[13:59] <mattgriffin> marcoceppi: how does one join the hangout?
[13:59] <marcoceppi> mattgriffin: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/fa6dea509240bfe96361ee99a233312bebed02b0?authuser=0&hl=en
[14:01] <marcoceppi> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/servercloud-s-juju-flag-bearer-charms
[14:05] <arosales> Any question please preced them with [QUESTION]
[14:05] <arosales> Welcome to Flag Bearer Charms (application) session :-)
[14:05] <bkerensa> [QUESTION] Will there be preferred languages for textbook charms?
[14:06]  * bkerensa jolts marcoceppi 
[14:08] <bkerensa> maybe have a textbook charm in all the most common languages?
[14:08] <bkerensa> ahh
[14:10] <bkerensa> uhh loud phone
[14:10] <bkerensa> :s
[14:13] <bkerensa> if you going to pycon have a py charm
[14:13] <bkerensa> ruby event have a ruby charm
[14:13] <bkerensa> that way if people say well lets see ruby we have one
[14:14] <bkerensa> Could we maybe have a screencast showing the anatomy of them?
[14:14] <marcoceppi> bkerensa: docs will have that
[14:14] <bkerensa> ahh
[14:15] <arosales> bkerensa, ya we'll definitely do an anatomy of a charm web cast.
[14:35] <marcoceppi> Questions?
[14:41] <arosales> Flag Bearer Charm Session ended
[14:42] <arosales> jcastro, in regards to work items in the pad I think it is useful to first collaborate on them in the pad, and then just to a past afterwards into the BP.
[14:42] <jcastro> ack
[14:42] <arosales> as launchpad can stomp multiple folks pasting, but if that is coordinated in the hangout no worries
[14:45] <jcastro> yeah
[14:45] <bkerensa> heh
[14:45] <jcastro> I just pasted in the notes to the BP
[14:45] <jcastro> I've just been burned by buried notes and WI not making it into LP in the past
[14:50] <m_3> jcastro: thanks... I was just worrying through trying to figure out what work-items we needed to capture
[14:51] <jcastro> I had one cycle
[14:51] <jcastro> where I missed an entire blueprint
[14:51] <jcastro> like next month my boss is llike "how's it going?"
[14:51] <jcastro> and I was like man, what is he talking about
[14:54] <m_3> well 0 workitems works too: "It's going great!... what do you mean?"
[15:05] <arosales> Charm Policy Review starting in a couple of minutes
[15:05] <arosales> IF you want to join us please feel free to. We are at https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/a8dd2bb22ca20fe5b4473891f25210fe2d5710da?authuser=0&hl=en
[15:05] <arosales> http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1305/meeting/21705/servercloud-s-juju-charm-policy-review/
[15:06] <cjohnston> heya
[15:06] <marcoceppi> o/
[15:06] <jamespage> o/
[15:07] <cjohnston> so professional
[15:08] <arosales> cjohnston, hello
[15:09] <cjohnston> :-)
[15:11] <utlemming> I don't care where the bits land, as long as they are in the same place
[15:11] <utlemming> its really hard to do a backup charm with everyone dropping the bits anywhere they want
[15:12] <arosales> cjohnston, utlemming feel free to join us in the hangout :-)
[15:13] <arosales> URL is above ^
[15:14] <avoine> o/
[15:14] <arosales> avoine, hello
[15:14] <avoine> hi
[15:17] <arosales> If folks want to join us in the hangout the URL is in the pad
[15:17] <arosales> or just give me a ping
[15:18] <arosales> also preface questions with [QUESTION] so we don't miss them.
[15:21] <robbiew-uds> jcastro keeping them honest!
[15:30] <avoine> hehe
[15:35] <wedgwood> wow, reminder fail. just tuning in
[15:37] <marcoceppi> Questions?
[15:38] <avoine> [QUESTION] Does charm writer will have access to per commit test run?
[15:38] <wedgwood> I'm just catching up. I don't see any surprises.
[15:39] <wedgwood> jcastro: question ^^
[15:39] <wedgwood> or arosales ^^
[15:39] <arosales> wedgwood, ack
[15:45] <arosales> Any other questions?
[15:46] <wedgwood> have we discussed anything about how a ratings system might relate to or affect policy?
[15:48] <wedgwood> jcastro: +1
[15:48] <wedgwood> It would be nice to be able to say we require a certain quality rating for production environments
[15:49] <wedgwood> I'm good thanks
[16:05] <arosales> jcastro, ping
[16:05] <jcastro> pong
[16:05] <jcastro> coming
[16:08] <arosales> Started session: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1305/meeting/21703/servercloud-s-juju-audit-charms/
[16:09] <arosales> pad: http://pad.ubuntu.com/uds-1305-servercloud-s-juju-audit-charms
[16:09] <arosales> Google hangout URL is in the pad if you are interested in joining us. Be sure to preface questions with [QUESITON] so we don't miss them.
[16:36] <marcoceppi> Questions?
[16:38] <arosales> https://juju.ubuntu.com/docs/charm-store.html --> should we add an "audit charm" guide ?
[16:57] <arosales> Charm Audit session done
[17:57] <arosales> Charm Development Tooling starting in a bit
[17:57] <arosales> If your are interested in joining us in the hangout: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/7702813e48c52e2459fda12e4c5e86b4da64541c?authuser=0&hl=en
[18:07] <arosales> we are live in the google hangout.  If you have any questions please preface them with [QUESTION] so we don't miss them
[18:17] <mattyw> QUESTION: I'm a bit confused by the idea of the contrib directory. Are we saying this is where contributers would merge to, and then it would get taken into 'main' when it was deemed ready?
[18:18] <arosales> mattyw, thanks for the question. I'll tee it up
[18:18] <avoine> +1 for package in main, pip is not checking for signature
[18:18] <avoine> or other security check
[18:20] <arosales> for folks wishing to joing us in the g+ hangout feel free to join via https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/7702813e48c52e2459fda12e4c5e86b4da64541c?authuser=0&hl=en
[18:22] <bac_> The branch can be seen at http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~charm-helpers/charm-helpers/devel/files/head:/charmhelpers/
[18:25] <arosales> marcoceppi, sorry not main, but universe for charm-tools
[18:25] <arosales> marcoceppi, Filename: pool/universe/c/charm-tools/charm-tools_0.3+151-0ubuntu1_all.deb
[18:25] <marcoceppi> arosales: ack
[18:25] <bac_> arosales: there is also python-charmhelpers, which is in the lp:charm-tools project
[18:26] <bac_> packaged universe also
[18:26] <arosales> bac_, thanks
[18:27] <mattyw> It sounds like contrib is a temporary place to put stuff in to achieve the goal of having stuff in one place - without contributors having to mess around with their package structure too much, and the first step on the road to organising it into a sensible place
[18:27] <arosales> +1 on keeping charm-tools seperate
[18:29] <wedgwood> mattyw: that's exactly it
[18:29] <mattyw> wedgwood, ok - thanks very much, sounds good
[18:29] <arosales> wedgwood, thanks for confirming
[18:30] <arosales> wedgwood, do you have the LP link to the current charm helper
[18:30]  * arosales is trying to collect the list of charm dev tools at the bottom of the pad
[18:30] <arosales> http://pad.ubuntu.com/uds-1305-servercloud-s-juju-charmhelper2
[18:30] <wedgwood> lp:charm-helpers
[18:30] <wedgwood> https://launchpad.net/charm-helpers
[18:31] <arosales> wedgwood, the icon for the project is nice too
[18:32] <bac_> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~charm-helpers/charm-helpers/devel/files/head:/charmhelpers/contrib/
[18:32] <bac_> arosales: ^^
[18:33] <arosales> bac_, thanks
[18:33] <mattyw> wedgwood, arosales does stuff that gets put it in here need to support py juju & juju-core? It looks like there's some stuff in here which is pyju specific
[18:33] <wedgwood> arosales: I put a list of the included projects at the bottom of the pad
[18:33] <marcoceppi> mattyw: great question, I'll ask in a second
[18:33] <arosales> mattyw, I think going forward we would just make sure there is support for juju-core
[18:34] <arosales> wedgwood, thanks for adding the list
[18:37] <arosales> adam_g, did you want to confirm out of band relations with mramm, and file a bug if it is not there?
[18:38] <adam_g> arosales, sure
[18:39] <arosales> adam_g, thanks
[18:59] <arosales> Any other questions ?
[18:59] <bac> marcoceppi: did you see my comment: lp:python-shelltoolbox (documented via extensive docstrings)
[19:00] <marcoceppi> bac: thank you!
[19:00] <bac> np
[19:03] <arosales> Framework Charms starting in a bit
[19:03] <arosales> Feel free to join us in the hangout @ https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/f7a5e5cb4adb060c1bc942cd70f0bf62b13c7fb2?authuser=0&hl=en
[19:03]  * arosales will also put it in the pad
[19:17] <hatch> I'm hoping to start on it right away
[19:18] <arosales> hatch, if you want to join us feel free to load up https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/f7a5e5cb4adb060c1bc942cd70f0bf62b13c7fb2?authuser=0&hl=en
[19:19] <hatch> I would like input from anyone who wants this charm as to what relations and feature they would like
[19:19] <hatch> arosales, yeah it won't connect from either of my machines....I'm keeping trying
[19:25] <hatch> that's a good idea
[19:25]  * hatch is going to try and participate via chat 
[19:30] <hatch> Creating a base charm and then passing it off to someone in that industry is a good idea
[19:31] <hatch> I think it removes the barrier to entry
[19:34] <hatch> I would like to create a standard for node
[19:34] <hatch> so that the juju charm config goes in X
[19:34] <hatch> across all node apps
[19:37] <hatch> I would be worried about a way to display these properly in the browser
[19:39] <hatch> node would be an easy one for that I would think
[19:42] <m_3> yup
[19:43] <avoine> [question] Where charmers should put documentation for an application charms? in the README of the framework charm? in a docs/ directory? rtd.org?
[19:43] <hatch> +1
[19:44] <hatch> thanks arosales :)
[19:44] <marcoceppi> avoine: thanks, queued!
[19:44] <hatch> exactly
[19:46] <hatch> m_3, we SHOULD standardize the location of the config for juju
[19:47] <hatch> wrt node applications - so we could say - "put your juju config file in the root dir and call it juju-config.yaml"
[19:48] <hatch> but we can has that out later on
[19:49] <m_3> hatch: ack.. that'd be awesome
[19:49] <m_3> hatch: it's also a problem with sinatra
[19:50] <m_3> hatch: but yeah, it's worth being opinionated about it imo
[19:50] <avoine> ok, but what about documentation about creating an new application charm?
[19:50] <marcoceppi> QUestions?
[19:50] <m_3> haven't been to date
[19:50] <marcoceppi> avoine: ack, queuing
[19:50] <hatch> yeah I'm ok with being opinionated ;)
[19:51] <hatch> ahh yeah that is also a good idea
[19:52] <hatch> sure thing
[19:52] <m_3> http://markmims.com/cloud/2011/09/07/node-mongo-ubuntu.html
[19:53] <hatch> thanks I'll read that after this
[19:55] <arosales> Any other questions ?
[19:55] <jcastro> avoine: any platform you're interested in in particular?
[19:55] <avoine> I'm Patrick, I'm writing the Django charm
[19:55] <hatch> yup will definitely be doing that blog
[19:56] <arosales> hello Patrick :-)
[19:56] <arosales> aka avoine
[19:56] <avoine> Hey o/
[19:56] <arosales> avoine, feel free to join us @ https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/f7a5e5cb4adb060c1bc942cd70f0bf62b13c7fb2?authuser=0&hl=en
[19:57] <avoine> my internet is really bad...
[19:57] <arosales> avoine, our G+ ended, but please feel free to join us tomorrow in some sessions if you are available
[19:57] <arosales> avoine, ah
[19:57] <hatch> great chat guys
[19:58] <arosales> hatch, m_3 has complete confidence that you will fix all node.js problems :-)
[19:59] <hatch> haha - I am excited to use the node charm so it's in my own selfish interests to do a good job ;)
[20:01] <avoine> jcastro: I'll request a merge to get the Django+Gunicorn charm in the store maybe this week or the next one
[20:02] <avoine> I just need Bruno to check out my spelling :P
[20:02] <jcastro> sounds awesome