=== XenGi_ is now known as XenGi [00:55] infinity: ogra_ thanks. I came home and plugged it into the duracell battery pack and it managed to boot and install while i was making tea =) [00:58] I wonder if we actually want an adb bridge running on ubuntu and allow to execute those commands (some of) === mainerror|away is now known as mainerror === mainerror is now known as mainerror|away === mainerror|away is now known as mainerror === mainerror is now known as mainerror|away === zz_chihchun is now known as chihchun === chihchun is now known as zz_chihchun === rsalveti_ is now known as rsalveti === jackyalcine is now known as zz_jackyalcine === zz_chihchun is now known as chihchun [05:46] You guys aware of the Horrible english on the Nexus 7 install instruction page? [05:47] "You will be connect the device to your WiFi network " [05:58] oye, theres a lot of new information in there since I was last maintaining it. [06:00] Which really there isnt any point in installing, Correct? [06:00] Doesnt Ubuntu for Tablets launch Thursday? [06:00] making These desktop-style builds obsolete? [06:08] Meh, Completely up to you if you want to install or not. [06:09] I do believe that the Ubuntu for Tablets launch is soon! Not sure about the exact ETA. [06:09] It's Thursday [06:09] regardless, I fixed that first paragraph. [06:09] According to 4 different news sources, Ubuntu Phone and ubuntu tablet launch Thursday [06:10] Can you share a bit of information about it with me? assuming you know about it? lol [06:10] is there any bugs for Nexus 7 wifi saying device not ready? [06:11] i just installed Ubuntu for Nexus 7, No wifi problems here [06:11] RDash-BNC: during install? [06:11] after installed [06:11] only problem so far is screen rotation and OTG Device support seems to have disappeared [06:12] dmesg says CFG8011-ERROR) wl_cfg80211_hang : In : chip crash eventing [06:12] and dhd_preinit_ioctls: can't get MAC address , error=-5 [06:12] RDash-BNC: dahh, i'm not really sure. I've been out of rotation for at least 3 months with the N7 doing other things. Your best bet is to check the existing bugs @ https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-nexus7 .. If you don't see anything, file one [06:13] Also, not really a bug, more of a missing feature, the Ubuntu Software Center seems to have no search bar [06:13] does build-essential override anything important for wifi? [06:13] i just happened to be "strolling by" #ubuntu-arm and saw Sailormoons initial blurb about the wiki [06:14] I have to say, you guys are very quick with development [06:14] wasnt just two months ago the Nexus 7 builds were garbage [06:14] Now i could actually see myself using this [06:14] true [06:15] other than the random framebuffer problems when rebooting [06:15] Ubuntu for Tablets launching Thursday [06:15] it is? [06:15] Supposidly, yes [06:15] http://www.itpro.co.uk/tablets/19236/ubuntu-tablet-os-will-make-its-debut-nexus-7-21-february [06:16] heh [06:16] I wonder if they hammered out the very major bugs [06:16] I wonder as well [06:16] screen rotation has me in fear of todays build [06:17] https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-nexus7/+bug/1068994 and https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-nexus7/+bug/1070283 are very annoying [06:17] Ubuntu bug 1068994 in ubuntu-nexus7 "button1 gets stuck after a while" [Critical,Confirmed] [06:17] Ubuntu bug 1070283 in ubuntu-nexus7 "after reboot, framebuffer of previous boot appears on screen" [High,Confirmed] [06:17] I know they are still patching it but still annoying [06:17] well, it wont be a stable build lol [06:17] is the button1 problem still around? [06:17] * sfeole looks at the bug [06:18] "button1"? [06:18] left mouse button [06:18] or a single finger tap [06:18] SailorMoon: the first bug listed above [06:18] ohhh [06:18] darn lol [06:18] that will make it unusable [06:18] and is there a way to install a compiler w/o bricking the wifi drivers? [06:18] yeap [06:19] RDash-BNC: i thought there was a convo about that RDash-BNC a few months / weeks ago here [06:19] let me check scrollback [06:19] going to reflash since it's all bricked [06:20] maybe dropbear or build-essential did it [06:20] Will Ubuntu Mobile make use of /system? or is my old android install just going to sleep there lol [06:22] No way to mount ubuntu over USB? =/ [06:23] and I just screwed up my initrd [06:23] I think that explains why my wifi broke === XenGi is now known as XenGi_ [06:30] My ubuntu just did the button1 thing =/ [06:30] just tap slowly [06:45] Hey, can someone help be get started on Installing Ubuntu for my Nexus 4? [06:46] Anonymous905: did you mean Nexus 7? [06:46] Well actually I have a Nexus 10, but I'm curious how I can go about installing Ubuntu on platforms other than PC [06:47] Right now, I think Nexus 7 is the only tablet running a kinda working Ubuntu [06:50] what does my display manager log have other than my hostname? [06:53] In that case, how do I get a Nexus 7 to run Ubuntu? [06:55] The wiki has the instructions for it. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Nexus7/Installation [06:55] Just remeber it's just the desktop and it's quite buggy [07:09] hello [07:09] have any of you got ubuntu for android working as a desktop? [07:10] it looks like i need an mhl adapter with the cradle, and a bluetooth keyboard. is that right? [07:15] ashes: you can use your finger for all the input [07:17] doesn't ubuntu run from a chroot? [07:17] uh [07:18] i'm not talking about running ubuntu in the android display. i'm talking about having it displayed to an hdmi monitor. i would prefer a keyboard for that === scrts_ is now known as scrts [07:30] good morning [09:44] xnox, what would adb gauin us over the serial console, usbnet and an optional sshd that we already ship ? [09:45] * ogra_ realy isnt fond of including any android stuff [09:45] true. [09:45] i'll just rip apart adbd to gain reboot bootloader. [09:45] especialy if it just duplicates standard linux tools we have already [09:46] oh, ok [09:46] why not, it's so trendy :) [09:46] well, we can surely mimic the userspace bit of reboot bootloader ... but will also need the kernel support [09:46] I have ubuntu 12.10 on my host machine. Is it possible to install arm-none-eabi- tool chain by apt-get install ... ? [09:46] what would arm-none-eabi be ? that sounds ancient [09:48] I have a arm926ej-s cpu, I guess arm-linux-gnueabi- does not support it [09:48] that should support v5 [09:49] do I need to download arm-linux-gnueabi- then compile it for arch=armv5te ? [09:49] or do I need to have arm-none-eabi- [09:49] ogra_: well the linux patches were supposedly upstreamed. https://lwn.net/Articles/504721/ [09:50] unless that's intel only and not android. [09:50] well, then we would be able to just ship a hacked reboot binary [09:51] angs, it should default to that, shouldne need arch= [09:51] *shouldnt === mainerror|away is now known as mainerror [10:26] hehe, i guess linus had hard time remembering children's birthdays hence using them as magic numbers for reboot syscall made sure he can look them up on any machine ;-) [10:27] heh [10:43] so the reboot syscall in ubuntu-nexus7 kernel does copy across the restart command... i'm stopping to dig further into arch specific implementations. but it's no different from the android kernel. === doko_ is now known as doko [10:45] prpplague: hi, early bird [11:00] xnox, well, it is the android kernel, just a different config [11:01] which reminds me ... [11:02] * ogra_ upgrades his n7 to yesterdays kernel [11:12] ogra_: right but stock android doesn't have much of an init system hence their reboot utility remounts the rootfs ro before doing reboot into firmware. [11:13] hmm, we could do that in a "startr on stopping filesystem" job or so [11:13] ogra_: and our reboot is naturally is handled by upstart which has it's own shutdown utility. I can see how I can force `reboot -f bootloader` but i'm not sure how to correctly hook into the whole sysvinit mechanics. [11:14] otherwise the next boot will not be clean. [11:14] we could ship our own reboot-bootloader binary [11:14] ogra_: no, one cannot use upstart job to accomplish that, since upstart is killed by sendsigs and then later the filesystem is unmounted and finally we reboot with sysvinit I believe. [11:14] that gets called instead of upstarts reboot in the case where you call it with the bootloader arg [11:15] ogra_: i'll do / try a quick dirty force one and then will work with jodh on the proper one which does it correctly. [11:15] k [11:15] we will needed for UEFI fastboot anyway, since we will need an option to "reboot into firmware" and we have designs from mpt for the reboot dialog as well on the desktop. [11:16] ugh, we want to expose that to the user ? === quin_ is now known as quin [11:20] ogra_: for UEFI fastboot we must. As UEFI fastboot means there is no physical way to interrupt the boot process. [11:21] (no usb, no keyboard, no networking, straight from poweron to boot the default configured OS as fast as it can) [11:21] well, i would consider that an admin task, not an enduser task ... and keep it as cmdline option [11:23] and to get back to e.g. grub or like recovery-mode one needs to be able to get there somehow. [11:23] hmm [11:23] well we will need a cmdline option to begin with =) to be able to actually do it ;-) [11:28] yeah === quin_ is now known as quin === dholbach_ is now known as dholbach [12:13] ~gibber 6 [12:13] ~gibberish 6 [12:14] oh sorry, please excuse me, wrong channel === arun_ is now known as arun === quin_ is now known as quin === Dr_Who is now known as tgall === Quintasan_ is now known as Quintasan [15:31] ogra_: I totally made upstart's: reboot -f bootloader [15:31] boot back into fastboot mode ;-) [15:32] lol [15:32] how evil :) [15:33] Now all you need to do is extend the system indicator to offer that option on the nexus 7. :p [15:33] hahaha [15:37] Hey, can i ask question about Ubuntu Mobile? Something is said in an official video [15:38] This image pretty much sums up my question http://i.imgur.com/AaRFzN7.png [15:38] He mentions running Windows apps, showing a tablet. [15:38] Is this an x86 example? [15:38] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thin_client [15:39] it is not running on the tablet [15:39] SailorMoon: if you listen to the video it is via thin client [15:39] Well i didnt know what a thin client was [15:39] I think we use those at work to process Orders [15:39] lol [15:39] Thanks for the info [15:39] SailorMoon: it runs on a windows machine elsewhere and you just access it via the thin client [15:40] Lol gotcha, useless feature [15:40] it may have been unfortunate to show that in the video, I've seen many people just assuming it runs windows apps :/ [15:40] i didnt think it did [15:40] was wondering how that was done lol [15:41] We get flashable builds tomorrow, right? [15:43] May i ask the stupidest question ever? [15:44] Java Runtime Environment? [15:44] Also, The builds of Ubuntu 13.04 for the Nexus 7 no longer support OTG Keyboards, will this mobile version? [15:46] openjdk should be available as usual, and I don't think Ubunut doesn't support OTG on nexus 7 Oo [15:47] The old 12 builds supported Mouse and Keyboard over OTG [15:47] But the new Dailies don't [15:48] I'm gonna try that [15:48] thanks~ [15:49] id also like to recommend You guys create a channel for Ubuntu Mobile [15:49] Because this feels more like a Dev channel than a social/support channel [15:49] Unless i'm wrong [15:49] it works okay [15:49] Last nights build didnt [15:50] i installed it last night and used my OTG cable and it didnt work [15:50] Unless my spare keyboard kicked the bucket (it IS cracked in half, but still worked as of a few days ago), ill test it on my desktop [15:50] yeah it works fine [15:51] didnt work on yesterdays 13.04 daily for the Nexus 7 [15:52] kernel was updated, maybe they changed something, gimme a while to update [15:52] Thanks again. my OTG cable and keyboard are working fine on Android [15:52] So it isnt my hardware [15:57] I hope this doesnt delay the launch [15:57] i guess it wont :P [15:58] I'm excited to replace android with something useful, is all [15:59] SailorMoon, that demos the rdp client if you use the tablet in thin client mode [15:59] ah, davmor2 already answered [15:59] * ogra_ should read the full becklog before answering :) [16:00] lol [16:00] Thanks anyway, ogra_ === cj5 is now known as cyber-6 [16:00] So, are the ARM guys ready to get popular? [16:00] ogra_: pleasure :) [16:00] lol [16:01] how well does everything work on Ubuntu Mobile in comparison to the Dailies we're getting for the Nexus 7? [16:01] Screen rotation issues, "sleep" issues, and button1 issues plague it [16:03] SailorMoon, i am already popular :P [16:03] ask my GF [16:04] what was Ubuntu ARM doing before this? [16:04] ogra_: I asked her the air went blue, what have you done to that poor woman ;) [16:05] haha [16:06] SailorMoon, building the archive, making images for developer boards (and occasionally for an enduser devcie like the ac100 or now the nexus7) [16:06] the arm port is around since 2009 [16:06] SailorMoon: OTG works okay [16:07] Why didnt it work for me last night then Tassadar =/ [16:07] you have to connect keyboard to OTG reduction and then the OTG cable to tablet [16:07] i did that [16:07] well, it works for me [16:07] Ill take your word for it, then :P [16:08] maybe not in the installation dialog but even then, it should work as expected [16:08] it didnt owrk then and it didnt work when i was trying to type Terminal into the app search thingy on Unity [16:08] But to be fair, durring my attempt to search for apps in unity, i couldnt get the virtual keyboard to pop up either [16:09] and got several system errors [16:09] :P [16:09] Will the Ubuntu for Tablets be just a sexier titanic? [16:11] will the aliens arrive tomorrow? [16:11] we'll see [16:12] Tassadar: we are here now but shhhh don't tell everyone ;) [16:13] i _knew_ it! [16:17] Okay now for the stupidest question [16:17] Nexus 7 wont run Minecraft right? [16:17] For 3D Acceleration reasons, not to mention the slow ARM processor? [16:18] also on Ubuntu Mobile, what happens if install LXDE, or KDE, Etc? (Hey, someone has to ask the dumb questions) [16:19] SailorMoon, get an old toshiba ac100 netbook ... we provide lubuntu images for it :) [16:19] everything works, KDE, lxde ... xfce ... [16:19] Thats totally diferent [16:19] I know it would work on the Dailies for Nexus 7 [16:19] right [16:19] i mean the actual Mobile ubuntu, with the side swipe, etc [16:20] well, no idea, i havent seen the code yet (and if i had i wouldnt talk about it before it is publically released) [16:20] What kind of Memory usage am i going to see just from the system with nothing installed? [16:20] ahh [16:20] it releases tomorrow though, i've been told by magical unicorn sources [16:20] should be similar or lower than the current nexus7 image [16:21] where we are right below 400M for an idling desktop [16:21] So more then Android [16:21] To be expected, i guess [16:21] The difference between a real OS ;P [16:21] nope, to be cut down :) [16:22] if we are done with the cut down work (which is still going on) i would put my bets on 256M for the idling desktop [16:22] and note that i'm talking about the actual desktop here [16:22] the tablet studff might then even eat less [16:23] (once we have it fully integrated) [16:24] the current work we do in ubuntu arm brings benefits for all desktops no matter what arch is below ... raring x86 desktop should already be a *lot* smaller and faster than 12.10 was [16:24] huh [16:24] Android wit honly a few things running is using 418MB of ram on my Nexus 7 [16:25] Difference being Android kills off Processes when memory gets tight, ubuntu can't do that, right? [16:25] ubuntu should use /system as swap [16:25] ubuntu can do that as well indeed [16:26] it just doesnt [16:26] if ubuntu used /system as swap, it wouldnt need to [16:26] we use compressed swap in ram [16:26] to not wear out the MMC [16:26] but what are you guys doing with /system ? [16:26] nothing atm (in the nexus7 image, cant talk about the tablet one yet) [16:27] My recommendation: Put a recovery image in there [16:27] (not because i'm not allowed, i was simply to busy to take a look yet) [16:27] in case people break their ubuntu, they could recover it with no struggle [16:28] the /system partition is like 700MB or something on the Nexus 7 [16:29] would also be good for OTA updates to store the update to make writing to /userdata safer [16:29] Anyway, ill shutup now lol [16:29] we dont touch /system in the current ubuntu image [16:29] i know [16:29] ubuntu lives in userdata [16:29] you should take advantage of everything your offered [16:29] if i would the image would wipe the device and use one big partition [16:29] lol [16:30] that would like, ruin Android [16:30] who cares [16:30] no going back lol [16:30] I care) [16:30] sure going back is always possible [16:30] i honestly wouldnt mind it if there was a no-fail way of undoing it [16:31] There's going to be people who install it and say "well, this isnt for me" [16:31] and ? [16:31] they can jusr reßflash android then [16:31] i know :P [16:31] but if you destroyed the partitions, that might be a bit harder [16:31] lol [16:31] its not like we trash the device [16:32] nah, you can always flash from fastboot and restore it [16:32] the tablet image will likely completely take over everything [16:32] I just realized what should be done with /system [16:32] repartitioning is not an option on nexus 7 anyway because of the bootloader, isn't it? [16:32] *is it? [16:32] Bootloader can be unlocked just by typing "unlock" [16:33] Tassadar, depends, if nvflash works now, you can even replace the bootloader with it [16:33] no, it doesn't [16:33] it didnt work back when we started with the n7, else i would have picked that route [16:33] you can on every other tegra [16:33] n7's bootloader is encrypted [16:33] and device-specific encrypted [16:33] right, you need the key [16:33] you guys need an android-style .zip package that installs like a rom, containing a Mini installer, with just wifi drivers, etc. To download the /userdata [16:34] SailorMoon, i think thats what the tablet image does [16:34] You'll get more users that way instead of the complex way its done with the Dailies [16:34] using zips and replacing all of android with the ubuntu image [16:34] SailorMoon, huh ? [16:34] its currently done with fastboot, wich 90% of android users have no idea how to use [16:34] whats complex there ? its a one click UI installer [16:35] For ubuntu users* [16:35] oh, well, i wouldnt ask my mom to use fastboot if there is a one click installer that runs fully automatic [16:35] (which we offer since day one) [16:35] Unless your mom was on Windows [16:35] or Mac [16:35] or A non-ubuntu distro [16:36] well, *my* mom wouldnt be on either :) [16:36] but i see what you mean, yeah [16:36] Point is [16:36] well, the tablet image works this way [16:36] androidusers are experienced with .zip packages that can be installed via Recovery [16:36] the nexus7 image never was for users [16:36] yeah, a horrid way [16:36] Horrid but familiar. [16:37] still nothing a normal unexperienced user would do [16:37] a normal unexperienced user doesnt even know what Linux is [16:37] So [16:37] :P [16:37] right [16:37] we need to define "normal" here) [16:38] ive been flashing Roms for a long time, but this was the first time i Really used Fastboot other than to unlock [16:38] but he would use the ubuntu tablet installer for windows ... with a one click UI :) [16:38] Tassadar, your mom [16:38] its a scary experience [16:38] or worse (since wimen are usually better at tech stuff) your dad [16:38] scary experience for first-timers* [16:38] dude, I'm afraid to let that man to use computer [16:38] SailorMoon, and using a zip wasnt when you did it the first time ? [16:39] I guess your right [16:39] Tassadar, then he is the perfect target user :) [16:39] But like i said [16:39] Every tech android user has flashed zip roms [16:39] * ogra_ usues his mom as tester if he writes apps [16:39] very few have done it with fastboot [16:39] SailorMoon, it wont be "flashing" at all [16:39] it will be "use the ubuntu installer for your OS" [16:39] but if you take that as target user group, then they will wait for real ubuntu tablets - like preinstalled new models from OEMs, and they won't give a damn about hows it called [16:40] yeah, indeed [16:40] So there will be a Windows installer, then? [16:40] i'm talking more about the early adopters [16:40] SailorMoon, i woudl hope so [16:40] else it wouldnt be ubuntu ;) [16:40] the issue with windows are usually the drivers :/ [16:41] yeah you'll need fastboot drivers [16:41] well, i would assume people attaching their adnroid device to win already have a driver for it [16:41] Windows doesnt install those itself [16:41] which they used to put i.e. music on the device [16:41] like i said earlier, not many have used fastboot, and thus not many will have the Fastboot driver [16:41] adb/fastboot drivers are often not the same thing as "normal" drivers [16:41] that driver is different, Ogra [16:42] anyway, no need to speculate ... we'll see where we are by 14.04 [16:42] infact on windows 8, i couldnt even install my fastboot driver [16:42] which is the actual target date [16:42] before "normal" users wont really use it anyway [16:42] lol [16:42] We totally will. it's too exciting to pass up ;P [16:43] you arent a normal user [16:43] Then why do i feel so Nooby. [16:43] you are in an IRC developer channel dude ! [16:43] lol [16:43] normal users dont do that [16:44] last night i did something stupid [16:44] did a Clockwork backup of my Android and its data but instead of moving it to my PC i moved it to internal memory [16:44] then i installed Ubuntu [16:45] and was like "Q~Q" [16:46] I managed to do something like that in a day or two after I got n7, wasn't really used to not having sdcard) [16:46] oops [16:46] pfft [16:46] that's why titaniumbackup + backup on dropbox roxx [16:46] Is there anything like Wine, but Android? [16:46] do ayou know how our binfmt handler for qemu-user-statinc works ? [16:47] it enables you to exec arm binaries on an x86 pc [16:47] I play some Android Games id rather not give up [16:47] I had QEmu on my Nexus 7 [16:47] I wonder will ubuntuone ever get popular in android apps [16:47] was running x86 linux on my Nexus 7 [16:47] very poorly <3 [16:47] i once wrongly unpacked a tarball with arm root filesystem while being in a custome phoe conf [16:48] Ubuntu one is fail (NOT THE FACE D;) [16:48] sadly i missed that i unpacked it to / [16:48] and i didnt notice it at all, since my PC happily execudes arm binaries [16:48] until the next reboot ... [16:49] *customer phone conf [16:49] i dont use Ubuntu on my desktop/laptop because of driver issues, hardware bugs, etc. But Ubuntu mobile, since its device specific, wont have any of these issues, right? Thats why im excited, anyway [16:49] I would totally use Ubuntu if the learning curve was smaller [16:49] lol [16:49] thats a brave assumption [16:49] i mean, i know it will be buggy but [16:50] it will be focused [16:50] does win8 have less bugs on phones than on the desktop ? [16:50] lol i wouldnt know [16:50] i dont even cal lthat shameful peice of trash Windows 8 [16:51] Windows RT [16:51] Runs only binaries signed by Microsoft [16:51] well, be sure ubuntu on phones and tablets will have bugs as well [16:51] i know [16:51] as all software has them [16:51] i didnt mean it like that [16:51] and there could even be owrse ones than on the desktop [16:52] *worse [16:52] i mean any bugs ive had on my desktop due to my hardware wont occure the same way on the tablet because the same hardware was developed on [16:52] usually bugs on such devices are way more fatal [16:52] simply because you only have one single way of input === highvolt1ge is now known as highvoltage [16:53] i just spenbt a weekend trying to fix the installer ... having to do that from an initramfs prompt on y touch device is no fun [16:54] Ubuntu Mobile will be less Likely to throw a Terminal in your face, is what i mean [16:54] that X bug with touch input must be real pain in the ass too :/ [16:54] sure, it will just get stuck instead [16:54] yeah [16:54] it happened to me twice last night, Tassadar [16:54] made me switch back to Android [16:54] Tassadar, it is, but not my area of expertise, so i'm wainitng for a fix to appear [16:55] sadly not even upstream seems to have a clue [16:55] The ubuntu desktop appears whe nyou connect a mouse and keyboard, the video revealed that, right? [16:55] Will that occure when you connect just a mouse? just a keyboard? [16:55] or requires both? [16:56] or will there be some magical switch somewhere? [16:56] i doubt thats in the demo yet [16:57] but the theory is that at some point when its implemented, the device will detect a monitor and switch modes [16:57]