[00:29] <celesteh> I seem to be having some odd kind of networking issue.  I can do IRC and some chat protocols and I can traceroute to, say, yahoo.com with no trouble, but I can't seem to load a web page.
[08:05] <diplo> Morning all
[08:05] <TheOpenSourcerer> Morning.
[08:08] <diplo> TheOpenSourcerer: I thought you guys had already employed someone for a job with you, or is this another one on top of that now ?
[08:11] <TheOpenSourcerer> diplo: We did, but unfortunately it didn't work out.
[08:13] <kvarley> Where is the recommended location to install user apps to?
[08:14] <TheOpenSourcerer> kvarley: Is it just for you, or shared between other users?
[08:14] <kvarley> TheOpenSourcerer: Doesn't matter
[08:14] <TheOpenSourcerer> Well it does.
[08:14] <kvarley> TheOpenSourcerer: I'm the only user account on the machine
[08:14] <TheOpenSourcerer> Just for you, stick it your own ~/bin
[08:14] <kvarley> Where would the location be for multiple users?
[08:14] <TheOpenSourcerer> to be shared I generally stick them under /opt
[08:14] <kvarley> Ok :)
[08:15] <kvarley> What is ~/.local/share/ for?
[08:15] <TheOpenSourcerer> /usr/local is another common location
[08:15] <kvarley> I have no write access to /usr so I'll stick it in ~/bin. Thanks TheOpenSourcerer
[08:15] <diplo> :( TheOpenSourcerer
[08:16] <TheOpenSourcerer> kvarley: This might be useful: https://wiki.linuxfoundation.org/en/LSB
[08:16]  * kvarley HATES opera
[08:16] <kvarley> It sets itself at the default browser when you install it
[08:16] <TheOpenSourcerer> diplo: yes.
[08:17] <kvarley> How can I stop Opera being the default browser?
[08:18] <kvarley> I'm running XFCE on Ubuntu Mini
[08:19] <dogmatic69> kvarley: what do you want as the default?
[08:19] <kvarley> dogmatic69: Firefox
[08:19] <dogmatic69> open ff, settings, set as default
[08:19] <kvarley> I have several browsers installed because I'm a web developer. Every time I install opera on a new install of linux it takes over - so annoying
[08:20] <dogmatic69> edit -> preferences ->advanced
[08:20] <dogmatic69> there is a check there.
[08:21] <kvarley> dogmatic69: Makes no difference
[08:22] <diplo> Settings > Default Applications ?
[08:22] <kvarley> dogmatic69: It sets itself in the gnome-www-browser variable which overrides it
[08:23] <kvarley> Fixed
[08:23] <kvarley> If anybody else has the same issue - http://askubuntu.com/questions/116080/thunderbird-uses-the-wrong-browser
[08:51] <knightwise> hey everyone
[08:53] <SuperMatt> morning
[09:36] <JamesTait> Happy World Theatre Day, everyone! :-D
[09:41] <AlanBell> http://www.dabs.com/products/techair-15-6--grey-orange-envelope-case--check-bundles-for-free-retractable-mouse--8HW7.html?utm_source=retention%20email&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=email260313&utm_content=i800
[09:41] <AlanBell> special ubuntu colours \o/
[09:48] <brobostigon> good morning everyone,
[09:53] <bigcalm> That mouse looks horrible
[09:53] <AlanBell> what mouse?
[09:54] <AlanBell> oh, that one
[09:54] <bigcalm> http://www.dabs.com/products/techair-mini-notebook-mouse-7M68.html?prev=8HW7
[09:56] <popey> it looks free
[10:02] <bigcalm> This ps2 to USB adapter isn't sending | or \. Looks like I'm going back to the Alienware kb that came with the machine :S
[10:04] <bigcalm> Ah well, Hayley will be pleased
[10:12] <DJones> How stable is 13.04 now, with beta freeze due tomorrow, I'm debating whether to upgrade and help test for the last month, no unusual hardware on the laptop, i3 using built in intel graphics
[10:15] <AlanBell> 13.04 has been stable all the way though the cycle, however I did lose my desktop background yesterday
[10:16] <bigcalm> Anybody finding gmail (not google apps) IMAP slow to respond the last couple of days?
[10:19] <DJones> AlanBell: Ah well, i'll give it a go
[10:19] <popey> bigcalm: what do you connect to gmail with?
[10:19] <bigcalm> popey: Thunderbird
[10:19] <popey> gosh
[10:19] <popey> why not use the web UI?
[10:20] <SuperMatt> why oh why is creating an email server so tricksy?
[10:20] <SuperMatt> All I want is a simple gui for setting it up
[10:20] <popey> email is hard, lets go shopping!
[10:20]  * AlanBell connects to gmail with thunderbird
[10:20] <popey> you probably want roundcubeemail or that one that starts with z I can never remember
[10:21] <bigcalm> popey: with several emails accounts, using a client keeps them all in one place
[10:21] <AlanBell> zentyal
[10:21] <SuperMatt> I do want roundcube, but I have to set up postfix and dovecot first ;)
[10:21] <popey> gotcha
[10:21] <AlanBell> did canonical ever do anything with zentyal?
[10:22] <bigcalm> Roudecube was nice, the last time I used it about 6 years ago
[10:22] <DJones> Hmmh, "Warning: Failed to read mirror file" after running do-release-upgrade -d & entering password
[10:23] <bigcalm> DJones: change your software sources to the main server?
[10:23] <TheOpenSourcerer> AlanBell: http://www.zentyal.com/news/zentyal-to-offer-a-linux-alternative-to-smb-it-infrastructure-with-support-from-canonical/
[10:24] <AlanBell> yeah, I meant beyond the joint press release
[10:24] <DJones> bigcalm: It is set to Main server
[10:24] <bigcalm> DJones: apt-get update before hand?
[10:24] <bigcalm> DJones: I'm grasping at straws here :)
[10:25] <DJones> Trying anyway
[10:26] <SuperMatt> hmmm... zentyal looks like what I need
[10:26] <DJones> seems to be running now
[10:31] <SuperMatt> dang, zentyal doesn't work with quantal :(
[10:37] <andylockran> hey all
[10:38] <andylockran> how goes things?
[10:38] <andylockran> Canonical's Landscape - could I use this to manage any ubuntu servers (eg, hosted on rackspace, bitfolk or other services)?
[10:43] <popey> yes
[10:56] <bigcalm> SNOW!
[10:58] <DJones> bigcalm: You seem surprised at snow
[10:59] <bigcalm> DJones: more disappointed than surprised
[11:01] <DJones> Heh
[11:01] <DJones> Its just stopped here, been snowing since I woke up, but not enough to stick
[11:04] <davmor2> Morning all
[11:07] <DJones> Upgrade failed, had to run sudo apt-get -f install to get it to continue
[11:11] <bigcalm> Morning davmor2
[11:16] <redtape-renegade> good morning folks.
[11:19] <xnox> Bon Jovi in Hyde Park tickets are £75              /0_0\
[11:19] <xnox> i guess they can....
[11:32] <davmor2> xnox that is cheap in comparison to some prices
[11:33] <bigcalm> 12 is small in comparison to some numbers
[11:33]  * bigcalm grins
[11:39]  * redtape-renegade looks at the real price of an X51 these days ::: | http://goo.gl/JQDTk = $1 K
[11:43] <diplo> xnox: Its why I've stopped going to there concerts
[11:43] <diplo> So yeah they can, but they're losing a fair few people, most of mates refuse to pay that much now
[11:44] <xnox> the tour is called "Because We can" as well....
[11:45] <BigRedS> heh
[11:47] <andylockran> playing with xslt for the first time in years ; what fun!
[11:49] <bigcalm> redtape-renegade: contact Dell directly, talk to a sales rep and you'll get a discount as they want to make a sale. My boss did just that and bought that machine for much less than £800 exVAT
[11:51] <bigcalm> redtape-renegade: consider that the case doesn't really allow for much in the way of upgrading. Though I was able to fit an extra SSD in an empty space
[11:58] <kvarley> popey: How long did it take for your Google order to dispatch?
[12:02] <redtape-renegade> bigcalm: Your right, .. your right, however ..
[12:03] <redtape-renegade> I would and have contacted Dell over some of it's more adaptable desktops which I have used in the past, for work (vostro etc) ..
[12:05] <redtape-renegade> However, the X51, is something that is slightly defective by design .. because of what you said .. Soo I was comparing the advert to the auction.com sites for who had , had enough and therefore was willing to get rid .. and what price that allowed for coming out of the same country. Namely the US.
[12:06]  * redtape-renegade makes a coffee before he brings out his cards, today.
[12:10] <redtape-renegade> bigcalm: Yeah, I don't think that I will go for a 'games-box' just yet as there are a lot of "Steam - boxes" coming out this year, and I hope my trip to the CES next year will find a good one :)
[12:11] <bigcalm> redtape-renegade: I'm happy with it for work and play: http://www.myrant.net/2013/02/17/multi-screen-with-ubuntu-unity/
[12:12] <bigcalm> But then, work was paying :)
[12:13] <redtape-renegade> After all it's not for ipython .. its for the Steam-pipe, or whatever comes down that shute.  I usually by a new Linux Box for the fact that it needs to be in the Ubuntu Friendly webpage.. but that only because I talk to it's co-organiser.
[12:13] <redtape-renegade> opening...
[12:14] <redtape-renegade> Is that yur site bigcalm ??
[12:14] <bigcalm> redtape-renegade: yes
[12:15] <redtape-renegade> it's very good.
[12:15] <bigcalm> Thanks
[12:15] <bigcalm> Theme isn't mine if that's what you were thinking
[12:15] <bigcalm> Content is though :)
[12:15] <redtape-renegade> how do you keep the hardware freecycle stuff conveyor belt .. as full as it is ?
[12:16] <bigcalm> redtape-renegade: that page is somewhat old. I haven't updated it for a long time. It's never gained any interest. Easier to just use freecycle on yahoo groups
[12:17] <redtape-renegade> yes i do have several a/c's there and have done the same .
[12:17] <redtape-renegade> although in America the prefered brand is yoohoo :D
[12:18] <redtape-renegade> Anyway, The point I wa trying to make was.. If , as it's looks for your blog, that you've put some time into this | May I propose that you get involved with these guys ::
[12:19] <redtape-renegade> wwwcentup.org .
[12:19] <redtape-renegade> www.centup.org
[12:19] <redtape-renegade> I have found them to be a bloggers dream.
[12:21] <bigcalm> redtape-renegade: I only blog about something when it comes to mind. Really I use it as a place to remember things I've done in the past
[12:22] <redtape-renegade> Even if it's just for 'your' amusement (the blog) .. I would say that if a potential high earner stumbles over your website / rant .. and thinks .. well I like the cut of this man's jib .. then . there may well be grounds to attain other 'interesting things' that you perhaps would like to show on your blog but would normal go for .. but things that others are intested in having etc ... Well this is your solution ..
[12:22]  * redtape-renegade notes he may have mentioned this idea before , dunno ?
[12:23] <Myrtti> "woops" http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/03/27/gchq_plain_text_password_reminder/
[12:23] <redtape-renegade> #Anyhow  , just a thought.
[12:23] <bigcalm> redtape-renegade: thanks for the info
[12:24]  * redtape-renegade wonders what ever happened to "Web-Rings" animations that were all over linus sites as Links as a roulette wheel in th 90's ?
[12:24] <redtape-renegade> **Gnu/linux sites ..
[12:25] <aquarius> how do I know which model of HP Microserver I have? So I can know which hard drive I can put in it...
[12:25] <redtape-renegade> its snowing hard here ...
[12:27] <redtape-renegade> BTW .. London Transport are giving away freepost badges for ppl who may be pregnant and want a seat of comfort whilst travelling. I gues the badges work for Women with a Bump on any public transport . Let me know if you want the details . I got two .. and they sent those Outside The U.K. !!
[12:28] <redtape-renegade> .. they just arrived in the post !
[12:34] <redtape-renegade> .... anyway . That's my rant over |
[12:35] <redtape-renegade> bigcalm: I'll PM you ..
[12:36] <Lord-Readman> I am finding it really hard to try and get the cpu usage of mysqld via commandline so I can use it in a script
[12:36] <Lord-Readman> ps -eo pcpu,pid,user,args | sort -r -k1 | grep -i '/usr/libexec/mysqld' | awk '{print $1}'
[12:36] <Lord-Readman> this only prints the lifetime average, and along with the grep command of 0%
[12:36] <Lord-Readman> any ideas?
[12:36] <mungbean> mysqltop
[12:37] <redtape-renegade> bigcalm: Are you reading my P/Message ??
[12:38] <redtape-renegade> perhaps your too buzy .................... ?
[12:41] <redtape-renegade> Anyway here's the new ponycar on the block :: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/03/22/review_renault_zoe_bev_electric_car/page2.html
[12:42] <redtape-renegade> perhaps it's one for discussion .. as /that/ seems to be all everyone gets hot under the collar, about here.
[12:46] <DJones> Hmmh, no sound after update, speaker is set at nil & can't change, no devices showing in output for sound, but aplay /usr/share/sounds/alsa/Front_Center.wav plays sound
[12:48] <aquarius> ha! it is an N36L according to the HP website.
[12:48] <popey> kvarley: couple of days
[12:48]  * popey has an N36L
[12:48] <aquarius> OK, #ubuntu-uk, recommendations for 1TB or larger SATA 3.5" hard drives?
[12:48] <popey> they are all the same for hard drives
[12:48] <aquarius> popey, ya, mine was yours, remember? :)
[12:48] <popey> i have 4x2TB in mine
[12:48] <popey> oh yeah :D
[12:49] <aquarius> I have 1x1TB, and it's nearly full, so I need another drive.
[12:49] <popey> wondered where that went
[12:49] <aquarius> popey, you would think it would say "n36L" somewhere on it. Which it does not. And the HP website doesn't tell you either, even if you put the serial number in, unless you poke around extensively. Still, I know now, at least :)
[12:50] <aquarius> blimey, 2TB drives are only seventy quid now?
[12:50] <popey> 	Version: AMD Athlon(tm) II Neo N36L Dual-Core Processor
[12:50] <popey> from dmidecode ^^
[12:50] <popey> yeah madness isnt it
[12:50] <popey> someone somewhere may have said something about hard drive size limits on the N36L
[12:50] <popey> but I dont know who or where
[12:50] <popey> Google will know
[12:50] <aquarius> oh yeah dmidecode. I walked downstairs !
[12:51] <popey> retro
[12:52] <aquarius> aha http://n40l.wikia.com/wiki/Hard_drives sounds useful.
[12:53] <aquarius> http://www.amazon.co.uk/Seagate-Barracuda-inch-Internal-Drive/dp/B006H32Q3S/ref=sr_1_2?s=computers&ie=UTF8&qid=1364388732&sr=1-2 looks like the thing. We like Seagate drives, right?
[12:53] <diplo> I've got seagates in mine
[12:53] <diplo> been up and running 2 years or more now and fine
[12:54] <diplo> need two more, ebuyer just sent an email for 2TB drives for £62.99
[12:54] <aquarius> er! unbrilliant amazon reviews on that drive.
[12:56] <aquarius> and the WD ones on that page are all Green at Amazon, which it says to not use
[12:56] <aquarius> hrm.
[12:57] <mgdm> the guy sitting opposite me has talked about having Red drives in his
[12:57] <mgdm> but he also talked about having to RMA one of them, so...
[12:57]  * popey scans what's in his microserver
[12:57] <BigRedS> We've had reasonable life out of Greens but no raid card likes them
[12:57] <BigRedS> they take forever to spin up and do something once they've been given an instruction
[12:58] <aquarius> maybe a http://www.amazon.co.uk/Hitachi-Deskstar-2000GB-Internal-Drive/dp/B004E9SGO0/ref=sr_1_1?s=computers&ie=UTF8&qid=1364389056&sr=1-1 then.
[12:58] <popey> "Deathstar"
[12:58] <aquarius> I don;t know much about hitachis.
[12:59] <redtape-renegade> That's no Pale Moon... http://www.palemoon.org/palemoon-portable.shtml
[13:00] <popey> http://paste.ubuntu.com/5652203/  that's what's in my microserver
[13:00] <aquarius> aha, you have some samsung spinpoints. the wiki mentions those
[13:01] <popey> i do indeed
[13:01] <aquarius> 160 quid, mark you
[13:01] <aquarius> which is about twice what I want to pay :)
[13:03] <aquarius> looks like the hitachi for me!
[13:03] <aquarius> eleven quid delivery??
[13:04] <czajkowski> aloha
[13:07] <diplo> Actually I have the Hitachis aquarius
[13:07] <aquarius> diplo, ah, sweet. that's encouraging then
[13:07] <aquarius> I am getting over delivery being so outrageous, since the alternative is cheaper delivery and a more expensive drive, heh
[13:08] <diplo> Tried ebuyer?
[13:10] <SuperMatt> anyone know how to get postfix to process an alias before the final email address?
[13:10] <SuperMatt> or maybe disable the email account for a system account?
[13:11] <popey> SuperMatt: /etc/aliases
[13:12] <SuperMatt> yeah, but the problem is that it's sending the email to a system account with the same name as my alias
[13:12] <SuperMatt> unless
[13:13] <SuperMatt> maybe postfix hasn't imported my new aliases file?
[13:14] <SuperMatt> that was it :D
[13:15] <mgdm> SuperMatt: did you run 'newaliases'?
[13:17] <SuperMatt> I did not
[13:17] <SuperMatt> it's all done now :)
[13:20] <kvarley> popey:I ordered sunday night, still waiting for dispatch. I'm just used to amazon & ebuyer who dispatch immediately I guess
[13:20] <DJones> Has anybody had an issue on 13.04 where they can't get to software sources
[13:21] <kvarley> DJones: Does running "software-properties-gtk" in terminal give you any info?
[13:22] <DJones> kvarley: http://pastebin.com/Q9Sj3Dgn
[13:23] <popey> works here DJones
[13:24] <popey> try "sudo apt-get install --fix-policy" - anything missing?
[13:24] <DJones> Seems to fixing quite a few things
[13:31] <kvarley> OT: Anybody know where I can learn about Python for the web? Is Django the best way to go?
[13:32] <Myrtti> Django has unicorns.
[13:32] <Myrtti> so clearly it's the best way to go.
[13:32] <DJones> popey: Thats solved a couple of issues with the indicator applets, but can't get to Software & Updates from System Settings
[13:33] <kvarley> Myrtti: Hehe true. My concern is that the documentation seems poor. Aside from the first app tutorial, you're on your own. The book is outdated.
[13:34] <Myrtti> oh god, now the pink fluffy unicorns dancing on a rainbow started to play in my head
[13:34] <DJones> Starting software center also won't let me get to software sources
[13:35] <Myrtti> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ky3Ordfqn88 I'll get my revenge by getting it to play in yours too.
[13:35] <kvarley> Myrtti: hehe
[13:36] <DJones> selecting software sources in software centre (running from terminal) gives this error http://pastebin.com/28LdUUQj
[13:37] <bigcalm> Myrtti: that was horrible
[13:37] <redtape-renegade> Myrtti: Haha ..
[13:38] <redtape-renegade> .. and with 1800 likes to 82 'un-likes' .. it's a winner !
[13:41] <redtape-renegade> Woow .. Thy're really pushing the boundaries of StarwarS under the "Art2-D2's" on Amazon these days :D |  http://goo.gl/cH0Xj
[13:43] <redtape-renegade> Myrtti: I click and subscribed to the 'unicorn' channel .. only to find a more annoying one .. on Spot.fx |  http://goo.gl/ys7QS
[14:01] <DJones> Problem solved, opened synaptic, and ran "Mark all upgrades" and the "Apply" appears to solved it anyway, the upgrade did fail part way through originally
[15:17] <mungbean> anyone know how to troubleshoot suspend problems?
[15:17] <mungbean> consistently fails
[15:24] <popey> mungbean: suspend fails or wake does?
[15:27] <mungbean> popey: i think i've seenboth, certainly justearlier, tried to suspend and the stopping xXXX service messages were on screen but couldn't ctrl-alt-f1 etc
[15:28] <mungbean> usually have to power off
[15:28] <awilkins> Is there a web app or piece of javascript that will play back shell sessions?
[15:28] <awilkins> Like a video, but without the hideous overage of bandwidth?
[15:31]  * awilkins finds bsdutils script / replay commands
[15:48]  * awilkins has found the marvellous http://shelr.tv which fulfils his need to unleash shell sessions on the world
[15:49] <awilkins> sudo apt-get install shelr and off you go...
[15:49] <popey> mungbean: stock ubuntu?
[15:50] <SuperMatt> running my own email server \o/
[15:50] <SuperMatt> and I've donated to geary ;)
[15:50]  * popey signs up SuperMatt to various spamming services
[15:50] <SuperMatt> you wouldn't dare!
[15:51] <mgdm> SuperMatt: come across 'swaks' yet in your travels?
[15:51] <mgdm> probably a bit late, but it's nice for debugging
[15:51]  * awilkins signs SuperMatt up to various spam blocklists
[15:51] <SuperMatt> D:
[15:51] <SuperMatt> WHY U DO THIS?
[15:51] <SuperMatt> mgdm: swaks?
[15:52] <mgdm> SuperMatt: http://www.jetmore.org/john/code/swaks/
[15:52] <SuperMatt> I did not
[15:53] <mungbean> popey: sort of..stock ubuntu was installed, yes
[15:53] <mungbean> added a couple of DEs, and have encryped home i think
[15:53] <SuperMatt> mgdm: I think I'm going to step away from my configuration now
[15:53] <ali1234> there's little to no point trying to debug suspend problems unless you're willing to fix kernel drivers
[15:55] <SuperMatt> I do wish that setting up a mail server was a little bit easier. I understand the need for the bajillion options, but I don't understand why the default isn't "allow receiving from all, sending must be authenticated"
[15:56] <awilkins> Is the default "only stuff on this machine can send" though?
[15:57] <SuperMatt> it is, yes
[15:59] <mungbean> ali1234: it worked once
[16:00] <SuperMatt> ooh, looks like postgrey is easy to install
[16:00] <SuperMatt> I might have fun with that later
[16:17] <mungbean> X server just hung ,although can ssh in http://paste.ubuntu.com/5652673/
[16:36] <kvarley> Is it possible to manipulate the apps installed within the ISO image for Ubuntu?
[16:38] <awilkins> kvarley, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YW676T1hpEA
[16:39] <kvarley> awilkins: Can that be manipulated via CLI too?
[16:39] <awilkins> I don't know
[16:39] <SuperMatt> ok, all I need now is to some how link my owncloud webdav contacts with roundcube
[16:45] <kvarley> popey: Am I allowed to make a site similar to SuseStudio but for Ubuntu? Would that cause any obvious copyright issues?
[16:59] <directhex> kvarley, yes, i do that for work, to make a custom iso
[16:59] <directhex> things like java & skype by default
[16:59] <directhex> no unity
[16:59] <kvarley> directhex: Thank you :)
[16:59] <kvarley> directhex: I'm considering launching a service themed around that topic
[17:01] <popey> there is a debian one already
[17:01] <popey> which might be a good base
[17:01] <kvarley> Oh and expect it to all be MIT licensed \0/
[17:01] <MartijnVdS> Debian One? Is that like Ubuntu One?
[17:01] <kvarley> Haha
[17:05] <shauno> SuperMatt: "receiving from all" is a difficult default, without specifying who you're receiving for.  if you just assume local users at any domain, you're going to get bombarded with spam quickly
[17:05] <SuperMatt> indeed
[17:06] <shauno> they're tricky business.  any default has to be a very defensive default
[17:16] <^aDaM-iPhone> lo all
[17:59] <sebsebseb> hi
[18:17] <davmor2> well that was one task that lasted far too long
[18:30] <czajkowski> peeka boo
[18:30] <MartijnVdS> howdy czajkowski
[19:00] <davmor2> czajkowski: prod!
[19:50] <madpup_uk> Hi all
[20:12] <SuperEngineer> Made I laugh!  http://theravingrick.blogspot.co.uk/2013/03/time-killer-extrordinaire.html
[20:13] <mungbean> anyone got thoughts on this? http://liquidat.wordpress.com/2013/03/27/pass-a-perfect-shell-based-password-manager/
[20:14] <daubers> Anyone have any idea why my mouse pointer is really really not smooth when moving across the screen?
[20:15] <AlanBell> clean the ball? </retro>
[20:15] <daubers> It's optical :)
[20:23] <mungbean> woops forgot to upload my joulo data
[20:47] <czajkowski> davmor2: sup
[20:49] <SuperEngineer> daubers: clean the table?
[20:50] <AlanBell> or dirty the table, shiny surfaces are more of a problem
[20:50] <brobostigon>  /win 5
[20:52] <daubers> Nah, looks like a rendering issue
[20:53] <daubers> Get the same problem with a wacom tablet
[21:37] <StevenR_> hrm. How do I add the testing kernel suggested here? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/1160582
[21:42] <ali1234> StevenR_: download these
[21:42] <ali1234> linux-image-3.2.41-030241-generic_3.2.41-030241.201303201717_amd64.deb
[21:42] <ali1234> linux-headers-3.2.41-030241-generic_3.2.41-030241.201303201717_amd64.deb
[21:42] <ali1234> linux-image-extra-3.2.41-030241-virtual_3.2.41-030241.201303201717_amd64.deb
[21:43] <ali1234> install each one with sudo dpkg -i
[21:43] <ali1234> reboot and select the kernel at grub menu
[21:44] <ali1234> actually you probably dont need linux-image-extra
[21:50] <StevenR_> ali1234: seem to have a cyclic dependency
[21:50] <ali1234> well try installing them in a different order
[21:50] <StevenR_> nevermind. need linux-headers-3.2.41-030241_3.2.41-030241.201303201717_all.deb
[21:51] <ali1234> oh yeah, forgot that one sorry
[22:06] <MooDoo> evening all
[22:19] <redtape-renegade> Hi MooDoo
[22:19] <redtape-renegade> Hey Everybody o/
[22:19] <redtape-renegade> Had a bad day ?
[22:20] <redtape-renegade> Call Anthony .. http://www.anonymous.se/wp/?p=104
[22:20] <redtape-renegade> later..
[22:22] <redtape-renegade> #happy-times
[22:25] <StevenR_> ali1234: thanks. got them installed. Crashes after 1 min of uptime though :( (well, X11 does. ssh still works)
[23:03] <ali1234> anyone feel like giving me some armchair legal advice?
[23:03] <ali1234> i'm being asked to become a director of a LTD company
[23:06] <Azelphur> ali1234: I might end up needing to do that for my BTC business
[23:06] <Azelphur> be interested to know what you find out
[23:10] <popey> Evening all.
[23:14] <popey> ali1234: wassup?
[23:17] <ali1234> we're setting up a LTD for drum off... they want me to be a director
[23:17] <ali1234> and i'm worried about getting sued
[23:27] <AlanBell> what is drum off?
[23:27] <amayer> where is the "correct" place to install a program. i just compiled a program for the first time and would like it to be accessable to everyone one the system
[23:30] <AlanBell> ali1234: the point of a limited company is that your liability is limited to the share capital (unless limited by guarantee) so you are possibly better off having it to avoid personal liability
[23:31] <AlanBell> but as a director you have various responsibilities and if you screw up badly enough you could be barred from being a director for a while
[23:31] <ali1234> AlanBell: drumoff.tv <- explains it
[23:32] <AlanBell> who is involved with the company? how many people?
[23:32] <ali1234> me and two others are looking at being directors/shareholders
[23:32] <ali1234> i know these people very well and i'm not woried about them suing me
[23:34] <ali1234> but i'm worried about scenario: company gets sued, has no money -> insolvency, liquidators sue us for "wrongful trading"
[23:34] <AlanBell> if there is only a little bit of money involved then it is best to reduce that to zero, and have a way so that no money changes hands and no company is required
[23:34] <AlanBell> if there is a worthwhile amount of money then a limited company is the way to do it
[23:35] <ali1234> we need to pay musicians etc
[23:35] <ali1234> and we'll sell the recordings at the end
[23:35] <AlanBell> ltd company it is then
[23:37] <ali1234> yeah there's no question about needing the company
[23:37] <ali1234> the question is just do i want to be a director or not?
[23:37] <ali1234> i think on balance the answer is probably yes
[23:38] <AlanBell> yeah, probably
[23:39] <AlanBell> three £1 shares to start it?
[23:41] <^aDaM> lo
[23:41] <ali1234> hmm, why £1
[23:42] <ali1234> the current plan is 300 £1 shares
[23:42] <ali1234> because we've each put around £100 into setting everything up
[23:42] <AlanBell> that works too
[23:43] <ali1234> does it really matter how much the original shares are worth though?
[23:43] <ali1234> we're going to end up putting more money in later
[23:43] <AlanBell> just when you pay a dividend you pay it "per ordinary share"
[23:45] <AlanBell> you can loan the company money, and it can pay it back to you
[23:46] <AlanBell> rather than issuing more shares and buying them
[23:47] <ali1234> so liability is limited to "share capital" - if the company already spent all the share capital, that means there is no liability?
[23:47] <AlanBell> it is worth getting the accounting right for the initial shares though, some people mess that up
[23:47] <ali1234> or does it mean liability is always £100 each no matter what the company bank balance is?
[23:47] <AlanBell> erm, it means you stand to lose the £100 each that you have put in or something, if the company has spent it then it is gone
[23:48] <ali1234> and how do people mess it up, exactly?
[23:48] <ali1234> so the former then
[23:49] <AlanBell> when you set up a company you normally get 1 share certificate and 1 £1 share issued, which just looks like an irrelevant technicality
[23:49] <AlanBell> until you want to pay dividends and it isn't clear who owns the share and there should be one each
[23:50] <AlanBell> some people start out thinking directors get dividends, but they don't, shares get dividends.
[23:50] <ali1234> yeah, i think we've done that part right
[23:50] <ali1234> because it's 50% of the reason we're doing it
[23:51] <AlanBell> yup