[08:40]  * smartboyhw can't think of what to do.
[08:40] <smartboyhw> Hmm, probably do some daily testing then.
[08:54] <smartboyhw> zequence, I do wonder: Our boot screen for the images has quite an old logo. Can we ask madeinkobaia to re-design one for 13.10?
[08:54] <smartboyhw> It would be too late now I know for 13.04.
[09:07] <smartboyhw_> On the installation session of 13.04 daily.
[09:07] <smartboyhw> That's me:P
[09:20] <smartboyhw> Not seeing bugs:)
[09:21] <smartboyhw> Let me see if Arandr does work in a clean install.
[09:21] <smartboyhw> (still waiting for the Release Team to ACK and a sponsor to sync)
[11:27] <zequence> smartboyhw: Are you fixing a bug that deals with arandr?
[11:56] <zequence> I'm going out for a couple of hours
[12:37] <smartboyhw> zequence, yep.
[13:10] <em22> anyone awake?   Im having a problem with external video,  plan to file a bug but cant figure out the area.  from the area finder it ought to be LaptopVideoOutputControl  but I dont see any bugs at all associated with that tag and it appears to be a dead project.  so I am "dazed and confused" :-) about what area to use.  the problem is visible in ARnR but that is not necessarily the source of the problem.  the problem is that it l
[13:10] <em22> ist all kinds of devices that dont seem to exist... but more importantly I am not given a choice for the video resolution that I need.  this all works in 12.04
[13:11] <em22> Im testing the 13.04 beta 2
[13:14] <smartboyhw> em22, what area!?
[13:39] <em22> hi smartboyhw... ah yes... what area... that is the question that I am asking...   
[13:39] <smartboyhw> em22, and I'm not understanding what you're saying.....
[13:39] <em22> I cant use the external vidoe because the resolutions offered is not correct
[13:40] <em22> also extra devices appear that do not actually exist
[13:40] <em22> I tried the area finder web page, but the suggestions are less than helpful
[13:47] <em22> I want to file a bug report but I cant figure out what area to use
[13:47] <smartboyhw> em22, what do you mean by what area? 
[13:47] <smartboyhw> (I don't understand)
[13:47] <smartboyhw> You file a bug in Launchpad.
[13:48] <smartboyhw> More easily, just do "ubuntu-bug <packagename>" and that shall guide you through.
[13:48] <em22> when you do ubuntu-bug  or also in lauchpad...  it asks for the area that the bug belongs to....  er uh okay, package name == area
[13:49] <smartboyhw> em22, yes.
[13:49] <em22> so for a bug with the external video of a laptop Im trying to figure out what package name
[13:49] <em22> to use
[13:50] <smartboyhw> em22, the driver?
[13:50] <smartboyhw> Your display driver that is.
[13:50] <em22> xorg
[13:50] <em22> fglx
[13:50] <smartboyhw> em22, fglx then.
[13:50] <em22> oh, okay, that was simple....   thanks
[13:51] <em22> its a huge complex system, Im still trying to find my way around things
[13:53] <zequence> em22: fglrx is the name of the AMD driver pacakge
[13:53] <smartboyhw> zequence, I am actually asking for a sync (for the fix)
[13:54] <smartboyhw> Just waiting for a release team member to ACK and a normal sponsor to DO the sync.
[13:54] <em22> I have another question for you...   if you do an lshw and various other things....   the utility is able to get the model name and manufacturer string...  like HP DV7....    I've been searching all over /proc and /sys trying to find that name any ideas?   Id like to include it in my temperature monitoring program
[13:54] <zequence> smartboyhw: Debian sync? Would you mind posting the bug number
[13:55] <smartboyhw> zequence, Bug 1168693
[13:55] <smartboyhw> YEPEE!
[13:55] <smartboyhw> zequence, you really ought to become a MOTU :P 
[13:56] <zequence> smartboyhw: So, what does your chances for a sync seem to be? Have you gotten any feedback on that?
[13:57] <zequence> em22: What kind of monitoring program is that? You're coding it?
[13:57] <smartboyhw> zequence, I got feedback from a Kubuntu developer and the Lubuntu QA Lead. Both say that if this incorporates an unlaunchable fix I would have a high chance.
[13:57] <smartboyhw> s/unlaunchable/unlaunchable bug/
[13:57] <kubotu> smartboyhw meant: "zequence, I got feedback from a Kubuntu developer and the Lubuntu QA Lead. Both say that if this incorporates an unlaunchable bug fix I would have a high chance."
[13:58] <zequence> smartboyhw: Will it need dependencies to be updated?
[13:58] <smartboyhw> zequence, no.
[13:58] <em22> hi zsequence!   fglrx...   Ive hit two bugs, one is cant use external monitor because the list of resolutions does not include the one I need.  the other bug is I cant install the proporiaty (sp) drivers, it hangs about about 10% are these knowen issues?
[13:58] <smartboyhw> zequence, it just's that:P
[13:59] <smartboyhw> zequence, http://paste.ubuntu.com/5704407/
[13:59] <zequence> em22: fglrx is the name of the proprietary driver, and to my knowledge, it doesn't support newer x servers, beyond 12.04
[13:59] <smartboyhw> That's the NEWS from the 0.1.7.1 tarball
[13:59] <DarkEra> good afternoon guys
[13:59] <smartboyhw> Hello DarkEra :)
[14:00] <zequence> smartboyhw: Ok. Seems like the best way to fix it then
[14:00] <smartboyhw> zequence, :)
[14:00] <zequence> em22: At least, this was the case about 6 months ago
[14:01] <zequence> em22: You might be able to write a xorg.conf forcing the resolutions you need
[14:01] <em22> zsequence: yes, I wrote a temperature and cpu load monitoring program.  see:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux-lowlatency/+bug/1166916   go down to the bottom and look at the attachments.
[14:01] <smartboyhw> zequence, you said you requested the Forums Council to add the whole PR team as mod, but they only put you as mod. Any reasons? (Not trusting me or the whole PR team or what?)
[14:01] <smartboyhw> em22, well that might just be a -generic problem.
[14:01] <smartboyhw> zequence could surely fix that though:P
[14:02] <zequence> smartboyhw: I didn't know if they could give authorization to whole LP teams, but it seems not
[14:02] <smartboyhw> zequence, yep. Anyways you could just do the thing yourself:P
[14:03] <zequence> em22: did you ever try fglrx on 12.04?
[14:04] <em22> yes, I have now proved that it is generic but I dont seem to have permission to alter the bugs status
[14:04] <smartboyhw> em22, why?
[14:04] <smartboyhw> em22, let me do that.
[14:05] <zequence> em22: I'm thinking this is really a driver problem, with the free drivers
[14:05] <zequence> smartboyhw: ^
[14:05] <smartboyhw> zequence, the drivers are an extreme problem.
[14:05] <em22> I have a very vague memory that I may have added the missing resolution to 12.04....   but an associated problem is that I now see half-a-dozen video devices that dont actually exist
[14:06] <smartboyhw> zequence, one weird thing though (I will report a bug, but dunno how to do stack traces): Today I boot into 3.8.0-18 lowlatency and closed the lid after selecting the kernel using GRUB2. Then when I reopened the lid again I saw a hell of stack traces:O
[14:08] <zequence> I changed the bug to affect: xserver-xorg-video-ati
[14:08] <smartboyhw> zequence, \o/
[14:08] <em22> I dont know why, but there are fields that I see on other bugs that I cant access...  and some of the fields that i can access I simply do not understand.  I have not used launchpad very much and find it a bit obtuse
[14:09] <zequence> em22: with fglrx, you can't monitor temprature. At least not, that I know of. You should be noticing the difference easily by just listening to the fans
[14:09] <zequence> And physically monitoring heat directly around the card(s) with your hand, or whatever
[14:09] <smartboyhw> em22, and I surely won't watch video on Virtualbox:P
[14:10] <em22> well, in 13.04 lm-sensors does indeed report the temperature for the radeon...  and it used to do so for 12.04 before I ran the auto detect sensors program...
[14:10] <zequence> em22: It will monitor temprature only if you are using the free drivers: xserver-xorg-video-ati
[14:10] <em22> all my program does is to reformat the output of lm-sensors and combine it with load info that I grab from /proc
[14:12] <em22> I always watch video on virtualbox... it is very very impressive....  12.04 I can have 4 going at the same time and not overheat
[14:12] <smartboyhw> em22, :O
[14:12]  * smartboyhw would never watch video on such a program.
[14:13] <zequence> btw, the guy tete did an error when starting alsa_in before. He wasn't providing the correct device. Probably his ~/.jackdrc was not correctly configured, and he needed to use the "-d <card" option
[14:14] <zequence> I was helping him in #jack with this
[14:14] <zequence> Since jack hasn't been updated for probably a few months, an update is very unlikely to cause problems
[14:14] <zequence> I mean, a system update would unlikely cause any problems
[14:14] <em22> it works great!  first off Im stuck because netflix ceo is very tight with microsoft therefore netflix will never be available for linux even though it could easily be.  so I run xp in virtualbox.  beyond that, since my host os changes a lot I use virtualbox for my stable development environment...  I do all my real work inside of vbx and yes that includes watching the occasionsal video
[14:15] <smartboyhw> zequence, OK
[14:15] <smartboyhw> em22, ........
[14:22] <em22>  did you ever try fglrx on 12.04? ==  yes. I've tried all 3 drivers on 12.04, they all work fine as far as I can tell.   I have zero overheating prolems on 12.04  enven thoug it is a bit hotter than 10.10
[14:25] <em22> smartboyhw:  Im no longer convinced that the overheating is *only* a video driver issue...   at idle the video is hotter, but underload the cpu gets much hotter than the video.  see the attachment for 13.04 idle to max to idle
[14:26] <smartboyhw> em22, point that to zequence :P
[14:27] <em22> zequence: at 100% load the cpu hit 96c yikes! before I shut it down.  see the data.  meanwhile the video was about 4-5 degress cooler
[14:48] <zequence> em22: Is this a laptop
[14:48] <zequence> em22: When your card overheats, it's a card driver issue, no doubt
[14:49] <zequence> em22: The kernel itself does not do anything except point applications to the driver
[14:52] <zequence> em22: If your CPU is at 100%, I can't see how it would get hotter or colder on different kernels
[14:52] <zequence> em22: If you like, try a newer kernel on 12.04
[14:54] <em22> well the difference at 100% load is about 15c degrees between 12.05 and 13.04...  that is a huge difference.  both computers running similar load, both reported as near 100%
[14:54] <zequence> em22: Just that it stands against logic
[14:55] <em22> okay, would it be compatible to put the kernel from 13.04 onto 12.04?
[14:55] <zequence> em22: It'll work
[14:55] <em22> logic or not...  that is the data and the fans and the temperature on the hand
[14:55] <em22> okay, I will give that a try...  
[14:56] <em22> I will do that now...  be back in about 30 minutes
[14:57] <em22> bye for now
[14:57] <zequence> em22: later
[14:58] <zequence> There's also a chance heat monitoring is off
[16:29] <em22> okay, Im back...  for the moment...   I was under the impression that I just needed to copy the kernel files  *17-generic  and jigger the grub menu....   but it didn't work.   I got errors like pci vga not found...    so I am now reviewing  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kernel/MainlineBuilds   which among other things says I must uninstall virtualbox  argh.    have I missed something?  is there another way to do this?
[16:31] <smartboyhw> Hmm?
[16:32] <smartboyhw> em22: We aren't kernel experts:P
[16:33] <em22> oh, okay...  then I will just follow what the web says...  of course a lot of what the web says is wrong/obsolete
[16:33] <smartboyhw> em22: And either I have understanding problems today, or your question is just unclear.
[16:33] <smartboyhw> What do you mean by copying files?
[16:33] <em22> sorry...  this relates to a conversation from about an hour ago
[16:33] <smartboyhw> You just install the kernel …
[16:34] <smartboyhw> em22: Oh OK.
[16:34] <em22> what we discussed is to take the kernel from 13.04 and run it on 12.04
[16:34] <smartboyhw> em22: Then you should be copying the 3.8 kernel instead of an 3.5 kernel....
[16:35] <em22> well, yeah if it was in synaptic...  but the kernels for new editions dont show up for older editions
[16:35] <smartboyhw> em22: We will probably add such support for Precise later 
[16:35] <smartboyhw> em22: It does for -generic 
[16:35] <smartboyhw> It just doesn't for -lowlatency
[16:36] <em22> yes, I copied th 3..8..17-generic   about half a dozen files from one boot dir to the other boot dir
[16:36] <smartboyhw> em22: That wouldn't work I think.
[16:36] <em22> then I tried to get grub to auto detect the change, but it didnt do then I created a manual entry and booted it...  and the kernal was not happy
[16:37] <em22> yes didnt work....  somehow I had the impression that it would...  so I guess I just follow the web page
[16:37] <smartboyhw> em22: Wait. I think there's a packagw for you.
[16:38] <em22> okay great
[16:40] <smartboyhw> em22: Add the PPA from https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-x-swat/+archive/r-lts-backport
[16:41] <em22> okay, thanks!!!
[16:44] <em22> back later
[16:48] <smartboyhw> zequence: We REALLY ought to have a linux-lts-raring-lowlatency package for Ubuntu Studio 12.04.3:P
[16:58] <smartboyhw> zequence: That will put a bit of pressure on you though, making so many kernels… (maybe not a good idea then)
[17:04] <micahg> rebasing isn't hard, it's the testing for the SRU :)
[17:09] <smartboyhw> micahg: That's the issue.
[18:08] <zequence> One simply needs to download the kernel .deb files and install them manually
[18:22] <em22> okay, I have posted the results to the bug.  bottom line is that it runs about 6 degrees hotter so something very stange is going on here
[18:25] <em22> be sure to take a look at this video, it was essential for my load testing :-)   Im sure you will enjoy it.  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H93n-k3SkiQ
[18:26] <em22> well, I gotta go get some sleep.  bye for now
[18:28] <em22> thanks for all the help smartboyhw
[21:22] <len-1304> zequence, do you know what the difference is between the document viewer in the menu (in office) and the internal pdf view in firefox?
[21:24] <len-1304> I have an 84 page pdf (ice1712 data sheet as happens) that after 60 or so pages just sits with the loading animation forever, but firefox allows reading to the end.
[21:27] <len-1304> page 62 won't render with evinced
[21:29] <len-1304> It doesn't seem to be file size. I can see the end of larger files with more pictures and less pages.
[21:31] <len-1304> Not page number related either. Found bigger file with more pages still ok.
[21:46] <len-1304> zequence, putting a bug in anyway. Probably document uses non-standard feature
[23:32]  * smartboyhw hugs Scott Kitterman for doing the Arandr sync:)
[23:46] <DarkEra> cool \o/
[23:46] <smartboyhw> DarkEra: :)
[23:47] <DarkEra> so it should be in the updates?
[23:47] <smartboyhw> DarkEra: 13.04 yep.
[23:47] <DarkEra> awesome
[23:48] <DarkEra> i currently run Ubuntu Studio 12.04 and have 13.04 on another partition for testing
[23:49] <smartboyhw> DarkEra: \o/
[23:51] <DarkEra> i love the work you guys are doing and trying to get a bit more involved. My next step is to get back into music creation, so far Ubuntu Studio came out as the best distro for me
[23:53] <micahg> the new arandr should be backportable to precise if desired (see requestbackport in ubuntu-dev-tools)
[23:54] <DarkEra> micahg, arandr works fine for me on 12.04 and have the dual screen working great on it. :)
[23:56] <smartboyhw> micahg: That's a SRU…
[23:56] <smartboyhw> It fixes A BUG.
[23:57] <micahg> smartboyhw: well, you can backport the bug fix if there's a bug in the precise version
[23:58] <smartboyhw> micahg: I will probably do so.
[23:58] <micahg> I was saying the new version is backportable as is if there were features wanted (but if an SRU is needed, that should be done first)
[23:58] <DarkEra> i'll be back in a bit, booting into 13.04 and pull in the updates
[23:58] <smartboyhw> micahg: As the upstream website says: This problem exists when version <0.1.6
[23:59] <smartboyhw> micahg: SRU first.