[00:37] zequence, it looks like we need something like kgamma... with out the k [00:38] len_1304: When it comes to that, I really have no clue, so whatever you say :) [00:38] It's one of those things that would be good for someone to do some research on [00:38] Someone who had only, say, graphics to worry about [00:41] ..since it's also video related, is what I mean [00:43] Yes [00:44] I think there should be a setting for it in xfce settings. [00:44] I may whip up a python app that plays with xrandr [00:45] Maybe the xfce4 display settings is already in python. I should find out. [06:36] Len-nb: You're absolutely right. No one's taken a look at settings for a couple of releases. I ran out of time last night (way too much work), I'll try again Wednesday evening. [15:21] i swear i could build a case for not including JACK by default [15:23] The problem is that people coming from Windows think that starting applications is enough, and the audio should just work [15:23] ..and I guess it would be good, if it did [15:24] right, and windows nor osx do what we do anyway [15:24] I'm considering trying to push for such a change in the whole LA world. But, it might not be that simple, as there are multiple jacks around [15:24] nothing ships with everything "out of the box" [15:34] zequence: we need that page as a bot popup [15:34] !proaudio [15:35] holstein: Can you program it? [15:36] !audio [15:36] If you're having problems with sound, click the Volume applet, then Sound Preferences, and check your Volume, Hardware, Input, and Output settings. If that fails, see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Sound - https://help.ubuntu.com/community/SoundTroubleshooting - http://alsa.opensrc.org/DmixPlugin - For playing audio files, see !players and !mp3. [15:36] zequence: no, but lemme check... [15:40] I don't have ops privileges, and don't know much about bots [15:43] i think i know who maintains it [15:43] i'll check.. [16:17] hi all! [16:18] finally, I managed to route flash audio trough jack (so I don't have to stop JACK when I need to youtube as part of my workflow) [16:19] insomniaSalt: there is a module on by default, which does that for you. Did you try it? [16:20] not entirely sure [16:20] If you start jack with qjackctl, pulseaudio creates sink and source for jack [16:20] I'm in here because I was wondering if there's any better way [16:20] that, for some reason didnt work [16:20] Then, if you go into the PA mixer, you can set PA to use jack [16:21] I connected sink to system in qjackctl [16:21] but that PA mixer pref, where is it supposed to be? [16:21] in outputs [16:21] Just like if you would choose an audio device, you choose jack [16:22] Output Devices tab [16:22] It would be better if PA set itself to use jack by default, when you start jack. This is something I'd like to happen in the future [16:22] Yes [16:22] shows my two soundcards [16:22] Is jack running? [16:22] and I can select a "port" from a dropdown [16:22] running and playing sound currently [16:22] How are you starting jack. Is it jackdbus, or jackd? [16:22] lemme see messages window [16:22] Are you using qjackctl, with default settings? [16:23] 16:57:14.376 D-BUS: Service not available (org.jackaudio.service aka jackdbus). [16:23] 16:57:14.383 JACK is starting... [16:23] 16:57:14.383 /usr/bin/jackd -dalsa -dhw:0 -r44100 -p1024 -n2 [16:23] That looks pretty default [16:23] qjackctl, yes [16:23] insomniaSalt: Check in: Setup -> Misc, and look fot the dbus option [16:23] Is it enabled? [16:24] yes (also default I guess) [16:24] Yep [16:24] insomniaSalt: So, I don't know how you're making the PA jack connection right now, but what I would like you to do is shut everything down, logout, and login again [16:24] anyways, what I did was use libflashsupport.c from Torben Hohn minus the V4L stuff [16:25] Ah, ok [16:25] weird thing is sometimes there is Sink and Source in connection window, sometimes not [16:25] but no matter, no flashsound [16:25] If you restart jack sometimes the thing fails [16:25] I'd use the module over the libflashsupport thing [16:26] The module is in its own package, called pulseaudio-module-jack. It's installed by efault [16:26] To try it, remove the libflash thing, logout, login, and then start jack [16:26] If you see the PA sink and source, set PA to use jack. Done [16:26] currently not there [16:26] could be the libflash thing is blocking it. [16:27] also, sometimes I've to log out and in again, or else jack won't even start [16:27] I don't really know [16:27] insomniaSalt: Yes, that's a jack bug [16:27] nah, t'was the same before [16:27] trying again [16:27] insomniaSalt: When that happens, you can kill jack in a terminal: killall -9 jackdbus [16:28] insomniaSalt: There's a fix for jack, which I'm trying to get in for 12.04. Right now, it works fine on 13.04 [16:33] no sink, no source :( [16:33] insomniaSalt: Well, they usually don't fail on a clean system, when starting jack for the first time in a session [16:33] insomniaSalt: Did you remove the libflash thing? [16:35] doubt that's it but I do [16:38] insomniaSalt: pulseaudio-module-jack is installed? You sure you get the sink and source at times? [16:40] used to, at least [16:41] quick reboot just to make sure [16:50] reboot, login, start Qjackctl: The playback device "hw:0" is already in use (...) pulseaudio [16:50] $ pulseaudio -k [16:50] only then jack starts [16:51] then automatically relaunching pulse as it seems [17:00] insomniaSalt: PA is set to autospawn [17:00] insomniaSalt: Try doing this. In a terminal, do: pasuspender -- && sleep 15 [17:00] Then, while PA is suspended, start jack [17:01] Wait, that doesn't work :P [17:02] pasuspender -- sleep 60, or whatever [17:02] You can do Ctl+C to end the sleep once jack is running [17:02] insomniaSalt: Ah, first kill jack though [17:02] killall -0 jackdbus [17:02] killall -9 jackdbus* [17:03] insomniaSalt: If PA is set to use the same device as jack, it might not let go of the device [17:03] It's a PA bug [17:03] Works best if you are not using PA to do anything [17:03] :-) [17:03] that's how I fixed audio an my gentoo box [17:04] uninstall pa, global useflag -pa [17:04] looking at my shell history, it seems somewhere along the process I had to install jack and jack-dev packages, how can that be [17:04] weird! [17:04] trying the sleep thing [17:05] insomniaSalt: You probably needed the jack-dev to build the libflash thing [17:05] yes, idd. but what about the former? :-) [17:05] and qjackctl got autoremoved in between [17:06] then i reinstalled it, now it won't be autoremoved anymore [17:06] weird [17:08] insomniaSalt: The dev libraries depend on jack1 libs. Why qjackctl got removed has to do with dependencies [17:08] $ pgrep jackdbus [17:08] It's not very slick [17:09] jackdbus ain't ever running [17:10] sleep is over, pulse seems running (pgrep returns a PID), and still no sink/source :( [17:10] and jackdbus never even ran to begin with [17:11] only jackd [17:11] insomniaSalt: is jackd2 installed? [17:12] If you didn't reinstall it, you might be running jackd1 [17:12] Which doesn't support dbus. jackdbus is a part of the jackd2 package [17:12] no d2 [17:12] yay! [17:13] removing d1 d1-firewire libjack-dev and libjack0 [17:13] in favour of d2 [17:14] welcome back sink/source [17:14] xD [17:15] oh dear [17:15] it works! [17:16] but the setting in PAmixer is "hidden" in the playback tab [17:16] there, I didn't look before [17:17] currently hearing sound from youtube -> PA -> Jack [17:17] * insomniaSalt starts Mixxx and prays [17:17] which instantly killed the sound [17:21] Well, that's probably not related to the module, rather on Mixxx itself [17:22] it made entire firefox crash [17:22] flash is probably the crook there [17:23] When PA misbehaves, flash gets annoyed [17:23] educational experience, still [17:24] Trying to get ArdourXchange working. Have got it working in the past. Damn, I need it now [17:25] verdict: back to the libflashsupport-jack thingy (the main purpose of all this being to enable people other than me to work at this computer, lol) [17:27] minor thing: still no html5sound then [17:29] Anything that works with PA will go through the module [17:30] The module needs to be worked on, and is the best way to integrate jack with PA [17:30] The libflash thing only works on flash, no? [17:30] Not really an option [17:30] and, does it work with jackd2? [17:32] doubtful, I'll report [17:33] indeed, make fails because of "No package 'jack' found [17:34] WHen I say module, I'm talking about pulseaudio-module-jack, or module-jackdbus-detect, not the libflash thing [17:34] I'm aware :) [17:34] You can't compile libflash without jack dev packages, and those can't be installed when jackd2 is installed [17:35] it's weird [17:35] Hopefully jack devs come to resolution on those things at some point [17:37] I'm more than happy to go back to jackd1 + libflashsupport-jack till then, seems the only way to have "agressive" applications such as Mixxx running througgh jack while simoultaneously being able to route sound from flash-based sources [17:38] insomniaSalt: It's Mixxx that is the problem in this case [17:38] insomniaSalt: Try disabling the PA module, and use only jack with Mixxx [17:38] Probably it has bad jack code in it [17:39] It has jack support, doesn't it? Or is it ALSA only [17:39] Mixxx is not agressive. Just poorly written [17:39] basically everything [17:39] yes, tend to notice that too at times [17:40] oss alsa jack pa [17:40] but being able to use Mixx is not really the point, it's just a good example of an application that behaves bad [17:41] (imho) [17:41] An application that behaves bad with jackdbus, not PA, if you're using the jack interface, that is [17:42] There are other examples of jack apps that work poorly on one jack, and better on the other [17:42] and mix is also an example of an application that people using this setup from hell expect to work (same as flash) [17:43] The PA interconnection is not a big deal [17:43] The module is quite stable [17:43] There are some bugs related to PA and jack, which do not really have to do with the module itself [17:45] In some situations audio might get blocked as a result of using jack with PA, adjusting settings, starting/stopping, etc. [17:45] There could of course be something in the module that causes some weirdness, but in most cases, I would say the bugs are either in PA itself, or jack itself, not in the module [17:46] with that jackd2/module setup I'd be happier if stuff wasnt crashing all the time :-) [17:46] Badly written jack apps can make jack crash. In that case, it's the app that is bad [17:46] yes! [17:47] I don't experience any crashing with jack2 and PA [17:47] But, I'm not using Mixxx [17:47] crashing the client software that is, not pa or jackd [17:48] ..aside from the jack bug, when trying to stop jack (on 12.04, and 12.10) [17:49] Right now, I'd like to write emails to every programmer in the world, and tell them: please, please, please - use standards!!!! [17:49] I want to export a session from Cubase to Ardour [17:49] There's a tool for it, but I can't get it working [17:49] there is an xkcd about that [17:50] where it says, now because of you we have n+1 standards [17:50] :-) [17:51] meh cubase :( [17:51] creating custom formats should lead to jail sentences [17:51] * insomniaSalt is a freetard somehow [17:52] Maybe what I should do is write a OMF to ardour converter [17:53] omf is actually an open standard [17:54] ardour just needs to have it implemented [17:54] people will always try an be evil [17:54] like that tetra pak machine patent that forbade people other than the proprietor to produce paks that could be filled with these machines [17:55] until they were sued for trust [17:56] abuse of dominant market position is what that's called [17:57] In this case, the proprietary application does support the open format, while the free one does not [17:58] go, implement! [17:58] :) [17:58] but then, how often does the open format specification and reference implementation by steinberg change? [17:58] if you're unlucky twice a week [17:58] have fun trying to keep up [17:59] (not sure about that, but possible in theory, 'pseudo-open' standards existed before) [18:02] It's not a Steinberg format [18:02] It's an open format that many DAWs support [18:03] Includign Steinbergs various DAWs, Pro Tools, It think pretty much all the big ones [18:04] avid, ic. [18:04] As long as you can get the files into their right places, with tempos, etc. [18:07] there seem to be different 'flavours' of OMF, too :-) [18:11] Yeaaah!!. Now I get to do export one track at the time! [18:11] >tool for it [18:11] aatranslator? [18:14] I already have a tool, that doesn't work [18:14] ArdourXchange [18:14] I got it to work last year, but not now [18:30] learned a lot more, but now my headache got much worse, time to stop and find something to eat [19:00] !proaudio [19:00] For information on professional audio tools in Ubuntu, see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuStudio/ProAudioIntro/1204 [19:00] holstein: Alright [19:00] right! :) [19:00] zequence: knome hooked us up [19:00] Great [19:23] Damn, I nearly had it working === jta is now known as jta_afk [20:28] holstein: For now, I just included the 1204 page into the page that !proaudio links to [20:28] !proaudio [20:28] For information on professional audio tools in Ubuntu, see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuStudio/ProAudioIntro [20:28] So, same as before now [20:28] You need to refresh, to see the change [20:29] zequence: i like it [21:41] Been updating the kernel for a while now. Every 3 weeks, or, a little more often. Sometimes there's a sudden critical update. [21:42] A run a script, and then, I try not mess up the manual bit, where I edit the changelog [21:42] Messed it up three times already :P