=== Cracknel_ is now known as Cracknel === schwuk_away is now known as schwuk [13:09] ah its utc..:/ === udsbotu changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-community-2 to: Track: Community | Localizing the Q&A Systems | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1305/meeting/21834/community-1305-q+a-systems-localization/ [13:53] hi [13:55] hello everyone [13:56] balloons: hi [13:56] I've started up the hangout [13:57] who all needs to be in the session? [13:57] JoseeAntonioR, you here? [13:57] balloons: it was basically jono and I [13:57] balloons: yep, I'm almost ready [13:58] http://youtu.be/GYwZKtOEsH8 [13:58] https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/a36610cf64e5188542cb2a2916ed4832a29ebdf2?authuser=2&hl=en [13:58] balloons: I was about to tell you to not link publicly but anyways :) [13:58] heh [13:58] joining in 2-3 mins [13:59] JoseeAntonioR, I won't be able to join the session [14:00] hi [14:01] hi YoBoY [14:01] hey, YoBoY [14:03] when the session will start? [14:04] ok should be live now :-) [14:04] UbuPhillup: live now :) [14:05] it's live for me too [14:05] yes for me too [14:06] i can see you too [14:07] yes, english only for a tool who is promoted everywhere now, it's bad for foreign users :] [14:08] http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Q&A/Localization [14:08] german [14:08] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QandALocalization [14:08] french :D [14:09] There's a little bit of delay on the thingy :) [14:12] ubuntu.shapado.com [14:13] I like the idea to have finaly a localised tool from ubuntu.com [14:13] who is going to create thh localised vrsion of AskUbuntu? [14:13] hmm thats a nice idea, but the german community have a very big own support page [14:14] *the :-D [14:15] UbuPhillup, the french community too, but we are missing actually a Q&A tool, I think it's really more efficient than a forum. And we don't have the ressources to have our own right now [14:16] YoBoY: okey [14:20] a localised Q&A is good for answer archive, and relieving our forums. I know that the Greek translators will help, but we are low on coding manpower. Will there be templates ready? [14:21] if i go to ubuntu.shapado.com i see a white page [14:22] okey i chromium it worked [14:22] *it [14:24] how this Q&A system will be integratd with the other support sessources ? askubuntu have bad integration with ubuntu.com for example, and I really don't like to send people somewhere without having a link for them to go back or to find more ressources [14:26] any more doubts/questions/suggestions/anything you want to discuss? [14:26] ok [14:27] if not I'll just wrap it up [14:27] can it work with ubuntu sso account? [14:27] when it will be ready to use? [14:28] How this new q&a can be promoted on ubuntu.com website and on the ISO where localised ressources are so dably hightlited ? [14:31] only this page http://www.ubuntu.com/support/community/local-language [14:31] how can we track the progress? [14:33] https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/community-1305-q+a-systems-localization [14:34] * YoBoY counting "one hangout error" (new game of the day :D) [14:34] :P [14:34] subscribed already, thanks! [14:34] any other questions you may have? [14:35] no more question for now [14:35] yes everthing is fine [14:36] everything fine here too! [14:36] ok, thank you for holding this session and for your work :) [14:37] JoseeAntonioR: thanks [14:38] :) [14:38] you're welcome [14:38] I hope this can really be done soon [14:38] yeah [14:39] I just want to add, this kind of localised tool can be really usefull for starting loco/language community teams who don't already have a well established website, ressources, etc… === udsbotu changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-community-2 to: Track: Community | Enabling local subteams | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1305/meeting/21835/community-1305-enabling-local-subteams/ [15:00] rrnwexec, you want into the hangout? [15:00] yes please. [15:00] for whomever needs it.. hangout is up: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/88071639044fa4733f799fc40426f337870537b1?authuser=2&hl=en [15:00] i'm someone who wants to start a substeam. should i join the hangout? [15:01] subteam* [15:02] balloons: check my irc message please [15:02] fisch246, definitely [15:02] the more the merrier [15:02] rrnwexec, doesn't want to feel alone in here :-) [15:03] balloons, I want to join in too [15:04] https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/88071639044fa4733f799fc40426f337870537b1?authuser=2&hl=en [15:04] anyone who wishes to join, please do so [15:05] we'll start in a minute [15:06] I am updating the plugins so in a bit ll be able to join [15:07] ok, it's live :) [15:07] yes live [15:08] remember to turn on your lower third guys :-) [15:08] coolbhavi: you joinging ? [15:08] yes in a bit [15:08] balloons: want to have members of the loco council on :) [15:09] czajkowski, https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/88071639044fa4733f799fc40426f337870537b1?authuser=2&hl=en [15:15] I think it's good an bad at the same time to have teams at the same level as the country/loco teams. Not easy to explain, but for a strong loco/country team, they can have these teams on the country and work with them, promote them, etc… but where the loco/country team is weak, a strong city/region/whatever team can kill this loco by not participating in it too. [15:18] * tiagoscd agree YoBoY [15:18] here on Brazil we have twenty-seven LoCo subteams [15:18] * YoBoY have to take a break T_T [15:19] I disagree with YoBoY - if the country LoCo is weak then a strong city/region LoCo may be all that keeps the community alive in that country. [15:20] I think regions/provences/states within a country can work [15:20] and is a very hard work to keep it working. now thinking in cities, towns and villages, I think that should be yet more hard to coordinate [15:20] and using the parent loco as the main looc channel and mailing list [15:21] czajkowski: +1 [15:22] czajkowski: +1 [15:22] so in no way getting rid of a way to mentor young locos within the country loco [15:22] but also foster a "fostering" loco [15:22] so for example lets just take france YoBoY do no panic [15:22] France is the mother loco :) [15:22] and then you could in theory split it into states [15:23] doesnt mean you have to have every single state created in one go [15:23] well, the UDS during work time is impractible for me :( I need to go [15:23] and the mother loco helps the state one at the same time [15:23] see you gurs [15:23] *guys [15:23] but leaves them able to run more local events [15:24] +1 for everything czajkowski says, but applied at the city level instead of state [15:24] I feel like I'm maintaining two separate teams: Ubuntu Canada, the online team and Ubuntu Kitchener-Waterloo, the in-person team. [15:24] balloons: see I'd say no for city [15:24] BobJonkman1: [15:24] damn tab completion gets me every time [15:24] :-) [15:26] Both the online team and the in-person team are valuable, and one helps the other. But they're two largely separate things. [15:26] dscassel_: yes so again using the main country as the main channel [15:26] to help one another [15:27] czajkowski: Yup! But I'd like to have a place for Ubuntu Kitchener-Waterloo events to be recognized somewhere. [15:28] And giving people Ubuntu Toronto or Ubuntu Ottawa a thing to take credit for. [15:28] dscassel_: still on the ltp [15:37] * YoBoY back [15:38] broken audio too [15:39] YoBoY, :S [15:41] so far nobody seems 100% sold on the idea either [15:42] each one have his point of view depending how they live their ubuntu advocacy/promoting experience :) [15:44] mine is more an online french promotion 14/7 + events sometimes, the teams more localised in France are doing events too, but less this online global promotion, it's more localised in their area, but they know we are doing the promotion for them too [15:44] 24/7 [15:44] 14/7 seems relaxed. I'd prefer that. [15:45] :p [15:47] I have to break away for an emergency... sorry [15:48] So far, I see the purpose of LoCo structure is to 1) Prevent confusion, 2) distribute swag. What else am I missing? [15:48] What is different for a french person who wants to start a local team is, he don't go to the loco council, he go to us, the loco, and we just say "GO, what do you need" :). But for english teams… the entity promoted for that is the loco council, and the answer is clearly not the same and it's normal [15:50] Reason for question: Is the same structure appropriate for both(all) purposes? [15:51] cheesehead: it's for like minded individuals to gather, and/or to share ubuntu to the community. [15:52] fisch246: Right - that's the goal of the LoCo. I's asking about the purpose of the structure....I like that answer though! [15:52] 3) Protect the Ubuntu name/trademark [15:54] cheesehead: ah i see what you mean. it's not always to prevent confusion. the purpose is objective, but the structure is subjective. [15:55] fisch246: Right. I deal a lot with various structures. This kind of discussion happens sometimes when an appropriate structure for one purpose is misapplied to another purpose. [15:55] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LoCoCouncil/LoCoTeamsBestPracticesandGuidelines [15:55] I'll update this wit the loco council [15:56] For example, my (unverified) LoCo cares nothing about swag, so we're happy to stay unverified. [15:56] cheesehead: yeah which is good [15:56] some teams lkike it [15:56] me I liek reading the wiki applications [15:56] you should see some of the workd teams do [15:56] love pictures :) [15:57] (what is swag ¬_¬) [15:58] YoBoY: Sorry for the slang. "swag" = giveaways, usually from a company [15:58] YoBoY: swag is free gifts, like CDs or banners [15:58] ok [15:59] thanks everyone :) [15:59] You can reach the council via mail: loco-councillists.ubuntu.com [15:59] * YoBoY needs to watch again this session to have the missing parts ^^" [16:00] plars, you have someone hosting this ubuntu touch image testing session/ [16:00] balloons: I just need the link === udsbotu changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-community-2 to: Track: Client | Ubuntu Touch Image Testing | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1305/meeting/21828/client-s-ubuntu-touch-image-testing/ [16:00] o/ [16:00] who's driving the hangout? [16:00] plars, yes, I just want to know if I need to host or not [16:01] since this is under client [16:01] balloons: ah, yes if you could [16:01] balloons: I don't know how that's decided, tbh [16:02] balloons: is there a different track lead who needs to create the client track ones? can't remember who's done it on here before [16:02] https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/6e57c6187df997f399143e2d20784def48c96783?authuser=2&hl=en [16:02] actually, this one is on community track [16:02] so I think that *is* you :) [16:02] joining [16:06] thomi: are you joining? [16:06] gema: if you want me to? [16:06] thomi: please [16:07] not live yet [16:07] we are [16:09] following this one via youtube [16:10] rsalveti: ack, feel free to join if you want [16:10] sergiusens, did we finish our discussion about having the touch images under saucy milestone? [16:11] balloons: it's ok... we are migrating [16:12] sergiusens, excellent.. I assumed so but I can't remember if I heard back from you or not? [16:12] :-) [16:12] QUESTION: is there any work being done to make an Intel-based Ubuntu Touch image so that we can more easily virtualize it? [16:13] I'm thinking about running tests in the data center and on developer desktops [16:13] sergiusens, one more thing while we're talking about it.. I can mark the "Quantal Ubuntu Touch Final" milestone as complete now yes? that means no more results can be reported to that milestone [16:14] thomi: thanks for your answer [16:16] well, I guess the "Intel-based" part was a red-herring [16:16] I guess I want us to be able to run our touch images in the cloud [16:16] and I thought that it was easier to do that with Intel images [16:17] QUESTION: can we run ubuntu touch tests in our testing cloud today? [16:18] Google found that 95% of the bugs that tests found are not hardware dependent when testing android [16:18] you need real hardware testing, but for CI I don't think you need to run that on real hardware, and this is what Google QA found as well [16:20] rickspencer3: we have CI sort of covered, the problem is the final image testing after integrating [16:20] ok [16:20] yeah [16:21] understood [16:21] rickspencer3: just shared a few pages of "how google tests code" with you for when you have time [16:21] but I guess I thought testing the full stack in a parallized manner in our cloud before we push images to hardware seems faster [16:21] thanks sergiusens [16:28] rickspencer3: the parallelized thing is a feature I want to see in autopilot (client - server) to push suites to different devices in a pool [16:28] there is no point in testing an image if there are no indicators [16:29] gema, I disagree [16:29] I don't think an image without indicators is worth testing [16:29] rickspencer3: ok, so indicators are important, to which extent do we make sure they work to decide whether the image is worth further testing? [16:29] rickspencer3: do you want to join the hangout? [16:30] gema, no thanks, irc is fine [16:30] rickspencer3: ack [16:30] I just have a few points [16:30] we can discuss the depth of smoke tests later [16:30] rickspencer3: can you add them to the etherpad as well? [16:30] rickspencer3: indeed, we'll need to review the smoke tests we add an interate a few times to get them right [16:30] if we compare this to iso smoke testing, we'd be looking to see the image is sane, can be installed, and the phablet device boots up [16:31] balloons: agreed [16:32] QUESTION: when does the image turn "green" on the dashboard? after it passes smoke tests, or after it passes regression tests? [16:33] rickspencer3: there'll be two different views [16:33] it'll be green in one and orange in the other, for instance [16:33] rickspencer3: and the KPI view (summary view) will have an o verall rating [16:34] yes~ [16:34] no it's not [16:34] *everyday* Ubuntu should work [16:35] that's on the desktop, server, and Touch [16:35] rickspencer3: the problem is that "ubuntu works" means different things for different people [16:35] plars, ^ [16:35] rickspencer3: sort of a an unofficial rolling relase I would think [16:35] _release_ [16:35] sergiusens, right, we need to raise our game in daily quality now [16:36] exactly! [16:36] indeed.. you have to define 'works'.. but in rickspencer3's case, I'm guessing he would include the smoke and essential tests to pass.. meaning, images work, boot, de's work, and default apps work (don't crash just by opening :-) ) [16:36] no, it speeds the development [16:36] it slows development for the developer who wrote the buggy code [16:37] but when an image is busted, it goes slowly for everyone [16:37] +1 [16:37] right [16:38] I think the desktop smoke tests have a lot of room for deeper and broader testing [16:38] rickspencer3: I absolutely agree [16:38] rickspencer3: on the other hand, running all the unit / integration tests from autopilot for smoke testing may be not be wise either [16:38] rickspencer3: trying to fing the right balance [16:39] I think that all regressions should result in code getting getting kicked out of the image [16:39] rickspencer3: agreed [16:39] I think the right balance is to absolutely not tolerate regressions [16:40] yeah [16:44] work items time :-) [16:45] sergiusens is going to feel lonely otherwise [16:56] any questions? [16:57] good discussion, thanks everyone! === udsbotu changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-community-2 to: Currently no events are active in this room - http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1305/community-2/ - http://ubottu.com/udslog/%23ubuntu-uds-community-2 === schwuk is now known as schwuk_away [17:51] helo [17:51] hello [17:51] hopefully things will be smoother today [17:51] hi teolemon [17:51] ok, try joining early [17:51] https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/aa20339fb190a752484772753d8351b840718a2c?authuser=2&hl=en [17:52] work out the kinks now :-) [17:54] are you joininh === udsbotu changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-community-2 to: Track: Community | Scaling Translations using Tech | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1305/meeting/21803/community-1305-scaling-translations-using-tech/ [17:58] gema: plars: sergiusens: added a few post session comments - mostly on what i think on the x86 and emulator discussion [17:59] hi asac [17:59] Hey everybody [18:00] hi Henne91 [18:02] hello all [18:02] feel free to join [18:02] https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/aa20339fb190a752484772753d8351b840718a2c?authuser=2&hl=en [18:03] hannie [18:04] UbuPhillup [18:04] are you joining ? [18:05] teolemon: no sorry i can only watch ;( [18:06] we'll start in just a moment [18:07] can hear you, need to check my mike [18:07] mic [18:07] we should be live [18:08] yes, I can hear you [18:09] i can see and hear you nice [18:09] remember to stop the video for anyone is the hangout [18:10] :-) [18:11] yes [18:12] asac: ack... I'll take a look [18:12] sorry, can't get it to work but I'm still listening [18:13] no you are not [18:14] you can talk we can hear you ;) [18:14] yes [18:15] but there's no point talking alone [18:15] so basically [18:15] any launchpad dev in the room ? [18:15] no ? [18:15] teolemon_, I'll leave the hangout up until you tell me to shut it down if you don't need it [18:15] we don't need it anymore [18:15] nobody will join [18:15] so useless [18:16] teolemon_, sorry :-( [18:16] sry, it actually should work but it does not [18:17] let's focus on the portal [18:17] that's the only thing we can move forward as translators [18:17] YoBoY [18:17] would you be able to host us [18:17] on your people.ubuntu.com space ? [18:18] basically, what we're going to do is host it first on a personnal folder [18:19] to have agility [18:19] and no restrictions [18:19] make an install [18:19] give rights to all the active members [18:19] (Hannie, Hendrik, if you're interested) [18:19] sure [18:19] we'll use the same theme as the French translation portal [18:20] which is working well [18:20] traduire.ubuntu-fr.org [18:20] if you want to have a look at it [18:20] looking good [18:21] so basically, let's have a look at the note on the pad and let's expand [18:21] Henne91: would be also a good think to have for the german community [18:21] sergiusens: that touch image testing session just ended ? [18:21] yes. is it using the default Ubuntu theme or is it modified? [18:21] you were still talking :) [18:22] (sorry for disturbing current session ... will move it offline) [18:22] I was wondering about doing an international one [18:22] asac: ended two hours ago [18:22] translated in various languages [18:23] including german french and dutch [18:23] and having some team specific pages [18:23] that would be nice [18:23] so that we save on ressources [18:23] maintenance time [18:23] and when we write somethinbg [18:23] or add a tool [18:23] everybody benefits quicly [18:23] quickly [18:23] and have the pages translated using launchpad [18:24] what do you think ? [18:24] teolemon_: Oh ok, so you mean completely combining everything. This way we could have an overview of packages that have to respect Upstream translations etc. [18:24] yes I think that's the right approach [18:25] i think it would be a very good idea [18:25] not sure what you mean by combining everything [18:25] but one interface [18:26] bridgin [18:26] g [18:26] yes [18:26] informational pages [18:26] nightmonkey [18:26] statistics [18:26] a page a bit like UDS [18:26] with a pad, irc [18:26] and hangout [18:26] for biweekly team meetings [18:27] ok, and every team would have to have a page for language-specific rules [18:27] translation rules [18:27] yes [18:28] hopefully [18:28] over time [18:28] we'll minimize the difference [18:28] yes [18:28] it's basically having a place [18:28] that makes us feel efficient [18:28] not having to look for the info [18:29] and where we can attract some new translators [18:29] make us look dynamic for potential [18:29] yes [18:29] that's it [18:29] ok, concerning the layout: I think we should maybe try to adapt to the standard Ubuntu layout to make it look uniform, but your layout basically does that I think [18:30] yes, i took it from launchpad [18:30] what software are you using to run the page? [18:30] it's an official template for community [18:30] unfortunately drupal [18:30] which is a pain in the *** [18:30] but works ok [18:30] and has the advantage of being a standard for ubuntu [18:31] so more people ready to help us [18:31] and having a ready made template [18:31] ok, I don't think it's to bad. I really like Joomla but Drupal is still better than Typo ;-) [18:31] if it's the Ubuntu standard we should stick with it [18:31] hopefully we should have a plugin for multilingual [18:31] site [18:31] with po export [18:32] and many plugins so that we don't have to reinvent the wheel [18:32] YoBoY ? [18:32] are you here ? [18:32] you mean a plugin with po export for Drupal? [18:32] to basically export content in a po file [18:32] put it up for translation on Launchpad [18:32] and reimport it [18:32] oh I see [18:33] and bang, content translated [18:33] do you know a plugin for that ? [18:33] i know that you can translate content within drupal [18:33] and i think the loco team more or less works that way [18:33] my guess would be: yes [18:33] drupal does export translations as po for modules as far as i can see [18:34] okey [18:34] http://drupal.org/documentation/modules/locale [18:35] this module can import po translations [18:36] and it does export po files [18:36] for content as well ? [18:36] i think so [18:37] coool [18:37] :-) [18:37] it says "generating portable object files from your site's strings" [18:37] so basically [18:38] is any of you a ubuntu member [18:38] with a people£.ubuntu.com hosting ? [18:38] no [18:38] no [18:38] so basically [18:38] either YoBoY says yes [18:38] but there was someone on the German translators team [18:39] or we can morph the French portal in the international one [18:39] during the test phase [18:39] and then properly host it on the official servers [18:39] is there enough space to set up a second portal for testing? [18:39] so we don't break the French one [18:39] we can do that as well [18:40] or I can host it on my personnal server [18:40] but I'd be more confident having something more or less ubuntu [18:41] can the person on the German team host us [18:41] yes [18:41]