[18:55] hi [18:59] Aloha [19:04] Online [19:04] who's here [19:05] Islam Hassan reporting for duty :D [19:05] ? [19:06] mohammed gamal, roger! [19:06] starting meeting now ? [19:08] anyone got this? [19:08] yep [19:08] yeah [19:08] okay cool [19:08] meeting agenda [19:08] - update [19:09] - council [19:09] - new plan [19:09] - weekly meeting [19:09] Alooo [19:10] m3ak [19:10] ma3ak [19:10] here [19:10] any another points to Agenda ? [19:11] alooo [19:11] anyone want to add points ? [19:12] not me [19:12] ok [19:12] let's start [19:13] ok [19:13] ok [19:13] ok [19:14] - update [19:14] - today our member eslam make presentation at mansoura [19:15] i sent details at facebook msg [19:15] I see [19:15] and what are the results? [19:15] ok [19:16] - we will participate at Open mind open source event at Cairo CIS after 4 days .. this thursday [19:16] Thursday [19:16] this weekend .. [19:16] - we are community partner with JDC 2013 [19:17] and our members selected to join there [19:17] - bas kda [19:17] any comments and Q ? [19:17] these latest update [19:18] yeah, I have some [19:18] at Cairo cis - hasebat - Mahmoud dawreesh or me will make presentation [19:18] ok, you can ask [19:18] 1 - What do we have in preparation for the CIS event? [19:19] 2- What's required from us as JDC partners? [19:20] good q [19:20] 1- we need to print our papers, [19:21] we first need to meet with dawreesh and choose our session's title [19:21] we didn't choose one :( yet [19:22] ok ? [19:23] OK, so we need to design the papers or use a previous design, print the papers, contact darweesh [19:23] use old one it's very good [19:23] and we also need to publicize for the event. [19:23] ok [19:23] What is the sessions supposed to be about? just intro or some specific topic? [19:23] i have a daily disscusion with darweesh , it's not easy to choose title for unique session [19:24] unique intro [19:24] aha [19:25] OK, what about publicity? [19:25] Can any one attend or just the CIS students? [19:25] i will have a last decision tomorrow [19:25] from our team [19:25] yes [19:25] from any where yes [19:26] our channels will announce later after choose our session [19:26] OK, but we need to do it soon so people can get ready. [19:27] ok [19:27] https://www.facebook.com/events/481542855215492/482770005092777/ [19:27] this event url [19:27] Out of topic: I want to add 2 items that I've just remembered to our agenda [19:28] 1st: A teacher assistant want an intro session to Cairo uni Biomedical 2nd year students [19:28] 2nd: Ref3atov as art director [19:29] ok [19:29] but let's get through with agenda items and then we can discuss yours [19:29] Anas? [19:29] OK [19:29] good points [19:30] ok ,so what else do we need for the FCI event? [19:30] our council team should attend [19:31] we may need t-shirts for new member will be at our booth [19:31] need someone will be responsible for our booth [19:31] who's can say me :D ? [19:31] ok ,since council members are here [19:31] who can attend? [19:31] I say no :( [19:32] i can't unfortunately :S [19:32] ha ? [19:32] aloooo [19:32] anybody here ? [19:32] I probably won't be able to attend, Can't leave work before 5 [19:32] But I'll try [19:33] so ... [19:33] ok, i will search for someone from group or mail list [19:34] any q before next point ? [19:34] no [19:34] Council [19:34] Council Council Council Council Council Council Council Council Council Council Council [19:34] our Council ... [19:34] Our Dear Council [19:34] yes [19:35] no [19:35] I have no question [19:35] we need to rebuild council or add new members or or or , ... [19:35] :( [19:36] I think we actually need to get new members to run the LoCo altogether [19:36] Suggestions...? [19:36] preferable students [19:36] so any suggest ? [19:36] *preferably [19:36] I have no idea how we can do this with our very busy schedules really :( [19:36] Standards of choosing ? [19:37] maybe we could reach out to the active facebook group members [19:37] +1 mgamal for recommending students, & for our tight schedules :D [19:37] why we start council ? [19:37] you're asking hard questions, anas? :D :D [19:38] :D [19:39] The Council with supposed to handle team structure so the team continues seamlessly independent from certain members. [19:39] It's clear that all of us are becoming too busy to actually run the council [19:39] And to create a process for electing new council members [19:39] who agrees? [19:39] +1 [19:39] agree for what ? [19:40] noooooo [19:40] that we are becoming too busy [19:40] no one will leave council without select new member [19:40] +1 But I think what we really lack is the initiative not time [19:40] Personally, I do lack both :) [19:40] :D [19:41] ana 3andy ra2y [19:41] ok ? [19:41] go ahead [19:41] kol wahed ye7'tar 2 new members --active - and training them, 2 meetings , orientation [19:41] and be mentor of them [19:42] so we will have after 2 weeks [19:42] new double new council members [19:42] ok ? [19:42] I don't think i'd even have time for this [19:43] online [19:43] using hangout [19:43] at weekend [19:43] The idea is good, but train them for what? [19:44] orientation for our team, our activities , how to organize events, [19:44] ok [19:44] i have another idea [19:45] w leh kol wa7ed ygeb etnen w yo33od lw7do m3ahom? [19:45] isn't that the definition of wasting time/effort? [19:45] can we have one online meeting orientation for all members, using google hangout [19:45] and ask them who's can join and how to work [19:46] ... [19:46] so what ? [19:47] and now ? [19:47] aloooooooo [19:47] I agree with the hangout [19:47] let's do this [19:48] ok [19:48] i saw we first proceed with recruiting [19:48] here is what I have in mind [19:48] then we figure out what is the best way to transfer our knowledge [19:48] I think we should have at least one physical meeting with them to get familiar with them quickly [19:48] what about make weekly meeting (irc or hangout ) [19:48] then we can go on with online meetings [19:48] guys [19:48] concentrate! please! [19:48] ok [19:48] let's first finish with the recruiting thing [19:48] we have 2 option : [19:48] I think we should do the following [19:49] 1- close council [19:49] announce the need for new members on the facebook [19:49] group [19:49] start a google hangout for this [19:49] explain what we do and what membership [19:49] is [19:49] 2- work with same current situation [19:49] and then recruite interested members [19:49] 3- try to build new council [19:50] ok, great [19:51] @gamal: The hangout in step 3, is it like an interview for the selection or the training sessions? [19:51] iahvector: Error: "gamal:" is not a valid command. [19:51] what criteria for new members ? [19:51] @mgamal: The hangout in step 3, is it like an interview for the selection or the training sessions? [19:51] iahvector: Error: "mgamal:" is not a valid command. [19:51] no! [19:51] no interviews! [19:52] we are introducing new members to the team [19:52] it's more like an info session [19:52] +1 [19:52] so, on what basis will we select the new members? [19:52] interested members will then move to step two [19:52] which is recruitment [19:52] which I don't know what it is in fact :D [19:53] if (find_out_how_will_we_do_recruitment) { +1; } [19:54] exactly :) [19:54] :( [19:54] so I think we need to agree what will be our criteria for recruiting [19:54] i wana to explain what i mean [19:54] go ahead Anas [19:55] i need a council to help me to rebuild or discuss members system [19:55] that point [19:55] I think we should destroy the council :D [19:55] IT does absolutely nothing [19:55] we're still working the old way [19:56] and quite frankly [19:56] we are so busy to discuss this point ... [19:56] I think it works and there is no need to change it :D [19:56] ok [19:56] what we really need is to make sure the group continues running without us [19:56] and i am agree, but afraid from disactive our old people [19:56] then those who run it AFTER us can choose to run a council or not [19:57] :( [19:57] mmmmm [19:57] well, the old way depended totally on Toulan, that's why we created the council and Toulan decided to stepdown [19:57] and Toulan chose to step down at the EXACT wrong point in time [19:58] when everyone was either graduating or getting into the army :) [19:58] and so fat [19:58] &and so far [19:58] lol :D [19:58] and me start my startup [19:58] :( [19:58] fat works too :) [19:58] the group is not even having a formal structure [19:58] cuz we are :( [19:58] yeah :D [19:58] when we are having sessions [19:58] we are going and asking others for help [19:58] who are simply just volunteers [19:58] and quite frankly [19:59] I think this 'anarchic' structure is better and flexible and can work better [19:59] no hierarchies needed [19:59] the only thing we need [19:59] is more members [19:59] and more members [19:59] and more members [19:59] mmmm [19:59] and what you need to do is pull those active facebook group members to real life [20:00] +1 ^ [20:00] mmm [20:00] If we could get them to real life, we won't be needing any council [20:00] or it will be just for solving conflicts [20:01] a council should evolve out of a real need for it [20:01] not just to satisfy some formality [20:01] some problems happen that need us to choose mentors or moderators, or admins, or formal speaker, formal leader, events speakers [20:01] so if the group grows to the extent that it needs it [20:01] it should form it [20:01] agree [20:02] and how did we solve them [20:02] ? [20:02] we still got volunteers [20:02] who don't necessarily hold an ubuntu-eg badge [20:02] i agree for open community but about moderation [20:03] can we make voice meeting, ? [20:03] skype or google hangout [20:03] to more understanding [20:03] If the members became really active, they can self moderate the community [20:03] or can gamal descripe your idea more [20:03] -1 vice :( USB modem [20:03] voice* [20:04] i agree to letting the future members to choose their way of managing the thing [20:04] ok [20:04] ok, am agree [20:04] and if anything went dramatically wrong, we can step in then, but that won't be regular as we need them to mature & be held responsible [20:05] but about next actions, how can choose speaker or take actions ? [20:06] simple! [20:06] event after event, speakers will show up, moderators will show up, admins will show up ... let them evolve ya anas [20:06] call for volunteers [20:06] everytime we have an event [20:06] we call for volunteers [20:06] aha [20:06] ok [20:06] the only drawback however [20:06] i am totally agree [20:06] The mailing list activity was great for that, I really miss it :( [20:06] is that whenever there is an event [20:07] we need to know before it long enough [20:07] ok [20:07] not like JDC or FCI this time [20:07] but to be honest [20:07] mail list it's old fasion and new members not love it [20:07] even FCI doesn't seem to be prepared either [20:07] i know :( [20:08] about the mailing list [20:08] I think we should still use it [20:08] just like OpenEgypt [20:08] but i think it's simple, just we need to print and some members at booth, and dawreesh prepare his talk [20:08] they use both [20:08] I know [20:08] I mean that FCI and JDC gave us a short notice [20:09] no, it's my problem [20:09] i was overloaded at work [20:09] Actually, FCI has been contacting us for monthes, but we didn't respond except for late. [20:09] and at weekend , very tired to answer emails [20:09] i am sorry for that [20:10] but we call members for our booth at jdc and they ready [20:10] we're not blaming anyone here [20:10] I am just saying that in the future we should know about events long enough so that we can get enough volunteers [20:11] right [20:12] tal7'es kol dah eh in actions ? [20:12] are i should have weekly meeting with our members online ? every 2 weeks have offline meeting ? [20:13] I think we have two phases [20:13] 1- Dissolve the Council [20:13] :D [20:13] go on gamal [20:13] I forgot what I wanted to say [20:13] you go on :) [20:14] ha ? [20:14] and that, my friends, is the attention span of the council members ! :) [20:14] ok, Phase 1: Get the members to be more active in real life so they can go in with out moderation. [20:15] ok [20:15] phase 2 [20:15] Phase 2: dissolve the council and transfer all the authority to the members [20:15] تسليم السلطة للجروب :) [20:15] :D [20:15] :D [20:16] so what you mean is that the council should stay as a moderating body for the rest of the group [20:16] ? [20:16] if that's the case, I fully agree [20:16] بالظبط، قبل ما ننتهي ب"هذه الإتهامات أنكرها تماما" :D [20:17] OK, We need to define how will we execute these 2 phases? [20:18] mmm [20:18] just like what we explained below [20:18] the council we remain [20:18] the group will remain [20:18] whenever there is an activity [20:18] we will reach out to the group and mailing list [20:18] call for volunteers [20:19] get members [20:19] when we feel the community is going by جفع ذاتي [20:19] who's manage activity or contacts ? or action ? who's will call volunteers ? [20:19] *دفع ذاني [20:19] we can dissolve the council then [20:19] the FB moderators [20:20] in addition to Anas and me since we lead the council [20:20] what do you think? [20:20] We need som large successive events to stir them up enough [20:20] some* [20:20] ok [20:21] it's ok [20:21] are we should have weekly meeting with our members online ? every 2 weeks have offline meeting ? [20:23] alooo [20:23] Meetings work on council scale onlym when you're talking about many members, we need something larger [20:24] we should call for members gatherings just so they'd get familiar with each other [20:24] ok [20:24] may be discuss some stuff, but no more [20:24] The real decisions will be taken online [20:25] IRC + Mailing list [20:25] untill we find some other way for discussion [20:25] Cuz I think the noise is too much on the FB group [20:26] i talking for weekly meeting , for make actions , talk about new news ? [20:26] IRC may work for that [20:26] the problem ya anas is that we can't promise for weekly or even bi-weekly offline commitment [20:27] mmmm [20:27] ok [20:27] so what's guaranteed is online meetings, be it IRC or hangouts, offline meetings can be managed later on time [20:27] I say we just this to the members and see wht will they prefer [20:27] ok [20:28] right [20:28] ok [20:30] and next ? [20:30] We still didn't agree to a solid plan to do this [20:31] ؟ [20:31] ؟؟ [20:31] How will we get them to be more active [20:32] with make our actions like game ? [20:32] and points [20:33] gamification [20:33] i talk about gamification [20:33] i guess what will make a member committed is when he does something & see output [20:33] competitions [20:34] game [20:34] make it like game [20:34] like managing an event, making online campaign about an event, stuff like that [20:34] I thinks - as an old gamer - That whenever there's score, there will be cheating, we'll see too much fake activities :) [20:34] Plus I think it will be too sophisticated. [20:35] I agree with tantawy, but that means there will some authority there [20:35] Doesn't that conflict with the idea of removing the council? [20:35] mmm [20:35] how? [20:36] can make a game and point automatic and people choose winners [20:36] Who will decide who enters and who doesn't? [20:36] mmm [20:37] i try to make clear idea about that, [20:37] In the pre-council era, there was no membership, any one can come and go as he like, the only condition is not to do any thing in the name of the team without taking a public vote :) [20:37] +1 [20:38] simply ya ged3an, give them chance, let them try, make errors, evolve & learn ... while we watch mn b3eed & step in once things are about to get nasty or out of control [20:39] +1 [20:39] and we can change council name to "Advisors" :D [20:40] No, we will have no name at all [20:40] ok [20:40] When we need to step in, we'll just give suggestions as normal members and try to earn members agreement [20:40] +1000 to tantawy [20:40] ok [20:40] cool [20:41] +1 [20:41] ok [20:41] I know I'm becoming annoying, but all this concerns phase two. We still didn't decide on phase 1 :) [20:41] can someone summarize meeting ? [20:42]