[17:00]  * pleia2 waves
[17:01] <czajkowski> aloha
[17:02]  * vibhav waves
[17:02] <funkyHat> Hello
[17:02] <Tm_T> hi funkee
[17:03]  * funkyHat o/
[17:03] <vibhav> Tm_T: Irc council? :)
[17:03] <Tm_T> vibhav: yes?
[17:04] <YokoZar> Hello
[17:04] <dholbach> hi
[17:04] <AlanBell> o/
[17:05] <topyli> hi
[17:05]  * AlanBell installs phablet tools
[17:05]  * cprofitt waves
[17:09] <cprofitt> #startmeeting
[17:09] <meetingology> Meeting started Thu Feb 21 17:09:05 2013 UTC.  The chair is cprofitt. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
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[17:09] <pleia2> hello
[17:09] <cprofitt> Hello everyone and welcome to the CC meeting
[17:09] <cprofitt> today we will be touching base with the IRC Council and Developer Advisory Team
[17:09] <dholbach> I see we have a number of IRC Council people here. :)
[17:09] <cprofitt> are people here from IRC Council?
[17:10]  * cprofitt smiles
[17:10] <dholbach> And a bit fewer DAT people too. :)
[17:10] <AlanBell> hi cprofitt
[17:10] <Tm_T> moin
[17:10] <topyli> o/
[17:10] <funkyHat> Hello
[17:10] <Tm_T> all but one from ircc, nice
[17:10] <cprofitt> great, lets start with the IRC Council
[17:10] <cprofitt> #topic IRC Council
[17:11] <cprofitt> #chair czajkowski dholbach pleia2 YokoZar
[17:11] <meetingology> Current chairs: YokoZar cprofitt czajkowski dholbach pleia2
[17:11] <dholbach> how are you all doing? how has the cycle been for the IRC Council so far?
[17:12] <czajkowski> anyone can answer :)
[17:12] <AlanBell> hi dholbach, I think this cycle has been fine, a bit quieter than the previous one perhaps
[17:13] <AlanBell> we did operator recruitment again, and k1l joined the team
[17:13] <AlanBell> doing recruitment in line with the development cycles still seems to make sense to me
[17:13] <dholbach> AlanBell, was it because of less planned work for the cycle or because of less adhoc "let's get the IRC Council involved" requests?
[17:13] <Tm_T> as I've been aboard on council for half a year, I've felt we've been basicly just doing what we always do, nothing special lately
[17:14] <cprofitt> are all operator teams well staffed?
[17:14] <AlanBell> all operator teams seem appropriately staffed, we have not really had any issues of a lack of operators
[17:14] <cprofitt> good to hear
[17:15] <AlanBell> dholbach: a bit of both, we made some changes in the prior cycle and had stuff like the Lubuntu operators to bring in etc
[17:15] <AlanBell> one thing I want to look at soon is disaster recovery for ubottu.com, that server had some reliability issues before christmas and we are a bit more dependent on it than I would like to be
[17:16]  * cprofitt nods
[17:16] <dholbach> do the IRC Council is down to the bottom of their TODO list? :)
[17:16] <czajkowski> AlanBell: do you feel it's a quieter cycle as it's the council has been organised and things are running smoothly ?
[17:16] <AlanBell> well there is an email in my inbox now that has arrived on the todo list, I think you all have a copy of that too
[17:16] <cprofitt> AlanBell: is ubottu currently a single server solution?
[17:16] <Tm_T> cprofitt: yes
[17:17] <AlanBell> don't really want to go through that until we have all read it
[17:17] <cprofitt> AlanBell: yes, we got that email
[17:17] <cprofitt> same here AlanBell
[17:17] <Tm_T> czajkowski: from long time ops POV I'd say we've quite estamblished team so things are bound to run rather smoothly
[17:17] <cprofitt> Tm_T: would you be looking at an HA solution or just a disaster recovery?
[17:17] <AlanBell> disaster recovery
[17:17] <Tm_T> ^
[17:18] <czajkowski> Tm_T: that's good to hear.
[17:18] <czajkowski> AlanBell: is there anything the CC can help with ?
[17:18] <AlanBell> we are cool with it being down for a few hours, but if it went and didn't come back we would be a bit annoyed
[17:18] <AlanBell> so we want a plan for that
[17:18] <dholbach> do you have new community members helping out in the irc world?
[17:18]  * cprofitt nods to AlanBell 
[17:18] <Tm_T> I wouldn't mind having more fresh blood in our ranks but as IRC administration is easily rather heavy duty I understand why we don't have that much changes
[17:19] <Tm_T> dholbach: some, but more wouldn't hurt ^
[17:19] <AlanBell> there are a few regular helpers who are not ops
[17:19] <AlanBell> some don't really want to be ops, which is fair enough
[17:20] <dholbach> did some of them take the ubuntu irc members route?
[17:20] <czajkowski> Tm_T: why do you say it's heavy duty ?
[17:20] <AlanBell> we have yet to award a membership, but we do have M4V on our agenda as a membership application
[17:21] <Tm_T> czajkowski: you know how high-paced #ubuntu can be and when we're doing our work we often face rather abusive response
[17:21] <Tm_T> and sometimes decisions have to be done rather quickly
[17:21]  * cprofitt nods at Tm_T 
[17:21] <czajkowski> ok
[17:22] <Tm_T> I would love to way a find to lower the barrier to get into our irc team activity, something that doesn't necessarily require op rights
[17:22] <Tm_T> +find
[17:22] <cprofitt> Tm_T: I think there is also a realization by ops that they often represent the face of Ubuntu to users on IRC and their actions will really reflect on the project as a whole
[17:22] <Tm_T> cprofitt: that, very much so
[17:23] <pleia2> I think there was a UDS session that discussed some tasks others could take on, like bot wrangling and updating of docs
[17:24] <Tm_T> yup, that's one thing
[17:24] <dholbach> do you have a gut feeling for how well channels like #ubuntu are running, compared to earlier times? more/less bans? more/less complaints? more/less stress?
[17:24] <cprofitt> good question dholbach
[17:25] <dholbach> I just thought that the team must surely have gotten some experience over the last cycles, which probably helped
[17:25] <dholbach> but yeah, just a gut feeling would be good to hear from you :)
[17:25] <Tm_T> I feel things are more settled these days as the community has matured somewhat, others might see it differently though ):
[17:25] <AlanBell> it goes up and down, we have 1859 users in there at the moment, which is quite a lot, I think the number of bans has probably gone down
[17:25] <Tm_T> (: even
[17:26] <Tm_T> I spend more time on other channels than #ubuntu so my perspective contains those too
[17:26] <AlanBell> I might try and do some stats on the frequency of bans and kicks issued
[17:26] <Tm_T> AlanBell: that would be nice
[17:26] <AlanBell> we haven't done much time analysis on the data
[17:27] <pleia2> gut-wise I've felt things be a whole lot calmer in irc-land
[17:27] <cprofitt> I would agree pleia2
[17:27] <Tm_T> pleia2: I have a feeling that our community has succeeded on creating an environment that helps on keeping bad behaviour limited (:
[17:27] <pleia2> I do see a fair amount of "I can't get help in #ubuntu" but that's really an issue with the size of the channel, it's not really possible to avoid
[17:27] <pleia2> Tm_T: yeah
[17:27] <pleia2> and plenty of people do get help in #ubuntu
[17:28] <AlanBell> there are also good, more focussed channels
[17:28] <AlanBell> like #ubuntu-tablet/phone/steam
[17:28] <AlanBell> so they are taking some of the chatter load out of #ubuntu
[17:29] <pleia2> that's good
[17:29] <Tm_T> and flavour channels ofcourse
[17:30] <dholbach> is there anything the CC or the wider community could do to help?
[17:30] <czajkowski> AlanBell: so now things are stable and working well, what would the IRC like to work on next?
[17:31] <Tm_T> dholbach: I would love to improve communication between teams (hey, theme from UDS)
[17:31] <Tm_T> I bet there's many ways how irc team could help other teams
[17:32] <dholbach> Tm_T, nice one
[17:32] <Tm_T> maybe we should advertise "we would love to help you, come and ask!" more or something
[17:32] <pleia2> :)
[17:33] <dholbach> maybe a session at open week or user days too?
[17:33] <dholbach> (in case you haven't done one of these in a while)
[17:33]  * AlanBell wonders if there is a QML IRC client
[17:33] <Tm_T> dholbach: perhaps, but it would be nice to know what others would need from us there (:
[17:33] <pleia2> open week would be most appropriate, or stand alone sessions (I think we wanted some this cycle, but didn't get around to it yet)
[17:34] <vibhav> AlanBell: I plan on writing one :)
[17:34] <pleia2> Tm_T: aha, you have an action item :) https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/community-r-irc-workshops
[17:35] <Tm_T> I do
[17:36] <Tm_T> but yeah, more of those would be good
[17:37] <dholbach> any more questions? :)
[17:37]  * dholbach is all set
[17:37] <czajkowski> likewise
[17:37] <cprofitt> I am as well
[17:37] <czajkowski> as we do have another board to get through
[17:38] <cprofitt> #topic Developer Advisory Team
[17:38] <AlanBell> perhaps some CC folk could pop into #ubuntu-irc-council later to chat about the email we received
[17:38] <cprofitt> welcome Developer Advisory Team!
[17:38] <cprofitt> AlanBell: will do
[17:38] <czajkowski> sure
[17:38] <dholbach> vibhav, _o/\o_
[17:38] <dholbach> hello hello :-D
[17:38] <dholbach> got any questions for us? :)
[17:38] <czajkowski> aloha :)
[17:39] <cprofitt> so how has this cycle been for the team?
[17:39] <czajkowski> dholbach: well I don't know much about the board, but I have seen it get involved in some discussion on the DMB, so I'm curious to know who the team is interacting with others and making progress?
[17:40] <dholbach> what the DAT does is mostly reaching out to development contributors... to folks who just got their first patch into Ubuntu, so we can welcome them, help them and ask for their feedback
[17:40] <vibhav> o/
[17:40] <dholbach> but we also talk to more experienced people, ask for their feedback, help them apply for upload rights if we feel they're ready
[17:40] <dholbach> and reach out to inactive folks as wlel
[17:40] <dholbach> well
[17:40] <vibhav> czajkowski: We recently had a meeting and we decided to work on some few targets
[17:41] <dholbach> we brought vibhav and jokerdino on board a couple of months ago, which was necessary as some of our old members got quite active with life
[17:41] <dholbach> the idea about working more closely with the DMB was in order to help developers who can apply for upload rights soon
[17:42] <vibhav> We also aim to help members who are rejected
[17:42] <dholbach> Iain Lane brought up the idea and we felt that it'd make sense to have a chat before folks apply, so we can either help fix the application or just take a bit more time until they apply
[17:42] <czajkowski> aye Laney does get some good ideas alright :)
[17:42] <Laney> meow
[17:42] <pleia2> :)
[17:42] <vibhav> czajkowski: Indeed
[17:43] <czajkowski> dholbach: I see the DAT focuses a lot on the develpers who are already involved, how do you get new people who may be involved locally at loco level to take the plunge
[17:44] <dholbach> that's nothing the DAT looks into really - we're mostly reacting to other people's contributions or lack of contributions I guess
[17:44] <czajkowski> ah I see
[17:44] <vibhav> czajkowski: dholbach maintains a list of New developers which is automatically updated
[17:44] <ScottK> dholbach: It might make sense to review the applications on the next DMB meeting agenda and proactively give feedback to applicants if warrented.
[17:44] <cprofitt> +1 ScottK
[17:44] <dholbach> ScottK, nice one
[17:44] <ScottK> (fwiw, we have a meeting Monday)
[17:45] <dholbach> I'm in the middle of the craziest of weeks, but I'll add something to my list
[17:45] <dholbach> and share it with the rest of the team
[17:45] <ScottK> That would also avoid it looking like talk with the DAT before applying is an actual part of the application process.
[17:46] <dholbach> no
[17:46] <dholbach> I never said that
[17:46] <ScottK> I understand.
[17:46] <dholbach> it's not necessary and shouldn't be. :-)
[17:46] <cprofitt> Is there anythink the CC can do to assist the DAT?
[17:47] <dholbach> good question :)
[17:47] <dholbach> vibhav, what do you think?
[17:47] <dholbach> vibhav, do we maybe need more hands on deck? :)
[17:47] <vibhav> dholbach: sure
[17:47] <dholbach> that's the only thing I can really think of
[17:47] <vibhav> We need people to help put with dat v2
[17:47] <dholbach> we should probably start a call for contributors some time soon again
[17:47] <dholbach> yes, that too
[17:48] <dholbach> dat v2 is the tool we're working on to help us track contributions
[17:48] <cprofitt> interesting sounding tool
[17:48] <dholbach> we've in the process of moving off of something horrible to something nice and django based
[17:48] <vibhav> The current tool we use is a bit broken
[17:48] <dholbach> but as we're all involved in all kinds of other teams, we didn't really get much done yet
[17:49] <dholbach> Andrew SB is putting some work into it right now
[17:49] <dholbach> vibhav, I'll add something to my list, so we can talk about a call for help soon
[17:49] <vibhav> Perfect
[17:49] <dholbach> :)
[17:49] <czajkowski> i take it some level of technical developer is needed in order to help out
[17:50] <dholbach> with the dat v2 yes, in general to help out the team not necessarily, although it help if you have a bit of an understanding about ubuntu development or how the development teams here work
[17:51] <vibhav> dholbach had written a small spec for dat v2
[17:51] <vibhav> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/community-r-dev-advisory-team
[17:51] <dholbach> vibhav, I'll have a chat with Andrew SB about it - once we have reliable data it should be much more fun to help out :)
[17:52] <czajkowski> Is there a way the CC can help ?
[17:52] <dholbach> not right now, but we might reach out to the CC some time in the future
[17:52] <vibhav> I think reaching out for new contributors for dat v2 can help
[17:53] <vibhav> Except that, we're quite fine as a team :)
[17:54] <czajkowski> nods
[17:54] <czajkowski> ok
[17:54] <czajkowski> thanks
[17:54] <czajkowski> :)
[17:55] <vibhav> :)
[17:56] <czajkowski> ok any other comments folks before we move on ?
[17:56] <dholbach> more questions? Otherwise I'd think that's a wrap. :)
[17:56] <czajkowski> going once
[17:56] <czajkowski> twice
[17:56] <czajkowski> gone
[17:56] <czajkowski> :)
[17:56] <czajkowski> #topic AOB
[17:57] <czajkowski> anyting else we need to look at folks
[17:57] <pleia2> I don't think so
[17:57] <czajkowski> I know the IRC wants to follow up on stuff we can do that after the meeting or later on
[17:57] <czajkowski> our trello looks up to date
[17:57] <czajkowski> #endmeeting
[17:57] <dholbach> I'm all set
[17:57] <meetingology> Meeting ended Thu Feb 21 17:57:52 2013 UTC.
[17:57] <meetingology> Minutes (wiki):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2013/ubuntu-meeting.2013-02-21-17.09.moin.txt
[17:57] <meetingology> Minutes (html):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2013/ubuntu-meeting.2013-02-21-17.09.html
[17:57] <dholbach> thanks a bunch everyone!
[17:58] <cprofitt> thanks for coming everyone!
[17:58] <czajkowski> cheers