[01:04] <Akiva-Mobile> I just thought I would share this : https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-lens-shopping/+bug/1156100
[01:06] <Akiva-Mobile> long story short, type gnome into the dash, and get greeted with this: http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41mS5Op6GfL.jpg
[01:11] <LordShadowWing> hello everyone
[01:14] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, whats wrong with that?
[01:14] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: Some people are more modest than others.
[01:15] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, so?
[01:15] <tgm4883> that is hardly NSFW
[01:15] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: don't peddle your dope to me.
[01:15] <tgm4883> and not adult material
[01:15] <Akiva-Mobile> in your opinion. Values are subjective.
[01:15] <Akiva-Mobile> and that is too much for myself.
[01:16] <Akiva-Mobile> and my grandma who runs ubuntu as well :P
[01:16] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, I don't smoke, can we also ban smoking pipes from showing up in results?
[01:16] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: Yes, i would like to.
[01:16] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, IMHO, it's that type of attitude that is wrong with the world
[01:16] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: There is porn in unitdy dash as well.
[01:17] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, but we aren't talking about porn, are we
[01:17] <tgm4883> we're talking about a garden gnome
[01:17] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: But that is the issue. I get "Non - Adult" material which I would call pornographic
[01:17] <tgm4883> Honestly, the worst thing about that is the title of the bug you posted
[01:18] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, out of curiosity, where are you from?
[01:18] <Akiva-Mobile> Yah, true, I thought it would get a lark.
[01:18] <Akiva-Mobile> Canada.
[01:18] <tgm4883> Is that something that someone could put out in their front garden in Canada?
[01:19] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: Technically you can be topless in canada
[01:19] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, so I'm guessing that is a yes then
[01:19] <Akiva-Mobile> But what does that have to do with anything?
[01:19] <Akiva-Mobile> certainly.
[01:19] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: You do realize that we have to draw the line somewhere,
[01:20] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, it has to do with a lot. The reason porn shouldn't be in the dash is that in some major localaties it is illegal for people under a certain age to view it
[01:20] <Akiva-Mobile> as I could make the argument that there is nothing wrong with necrophelia, or voluntary child porn, or incest, etc etc.
[01:20] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, I am unaware of any locality that bans those garden gnomes
[01:20] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: My house, we ban those.
[01:20] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, you could make the argument all you want, but those things are illegal in most countries
[01:21] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, perhaps search results should only be provided for approved, whitelisted content
[01:21] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: You are arguing against yourself. Drugs are mostly illegal in all countries
[01:22] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, such as Pepsi products and Silly putty
[01:22] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, and?
[01:22] <Akiva-Mobile> and yet you seemed to support the idea of crack pipes being present in dash.
[01:22] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, I never said that
[01:22] <Akiva-Mobile> you said pipes
[01:23] <tgm4883> This is not a crack pipe  http://www.amazon.com/Brand-Classic-Durable-Tobacco-Smoking/dp/B0037J7ZIG%3FSubscriptionId%3DAKIAIQ733ZDLGFIV6PEQ%26tag%3Du1treatyrslf-20%26linkCode%3Dxm2%26camp%3D2025%26creative%3D165953%26creativeASIN%3DB0037J7ZIG
[01:23] <Akiva-Mobile> Okay, I read a bit into your comment. I will retract it.
[01:23] <tgm4883> ty
[01:24] <Akiva-Mobile> so what about ciggarettes?
[01:24] <Akiva-Mobile> or tobacco?
[01:24] <tgm4883> what about them?
[01:24] <Akiva-Mobile> or drug paraphenelia?
[01:24] <Akiva-Mobile> should they show up in dash?
[01:24] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, as far as I know, there is nothing illegal about viewing them, so they shouldn't be banned
[01:25] <Akiva-Mobile> So its only legality you are concerned about
[01:25] <Akiva-Mobile> not whether it will offend users?
[01:25] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, yes
[01:25] <Akiva-Mobile> After all, I have seen full on nudity in my dash, but seeing as it is classified as art,
[01:25] <Akiva-Mobile> it could hardly be illegal.
[01:27] <tgm4883> ok
[01:28] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: I think the principle that should be followed, that is "What is hateful to you, do not do to another" as the most effective way to present dash.
[01:28] <ali1234> all you have to do to evade dash filters is prefix query with space
[01:28] <Akiva-Mobile> Assuming that it is ubuntu's goal for the shopping lens to help users, rather than to peddle dope.
[01:28] <ali1234> just sayin'
[01:28] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, I'm not sure what that has to do with anything
[01:29] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: if your dash shopping lens suddenly started trying to convert you and your children to a religious cult, would you take issue?
[01:30] <cjaredrun> i would listen intently....
[01:30] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, "If all printers were determined not to print anything till they were sure it would offend nobody, there would be very little printed."
[01:30] <dank101> one day d2att port status: Downloaded: 30
[01:30] <ali1234> Akiva-Mobile: that's why i stopped using unity
[01:30] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: Of course, but as said, ubuntu's aim is to be helpful, assuming for the vast majority.
[01:31] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, "Be careful that what you write does not offend anybody or cause problems within the company. The safest approach is to remove all useful information."
[01:31] <dank101> Ubuntu is god
[01:31] <dank101> the end
[01:31] <dank101> if you disagree
[01:31] <dank101> you are wrong
[01:31] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: Opensource software offends Steve Ballmer and Bill Gates; does that mean we shouldnt pursue it?
[01:31] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: A bare naked gnome is useful information?
[01:31] <ali1234> open source software does not offend bill gates
[01:32] <dank101> no
[01:32] <ali1234> he said so on reddit
[01:32] <dank101> it doesn't
[01:32] <ali1234> so it must be true
[01:32] <Akiva-Mobile> ali1234: I recalled a quote, hmmm
[01:32] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, you apparently believe we shouldn't because it offends Microsoft
[01:32] <dank101> he made winNT opensourced
[01:32] <dank101> then he got flamed
[01:32] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, if you are searching for garden gnomes, then yes, it is useful information
[01:32] <dank101> for comparing windows to linux
[01:32] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: Either you are a troll, or you misunderstdood this :"ubuntu's aim is to be helpful, assuming for the vast majority."
[01:33] <Akiva-Mobile> the view of steve ballmer is not the vast majority.
[01:33] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, just because a majority of people think something, doesn't make them right
[01:33] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: Let the garden gnomes you search for keep their pants on.
[01:33] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: Where did I claim it was?
[01:34] <ali1234> i'm really confused what this argument is even about any more
[01:34] <dank101> Windows, OpenSourced, and lawn gnomes
[01:34] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, when you assumed that we should ban "mooning garden gnomes" in the name of pornography
[01:34] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883 thinks that anything goes in the unity shopping lens in so long as it is not illegal to look at it.
[01:34] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, because that is what the "majority" would think
[01:35] <dank101> JUST SHUT UP
[01:35] <ali1234> what's wrong with that?
[01:35] <dank101> STOP FIGHTING
[01:35] <tgm4883> dank101, we aren't fighting
[01:35] <ali1234> personally i think it should either be unfiltered or not exist at all, precisely because of arguments like this
[01:35] <dank101> could not agree more
[01:35] <ali1234> you can never decide on what gets filtered and what does not
[01:35] <tgm4883> dank101, this is called having an adult discussion about a topic. If you can't handle that, this is IRC and you are welcome to leave
[01:35] <ali1234> someone will always be like "i get offended by chairs" or something
[01:35] <tgm4883> ali1234, I disagree
[01:36] <ali1234> tgm4883: i fine with that. i don't use it anyway :)
[01:36] <tgm4883> you can decide on what gets filtered, if you have a basis for your reasoning
[01:36] <Akiva-Mobile> ali1234: how about "No nudity of breasts or bottoms whatsoever."; that should suffice for 99 percent.
[01:36] <dank101> ali1234, is right the end now be quiet before i offend all of you using chairs
[01:37] <LordShadowWing> im back lol
[01:37] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, I disagree, a mooning garden gnome is not offensive (and I think the majority would agree with me)
[01:38] <dank101> Guys
[01:38] <dank101> stop
[01:38] <dank101> please
[01:38] <LordShadowWing> I concur
[01:38] <tgm4883> dank101, why
[01:38] <dank101> it's annoying
[01:39] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: Its better to remove rather than include. I don't care if 75 percent of people want dash to display kiddie porn on their shopping lens by default. At best, put a filter option when you install, and let people choose their level of promiscuity
[01:39] <tgm4883> dank101, so we shouldn't have a conversation about a bug report and decide whether it needs fixed or not because it annoys you?
[01:39] <dank101> SINCE WHEN WAS THIS ABOUT A BUG REPORT
[01:39] <dank101> AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH MY BRAIN
[01:40] <dank101> IM MELTING IM MELTHING
[01:40] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, you're points would go further if you would stop using instances that are almost universally illegal in all countries
[01:40] <ali1234> since always, read the log
[01:40] <tgm4883> dank101, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-lens-shopping/+bug/1156100
[01:40]  * dank101 turns to a pile of goop
[01:41] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: and if Kiddie Porn was legal in all countries, then your answer would be to include it by default?
[01:41] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, as much as I wouldn't want to see it, I wouldn't say we should ban something that isn't illegal
[01:42] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, providing it was legal for everyone to see
[01:42] <LordShadowWing> Any new functionality in the most recent nightly
[01:42] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: I agree. I think we should be able to choose our levels of promiscuity, and that it should be set to safe by default.
[01:42] <Akiva-Mobile> People would be less offended if they knew that porn was deactivated by default, rather than enabled by default.
[01:42] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, but it is set to safe by default
[01:43] <ali1234> does anyone have a link to said gnome?
[01:43] <dank101> it must be a amazon problem
[01:43] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: safe is not safe enough.
[01:43] <dank101> the end
[01:43] <Akiva-Mobile> sec
[01:43] <ali1234> nvm i found it on bug
[01:43] <ali1234> yeah that's pretty tame
[01:44] <Akiva-Mobile> http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41mS5Op6GfL.jpg
[01:44] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, not safe enough for you perhaps
[01:44] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: Exactly. Including my children
[01:44] <dank101> I have a fix
[01:44] <Akiva-Mobile> I don't want them picking up bad habits.
[01:45] <dank101> PURGE THE AMAZON LENS
[01:45] <dank101> and since WHEN was ubuntu for kids
[01:45] <dank101> that's edubuntu's jub
[01:45] <dank101> *job
[01:45] <Akiva-Mobile> dank101: .... if kids don't qualify as human beings, then I guess you have a point ;)
[01:46] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, honestly that sounds like bad parenting to me
[01:46] <dank101> they do
[01:46] <dank101> but they are YOUNG human beings
[01:46] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, but that isn't really the point of this discussion
[01:46] <ali1234> the "human beings" thing was dropped long ago
[01:46] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: Send the social workers.
[01:46] <Akiva-Mobile> ali1234: Really?
[01:47] <ali1234> "ubuntu is not aimed at you" is now default answer to any complaints
[01:47] <dank101> something i want to show you Akiva
[01:47] <dank101> http://www.edubuntu.org/
[01:47] <Akiva-Mobile> thanks dank101
[01:48] <dank101> linux for young human beings
[01:48] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, so where would you like us to draw this arbitrary lines?
[01:48] <dank101> get the LTS
[01:48] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, should we remove pictures of guns too?
[01:48] <dank101> should we remove pictures of cars?
[01:49] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: I already told you; the majority 99 percent of users..
[01:49] <tgm4883> dank101, that is a good one. Cars create pollution. We should probably ban pictures of cars
[01:49] <ali1234> http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/xhboe/reddit_what_the_best_revenge_youve_ever_gotten_on/c5mcvb0
[01:49] <Akiva-Mobile> dank101: Only ricers.
[01:49] <dank101> Hell should we remove the amazon lens entirely
[01:49] <dank101> we should remove pics of mario!
[01:49] <dank101> he kills people everyday!
[01:50] <Akiva-Mobile> dank101: He kills monsters. That is different.
[01:50] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, should we also ban wikipedia?
[01:50] <dank101> BUT THERE STILL PEOPLE!
[01:50] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: who said anything about ban?
[01:50] <dank101> Remember what ubuntu means
[01:50] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, you did. You want to ban these things from showing up in search results in the dash
[01:51] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: I clearly mentioned that users should be able to choose, and the default level should be set to safe, and that the safe needs to be safer than it is currently.
[01:52] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, there is a wikipedia lens, and that can return results about the KKK and the holocaust
[01:52] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, are those safe?
[01:52] <dank101> Akiva-Mobile, focusing on everything's allegiances and relations with each other.
[01:52] <dank101> thats what ubuntu means
[01:53] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: No, those are adult subjects as far as I am concerned, and should be approached in the presence of an adult who can provide context.
[01:53] <dank101> so mario OBVIOUSLY should be banned
[01:53] <Akiva-Mobile> dank101: Strawmen should be banned too.
[01:53] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, but they would still show up in search results in the dash
[01:53] <dank101> HELL LETS BAN EVERYTHING
[01:53] <dank101> EVERYTHING IS BAD
[01:53] <dank101> TRAINS KILL PEOPLE
[01:54] <dank101> GNOMES MOON YOU
[01:54] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: Images is what I am most concerned with. Text is another matter that I frankly havnt thought through.
[01:54] <dank101> VIDEO GAMES BURN OUT YOUR EYES
[01:54] <dank101> MUST BE TOO GRAPHIC FOR KIDS
[01:54] <ali1234> how are you going to filter images though?
[01:54] <Akiva-Mobile> dank101: For example, there are many grotesque images from the holocaust.
[01:54] <ali1234> i don't wanna be the guy who has to program the filter that detects mooning gnomes
[01:55] <Akiva-Mobile> ali1234: ha ha
[01:55] <dank101> ali1234, i don't think anyone does
[01:55] <tgm4883> ali1234, you would probably need to have lots of known mooning images to test with
[01:55] <dank101> and thats why parents should stick with edubuntu
[01:55] <dank101> THATS WHY EDUBUNTU WAS INVENTED
[01:56] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, for your 99%, in the small, non-scientific poll of the 4 people in this discussion, 3 of them don't think that image is offensive
[01:56] <tgm4883> I have a feeling the more people we get in this poll, the more people think that image is fine
[01:56] <dank101> I HAVE THE SOLUTION
[01:57] <Akiva-Mobile> ali1234: to me, the solution would be an efficient algorithim that compares the tags of the result to  a dictionary of prohibitted words.
[01:57] <dank101> IF AMAZON'S CONTENT IS "TOO OFFENSIVE"
[01:57] <dank101> THEN USE http://www.edubuntu.org/
[01:57] <Akiva-Mobile> dank101: that is a good suggestion.
[01:57] <ali1234> amazon has plenty of stuff i legitimately wouldn't want my hypothetical kids to see
[01:57] <ali1234> but this gnome is not one of them
[01:57] <dank101> tl;dr if you have kids
[01:57] <dank101> use http://www.edubuntu.org/
[01:57] <dank101> LTS
[01:57] <tgm4883> lets not get hung up on the "how do we filter it" and instead discuss the "why should we filter this"
[01:58] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: Look, I am a moral nihilist, and so I approach these issues with a utilitarian frame work.
[01:58] <ali1234> wat
[01:59] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, I'm a person. and I approach these issues without fancy words for myself
[01:59] <Akiva-Mobile> Most people are less offended when a setting is set on safe by default, rather than promiscuous by default. Ergo, I say set it to safe, and make it safer than it is right now.
[01:59] <dank101> this is linux for people
[01:59] <ali1234> but it already is on safe
[01:59] <dank101> NOT YOUNG PEOPLE
[01:59] <dank101> http://www.edubuntu.org/
[01:59] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, the issue is that we 3 of the 4 people here don't think that image is unsafe
[01:59] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: .... do you not know what Moral Nihilism is?
[01:59] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, AT ALL
[01:59] <dank101> i used edubuntu when i was in school
[01:59] <ali1234> i don't
[02:00] <dank101> i graduated
[02:00] <dank101> fix of your problem
[02:00] <dank101> http://www.edubuntu.org/
[02:00] <dank101> http://www.edubuntu.org/
[02:00] <dank101> http://www.edubuntu.org/
[02:01] <Akiva-Mobile> ali1234: it basically means within a secular framework (IE, not bringing G-d into the equation), there is no way to be certain if a)Absolute universal morality does exist, and b)If it does exist, to be absolutely certain as to what it is.
[02:01] <dank101> Akiva-Mobile, follow my suggestion
[02:03] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, honestly, I don't think that is a non-safe image. You should probably take it on yourself and disable the amazon search in the dash
[02:04] <Akiva-Mobile> ergo (18:57:57) tgm4883: lets not get hung up on the "how do we filter it" and instead discuss the "why should we filter this"  -- is a statement not suitable for this discussion, unless speaking about some hypothetical utilitarian end.
[02:04] <ali1234> well if you're only interested in the how... then the simple answer is we can't filter everything perfectly
[02:04] <ali1234> we can't even filter most things badly
[02:04] <ali1234> if you're going to include stuff like this
[02:04] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, if we aren't discussing why it should be filtered, then wtf are we discussing?
[02:04] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: I took it upon myself to report this as a bug to Ubuntu. It is their company, and they should know that at least one user does not find this content to be appropriate to look at.
[02:05] <Akiva-Mobile> they can judge whether it is worth their resources, or whether it is worth it at all to deal with this.
[02:06] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: I am sorry for being technical, but since you asked; We are discussing Hypothetical imperatives, not categorical imperatives.
[02:06] <ali1234> whaaaaaaaat
[02:06] <Akiva-Mobile> or at least, I am not discussing a categorical imperative because I believe that endeavor to be mired in perpetual folly.
[02:07] <Akiva-Mobile> ali1234: there are two types of "imperatives" or "Reasons" as to why we ought to do something.
[02:08] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, cut the crap. We're discussing whether or not a bare butt on a garden gnome should be filtered by default or not. The "don't discuss how, discuss why" quote of mine was that we shouldn't discuss how to technically filter it (eg. in code), but as to whether or not it should be filtered
[02:09] <Akiva-Mobile> A hypothetical imperative is the most common, simply meaning that "We ought to do x so that we can accomplish y". For example: If I want to go to the store, I ought to stand up, go to my car, turn it on, drive to store, etc etc. This has been shown to work.
[02:10] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, there are more than enough ways to actually get rid of the particular images, which is why I didn't think we should bother discussing it
[02:10] <Akiva-Mobile> A categorical Imperative is the type of thing you "Ought" to do simply because it is the "Moral" or "Right" thing to do, and not because of any benefit you may derive from doing so.
[02:10] <tgm4883> for instance, we could look at image tags and filter out when certain keywords are met (although this requires that people tag the images)
[02:11] <tgm4883> or we could filter on page content (although we'd probably just combine this with the one above)
[02:11] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: and I already told you; the reason why I think ubuntu should remove it, is because I don't like it.
[02:11] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, and I asked you where we should draw all this arbitrary lines
[02:12] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: I already said; no nudity of bare bottoms or topless women.
[02:12] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, we can show guns though?
[02:13] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, cause I'm from 'Merica, so that is kinda a deal breaker if you want to filter guns out ;)
[02:13] <Akiva-Mobile> For my tastes, I don't care. If someone is willing to say no, it is upon them to pipe up.
[02:13] <Akiva-Mobile> If they disable guns by default, I won't be angry.
[02:14] <tgm4883> what about flag burning? should we filter that out?
[02:14] <ali1234> sure
[02:14] <Akiva-Mobile> Its up to the people who see that as so intollerable to make their concerns heard.
[02:14] <ali1234> people only do it to get attention anyway
[02:15] <dank101> EVERYBODY QUITE
[02:15] <ali1234> quite what?
[02:15] <dank101> FOR THE 6K TIME THE FIX IS INSTALLINGhttp://www.edubuntu.org/
[02:15] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, ok, what about automobiles? they pollute the environment, so.... filter them out?
[02:15] <dank101> *quiet
[02:15] <dank101> what about mario
[02:15] <Akiva-Mobile> Its up to the people who see that as so intollerable to make their concerns heard.
[02:15] <dank101> he kills people all day
[02:15] <dank101> breaks ubuntu
[02:16] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, what about images of Stalin or Hitler?
 Its up to the people who see that as so intollerable to make their concerns heard.
[02:16] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: dank101 - Remember, Ubuntu is a company selling a product, and it is presumably in their best interest to satisfy their customers to the best of their ability.
[02:16] <dank101> ...
[02:16] <dank101> Canonical is a company
[02:16] <dank101> not ubuntu
[02:16] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, actually, no. Canonical is a company that is selling a product (Ubuntu).
[02:16] <dank101> ubuntu is a word
[02:17] <dank101> a legacy
[02:17] <dank101> a South African legacy
[02:17] <Akiva-Mobile> dank101: okay, ubuntu is a product of a company.
[02:17] <Akiva-Mobile> and that product presumably aims to satisfy its users to the best of the abilities of the company who supports it.
[02:17] <dank101> Ubuntu is south african for  focusing on people's allegiances and relations with each other
[02:18] <tgm4883> I'll half agree that Ubuntu is a product of Canonical. Canonical employes a lot (most?) of the developers of Ubuntu
[02:18] <dank101> consitoring Mark Shuttleworth is south african
[02:18] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: I think its 40 percent user contributed
[02:18] <dank101> guys
[02:18] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883:  I could be wrong about that number, but I recall hearing that recently.
[02:19] <dank101> ubuntu == south afican for unity
[02:19] <Akiva-Mobile> and canonical is about 500-600 employees strong.
[02:19] <dank101> $30 million stock
[02:19] <Akiva-Mobile> wow, I have to buy in :P
[02:20] <Akiva-Mobile> that is still fire sale
[02:20] <lilstevie>  dank101 which south african language :p there are a ton of official languages, none of which are named south african :p
[02:20] <lilstevie> I'm assuming Afrikaans though
[02:20] <Akiva-Mobile> afrikaans is germanic, no?
[02:21] <lilstevie> Akiva-Mobile, it is very heavily influenced by dutch, so yes
[02:21] <lilstevie> :p
[02:22] <Akiva-Mobile> lilstevie: Interesting; I thought it evolved from the german colony, but that makes more sense.
[02:22] <Akiva-Mobile> it is a nice quaint language; I quite enjoyed listening to it.
[02:22] <lilstevie> and ok, ubuntu is zulu :p
[02:27] <Namidairo> and unity is english for EWWW WHAT IS THAT
[02:28]  * tgm4883 likes Unity
[02:28] <lilstevie> Namidairo, lol
[02:29] <Namidairo> i'm being a tad harsh to it
[02:30] <Namidairo> it's appearance as a purple hippo's vomit is purely subjective
[02:30] <dank101> Linux is defiantly growing
[02:30] <dank101> Red Hat, Inc is gaining TONS of cash
[02:31] <dank101> 2009 was the linux takeover
[02:31] <Namidairo> how much of that cash was thrown at ms to sign their bootloaders
[02:32] <dank101> idk
[02:32] <dank101> Red Hat is highest in 13 years
[02:32] <dank101> RED HAT
[02:33] <mattwj2002> does ubuntu phone do anything yet?
[02:34] <tgm4883> mattwj2002, I've read somewhere that it will be a daily driver in a few weeks
[02:35] <Akiva-Mobile> Namidairo: Unity's selling point for me is its HUD
[02:35] <mattwj2002> when you say daily driver do you mean daily releases?
[02:35] <Akiva-Mobile> Namidairo: I can now use gimp without a headache
[02:36] <tgm4883> mattwj2002, no, I mean something that you could feasibly use on your device thoughout the day
[02:36] <Namidairo> the fact that it gave you headaches in the first place confuses me
[02:36] <tgm4883> mattwj2002, eg. it actually works
[02:36] <mattwj2002> oh that would be good
[02:36] <tgm4883> yea, that would be pretty sweet
[02:36] <Akiva-Mobile> Namidairo: do you know how many menus and dialogues gimp has?
[02:37] <mattwj2002> no offense to anyone but I was disappointed with the developers preview
[02:37] <tgm4883> mattwj2002, why?
[02:37] <Akiva-Mobile> Namidairo: Sure, after awhile you get used to it, and if you study it, you can memorize all the shortcuts and hotkeys etc
[02:37] <mattwj2002> there was very little functionality on my phone
[02:37] <Akiva-Mobile> but for those who arent pro, like myself, it is a g-d send
[02:37] <tgm4883> mattwj2002, no offense to you, but I think you completely misunderstand what a developer preview is
[02:37] <mattwj2002> I tried it like day one or two when it came out
[02:38] <Namidairo> you realise the purpose of the developer preview was not to have it all working
[02:38] <mattwj2002> none take
[02:38] <Akiva-Mobile> mattwj2002: All placeholder apps right?
[02:38] <mattwj2002> *taken
[02:38] <Namidairo> it was so you could test your QML apps
[02:38] <mattwj2002> yeah
[02:38] <mattwj2002> I have tried windows developers previews
[02:38] <Akiva-Mobile> mattwj2002: Do you blame them?
[02:38] <mattwj2002> nope
[02:38] <mattwj2002> I just thought it would be more developed :)
[02:38] <Akiva-Mobile> mattwj2002: Yah, it would be nice, but geez
[02:39] <Akiva-Mobile> What a mountain to climb
[02:39] <mattwj2002> Akiva-Mobile: seriously could become way better than android
[02:39] <mattwj2002> I have great hopes for it
[02:39] <mattwj2002> *it seriously
[02:39] <Akiva-Mobile> mattwj2002: Oh me too, I am developing for it
[02:39] <mattwj2002> nice :D
[02:40] <Akiva-Mobile> java really churns my stomache
[02:40] <Akiva-Mobile> so it was so nice to see that they were doing a native approach.
[02:40] <tgm4883> mattwj2002, When I first heard about it, I thought too little, too late. But once I loaded up the developer preview, and started using my android tablet more I really saw the potential in a Ubuntu device
[02:40] <mattwj2002> I think it has great protential :)
[02:41] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: I havnt been able to test it yet; do not have a device, but I do have a touch laptop, and unity makes so much sense. I absolutely love it on this device. Is the interface as nice to use on  a phone as the demos make it out to be?
[02:42] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, I used it on my nexus 7, it was pretty nice. Easy to use. I'm hoping that it is a bit customizable in what you can have on each screen
[02:43] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: Does it have multiple desktops? how is it managed?
[02:43] <mattwj2002> I have a nexus 7
[02:43] <mattwj2002> :)
[02:43] <tgm4883> it's done similarly to android home screens
[02:43] <Akiva-Mobile> mattwj2002: Jealous :P
[02:43] <dank101> Name	Symbol	Last price	Change
[02:43] <dank101> Red Hat, Inc.	RHT	50.44	-0.22
[02:43] <dank101> Microsoft Corporation	MSFT	28.04	-0.1
[02:43] <mattwj2002> hehe
[02:43] <dank101> 0wnws
[02:43] <mattwj2002> I won't tell you about my phone then
[02:43] <mattwj2002> :P
[02:44] <dank101> 0wned
[02:44] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883, mattwj2002, What do you think of gnome-shells method for handling desktops? I kind of wondered if it would work well for unity.
[02:44] <Akiva-Mobile> Its the one feature of Gnome-shell that really appeals to me.
[02:44] <mattwj2002> gnome shell?
[02:44] <tgm4883> dank101, uh, Microsoft has 45 times the stock volume
[02:45] <mattwj2002> like terminal ?
[02:45] <tgm4883> and 23 times the market cap
[02:45] <dank101> oh
[02:45] <Akiva-Mobile> mattwj2002: its gnome 3.0
[02:45] <Akiva-Mobile> sec
[02:45] <dank101> FU
[02:45] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, I'm probably the wrong one to ask. I don't usually use multiple desktops
[02:45] <mattwj2002> language please dank101
[02:45] <tgm4883> !ohmy
[02:46] <dank101> ok
[02:46] <dank101> nyan
[02:46] <tgm4883> dank101, https://www.google.com/finance?chdnp=1&chdd=1&chds=1&chdv=1&chvs=maximized&chdeh=0&chfdeh=0&chdet=1363488383287&chddm=1173&chls=IntervalBasedLine&cmpto=NYSE:RHT&cmptdms=0&q=NASDAQ:MSFT&ntsp=0&ei=ey5FUfCAOcrWiAK3hQE
[02:47] <mattwj2002> I heard much about RedHat in years
[02:47] <Akiva-Mobile> mattwj2002: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SSGfS6K7pI0  -  basically it creates and deletes desktops as you create apps, and drag them to it.
[02:47] <mattwj2002> Fedora yes not so much with RedHat
[02:47] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, perhaps I would use it more then. I seem to recall me using that when gnome 3 first came out
[02:47] <dank101> Once upon a time
[02:48] <dank101> RedHat INC was richer then MS
[02:48] <tgm4883> mattwj2002, thats cause redhat is big on servers, not as much on desktops (where they use fedora for that mostly)
[02:48] <dank101> Rather
[02:48] <tgm4883> dank101, I don't think redhat was ever richer than microsoft
[02:49] <mattwj2002> that makes sense tgm4883
[02:49] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: Yah. I am all about the multi desktop environment, but it seems like a good idea to not have desktops present when they are empty.
[02:50] <dank101> november 2001
[02:50] <Akiva-Mobile> dank101: Oh, the stock market boom and bust
[02:50] <dank101> yeah
[02:50] <dank101> :(
[02:51] <Akiva-Mobile> Whatever, wallstreet gets so drunk sometimes.
[02:51] <dank101> Jan 2004
[02:51] <dank101> Look at dat
[02:51] <mattwj2002> wallstreet is just rich mans gambling
[02:51] <Akiva-Mobile> etoys was bigger than toys r us, and it was just a guy who owned an appartment, with no product, no manufacturing, no stores, etc etc
[02:51] <mattwj2002> etoys?
[02:52] <Akiva-Mobile> mattwj2002: exactly.
[02:52] <Akiva-Mobile> etoys?
[02:52] <tgm4883> dank101, but richer?
[02:52] <tgm4883> dank101, I suppose you should define richer
[02:52] <dank101> yeah :(
[02:52] <dank101> oh do i wish MS would stop plaguing linux
[02:53] <Akiva-Mobile> It has been bad, but more of an annoyance.
[02:53] <mattwj2002> well windows 8 I think was a flop
[02:53] <Akiva-Mobile> and to wit, it could have even been a motivator to developers.
[02:53] <mattwj2002> I know I am currently running it
[02:53] <mattwj2002> on a personal computer
[02:53] <mattwj2002> Vista 2.0 :P
[02:54] <Akiva-Mobile> my thoughts on windows 8; its probably fine, but we are all going to harp on big bad microsoft anyways.
[02:54]  * dank101 loads the eggs
[02:54] <tgm4883> dank101, I think this comparison says it all https://www.google.com/finance?chdnp=1&chdd=1&chds=1&chdv=1&chvs=maximized&chdeh=0&chfdeh=0&chdet=1363488842047&chddm=2715104&chls=IntervalBasedLine&cmpto=NYSE:RHT&cmptdms=0&q=NASDAQ:MSFT&ntsp=0&ei=BjBFUcCvBaGZiALMQQ
[02:54] <dank101> none use VIsta and are still alive
[02:55] <Akiva-Mobile> Microsoft is getting better, and xbox 360 has basically owned the game market
[02:55] <dank101> linux is about to send a queen out on that
[02:55] <dank101> one word
[02:55] <dank101> Ouya
[02:55] <tgm4883> other than the first initial batches of the 360, I think Microsoft has always made good hardware
[02:56] <Akiva-Mobile> they managed to create a pretty good community, and the xbox 360 has a full proof security system, which makes pirating very difficult.
[02:56] <Akiva-Mobile> dank101: ouya?
[02:56] <dank101> http://www.ouya.tv/
[02:56] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: like mice and keyboards? Yah, not bad.
[02:57] <mattwj2002> I heard about that dank101
[02:57] <tgm4883> Akiva-Mobile, mice, keyboards, OG xbox, wireless adapters/routers, xbox 360 after they worked out the production issues
[02:57] <Akiva-Mobile> frankly, I think ubuntu will make a better gaming platform :P
[02:57] <Akiva-Mobile> tgm4883: Their controllers seem to be bar none, the best
[02:57] <Akiva-Mobile> game controllers*
[02:57] <tgm4883> steam box > ouya
[02:58] <Akiva-Mobile> I will probably agree. Speaking of which, back to my game :P
[02:58] <mattwj2002> steam box?
[02:58]  * mattwj2002 googles it
[02:59] <dank101> box of steam
[02:59] <dank101> nothing more
[02:59] <dank101> Windows based
[02:59] <tgm4883> !stab wubi
[02:59] <tgm4883> dank101, the steam box is linux based
[02:59] <dank101> :O
[02:59] <mattwj2002> !fish dank101
[02:59] <mattwj2002> !trout dank101
[02:59] <dank101> MY LIFE IS COMPLETE
[03:00] <mattwj2002> it is?
[03:00] <dank101> yes
[03:00] <mattwj2002> why?
[03:00] <dank101> steam box
[03:02] <mattwj2002> I still want a wind bel :(
[03:02] <mattwj2002> *belt
[03:03] <mattwj2002> though I think it might be vaporware
[03:06] <linusasus6> is Sony xperia V is a supported device yet for ubuntu touch or not yet?
[03:09] <goku> goku
[03:10] <goku> Did they release a newer version of the Developer Preview?
[03:10] <Guest17484> Did they release a newer version of the Developer Preview?
[03:12] <tgm4883> Guest17484, there are daily builds
[03:13] <dank101> i have a dare for everyone here
[03:13] <dank101> Write a history on Ubuntu without using wikipedia
[03:14] <dank101> from birth to now
[03:14] <Namidairo> and do it without inflating mark shuttleworth's ego
[03:14] <dank101> naw
[03:14] <Namidairo> that's a challenge.
[03:14] <dank101> Ok
[03:14] <dank101> Who will do it
[03:15] <robru> dank101, here is the history of Ubuntu: "Linux could only be used by the nerdliest of nerds. Then, Ubuntu."
[03:18] <dank101> Wrong
[03:18] <dank101> you get a F in history
[03:19] <ali1234> so did someone here post on my G+ or is there more to that gnome than there seems?
[03:20] <linusasus6> well I guess not since no one answer my question
[03:21] <dank101> Do it
[03:21] <dank101> NOw
[03:22] <pjt> Do what?
[03:23] <dank101> Write a history on Ubuntu without using wikipedia
 from birth to now
[03:23] <dank101> and do it without inflating mark shuttleworth's ego
[03:24] <dank101> gogogogogogogogogo
[03:25] <ali1234> ubuntu was invented in 2005 when mark shuttleworth used the money he made selling SSL certificates to hire a bunch of debian developers to polish debian for the masses
[03:26] <dank101> google docs
[03:26] <ali1234> that's it
[03:26] <dank101> all of the history
[03:26] <dank101> 2005-2013
[03:27] <ali1234> that's all i got
[03:28] <dank101> get all of it
[03:29] <dank101> use other sites
[03:30] <ali1234> so basically you want only the stuff from wikipedia that has a citation?
[03:30] <dank101> no
[03:31] <dank101> no wikipedia
[03:31] <dank101> WikiPedia is too big of a info farm
[03:31] <ali1234> this sounds suspiciously like homework :P
[03:32] <lilstevie> ali1234, I have never heard of a school assigning homework about ubuntu
[03:32] <lilstevie> :p
[03:33] <Namidairo> ^
[03:34] <ali1234> well you never know these days
[03:34] <ali1234> maybe it was like a "write a history on your favourite piece of software" type assignment
[03:34] <lilstevie> lol
[03:34] <lilstevie> schools have a major aversion to linux
[03:34] <dank101> THIS IS LINUX SCHOOL
[03:34] <dank101> DO YOUR HOMEWORK
[03:35] <dank101> OR ELSE YOU GET A F
[03:35] <ali1234> yeah but when you're writing a report like this it's not the subject that is important... it's about learning to write essays
[03:35] <dank101> the facts are the only important part
[03:35] <dank101> you can ditch spelling and grammat
[03:35] <Namidairo> except for mine where the entire IT school has flapped up Fedora installs
[03:36] <Namidairo> that for some reason or another decide to have synchronised hangs for about 10 seconds every 5 minutes
[03:36] <dank101> or mine where some kid did dd /dev/sd* on ubuntu
[03:37] <Namidairo> dd if=/dev/sd* of=/dev/zero
[03:37] <Namidairo> or something like that
[03:37] <dank101> yeah
[03:37] <lilstevie> that wouldn't do much
[03:37] <dank101> i had to pay for all the computers
[03:38] <dank101> and thats why you must block Sudo
[03:38] <lilstevie> writing all the content from sd* to /dev/zero seems like a pointless endeavor
[03:38] <dank101> and then rm -rf /'d them
[03:39] <dank101> then rewrote the harddrive with /dev/urandom
[03:40] <dank101> it was dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/sda bs=1Mdd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/sda bs=1M
[03:41] <dank101> ▲
[03:41] <dank101> ▲ ▲
[03:44] <Namidairo> indeed it does
[03:44] <Namidairo> but I didnt want someone here copy pasting
[03:47] <dank101> do your linux homework
[04:14] <dank101> http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2191235
[04:42] <dank101> anyone done with homework?
[05:52] <Akiva-Mobile> looking over the gui guidelines on http://design.ubuntu.com/apps/building-blocks/text-field, is there a template app that features an example of each? I am not looking to reinvent any sort of wheel, so all I desire is a shortcut for getting my gui up and running.
[07:27] <viveak> hi, I want to flash Ubuntu touch through windows PC
[07:29] <viveak> are there instructions to flash ubuntu touch from windows PC?
[07:29] <kms_> ssory, i need use only c++ in qt editor? i can't use golang?
[08:59] <traxmac> how do you get a test application to run on the device
[08:59] <traxmac> do I need to add it somewhere
[09:11] <mut3d> i guys how do we enable wireless
[09:25] <IReboot> traxmac: Check in the release notes for running an app on a device.
[09:26] <IReboot> traxmac: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/ReleaseNotes
[09:44] <traxmac> Yep found it, thanks
 does ubuntu-desktop for arm run on the nexus-10 [2]ubuntu-touch.. once there is a terminal, can one run compiler tools etc on arm
[11:17] <gregor_> hello there!  Are there plans for integrating CalDav sync into the default calendar app/ is it in progess? (Only U1 is mentioned)
[11:56] <alo21> hi all.. where are hosted all phone programs (not core only)?
[12:22] <adam_b> alo21: I started a list here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Apps
[12:23] <alo21> adam_b, oh... thanks
[12:36] <doomlord> does the terminal app work yet
[12:56] <eschatus> doomlord, no, not yet
[13:58] <zAo^> Lol, how do you turn your device off? :D
[14:00] <sycho12321> hi I was wondering if it would be worth it to install on a nexus 7
[14:00] <Deihmos> I was thinking about installing it but everyone seems to use for a minute then return to android
[14:01] <sycho12321> ya i know what mean
[14:03] <sycho12321> what apps can you get on it
[14:07] <zAo^> sycho12321: I have it on my n7, but its pretty much useless
[14:08] <sycho12321> oh ok thanks!
[14:31] <hopkinskong> anyone are here?
[14:32] <hopkinskong> i just compiled CM10.1 by following https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Porting
[14:32] <hopkinskong> what next?
[14:33] <hopkinskong> I cannot find " /usr/bin/ubuntu-session "
[14:33] <hopkinskong> i just got the zip file.
[14:33] <hopkinskong> and i can't find the "init" file.
[14:33] <hopkinskong> The zip i got is not the rootfs?
[14:34] <asaun> hello!
[14:34] <hopkinskong> popey, i nned your help.
[14:34] <hopkinskong> need*
[14:35] <RamchandraApte> po
[14:35] <RamchandraApte> oops
[14:41] <asaun> forgive me if i'm asking a frequently answered question, but is there still an intention to release a stable version of Ubuntu Core (i.e. Ubuntu desktop, not with the Touch UI) 13.04 for the Nexus 7?
[14:41] <asaun> thanks
[14:42] <hopkinskong> anyone could tell me what should i do for the next?
[14:43] <hopkinskong> ogra_?
[14:49] <spanner3003> Hi all
[14:49] <spanner3003> Ubuntu touch is looking good
[14:50] <spanner3003> I have it running on my nexus 7 with multirom
[14:54] <hopkinskong> Should i download the preinstalled-image, and copy over my builded cm10.1 into it?
[14:54] <hopkinskong> built*
[15:25] <hopkinskong> anybody could help?
[15:45] <LordShadowWing> +OK A2p0w1Wk2wj1
[15:46] <LordShadowWing> +OK Um9.y1KrNo./6G8Nb1qfwWf.
[15:48] <LordShadowWing> +OK BFIQe/vUYfP/ptda9.Lqa9z/8RZ2w/Hy.mH.CNNOp1tZJVX.MiYM..Fzp9r0
[15:48] <padme1> no fish please
[15:48] <padme1> go do your fishing elsewhere
[15:49] <LordShadowWing> I was trying to figure out what it is
[15:54] <LordShadowWing> Any new developments with Ubuntu touch
[15:55] <padme1> don't expect anything explosive for the next few months
[15:55] <LordShadowWing> I was looking for at most basic gsm data
[15:57] <LordShadowWing> gonna flash it anyway
[15:58] <LordShadowWing> Stupid windows updates.
[16:01] <padme1> check the commits in the projecto
[16:01] <padme1> it's the best way to know
[16:03] <LordShadowWing>  Link to comments page?
[16:06] <padme1> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-touch-preview
[16:07] <LordShadowWing>  thanks
[16:23] <LordShadowWing> flashing to my gnex, going to attempt use as daily driver, for extensive testing
[16:26] <marcthenarc> hellooooo everyone!
[16:27] <LordShadowWing> Hello
[16:28] <marcthenarc> I have question.  I intalled ubuntu-core on my tablet.  Now I want to install Touch.  But the recipe for adb listing doesn't work.  How can I enable USB debugging in Ubuntu core so that the desktop might see it ?
[16:28] <LordShadowWing> I have no idea
[16:29] <marcthenarc> Awww too bad.  I don't want to reinstall android just to wipe it out again. :(
[16:30] <LordShadowWing> u r running ubuntu right?
[16:30] <LordShadowWing> in your pc
[16:30] <marcthenarc> yes.
[16:30] <LordShadowWing> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Install
[16:30] <marcthenarc> And full functionnal but useless Ubuntu core on my tablet :)
[16:30] <LordShadowWing> did you follow those instructions?
[16:32] <marcthenarc> Yes.  But as I said.  I don't have Android anymore on my tablet, just an install of Ubuntu-core that was release 2 weeks ago.
[16:32] <LordShadowWing> interesting
[16:33] <marcthenarc> isn't it ? :)
[16:33] <LordShadowWing> im going to test its use as a daily driver
[16:38] <marcthenarc> hello.  I might disconnected during this process the tablet and desktop are fighting for my connection :-/
[16:44] <marcthenarc> Sooo ... no one has an idea ?
[16:49] <LordShadowWing> is it possible to SMB into ubuntu-touch
[17:06] <ogra_> hopkinskong, boot into recovety, make sure /data is mounted and has enough free space and flash the pahblet*.zip
[17:46] <Nickname172> Hey, I understand that the Ubuntu tablet operating preview system is currently only available for Nexus devices and that the Toshiba Thrive AT100 model isn't supported.
[17:46] <Nickname172> Except what I am not quite understanding is this text from the supported device list:
[17:46] <Nickname172> The table below lists the supported devices and their corresponding factory images, should you want to switch back to Android.
[17:47] <Nickname172> So, do they mean only those devices can switch back to Android, though any can get Ubuntu?
[17:47] <Nickname172> Help would be greatly appreciated.
[17:47] <Nickname172> Source: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Install#Supported_devices_and_codenames
[17:50] <Nickname172> ? Any support currently?
[17:52] <Nickname172> I can tell lots of help is coming our way here :/
[17:52] <JanC> Nickname172: please be patient
[17:52] <Nickname172> At least I'm aware a supporter is here.
[17:52] <JanC> it's Sunday evening for most people  ;)
[17:52] <Nickname172> Thanks.
[17:53] <Nickname172> It is here for me also.
[17:53] <JanC> and AFAIK, only the Nexus devices listed are supported officially, but there are some unofficial ports available too
[17:55] <Nickname172> So even though my device isn't listed officially if I tried it may work but it isn't guaranteed to work properly ?
[17:55] <JanC> also, I'm pretty sure that if you can install Ubuntu, you can also install Android again
[17:55] <JanC> *if* you have an Android image
[17:56] <Nickname172> I don't have the Android image for ICS, but thanks for the support anyways.
[17:57] <JanC> Nickname172: I'm sure there are others who can give better and/or more detailed advice though
[17:57] <JanC> eh
[18:18] <DarkSim> Hello! I could need some help :)
[18:19] <DarkSim> I'm trying to install Ubuntu Touch on my HTC One X endeavoru, but I'm having a hard time understanding the guide
[18:41] <IReboot> I have contributed to MythTV for a while. I have a few of those contributions distributed through launchpad but have their documentation on the MythTV wiki. Is wiki.ubuntu.com appropriate to supply the same level documentation as in this example if I create a Touch app? See: http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/MythTV-indicator
[19:20] <The_Matrix>  Hello, I have a question regarding how should I learn QML. I have no programing background, except html and css. Should I learn Javascript, or is there a resource online to learn QML syntax. I have already gone to http://www.developer.ubuntu.com and followed the links there, but I did not find them helpful. Thanks in advance.
[19:23] <eschatus> Knowing javascript is absolutely helpful - it is very similar...
[19:24] <eschatus> There must be some tutorials somewhere, but I've never looked for them so I can't help you with that. Google? ;)
[19:24] <The_Matrix> Thank you for your response
[19:24] <The_Matrix> I have been looking on google.
[19:25] <The_Matrix> I did not have luck finding any tutorials for qml, but if Javascript works, then I'm good.
[19:25] <The_Matrix> as there are tutorials for that.
[19:25] <eschatus> np :) I've just started with QML myself, but from the examples I've seen it's almost the same as javascript, so that will get you far. :)
[19:27] <The_Matrix> I guess that if I master javascript, then I will able to write apps for Ubuntu Touch.
[19:27] <The_Matrix> I have played with the sdk.
[19:28] <The_Matrix> and followed the currency converter instructions
[19:28] <The_Matrix> Did you have previous knowledge of javascript?
[19:28] <eschatus> Yes, 10+ years... :)
[19:28] <The_Matrix> Well, I guess that is where I will start.
[19:29] <The_Matrix> Thank you for your help
[19:29] <eschatus> np :) Good luck :)
[19:29] <The_Matrix> Thank you and you as well :)
[19:43] <agcalamitaITA> Evening guys. Can anyone help me in running the core apps? I've installed the terminal app using SSH (apt-get install) and I can run it via SSH however this seems to be open in the 'background' as when opening other apps it appears for a while, but disappears. Thanks
[19:45] <ali1234> that happens to me whenever i run anything from ssh
[19:45] <agcalamitaITA> Do you use QT Creator to run them then?
[19:45] <ali1234> no, because i couldn't get that to work at all
[19:46] <agcalamitaITA> Haha! Did you get it to work at all... :)
[20:03] <debb1046> import QtMultimedia 5.0
[20:04] <debb1046> Why dies it say module not found?
[20:21] <vthompson> @debb1046, try to install libqt5declarative5-qtmultimedia-plugin
[20:22] <frankencode> agcalamitaITA: try to start another app (like phone-app) before you start your app from ssh
[20:22] <frankencode> or try to swipe in from the right
[20:23] <debb1046>  libqt5declarative5-qtmultimedia-plugin is already installed
[20:24] <agcalamitaITA> frankencode, thanks -- I'll give it another go. I've tested the WhosThere app from SSH and that launches and runs ok
[20:25] <vthompson> Can you start the app from the command line? Maybe it's a QtCreator issue on your end.
[20:26] <vthompson> I'm using QtMultimedia in my development as well, and haven't had any issues yet
[20:27] <debb1046> it has that red swiggly underline in QtCreator editor and when I hover it says module cannot be found, then something about adding import paths to project file
[20:27] <dank101> is it just me or is  XDA slow today
[20:28] <vthompson> What does your .qmlproject file say for importpaths?
[20:30] <debb1046> nothing set, used the QtQuick 2 application template
[20:31] <vthompson> I bet your app would run from the command line, but you could add this to your project file assuming you're 64 bit:     importPaths: [ "." ,"/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/qt5/qml" ]
[20:32] <debb1046> OK, thanks, I'll try that later. Trying to port a game that I wrote for the N9 in Qt 4.7 and half of the code seems to be obsolete and not supported in Qt 5
[20:32] <agcalamitaITA> debb1046, random question as I'm no programmer, but what languages does QT 5 support?
[20:33] <vthompson> Cool, most of your QtMobility stuff probably won't work
[20:34] <debb1046> yeah, had QTMultimediaKit and labs.particles in there. Even ParallelAnimation class is missing functions that were there previously
[20:35] <agcalamitaITA> frankencode, thanks! launching another app then running the command over SSH worked!
[20:35] <frankencode> great
[20:35] <debb1046> agcalamitaITA: C++, javascript and QML (the latter being unique to Qt)
[20:35] <agcalamitaITA> Not that the core apps are much use at the moment :)
[20:36] <agcalamitaITA> debb1046, Thanks! The only programming I've done is C# (and windows batch files -- if that's classed) Might start looking into C++ and QML
[20:37] <debb1046> QML rocks (for small projects)
[20:37] <debb1046> No C++ required for simple things
[20:38] <frankencode> i learned most about qt by using pyqt back in the qt3 days
[20:39] <agcalamitaITA> Might have a look into QML then. I'm still involved in loads of Windows stuff because of work so don't get much time to play with Linux
[20:39] <debb1046> I once wrote a host for LADSPA audio plugins in Qt, and a Maps app for the Zaurus
[20:39] <debb1046> QML works for Wondows, too, I believe
[20:41] <debb1046> gotta go
[23:19] <hopkinskong> ogra_, " pahblet*.zip" from the site? Daily built images?
[23:19] <hopkinskong> So what is the use of my CM10.1 which i've just built?
[23:19] <dank101> flash
[23:19] <dank101> see if it works
[23:19] <dank101> and the phablet
[23:20] <hopkinskong> btw, i got NO "pahblet-*.zip"
[23:20] <RobbyF> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-touch-preview/
[23:20] <hopkinskong> i got "manhattan-quantal-armhf-tar-20130317-1.tar.gz", and "cm-10.1-20130317-UNOFFICIAL-leo.zip"
[23:22] <dank101> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-touch-preview/daily-preinstalled/current/quantal-preinstalled-phablet-armhf.zip and your zip
[23:58] <jonnie_> hi
[23:59] <jonnie_> im tryinh to build ubuntu for ray got most done but when i try to build i get build/core/config.mk:346: *** Error: could not find jdk tools.jar, please install JDK6, which you can download from java.sun.com. Stop.
[23:59] <jonnie_> anyone help ive tryed loads of things