[02:41] <xxiao> i can do python setup.py fine on x86, but it always gave me 'illegal instructions' on ppc, am I missing something on python build env?
[02:45] <Chipzz> logout
[02:45] <Chipzz> *facepalm* my bad, ignore pls :P
[02:51] <infinity> xxiao: If you can sort out what the illegal insn is... Python could be miscompiled (perhaps has AltiVec enabled when it shouldn't)
[02:52] <infinity> xxiao: All our buildds support AltiVec, so we don't catch that in production when it slips in. :/
[02:53] <xxiao> infinity: on this particular chip i actually had altivec
[02:53] <xxiao> yes i'm trying to chase it down
[02:54] <infinity> xxiao: Oh, kay.  I knew some of the fsl chips BenC was working with didn't have Altivec, so that was my shot in the dark.
[02:54] <infinity> xxiao: Seems unlikely that python is just plain fundamentally broken on PPC, or it would break a huge number of builds in the distro.
[02:55] <xxiao> so far i had no idea on how to debug python setup.py breakage, googling
[02:55] <xxiao> i wrote a simple setup.py and it worked
[02:55] <xxiao> so probably some 'import' caused this trouble
[02:55] <xxiao> i bootstrapped the rootfs from 12.10 ubunut-core for ppc
[02:56] <xxiao> the kernel is 64bit
[02:56] <xxiao> the python setup.py died immediately, i.e. even 'python setup.py help' will not run
[03:07] <xxiao> from sphinx.setup_command import BuildDoc Illegal instruction
[03:07] <xxiao> seems like the illegal instruction has something to do with BuildDoc and sphinx
[03:08] <xxiao> maybe I'm missing some sphinx pkgs?
[03:11] <xxiao> everytime i saw documentation related errors from debian/ubuntu it scares me
[03:14] <xxiao> now I can reproduct this easily: put one liner to a python script:
[03:14] <xxiao> from sphinx.setup_command import BuildDoc
[03:14] <xxiao> then run it, it will illegal instruction
[03:15] <xxiao> s/reproduct/reproduce/
[03:16] <xxiao> ahh...i could not run sphinx at all, "sphinx-quickstart' will crash on ppc right away
[03:18] <infinity> xxiao: Which version of python-sphinx is that?  The one from quantal or raring?
[03:18] <xxiao> quantal
[03:18] <infinity> Although, hrm.  Can't be sphinx's fault, it's arch:all.
[03:19]  * infinity spins up a PPC machine to test this.
[03:20] <xxiao> thanks
[03:23] <infinity> xxiao: So, you say that 'sphinx-quickstart' just crashes instantly for you?
[03:23] <infinity> xxiao: Works fine on my POWER5 here, on both raring and quantal.
[03:24] <infinity> xxiao: http://paste.ubuntu.com/5560511/
[03:24] <xxiao> correct, it crashes on my t4240 box
[03:25] <infinity> Or do I need to fill in some values, does it crash later?
[03:26] <infinity> Hrm, no, seemed to go all the way through fine.
[03:26] <xxiao> http://paste.ubuntu.com/5560515/
[03:27] <infinity> Well, your kernel seems to be living in the distant past, but that's probably not the issue.
[03:27] <xxiao> we're upgrading 3.0 to 3.8 these days, will math-emulation matter?
[03:28] <infinity> Possibly.  BenC probably knows the answer to that better than I do.
[03:28] <infinity> I'm really unfamiliar with the fsl cores.
[03:28] <xxiao> it seems t4240's FPU has one special instruction that diffs from power5
[03:28] <infinity> My house is full of old Motorola cores, and new IBM ones.
[03:28] <xxiao> i c, will talk with BenC then
[03:28] <xxiao> meanwhile I will try math-emu
[03:29] <xxiao> thanks for the help
[03:29] <infinity> Let me try this on an old PPC750
[03:30] <xxiao> I assume you have math-emu on?
[03:31] <infinity> I have... Whatever our distro kernels have.
[03:34] <xxiao> i'm bulding kernel with math-emu
[03:34] <xxiao> had to do this with yocto, which means 30 minutes to get a clean build, sigh
[03:34] <BenC> xxiao: Shouldn't matter
[03:34] <BenC> xxiao: You're going to be in Austin next weekend, right?
[03:34] <xxiao> BenC: yes
[03:34] <BenC> Flying out there tomorrow
[03:34] <xxiao> that's early
[03:34] <xxiao> but...welcome to Austin
[03:35] <BenC> Going to Dallas on Monday (Servergy office) and coming back to Austin later on in the week
[03:35] <xxiao> whenever i saw doc-related crash, i thought about fpu, which is troublesome for fsl chips
[03:35] <infinity> BenC: Want to try to sort out this illegal insn issue xxiao is seeing?  I can't reproduce here, and I don't have the right hardware to dig deeper.
[03:35] <xxiao> we will have weeklies with servergy
[03:35] <BenC> just cheaper to round trip to Austin (and drive to/from Dallas) rather than make a 3-point trip
[03:36] <BenC> infinity, xxiao: Can you give me a repro case?
[03:36] <infinity> BenC: Install python-sphinx, and run sphinx-quickstart
[03:36] <infinity> BenC: Possibly quantal-specific.
[03:36] <infinity> xxiao: Did you try on raring?
[03:36] <xxiao> infinity: not yet
[03:37] <xxiao> i will try it on raring tomorrow
[03:38] <infinity> BenC: Can't reproduce on any of the IBM cores I throw it at.
[03:38] <BenC> infinity: should crash on start?
[03:38] <infinity> (Well, I'm still debootstrapping to test on my 750, but I imagine it'll be fine)
[03:38] <xxiao> BenC: or one liner python : from sphinx.setup_command import BuildDoc will trigger it
[03:38] <BenC> raring doesn't seem to show it
[03:38] <infinity> BenC: Crashes at startup, yeah.
[03:38] <BenC> On e500mc that is
[03:38] <infinity> BenC: http://paste.ubuntu.com/5560515/
[03:39] <BenC> Checking quantal
[03:39] <infinity> BenC: Then again, I'm willing to blame xxiao's sketchy kernel there, too. ;)
[03:39] <BenC> xxiao: what does gdb show as the illegal instruction?
[03:39] <xxiao> hold on
[03:40] <BenC> Doesn't crash on e500mc on quantal
[03:43] <infinity> Works fine on a 15-year-old PPC750 too.
[03:44] <xxiao> crappy t4240 then
[03:44] <xxiao> sphinx* is all pythin scripts, don't know how to gdb the instruction
[03:45] <xxiao> it happens when "from sphinx.something import somefunc"
[03:45] <BenC> xxiao: gdb python
[03:45] <BenC> xxiao: set args -f sphinx-quickstart
[03:47] <xxiao> http://paste.ubuntu.com/5560553/
[03:47] <infinity> *blink(
[03:47] <infinity> Under gdb, I get a SIGILL.
[03:47] <infinity> Double-U Tee Eff.
[03:47] <xxiao> __sqrt_finite ()
[03:47] <xxiao> I KNEW it!
[03:47] <xxiao> last time a floating related PHP bug on ppc haunted me for two days
[03:49] <xxiao> i ended up using integer to work around that, instead of compiling all those php stuff from source
[03:51] <infinity> xxiao: Is it dying in OPENSSL_cpuid_setup() for you, or elsewhere?
[03:52] <xxiao> the pastebin is all I saw
[03:52] <xxiao> why is openssl involved here, curious
[03:52] <infinity> Oh, mine's a false alarm.
[03:53] <infinity> OPENSSL_cpuid_setup just can't trap SIGILL when run under gdb.
[03:53] <infinity> xxiao: Nevermind me, I'm just being a doofus.
[03:53] <infinity> xxiao: Your crash is elsewhere, and more interesting. :P
[03:56] <infinity> xxiao: disassemble 0x0fe9aa94
[04:06] <xxiao> http://paste.ubuntu.com/5560579/
[04:07] <Bluefoxicy> ffs I need to replace the wall in this room with a big white board.
[04:16] <xxiao> BenC: math-emu seems helped
[04:17] <xxiao> infinity: with math-emu now it's ok
[04:38] <xxiao> is there nodejs for ppc?
[04:38] <BenC> xxiao: nope…v8 needs a lot of porting for ppc
[04:38] <infinity> Yeah. :/
[04:39] <infinity> There's a lot of v8-using stuff out there these days too.
[04:39] <xxiao> BenC: i'm 'recommending" freescale to become openstack member asap
[04:39] <BenC> xxiao: We were going to bring up v8 with Freescale this week :)
[04:39] <infinity> BenC: I stumbled on a v8/ppc "port" on github a while back, but I suspect it stalled before it ever really got started.
[04:39] <xxiao> the openstack guys mandated nodejs for its dashboard, that kills ppc/mips
[04:39] <BenC> infinity: It's completely empty from > 1 year ago
[04:39] <infinity> BenC: I'd love if someone just wrote a *&%! generic C implementation of v8, to be honest.
[04:40] <infinity> BenC: Sure, it might be slow, but at least it would work everywhere.
[04:40] <BenC> infinity: amen...
[04:40] <infinity> xxiao: There's a MIPS v8 port that actually works, AFAIK, it's just not upstream.
[04:40] <infinity> xxiao: But yeah, nothing for PPC.
[04:40] <BenC> xxiao: That's fantastic…openstack is right where we want to position CTS-1000 hardware
[04:41] <infinity> BenC: If you can talk anyone into putting resources into v8/ppc, that'd be awesome.  If you can talk anyone into generic C, I won't complain. :P
[04:42] <BenC> infinity: I have a feeling I'll be buying lots of jaeger bombs this week…let's see if it gets things moving
[04:42]  * infinity can't help but think this is the sort of thing IBM would have thrown money/people at 10 years ago, but trying to convince them of it today would be hard.
[04:42] <infinity> But perhaps worth asking benh, on the off chance they've been doing something there and just not been vocal.
[04:44] <xxiao> ok lxc/12.10 is up
[04:44] <xxiao> time to tie it with openstack via cli, as no dashboard can run without nodejs
[04:45] <Bluefoxicy> infinity:  no way, Websphere is infinitely superior to nodejs, and you should be using it instead.  Ask IBM.
[04:46] <infinity> Bluefoxicy: v8's embedded in a lot of products other than nodejs.  Lacking the port sucks period.
[04:46] <Bluefoxicy> infinity:  Also, MySQL sucks terribly, but if you need something better there's this database called Oracle that the folks who currently control MySQL would be happy to help you deploy...
[04:46] <infinity> (And lacking a generic implementation sucks for new arches)
[04:47] <erickLee> hi
[04:48] <BenC> xxiao: openstack-dashboard works for me
[04:48] <erickLee> can anyone tell me what is the safe package to attempt modifications?
[04:48] <xxiao> http://paste.ubuntu.com/5560653/
[04:48] <BenC> Although, I think I used it on x86
[04:48] <xxiao> what the hack, it takes 2 minutes for lxc to get a login prompt
[04:48] <Bluefoxicy> infinity:  I suffered major stage 12 burnout recently and have come out incredibly, terribly critical and horrible somehow.  I make no excuses or apologies for this, but keep your eyes peeled for cynicism.
[04:49] <xxiao> BenC: which openstack version? they mandated nodejs for folsom
[04:49] <xxiao> if you're doing Essex it might be fine
[04:49] <BenC> xxiao: I don't know the versions, but that's from raring
[04:49] <xxiao> BenC: hmm need try that then
[04:50] <xxiao> BenC: i'm building the whole thing from source, maybe I should do deb install instead
[04:50] <BenC> xxiao: Might save you some time :)
[04:50] <xxiao> build it from source is easy to hack in lxc support, which is not officially supported
[04:51] <infinity> nova-compute-lxc is packaged.
[04:51] <infinity> You shouldn't need to build from source for that.
[04:51] <xxiao> yeah will try the package install tomorrow
[04:52] <infinity> It's how we currently do openstack on ARM, due to the lack of paravirt solutions there.
[04:52] <xxiao> i spent the whole day to get it fully built from devstack, just missing nodejs
[04:52] <vibhav> You can get away with misaligned access on x86, right?
[04:52] <xxiao> not sure how ubuntu bypassed that
[04:52] <infinity> vibhav: Yes, but don't.
[04:53]  * vibhav grumbles 
[04:53] <infinity> vibhav: For two reasons.  (a) it's bad practice that creates unportable code and (b) it's slower, cause you waste cycles on fixups.
[04:54] <vibhav> infinity: Indeed. Thoggen had failed to build on arm for this reason
[04:54] <vibhav> And I was finding ways to fix it
[04:56] <xxiao> BenC: who can I ask further on openstack/raring/ppc?
[04:56] <xxiao> esp the openstack version and nodejs dependency
[04:58] <lifeless> xxiao: whats wrong with nodejs ?
[04:58] <BenC> xxiao: If there was a nodejs dep, I would not be able to install it :)
[04:58] <BenC> lifeless: it doesn't run on ppc
[04:58] <BenC> xxiao: *wouldn't
[04:58] <BenC> err, had it right I guess
[05:03] <xxiao> ok will try install from pkgs tomorrow
[05:03] <xxiao> http://packages.ubuntu.com/quantal/python-django-horizon shows no nodejs
[05:04] <xxiao> http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/changelogs/pool/main/h/horizon/horizon_2012.2-0ubuntu2/changelog
[05:04] <xxiao> Drop node-less dependency (LP: #1024326)
[05:04] <xxiao> that is it I think
[05:05] <lifeless> BenC: ah; shallow or deep issues do you think ?
[05:11] <BenC> lifeless: deep…v8 needs to be ported
[05:11] <BenC> xxiao: right, but it jut means you need nodejs to access it, not to run it, right?
[05:12] <BenC> I'm wrong, looks like it needs it on the host system
[05:14] <BenC> xxiao: But it does look like it's fixed in quantal and raring
[05:14] <lifeless> so the nodejs dep
[05:14] <xxiao> BenC: yes
[05:14] <lifeless> is currently just as a compiler for lesscss
[05:15] <lifeless> so you can run that once per revision on any architecture and then its done.
[05:15] <xxiao> BenC: basically it tells openstack don't do dynamic compilation, use a pre-built css instead
[05:15] <xxiao> i'm pulling that into devstack now, will see how it goes
[05:15] <lifeless> however its likely upstream will want to do much more dynamic things later, so I wouldn't bet on it staying as an indefinite workaround
[05:16] <xxiao> lifeless: that's why I want to ask freescale to get on openstack paid membership to vote against this tech decision
[05:16] <xxiao> or port v8/nodejs to ppc
[05:16] <lifeless> paid membership gets a board position; nodejs is a tech decision that the board doesn't vote on
[05:17] <xxiao> requires nodejs just for the sake of css seems odd to me
[05:17] <lifeless> the way to get technical leverage is to contribute
[05:17] <lifeless> technically
[05:17] <lifeless> you could write a python LESS compiler
[05:18] <lifeless> then get the nodejs dep dropped, as long as it has not expanded in scope
[15:10] <jbicha> hi, could we get a rebuild of cmake, gvfs, and packagekit for the libarchive transition?
[19:40] <Laney> jbicha: what about all the others?
[19:43] <infinity> Laney: I'm working on the whole stack right now.
[19:44] <infinity> Laney: Though cmake might be stuck on an FTBFS in the testsuite.  *sigh*
[19:45] <jbicha> infinity: thanks
[19:46]  * infinity scratches his head at cmake's newfound hatred for its testsuite.
[20:16] <xxiao> I was told turning on math-emu is the wrong thing to do, not sure if that's a correct suggestion
[20:17] <xxiao> infinity: for ppc of  course, if kernel has math-emu off, will the sphinx-quickstart abort?
[20:17] <xxiao> I would assume ubuntu rootfs is soft-float by default?
[20:25] <xxiao> BenC: pinh
[20:25] <xxiao> ping
[20:25] <infinity> xxiao: Why would you assume Ubuntu is soft-float?
[20:26] <xxiao> infinity: just guessing, is it?
[20:26] <infinity> Isn't soft-float on PPC a reasonable new (and incompatible) ABI?
[20:26] <xxiao> infinity: in my case, ppc rootfs in embedded space is mostly soft-float
[20:27] <xxiao> esp those e500 chips
[20:28] <xxiao> if everything is hard float, then why we need math-emu?
[20:29] <infinity> I'm not familiar with the math-emu you keep talking about.
[20:29] <infinity> Is this specific to fsl kernels?
[20:29] <infinity> If so, it's probably trapping instructions that don't exist on your cores.
[20:40] <xxiao> math-emu is a kernel option that traps floating point instruction if there is no fpu
[23:39] <wooo>  What is vnode? Is is somewhat similar to inode?
[23:45] <gkcn> wooo, http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/linux-kernel-70/difference-between-inode-and-vnode-657954/