[00:04] Chipzz thanks! [00:19] hi [00:20] I'm sorry to ask this, but what's happening to ubuntu-devel mailing list? [00:20] I'm getting TONS of email since a couple of hours [00:20] and I cannot stop them [00:20] I've tried unsubscribing from ubuntu-devel ml and I'm still getting them [00:23] there were 10 mails today on that list [00:24] really I'm getting tons of them [00:25] I don't know if these are just delayed emails and I'm getting them all at once [00:25] but it's being very bad [00:25] sounds more like a problem with your mailserver [00:27] ogra_, https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2013-March/thread.html looking at the archive it seems the emails are a lot... anyway I'm using GMail, surely I can't fix it [00:27] Andy80: over the past couple of days the list has 'blown up' in response to a proposal that was made [00:27] not sure what you define a lot [00:28] ogra_, I'm getting an email every 5-10 seconds [00:28] right, there was some discussion, surely not what i define a lot though [00:28] I didn't check if they're duplicated or not [00:28] but it looks like they're not stopping [00:28] I'd say there has been 100+ since Thursday. 5-10 seconds though is not what I'm seeing.. [00:29] I just marked everything as read and archived, and now I've other 6 emails :( [00:29] I'm not joking, really :( [00:29] Andy80: try checking a couple of them and see if your just very delayed in getting the emails that I've been getting over the last few days [00:30] I will try to monitor the next I get [00:31] Andy80: you're not the only person I've heard who's getting the mails all at once [00:31] geofft, do you know if those people were using GMail aswell? [00:31] i'm actually forwarding that list through gmail and have no delays [00:32] If you need sysadmin help, you'd need to try #canonical-sysadmin; the greatest access level you're likely to find here is that of list moderator, which isn't sufficient to debug this kind of thing [00:33] (gets me cheap spam filtering to hook gmail in the loop) [00:34] cjohnston_, thanks! If I keep getting emails I will try to ask there if anyone can investigate (maybe at the moment nobody is working, better tomorrow) [00:35] Andy80: I suspect so. [00:35] You might find the start of the APAC shift === cjohnston_ is now known as cjohnston [00:56] good night [01:10] I stopped receiving ubuntu-devel emails several days ago, so I resubscribed to the list but started getting the missing emails a few hours ago too (also on gmail) [01:12] jbicha, it looks like a common problem then :) [01:13] time to go to bed now ;) [01:13] see you all! [01:26] SpamapS: ^ could have been what happpened to you ? [03:52] lifeless: indeed, though I have not seen any of the old ones arrive just yet [03:53] lifeless: and they definitely stopped on my last day at canonical.. so my guess is that it was some kind of sweep for my email/name that was too broad [03:53] or I was more bitter than I remember, and I did it and forgot ;) [03:53] SpamapS: Hah. Probably just overbroad. Or you were subscribed via you canonical.com address? [03:53] s/you/your/ [03:54] I am 99.9% sure I subscribed w/ my @ubuntu.com email [03:54] but, there was some trouble with that particular email... [03:54] i did not, fwiw, so probably not an @ubuntu.com issue [03:54] because I used clint@ .. but my launchpad id was clint-fewbar .. so I was sort of abusing my canonical username [03:54] I resolved that before my last day, but its entirely possible the sweep and the special forwarding privileges I got were not compatible [03:55] SpamapS: *nod* [03:57] gmail decided it didn't want to talk to our mail server for a little while after we upgraded it [04:05] SpamapS: fwiw, your clint@ address is still subscribed, and mail is being delivered to it. [04:06] bradm: I re-subscribed earlier today [04:06] bradm: at which time the emails started flowing again [04:06] SpamapS: if you're not on gmail, days ago. [04:06] my MX is a barracuda run by my friend's hosting company [04:07] but again, the ubuntu-devel emails stopped basically the day I departed Canonical, so I'm pretty sure either I unsubbed, or something went wonky [04:09] SpamapS: you were on ubuntu-devel with your @canonical.com address [04:13] bradm: *DOH* [04:14] bradm: thanks for checking [04:19] SpamapS: no worries. [05:58] Good morning === pitti_ is now known as pitti === Logan_ is now known as Guest15281 === Logan__ is now known as Logan_ [07:21] ricotz: FYI, I uploaded https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/udisks2/2.0.92-0ubuntu1 to raring, with a proper port of the "mount in /media" patch [07:28] pitti, alright, thanks [08:06] good morning [08:16] Hello === henrix_ is now known as henrix === tkamppeter_ is now known as tkamppeter === zequence_ is now known as zequence [09:29] Is there somewhere documentation about how to participate in the sessions of the UDS? === tyhicks` is now known as tyhicks [09:35] tkamppeter: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1303/2013-03-05/ has links to videos and irc rooms [09:35] but I can't find anything about how to use google hangouts [09:38] tkamppeter: someone mentioned https://wiki.ubuntu.com/OnAir/BestPractices on the planet [09:44] "The required participants for a meeting will also be given a link to participate in the hangout" [09:44] hmm [09:49] Laney: yeah, I don't like that. I did use required participation - only to force the scheduler to be sensible. [09:50] as well as to subscribe other people. [09:50] Unfortunate constraints imposed by the technology [09:51] Laney: all our base are belong to G+ ? [09:51] something like that [09:52] better than to facebook :) [10:09] hey [10:09] update-manager is borked on raring as on version 1:0.183 [10:09] someone might want to figure out an interesting fix [10:10] http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/5584706/ [10:10] dholbach: do you know who maintains update-manager after mvo left? [10:11] zyga, might be good to ask mvo directly - he's still on IRC you know :) [10:11] mvo: ping? [10:11] dholbach: yeah but he's not required to be here anymore [10:11] pitti: perhaps you know (unless mvo is faster) ^^ [10:11] well he's still part of the Ubuntu and Debian projects [10:11] have you filed a bug? [10:12] Laney: filing [10:12] it's a bit tricky [10:12] since ubuntu-bug rejects the bug :) [10:12] as updates are available [10:12] * zyga thinks that's an interesting exception where we should still be able to do so [10:13] zyga: the two error messages look fairly self-explanatory? [10:13] pitti: yes, they od [10:13] do [10:14] ok, filed as https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/update-manager/+bug/1144058 [10:14] Launchpad bug 1144058 in update-manager (Ubuntu) "update-manager crashes with nboundLocalError: local variable 'installed_file' referenced before assignment" [Undecided,New] [11:04] hey seb128, have you got a sec? [11:05] ivanka, hey, sure [11:05] seb128, how do I find what blueprints are being registered for this week? [11:05] ivanka, https://blueprints.launchpad.net/sprints/uds-1303 [11:05] seb128, sorry, there is probably an email buried in my inbox but was at MWC and still trying to catch up [11:06] zyga: hi, sorry for the delay - its group maintained AIUI, mterry is doing quite a bit of work on it too [11:06] ivanka, or just check the schedule http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1303/2013-03-05/display?edit and http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1303/2013-03-06/display?edit [11:06] ups [11:06] without the edit part [11:06] http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1303/2013-03-05/display [11:06] ivanka, let me know if need more details [11:06] ivanka, do you have sessions to add? the schedule is pretty packaged already, we had to make call on stuffs to drop from the list for client [11:07] thanks seb128 - that should keep me quiet for the moment [11:07] ivanka, the community track might have some free slots still though [11:07] seb128, I will have a look, but I spoke to pmcgowan before MWC and he suggested that the focus for the first UDS will be on fixes and background stuff so I get some time to prioritise UI elements [11:08] ok [11:08] mvo: hey, thanks for getting back to me [11:08] seb128, we are just getting back the usability testing results and need to look at what design changes we need to make [11:08] seb128, off to check the schedule! :-) [11:08] ivanka, good luck! [11:08] ;-) [11:11] hey ckpringle there is a UDS session for app development [11:11] ckpringle, I am subscribing you and making your participation essential [11:11] ckpringle, I shall add Christina too? Mika? Anyone else? [11:11] ivanka: I think that is the session dpm is organising, we spoke about it last week but do you know when exactly it will be? [11:12] ivanka: the three of us would be nice, if we can't all go I at least will though. [11:16] ckpringle, xchat just crashed on me! OK - will add the others [11:16] ckpringle, I think it is one of the early sessions http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1303/2013-03-05/display [11:16] ckpringle, as long as the sessions don't move too much [11:17] ivanka: there is also one at 6pm [11:17] ivanka "Ubuntu touch core apps project" [11:32] ckpringle, ivanka, the schedule is still a bit in flux, as we're populating it right now, and some sessions will need to be reshuffled if they clash with others with the same essential participants. Let me come back to you guys later on on the design sessions [11:33] dpm, I am am just assigning people to Blueprints so, if they can't attend that can still contribute discussion points. [11:34] ivanka, excellent, sounds good [11:35] seb128, what's Ubuntu Friendly? [11:35] ivanka, https://friendly.ubuntu.com/what-is-ubuntu-friendly/ [11:35] ;-) [11:36] seb128, oooh nice [11:39] xnox, hi [11:39] dpm, who is in charge of the schedule? [11:42] ivanka, there is a track lead for each track in charge of the schedule. For app development I am, then seb128 and jasoncwarner_ are for client, Daviey for server... etc. [11:42] sorry there are 2 track leads I meant to say [11:42] popey and I for app development, etc, etc [11:42] dpm, great, thanks [11:42] Let me see if I can get you the full list [11:42] ok [11:43] dpm, sorry, I am frantically trying to catchup as I was at MWC last week [11:43] ivanka, no worries, happy to help in what I can [11:43] thanks dpm [11:43] us who weren't in MWC are also frantically catching up at the pace things are running now ;) [11:47] hi [11:55] hello [11:56] I am trying to learn how to use gfxboot-examples in order to get a custom /isolinux/bootsplash archive with a init file in it containing a custom 800x600 jpg image. I read the examples, but when it comes to putting this in practice I am stucked with questions (the exemple is not clear enough to me). [11:57] I have also read this post: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2005-December/013846.html [11:57] and I wonder if someone here could help me understand how to use the exemple the right way ? [11:58] this is in Ubuntu Precise === MacSlow is now known as MacSlow|lunch [12:51] dholbach: re bug #1140613, please unsubscribe the sponsors team and set the bug to 'fix committed' [12:51] bug 1140613 in python-warlock (Ubuntu) "Merge python-warlock 0.8.1-1 (main) from Debian experimental (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1140613 [12:51] dholbach: and this package has a dependency wait [12:52] hum, weird - let me have another look === MacSlow|lunch is now known as MacSlow === ckpringle_ is now known as ckpringle [14:12] hi, how are the official ubuntu versions creating their isolinux/bootlogo file ? [14:13] I ask because I tried https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gfxboot-examples/+bug/1077339 [14:13] Launchpad bug 1077339 in gfxboot-examples (Ubuntu) "gfxboot examples fail to run" [Undecided,New] [14:13] and it fails [14:14] I would just want to change the color there: http://askubuntu.com/questions/10258/how-to-change-live-cd-splash-screen [14:15] same as the one who posted : I can change the first screen but not the following, even after unpacking initrd.lz and changing the ubuntu-plymouth-text "black" hexa code line [14:15] and recreating it [14:15] it shows only one very small second at shutdown, but none at reboot, so I supposed the guilty one is located in bootlogo (init file) ? [14:16] it's built by the gfxboot-theme-ubuntu package [14:16] gfxboot-examples is of little interest to me [14:17] hello cjwatson [14:18] is there a tutorial somewhere ? I have also installed gfxboot-theme-ubuntu package in my ubuntu precise host, and I seem to be unable to find a howto [14:18] no [14:18] at least not afaik [14:19] :-( [14:20] perhaps if I change the hex color code in a *.inc file there and use a "make" command ? [14:21] I can copy the content of the gfxboot-theme-ubuntu directory to /tmp and do tests there [14:24] in general you should start from the gfxboot-theme-ubuntu source package and not from any other version of it, certainly [14:24] it's a standard-Debian-format source package so you can build it in the usual way [14:24] I am not yet used to packaging [14:25] is the build command as presented in the examples ? I posted here the test I did: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gfxboot-examples/+bug/1077339/comments/1 "# make -C themes/example_07" [14:25] Launchpad bug 1077339 in gfxboot-examples (Ubuntu) "gfxboot examples fail to run" [Undecided,New] [14:29] getting gfxboot-theme-ubuntu source package now. What would be nice would be to know if there is a dedicated forum, mailing list, or chan to learn using it ? [14:33] reading into common.inc file now [14:33] dholbach, thanks for syncing the libreoffice deps :) [14:34] ricotz, no worries [14:37] sorry [14:41] ivanka: heya. Sorry, missed your ping from 11:39, what's up? =) [14:41] (#ubuntu-devel is busy with planning everything today) === _salem` is now known as _salem === wedgwood_away is now known as wedgwood [14:46] slangasek: I'd like to participate in the hangout of https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/foundations-1303-consolekit-logind-migration -- what do I need to do for this? (cjohnston said to contact the track lead) [14:46] melodie_: any Debian-format source package can be built using debuild (read its man page for details); the entry point into each package's build system is always debian/rules [14:47] cjwatson thanks (I will restart learning packaging soon) just now what I try to understand while reading in the source package files is how the background for the first live splash is setup [14:47] pitti, on this topic, I just moved it to 18utc, I hope it works for you [14:48] seb128: sure, I'll just skip Taekwondo [14:48] pitti, I want to try to have robert_ancell there and he's not going to be up much earlier I guess [14:48] pitti, oh, let me put it tomorrow 18utc then [14:48] seb128: no worries [14:48] cjohnston btw, I have found someone to sponsor a openbox-menu package I did and will redo it up to date for debian next. and the mentor talks the same language as me. :) [14:48] pitti, well, it's the same [14:48] seb128: I don't plan on going anyway, too many UDS sessions [14:48] pitti, ok, as you want [14:48] sorry [14:49] I tabbed too fast: cjwatson [14:49] :] [14:53] I'm getting chroot problems with building armhf on nasl, I've hit retry a few times but it keeps getting stuck https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/opal/3.10.10~dfsg-1/+build/4343624 [14:56] cjwatson this is what the project looks like once booted: http://meets.free.fr/debian/images/OBUbuntu-RC3.png [15:00] jbicha: yeah looks sad: https://launchpad.net/builders/nasl/+history - ping czajkowski in #launchpad === kentb-out is now known as kentb [15:05] dpm: any chance we can make the core apps project earlier (currently at 7-8pm0 [15:06] ckpringle, I will try, but there are a lot of sessions to coordinate and we're all on the same boat [15:08] rickspencer3: are we going to have a UDS session to actually discuss whether we are dropping non-LTS releases or not? I see sessions scheduled about the details, but nothing where we'd actually make that decision and drop 13.04 [15:08] hi tumbleweed [15:09] I'm not sure what the plan is for that [15:10] yeah, me neither. I'm just getting concerned that some people see it as a forgone conclusion while others feel that we haven't had the UDS discussion about it yet [15:10] I'm not certain what kind of discussion would add to what's already been discussed, tbh [15:10] heh, there really ought to be something [15:10] cjwatson, tumbleweed what would such a session look like? [15:10] if only because if we don't we'll spend time later answering the question why not [15:11] the whole question of monthly snapshots/updates/whatever deserves a session of its own, I guess; and then there's the question of how Ubuntu Desktop's decisions affect flavours [15:11] oh, I thought there was a session for monthly snapshots [15:12] yes, we have that [15:12] and I though slangasek brought one forward for the flavors [15:12] how does it get decided whether we do 13.04? [15:12] oh, yes, I've found it now [15:12] http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1303/meeting/21596/foundations-1303-monthly-snapshots/ [15:12] especially with respect to its release schedule [15:12] I haven't seen a flavours one yet [15:13] Laney, aiui the current idea is that we decide some more details and then go to the techboard [15:13] * micahg sees 3 sessions missing, was going to pen a mail to -devel (who, when, how of rolling release) [15:13] well, we have Feature Freeze on Thursday for example [15:13] fwiw, as Martin said, I don't see how the techboard can make a plausible decision other than "we can't do 13.04 if Canonical isn't funding the engineering to make it happen" === lynxman_ is now known as lynxman [15:14] cjwatson, there is that [15:14] there is that, but it hasn't been explicitly stated that I've seen [15:14] but we can do our best to make sure all the other things around that are as good as they can be [15:14] tumbleweed: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/technical-board/2013-March/001513.html [15:14] cjwatson: Do you happen to know if we're going forward with the TB meeting this evening in spite of UDS going on? [15:14] cjwatson: right, but for Canonical to prematurely yank funding if Ubuntu isn't ready to roll seems implausible as well [15:14] cjwatson: that doesn't say "canonical won't support non-LTS releases" it says people have been saynig that canonical is talking about this [15:15] * tumbleweed really needs to run, but I'll be back in 10 mins [15:15] tumbleweed: oh, ok, granted [15:15] soren: hm, I haven't seen an indication that we wouldn't. that means I have a long few days :-/ [15:15] I'm not sure I can make it given the demands [15:15] soren: UDS is tomorrow [15:16] micahg: orly? [15:16] tomorrow + Wed [15:16] soren, http://summit.ubuntu.com/ [15:16] Blimey. So it is. [15:16] * soren adjusts the date on his wrist watch. srsly [15:16] * micahg needed to catch up on the thread before penning the e-mail to devel about the missing sessions [15:17] Stupid thing needs manual adjustment for non-31-day months. I must have gotten it wrong. :) [15:25] cjwatson: right. so if we don't want to discuss it at the UDS, it'd help if canonical's plans were clear [15:29] I have some questions to the online UDS. Can I participate without G+ account? Or without webcam (audio-only)? [15:30] which one is the package containing debuild ? [15:31] melodie_: devscripts [15:31] Laney thanks [15:31] sure === Ursinha_ is now known as Ursinha === rsalveti_ is now known as rsalveti [16:19] mhall119: hmm, pitti asked about being included in the hangout for one of the foundations sessions... is there a particular process for how we handle who goes in which session, or is that just a matter of who we invite to the hangout at the time we set it up? [16:20] I saw somewhere that the 'required participants' get a link to join the hangout [16:23] cjwatson, mhall119: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1303/meeting/21641/community-1303-rolling-toolchain/ needs to be taken off the schedule, because doko's not available to discuss it; I've untargeted the blueprint from the sprint, is there anything else I need to do to get it off the schedule? [16:24] * tumbleweed heard that mentioned but haven't seen it documented anywhere [16:24] planet I think [16:24] * cjwatson has no idea I'm afraid [16:24] http://www.chrisjohnston.org/ubuntu/vuds [16:25] do we have a way to get people who are talking a lot in IRC into the sessions? [16:25] often the active participants aren't readily determinable in advance [16:26] you should be able to share the link out of band [16:26] (I guess) === beuno is now known as beuno-lunch === beuno-lunch is now known as beuno [16:33] slangasek, lool, xnox, Does it make sense to have a session on proposed solutions to manage ABI/API stability? [16:34] we had approx. similar one in Copenhagen, driven by steam coming to ubuntu and wanting to keep same binary around for as long as possible, ideally forever. [16:35] cjwatson: haha, sorry, I meant cjohnston [16:35] but nothing per se, resulted from it. [16:35] (as far as I know) [16:35] tedg: isn't there already some "app development SDK/ABI/API" sessions?! [16:35] slangasek: your becoming hard to follow... too many places lol [16:36] slangasek: ah :) [16:36] Laney: right, that says "the required participants will be given a link"... I guess that means I can use summit to mark the people I want "required" in the hangout [16:36] xnox, I think they were mostly targetted at the individual libs instead of a general solution. But I could have missed it. [16:36] I did wonder [16:36] slangasek: That's my understanding, but you have the author of the blog post here :-) [16:36] slangasek: they have to be marked as required [16:36] in summit [16:36] tedg: not sure, what do you have in mind for a session on proposed solutions to manage abi/api stability? [16:36] one sec [16:36] The gaming ABI session mostly ended up being about tracking ABI changes systematically so that we know when they happen and can manage them appropriately [16:37] cjohnston: ok. And I first need to mark them on the blueprint? [16:37] slangasek: I marked myself as "participation essential" in LP, but I understand that's not the same "required" as cjohnston means [16:37] xnox, I was thinking like the acc thing we discussed last week. [16:37] Since in the context of libraries we don't maintain it isn't meaningful to say "we won't change the ABI" - we need to find out when they change and keep compatibility packages around, etc. [16:37] xnox, And getting that to all libs. [16:37] slangasek: they need to be 'attending' via the BP.. essential on the BP doesnt matter.. [16:37] cjwatson, I was also concerned about accidental changes, more than on purpose ones. [16:38] pitti: I don't see you subscribed to https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/foundations-1303-logind-migration at all? [16:38] for some upstreams it's basically impossible to do that, sadly :-/ [16:38] Right, for those we can only meaningfully find out about them post hoc [16:38] slangasek: that's the superseded one; https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/foundations-1303-consolekit-logind-migration is the real thing AFAIUI [16:38] pitti: oh blast, the wrong blueprint is linked to the summit session [16:38] As long as it's before release and in time to do something about it ... [16:39] cjwatson, Release? I'm unfamiliar with this term you speak of ;-) We could block package build if it changes unknowningly, effectively like .symbols files. [16:39] cjohnston: hi, sorry - I need http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1303/meeting/21636/foundations-1303-logind-migration/ points to a wrong blueprint, I need to get https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/foundations-1303-consolekit-logind-migration on the schedule in its place... what's the best way to do that? [16:39] tedg: Last I checked we were still doing an LTS :-P [16:40] tedg: Yes, perhaps some kind of autopkgtest or autopkgtest-like checks across the board would be helpful [16:40] So not block build (though packages can and do do that themselves) but block promotion to the release pocket? [16:40] Anyway, that's what I was thinking for the session. If we had a plan there, then we could implement it on Canonical-libs first. [16:41] cjohnston: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/foundations-1303-consolekit-logind-migration is targeted to uds-1303, but I don't see it in the system anywhere [16:41] cjwatson, Sure, blocking getting out into the wild. Which step I'm not as worried about. [16:42] We could already have Canonical libraries use whatever the dh_makeshlibs option to fail on symbols file mismatches [16:42] *option is [16:42] And we're migrating many of them to use that. [16:42] dh_makeshlibs -- -c2 [16:42] But it's not really full ABI stability for things like structure sizes. [16:42] Which are really critical in the GObject world. [16:43] Indeed. There are various ABI checker tools around - does abicheck handle that? [16:43] slangasek: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1303/2013-03-06/ 1815.. isnt that the one you wnat [16:44] Or abi-compliance-checker [16:44] Yes, and I think that xnox was going to look into using it. [16:44] I think by now this is probably not a wheel we need to reinvent [16:44] * cjwatson nods [16:44] Basically adding a "symbols file" like thing to a package for the ABI. [16:44] Aha, that's what you meant by "acc"? That was a bit cryptic for me. [16:45] Yep. I approve :) [16:45] Sorry, yes, that's what I meant. [16:45] cjohnston: yes... hmm, did something magically fix itself? :) [16:45] i dunno... im confused from trying to keepup with all of the links that kept getting posted [16:45] and im confused why its against client unless it was renamed from client [16:46] it should point to foundations and not client correct? [16:47] cjohnston: it was renamed from client; it should be foundations, yes :) [16:47] and removed from the client room? [16:47] cjohnston: I imagine so [16:47] cjohnston: what's our hangout size limit? [16:47] (Though I'm not wild about abi-compliance-checker's configuration apparently being in XML :-/) === _salem is now known as salem_ [16:48] configuration, or manifest? [16:48] Manifest [16:48] slangasek: its removed from the client room, and assigned to foundations. you should now have the ability to schedule it [16:48] cjohnston: ta [16:48] Ah, it has some kind of alternative dump format too. I haven't really looked into it deeply ... [16:49] slangasek: also, in the subnav, you will see 'review attendees'... thats where you mark people required [16:49] cjohnston: yes, I know... I was halfway through that list when something reset the statuses on me ;) [16:49] hrm. ok [16:49] slangasek: Unrelatedly, I wonder if the GRUB efinet problem I'm seeing on my test system has anything to do with yours; it seems to just refuse to receive any packets ever, claiming (once I apply sufficient debugging) that the interface is uninitialised, but it can *transmit* packets just fine [16:50] It's very odd [16:50] Laney: can I ask you to set a britney block on pygobject? I'm about to upload 3.7.91, and while I don't know of anything that's broken I'm paranoid [16:50] oui [16:50] cjwatson: that sounds roughly familiar [16:50] Laney: i. e. I'd like to wait on all reverse depends autopkgtests [16:50] Laney: merci mon ami :) [16:50] Specifically it's getting EFI_DEVICE_ERROR on EFI_SIMPLE_NETWORK_PROTOCOL.Receive [16:50] slangasek, http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1303/2013-03-06/display the logind one is at 18:15 [16:51] slangasek: Are you still in a position to reproduce what you saw? [16:51] slangasek, I put it in the client track since after all we had some free slots [16:52] tedg, cjwatson: so the question was whether we needed a session on ABI stability. Does the appdev session have this covered, or do you need me to add something in the foundations track? [16:52] seb128: ok [16:52] cjwatson: with sufficient swapping of state into my brain, yes [16:54] slangasek: My current debugging patch is http://paste.ubuntu.com/5585573/ (note that that deliberately slows packet reception down to one poll every two seconds so that one can see what's going on); it would be interesting to apply that and see what error get_card_packet is hurling out [16:54] (That's against upstream trunk, ish, hopefully it roughly applies to 2.00) [16:55] slangasek: should http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1303/meeting/21603/community-1303-plusone-maintenance/ be renamed to foundations, and not against community and foundations? [16:55] slangasek: Oh, you'll need to "set debug=efinet" for that to work, so either do that in shell/configuration before doing any network operations, or build the netboot image with grub-mknetdir --debug-image=efinet [16:55] slangasek, I don't see one that covers this topic, I'm not 100% we need one as it seems relatively straightforward, but perhaps to coordinate? [16:56] cjwatson: ok, will try to have a look today [16:56] tedg: As long as somebody from foundations is in an appdev session as a general sanity check, I think we could deal with its output later [16:57] tedg: so currently I'm feeling a bit too-many-cooks on the question of abi checking; I don't think there's a lot to discuss, we just need to implement ABI checking infrastructure which doesn't really require more meetings IMHO [16:57] amen [16:57] Heh, sounds good to me. [16:58] You'll be sending out weekly TPS reports on progress right? ;-) [16:58] +1 [16:59] tedg: lool, tvoss and I are already planning to provide Canonical upstreams with a best practices guide for ABI stability, and to identify the correct infrastructure to check at package upload time that ABI/API hasn't silently broken [16:59] slangasek: I think if that fails (efinet) my next step is to try to dump out and disassemble this system's UEFI somehow :-/ [16:59] cjwatson: fun [16:59] In order to have some freaking clue what it's doing [16:59] It's still possible that GRUB's EFI calling shims are broken, though (a) I've hand-checked them (b) you'd think we'd have noticed [17:01] slangasek: lool how does http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1303/track/foundations/ look [17:01] cjohnston: LGTM, thanks [17:01] fulkl of sessions ! [17:01] *full [17:01] slangasek: have I addressed all of your concerns (that I can take care of with less than 24 hours to go) [17:02] I don't know if I was able to keep up with everything in both channels [17:03] cjohnston: I believe so, yes [17:03] cool. thanks [17:03] cjohnston: if not, once I've fully unwound my stack in another hour, I'll let you know :-) [17:03] :-) [17:03] * cjohnston notes to leave in 55 minutes === jbicha_ is now known as jbicha [17:34] cjohnston: thanks for fixing foundations track! :) [17:34] np === henrix is now known as henrix_ === henrix_ is now known as henrix [18:23] if i want to comment on a blueprint (asking a question i would like clarified), what is the convention for doing so? just edit the whiteboard directly, put my nick in [square brackets] then ask my question? [18:24] achiang: yes. [18:24] in chronological order =) [18:24] xnox: should i insert the question inline? or is there typically a q&a section? [18:25] achiang: wherever it's obvious, subscribed people will get a "diff" format of it anyway =) [18:25] xnox: thx [19:02] are the arm64 buildd's swamped? I've been getting timeouts trying to get a PPA to build a patched xserver for a bug (https://launchpad.net/~bryce/+archive/lp982889/+packages) and wonder if I should keep trying or if it's a lost cause? [19:03] hi guys [19:03] bryce: arm64 ?! wishful thinking =) or do you mean amd64 or armhf? [19:04] xnox, arg, yeah typo. amd64 [19:04] I really don't want to annoy anyone, but.... despite the fact that I really apreciate that Unity is moving to Qt/QML (I told this 2 years ago and nobody listened), I really don't like how the decision was takes: 0 community involvement, just an announcement. [19:05] Andy80: #ubuntu-unity [19:05] bryce: it doesn't look that busy, i386 is chugging away in the ppas though. === xnox changed the topic of #ubuntu-devel to: Packaging apps and software for Ubuntu, including new packages, PPA packages, etc. | Packaging guide: http://developer.ubuntu.com/packaging/html/ | For working on Ubuntu Core OS, see #ubuntu-devel | For writing apps and software targeting ubuntu, see #ubuntu-app-devel [19:05] damn, please revert. [19:05] bryce: https://launchpad.net/builders [19:05] dobey, I don't want to be OT, don't worry... but this is not an #ubuntu-unity problem only... it's something bigger. It involves the whole Ubuntu development. === xnox changed the topic of #ubuntu-devel to: Ubuntu 12.10 released | Archive: Open | Dev' of Ubuntu (not support or app devel) | build failures -> http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/ftbfs/ | #ubuntu for support and discussion of hardy -> quantal | #ubuntu-app-devel for app development on Ubuntu http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment | See #ubuntu-bugs for http://bit.ly/lv8soi | Patch Pilots: [19:07] Andy80: then IRC surely isn't the place to discuss it. you can perhaps bring it up on ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list or something [19:07] dobey, ok... sorry then. [19:09] xnox, thanks for the link. yes they don't look bogged down. Would you suggest I just keep trying? My build log isn't really very clueful about what went wrong. === shadeslayer is now known as evilshadeslayer [19:22] Andy80: I think Unity going to Qt/QML will have less of an impact than their decision to invent their own X windows replacement. [19:23] ScottK: I wish they named their display server 'UDS' instead of 'Mir' ;) [19:25] ScottK, that's not the point :) (maybe it's better if I blog my thoughts....) I 100% agree with the decision they (finally) made. But I strongly disagree with the way they did it. Community was not involved at all. That's what really hurts me. [19:26] Andy80: Right. Totally agreed. [19:26] First UDS, then rolling release, now this. [19:26] They have no end of surprised in store, apparently. [19:27] ScottK, oh wait... it's already decided for the rolling release :D ? (I agree with this too, but I totally missed the announcement :P ) [19:27] That's my assumption. [19:27] It certainly appears to me that the call do "discuss" it is pro forma. [19:27] ok [19:28] I already felt this a couple of UDS ago... [19:28] but I just didn't want to be "rude" bothering with them [19:28]