[08:50] <soren> How can I query the bantracker? A user was banned in #ubuntu-server and I'd like to see why.
[08:57] <Myrtti> who?
[09:12] <soren> Myrtti: Usual nick is twb.
[09:12] <soren> Myrtti: freenode account name trentbuck
[09:16] <Myrtti> right
[09:18] <Myrtti> well first if all, many people seem to have an issue with the explicit language he uses
[09:19] <Myrtti> second, if you are an op of -server, you might want to join -ops semipermanently
[09:19] <soren> Who has an issue?
[09:20] <Myrtti> third, someone with rights to give you access to the bot config options might fix the access issue for you
[09:21] <soren> It's not a matter of access.
[09:21] <soren> It's a matter of not having a clue where to look.
[09:21] <soren> Once I work that out, it might be an access issue.
[09:21] <Tm_T> @btlogin
[09:21] <soren> Tm_T: Was that to me?
[09:21] <Myrtti> @login first
[09:21] <ubottu> (login takes no arguments) -- Allows users who are identified to NickServ to login without a password.
[09:22] <Tm_T> soren: yup
[09:22] <Myrtti> yesyes ubottu
[09:22] <Myrtti> shhh :-P
[09:23] <soren> No access. It doesn't accept my login request.
[09:26] <soren> Again: Who has an issue with twb's language?
[09:30] <soren> Yeah, that's kinda what I suspected.
[09:31] <Tm_T> soren: I have no idea what you're talking about, sorry
[09:31] <soren> Tm_T: Sorry, it was mostly a question for Myrtti.
[09:31] <Tm_T> soren: aah I see the context now
[09:32] <Tm_T> count me in for "having an issue"
[09:33] <soren> The issue being what exactly?
[09:34] <Tm_T> I recall the issue being general swearing and other inpolite language
[09:35] <soren> Seriously, it's not #ubuntu-kindergarten.
[09:35] <Tm_T> indeed it isn't
[09:35] <soren> He has easily been one of the most useful people in #ubuntu-server he gets banned for accsionally saying "shit"? Really?
[09:36] <Tm_T> cannot recall all the details but I don't believe it was only "shit" that triggered the ban
[09:37] <Tm_T> oftentimes big part of a ban plays how people take requests on behaviour
[09:38] <soren> You know... If I said "shit" every once in a while (which I do) and someone threatened to throw me out of a club that I helped form I'd tell them to grow some bloody skin.
[09:38] <Tm_T> soren: threatened?
[09:39] <soren> You're saying he didn't even get a warning before being banned?
[09:39] <Tm_T> I recall there being several requests about the language used, and some discussion
[09:39] <Tm_T> so yes, plenty of warnings
[09:39] <soren> Right.
[09:39] <soren> That.
[09:40] <Tm_T> there's no threatening in that necessarily
[09:40] <soren> I'm willing to bet that noone actually has taken offence, but his choice of words has just made someone's IRc client make an annoying noise.
[09:40] <Tm_T> we ask people to not use profane language on daily basis
[09:41] <Tm_T> I'd say in very rare cases it escalates to a ban
[09:41] <soren> Well, I've removed the ban. Feel free to ban me in response. It's ridiculous.
[09:41] <Tm_T> soren: why would I ban you?
[09:42] <Tm_T> I most likely would have removed the ban too if he came and asked it (:
[09:42] <soren> I have no idea.
[09:42] <soren> Just like I have no idea why you'd ban twb for his language.
[09:42] <Tm_T> I wonder if there's been any discussion with him about the ban since
[09:43] <soren> He said he tried to have a discussion about it, but people were just rude to him.
[09:43] <Tm_T> when? where?
[09:44] <soren> 08:42 < twb> btw do I know you from #ubuntu-server or something?
[09:44] <soren> 08:42 < soren> twb: Indeed.
[09:44] <soren> 08:42 < twb> Ah, I got banned from there
[09:44] <soren> 08:42 < soren> lol. What on earth for?
[09:44] <soren> 08:42 < twb> They wouldn't tell me
[09:44] <soren> 08:42 < soren> twb: Who did it?
[09:44] <soren> 08:42 < twb> No idea
[09:44] <soren> 08:43 < twb> I tried to join one morning as usual and it said banned -- still does
[09:44] <soren> 08:43 < twb> I asked #ubuntu-ops but whoever was on duty was extremely unhelpful
[09:44] <soren> 08:44 < twb> This was around Nov 2012
[09:44] <soren> 08:44 < soren> twb: Just removed the ban. What nonsense. You're easily one of the most useful people there. You're welcome back, but I totally get it if you don't feel like it.
[09:44] <Tm_T> and if he didn't believe ops doing the justice, there's irc council he could have contacted (:
[09:44] <Tm_T> let's see...
[09:44] <soren> Sure.
[09:45] <Tm_T> anyway, I see what I can find about this
[09:45] <soren> What we want to do is drive the best people in the community away by default unless they care enough to escalate to some council (who are likely friends of whoeever imposed the ban to begin with).
[09:46] <Tm_T> soren: we have a problem if you cannot trust council
[09:46] <soren> Yes. We also haev a problem if people can't have conversations like regular people without having to talk to a council first.
[09:46] <Tm_T> they can
[09:46] <Tm_T> if not, there's a problem too
[09:47] <soren> Regular people say shit.
[09:47] <soren> Really. I've seen it happen.
[09:47] <Tm_T> 1136.41 < Tm_T> cannot recall all the details but I don't believe it was only "shit" that triggered the ba
[09:47] <Tm_T> n
[09:48] <soren> There are other words too, but I see the language police lurking here and I honestly can't be bothered having to deal with a bloody council 10 minutes from now because someone's IRc client makes a rude noise.
[09:48] <soren> Just forget it.
[09:48] <soren> I've unbanned him.
[09:58] <Myrtti> that went well...
[09:58] <Tm_T> what I can see from logs there weren't any rudeness though
[13:10] <hggdh> that is not typical of soren
[13:21] <Tm_T> indeed this whole thing seems to be blown out of propotions for no apparent reason
[13:38] <Myrtti> in addition I didn't notice he was in -ops, so that might have added on his hurt feelings :-(
[13:40]  * AlanBell looks at the scrollback