hi Five o/
[17:54] <redtape-renegade> Brill day today ...
[17:55] <MartijnVdS> *\o/*  */o\* ?
[17:55] <redtape-renegade> hi MartijnVdS  .. My folks are in Holland next wekend .. :)
[17:55] <redtape-renegade> .. perhaps you could link up  ??
[17:56] <MartijnVdS> redtape-renegade: my weekend is fully booked, sorry :)
[17:56] <redtape-renegade> ok .. No prob.s .. :D
[17:57] <redtape-renegade> Man it's a brilliant day today .. All I need is some b$tches for my batcave .. Where d'em at ??
[17:59] <MartijnVdS> Not anywhere near you if you refer to them like that, I hope :)
[18:00] <redtape-renegade> hey money talks !
[18:01]  * redtape-renegade puts on * Deadmau5 * to live the dream for the rest of the day :)
[18:01] <MartijnVdS> yeah but community guidelines speak louder :)
[18:01] <MartijnVdS> redtape-renegade: if you want to dream, http://open.spotify.com/user/martijnvds/playlist/2UHNlhHRMcziirEn188343
[18:01]  * redtape-renegade apologises .. just feeling the wave atmo .. 
[18:01] <redtape-renegade> opening..
[18:03] <redtape-renegade> Great .. playing ♫ Girl from Jupiter now :) .. Is it ok if I add that playlist to my playlist page ?
[18:12] <MartijnVdS> redtape-renegade: sure
[19:30] <jacobw> evening
[20:06] <mungbean> football is making me sad :(
[20:28] <redtape-renegade> Is this TRUE ??
[20:28] <redtape-renegade> http://news.slashdot.org/story/13/02/18/2236218/canonical-announcing-ubuntu-tablet-tomorrow
[20:29] <dwatkins> did you see ubuntu.com, redtape-renegade?
[20:29] <redtape-renegade> opening...
[20:30] <redtape-renegade> Crumbs, have I been late to the shooting match ... Is there a #channel for this ??
[20:33] <dwatkins> yes, #ubuntu-tablet, redtape-renegade
[20:34] <ali1234> "you don’t have to keep returning to the home screen every time you want to switch apps"
[20:34] <ali1234> you don't have to do that on any tablet
[20:35] <ali1234> people just do it because it's the most efficient way
[20:35] <MartijnVdS> my mum uses the app switcher on android all the time
[20:35] <mgdm> On iOS I've taught quite a few people the double-tap-home trick
[20:36] <mgdm> it's not very discoverable, though I use it quite a bit
[20:36] <ali1234> starting to wonder if canonical UI designers have ever used any computer or mobile device
[20:36] <ali1234> i mean, previously i thought they only used macs and iphones or something
[20:36] <dwatkins> you can also swipe between apps
[20:40] <ali1234> using the homescreen is the best way to switch apps because the icons on the home screen do not move around
[20:40] <ali1234> using an application switcher is second best because the same button will always get you to it, but it is worse because the icons/previews more around
[20:40] <ali1234> using a back button is the third best because at least the button is always in the same place and you can see it, even if it doesn't always take you to the same place
[20:41] <ali1234> swiping edges is the worst way because you can't see that it is a function that exists, and you don't know where it will take you
[20:45] <brobostigon> is it possible, that when my mums archos arnova, tries to playback upnp/dlna from my rpi, that it would cause the whole wifi to die, of the router the rpi is connected to. ?
[20:45] <MartijnVdS> brobostigon: how big is the file she's trying to play?
[20:46] <MartijnVdS> or you :)
[20:46] <brobostigon> MartijnVdS: 300megabyte roughly.
[20:46] <ali1234> yes, very possible
[20:47] <brobostigon> MartijnVdS: an hours tv prog, off iplayer, via get-iplayer.
[20:47] <MartijnVdS> you could tell the pi to rate-limit
[20:47] <brobostigon> thing is, i do it on my nexus7, no issue at all, plays back without interrupting anything,
[20:47] <ali1234> upnp is extremely unreliable, and so is wifi
[20:48] <redtape-renegade> MartijnVdS:
[20:48] <MartijnVdS> redtape-renegade:
[20:48] <redtape-renegade> MartijnVdS: You have Spotify mail ;)
[20:48] <MartijnVdS> redtape-renegade: you subscribed to the playlist? :)
[20:48] <brobostigon> so the arnova seems to be doing something, my nexus7 isnt.
[20:49] <redtape-renegade> Yep indedy-do :)
[20:49] <MartijnVdS> brobostigon: maybe it's pre-caching the entire file.. or it's sending a "play" request for every few kilobytes separately (and the Pi doesn't stop sending the entire file every time? that would kill wifi fast)
[20:49] <MartijnVdS> redtape-renegade: I've been adding a few things to the list as well
[20:50] <brobostigon> MartijnVdS: even with same upnp-dlna client software being used on both devices, setup as far as i can see, exqactly as standard.
[20:50] <redtape-renegade> yep .. A ten minute track I see .. looks good .. just listening to it !!
[20:51] <brobostigon> MartijnVdS: let me look, see if the client end, has such config option.
[20:53] <redtape-renegade> MartijnVdS: What happened to all your hair ? Errata : Egg-heads are cooool     ;)
[20:53] <brobostigon> MartijnVdS: ok, i see no similer config options in the client, only thing similer, is in the file browser, in the client, it has an option to download the whole file.
[20:54] <brobostigon> next thing, lets look at the server config.
[20:54] <redtape-renegade> yes, lets do that ...
[21:02] <redtape-renegade> Meanwhile in Galway, IRL   :: https://dl.dropbox.com/u/55128914/Attachments%20Email%20Xchat/The%20salmon_weir.JPG
[21:09] <shauno> not entirely sure what I'm looking at?
[21:09] <redtape-renegade> shauno: You mean The Salmon Weir ?
[21:10]  * redtape-renegade thought it was famous ?
[21:10] <shauno> well given the "meanwhile in .." I think I was looking for a punchline
[21:10] <redtape-renegade> punchline ? .. I think fists start flying at 1am usually :)
[21:11] <shauno> was just nosey because I'm in galway myself :)
[21:11] <redtape-renegade> Wow .. I love Galway .. go there every year :D
[21:12]  * redtape-renegade thinks we may have had this conv. before though ..
[21:12] <brobostigon> would changing the port upnp/dlna broadcasts on matter ?
[21:37] <bigcalm> popey: do you have ia32-libs installed?
[21:39] <popey> yes
[21:39] <bigcalm> That will be why Titan Attacks worked for you
[21:39] <bigcalm> After installing, the game works for me
[21:40] <popey> yay
[21:41] <Klettbar> is there an utility who would "click" on a linck on an updated page
[21:41] <Klettbar> link
[21:42] <popey> wget or curl?
[21:42] <Klettbar> i have an application which gives alert when page chanes
[21:42] <Klettbar> changes
[21:42] <Klettbar> how can i automatically click on the right link on thta page
[21:43] <Klettbar> click is not the word
[21:43] <Klettbar> open the linked page
[21:43] <bigcalm> Wow, that game is so much fun :D
[21:43] <Klettbar> what does curl do
[21:45] <bigcalm> Curl is a utility for making HTTP requests
[21:45] <Klettbar> let's say you have a board with jobs on it (which appear when teh page reload because in fact there are jobs)
[21:45] <Klettbar> and you want to be sure to pick the job even if you are in the bathroom
[21:46] <Klettbar> aplication should detetct
[21:46] <Klettbar> reload of page
[21:46] <Klettbar> new link
[21:46] <Klettbar> and secon new link
[21:46] <Klettbar> and second new link
[21:46] <Klettbar> inside second page
[21:46] <popey> python and beautifulsoup could do that
[21:46] <Klettbar> not clear i bet
[21:48] <Klettbar> do you know any premade utility on ubuntu linux
[21:48] <Klettbar> or even browsers plugins
[21:49] <ali1234> bug 1130388
[21:49] <popey> i would do it with python and beautifulsoup
[21:50] <ali1234> i would do it with greasemonkey
[21:50] <shauno> I'd just take my laptop to the bathroom
[21:51] <popey> always thinking outside the box there shauno
[21:51] <popey> or inside the bog
[21:51] <ali1234> "poopsock"
[21:51] <shauno> hey, it's an option :)
[21:51] <mgdm> lavtop?
[21:53] <ali1234> so i'm sitting here and i can only unminimize one window at a time. what can i do to debug this??
[21:53] <shauno> I mostly mention it because it sounds a lot like a problem I once tried to solve.  almost identical.  until I realised that it'd only make me feel clever until they found out I had ff acknowledging my tickets automatically, and let me go
[21:53] <Klettbar> the prob is competition
[21:53] <Klettbar> competitors are lightning fast
[21:53] <Klettbar> or they have already solved this problem
[21:54] <ali1234> it's like eve
[21:54] <ali1234> "this guy is sitting there mining asteroids for 18 hours a day. it must be a bot because no one is that sad" - person who sits and mines asteroids 18 hours a day
[21:57] <zleap> ok odd question does IRC predate the web on the internet
[21:57] <ali1234> hmm... switched to metacity and no bug. so it's definitely compiz, not xfce
[21:57] <ali1234> zleap: yes
[21:57] <ali1234> but only by a couple of years
[21:58] <popey> irc was ~1988
[21:58] <popey> www was ~1990
[21:59] <zleap> tanks
[21:59] <zleap> thanks
[22:00] <zleap> i am setting up an irc channel for my local rugby club
[22:01] <ali1234> i am imagining a load of huge rugby players typing on tiny keyboards with their massive hands
[22:01] <zleap> lol
[22:01] <zleap> yeah some have big hands
[22:02] <ali1234> ok switched back to compiz - now many windows won't unminimize at all
[22:04] <Klettbar> maybe it could detect the screen
[22:05] <Klettbar> maybe it can be done hardware on a touchscreen
[22:05] <Klettbar> if i learn how to do that maybe tehn i don't need to get those jobs lightning fast
[22:06] <ali1234> is this mechanical turk or something?
[22:07] <Klettbar> a robot
[22:07] <Klettbar> i need a robot working fro me
[22:07] <Klettbar> for
[22:08] <Klettbar> if you are able to solve that prob
[22:08] <ali1234> my taskbar is flashing like a christmas tree because nothing will unminimize
[22:08] <Klettbar> maybe i can pay you a little percent
[22:09] <Klettbar> are there programmer's jobs you have to grab faster than others
[22:10] <ali1234> i don't get jobs by being the first person to click on a website, so i dunno
[22:12] <popey> bigcalm: titan attacks is jolly good fun. i deffo need a controller tho ☺
[22:12] <popey> killing my thinkpad keyboard
[22:22] <Klettbar> ok let's change subjetc
[22:22] <Klettbar> ssd vs. hard disk
[22:22] <Klettbar> i will have to buy one soon
[22:23] <Klettbar> ssd vs. hdd reliability
[22:24] <directhex> depends on your usage patterns
[22:24] <popey> I have 7 SSDs and currently 15 HDDs and have had no SSDs fail
[22:24] <popey> but have had 3 HDDs fail
[22:24] <directhex> an hdd can only survive a limited number of on/off cycles
[22:25] <directhex> an ssd can only survive a limited number of write/erase cycles
[22:25] <directhex> so you pays yer money you makes yer choice :D
[22:25] <popey> \o/ backups
[22:25] <ali1234> popey: didn't you have an ssd fail though?
[22:25] <popey> no, i thought i did, but didnt
[22:26] <ali1234> ok
[22:26] <popey> it was the mobo
[22:26] <ali1234> i have only ever had two hard drives die in 20 years
[22:26] <directhex> i've had an HDD fail
[22:26] <directhex> just one
[22:27] <ali1234> neither was a maxtor, which is what i always used to buy
[22:27] <directhex> although at my last job we had a lot of disk failures in our ibm servers
[22:27] <directhex> some kind of "deskstar" drive. 60gxp series i think
[22:27] <ali1234> aka deathstar
[22:37] <ali1234> mm.... started up gnome-panel and it can unminimize windows just fine
[22:44] <Klettbar> popey : ssd and hdd had same age
[22:48] <popey> no, HDD older
[22:49] <popey> but my SSDs are all in daily use. for between 1 and 2 years now.
[22:49] <Klettbar> se
[22:49] <Klettbar> ssd are quite
[22:49] <Klettbar> quiet
[22:49] <Klettbar> but
[22:49] <popey> silent
[22:49] <Klettbar> also sad in a way
[22:50] <popey> sad?
[22:50] <popey> The price has come down quite a bit
[22:50] <Klettbar>  i think they woul dsuffer heat maybe more than hdd
[22:50] <popey> you can get 512GB SSDs for the price I paid for a 240GB one about a year ago
[22:51] <popey> not compared heat directly myself
[22:52] <Klettbar> with the price of 64 gb ssd one can get 320/500 Gb hdd
[22:52] <popey> yeah, i put a small SSD in my desktop and a big disk for data
[22:53] <directhex> Klettbar, an SSD doesn't suffer from heat as much as a desktop
[22:55] <Klettbar> i shofanless laptop
[22:55] <Klettbar> those who didipate heat through the whole chassi
[22:55] <Klettbar> ss
[22:55] <Klettbar> should have
[22:56] <directhex> a seagate barracuda has a safe operational temperature of 0-60°C, putting out about 8W of its own heat. an ocz vertex has an operational temperature of 0-70°C putting out about 2W of its own heat
[22:56] <Klettbar> ok
[23:04] <ali1234> does raring work properly at the moment?
[23:06] <directhex> i work on the assumption that ubuntu+1 may be unusably broken up to the same day as release. i'm too old to install it before it's had a chance to be proven working
[23:08] <AlanBell> ali1234: raring works great
[23:08] <AlanBell> I have been using it for many weeks with no issues
[23:08] <AlanBell> least breaky development release evar
[23:09]  * directhex remains suspicious
[23:10] <AlanBell> mostly running gnome-shell, but when I have looked at unity it hasn't been broken
[23:10] <AlanBell> I am guessing unity is a bit more volatile than shell
[23:18] <ali1234> directhex: that's not far from the truth. the problem is it doesn't magically start working on release day either
[23:19] <ali1234> AlanBell: i will be installing gnome classic, because i've had enough of xfce being broken
[23:19] <ali1234> i doubt it will have been changed in any significant way
[23:20] <Klettbar> i use uberstudent
[23:20] <Klettbar> it has a fast boot
[23:20] <ali1234> the main problem is getting nvidia driver to work, but apparently it is ok at the moment
[23:21] <AlanBell> gnome shell with https://extensions.gnome.org/extension/6/applications-menu/ is nice
[23:22] <AlanBell> but generally gnome shell is quite good at letting you run applications you want to run, and switching between open windows
[23:22] <ali1234> does it have a task bar?
[23:22] <ali1234> can i use indicators?
[23:22] <AlanBell> https://extensions.gnome.org/extension/368/taskbar-with-desktop-button-to-minimizeunminimize-/
[23:22] <ali1234> can i have that task bar on every monitor, showing only the windows from that monitor?
[23:23] <AlanBell> dunno, but extensions are really quite easy to write
[23:23] <AlanBell> even I can do it, just javascript
[23:23] <ali1234> why reinvent the wheel?
[23:24] <AlanBell> it is a better framework and you can do more stuff with it, but sure, gnome-panel does that already
[23:24] <ali1234> what can you do with it, that you can't do with gnome-panel?
[23:26] <ali1234> can i use the same theme for the panels and for windows?
[23:28] <AlanBell> the overview mode is kinda nice, super+type name of application to jump to it or launch it
[23:28] <ali1234> looks like gnome extensions has the same problem that firefox extensions has
[23:28] <ali1234> ie they change the api every two weeks and break all the old extensions
[23:28] <AlanBell> the way it handles workspace is kind of nice, a growing vertical list
[23:29] <redtape-renegade> MartijnVdS: Did you get my Spotify email ?
[23:29] <AlanBell> yes, they change the API revision number and break the extensions :(
[23:29] <AlanBell> even if they are not actually broken
[23:29] <redtape-renegade> MartijnVdS: You can mesage on it you know ;)
[23:29] <redtape-renegade> **message
[23:30] <ali1234> shell is damn ugly too
[23:30] <ali1234> https://extensions.gnome.org/static/extension-data/screenshots/screenshot_327_4.png
[23:30] <ali1234> why does everything have glowing round edges?
[23:31] <ali1234> this is not KDE
[23:31] <ali1234> the speech bubble style is terrible also
[23:31] <dwatkins> that's enough to make me switch to twm
[23:32] <ali1234> i also like how the space for the app label is not big enough for the majority of app names
[23:32] <dwatkins> ali1234: by the way, I understand the flash smurf bug is fixed, and was a result of a problem in the NVidia driver, although I can't confirm this for myself.
[23:32] <ali1234> it is fixed
[23:32] <AlanBell> there are extensions to remove the rounded corners
[23:32] <ali1234> it was fixed in libvdpau
[23:32] <dwatkins> I much prefer having a menu I can explore to see what apps are available.
[23:32] <ali1234> they added a special case for flash. when detected, it reverses the red and blue channels in the video
[23:32] <AlanBell> I like the rounded corners and menus as speech bubbles though
[23:32] <dwatkins> ali1234: fixed in libvdpau, or worked around?
[23:32] <ali1234> worked around, yes
[23:33] <dwatkins> ah I see, fair enough
[23:34] <ali1234> AlanBell: can extensions remove stuff that's already there?
[23:34] <AlanBell> yes
[23:34] <ali1234> can i make an extension that removes everything and starts over from scratch?
[23:34] <AlanBell> to my great sadness the #1 extension is the one that removes the accessibility indicator
[23:34] <ali1234> can i remove the whole panel?
[23:35] <ali1234> and also disable hot corners?
[23:35] <AlanBell> probably, and certainly the hot corner
[23:35] <ali1234> can i then draw my own panel that uses gtk widgets?
[23:36] <AlanBell> https://extensions.gnome.org/extension/3/bottom-panel/ is adding a panel
[23:36] <AlanBell> might be code in that to get a handle to a panel and remove it
[23:36] <ali1234> it's still black though
[23:37] <AlanBell> it works though
[23:37] <AlanBell> https://extensions.gnome.org/extension/118/no-topleft-hot-corner/ turns off the hot corner
[23:38] <AlanBell> the bottom panel thing needs to know about multi monitors a bit better
[23:38] <ali1234> when i tried gnome panel it did not make any attempt to manage multiple monitors at all
[23:39] <ali1234> you could drag a window onto another monitor. and then it owuld just stay there forever
[23:39] <AlanBell> https://extensions.gnome.org/extension/323/multiple-monitor-panels/
[23:42] <ali1234> seems like i would have to run an awful lot of javascript code that has had very little testing and code review
[23:42] <AlanBell> it does get tested and reviewed
[23:42] <AlanBell> my extension was reviewed
[23:42] <AlanBell> "very little" is probably still accurate
[23:43] <ali1234> http://art.gnome.org/themes
[23:43] <AlanBell> one thing I want to do is implement the HUD, but that means getting dbusmenu working
[23:43] <ali1234> where do they keep shell themes?
[23:44] <AlanBell> dunno
[23:45] <ali1234> http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-bK-68lM5VEo/TnOM_K1afrI/AAAAAAAAChI/x1ivWEk9ol0/s1600/gnome_shell_theme_elementary_luna_by_half_left.jpg
[23:45] <AlanBell> one thing I want to do is implement the HUD, but that means getting dbusmenu working and all the applications won't use it because of the wrong desktop environment
[23:45] <ali1234> that one looks quite nice
[23:46] <ali1234> can i have the sidebar thing on the top panel instead?
[23:46] <ali1234> and why do notifications come up from the bottom left?
[23:46] <ali1234> they have a speech bubble/arrow thing, but it doesn't point anywhere
[23:46] <AlanBell> notifcations come up from the bottom middle on mine
[23:47] <ali1234> ok. same question
[23:47] <AlanBell> if you hold the mouse down at the bottom you get a popup panel thing
[23:47] <ali1234> what for?
[23:47] <AlanBell> with a kind of history of notifications that you can dismiss or click on
[23:47] <ali1234> a hot edge?
[23:47] <AlanBell> and that is where stuff like skype and dropbox tray icons go
[23:48] <ali1234> i'd need to disabe that too
[23:48] <ali1234> and put those icons on the top panel
[23:48] <AlanBell> yup
[23:49] <ali1234> how easy is it to do this stuff?
[23:49] <AlanBell> https://extensions.gnome.org/extension/495/topicons/
[23:49] <AlanBell> easy peasy
[23:49] <ali1234> can you just do clock.delete(); clock.add(topright);
[23:49] <ali1234> or do you have to rewrite the entire clock functionality in order to get it to appear somewhere else?
[23:52] <AlanBell> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1685163/ that is the topicon extension
[23:52] <ali1234> is that extension multimonitor compatible?
[23:52] <AlanBell> erm, I am using it with two monitors
[23:52] <AlanBell> it put the tray icons on the right monitor
[23:52] <ali1234> that looks a lot like it reimplements the message box thing
[23:52] <AlanBell> dunno how that interacts with the other extensions I have installed
[23:52] <ali1234> yeah i need it to put them on every monitor
[23:52] <ali1234> i guess that will never be possible with the tray api though
[23:53] <ali1234> i am going to install gnome shell and try it, instead of installing raring
[23:53] <ali1234> then if it sucks i'll just delete it and install raring
[23:53] <AlanBell> cool
[23:54] <AlanBell> the extension site is great, when you are running shell you just get a switch on each page to automatically download, install, activate the extension
[23:54] <ali1234> do i install "gnome"
[23:54] <AlanBell> they go in ~.local/share/gnome-shell/extensions
[23:54] <ali1234> and that's everything?
[23:54] <ali1234> do you have to run gnome web browser for that to work?
[23:54] <AlanBell> just install gnome-shell I think
[23:55] <AlanBell> no, it works in chromium and firefox
[23:55] <ali1234> that doesn't install very much of anything
[23:55] <ali1234> remember i am using xfce...
[23:55] <AlanBell> ah
[23:55] <ali1234> xubuntu specifically
[23:55] <ali1234> i went for gnome anyway
[23:56] <popey> heh, steam showed 108 games for linux at 14:00 today, now it's 112..
[23:56] <ali1234> still waiting for arma 2
[23:58] <popey> right, my nexus 7 running ubuntu phone OS is at 100% charge.. will unplug it at 00:00 and turn off the screen to see how long the battery lasts
[23:58] <popey> (it boots faster than Android)
[23:59] <ali1234> are you gonna stay up until 4am?
[23:59] <popey> haha
[23:59] <AlanBell> so, does it rotate?
[23:59] <ubuntubhoy> lol
[23:59] <ali1234> linux killed battery on my htc wizard
[23:59] <ali1234> at least it had replaceable battery