/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/03/22/#ubuntustudio-devel.txt

smartboyhwHello zequence 11:08
smartboyhwmicahg, ping11:09
zequencesmartboyhw: Hi. Did you do your tests yet?11:11
smartboyhwzequence, for what?11:11
smartboyhwUpgrades?11:11
smartboyhwYou know, I have been busy with tests in the last few days (1 week I think)11:12
zequencesmartboyhw: No, I meant school11:12
smartboyhwAnd I will be away for 4 days till Tuesday I think)11:12
smartboyhw>>>>>>>11:12
smartboyhwzequence, so NO:P11:12
zequenceWell, good luck with them11:12
smartboyhwzequence, :)11:13
smartboyhwand here's scott-work !!!! XD11:13
scott-workhi smartboyhw 11:29
* scott-work has been dealing with allergies this week11:29
smartboyhwscott-work, what allergies?11:29
* smartboyhw has been dealing with dozens of tests11:30
scott-worksmartboyhw: texas is seeing record high pollen counts the past week, my sinuses are working overtime11:30
smartboyhwUh11:31
scott-worki've been getting sinus pressure headaches, my teeth even hurt from the pressure and my ears are stuffed up and popping11:31
* smartboyhw thinks that Hong Kong has high air pollution always11:31
zequencesmartboyhw: pollen, not pollution :)11:32
smartboyhwzequence, how are the test results for upgrade tests?11:32
smartboyhwzequence, that proves that every place has problems with air. scott-work got pollens, I got particles from factories in China11:32
zequencesmartboyhw: I haven't started doing any yet. I will need a special machine for it11:33
zequenceHaven't seen anyone doing any tests yet, but there's no particular hurry11:33
scott-workzequence: i saw your email (i'm working through a backlog of email now) and i should respond today11:33
smartboyhwscott-work, and condemn me:)11:33
scott-worksmartboyhw: why would i condemn you?11:36
smartboyhwscott-work, look at one of the e-mails sent yesterday and you would understand.....11:36
smartboyhwAnd you will probably kill me:(11:36
scott-workheheh, i see what you mean ;)11:37
scott-workno i think that is a fair concern, i actually have been discussing this with zequence for a bit11:37
smartboyhwscott-work, ;)11:38
scott-worki have realized that i am being less and less involved, and this was one of my biggest criticisms of the previous leads and something i am sensitive towards11:39
scott-worki've been getting into some programming at work which is taking more time from my schedule11:39
scott-workand it looks like i should be starting a program for a bachelors degree for IT with software emphasis which will take even more time11:40
smartboyhwscott-work, good. I do want to get to MIT  or Harvald or Cal Tech for university :P11:41
smartboyhwzequence, when was our @ubuntustudio.org RT request filed?11:51
zequencesmartboyhw: A long time ago. We haven't got any answer on that yet11:53
zequenceAlso, no answer on updating our website11:53
smartboyhwHmm....11:54
zequenceI think it was in December I made those requests11:54
smartboyhwMaybe they were too busy with the Forums upgrade11:54
zequenceUsually it doesn't take this long11:54
* smartboyhw agrees11:55
smartboyhwWell we can't go and chase the Canonical IS can we?11:56
zequenceWho could we poke on IRC about this?12:02
smartboyhwzequence, can we poke at #canonical-sysadmin ?12:02
zequencedid that, so let's see if someone can enlighten us on this12:13
zequenceSo, we'll just have to wait for a little while longer12:26
ttoinescott-work, what's up ?13:57
scott-workhi ttoine, just doing some lisp programming right now13:58
ttoinewow13:58
ttoineyou will enjoy to know that Stephane LETZ is a good lisp programmer too ;-)13:58
ttoineit is only in french at the moment13:58
ttoinescott-work, http://lite.framapad.org/p/5n3kYagDQA13:59
scott-workttoine: i'm a hacker, i can make stuff happen, but it isn't pretty or good ;)14:01
ttoinescott-work, and I own a licence for Ubuntu Studio stuff, it is done14:02
scott-workttoine: WOW!  that is amazing and exciting news14:02
ttoineso now, I have to find a worldwide delivery website for creating t-shirt, caps, mugs, ...14:02
scott-worknow we just need to develop some ideas for shirts, etc14:02
ttoinescott-work, sure14:03
ttoinebut we can start with something simple14:03
scott-work"get your music on" :P14:04
ttoinescott-work, http://society6.com/14:04
ttoineyou provide the artwork, they do the job14:04
ttoinefrom iphone c ases to posters14:05
len-1304Probably talk to the xubuntu people they are on round two of ordering stickers/t-shirts14:05
len-1304They know the pitfalls14:05
ttoinelen-1304, I don't want us to order something14:06
ttoinewho pay ???14:06
ttoinelook at the society6 website14:06
len-1304Yes but they know which ones do a bad job :)14:06
ttoinelen-1304, I actually now a french artist using this site14:07
ttoineand it is good quality14:07
len-1304They have a web page somewhere that you can take their logos and get your own stuff printed. I think they have recomendations.14:07
ttoinethe only bad thing: they don't do mugs at the moment14:07
len-1304Ah, that is good then.14:07
smartboyhwttoine, you do know how to sell things:)14:08
len-1304Any of the larger malls have kiosks that make mugs from artwork.14:08
len-1304(At least in north america)14:08
len-1304Not in this small city though.14:09
zequenceIf we were doing this only to get each of us a Ubuntu Studio cup, I'd be all for it. Would be pretty awesome drinking coffee from it14:11
len-1304A small COF to cover the MS flag would be nice...14:12
zequenceYeah, stickers are really great to have14:12
zequenceI got a few from the last UDS. Got this old laptop, that is now Ubuntu only14:13
smartboyhwzequence, LOL:)14:14
zequencefor the flag, but also for branding14:14
zequencehttp://shop.canonical.com/product_info.php?products_id=71814:15
len-1304I like the idea of a mixed sheet14:16
zequenceMaybe we could just use the same format that Ubuntu uses14:17
zequenceWe seriously need an art team for this stuff14:18
len-1304That was my first thought14:18
smartboyhwAnd we seriously need art contributors14:18
smartboyhwSadly my art is basically crap14:18
zequenceEven if we know what material to use, it takes a bit of effort to achieve the right ratios, and quality14:21
zequenceI'd rather we had a unified style for logos and icons first, that we'd then use on websites, social sites, our ISO and these stickers14:22
zequenceMaybe something to be planned for 14.04?14:22
zequenceGet at least one guy to work on this14:23
zequenceKubuntu has their stuff in that store, btw14:24
zequenceWonder if they'd sponsor me with some cycling clothes. I will be participating in some events during summer http://shop.canonical.com/product_info.php?products_id=78314:26
ttoinesmartboyhw, I have a master in marketing...14:26
ttoinezequence, society6 is not the best place for our stuff, since it for artists14:27
ttoinebut I am sure we can find a place like that for Ubuntu Studio14:28
zequencettoine: I think the Canonical store would be a good start14:29
ttoinezequence, perhaps14:29
zequenceAnd our website14:29
ttoineI would say that have a link in our website to a place like society 6 would be grear14:30
ttoinegreat14:30
ttoineI don't have the time to manage orders, expeditions, etc. it costs a lot of time14:30
ttoineand I would prefer to find a place where they could do a per order production14:31
zequenceSo, Canonical store?14:31
ttoineit why places like society6 are very interessant14:31
zequenceI don't know how the Canonical store works, but I would think it's managed by Canonical14:31
ttoinezequence, not possible... who will pay the 1000 stickers order ?14:31
ttoineIf I get a licence for that, it may be because they are not interested to do that for ur14:32
ttoineus14:32
zequenceHas anyone asked them?14:32
zequenceWhat are the options in getting funds?14:32
zequenceI don't know what the legal side of this is at all14:33
zequenceWe are very small, so probably to get anything started, we'll either need coorporate sponsoship or we pay ourselves14:34
zequenceThat's my guess anyway14:34
len-1304That is what xubuntu did14:34
zequencepayed themselves?14:34
len-1304(paid themselves)14:34
zequencepaid*14:35
* len-1304 has been watching their channel14:35
len-1304SOme of the discussion will be in the irc logs14:36
smartboyhwttoine, XD14:36
smartboyhwShould I ask some Kubuntu guys to come here?:P14:36
ttoinezequence, I asked them in the past. ubuntu store is for ubuntu14:36
zequencettoine: And Kubuntu, apparently14:36
ttoinezequence, and with the licence, I don't have the right to make benefits14:37
zequencettoine: What does the license really mean?14:37
ttoinezequence, it will disapear soon, I guess, for Kubuntu is not anymore an official distro, and is now founded by a german rich guy14:37
ttoinezequence, it means that we have the right to sell branded goods to enthusiast, without benefitsd14:38
ttoinejust to serve the communication of our community14:38
smartboyhwttoine, true14:38
zequencettoine: What does benefits mean?14:38
smartboyhwzequence, nah Canonical *dumped* Kubuntu (that's how the Kubuntu guys think now)14:39
ttoinesmartboyhw, ;-)14:39
ttoineI can't run a business with my licence14:39
smartboyhwttoine, oh14:39
ttoineit non profit only14:39
ttoineit is14:39
zequencettoine: Ok, so what it means you can start a non-profit organization that sells items with the Ubuntu Studio brand14:40
len-1304That is best anyway.14:40
zequenceWhere the non-profit organization is what holds the funds, etc14:40
zequencettoine: Or, the license is to you, specifically?14:41
ttoinezequence, as Ubuntu Studio is not a company nor a non profit organisation, and as a member of Ubuntu Studio devel and team14:45
ttoineyes, I had to put my name on it14:45
len-1304Makes sense14:45
ttoinebut it can be changed if in time we create a kind of foudnation14:45
ttoineor ong14:45
zequenceMaybe that's a good idea to do?14:45
ttoinezequence, sure14:46
ttoineI can do that in France14:46
zequenceSounds good to me14:46
ttoinewe call that a non profit association14:46
len-1304ong , at least here requires a minimum number of people and meetings. I am not sure they can be virtual meetings either.14:47
zequencebah, old rules :P14:47
zequenceYeah, let's start buying air planes tickets, so we can meet face to face every so often :)14:48
len-1304They are there to keep it from being abused14:48
zequenceI guess that depends on what privileges the organization gets14:48
len-1304I think the books get looked at every year by the tax dep as well.14:48
zequenceYeah14:48
len-1304I would suggest that because our idea is not to make money, it only needs to be done in one country14:49
len-1304It is only there for holding artwork really.14:50
zequenceIf we can share responsibilities as far as the organization goes, that would be good. But, if ttoine is the only person to handle this, I think it will also be up to him to decide14:50
len-1304Yup.14:50
zequenceAlso, I don't speak French, and if I have to work with French text, even with Google translate, that might be a bit difficult14:55
smartboyhwEspecially when it's sort of legal matters:)14:57
smartboyhwzequence, do we want ardour3 to be synced into the Ubuntu repos15:35
smartboyhw?15:35
ttoinehop, here again15:35
smartboyhwHey ttoine 15:35
ttoinesorry, I had am in a meeting, I had to restart my laptop with one screen only15:35
smartboyhwOh15:35
smartboyhwYou did see what we are talking about right?15:36
ttoinethe amd driver is not friendly with suspend wake up and screens change15:36
ttoineno15:36
ttoinesorry15:36
smartboyhwttoine, I will just post the sentences after you last speak before you left15:37
smartboyhwttoine, http://paste.ubuntu.com/5637281/15:37
ttoinethanks, smartboyhw 15:37
smartboyhwI think you wouldn't have missed it15:37
ttoineok15:39
ttoineso actually, it may just be french text for what we call statuses15:39
ttoinebasic accounting can be done on a shared google doc tab15:39
ttoineand of course, we can speak french and members of the ong board can be global15:40
ttoineso if you want me to create a kind of french ong so I can manage that, it is ok15:40
ttoinehowever15:40
ttoinethink that I won't have time and money to pre order stuff we want to sell. and global delivery is a true job15:41
ttoineso please have in mind that we have to find an operator for that15:42
ttoinesome website like society6, where we provide the artwork and they produce, sell and deliver15:42
ttoineotherwise it will be impossible to handle that15:42
smartboyhwFor such complicated matters, I'm out of this money business:P15:42
ttoineI know well the people of framasoft.org and ubuntu-fr.org15:43
ttoinethey have a website to sell stuff, look for http://enventelibre.org/15:43
ttoinethey don't make a lot of turnaround. more, they spend so much time with that, they are considering to close it and find another solutioon15:44
ttoineand only deliver in france15:44
ttoinesmartboyhw, you are not out ;-)15:44
ttoinewe have a licence to sell branded stuff without profit15:44
zequencesmartboyhw: If you want to sync Ardour3, I don't think anyone will object :)15:45
ttoinezequence, of course15:45
len-1304smartboyhw, of course we want A# packaged. The real question is do we want to keep an a2 package around?15:45
len-1304a315:45
zequencelen-1304: Debian Multimedia Team is going to do that15:45
zequenceHave both15:45
ttoinezequence, smartboyhw, it will take me some time to organise that and find a webservice. but we can already start the artwork design15:46
zequenceSince apparently, A3 can't open A2 projects15:46
ttoineand it doesn't have to be complicated15:46
zequencettoine: The important thing about artwork IMO is that we have a unified style15:46
ttoinezequence, no, A2 can't open A315:46
len-1304Is ardour going to keep updating a2 for a while?15:46
zequenceAnd that means, the artwork needs to be done first15:46
zequencettoine: Someone said A3 can't open A2 projects15:47
len-1304I thought A3 could import A2 projects.15:47
ttoineif you import an A2 session in A3, A3 will create a session fdor A215:47
ttoinean archive15:47
len-1304Can't open15:47
ttoinezequence, look at the official release post on their blog15:47
ttoinebut the modification done in A3 will not be saved back for the A2. it is only an archive.15:48
zequenceDebian has just prepared an intial working package15:49
len-1304I think as long as A3 can save an A2 project as A3 that would be fine for most people15:49
zequenceSomeone would need to make sure it's syncable even, before anything15:49
len-1304those who are in the middle of an A2 project, may wish to be able to finish there though.15:50
ttoinelen-1304, this is not the case15:51
ttoineA3 can not save in A215:51
ttoineit can import it, and doing so, it just create an archive of the A2. that's all15:51
ttoineI get that from the ardour website15:51
zequencehttp://lists.alioth.debian.org/pipermail/pkg-multimedia-maintainers/2013-March/031748.html15:52
zequenceI guess that was wrong then15:52
zequencehttp://lists.alioth.debian.org/pipermail/pkg-multimedia-maintainers/2013-March/031762.html15:52
zequenceThis late in the game, syncing A3 might not be the best idea, but I'm not going to stop anyone from trying15:53
len-1304A3 can not import an A2 project and save it as A3? Then why have it import at all?15:53
len-1304zequence, I don't expect A3 in 13.0415:54
ttoinelen-1304, follow what i am saying15:55
len-1304And it sounds like the normal replace ver2 with ver3 method is not a "good idea" anyway.15:55
len-1304ttoine, Ya I tried, but it doesn't make sense to me.15:56
ttoineyou can import an A2 in A3. doing so, A3 will save the A2 version of the session. Once you started to work with A3, it will not possible to work on it with A2. the only thing you can have in A2 is the save15:56
zequencelen-1304: Well, it won't appear in 13.04 automatically, since Debian import freeze was a long time ago15:57
len-1304ttoine, so the project in A2 would become an A3 project.15:57
ttoinelen-1304, sure. I think that there is an issue with pan of tracks, but i am not sure where I read that15:57
ttoineI am pretty sure too that Harrison will soon release an A3 based Mixbus version15:59
smartboyhwzequence, len-1304 as it turns out I can't sync yet it stil hasn't been uploaded to Debian (prepared already)16:00
len-1304Like everything, buy a new hard drive for the new version. Then I will have 11.04, 12.04 and 14.0416:02
len-1304smartboyhw, I think we need to keep A2 alive16:02
len-1304ttoine, yes there is work on making a harrison mixbus316:03
smartboyhwlen-1304, hmm i think ardour3 will be a seperate package from ardour16:03
smartboyhwI don't know16:03
len-1304So not sync, but package then16:03
len-1304sync means replace with16:04
smartboyhwlen-1304, ?16:04
zequencesync means import from Debian16:04
smartboyhwWell we can sync new packages16:04
zequencesync our with Debian16:04
smartboyhwFrom Debian16:04
len-1304sync means get the latest version16:04
zequencesync means syncing with Debian16:04
* smartboyhw wonders if we have to start a debate on "How to define 'sync'"16:04
len-1304If they are named differently we should be ok then16:04
* len-1304 was never very good with debate16:05
ttoinelen-1304, I know, I asked them ;-)16:06
ttoinesmartboyhw, it is possible to install both ardour 2 and 3 on the same computer16:06
smartboyhwlen-1304, I am good at debate:)16:08
smartboyhwttoine, yep16:08
len-1304Yes, I have had as many as three versions of Ardour at once.16:11
len-1304As long as they keep their binaries in separate directories or at least uniquely named. I think the config has to be in different directories too.16:12
ttoinelen-1304, it is scheduled this way in the release note16:12
len-1304The downloads from ardour.org each use a separate directory under /opt16:13
ttoineneed to restart, again a problem with amd driver when pluging my second screen16:13
zequenceIt all depends on the packaging, really16:13
zequenceWell, configs may need to be hardcoded16:13
zequence..for the application, as it is expecting to find them in certain places or with certain names16:14
len-1304Yup16:14
len-1304TCL keeps separate directories in /usr/lib last I looked. so it would be the same kind of thing.16:15
zequenceJust spent half a day trying to get back a guitar sound I got a few days ago16:15
len-1304Always take notes...16:15
zequenceWell, not the guitar sound itself, but mic placement16:15
* len-1304 still hasn't learned this yet16:15
zequenceWhen I started recording a few days ago, I didn't have a good mic stand, so I just put the mic somewhere close to the speaker. Not centered at all. A bit above, pointing towards the middle. It's a condenser mic16:17
zequenceThen, when I was going to do it properly, with better placement, it just sounded crap16:17
ttoinehop16:17
zequenceNow I'm back where I started. Sounds good now, but I want to isolate the are a bit. Getting my picking sound into the mic16:18
zequenceDon't want to sit in another room16:18
zequenceThink I learned something new about mic placement with condensers today16:19
zequenceIt just sounds so different - which is not what I'm used to16:19
zequencea bit of phase distortion too, makes wonders to this particular sound16:20
=== jta is now known as jta_afk
Len-nbthe software updater seems more flaky these days... The icon shows in systray, I click on show updates sometimes it never shows up sometimes just the window decoration.16:58
Len-nbXubuntu has about 250 updates since yesterday16:59
ttoinelen-1304, I had problem like that in unity17:06
ttoineit is fixed, since17:06
len-1304I think the software updater in general needs to provide more user feed back. Even when it works, I click on it and it takes much longer than usual before anything happens. Often there is not even some disk activity.17:07
len-1304I would guess it is checking network connections for all ppas apt is aware of.17:08
len-1304I have been using apt-get a lot more these days.17:09
ttoinegoog week-end to all17:25
=== jta_afk is now known as JuxTApose
=== JuxTApose is now known as JTa
len-1304Speaking of sync of packages. mudita24 version 1.1.0 fixes the issues zequence and I found earlier.21:14
len-1304The one we ship says 1.0.4 in the about and synaptic says latest installed is 1.0.3 (mudita still)21:18
len-1304Ok, no syncrequest because debian does not yet have mudita24 anyway.21:25
len-1304zequence, how do we go about requesting an update to a new package in debian?21:26
len-1304Version 1.1.0 cam out a month ago BTW21:27
len-1304Oops longer, Feb 2.21:27
zequencelen-1304: Because of the Debian freeze, which has been going on for many months now (they won't release until all serious bugs have been fixed, and it will probably take a couple of more months), may be that packages aren't being updated as frequently22:13
zequencelen-1304: Also, there may be low activity on some packages, depending on who maintains it, etc22:13
len-1304Well we won't need it before 13.04 anyway.22:13
len-1304But it should be in 14.0422:14
len-1304They look like they have about 4 sets of repos. Is there one not frozen?22:15
zequenceI'm not 100% sure about how those work, but stable is of course stable, which is squeeze22:17
zequencetesting is the development release22:17
zequenceWhich is wheezy22:17
len-1304Then there is unstable and testing22:17
zequencesid is unstable22:17
len-1304mudita24 is only in sid and wheezy, same version.22:18
zequenceThen there's also experimental, but you can only install packages from there, if you expressively use an option to do that with apt-get22:18
len-1304maybe that was the other one.22:19
zequenceexperimental is not a release, while the others are22:19
zequencesid will never change. It will always be called sid22:19
len-1304Ok, that makes sense22:19
zequencetesting is the next release, and stable is the current release22:20
=== jta is now known as jta_afk
len-1304I am still not sure what that means so far as getting the newer version of mudita24 or other SW available for our use once 13.04 is out, zequence .22:33
len-1304Ie, does that mean things should start moving soon enough not top be a problem?22:34
zequencelen-1304: Don't know.22:51
len-1304OK22:51
len-1304zequence, new email about ... email addresses. His solution sounds just fine to me.23:02
len-1304In fact I think that looks to me what was meant23:04
zequencelen-1304: Cool. Let's see..23:42
zequenceWell, it'll mean we need to poke them each time we want to change an adress, but I think that few of us will actually have a use of it anyway23:48

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