[00:01] <sergiusens> rsalveti: seems I can't test my stuff with github for a bit: "message": "API Rate Limit Exceeded for 190.17.x.x"
[00:04] <rsalveti> sergiusens: lol
[00:04] <rsalveti> sergiusens: let me know if I can help
[00:05] <rsalveti> I also got a vpn (hidemyass.com)
[00:06] <sergiusens> rsalveti: ah, if I auth I get more reqs :-)
[00:08] <rsalveti> sergiusens: cool
[00:10]  * sergiusens tries to remember his github password
[00:11] <sergiusens> rsalveti: I am now Unauthorized instead of Forbidden :-P
[00:11] <rsalveti> sergiusens: haha
[00:11] <rsalveti> now they know it's you
[00:13] <sergiusens> rsalveti: need to fill in the forgot password form again :-/
[00:13] <rsalveti> sergiusens: isn't it the one you use for you blog as well?
[00:16] <sergiusens> rsalveti: ssh keys and web login passwords are different
[00:16] <rsalveti> sergiusens: right :-)
[00:16] <sergiusens> rsalveti: to add up to the issues, I stopped paying my ieee subscription and my email relay has been shutdown it seems :-P
[00:17] <rsalveti> blogs at github is kind of new to me :-)
[00:17] <rsalveti> sergiusens: hahah
[00:21] <sergiusens> rsalveti: it's not a blog as in _today_'s terms, it's a satic blog
[00:21] <sergiusens> rsalveti: http://nikola.ralsina.com.ar/
[00:21] <sergiusens> rsalveti: I just commit the output to github pages: http://pages.github.com/
[00:21] <rsalveti> sergiusens: cool
[02:25] <Sahir> hi every one
[02:25] <Sahir> i need help and advice
[02:26] <Sahir> i am ubuntu fan, and i would like to be ubuntu developer, but i don't know how and where to start
[02:27] <Sahir> any syggestion , ideas from the experties here, i know that's always the first step is the hardest step, that's why i came here
[02:29] <bef0rd_> do you have any previous knowledge about development or programming
[02:30] <bef0rd_> Sahir ^
[02:30] <Sahir> yes
[02:30] <bef0rd_> what languages
[02:30] <Sahir> english,and arabic
[02:30] <bef0rd_> er, programming languages
[02:31] <Sahir> i know c++, littile of java
[02:31] <bef0rd_> I would say that python is preffered in Ubuntu Desktop, now in Ubuntu Touch apps, QML and Javascript should be enough, some c++ will help
[02:32] <bef0rd_> you can also use QML on the desktop though
[02:32] <Sahir> i c
[02:32] <bef0rd_> search que Ubuntu SDK guides
[02:32] <Sahir> ok, that sounds good
[02:32] <bef0rd_> and follow them, create the sample app and go from there
[02:33] <Sahir> thanks
[02:33] <Sahir> :)
[02:33] <bef0rd_> no problem
[02:41] <sergiusens> rsalveti: still here?
[02:41] <rsalveti> sergiusens: yup
[02:42] <sergiusens> rsalveti: awesome, I just had some dinner and going to send in some patches (very minor) that I did when my github thing died
[02:43] <rsalveti> sergiusens: ok
[02:43] <rsalveti> sergiusens: we need to rebase the nm mr
[02:43] <rsalveti> sergiusens: and the current mr fails to build for me
[02:43] <rsalveti> network-manager-packaging/debian/patches/series:git_machine_id_duid_gen_1d14d17.patch
[02:43] <rsalveti> which is not there
[02:43] <rsalveti> sergiusens: https://code.launchpad.net/~network-manager/network-manager/ubuntu.raring
[02:44] <rsalveti> sergiusens: cyphermox_ pushed a new version at raring a few hours ago
[02:44] <rsalveti> sergiusens: mind updating the mr?
[02:44] <rsalveti> https://code.launchpad.net/~sergiusens/phablet-extras/network-manager-packaging/+merge/155388
[02:45] <rsalveti> I'm finally able to check and test all the pending mrs as I got my internet back :-)
[02:47] <rsalveti> sergiusens: that's an easy one, will push
[02:50] <sergiusens> rsalveti: it's 4
[02:50] <sergiusens> rsalveti: :-)
[02:50] <rsalveti> sergiusens: yeah, just got them
[03:05] <rsalveti> sergiusens: all pushed
[03:06] <sergiusens> rsalveti: ok, just checked and github api is allowing me to use it again... one more step and everything breakfast will work
[03:06] <sergiusens> rsalveti: but that's a tomorrow task :-)
[03:06] <rsalveti> sergiusens: cool
[03:07] <sergiusens> going to zZzZz now
[03:07] <rsalveti> sergiusens: I manually merged latest nm and I'm testing it here
[03:07] <rsalveti> should update or create a new mr later today for you to test tomorrow
[03:08] <sergiusens> rsalveti: awesome, I might make some tea and stay a little longer :)
[03:08] <rsalveti> sergiusens: don't worry too much, will take a few to build
[08:10] <zsombi> robru: ping
[08:10] <lotuspsychje> any ubuntu tablets being sold yet?
[08:35] <madeu> if you install ubuntu touch, will it remove the android os
[08:36] <madeu> if no, then is there any way to remove android before adding linux
[08:36] <madeu> My phone is underpowered so any solution to that?
[09:21] <lenios> madeu, it will remove android
[09:22] <madeu> ok thanks
[09:22] <madeu> lenios was very helpful
[09:22] <madeu> Bye, guys
[09:37] <Rhonda> Hi. I wonder, is the ubuntu mobile OS compatible with the google app store, or wouldn't that work?
[09:38] <Rhonda> And are devices already available?
[09:40] <nik90> Rhonda: Ubuntu Mobile OS is *not* compatible with google app store. You cannot run android apps on ubuntu.
[09:41] <nik90> Rhonda: However there are many community apps which are in development which port some of the famous android apps over to ubuntu touch.
[09:42] <ogra_`> Rhonda, we only use the kernel, driver and HAL layer of android,  above that it is a normal ubuntu rootfs
[09:42] <ogra_`> there is no java at all in the default install
[09:43] <ogra_`> (i assume someone could write a dalvik emulator to make it work thouogh)
[09:43] <Rhonda> Is there some gps/geocaching app available already? :)
[09:44] <Namidairo> i don't even think gps even works on most of the builds
[09:44] <ogra_`> nope, at least not beyond what you could quickly port from maemo or so :)
[09:44] <Rhonda> too bad
[09:44] <ogra_`> and the platform API is still lacking in the sensors area
[09:44] <Rhonda> Guess that would be an interesting market enabler.
[09:45] <ogra_`> but its planned to have such stuff indeed :)
[09:45] <ogra_`> UTouch is still young ...
[09:45] <ogra_`> (it looks farm more mature than it is though :) )
[09:45] <ogra_`> *far
[09:45] <Namidairo> it still has that tentative release date of october does it not
[09:45] <ogra_`> it does
[09:45] <Rhonda> I know I know, wasn't meant to badmouth or such. :)
[09:46]  * ogra_` didnt read it as badmouthing :)
[09:46] <Rhonda> The ellipsis made it sound a bit, just stating.
[09:47] <Rhonda> Alright, if I would get me a nexus, would there be a way to have the images stored on my laptop, and switch between android and utouch every now and then?
[09:47] <ogra_`> october is the estimated date for a basic phone release whith the handfull of core apps currently in development ... focus is to run on a dual core A9 with 512M ...
[09:47] <ogra_`> high end phoness and extra features will happen for 14.04
[09:48] <ogra_`> yeah, you can flash back and forth as you like
[09:49] <Rhonda> Including user data without any troubles to lose something, I hope. :)
[09:49] <ogra_`> not yet :)
[09:50] <Namidairo> if you backup properly...
[09:50] <ogra_`> right
[09:50] <Namidairo> but that is an extensive process
[09:50] <ogra_`> well, android is cloud centric enough to not lose anything if you use all the google stuff
[09:50] <Rhonda> The nexus 4, 7 and 10 are tablets, only the galaxy is a mobile phone, right?
[09:50] <ogra_`> on the ubuntu side you would have to backup the /home/phablet dir
[09:51] <ogra_`> nexus4 is a phone
[09:51]  * Rhonda . o O ( sorry for that dumb question, I don't have any smartphone yet and am a DAU when it comes to hardware … )
[09:51] <ogra_`> aa pretty high end one
[09:51] <Namidairo> no smartphone in this age?
[09:51] <Namidairo> owch.
[09:52] <Rhonda> Got me a samsung outdoor mobile phone two years ago, but that was the biggest waste of money I've done so far. :)
[09:52] <ogra_`> (the nexus4 HW is easily worth twice the amount you pay for it, if you consider a smartphone, get an n4)
[09:52] <Rhonda> Was looking for something sustainable with a little kid, that was the reason to choose it.
[09:52] <ogra_`> (i.e. the same device from samsung or HTC will cost you double)
[09:52] <Namidairo> yeah the price is very good
[09:52] <Namidairo> the only thing I don't like about it is the lack of usb host
[09:53] <Rhonda> Some shop you can encourage to use, I see it for 430,- EUR on amazon. :)
[09:53]  * ogra_` doesnt like that the case breaks so easily ... you have to treat it like your precious :)
[09:53] <Rhonda> uh oh, that might outrule it in my environment.
[09:53] <ogra_`> making everything glass is shiny and feels really good in your hand ...
[09:53] <ogra_`> but you have to be sooo careful
[09:54] <Namidairo> I've scuffed my galaxy nexus in a couple places
[09:54] <Namidairo> if I did that with the nexus 4 it would probably shatter
[09:54] <Rhonda> So the galaxy is tougher?
[09:54]  * ogra_` has a "phone sock" for his ... 
[09:55] <ogra_`> Rhonda, it doesnt have as much glass ...
[09:55] <ogra_`> the n4 has glass on the back as well
[09:55] <Namidairo> there are a multitude of phones under the samsung "galaxy" brand
[09:57] <Namidairo> like, alot.
[09:58] <Namidairo> look at this list and weep
[09:58] <Namidairo> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samsung_Galaxy
[10:00] <Rhonda> About the battery life time, what would you rather suggest?
[10:01] <Namidairo> i know the galaxy nexus has pretty crap battery life
[10:02] <ogra_`> well, we dont have working 3G networking yet (only GSM for calls/SMS and wlan for network) ... so the battery life currently fells like its endless :)
[10:02] <ogra_`> that will change massively once 3G works
[10:03] <ogra_`> i'm using an old galaxy S2 for development, it easily survives a full week of daily playing around with no charging currently ...
[10:03] <ogra_`> using it with android and 3G networking it survives 2 days in max
[10:05] <ogra_`> given that we use android at the bottom layer i would expect that in the end we have similar battery life
[10:05] <ogra_`> once all the bits work etc
[10:06] <Namidairo> is there anything stopping an app from just keeping a wakelock and draining the battery like theres no tomorrow?
[10:16] <ZDmitry> clear
[10:19] <nik90> ogra_`: damn I wish there was an image for the s3 international :(
[10:22] <ogra_`> still none ?
[10:23] <ogra_`> i thougght people are actively working on it
[10:29] <nik90> ogra_`: there was some1 working on it...but now in the wiki, it shows nobody working on it
[10:29] <mlankhorst> I see a raring-preinstalled-phablet-armhf.zip, does it work yet or is quantal still recommended?
[10:30] <ogra_`> mlankhorst, it "kind of" works :)
[10:30] <ogra_`> its not ready to replace the quantal one yet
[10:30] <mlankhorst> nexus 7, no need to make phone calls or anything as long as wireless touch and display works I suppose
[10:30] <ogra_`> basic functions are there (you get the shell) ... so for testing graphics stuff which i assume you want, it shoudl work
[10:31] <mlankhorst> yeah
[10:31] <ogra_`> apps are not all working yet and there are bits and pieces missing ...
[10:32] <ogra_`> we'll only fully switch once the image is equally good
[10:32] <mlankhorst> and then it's time to move to s again :P
[10:33] <ogra_`> yeah
[10:33]  * ogra_` would really have liked to skip R 
[10:39] <smartboyhw> ogra_`, people would have liked to skip S even:P
[10:40] <ogra_`> well, we need to work inside the distro at some point
[10:40] <ogra_`> so S is fine
[10:41] <ogra_`> R is just to early ... since not everything could go in
[12:04] <chon> Hi
[12:27] <sergiusens> mlankhorst: networking (all types) don't work on the raring build
[12:30] <ogra_> sneaker network does if you use an OTG cable and USB stick ;)
[12:30] <ogra_> though the throughput speed is limited :)
[12:31] <sergiusens> ogra_: speaking of limited throughput, did you solve that problem with the chromebook?
[12:31] <ogra_> which one ? i dont have any
[12:31] <ogra_> (i think i claimed that before)
[12:33] <ogra_> the only issues i have with my chromebook is that unity tells me it is fully supported but it doesnt actually seem to be accelerated at all ...
[12:33] <sergiusens> ogra_: yeah, but before that you mentioned otherwise when I told you that I could download our images at 3MBps on my workstation, but at 100KBps on the chromebook ...
[12:33] <ogra_> on a lower level the device just works as i expect
[12:34] <ogra_> well, i have a 2M line here ... so i can hardly compare ... but transferring files in my LAN shows no issues
[12:35] <sergiusens> I'll have to dig in deeper then
[12:37] <ogra_> what kernel do you use ?
[12:37] <ogra_> i didnt touch it at all here
[12:45] <sergiusens> ogra_: IIRC I'm using an ubuntu one, let me check
[12:45] <ogra_> ah
[12:45] <ogra_> might be an U1 screwup
[12:45] <ogra_> i definitely didnt get good throughput from it alst time i tired
[12:45]  * ogra_ blames aquarius 
[12:46] <sergiusens> ogra_: yeah, I'm using linux-image-3.4.0-5-chromebook
[12:46] <Quintasan> ogra_: As I expected, upgrading the hybris bzr stuff helped
[12:46] <sergiusens> ogra_: just got your pun :-P
[12:47] <ogra_> Quintasan, yay
[12:47] <Quintasan> too bad most of the fuctions are placeholders
[12:47] <Quintasan> but it works quite good
[12:48] <Quintasan> I wonder if hw acceleration is present
[12:50] <popey> bug 1129061 # wondering if this is a virtualbox upstream bug..
[12:50] <popey> qmlscene just renders a black box
[12:57] <mhall119> because virtualbox doesn't support OpenGL ES
[13:00] <mhall119> The Clinic is Open!
[13:03] <popey> Hmm..
[13:03] <christina> popey, hello
[13:03]  * mhall119 is also in a meeting
[13:03] <popey> hi christina
[13:03] <mhall119> hello christina
[13:03] <popey> christina: you been testing out apps on the phone?
[13:03] <christina> hey mhall119
[13:04] <christina> popey, we got the apps on the device and been playing around with them
[13:04] <popey> excellent
[13:04] <mhall119> so the device images have a new QML shell that lets you see and run any installed SDK app
[13:04] <mhall119> also ^^ about getting clock, calculator and calendar in the default images
[13:05] <mhall119> popey and I are also planning on opening a "beyond core" apps PPA, to collect the 3rd party apps being developed into a single PPA
[13:06] <mhall119> popey: the resistor calculator is packaged now, so that's an easy one to target for that PPA
[13:06] <popey> great. we need a better name than "non-core" and I don't like "extras" because it clashes with the desktop extras ppa
[13:06] <popey> without wishing to bikeshed it, a name would be useful
[13:07] <mhall119> cool-apps :)
[13:07] <ogra_> "community"
[13:07] <popey> meaning core ones are uncool? ☻
[13:07] <popey> "other" ☻
[13:07] <mhall119> ogra_: well core-apps are written by the community
[13:07] <mhall119> so that might be confusing
[13:07] <mhall119> more-apps?
[13:07] <popey> http://thesaurus.com/browse/extra
[13:08] <popey> "optional" ?
[13:08] <mhall119> cheating
[13:08] <mhall119> :)
[13:08] <popey> "beyond"
[13:08] <mhall119> any app developers around that want to weight in on this?
[13:09] <popey> in addition I'd love to see some video tutorials for getting started with qml..
[13:09] <popey> like video versions of your blog posts
[13:09] <mhall119> good idea, we just need somebody with a good recording voice...
[13:10] <mhall119> speaking of, I need to write tomorrow's post sometime today
[13:10] <mhall119> doing a blog-a-day is harder than it sounds
[13:10] <sergiusens> popey: app-bazaar
[13:11] <mhall119> we don't want to imply that it's a market or store, we have one of those and a PPA isn't it
[13:12] <mhall119> app-playground maybe?
[13:12] <mhall119> app-potluck
[13:12] <ogra_> app-kindergarden ?
[13:12] <mhall119> app-hippie-commune
[13:13] <sergiusens> well it's a freemarket
[13:13] <mhall119> not really, it's a curated PPA where everything is free
[13:13] <ogra_> app-pool ?
[13:13] <ogra_> (bring your own bikini)
[13:14] <mhall119> mankini
[13:14] <ogra_> ++
[13:15] <mhall119> no ++
[13:15] <ogra_> heh
[13:15] <popey> mhall119: I'll happily convert your blog posts to videos if you like
[13:15] <mhall119> popey: it might work better with a simpler app
[13:16] <popey> sure, initially I agree
[13:16] <mhall119> like the currency converter, once we finish updating the text version to use the new SDK
[13:19] <mhall119> oh, we should be getting updated API docs soon, for version 0.1.40 of the SDK components
[13:21] <popey> ckpringle: speaking of videos, you might want to record future videos using the camera app on the iphone rather than vine, and then upload to youtube, it gets wider coverage and is less freedom hating than vine ㋛
[13:21] <popey> e.g. i can't play the vine videos in chromium at all so I just see big boxes with no content
[13:22] <mhall119> vine?
[13:23] <nik90> youtube is the best way to showcase videos..
[13:23] <nik90> mhall119: I think it is a video recording app for iphone
[13:23] <popey> yeah, a proprietary video camera app / editor and host
[13:23] <mhall119> oh, ckpringle, I never did get a +1 or -1 on using the icons from the qml shell for the core apps
[13:23] <mhall119> can I get that today?
[13:23] <ckpringle> popey: lol ...
[13:23] <popey> the "USP" is that you can only publish 6 second videos
[13:24] <ckpringle> mhall119: they seem to be on the build already so I think that is fine for now, it is temporary
[13:24] <mhall119> ckpringle: I would need to copy them into the core-apps branches, so they become part of their .deb package
[13:25] <mhall119> is that okay?
[13:25] <nik90> mhall119, popey: renato submitted a MP with a basic autopilot test for clock app..however in order to run the tests, I need autopilot package which is currently only for quantal and raring..whom do I contact to get it for precise?
[13:26] <mhall119> balloons
[13:26] <nik90> oh yeah. I will do that
[13:26] <mhall119> maybe thomi, but I don't know if he's still doing autopilot stuff
[13:26] <mhall119> balloons will at least know who to poke about it
[13:26] <popey> nik90: https://launchpad.net/~autopilot/+archive/ppa?field.series_filter=precise
[13:26] <mhall119> nik90: you need precise packages?
[13:26] <popey> there's a ppa with a precise build of autopilot
[13:27] <nik90> mhall119: yeah i am using precise for clock app development..my production laptop
[13:27] <nik90> renato asked me to use https://launchpad.net/~phablet-team/+archive/tools ppa where the autopilot was only for q and r
[13:27] <mhall119> nik90: raring is so nice, you should upgrade :)
[13:27] <popey> I disagree. I am keen for people to develop on 12.04
[13:27] <mhall119> raring is still nice :)
[13:27] <nik90> mhall119: I have 15 ppa on my system :P... the upgrade might not go that smooth
[13:28] <popey> nik90: give that ppa a go, and let me know if it works
[13:29] <popey> also..
[13:29] <popey> alan@deep-thought:/etc/apt/sources.list.d$ ls -l *.list | wc -l
[13:29] <popey> 76
[13:29] <popey> :D
[13:30] <nik90> popey: holy shit...that many ppa
[13:30] <popey> I should have a clean out
[13:30] <mhall119> 24
[13:31] <nik90> so when u guys go over to the newer release..do you upgrade or clean install?
[13:31] <mhall119> upgrade, but I believe it disables PPAs automatically before doing the upgrade
[13:31] <popey> i upgrade
[13:31] <mhall119> so most of mine, and probably most of popey's, aren't active
[13:31] <nik90> ah ok
[13:31] <popey> they are, the inactive ones are .list.save
[13:32] <nik90> popey: I will try out the ppa u linked...but do I install autopilot or libautopilot-qt or both of them?
[13:32] <popey> oh, many commented out, I should clear up.. job for later
[13:32] <popey> python-autopilot i believe
[13:32] <popey> ah hang on
[13:32] <popey> https://launchpad.net/~phablet-team/+archive/tools has the version modified to work with qt?
[13:33] <mhall119> popey: find /etc/apt/sources.list.d/ -name "*.list" |xargs grep -v '^#' |grep -v 'deb-src' |wc -l
[13:33] <mhall119> I get 8
[13:33] <popey> so the one in the autopilot ppa won't have that I suspect
[13:33] <nik90> not sure...I was asked to install that by renato..so I assume they work with qt
[13:33] <ckpringle> nik90: mhall119 popey video - it's what my iPhone made :(
[13:34] <popey> ckpringle: using vine?
[13:34] <mhall119> iphones...
[13:34]  * popey ♥  his iphone
[13:34] <nik90> ckpringle: in all honesty, I do not know why people had trouble playing your videos .. it worked fine for me on firefox
[13:34] <mhall119> nik90: so how are you finding the core-apps development work? I see you've been doing a lot of stuff with the Clock app
[13:35] <popey> bah, it works now, ignore me ckpringle ☻
[13:35] <nik90> mhall119: it is really fun to talk to other people, get opinions and improve your code .. nice experience
[13:36] <nik90> ckpringle: ooh by the way, I wont be able to make it to the design meeting tomorrow..I actually have an exam tommorw
[13:36] <ckpringle> popey: yeah vine
[13:36] <mhall119> it's certainly been a new experience, we've never organized teams and projects like this before
[13:36] <ckpringle> nik90: oh no! We could rearrange?
[13:36] <nik90> ckpringle: would u be up for friday same time?
[13:37] <nik90> mhall119: the best part is that the core apps started from scratch which made it so much easier for me to join and contribute..I learnt quite a bit of qml through this process
[13:38] <mhall119> nik90: so you're new to QML as well?
[13:39] <nik90> mhall119: yup :)
[13:39] <mhall119> what do you think of it?
[13:39] <mhall119> I know I've had to change the way I approach GUI coding
[13:40] <nik90> it seems easier to work it and also much easier to draw the gui elements compared to stuff like gtk..but I still am discovering more of its advantages
[13:41] <nik90> also I like that you can combine javascript to do the logic part which is nice as well
[13:41] <mhall119> yeah, I'm getting advice on my blog posts about easier ways to do thingss
[13:41] <nik90> yeah I saw ur posts..very informative for new users like me
[13:41] <mhall119> I'm so used to having to be explicit about every little thing
[13:41] <sergiusens> popey: mhall119 nik90 there are to versions of autopilot dangling
[13:41] <sergiusens> one that is compatible with unity
[13:41] <sergiusens> another one that is touch friendly
[13:42] <sergiusens> autopilot 1.3 should merge all these changes, but there will be _some_ breakage
[13:43] <popey> sergiusens: will it be backported to 12.04?
[13:43] <sergiusens> popey: according to thomi, no... we backported to quantal ourselves
[13:43] <popey> we use autopilot for desktop testing, that needs to carry on working
[13:45] <nik90> is there a easy way to copy your ssh-id authentication keys from 12.04 to a new ubuntu install?
[13:46] <nik90> I actually triple boot (windows, 12.04, 13.04) ...so if I can copy my launchpad keys over to 13.04, I would like that
[13:46] <popey> yeah, just copy the ~/.ssh folder
[13:46] <popey> but I generally make new ssh keys for new machines so if one machine is compromised/lost I can disable that single key
[13:47] <popey> (doesn't apply for dual booting I guess)
[13:47] <nik90> popey: and branching code from launchpad and all other developement stuff should just work..I will give that a try then
[13:49] <mhall119> behold the power of config files
[13:49] <nik90> mhall119: :)
[13:54] <WebbyIT> hi popey! Today I signed the CLA,but some days ago I did some bugfix that were included in trunk. mhall119 said me to wrote you, but you didn't answer me. Can I assume that everything is all right? (sorry for poor english)
[13:54] <popey> oh, not seen that.. lets see
[13:54] <popey> WebbyIT: did you mail my canonical address?
[13:55] <WebbyIT> popey: yes, i did. I'm Riccardo Padovani
[13:55] <WebbyIT> popey: is a forward of an email with object "Re: Calculator application"
[13:55] <popey> ah, found it, thanks
[13:55] <popey> one moment
[13:57] <mhall119> hi WebbyIT
[13:57] <popey> WebbyIT: just checking the CLA
[13:58] <WebbyIT> popey: my launchpad's profile is https://launchpad.net/~rpadovani
[13:58] <WebbyIT> (if you need it)
[13:58] <popey> WebbyIT: thanks, just checking with our administrators that your CLA application has been processed
[13:58] <mhall119> popey: he's in the LP tema
[13:59] <mhall119> team
[13:59] <popey> you're in https://launchpad.net/~contributor-agreement-canonical so that implies yes
[13:59] <WebbyIT> so, is it all ok? :)
[13:59] <popey> not sure about back-dating contributions. I mean, given you've now signed it, and we have that email it should be fine, but I'm not a lawyer ☻
[14:00] <mhall119> popey: yeah, I would think that the email saying the previous contributions can be considered as being done under the CLA would be enough
[14:00] <cyphermox> sergiusens: care to join #ubuntu-unity to discuss the stack updates with us?
[14:01] <popey> mhall119: WebbyIT I'll get a confirmation though
[14:01] <WebbyIT> popey, mhall119, ok, i'm here. If you need more time, you have my email ;)
[14:01] <WebbyIT> thanks guys
[14:03] <mhall119> thank you WebbyIT
[14:04] <mhall119> and with that, another clinic hour comes to a close, thanks everybody who came
[14:04] <mhall119> we'll all still be around here of course, so you can ask questions any time
[14:05] <P3T3> popey, mhall119 Hi, can anybody explain what changed in compilation from MWC demo to daily builds? I am stuck with HP Touchpad. It boots in BlackScreen with daily builds
[14:05] <popey> P3T3: do you know at what point it broke?
[14:06] <mhall119> yeah, kind of a lot has changed
[14:06] <P3T3> popey, not exactly, but MWC boots in GUI while daily finishes in black
[14:07] <P3T3> I am trying it on HP Touchpad also with Toshiba AC100, both of them finishes in black
[14:08] <popey> i have a bunch of old images if you want to try an older one
[14:08] <popey> alan@deep-thought:~/Downloads/phablet-flash$ du -hs .
[14:08] <popey> 15G	.
[14:08] <christina> nik90, ckpringle and i could make friday if it works better for you
[14:08] <popey> http://paste.ubuntu.com/5695477/
[14:09] <christina> popey, ^ any chance we can rearrange tomorrow's to friday so nik90 can join us? thanks!
[14:09] <nik90> christina: friday is fine with me..(any time)..I can send an email to everyone if ckpringle is alrite with the change
[14:10] <popey> christina: sure, you guys agree a time and I'll move it
[14:10] <popey> actually, dpm owns that meeting, he will need to move it I think
[14:10] <popey> but I'm sure he'd be delighted to move it for you
[14:10] <christina> nik90, ckpringle and i are fine with this. what time do you suggest? perhaps dpm can help us move this meeting.
[14:10] <christina> popey, thanks
[14:11] <popey> i have a bunch of meetings on friday, don't block on me not being there
[14:11] <popey> mhall119: how about "collection" for the ppa?
[14:11] <mhall119> popey: works for me
[14:11] <popey> win, done
[14:12] <P3T3> popey, can you share some early daily to me?
[14:12] <nik90> christina: thnx.
[14:12] <popey> P3T3: sure..
[14:13] <christina> nik90, shall we say 12.30 london time? (Im not sure what time it means for you..let me know if it's too early/too late)
[14:13] <popey> i think 90 was the mwc build number (that right ogra_)?
[14:14] <nik90> christina: yeah that is fine with me..it will be 13:30 on my side
[14:14] <christina> nik90, great! 12.30pm it is then.
[14:14] <nik90> c u there :)
[14:14] <christina> dpm, can you help us move the clock app meeting from tomorrow to friday 12.30pm for this week only? thanks
[14:14] <christina> nik90, yep we will see you then
[14:15] <lecrs> do we have a stable release by now?
[14:15] <popey> 12:30 BST, 11:30 UTC?
[14:15] <popey> lecrs: define "stable" ☻
[14:15] <lecrs> some non dev one
[14:15] <popey> P3T3: uploading the earliest build I have
[14:16] <popey> lecrs: no, we only have dev builds right now
[14:16] <lecrs> thank you
[14:16] <ogra_> popey, 68
[14:16] <ogra_> oh, mwc
[14:16] <P3T3> popey, OK I will wait
[14:16] <ogra_> popey, mwc was 95
[14:16] <P3T3> mhall119, is anywhere list of changes to look in?
[14:17] <P3T3> mhall119, changes from MWC to daily
[14:18] <popey> mhall119: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-touch-coreapps-drivers/+archive/collection
[14:19] <dpm> christina, sure
[14:21] <mhall119> popey: \o/
[14:21] <mhall119> popey: do we want to start pushing stuff in there, or ask upstreams first, or announce it and wait for upstreams to come to us?
[14:21] <popey> "yes"
[14:21] <mhall119> I'm +1 for grabbing what we find and pushing it in, personally
[14:22] <mhall119> ok :)
[14:22] <popey> i am keen on us packaging what we find, and letting people know we did it
[14:22] <popey> "people" as in the developers
[14:22] <mhall119> ok
[14:23] <popey> be good to have a wiki page with a list of candidates?
[14:23] <popey> we can crowdsource people letting us know about them
[14:23] <popey> which can be developers or random users who see stuff on their social network
[14:23] <mhall119> that would work, I have a few lists from previous blog posts to start with
[14:24] <popey> mhall119: can you make the first stab at the list on the wiki? and we'll promote and tidy as we go
[14:25] <mhall119> sure
[14:25] <popey> Touch/Collection perhaps
[14:25] <popey> i.e. not under CoreApps anywhere
[14:25] <christina> dpm, thanks
[14:26] <popey> we should craft a disclaimer for both the wiki and the ppa description "May eat your kittens and cause your device battery to die" etc
[14:27] <_NerdyMe_> hi there, how will the permissions be handled? I mean, if the app needs access to the contacts-directory, does the user has to allow the permissions for it first? so at the end will there be a api for that?
[14:30] <dpm> christina, popey, updated the clock meeting time, you should have received a notification
[14:34] <P3T3> popey, I have to go, can you mail link to build to pb@P3T3.org ?
[14:35] <popey> P3T3: http://people.canonical.com/~alan/phablet/8/ it will be there eventually
[14:42] <P3T3> popey, thank you, will check later
[14:42] <P3T3> Bye
[14:50] <mpt> awe, hi, did you see my questions about 3G and 4G yesterday?
[14:50] <mterry> jhodapp, hello!  I've got a merge dealing with some more gles2/gl nonsense.   Can you point me to who the best person to review it would be?  I'd like a quick turnaround on it if possible.  https://code.launchpad.net/~mterry/platform-api/gles/+merge/158128
[14:51] <jhodapp> mterry, I'd say loicm or ricmm is your best bet
[14:52] <awe> mpt, don't think so?
[14:52] <mterry> loicm, ricmm ^ I'd like to know if this is a good solution to the problem, and if not, what else might be
[14:52] <awe> I'm just finishing up a PRD review on messaging, then have a stand-up
[14:52] <awe> mpt, I can ping you when I wrap up
[14:52] <mpt> ok
[14:52] <_NerdyMe_> hello, permission to contracts-directory are handled how? will there be an API soon? (asked that before but internet connection went down.)
[14:57] <jhodapp> mterry, sorry I was thinking it was qtubuntu...ricmm is definitely your guy and if he can't, he'll recommend who else can review that for you
[14:57] <ogra_> _NerdyMe_, there will, but its not done yet
[15:20] <cyphermox> sergiusens: do we have an image almost ready to be usable as raring? :D
[15:21] <ogra_> cyphermox, only without networking ...
[15:21] <ogra_> afaik
[15:21] <ogra_> its on cdimage
[15:23] <sergiusens> ogra_: cyphermox: networking should be working soon
[15:23] <sergiusens> cyphermox: reviewing an MR for it right now
[15:23] <cyphermox> ok
[15:23] <cyphermox> what was wrong with networking?
[15:23] <sergiusens> cyphermox: I got this written up to make it easy: http://sergiusens.github.io/posts/using-phablet-tools-to-install-raring-image.html
[15:24] <cyphermox> cool, thanks
[15:24] <cyphermox> for now I won't need it, I did the dance to build hud on quantal
[15:24] <sergiusens> cyphermox: this is the MR, but basically udev: https://code.launchpad.net/~phablet-team/phablet-extras/network-manager-raring/+merge/158002
[15:24] <cyphermox> ok
[15:25] <cyphermox> interesting
[15:25] <cyphermox> ok, I'll try to figure out a way to flatten this in a way that things might magically work properly
[15:26] <sergiusens> rsalveti: I got my github password and email reset :-) with .netrc I get more API requests
[15:27] <rsalveti> sergiusens: haha, cool
[15:28] <rsalveti> ev: I suppose the apport issue is related with the ubuntu-desktop image, right?
[15:28] <rsalveti> might be something android changed at the kernel
[15:29] <ogra_> rsalveti, nope, its touch
[15:29] <ogra_> and indeed it is android changes :)
[15:29] <rsalveti> cool, didn't know we're trying apport there already
[15:29] <rsalveti> easier for me to test
[15:30] <ogra_> i was wondering if you knew which
[15:30] <rsalveti> need to check
[15:30] <rsalveti> ev: have a bug in hands?
[15:30] <rsalveti> cyphermox: the udev issue will be gone once we have a proper container or doing the flip
[15:30] <rsalveti> cyphermox: so it's a temporary fix
[15:31] <ogra_> "doing the flip" ... sounds like a dance :)
[15:31] <rsalveti> cyphermox: the only thing we need to take a better look is the disabling of p2p and policykit
[15:31] <rsalveti> ogra_: :-)
[15:31] <cyphermox> ok
[15:31] <cyphermox> ok, bbl
[15:33] <ev> rsalveti: nope, but I can create one :)
[15:33] <ev> rsalveti: what LP project?
[15:33] <ogra_> haha
[15:33] <ogra_> thats the trick question :)
[15:34] <rsalveti> ev: https://launchpad.net/touch-preview-images should work
[15:34] <ogra_> ev, try the topic pne
[15:34] <ogra_> *one
[15:34] <rsalveti> yeah
[15:34] <ogra_> hopefully that will soon just be "ubuntu"
[15:34] <rsalveti> ev: feel free to assign me to that
[15:34] <ev> oops :)
[15:34] <rsalveti> ogra_: yup
[15:37] <ev> rsalveti: https://bugs.launchpad.net/touch-preview-images/+bug/1167415
[15:37] <ev> ah, will do
[15:38] <rsalveti> ev: thanks
[15:52] <sergiusens> ogra_: I have image testing going on in our jenkins instance... but I'm consuming it post build from jenkins itself as you would
[15:52] <sergiusens> ogra_: do I really need to go to cdimage.../pending?
[15:52] <ogra_> sergiusens, not until we move to the actual cdimage stuff
[15:52] <ogra_> (i'd say)
[15:53] <plars> ogra_, sergiusens: when is that likely to happen?
[15:53] <ogra_> currently its still my shell script doing the mirroring
[15:53] <sergiusens> ogra_: then we can be good if you parse the test results bfore doing the sync?
[15:53] <ogra_> plars, i hope by end of the week i have at least the android builds working
[15:53] <plars> ogra_: I got a reply from IS saying that they think the firewall rules are fixed now, if you have an ssh key set up already, it might be good to test that it works (from my jenkins server it still seems to be blocked)
[15:53] <ogra_> plars, for the rootfs side i guess we will keep that on jenkins until S
[15:53] <plars> ok
[15:54] <sergiusens> ogra_: way further than S, lots of opens still live in a PPA
[15:54] <ogra_> i.e. until we can fully build from the archive
[15:54] <ogra_> sergiusens, that should change with S opening, no ?
[15:54] <ogra_> sergiusens, can you give me the urls to parse the results ?
[15:54] <sergiusens> ogra_: not entirely yet...
[15:55] <sergiusens> ogra_: sure, gave them last week... but it's not ready yet, autopilot is sort of broken
[15:55] <ogra_> well, then give them once you are ready :)
[15:55] <ogra_> i'll see what i can do
[15:56] <ogra_> plars, that wont affect you yet since currently i'm polling to cdimage with a script ... its not integrated in the stuff you do with cjwatson
[15:56] <sergiusens> ogra_: ok, it's the same build job though, but with /job/ubuntu-touch-image/lastCompletedBuild/aggregatedTestReport/
[15:56] <ogra_> ah. k, thanks
[15:56] <sergiusens> ogra_: plars I'm sort of lost with the targets here though (as in objectives)
[15:57] <ogra_> plars, our model wont need pending/
[15:57] <plars> ogra_: right, but if you eventually want it to test the image in pending, and then tell it to move it from pending to current when it passes smoke tests, you'll want this. I thought that was one of the goals here
[15:57] <ogra_> sergiusens, plars and colin work on a model that takes the created images from cdimage (pending/) then does a test in the lab and moves them to current/
[15:58] <awe> mpt, ping
[15:58] <ogra_> plars, yes but only after we actually build on cdimage
[15:58] <sergiusens> ogra_: should probably merge into the same team then... or sync up more often
[15:58] <ogra_> plars, today the whole build happens in jenkins as well as the tests ... i can just not pull if they failed
[15:59] <ogra_> sergiusens, on my side the plars/colin model will just work by the day we move the builds  ... on your side you should provide plars the tests
[16:00] <ogra_> but there is no hurry ... as i said S is earliest for these builds
[16:00] <ogra_> as long as we dont use the same infrastructure it wont matter much
[16:02] <ogra_> (pulling something to "pending" if we already know its not working doesnt make any sense ... so my script will just pull to current as it does now, after verifying teh tests were successfull)
[16:02] <sergiusens> ogra_: sounds good
[16:02] <ogra_> builds on cdimage actually get spit into pending first
[16:02] <ogra_> so they need to be pulled into jenkins and then become "current" after the tests
[16:03] <sergiusens> plars: anyways, autopilot is sort of failing today on the images... need to fix some code in there
[16:03] <tdcroz> Morning, I just got ubuntu touch installed on tf101 and now looking for help to set up a user account for me
[16:04] <plars> sergiusens: would still like to get those smoke tests running here too
[16:04] <plars> or at least some set of them
[16:04] <sergiusens> plars: sure
[16:04] <plars> sergiusens: what all devices are you running on at the moment?
[16:05] <sergiusens> plars: maguro
[16:06] <plars> sergiusens: I don't have any mantas, but I have grouper and mako we could be running on
[16:06] <ogra_> no maguro ?
[16:07] <plars> ogra_: I have maguro too, yes
[16:12] <sergiusens> rsalveti: just sent you an email
[16:19] <rsalveti> sergiusens: cool, will check later today, thanks!
[16:25] <jairo> alguien que sepa instalar el touch en milestone 3
[16:25] <jairo> o xt860
[16:25] <ogra_> jairo, try english :)
[16:26] <jairo> i need help, ive tried to install on milestone 3 or xt860
[16:33] <sergiusens> rsalveti: just approve ;-)
[16:33] <sergiusens> no trust these days :-P
[16:33] <sergiusens> lol
[16:34] <ogra_> what ? not even among brazilians ?
[16:34] <rsalveti> sergiusens: lol, want to test :P
[16:35] <HelenaKitty> Hello I want to know where the screen calibration and touch sensativity settings are please.
[16:35] <sergiusens> rsalveti: you should, I don't even trust myself :-)
[16:35] <sergiusens> rsalveti: anyways, I tested with breakfast mako and breakfast n7000
[16:36] <sergiusens> rsalveti: I did remove the prior mako entries from the manifest as well
[16:36] <rsalveti> sergiusens: cool
[16:37] <rsalveti> sergiusens: guess we need a patch for that as well, right?
[16:37] <rsalveti> at the android.git
[16:37] <ogra_> HelenaKitty, i think that part lives in the android layer
[16:37] <HelenaKitty> After a bit of use Ubuntu loses touch sensativity and I want to have a go at fixing it
[16:37] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: No?
[16:37] <HelenaKitty> I don't have Android
[16:38] <ogra_> if you use ubuntu touch you do
[16:38] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: Explain?
[16:38] <ogra_> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch
[16:38] <HelenaKitty> okies
[16:38] <ogra_> HelenaKitty, i assume you talk about the ubuntu desktop image for the nexus7 then
[16:39] <ogra_> if so, that would be Bug 1068994
[16:40] <ogra_> that bug seems to affect all xorg based touch installs
[16:41] <ogra_> (which ubuntu touch isnt)
[16:46] <sergiusens> rsalveti: one step at a time
[16:46] <sergiusens> rsalveti: but yes
[16:46] <rsalveti> sergiusens: :-)
[16:46] <sergiusens> rsalveti: it does no harm it it' there though
[16:47] <bobweaver> Hello there I have ubuntu touch running on a virtual machine and am trying to tie it into qtcreator all the ssh tests come back a fine meaning that it can connect to virtual machine. But It will not deploy wondering if anyone has had any luck with something like that
[16:49] <bobweaver> maybe shared folders ? I am going to try that
[16:52] <HelenaKitty> ogra_?
[16:52] <HelenaKitty> That says nothing about android
[16:52] <HelenaKitty> that just says about using it on android compatible devices. :/
[16:53] <ogra_> HelenaKitty, Ubuntu Touch (which this channel is for) is based on a minimal android ...
[16:53] <ogra_> HelenaKitty, but since you say your issue is not on ubuntu touch i figured thatt you might hit bug 1068994
[16:54] <ogra_> (which is known to appear on xorg based ubuntu like the nexus7 ubuntu desktop image we also provide atm)
[16:54] <aquarius> how am I meant to use Tabs so that the content of a Tab does not appear *underneath* the header bar??
[16:54] <aquarius> annoying. :(
[16:59] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: So if it's the android kernel...
[16:59] <HelenaKitty> that means that keyboard isn't part of gnome/unity, right?
[16:59] <ogra_> keyboard ?
[16:59] <HelenaKitty> yeah
[16:59] <HelenaKitty> onscreen beyboard
[16:59] <ogra_> didnt you talk about touch ?
[16:59] <ogra_> ah
[17:00] <ogra_> so what do you have installed over there ?
[17:00] <ogra_> what image on which device
[17:00] <HelenaKitty> er...
[17:00] <ogra_> (lets clearify that first, its hard to support someone without knowing that)
[17:00] <HelenaKitty> raring 12 image on the Nexus 7
[17:00] <ogra_> ah
[17:00] <HelenaKitty> It's just I want to use a different WM
[17:00] <ogra_> so the keyboard is "onboard"
[17:01] <HelenaKitty> yes
[17:01] <ogra_> its the default accessibility kbd shipped with ubuntu
[17:01] <HelenaKitty> :(
[17:01] <ogra_> why :(
[17:01] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: Will it work with other WMs?
[17:01] <ogra_> you can use it under any WM you like
[17:01] <ogra_> sure
[17:01] <HelenaKitty> :o
[17:05] <ogra_> HelenaKitty, it needs some gnome infrastructure like dconf to store its settings, make sure to not remove that
[17:05] <HelenaKitty> hmm
[17:05] <HelenaKitty> either way...
[17:06] <HelenaKitty> I lauched i3
[17:06] <HelenaKitty> and the keyboard didn't come up :/
[17:06] <HelenaKitty> but...
[17:06] <ogra_> you need to put it in the startup scripts of your wm indeed
[17:06] <HelenaKitty> sensativity on i3 is a LOT better and smoother
[17:06] <HelenaKitty> oh
[17:06] <ogra_> it doesnt launch on its own (not even in gnome) :)
[17:07] <bobweaver> yeah it is not shared folders I also checked to make sure that the ports where open and forward'ed. Not sure if this can even be done but would be cool
[17:07] <HelenaKitty> Once I have this working my next task is to safely remove gnome/unity :/
[17:07] <HelenaKitty> damn
[17:07] <ogra_> bobweaver, what exactly are you running as VM over there ?
[17:08] <HelenaKitty> and it feels like the keyboard isn't part of gnome ogra_
[17:08] <HelenaKitty> even that has better touch sensativity than gnome
[17:08] <ogra_> HelenaKitty, you mean onboard ?
[17:08] <bobweaver> Hey ogra_  like this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wzNFCmIFyJw      btw hope that you are having a good day !
[17:08] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: Yes
[17:09] <HelenaKitty> if I say keyboard in this channel EVER!
[17:09] <ogra_> onboard is just a python app
[17:09] <HelenaKitty> I mean onboard :3
[17:09] <HelenaKitty> oh :o
[17:09] <ogra_> but it uses gsettings/dconf to store its settings
[17:09] <ogra_> so that part of gnome needs to stay installed if you want to use it
[17:10] <HelenaKitty> :/
[17:10] <HelenaKitty> damn
[17:10] <ogra_> (its just a tiny part, dont worry)
[17:10] <ogra_> bobweaver, always ! :)
[17:10] <HelenaKitty> I'm Googling and can't even find out how to use this dconf thing
[17:10] <HelenaKitty> I found a gnome page but it isn't helping
[17:10] <HelenaKitty> Wait...
[17:10] <HelenaKitty> documentation
[17:10] <HelenaKitty> aaaah
[17:11] <ogra_> bobweaver, lol. the background sound is funny ...
[17:11] <bobweaver> ogra_, I know right that is my fan going crazy !
[17:11]  * ogra_ is working with arm devices since ages ... havent heard a fan around me for some time 
[17:11] <bobweaver> lol
[17:11] <ogra_> i was just checking my chromebook when the video started
[17:11] <ogra_> :)
[17:11] <HelenaKitty> :o
[17:12] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: I found gsettings but I can't find out how to use it for er...
[17:12] <HelenaKitty> xsession
[17:12] <bobweaver> I guess one of the main reasons that I want to do it this way (VM ) is because I am sick of not beeing able to play simpsons  touch on n7
[17:13] <ogra_> you dont, onboard will take care itself
[17:13] <bobweaver> HelenaKitty,  you are using dconf-settings ?
[17:13] <ogra_> just make sure onboard gets started in your xsession
[17:13] <Robin_Watts> ogra: My A305 had a fan. So did my A310. And my A440/1. Any my A5000. And my A7000+. And my RISC PC. And my Netwinder. And my DNARD...
[17:13] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: Well it hasn't taken care of itself
[17:13] <ogra_> bobweaver,  ubuntu desktop image on the nexus7
[17:13] <HelenaKitty> wait...
[17:13] <HelenaKitty> I just but gsettings command into xsession ?
[17:13] <ogra_> no
[17:13] <ogra_> onboard
[17:14] <HelenaKitty> it's not a command
[17:14] <bobweaver> ogra_,  cygwin I think with touch chroot but could be wrong a about that
[17:14] <HelenaKitty> oh it is
[17:14] <HelenaKitty> nvm
[17:14] <ogra_> :)
[17:14] <HelenaKitty> thanks!
[17:14] <ogra_> bobweaver, ah, so you omit the android layer ?
[17:14] <ogra_> Robin_Watts, well, my SGIs all have fans too ... that doesnt mean i run them often :)
[17:15] <HelenaKitty> Oooooh come on gnome!
[17:15] <HelenaKitty> respond pls :(
[17:15] <HelenaKitty> :(((
[17:15] <bobweaver> Not sure what that means ogra_   on my nexus 7 I have a x11 12.04 version with my hacked up unity 2d then internal then Ubuntu touch then raring desktop multi boot
[17:15] <bobweaver> ogra_,  ^^
[17:15] <ogra_> mlankhorst, do you know if someone still actively works on bug 1068994
[17:16] <bobweaver> But I also have Ubuntu touch running in a 12.10 x11 version of Ubuntu
[17:16] <ogra_> bobweaver, ah, well, we are looking for a real VM solution where we can also run the android layer ... i was wondering if you had found something like that
[17:17] <ogra_> that will soon stop working
[17:17] <ogra_> since UTouch will switch to MIr
[17:17] <ogra_> (before the desktop does)
[17:17] <bobweaver> ogra_,  yeah just make cgwin and add it you can use img in creating but davik or whatever it is called is a b&*%(#
[17:17] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: The onboard keyboard still doesn't come up :/
[17:17] <HelenaKitty> it never comes up by default anyway
[17:18] <bobweaver> ogra_,  if you want to try something like that try necessitia
[17:18] <ogra_> weird, i definitely have used it under openbox on the very forst image (before we added the desktop to it)
[17:18] <davmor2> ogra_: kvm set to arm?
[17:18] <HelenaKitty> O.o
[17:18] <ogra_> bobweaver, well, i need something from the archive :) or at least something i can put there
[17:19] <ogra_> davmor2, kvm x86 with an x86 android layer was my idea
[17:19] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: I put the onboard command into the ~/.xsession file
[17:19] <HelenaKitty> logged out
[17:19] <HelenaKitty> logged into i3
[17:19] <ogra_> can you see it in the processlist ?
[17:19] <HelenaKitty> I can't get a processlist up ogra_
[17:19] <bobweaver> ogra_,  try this and see what you think it is android but there is no port to qt5 (stable) if you want qt5 look at zephyer that is qt5 on wayland
[17:19] <ogra_> it probably runs but i3 doesnt give the right info to it
[17:19] <HelenaKitty> the WM is complately dependant on a keyboard
[17:20] <ogra_> install openssh and log in via ssh
[17:20] <davmor2> ogra_: hmmm yeah I forget you still need the underlying android stuff
[17:20] <mlankhorst> ogra_: xserver bug?
[17:20] <mhall119> aquarius: I noticed that about tabs headers too
[17:20] <ogra_> bobweaver, thats not a VM :)
[17:20] <mhall119> not sure how you're supposed to position content
[17:20] <mhall119> but I gather anchors.fill: parent isn't it
[17:20] <ogra_> bobweaver, we want to emulate the hardware and possibly also sensors etc
[17:20] <aquarius> mhall119, aha, sussed it
[17:20] <ogra_> mlankhorst, xinput bug
[17:21] <aquarius> mhall119, a Tab must contain a Page
[17:21] <aquarius> as page
[17:21] <mhall119> what?
[17:21] <mhall119> I thought a Tab *was* a Page
[17:21] <aquarius> so don't do Tab { page: LlistView {} }
[17:21] <ogra_> bobweaver, zephyr will just give me a graphical emu
[17:21] <mhall119> oh, a page property?
[17:21] <davmor2> ogra_: Has anyone tried android on an arm vm or lxc
[17:21] <aquarius> do Tab { page: Page { ListView { } } }
[17:21] <mhall119> makes no sense at all
[17:21] <aquarius> and then put anchors.fill on the ListView so it fills the Page.
[17:21] <bobweaver> ogra_,  so necessita uses adk and ndk and a tool chain that has been ported then when installing to client it uses minestro to look to see if libs (qt) are installed if so app runs if not it it grabs from repo it is android emulator
[17:21] <mhall119> well, ok, it kind of does
[17:22] <ogra_> davmor2, not yet, i got it on my TODO but am stuck on some other tasks
[17:22] <mlankhorst> ogra_: all the patches from https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=56578 should fix it
[17:22] <bobweaver> mhall119,  use a loader
[17:22] <mhall119> but it kind of doesn't
[17:22] <aquarius> it does not. I ahve just complained at bzoltan1's team about this :) Page is what takes care of avoiding the header.
[17:22] <mhall119> aquarius: then it should be baked-in to Tab
[17:22] <ogra_> mlankhorst, right, i was just wondering if we will get the fix in before final
[17:22] <mhall119> imo
[17:22] <HelenaKitty> Oh come on
[17:22] <HelenaKitty> :(
[17:22] <aquarius> mhall119, I agree :)
[17:22] <ogra_> mlankhorst, since else the nexus7 desktop image gets unusable
[17:22] <mlankhorst> ogra_: not likely, just get it from S since sru takes ages..
[17:22] <mhall119> bobweaver: loader?
[17:23] <ogra_> mlankhorst, then we will have to kill that image :(
[17:23] <ogra_> mlankhorst, i'm only talking about raring
[17:23] <mlankhorst> or push the sru admins quickly, it's not that hard to fix :P
[17:23] <bobweaver> mhall119,  http://pastebin.com/rE9kqGy7
[17:23] <ogra_> we cant release without working input
[17:23] <ogra_> its a touch based image
[17:24] <mlankhorst> I can cook you a patched xserver
[17:24] <ogra_> so SRUs wont happen if the image is gone before release ...
[17:24] <ogra_> i thought timo was working on it
[17:24] <mhall119> bobweaver: are you talking about in general, or for my app specifically?
[17:24] <ogra_> but it got quiet around that bug
[17:24] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: Shouldn't onboard be set up like a service?
[17:24] <HelenaKitty> init script or something?
[17:24] <ogra_> nope
[17:24] <mlankhorst> ogra_: well the current series was only reported to work on 1.14
[17:25] <ogra_> for which we dotn have tegra X11 drivers
[17:25] <bobweaver> mhall119,  pm tell me what you are trying to do (if you like)
[17:25] <ogra_> which is the only reason we stayed oon 1.13
[17:25] <mlankhorst> ironic, eh?
[17:25] <ogra_> yeah, quite
[17:25] <mhall119> bobweaver: the issue aquarius and I had was that if you don't use Page as the only child of Tab, then your content will fall below the Header
[17:26] <bobweaver> mhall119,  take a look at paste the anchors take care of that
[17:27] <bobweaver> If I get what you are saying
[17:27] <aquarius> nah. YOu're not supposed to use anchors for this
[17:27] <aquarius> Page takes care of avoiding the header by magic
[17:27] <aquarius> I just got shouted at for using anchors to try and do the magic myself ;)
[17:27] <bobweaver> aquarius,  read Page.qml
[17:28] <mlankhorst> ogra_: we could do a custom 1.13 once we figure out why 1.13 was crashing
[17:28] <ogra_> HelenaKitty, onboard is just an app you run from the startup scripts of your desktop ... it listens to input focus events from the WM, it could well be that i3 doesnt use the standards here
[17:28] <HelenaKitty> oh
[17:28] <ogra_> mlankhorst, so heeping the image around but tell people to pull another xserver after install ?
[17:29] <aquarius> bobweaver, yeah, I talked to timp. You need to do Tabs { Tab { title: "tab1"; page: Page { ListView { anchors.fill:parent } } } }
[17:29] <ogra_> HelenaKitty, install openbox and try with that ... also first switch to gnome and enable the "floating button" option in the onboard settings
[17:29] <bobweaver> aquarius,  / mhall119  so it is when you use Page under  Tab{ page: Page{}}  that it is messy ?
[17:30] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: How the hell do you configure gnome when the damn DE doesn't respond to touch?
[17:30] <mhall119> bobweaver: just tedious, really
[17:30] <mlankhorst> ogra_: or make the image with the custom xserve
[17:30] <bobweaver> aquarius,  wont that fill the full parent aka Tabs ?
[17:30] <aquarius> that is: a Tab must have a Page set as "page". The Page can then have whatever children you want, which should fill the Page. Then the header stuff all works properly.
[17:30] <mhall119> if you *always* need a Page inside a Tab, it should do that for you
[17:30] <aquarius> bobweaver, no, it won't -- the parent of the ListView is the Page.
[17:30] <ogra_> mlankhorst, its an official image, no PPAs allowed
[17:30] <aquarius> I agree with mhall119 that since you *always* have to put the page in, then that's stupid and Tab should do it for you :)
[17:30] <ogra_> has to be done by the user
[17:30] <bobweaver> aquarius, gotcha
[17:31] <ogra_> HelenaKitty, well, it does respond for me ... it just freezes after a while here
[17:31] <HelenaKitty> Okies
[17:31] <ogra_> is it completely frozen for you right after start ?
[17:31] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: It does after a bit of use
[17:32] <ogra_> (and how did you install i3 then )
[17:32] <HelenaKitty> you could only get seconds out of it
[17:32] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: with a terminal
[17:32] <bobweaver> aquarius,  I also noticed thhat there was a change in the sdk like a week ago that made it so I could not just do  Tab{page: MyElenmet{}}   docs should be up dated
[17:32] <HelenaKitty> and struggle
[17:32] <ogra_> yeah, that should be enough to fiddle with the onboard options
[17:32] <aquarius> bobweaver, the docs are updated...but the website is not showing the updated docs, yet.
[17:32] <ogra_> the floating button helps a lot
[17:33] <ogra_> HelenaKitty, we are talking about the default unity desktop, right ?
[17:33] <mlankhorst> ogra_: well I'll try to look at backporting
[17:33] <HelenaKitty> yep
[17:33]  * ogra_ hugs mlankhorst 
[17:33] <mlankhorst> boo btw, just upgraded to ubuntu touch
[17:33] <HelenaKitty> I can't restart the X service :/
[17:33] <ogra_> from the commandline ?
[17:33] <HelenaKitty> yep
[17:33] <HelenaKitty> from SSH
[17:33] <ogra_> sudo service lightdm restart
[17:34] <HelenaKitty> oh
[17:34] <ogra_> you dont restart X ... you restart the login manager
[17:34] <ogra_> (which is the one starting X actually)
[17:35] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: Even on openbox onboard doesn't pop up
[17:35] <HelenaKitty> cat ~/.xsession
[17:35] <HelenaKitty> yep I see it
[17:35] <ogra_> it should pop up as soon as there is something to type in ...
[17:35] <HelenaKitty> xinitrc is deprecated
[17:35] <ogra_> i.e. a terminal that has the focus
[17:35] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: I need it to always be up
[17:35] <HelenaKitty> (if possible)
[17:36] <ogra_> that can be adjusted in the settings
[17:36] <HelenaKitty> well...
[17:36] <HelenaKitty> okies
[17:36] <ogra_> but for that you need to trigger it to come up at least once
[17:36] <HelenaKitty> Oh come on
[17:36] <ogra_> so put xterm into your xsession
[17:36] <bobweaver> aquarius,  I just tried that and 1 out of 4 times that I switch tabs it kills the app (crash's) Do you know workaround ?
[17:36] <ogra_> and tap it so it gets the focus
[17:36] <HelenaKitty> no manual page for onboard
[17:36] <ogra_> (or better gnome-terminal)
[17:37] <HelenaKitty> I google onboard gnome and find nothing of any use
[17:37] <ogra_> yeah, its badly documented
[17:37] <HelenaKitty> What?!
[17:37] <ogra_> onboard
[17:37] <aquarius> bobweaver, I do not :(
[17:37]  * HelenaKitty hates it when cool stuff is badly documented
[17:37] <HelenaKitty> it's always the cool stuff :/
[17:37] <HelenaKitty> Whyyy WHYYYY WHY! :(
[17:37] <aquarius> bobweaver, also, by definition, a crash is a bug that needs fixing :(
[17:38] <netcurli> bobweaver: do you have a webview in one of your tabs?
[17:38] <ogra_> well, the onboard devs surely would love contributions ;)
[17:38] <bobweaver> aquarius,  then back to anchors for me :P
[17:38] <bobweaver> netcurli, nope
[17:38] <HelenaKitty> lol
[17:38] <bobweaver> it is alpha code I will post it
[17:39] <mlankhorst> because cool stuff becomes boring when it works? :)
[17:40] <HelenaKitty> xsession doesn't seem to work
[17:40] <HelenaKitty> not even a terminal will start
[17:40] <ogra_> openbox ?
[17:40] <HelenaKitty> is it .xsession or .xsessionrc ?
[17:40] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: Yes
[17:41] <ogra_> HelenaKitty, ~/.config/openbox/autostart ... add bith there
[17:41] <ogra_> *both
[17:41] <bobweaver> netcurli,  and aquarius  both of the 1st 2 branchs do that. the weather one has webview in it though https://code.launchpad.net/~josephjamesmills
[17:41] <ogra_> with & for backgrounding
[17:41] <bobweaver> lp:~josephjamesmills/+junk/myth-remote
[17:41] <bobweaver> lp:~josephjamesmills/+junk/ubuntu-weather-sdk
[17:43] <sergiusens> rsalveti: I'm applying your patches
[17:43] <HelenaKitty> Okies that worked
[17:43] <HelenaKitty> but no keyboard
[17:44] <ogra_> even if the terminal gets focus ?
[17:44] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: Yep
[17:44] <t1mp> bobweaver, aquarius there is a bug for webviews inside Tabs https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-ui-toolkit/+bug/1124065
[17:44] <ogra_> did you use gnome-terminal ?
[17:44] <HelenaKitty> no
[17:44] <HelenaKitty> I used terminator
[17:44] <ogra_> try that then
[17:44] <ogra_> oh
[17:44] <mterry> robru, you have a work item for daily-release of qtvideo-node.  Is that lp:qtubuntu-camera/qtvideonode?
[17:45] <mterry> (i.e. source package qtvideonode-plugin)
[17:45] <t1mp> bobweaver, aquarius feel free to add information or solutions there. Hopefully I can work on it next week.
[17:45] <ogra_> HelenaKitty, another missing bit might be gnome-settings-daemon ...
[17:45] <bobweaver> thanks t1mp  you can also seeing it work great on pure android here lp:~josephjamesmills/+junk/ubuntu-weather-sdk-pure-android
[17:45] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: Crazy, right?
[17:45] <HelenaKitty> oh
[17:45] <ogra_> try if that changes anything
[17:46] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: That's a daemon
[17:46] <ogra_> (start it before onboard)
[17:46] <t1mp> bobweaver: what do you  mean? you run te ubuntu sdk and your app on android, not ubuntu?
[17:46] <aquarius> hmph. In this new world order of having to have a Page in a Tab and then put my actual thing inside the Page, it's hard to find my actual thing by walking the tree. tabs.selectedTab.page.children[2] works, but that's horrid
[17:46] <bobweaver> t1mp,  it is port to necessitia
[17:46] <aquarius> and I don't know how to give a name to a child element :(
[17:46] <HelenaKitty> That worked ogra_
[17:47] <aquarius> t1mp, if you've got any ideas on that, that'd be handy :)
[17:47] <HelenaKitty> OMFG!
[17:47] <bobweaver> needs adk ndk and gcc armel
[17:47] <HelenaKitty> this is soo much better than gnome :D
[17:47] <HelenaKitty> and unity
[17:47] <HelenaKitty> and kde
[17:47] <bobweaver> aquarius,  you an not make a varient property ?
[17:47] <t1mp> bobweaver: oh that's cool. Does necessitas have its own qml component library, or is the ubuntu sdk ported to that?
[17:48] <bobweaver> I added some of it t1mp  you can compile I am working on backport to qt4
[17:48] <HelenaKitty> Thank you very much!
[17:48] <bobweaver> Ubuntushape ect
[17:48] <ogra_> :)
[17:48] <aquarius> bobweaver, the problem is this: how do I name a child? For example, imagine... Rectangle { id: top; Rectangle { id: interior } }. How do I get a reference to "interior" without saying "interior"? top.children[0] hsould work, but that'll screw up if I add other children later.
[17:48] <bobweaver> that is not in that branch though
[17:48] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: I knew it was gnome/unity at fault
[17:48] <HelenaKitty> with the touch thing
[17:49] <HelenaKitty> Now to get this working in i3
[17:49] <t1mp> aquarius: I'm reading the backlog, but I don't see what's the problem exactly. Can you repeat it for me?
[17:49] <bobweaver> aquarius,  so you want a dynamic id ?
[17:50] <ogra_> HelenaKitty, good luck :)
[17:50] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: I have to say...
[17:50] <HelenaKitty> my tablet is faster than my netbook
[17:50] <ogra_> haha
[17:50] <HelenaKitty> wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy faster
[17:50] <ogra_> the tegra is an awesome thing, yeah
[17:51] <t1mp> HelenaKitty: my tablet is faster than my ultrabook ;p
[17:51] <aquarius> t1mp, when we were talking earlier about how a Toolbar Action can reference "the current tab", I can use tabs.selectedTab. But I want to get at my widget inside the Page inside the Tab. So... Tabs{ Tab{ page: Page{ MyThingy{} } } } ... how do I get MyThingy? tabs.selectedTab.page.$SOMETHING. All I can think of is tabs.selectedTab.page.children[0] but that's horrid and will break if I add other children
[17:51] <bobweaver> property string childID interior.id       Rectangle { id: top; Rectangle { id: parent.childID } }     then make it  then call in other file ?
[17:51] <ogra_> t1mp, inteal is soo dead :) but people never belive me ...
[17:51] <bobweaver> aquarius,  ^^
[17:52] <ogra_> *intel even
[17:52] <t1mp> aquarius: you can give MyThingy an id
[17:53] <aquarius> t1mp, ya, but I can't use its ID... because what I want is "the MyThingy which is in the selectedTab". Not "this one specific MyTHingy always"
[17:54] <t1mp> Page { property alias myThingyId: mythingy; MyThingy{ id: mythingy } }
[17:54] <t1mp> add a myThingyId to each of the Pages?
[17:54] <t1mp> maybe that helps, but I don't know the full structure of your app
[17:54] <aquarius> I can alias to an Item?
[17:54] <t1mp> yes
[17:54] <aquarius> I tjought I could only alias to a property of an item
[17:54] <aquarius> right
[17:54] <aquarius> that's fine then
[17:54] <aquarius> thank you :)
[17:55] <HelenaKitty> fml
[17:55] <t1mp> hmm.. at least I think you can. You made me doubt now
[17:55] <t1mp> I think you can :)
[17:55] <mterry> robru, what's this about qtvideo-node being arm-only?  <- jhodapp, did you mention that at one point?
[17:55] <HelenaKitty> Oh come on
[17:55] <jhodapp> mterry, yes
[17:56] <t1mp> aquarius: ahh.. maybe not. but you can say property Item myThingyId: mythingy
[17:56] <t1mp> I was confused
[17:56] <aquarius> nope! it works fine!
[17:56] <aquarius> smart
[17:56] <jhodapp> mterry, robru filed a bug
[17:57] <aquarius> property alias thingy: myThingyId; MyThingy { id: myThingyId }
[17:57] <mterry> jhodapp, OK, the plan is to make it all arch right?
[17:57] <aquarius> sweet.
[17:57] <aquarius> I have learned a new thing.
[17:57] <jhodapp> mterry, eventually
[17:57] <mterry> jhodapp, what's so arm-specific about it?
[17:57] <nik90> mzanetti: ping
[17:57] <jhodapp> mterry, your patch from today will help, but there are a few things that blow up on amd64 right now (pointer casts, etc)
[17:58] <jhodapp> mterry, won't even successfully compile on amd64 atm
[17:58] <ds500ss> it is possible to build CM 10.1 jellybean for 'nozmomi' with the original AOSP code? https://github.com/sonyxperiadev/device-sony-lt26
[17:58] <mzanetti> nik90: pong
[17:59] <nik90> mzanetti: I saw your comment in the MP https://code.launchpad.net/~renatofilho/ubuntu-clock-app/autopilot/+merge/157982
[17:59] <mterry> jhodapp, hm, yeah I see an error about GL_TEXTURE_EXTERNAL_OES
[17:59] <nik90> mzanetti: will autopilot-qt5 work the same as libautopilot-qt5?
[17:59] <jhodapp> mterry, yeah, same thing happens with qtubuntu-media and qtubuntu-camera
[17:59] <mzanetti> nik90: yes. the main difference is that the old one consisted of 2 packages: autopilot-qt4 and autopilot-qt5
[17:59] <mterry> jhodapp, -media should work
[18:00] <mterry> jhodapp, it compiles on all three arches
[18:00] <jhodapp> mterry, you've tried it?
[18:00] <mzanetti> nik90: libautopilot-qt works for both qt versions
[18:00] <nik90> mzanetti: in the case that something goes wrong, I can always ppa-purge it , rite?
[18:00] <mzanetti> nik90: however, after I posted I've seen that there is actually a libautopilot-qt build for precise. you might want to try that one as well
[18:00] <mterry> jhodapp, yeah.  ppa:ubuntu-unity/daily-build-next has it building on amd64 and armhf; it only fails on i386 because of those header include issues
[18:00] <mzanetti> nik90: yeah. the packages should not harm your systems
[18:01] <jhodapp> mterry, yeah...ok
[18:01] <nik90> mzanetti: in the same ppa link you pasted in the MP?
[18:01] <mzanetti> nik90: yeah
[18:02] <mterry> jhodapp, except of course that it depends on qtvideonode-plugin, which is only on armhf.  this also stops mediaplayer-app from working on non-armhf
[18:02] <mzanetti> nik90: everything autopilot should be in there
[18:02] <nik90> mzanetti: I do see a libautopilot-qt version 0.6+bzr39.. is that the package u are referring to?
[18:03] <mzanetti> nik90: yes (dunno any version numbers out of my head)
[18:03] <jhodapp> mterry, interesting...actually to fix that it should rely on qtubuntu-media or qgstreamer as a package dependency...qtubuntu-media is useless when not on an Android-based ARM target
[18:03] <nik90> mzanetti: thnx for the backport to precise.. will give it a shot
[18:03] <nik90> and let u know
[18:04] <mterry> jhodapp, is the abstraction choice supposed to be at the app level or the qtubuntu-media level?
[18:04] <mhall119> popey: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Collection
[18:04] <jhodapp> mterry, but my ultimate goal (that I'm working towards now) is to get rid of qtubuntu-media and only need qgstreamer.
[18:04] <mhall119> pmcgowan: ^^ might interest you too
[18:05] <jhodapp> mterry, and then the abstraction would happen at the GStreamer level
[18:05] <mterry> jhodapp, cool
[18:08] <mzanetti> mhall119: should I add my apps in there?
[18:08] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: damn
[18:08] <HelenaKitty> Idk how to get the keyboard onscreen at all times :/
[18:08] <mhall119> mzanetti: yes please
[18:08] <pmcgowan> mhall119: nice, you can add my PPA and call packaging done
[18:08] <ogra_> HelenaKitty, did you enable the floating button ?
[18:08] <mhall119> mzanetti: give me one minute, I'm making an edit
[18:09] <ogra_> that should at least give you an on/off switch thats always there
[18:09] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: How do I do that from the terminal?
[18:09] <mhall119> pmcgowan: awesome, thanks
[18:09] <ogra_> HelenaKitty, you do it  in onboard ... it has a settings button somewhere
[18:09] <ogra_> that should pop up the settings
[18:11] <aquarius> mneh. how do I set the width of a DefaultSheet? :(
[18:11] <nik90> mzanetti: I added the ppa, however on trying to install autopilot, it says "unable to locate autopilot"
[18:11] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: Well I can't find it :/
[18:12] <mzanetti> nik90: have you tried apt-cache search?
[18:12] <ogra_> HelenaKitty, there is a modifier key on the right somewhere
[18:12] <netcurli> aquarius: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-ui-toolkit/+bug/1158569
[18:12] <ogra_> that should get you to another key layout
[18:12] <netcurli> use contentsWidth
[18:13] <nik90> mzanetti: tried it now, it shows 3 results, which are python-autopilot, autopilot-phablet and libautopilot-qt
[18:13] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: Alt Gr?
[18:13] <ogra_> no
[18:13] <nik90> mzanetti: I am guessing i need to install autopilot-phablet and libautopilot-qt
[18:13] <HelenaKitty> :/
[18:13] <ogra_> on the very right
[18:13] <mzanetti> nik90: exactly
[18:13] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: yeah and blue buttons come up
[18:13] <HelenaKitty> Onboard Home
[18:13] <HelenaKitty> Example
[18:13] <ogra_> right
[18:13] <HelenaKitty> and the rest are just dashes
[18:13] <HelenaKitty> I know
[18:13] <ogra_> there should also be one with an icon
[18:13] <HelenaKitty> that is on the very right
[18:14] <ogra_> with a wrench and screwdriver iirc
[18:14] <HelenaKitty> nope
[18:14] <HelenaKitty> nothing like that there
[18:14] <mhall119> mzanetti: all done, you can add yours now
[18:14]  * ogra_ hasnt used onboard in quite a while 
[18:14] <ogra_> there is ... for sure
[18:14] <mzanetti> mhall119: cheers
[18:14] <ogra_> tap around a bit :) might be another modifier level
[18:15] <nik90> mzanetti: Unresolvable packages http://paste.ubuntu.com/5696164/
[18:16] <HelenaKitty> Does anyone know how to use onboard?
[18:16] <mzanetti> nik90: yeah... thats what I feared...
[18:16] <aquarius> good call netcurli. I have affects-me'd the bug, although it's a dup of a private bug that I can't see :)
[18:16] <nik90> mzanetti: I will try to work on it on 13.04 then..no worries
[18:17] <mzanetti> nik90: ok thanks.
[18:17] <HelenaKitty> This is annoying
[18:19] <mhall119> aquarius: it doesn't take over the full width like Dialog?
[18:20] <aquarius> mhall119, it takes over slightly *more* than the full width. Usefully. That's what netcurli's bug is about :)
[18:21] <mzanetti> mhall119: done
[18:22] <mhall119> aquarius: ah, that does seem suboptimal
[18:24] <mhall119> kenvandine: http://askubuntu.com/questions/279971/how-to-add-support-for-new-services-to-friends
[18:25] <aquarius> kenvandine, also, lp:~sil/friends-app/popover-post :-)
[18:25] <aquarius> friends-app with mentions! yay! I bet kenvandine rejects it :)
[18:27] <mhall119> aquarius: robru just last week rejected an MP I sent in 2010
[18:27] <paullenovo> Can I run Ubuntu touch on my Lenovo X230 Tablet?
[18:27] <mhall119> so I'm betting kenvandine ignores it until he re-writes Gwibber in Go
[18:27] <mhall119> paullenovo: technically yes, usably not yet
[18:28] <ogra_> paullenovo, if https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices has it ... else you would have to port it yourself https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Porting
[18:28] <mhall119> ogra_: I believe the x230 is an x86 convertable laptop
[18:28] <ogra_> oh, wait, thats intel ?
[18:28] <paullenovo> How bad would it be?
[18:28] <ogra_> yeah, no intel yet
[18:28] <paullenovo> Yea, intel
[18:28] <mhall119> paullenovo: you'll really want to run Unity Next, once it's in a usable state
[18:29] <paullenovo> hmmmm Unity Next?
[18:29] <mhall119> that's the merging of Ubuntu Touch's Unity with the more traditional desktop Unity
[18:29] <paullenovo> Ok
[18:30] <robru> mhall119, not a bad bet. we are suffering through the worst part of jwz's CADT model at this point...
[18:30] <ogra_> heh
[18:30] <ogra_> jwz leaves his marks everywhere
[18:30] <mhall119> robru: which part isn't a bad bet, the ignoring, or the Go re-write?
[18:30] <robru> mhall119, all of it ;-)
[18:31] <ogra_> (i thought he stopped coding beyond doing screensavers)
[18:31] <robru> mhall119, just kidding. I think the new thing is really solid, well tested, and we can be responsive to bugs. I'm not sure why ken let patches languish for years, but I'm hoping to not let that happen again.
[18:33] <mhall119> in fairness to ken, my patches were probably pretty amateur
[18:33] <robru> mhall119, nahhhh... there were like trivial one-line patches that fixed important things that ken also ignored. I forward-ported those ones.
[18:34] <robru> (dpm had a one-line patch that fixed translations, had to forward-port it because the file had been renamed)
[18:36] <aquarius> hey, robru, is there something on a StreamModel so I can see whether it's still loading or not?
[18:37] <pmcgowan> bfiller: rsalveti who is doing the weekly update? I think we are overdue
[18:38] <robru> aquarius, ehh... still loading what? like when you first connect to it? or like after you do a refresh? there is a 'notify::synchronized' gobject signal that you can connect to in order to be notified after you're initially connected... otherwise, most methods offer async callbacks when various operations complete.
[18:38] <bfiller> pmcgowan: not sure, thought you were making a schedule to rotate it?
[18:38] <aquarius> robru, in QML, I mean. I'd like to display an ActivityIndicator while the StreamModel is in the process of populating itself
[18:38] <pmcgowan> bfiller: I was afraid you'd say that
[18:39] <bfiller> pmcgowan: :)
[18:39] <pmcgowan> I am now
[18:39] <aquarius> robru, notofy::synchronized is a signal on the deemodel, but I don't think it's exposed to QML as a property?
[18:39] <bfiller> pmcgowan: I can do this week if you promise to make a schedule :)
[18:39] <pmcgowan> deal!
[18:39] <robru> aquarius, probably not. ken wrote qml-friends, I don't know much about what we're exposing into Qml.
[18:40] <aquarius> yeah, kenvandine said "use synchronized" ;)
[18:40] <mpt> Accounts settings design done: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/OnlineAccounts#phone-settings
[18:40] <aquarius> but I can't see how that can be exposed, purely because you aren't allowed to name a QML property "notify::synchronized" ;-)
[18:43] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: Is there no tegra 3 for Ubuntu? :o
[18:43] <ogra_> HelenaKitty, how do you mean ?
[18:44] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: Well the graphics like to garble up, right?
[18:44] <ogra_> they should work fine
[18:44] <ogra_> at least under unity
[18:44] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: nope
[18:44] <HelenaKitty> they garble up
[18:44] <ogra_> no idea about other desktops
[18:44] <ogra_> how ?
[18:45] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: I don't see how it's the desktop!
[18:45] <HelenaKitty> Lots of white spaces scattering everywhere
[18:45] <ogra_> in unity ?
[18:45] <HelenaKitty> nope
[18:45] <HelenaKitty> in i3
[18:45] <ogra_> that must be new ...
[18:45] <ogra_> ah
[18:45] <HelenaKitty> like I said...
[18:45] <HelenaKitty> How is it the desktop?
[18:45] <ogra_> no idea, i never used i3 ...
[18:46] <ogra_> it definitely works under unity ... or it did at least
[18:46] <bobweaver> Hello there I want to killall unity and replace with metacity then run unity-next on desktop  I have it all compiled and am just having troubles with putting the command together. Host is VM oso no droping to tty. But this is what I tried       killall compiz && killall compiz && meatacity --replace && ./run     but it says that there is eindow manager open Oo thanks for your help
[18:46] <bobweaver> or mutter would be cool
[18:46] <bobweaver> or mir
[18:46] <ogra_> i doubt many actually check that image ... and we might even drop it if there is no fix for the xorg input bug
[18:46] <HelenaKitty> :/
[18:46] <ogra_> given that everything is focusing on UbuntuTouch now
[18:46] <HelenaKitty> DONT DROP IT!
[18:47] <HelenaKitty> Nexus 7 is a very nice tablet
[18:47] <HelenaKitty> :/
[18:47] <ogra_> yes, and UbuntuTouch supports it by default
[18:47] <HelenaKitty> If it gets dropped I will hate Ubuntu more than I already do.
[18:47] <ogra_> the desktop image was a temporary thing to get the apps  tested in context of a tablet
[18:48] <ogra_> i wanted to keep it for 13.04 at least, but if the bug doesnt get fixed that makes not much sense
[18:48] <slangasek> ogra_: what is this bug?
[18:48] <mlankhorst> https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=56578
[18:48] <ogra_> after 13.04 we will most likely have to drop it simply because there is nobody who would fix any bugs
[18:49] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: What is being dropped?
[18:49] <kenvandine> aquarius, do you get onSynchronizedChanged?
[18:49] <HelenaKitty> ubuntu touch?
[18:49] <kenvandine> that was just my guess :)
[18:49] <ogra_> slangasek, bug 1068994
[18:49] <seb128> ogra_, slangasek: it's not likely we will be able to keep a normal desktop running on armhf just after raring anyway
[18:49] <kenvandine> mpt, yay!  designs for UOA
[18:49] <slangasek> seb128: why?
[18:49] <seb128> well "normal desktop" being unity-compiz
[18:49] <ogra_> seb128, yeah, but i didnt want to put off poeple using the image so at least an unsupported release for 13.04 would be nice
[18:50] <ogra_> seb128, and we will still need an armhf image to test the apps
[18:50] <mlankhorst> ok setting up xserver, building from nfs will be fun
[18:50] <ogra_> you want to be able to try libreoffice still
[18:50] <mpt> kenvandine, are you implementing it?
[18:50] <ogra_> and other bits
[18:50] <ogra_> so a desktop image is definitely still needed
[18:50] <kenvandine> mpt, no :)
[18:50] <kenvandine> but i've been anxious for it
[18:51] <aquarius> kenvandine, interestingly, onSynchronizedChanged exists (becuase it doesn't throw an error) but it never fires... and it can't fire anyway, because you can't have a property called "synchronized", because synchronized is a reserved keyword, I think ;)
[18:51] <seb128> slangasek, ogra_: I was discussing that today with didrocks, quite some indicators and components (e.g bamf, hud) are not compatible with both desktop and ubuntu touch
[18:51] <kenvandine> i've been working on signon-ui for touch though
[18:51] <slangasek> seb128: and how is this an armhf issue?
[18:51] <kenvandine> aquarius, ah!
[18:51] <seb128> slangasek, ogra_: so it seems the current approach to be able to build ubuntu-touch from the archive is to enable the "touch" codepath on armhg
[18:51] <ogra_> seb128, then we can switch to xubuntu or something for that image ... but we need a desktop to test desktop apps on
[18:51] <slangasek> hmm
[18:51] <seb128> armhf
[18:51] <kenvandine> mpt, but we couldn't get to far with it or the qml bindings until we had designs
[18:52] <seb128> ogra_, slangasek: which will break the standard desktop
[18:52] <ogra_> seb128, i'm sure you dont want to fly blind
[18:52] <ogra_> you need something to test applications on
[18:52] <ogra_> and fixes/bugs etc
[18:52] <seb128> ogra_, sure, xorg will still run, it's just indicators and stuff will start breaking
[18:52] <seb128> so it will not be a fully functional image
[18:52] <ogra_> right, as i said, we can switch to a flavour desktop
[18:53] <seb128> or we need to define another strategy
[18:53] <slangasek> seb128: I would appreciate if we could have a public discussion about this on ubuntu-devel, so that everyone's on the same page wrt what's being rendered incompatible and why
[18:53] <ogra_> ++
[18:53] <seb128> +1 as well
[18:53] <seb128> the issue just started surface with hud2 landing
[18:53] <seb128> they rely on a bamf that is incompatible with the current desktop unity
[18:53] <ogra_> alternatively we could have a touch image with XMir
[18:54] <ogra_> if thats already far enough
[18:54] <seb128> so we can't land phablet apps, that use hud2
[18:54] <slangasek> ogra_: it's not; I'm told xmir is still several months out
[18:54] <seb128> it's not
[18:54] <slangasek> it's not critical path for the phone
[18:54] <ogra_> yeah, thought so
[18:54] <seb128> and that will not solve the issue of e.g bamf or hud being incompatible
[18:54] <seb128> same for indicators
[18:54] <seb128> atm we have "forked" versions of ubuntu-touch
[18:55] <ogra_> and how do you solve that on x86 desktop ?
[18:55] <seb128> those are going to be merged back
[18:55] <seb128> but atm they are no co-installable
[18:55] <seb128> ogra_, solve what?
[18:55] <ogra_> i dont see why the arch matters here
[18:55] <ogra_> well, the x86 desktop image will persist, wont it ?
[18:55] <seb128> atm we made the assumption i386,amd64=unity-compiz ; armhf=unity-touch
[18:56] <ogra_> ARGH !
[18:56] <seb128> that's not for R
[18:56] <ogra_> in the archive ?!?!
[18:56] <seb128> yes
[18:56] <seb128> different build time options
[18:56] <ogra_> oh my god !
[18:56] <seb128> until we properly converge
[18:56] <seb128> well, that's early thinking and not raring material
[18:56] <seb128> ogra_, if you have other suggestions, you are welcome
[18:57] <ogra_> we are talking about S here
[18:57] <seb128> the plan B was "don't build ubuntu-touch images from the archive until the codebases properly converge"
[18:57] <ogra_> raring is done
[18:57] <seb128> but that could be some months off
[18:57] <seb128> so what do we do early S?
[18:57] <seb128> keep "forked" versions in a ppa
[18:57] <ogra_> no
[18:57] <seb128> and keep building ubuntu-touch from that?
[18:58] <rsalveti> bfiller: will you cover this week then?
[18:58] <rsalveti> for the weekly updates
[18:58] <bfiller> rsalveti: yup
[18:58] <ogra_> that in package decision seems so wrong though
[18:58] <seb128> there is not so much decisions
[18:58] <rsalveti> bfiller: cool, thanks
[18:58] <seb128> we can't break the current desktop on i386/amd64
[18:58] <ogra_> have two differently named packages ...
[18:58] <ogra_> its very easy
[18:58] <seb128> co-installable?
[18:58] <ogra_> and do a transition once you can merge the codebase
[18:58] <seb128> like change all the paths, etc
[18:59] <seb128> have NEW sources in to drop them in a few weeks/months?
[18:59] <ogra_> have them conflict until the merge
[18:59] <seb128> it's a waste of efforts
[18:59] <seb128> well, have them conflict
[18:59] <seb128> how is that different from "have different builds flags"?
[18:59] <seb128> you are basically saying that ubuntu-touch will depends on the second source
[18:59] <ogra_> you still have working desktops ?
[19:00] <ogra_> yeah
[19:00] <seb128> do we need working indicators?
[19:00] <ogra_> no prob with that
[19:00] <seb128> it might be easier to claim desktop to be xubuntu...
[19:00] <ogra_> we already have a completely separate seed exactly for this
[19:00] <ogra_> we created it with exactly the difference in mind
[19:00] <seb128> well, it just means duplicate quite some sources
[19:00] <seb128> and making code changes to use different paths
[19:00] <slangasek> seb128: for my part, I have to wonder why these codebases can't be converged right now and be ready to go by the end of the month
[19:01] <seb128> slangasek, because they are on different techs
[19:01] <ogra_> why do we have a separate seed and meta at all then
[19:01] <seb128> it's going to take some time to converge them
[19:01] <ogra_> if ubuntu-desktop  is one thing on one arch and something completely different on the other anyway
[19:01] <mhall119> seb128: you're not busy this month are you? :)
[19:01] <seb128> slangasek, like the touch indicators speak a different protocol which is not understood by the compiz unity
[19:02] <slangasek> hmm
[19:02] <ogra_> seb128, it also means to me that my chromebook (and many others out there) is trash
[19:02] <ogra_> unless i stop using unity
[19:02] <seb128> mhall119, you know me, I'm a slacker ;-)
[19:03] <seb128> ogra_, slangasek: I'm not claiming any made decision anyway, I'm just saying it's not going to be easy to build ubuntu and ubuntu-touch from the same packages before a while
[19:04] <seb128> the touch image "forked" quite come component in a way which is incompatible with the compiz unity
[19:04] <slangasek> seb128: well, if you can lay out the details on -devel, that would help us understand the landscape here and what options we have for S
[19:05] <slangasek> I have assumed up to now based on other discussions that we would continue carrying desktop images for Panda for validation until Xmir lands
[19:05] <seb128> slangasek, will do, I need to sync with didrocks about specific technical details
[19:05] <slangasek> we should work out whether that's still the right call, and if so muster some resources to help you make this possible... and if not, figure out what our fallback is (and let people off the hook for maintaining Panda desktop hardware support that we won't use)
[19:07] <seb128> slangasek, did we commit to build ubuntu-touch from the ubuntu archive by some date and when is that?
[19:07] <mhall119> mzanetti: I see your apps are for Meego/Maemo, do they run on Ubuntu Touch too?
[19:07] <mzanetti> mhall119: GetMeWheels is fully ported, just not published yet because QtLocation crashes on our phone
[19:07] <seb128> slangasek, we could keep building from a ppa, containing the forked versions of the components that didn't converge, until ready
[19:07] <seb128> slangasek, but I'm not sure how long the "ready" is going to take
[19:08] <seb128> it's not going to be before summer
[19:08] <mzanetti> mhall119: Xbmcremote is 90% ported. I'm waiting for the design of the official music player to give it some consistency
[19:08] <mhall119> ok
[19:08] <slangasek> seb128: I am not happy at all about building Ubuntu Touch from a ppa, even in raring
[19:08] <mhall119> mzanetti: I'd love to see screenshots of them running with the Ubuntu SDK
[19:08] <mzanetti> mhall119: let me find the urls
[19:08] <slangasek> seb128: I understand there are incompatible changes that prevent us from syncing it in without disrupting stuff - I'm just saying that I'm not happy that it's in a ppa instead of the archive
[19:09] <mzanetti> mhall119: http://notyetthere.org/data/xbmcremote/screenshots/
[19:09] <seb128> slangasek, nobody is happy about it, but reality is that they took shortcuts to build the demos and it's going to take some time to clean that debt
[19:09] <mzanetti> mhall119: http://notyetthere.org/data/getmewheels_ubuntu.png
[19:09] <slangasek> seb128: so I don't know if we have a "committment" of any kind, but I think we *should* be building Touch from the archive as soon as S opens
[19:09] <slangasek> seb128: maybe you could throw some of the cleanup work our direction?
[19:09] <ogra_> slangasek, i heard that cant happen
[19:10] <mhall119> mzanetti: thanks!
[19:10] <ogra_> things like NM seem to have incompatible changes in them
[19:10] <ogra_> and other stuff
[19:10] <ogra_> so there will be packjages that seem to be planned to stay in PPAs
[19:10] <seb128> slangasek, we need to line a clear roadmap of what needs to happen to get there, I will try to get that done and posted to ubuntu-devel this week
[19:10] <slangasek> ogra_: nack, those things MUST be cleaned up so they can be integrated into the archive
[19:10] <seb128> slangasek, then we can see how we make things happen sooner rather than later
[19:10] <ogra_> slangasek, my words exactly :)
[19:11] <slangasek> seb128: thanks very much :)
[19:11] <ogra_> slangasek, i'm just the messenger
[19:11] <seb128> yw
[19:11] <seb128> ogra_, nothing was "planned to stay in the ppa"
[19:11] <seb128> but the first shortcut we were thinking about is to build the new codebase on armhf
[19:11] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: I'm playing a video in ubuntu touch :3
[19:11] <HelenaKitty> with LXDE it's a charm!
[19:11] <mzanetti> mhall119: and here's a video of playmee http://ubuntuone.com/3E17r8E45xefxXYunriiB7
[19:11] <slangasek> ogra_: well, the message you delivered was "that can't happen" - I'm saying not only do I not accept that it can't, I don't accept other people *believing* it can't because they should be working to fix the delta ;)
[19:11] <seb128> so making armhf the ubuntu-touch version (and breaking the normal desktop on it)
[19:12] <seb128> slangasek, we are working to fix the delta, we just say it's going to take some time
[19:12] <ogra_> slangasek, i was referring to "when S opens"
[19:12] <bobweaver>  \o/ Finally http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bh7yCVrGhc8
[19:12] <seb128> the question is what we do during this time
[19:13] <slangasek> seb128: well, for my part I think this is a high enough priority that we should consider throwing more resources at it to reduce the time :)
[19:13] <slangasek> like, every package with a delta should have someone responsible for fixing it
[19:13] <slangasek> in parallel
[19:13] <ogra_> +1
[19:13] <seb128> slangasek, I think we are throwing as much resources as we have
[19:13] <labsin> Anybody that can help me with the ValueSelector from Ubuntu.Components.ListItems?
[19:13] <slangasek> seb128: you're not, because you haven't tapped Foundations for it! :)
[19:13] <seb128> well, it's not as easy as "merging delta"
[19:14] <seb128> slangasek, I'm not sure that having foundation learn about gmenumodel and porting gtk code to it is the best use of your resources
[19:14] <seb128> it's going to take some weeks to get up to speed to do those code changes
[19:14] <slangasek> seb128: there are other packages we can help with.  I know mountall, network-manager, libhybris are all still on the "needs work before pushing to archive" list, for instance
[19:15] <ogra_> there are other bits
[19:15] <seb128> slangasek, right
[19:15] <slangasek> but I'm not sure anybody is driving this
[19:15] <slangasek> nobody's talked to me about the requirements for mountall, for instance
[19:15] <sergiusens> slangasek: it's everything in phablet-extras
[19:15] <seb128> slangasek, that's a bit orthogonal to the components I was talking about that are not "converged" yet
[19:16] <seb128> we should have cover mountall&co in https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/client-1303-ubuntu-touch-porting
[19:16] <ali1234> bobweaver: did you get touch UI working in virtualbox with the sdk?!?!?
[19:16] <seb128> the whiteboard says "* mountall: should be discarded based once we have a proper ubuntu/android container model"
[19:16] <ogra_> ali1234, necessitas
[19:16] <bobweaver> ali1234,  yup and it is tied into qtcreator
[19:16] <seb128> " discussion to have in the container discussion (will be fixed with lxc)"
[19:17] <ali1234> ogra_: wat?
[19:17] <bobweaver> ogra_,  that is not true it is unity-next
[19:17] <ogra_> ali1234, http://necessitas.kde.org/
[19:17] <ali1234> necessitas is qt for android
[19:17] <slangasek> seb128: right... who owns the action to finalize that "proper" container model?
[19:17] <bobweaver> not everything is working I had to compile it
[19:17] <ogra_> bobweaver, ah, i thought you said you used that
[19:17] <slangasek> (there's no workitem for it)
[19:17] <sergiusens> seb128: or if the flip happens android<->ubuntu
[19:18] <bobweaver> necessitias uses adk and ndk not virtual box
[19:18] <seb128> I'm trying to find the spec for that...
[19:18] <ali1234> bobweaver: oh it's unity-next? not the phone ui?
[19:18] <seb128> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/client-1303-containers-host-client-ubuntu-android
[19:18] <seb128> ?
[19:18] <bobweaver> it is ubuntu 12.10
[19:18] <ogra_> slangasek, it depends on ChickenCutlass1's outcome of the container model flip
[19:18] <ali1234> ah ok, not quite as exciting..
[19:18] <ali1234> good start though
[19:18] <seb128> right
[19:19] <bobweaver> with unity-next compiled on it  the main point is intergration into qtcreator for the sdk that way devs can test Hud and all that in there apps
[19:19] <seb128> that specs seems to suggest that a first step is ChickenCutlass1 to do investigations
[19:19] <ogra_> right
[19:19] <bobweaver> at this point you can not do that with qmlscence
[19:19] <ogra_> only if we know which container model we use we will know how we deal with it
[19:19] <ChickenCutlass1> seb128: ogra_ working on it
[19:19] <mhall119> bobweaver: that's nice, not being able to test HUD locally is a pain
[19:20] <ChickenCutlass1> seb128: ogra_ almost have Ubuntu booting first
[19:20] <ogra_> ChickenCutlass1, i know :)  slangasek was asking
[19:20] <ogra_> since there are depending workitems that arent actually clear
[19:20] <mhall119> bobweaver: in theory, would this allow writing Ubuntu SDK apps on Windows or Mac?
[19:20] <bobweaver> the VM will now be striped down of all things that are not needed make a stock image and tie that into the (might be better to start from scratch ) but I think that it would be cool if it was shiped in SDK itsself
[19:21] <bobweaver> mhall119,  if it runs VM and also qtcreator
[19:21] <mhall119> bobweaver: awesome
[19:21] <cyphermox> Fwiw I'm not convinced we can't handle at least NM without these patches.. I'll look at NM alongside ofono as soon as I'm done with hud (today)
[19:22] <cyphermox> seb128, slangasek: ^
[19:22] <rsalveti> slangasek: we still need the ppa even for raring, and we now we should be building from the archive asap, but I'm not concerned about the base os
[19:22] <bobweaver> mhall119,  just a VM that is moded like crazy then the code gets pushed to VM. I just think that that is how the SDK kit should work but that is just me
[19:22] <rsalveti> we're still investigating the container model and such
[19:22] <ogra_> rsalveti, we're discussing S
[19:22] <ali1234> well, i can test my desktop apps on my desktop... i can't currently test any phone apps though, that's the problem from my pov
[19:22] <rsalveti> ogra_: these modifications (nm, mountall and such) are all specifics until we define the way to go
[19:22] <mhall119> bobweaver: I'm with you, pmcgowan1 can we incorporate bobweaver's VM integration into our SDK offering?
[19:22] <rsalveti> just answering based on the backlog
[19:22] <ogra_> rsalveti, it isnt clear if we can actually start building images in S even
[19:22] <rsalveti> and I agree that switching to touch for armhf is *wrong*
[19:23] <ogra_> yeah
[19:23] <ogra_> but apparently that dcision is gone
[19:23] <HelenaKitty> ogra_: http://ompldr.org/vaTF6NA
[19:23] <ogra_> *decision
[19:23] <rsalveti> who made that decision?
[19:23] <HelenaKitty> Look at that!
[19:23] <rsalveti> just to understand why
[19:23] <HelenaKitty> no garbled graphics
[19:23] <HelenaKitty> :3
[19:23] <ogra_> rsalveti, desktop
[19:23] <slangasek> it's not decided, just being discussed
[19:23] <rsalveti> makes no sense for me
[19:23] <ogra_> HelenaKitty, great
[19:23] <rsalveti> there are still a lot of things to do to merge the touch things back
[19:23] <HelenaKitty> Yep :D
[19:23] <HelenaKitty> It's awesomes
[19:23] <HelenaKitty> lol
[19:23] <sergiusens> rsalveti: that choice is hud based only, right cyphermox ?
[19:23] <rsalveti> unity-next, hud, platform api and such
[19:23] <bobweaver> mhall119,  I was also thinking about making a adk/ndk viersion but with cgwin and phablet on top then user can pick from menu say Ubuntu touch on android that starts the android emulator or if desktop that starts virtual box or whatever
[19:24] <rsalveti> and for raring we're using the ppa anyway, so don't worry about the archive if the upstream app needs more love still
[19:24] <rsalveti> we are the upstream for most of these components, it's just that there might still take 1-2 months
[19:24] <ali1234> bobweaver: why would you need adk for that?
[19:24] <ogra_> rsalveti, well, we have the choice to not have touch images from the archive (and build armhf as is) or to have the merged code spit out different binaries based on arch
[19:24] <rsalveti> to have everything done right
[19:24] <ali1234> bobweaver: someone told me it would be better to use linaro's qemu
[19:24] <seb128> ogra_, rsalveti: no decision was made
[19:25] <mhall119> bobweaver: is this a QtCreator plugin, or just configurations?
[19:25] <ogra_> seb128, oh, it sounded like
[19:25] <seb128> ogra_, sorry if what I said was confusing
[19:25] <rsalveti> well, for raring we don't need to worry about the archive
[19:25] <slangasek> rsalveti: my concern is whether "not worrying" about the archive means things are being postponed that are going to be on the critical path for archive builds later
[19:25] <bobweaver> ali1234,  for the emulator you would just make a new emulator with custom iso
[19:25] <rsalveti> let's just keep producing the old desktop to avoid breaking panda, chrome and others
[19:25] <ogra_> rsalveti, right
[19:25] <slangasek> rsalveti: I don't want to be halfway through the S cycle and still be building from a ppa
[19:25] <seb128> ogra_, I said that was the first idea on "how to resolve the issue" we had with didrocks when discussing it today
[19:25] <mhall119> ali1234: an emulator in hand is worth two in advice :)
[19:25] <ogra_> ah
[19:25] <slangasek> rsalveti: and today, I'm not confident that we're on track to avoid that
[19:25] <seb128> ogra_, early brainstorming
[19:25] <rsalveti> slangasek: nothing is being postponed, people are working on that stuff
[19:25] <ogra_> seb128, that sounds completely different :)
[19:25] <cyphermox> It's especially relevant for hud, I suggested it knowing it's not a solution but it at least lets me test hud here for now
[19:25] <rsalveti> it's just that it might not be the right time to deal with that, specially for raring
[19:25] <ali1234> bobweaver: so..... why does it need adk/ndk?
[19:26] <ogra_> but probably i wanted to read it like that to have a reason for whining :)
[19:26] <seb128> ogra_, I will make sure we reach ubuntu-devel by the end of the week with the issues we have and the potential option we though about
[19:26] <ogra_> yeah
[19:26] <rsalveti> slangasek: that depends on the component, we got a *lot* to do
[19:26] <cyphermox> Separate packages with separate build rules seems a better option
[19:26] <seb128> cyphermox, so different sources building conflicting binaries?
[19:26] <rsalveti> yup, but still avoiding splitting packages based on arch
[19:27] <ogra_> and then merge by FF
[19:27] <seb128> souces duplications is annoying
[19:27] <ogra_> we have a separate touch seed, so we can easily handle that
[19:27] <seb128> but it might the easiest option meanwhile
[19:27] <seb128> +be
[19:27] <rsalveti> yup
[19:27] <ogra_> ok
[19:28]  * ogra_ goes afk to at least see the rest of that football game ... 
[19:28] <rsalveti> I just think that there's no to rush to push touch related changes at raring atm
[19:28] <seb128> ogra_, enjoy!
[19:28] <rsalveti> only if that helps us somehow once S is open
[19:28] <seb128> rsalveti, oh, raring is done, it's hard frozen
[19:28] <ogra_> i will ... the bavarians dont look good though :)
[19:28] <seb128> rsalveti, we are already on S
[19:28] <sergiusens> rsalveti: well didrocks though differently earlier today
[19:28] <rsalveti> good :-)
[19:28] <cyphermox> seb128, it's a lot of work but I got a handle on it and it might be mostly just for hud...
[19:28] <rsalveti> yeah, we're discussing this at the same time barca is playing against psg :P
[19:28] <sergiusens> rsalveti: well for daily releases at least
[19:29] <seb128> rsalveti, "we are" being "our thinking is"
[19:29] <rsalveti> right
[19:29] <seb128> cyphermox, it's going to be indicators as well
[19:29] <seb128> cyphermox, like indicator-messages
[19:29] <seb128> the touch version and desktop versions are very different
[19:29] <rsalveti> yup
[19:29] <sergiusens> seb128: bfiller told that has a path to resolution though
[19:29] <cyphermox> Ok
[19:29] <rsalveti> slangasek: the desktop related components is what worries me the most
[19:30] <cyphermox> Couldn't the indicators magically figure things out at runtime?
[19:30] <rsalveti> because of bamf, nux and a few other dependencies
[19:30] <seb128> sergiusens, the path is "teach the desktop unity to talk the new protocole, then make indicators build a desktop profile on the new model" I guess?
[19:30] <seb128> cyphermox, we need to make unity-3d speak gmenumodel indicators first
[19:30] <seb128> cyphermox, which isn't the case atm
[19:30] <bfiller> seb128: right
[19:30] <cyphermox> Ie, what kind of hud/unity do I have and what can I do with it
[19:31] <cyphermox> Do we?
[19:31] <seb128> cyphermox, larsu is working on it
[19:31] <bobweaver> ali1234,  we make are vm image right the moded one (ubuntu phablet) http://imagebin.org/253510      we then  add it to are qtcreator for testing  http://imagebin.org/253511  so when we press the run button it fires up the qemu emulator that the android-sdk uses and pushs code to it to test
[19:31] <bfiller> seb128: ubuntu touch indicators already speak it so they are all set
[19:31] <seb128> bfiller, the issue is that if your bring those on the desktop you break unity-3d indicators
[19:31] <seb128> until we teach unity-3d to talk the same protocol
[19:31] <seb128> but that's ongoing work
[19:31] <seb128> so not a lot of discuss
[19:31] <seb128> just a bit of time to get it done
[19:32] <bfiller> seb128: right, except I think the touch indicators are named differently right now so shouldn't conflict? maybe not in all cases
[19:32] <seb128> I think they have conflicting files
[19:32] <seb128> like icons
[19:32] <seb128> but that shouldn't be too hard to resolve
[19:44] <pmcgowan1> mhall119: bobweaver has vm intergation?
[19:46] <mhall119> pmcgowan1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bh7yCVrGhc8
[19:47] <mhall119> using virtualbox, integrated with QtCreator
[19:47] <mhall119> it may not give device-like emulation, but it should enable app development on non-Ubuntu platforms
[19:48] <pmcgowan1> mhall119: I think JP was planning to do exactly that, did he make a plugin
[19:48] <ogra_> pmcgowan1, using the android sdk emulator ...
[19:48] <pmcgowan1> interesting
[19:48] <pmcgowan1> mhall119: lets show it to jppiiroi1en
[19:48] <mhall119> probably too late today for jppiiroi1en
[19:48] <pmcgowan1> yep
[19:48] <mhall119> unless maybe we say his nick a bunch more
[19:49] <pmcgowan1> mhall119: so the collection page is great, is there any plan to package and PPA them all?
[19:50]  * mhall119 emails him
[19:50] <mhall119> pmcgowan1: that's the goal
[19:50] <mhall119> popey made a shiny new PPA for them
[19:50] <pmcgowan1> oh good where at
[19:50] <mhall119> https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-touch-coreapps-drivers/+archive/collection
[19:50] <pmcgowan1> ack
[19:56] <HelenaKitty> I've tried to install flash player to see how well youtube performs but every package and repo I've tried has failed.
[19:56] <HelenaKitty> and claims the package is missing
[19:56] <HelenaKitty> :/
[19:57] <labsin> HelenaKitty: I suppose there's no armhf build for that package.
[19:58] <ali1234> ogra_: he's using virtualbox... not qemu
[19:58] <ali1234> in the video anyway
[19:59] <HelenaKitty> labsin: Why not?
[19:59] <ali1234> wait, never mind
[20:01] <labsin> HelenaKitty: Adabe canceled development for it
[20:01] <labsin> and also for Linux
[20:02] <labsin> The Chrome implementation of it micht work. Will probably come with Chromium.
[20:03] <HelenaKitty> labsin: I know
[20:03] <HelenaKitty> but...
[20:03] <HelenaKitty> I still want to use it!
[20:04] <labsin> Maybe look at Gnash?
[20:04]  * HelenaKitty sighs
[20:04] <HelenaKitty> okies
[20:08] <labsin> HelenaKitty: Have you tried installing Chromium?
[20:09] <HelenaKitty> labsin: That's what I use
[20:13] <HelenaKitty> labsin: How do I use gnash?
[20:13] <HelenaKitty> I installed it but it doesn't work out of the box.
[20:14] <labsin> is it in chrome://plugins (you put that in you're address bar). I just found it when google'ing
[20:14] <HelenaKitty> Okies :3
[20:16] <HelenaKitty> labsin: gnash/flash doesn't show up in there. :/
[21:00] <rsalveti> boiko: testing today's image and the compose option is not available anymore when opening up a contact
[21:00] <rsalveti> boiko: actually, from the log
[21:00] <boiko> rsalveti: you mean clicking a message?
[21:00] <rsalveti> I dialed a number, and wanted later to send a text
[21:01] <rsalveti> but wanted to use the entry available at the conversation view
[21:01] <rsalveti> thought that this was available before
[21:01] <rsalveti> might be wrong
[21:01] <boiko> rsalveti: nope, it wasn't :)
[21:01] <boiko> rsalveti: known but and part of the discussions we are going to have with designers starting this week
[21:01] <rsalveti> the conversation view for an entry only allows 'back'
[21:01] <rsalveti> not even compose
[21:01] <boiko> rsalveti: it never had a compose option
[21:02] <rsalveti> boiko: right, then ok :-)
[21:02] <boiko> rsalveti: but anyway, there was a release today that improved that a bit, but not that far
[21:02] <rsalveti> just wanted to confirm that this was the behavior
[21:02] <rsalveti> quite annoying as I had to enter the number again when composing the message
[21:04] <boiko> rsalveti: yep, it is annoying, and we want to fix that
[21:04] <rsalveti> boiko: cool :-)
[21:05] <kgunn> jasoncwarner_: ping
[21:25] <rsalveti> cyphermox: sergiusens: why do we need https://code.launchpad.net/~mathieu-tl/phablet-tools/bootstrap/+merge/157967 ?
[21:31] <sergiusens> rsalveti: I think it's a tag for the daily release as it constructs a change log from the last bzr revno
[21:31] <sergiusens> rsalveti: so the next daily release will update/generate a changelog good for revno 71+
[21:32] <m3th4n3> Hello everyone!
[21:33] <m3th4n3> I just flashed My Nexus 7 with today's release of Ubuntu touch, but i am stuck with the lock screen and it says i have 14 tweets. the clock works, but nothing else.
[21:38] <HelenaKitty> I can't seem to get any sound. I boot up the device, gets to login screen, hears the login jingle, logs in, the volume control in the LXDE tray is always right down to minimum so I turn it up, still no sound however the tray icon is showing that something somewhere it muted, so I checked alsamixer only to find nothing is muted there and also found that my music player is on full volume, what could the problem be?
[21:38] <HelenaKitty> I would prefer to diagnose my system from a terminal.
[21:52] <bfiller> sergiusens: where do the raring images live on cdimages?
[21:53] <RobbyF> bfiller, http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-touch-preview/daily-preinstalled/current/ at the bottom of the page
[21:53] <RobbyF> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-touch-preview/daily-preinstalled/current/raring-preinstalled-phablet-armhf.zip
[21:53] <bfiller> RobbyF: thanks
[21:54] <HelenaKitty> Guys? I've no sound! O.o
[21:58] <sergiusens> bfiller: yes
[21:58] <sergiusens> bfiller: and you can use the --alternate-settings thing I gave you for autodownlaoding with phablet-tools
[21:59] <bfiller> sergiusens: thanks
[22:04] <cyphermox> rsalveti: it's needed because of daily build, to avoid having the automatic jobs picking up bugs that have already been fixed and marking them as closed by an upload
[22:07] <HelenaKitty> Ooooooooooh
[22:07] <HelenaKitty> academia
[22:07] <HelenaKitty> you can pick me up
[22:07] <HelenaKitty> soon with your love and I need your love
[22:07] <HelenaKitty> *whistlesdownthemic*
[22:07] <HelenaKitty> Guys?
[22:07] <HelenaKitty> Is this #music or...
[22:08] <HelenaKitty> #ubuntu-touch? :o
[22:08] <sergiusens> bfiller: if you want a working network manager I can make some packages available, if not, it will most likely be in the next build
[22:09] <sergiusens> HelenaKitty: what are you running?
[22:10] <HelenaKitty> sergiusens: ?
[22:11] <dassie> How will apps be distributed for the ubuntu phone? Is it gonna be like the apple store where developers have go through some validation process before it gets published? Basically I'm asking whether developers should anticipate their apps being rejected for the same reasons that apple would reject them from their store.
[22:11] <sergiusens> HelenaKitty: well you mention lxde, I don't consider that part of ubuntu-touch... so what are you running? how did you install?
[22:12] <HelenaKitty> ...
[22:12] <HelenaKitty> sergiusens: Dude
[22:12] <HelenaKitty> Ubuntu touch = Ubuntu with Android kernel
[22:12] <HelenaKitty> You use it like you use Ubuntu.
[22:14] <HelenaKitty> Either way I am going back to plain android because I found Ubuntu to be unstable on my device. :/
[22:15] <genii-around> hence "developer preview"
[22:15] <HelenaKitty> genii-around: Well...
[22:15] <HelenaKitty> overall it's nice
[22:15] <HelenaKitty> but...
[22:15] <sergiusens> I wouldn't expect stability with our raring transition either
[22:15] <HelenaKitty> what lets it down is a graphics bug
[22:16] <sergiusens> HelenaKitty: on what device?
[22:16] <HelenaKitty> that's the only thing that let it down
[22:16] <HelenaKitty> sergiusens: Nexus 7
[22:16] <cyphermox> sergiusens: using the desktop nexus 7 image actually
[22:16] <HelenaKitty> It's to do with the Tegra 3
[22:16] <sergiusens> cyphermox: oh, yeah, I don't consider that ubuntu-touch :-)
[22:16] <HelenaKitty> It is tho
[22:17] <HelenaKitty> like I said...
[22:17] <HelenaKitty> Ubuntu Touch = Ubuntu with Android kernel
[22:17] <sergiusens> HelenaKitty: it's much more than that today, so no
[22:17] <HelenaKitty> sergiusens: ?
[22:18] <sergiusens> Ubuntu Touch ~= Ubuntu + Android HAL
[22:18] <HelenaKitty> They've been talking about ditching the Nexus 7 image cause of that one bug. :/
[22:18] <HelenaKitty> fml
[22:18] <HelenaKitty> geez just leave it up there but mark it as stable!
[22:18] <HelenaKitty> Nexus 7 is a good tablet someone will come around to fixing the bug.
[22:18] <HelenaKitty> It doesn't happen over night, you know?!
[22:18] <HelenaKitty> it wont just happen in months even always!
[22:19] <sergiusens> HelenaKitty: well you can always rebuild the image... that image was build just to test stuff
[22:19] <HelenaKitty> s/stable/unstable
[22:19] <HelenaKitty> sergiusens: What image isn't?
[22:20] <HelenaKitty> what image would you recommend?
[22:20] <HelenaKitty> I've been told this before
[22:20] <HelenaKitty> but I STILL think it shouldn't be ditched!
[22:22] <sergiusens> HelenaKitty: it probably won't be ditched, but I'm sure the people who were working on it are moving on to ubuntu-touch
[22:22] <sergiusens> which is not the same
[22:22] <HelenaKitty> er
[22:22] <HelenaKitty> What is Ubuntu Touch then sergiusens?
[22:24] <HelenaKitty> I originally wanted Debian on my device. Before that I ran Debian in a chroot :/
[22:24] <sergiusens> HelenaKitty: what easier to explain than the wiki: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch
[22:24] <HelenaKitty> so I proceeded to flash Debian, ran into many problems I couldn't fix that were causing kernel panic
[22:25] <HelenaKitty> So then I flashed that Ubuntu image
[22:25] <HelenaKitty> lol
[22:29] <sergiusens> cyphermox: with the bootstrap thing you mean marking them Fix Released or Close?
[22:30] <HelenaKitty> WTF man?!
[22:31] <cyphermox> sergiusens: yeah, appearing in the changelog at all
[22:31] <HelenaKitty> ...
[22:31] <cyphermox> rsalveti: checked my bt patches for mako? :)
[22:31] <HelenaKitty> WTF?!
[22:32] <cyphermox> HelenaKitty: what's wrong?
[22:32] <HelenaKitty> Nexus 7? Whyy u no responding?
[22:32] <HelenaKitty> damn bootloader is all frozen up and everything. :/
[22:32] <cyphermox> also, can you please keep these interventions to a minimum or to make them in a more polite way, please?
[22:33] <HelenaKitty> This has baffled me
[22:33] <HelenaKitty> the only cause to this problem would be an I/O error
[22:34] <cyphermox> HelenaKitty: with the touch image or the desktop image?
[22:34] <HelenaKitty> nope trying to put factory android back onto it.
[22:35] <HelenaKitty> the device is totally bricked I am totally locked out completely can't even detect the device
[22:35] <sergiusens> HelenaKitty: boot with vol up and down pressed
[22:35] <HelenaKitty> I know what I am doing and can confirm I made no mistake here.
[22:35] <HelenaKitty> sergiusens: I know what to do
[22:35] <HelenaKitty> It's just...
[22:36] <HelenaKitty> MTD had a failure copying O.o
[22:36] <wilee-nilee> HelenaKitty, Can you get to the fastboot then recovery?
[22:37] <HelenaKitty> wilee-nilee: recovery is gone
[22:37] <HelenaKitty> bootloader is there
[22:37] <HelenaKitty> but recovery MTD messed it up
[22:37] <cyphermox> HelenaKitty: you can manually reflash that
[22:37] <HelenaKitty> I investigated the problem and there is an error on my system that came from the copying process of MTD.
[22:37] <HelenaKitty> cyphermox: Dude that is what I am doing!
[22:38] <sergiusens> HelenaKitty: if you know what to do and know the problem, why did you need a response?
[22:38] <cyphermox> HelenaKitty: just grab a cwm recovery and re-flash it, but even then, the factory images from google will just happily reflash over everything
[22:38] <wilee-nilee> yeah, Ihad the desktop image do some damage about 5 days ago I had to delete the ubuntu image from recovery and load the factory to get to my saved image in the end.
[22:38] <cyphermox> what's MTD have to do with reflashing a nexus 7?
[22:39] <HelenaKitty> fastboot uses the MTD protocol for I/O
[22:39] <cyphermox> wilee-nilee: afaik that was a known bug before, not sure if it was fixed, but yeah, re-flashing the factory images would clear it up
[22:39] <HelenaKitty> adb also uses the MTD protocol
[22:39] <HelenaKitty> YES!
[22:39] <HelenaKitty> it's okay now guys
[22:40] <wilee-nilee> cyphermox, Yeah I just chuckled, I have images of all my installs on all devices.
[22:40] <cyphermox> duh, /me confused MTD and MTP >.<
[22:42] <HelenaKitty> Okies
[22:42] <HelenaKitty> know that is out of the way
[22:42] <HelenaKitty> rebooting to the bootloader again
[22:43] <HelenaKitty> Now to flash "system" and should be ready to go!, right guys? haha
[22:45] <HelenaKitty> That's why it failed guys. I forgot to set "system" as mountable and when MTD attempted to mount that's how it failed.
[22:45] <sergiusens> rsalveti: this is good to go https://code.launchpad.net/~phablet-team/phablet-extras/network-manager-raring/+merge/158002
[22:46] <rsalveti> sergiusens: cyphermox: got it, cool (phablet-tools mr)
[22:47] <rsalveti> cyphermox: yup, had to fix network first at raring so I could test it there properly as well
[22:48] <rsalveti> should land for tomorrow's iamge
[22:48] <rsalveti> sergiusens: cool
[22:48] <rsalveti> sergiusens: will you merge/push it by hand?
[22:53] <sergiusens> rsalveti: sure
[22:53] <HelenaKitty> Okies :£
[22:53] <HelenaKitty> :3
[22:54] <sergiusens> rsalveti: on second though, can you do it? You already signed it :-)
[22:54] <rsalveti> sergiusens: sure
[22:55]  * HelenaKitty is tired, wants to chill in bed, get her feet warm and snuggle and watch some movies
[22:55] <HelenaKitty> :D
[23:04] <cyphermox> rsalveti: sergiusens: cool
[23:05] <cyphermox> I'm having dinner now, but when I'm done maybe I can try to flatten NM's patches in a way that I could just upload everything the same for phablet and not-phablet
[23:06] <rsalveti> cyphermox: p2p might be easy to support
[23:06] <sergiusens> rsalveti: how far is ofono from being in too?
[23:06] <rsalveti> even the revert I did
[23:06] <rsalveti> sergiusens: tested at quantal and it worked fine, now testing at raring
[23:06] <rsalveti> should be good in a few
[23:06] <rsalveti> cyphermox: only one that might be hard to support is regarding policykit
[23:08] <rsalveti> sergiusens: new nm just for raring, right?
[23:08] <sergiusens> rsalveti: yes
[23:08] <rsalveti> sergiusens: ok
[23:08] <sergiusens> rsalveti: we should deprecate quantal :-)
[23:08] <rsalveti> yeah
[23:08] <rsalveti> soon
[23:09] <sergiusens> pwd
[23:10] <sergiusens> ldoh
[23:16] <HelenaKitty> DOWN DOWN DOWN THE CHIMNEY
[23:16] <HelenaKitty> DOWN DOWN DOWN THE CHIMNEY