[00:14]  * Blazeix whispers: rick_h_! who are these people in our room!?
[00:15] <rick_h_> Blazeix: it's a couple that is working on learning to program
[00:15] <rick_h_> they wanted to come ask questions and hang out with programmers
[00:15] <rick_h_> the girl off to the side is his sister doing homework I guess
[00:15] <Blazeix> oh cool, so they are potential CHCers
[00:15] <rick_h_> right, very very early CHCers
[03:31] <greg-g> rick_h_: I love it, probably slow right now though :)
[03:32] <Blazeix> rick_h_ decided in CHC that newsblur was the most horrible thing he'd ever seen.
[03:32] <Blazeix> something about rainbox and green boxes
[03:32] <Blazeix> *rainbows
[03:38] <greg-g> :)
[03:39] <greg-g> can't please 'em all
[03:55] <snap-l> Um, so my slides for my low spam run your own mail server are up. ;)
[04:01] <greg-g> where abouts?
[04:04] <snap-l> https://dl.dropbox.com/u/9058804/low_spam.pdf
[12:05] <brousch> Geez, I must have pissed off Google somehow. They're killing Reader and removing ad blocking apps
[12:05] <snap-l> Good morning
[12:05] <snap-l> brousch: Yep, it's all your fault
[12:05] <brousch> They already killed Listen
[12:05] <snap-l> I'm surprised someone thought this was going to be condoned by Google.
[12:06] <brousch> They've been in there for years
[12:06] <snap-l> Google is not Apple
[12:06] <brousch> I've been using ad block since my first Android phone 4? years ago
[12:07] <snap-l> They probably didn't realize they were in the play store until someone bitched
[12:10] <brousch> rick_h_: If I send you $5 will you add feed reader functionality into Bookie?
[12:10] <snap-l> heh
[12:10] <snap-l> I think a sprint is forthcoming
[12:13] <brousch> If only I had the time
[12:14] <snap-l> I love it when people say Twitter is a replacement for RSS
[12:14] <snap-l> No, RSS is for people who aren't on Twitter 24/7
[12:15] <snap-l> And it's got people who are lazy
[12:15] <brousch> I will be seriously butthurt if they kill reader without offering a replacement
[12:16] <brousch> I spend about an hour a day in Reader, because doing it any other way would take me 3 hours
[12:18] <snap-l> Get used to disappointment
[12:20] <brousch> :P
[12:23] <rick_h_> yea, it's a mess.
[12:23] <rick_h_> and from my looking around last night everyone things rss means an email client
[12:24] <brousch> ug
[12:25] <rick_h_> so yea, there's some more hunting to do and maybe some code to be written. I don't know yet. I don't think I can tie rss into bookie. They're two different things.
[12:25] <snap-l> That's how I treat my RSS; as though it were another inbox
[12:25] <rick_h_> but what's interesting is that the new UI I've starting messing with I think would work for rss reading
[12:26] <snap-l> Too bad we didn't have this idea 1 year earlier.
[12:26] <rick_h_> I've been wanting to get a bookie ui with the list of bookmarks on the left and keyboard shortcuts to open their readable content/details in a wider right pane
[12:26] <rick_h_> and you could juse scroll through the bookmarks reading content as you go like a feed
[12:26] <rick_h_> and to be touch friendly so that swipes could work as well
[12:26] <brousch> You'd need a queue in Bookie, like a tag that goes away when you visit a bookmark
[12:27] <rick_h_> brousch: yea, I think it's too much to try to force the metaphor into bookmarks
[12:27] <rick_h_> and the back end is completely different
[12:27] <rick_h_> I think it'd just be a different application reusing UI widget components
[12:27] <rick_h_> but someone must have this already, so not given up looking for something decent yet
[12:27] <brousch> It is, but one of the apps I've wanted to build is a bunch of queues
[12:28] <snap-l> RSS is not queues
[12:28] <snap-l> It's a series of tubes. :)
[12:28] <snap-l> No, wait.
[12:28] <rick_h_> it is in a way
[12:28] <snap-l> It's very much like a set of onboxes
[12:28] <rick_h_> "mark all as read" == 'clear this queue'
[12:28] <snap-l> inboxes, rather
[12:29] <snap-l> queue implies FIFO
[12:29] <rick_h_> bah, the problem with the email metaphor is the wasted UI space for the list of messages.
[12:29] <snap-l> and RSS is not necessarily FIFO
[12:29] <snap-l> I didn't say listing messages like email
[12:29] <rick_h_> no, but forget that and it tends to be used as up-processed work items you walk through
[12:29] <rick_h_> s/up/un
[12:30] <rick_h_> very much like a worker queue where each category/feed is a queue in the system. you pick a queue and walk through un-processed work items
[12:30] <snap-l> I think it might be time to rethink RSS reading in general
[12:30] <snap-l> And not "hey, let's make it a dashboard" bullshit
[12:30] <rick_h_> well, that's currents/whatever-the-bleep-the-iphone-app-is
[12:32] <snap-l> True, but I'm thinking something like podcatching applications
[12:33] <snap-l> there's some out there that will keep however many episodes indefinitely
[12:33] <snap-l> and some episodes will have a backlog of 3 or so
[12:33] <snap-l> so you don't keep the totality of the Marketplace feed because who cares about last week's news
[12:33] <snap-l> So perhaps something with auto-expire on certain folders
[12:34] <snap-l> ie: If I haven't read /. feed in a week, start culling the herd
[12:34] <snap-l> but if I haven't read Sluggy Freelance in a week, keep that stuff around indefinitely.
[12:46] <snap-l> And now I:Scintilla join the mp3tribute.com tribute
[12:47] <snap-l> This gives me a happy
[13:23] <jrwren_> snap-l: i like your slides.
[13:23] <jrwren_> snap-l: of each of those antispam measures, which would you say does most good?
[13:24] <snap-l> They all work in tandem, though bl.spamcop.net is lilely the least effective.
[13:24] <snap-l> zen.spamhaus.org and DNS lookups are the two that are most effective
[13:25] <snap-l> SPF lookups are pretty effective as well
[13:25] <snap-l> And thank you. :)
[13:48] <rick_h_> ugh, feedhq is fugly as well
[14:26] <rick_h_> snap-l: booo for sharing that post
[14:27] <rick_h_> deduplication...that's a dream I've once had...
[14:27] <rick_h_> feedhq is at least django and looks hackable...open source but ugh
[14:29] <brousch> djangooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
[14:37] <snap-l> rick_h_: Sorry.
[14:38] <jrwren_> snap-l: do you greylist as well?
[14:39] <snap-l> jrwren_: No
[14:39] <snap-l> I think it's pointless for small installations
[14:40] <snap-l> Unless you get 1000s of pieces of email per day, greylisting is more trouble than it's worth IMO
[14:41] <snap-l> I tried it, and found that gmail would constantly rese thte clock
[14:41] <snap-l> s/rese/reset/
[14:42] <snap-l> THe biggeer providers need to be whitelisted
[14:42] <snap-l> at which point I decided it was a waste of time
[14:43] <snap-l> We had greylisting over at SF.net when I was there, but the basic premise that spammers don't wait is flawed
[14:44] <snap-l> The stuff I mentioned catches the ones that aren't operating in the open, and catches the known offenders
[14:45] <snap-l> Major point to consider: I am lazy. I don't want to think about my email server more than I have to
[17:44] <greg-g> oh, rick, you may like the new redesign of newsblur, if you have an account, go to dev.newsblur.com
[17:44] <greg-g> rick_h_: ^
[17:48] <dzho> is it working today?
[17:49] <dzho> it was pretty hammered last night
[17:49] <greg-g> dev.newsblur.com is doing better than the main site
[17:49] <greg-g> BUT DON'T TELL ALL YOUR FRIENDS! IT IS OUT LITTLE QUICK PLAYGROUND RIGHT NOW
[17:49] <brousch> tweeted and reddited
[17:50] <greg-g> NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOo
[17:53] <snap-l> That's actually not that bad
[17:55] <brousch> Heh, I get a 502 at dev.newsblur.com
[17:55] <greg-g> NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
[17:56] <greg-g> you ruined it, brousch !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[18:02] <rick_h_> greg-g: I'll check it out
[18:02] <greg-g> rick_h_: brousch broke it
[18:02] <rick_h_> doh
[18:02] <rick_h_> brousch: breaks everything...you think he'd like it since it's django
[18:04] <brousch> Django is the best!
[18:05] <rick_h_> except it can't stay up :P
[18:05] <rick_h_> or maybe we can blame mongo hah!
[18:22] <brousch> It's obvious that Python doesn't scale
[18:24] <snap-l> No, but it does whittle.
[19:39] <snap-l> I think I could get used to this faster network
[19:44] <rick_h_> woot!
[22:47] <snap-l> Good evening
[22:49] <rick_h_droid> party