[02:16] <zequence> Too bad. I think we've had at least five people come by here the last month wanting to help
[02:17] <zequence> None of them stick around after the first introduction
[02:17] <zequence> Either there's something really unpleasent with coming by here, or people get scared of actually having to do something
[02:25] <holstein> or they dont know what to do
[02:25] <Len-nb> hang around and listen anyway.... it's what I did
[02:26] <holstein> they might come back.. or prefer the mailing list
[02:27] <zequence> holstein: Each time, I told them what to do, and stick around
[02:27] <holstein> some folks dont like to hang on the IRC
[02:27] <zequence> Well, if they say they will, than I would assume that was their plan
[02:27] <holstein> in my local LUG, theres about 30 folks who come on and off
[02:28] <holstein> about 3 of those are in or on IRC
[02:28] <holstein> about 6 or 8 have said "im going to come and stick around in the IRC"
[02:28] <holstein> they dont ;)
[02:29] <zequence> If the person goes "great, tell me what to do. Ok, nice. I'll keep logged into this channel"..
[02:29] <zequence> It's not a misunderstanding on my part anyway
[02:29] <TheDrums> http://workaround.org/getting-help-on-irc is typically good, but a few of the things aren't quite in line with how we do it.
[02:31] <zequence> That's ok for user support, but it's a little different when it comes to geting people involved in development
[02:32] <zequence> And it is hard to know what to expect when you come here, for sure
[02:32] <TheDrums> Hrm, wrong topic.
[02:32] <zequence> If you don't have previous experience, you probably don't have a clue, and that's file
[02:33] <zequence> fine*
[02:33] <zequence> That's why I've been preparing documentation
[02:33] <zequence> Like this https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuStudio/SetupDeveloperEnvironment
[02:34] <zequence> But, the problem is, some people find even that one page to be this huge amount of text to read, so I think people are just not prepared to do that
[02:35] <zequence> anyway, it's really tough to find people
[02:35] <zequence> as it seems
[02:36] <zequence> Luke on the mail list seemed interested to start doing something, so that was positive
[02:37] <holstein> im going to stay off the mailing list
[02:37] <zequence> holstein: Why so?
[02:37] <holstein> ralph pushes my buttons... and then i misread things with my annoyed hat on tightly
[02:38] <zequence> :)
[02:38] <zequence> as long as someone is not clearly misinforming people, which happens, I try not to bother
[02:38] <holstein> yup
[02:38] <holstein> i'll take a break again, and i'll be cool
[02:39] <zequence> I get much too easily irritated myself. It's a real problem
[02:39] <holstein> im getting that way
[02:39] <holstein> im just too busy
[02:39] <holstein> it'll thin out a bit soon.. or at least get more "normal" and routine
[02:40] <TheDrums> I'm on x-dev and it seems pretty good, but I still never send to it.
[02:40] <zequence> holstein: What kind of gigs do you have now?
[02:40] <holstein> zequence: the one o have coming up is 8 shows a week
[02:40] <holstein> the one i*
[02:40] <holstein> plus, my other normal stuff
[02:41] <zequence> TheDrums: I've seen your nick here for a good while. Are you interested in helping out with Ubuntu Studio development?
[02:41] <holstein> i'll probably be playing 10 shows a week for about 11 weeks coming up
[02:41] <zequence> holstein: Theater?
[02:41] <holstein> zequence: yup :/
[02:41] <TheDrums> zequence: Sorry, but not all that much, I"m Unit193 of Xubuntu.
[02:41] <zequence> TheDrums: Ahaa
[02:41] <holstein> plus, i have a tech thing im taking on 2 days a week
[02:41] <holstein> not sure what
[02:41] <TheDrums> (And #ubuntustudio)
[02:41] <holstein> i think just helping folks..
[02:41] <zequence> TheDrums: Why the double identities?
[02:42] <holstein> TheDrums: i dont think i realized that..
[02:42] <zequence> TheDrums: irc alerts?
[02:42] <TheDrums> zequence: This is my alternick, to split up channels a bit.  I follow everything with the other, and this is for scrollback.
[02:42] <zequence> ok
[02:43] <zequence> holstein: You're getting to be a real veteran in the theater music business now then
[02:43] <holstein> hehe
[02:43] <holstein> right?!
[02:43] <zequence> You only started with that about a year ago, or something, was it?
[02:44] <holstein> yup.. 2 shows last summer too
[02:44] <TheDrums> holstein: (You mean the cloak didn't give it away?)
[02:45] <holstein> TheDrums: i never claimed to be observant
[03:00] <TheDrums> zequence: Though, what do you happen to need help with right now?
[03:02] <zequence> TheDrums: Nothing critical, if that is what you mean :). But, there are definately all kinds of areas that would need attention. 
[03:02] <zequence> User documentation, both written and videos. We have nothing there
[03:03] <zequence> A full inventory on the applications that are avilable for our workflows (probably one person would only like to do one of the workflows), and see if we are shipping the right stuff
[03:03] <zequence> Also, make sure the applications are fully functional and not lacking in the way they were built or packaged
[03:04] <zequence> That's something that Debian folks might not be fully on top, as some of them are packaging ridiculous amounts of applications
[03:04] <zequence> I should just write a list of these things, and post on the mail list soonish
[03:05] <zequence> Or, better yet, first ask for ideas on what we need done - adding the things I'm aware of (and things that are in progress already)
[03:08] <zequence> I'm slowly realizing that in order for people to get a picture of how they can help, giving them concrete tasks is probably the best first step
[03:09] <zequence> Insight in the fringes of Ubuntu flavor development probably comes later
[03:20] <TheDrums> Aha, I see.  What doc format are you using?
[03:28] <zequence> TheDrums: So far, this is all that exists, and I'm sure I'd come back to it if I felt I had the time https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuStudio/UserGuide
[03:29] <zequence> The idea is that it should be focused more on our workflows, rather than desktop usage
[03:29] <zequence> Naturally, we need a section about installation and hardware support
[03:30] <zequence> As for hardware support, that is also a bit special, since we should provide links and information to all hardware that deals with multimedia
[03:30] <zequence> The user guide, as far as using goes, should only be introductional
[03:31] <zequence> Then, provide links to other places of information, where there are manuals for things, etc
[03:31] <zequence> Actually, my idea is that Ubuntu Studio should offer information on all sorts of sites and forums that deal with Linux multimedia
[03:32] <zequence> So, that people who come to the Linux multimedia world, and often using Ubuntu Studio, may have a way to get in touch with the whole Linux multimedia community
[03:32] <zequence> Videos are probably better as usage introduction for a lot of things though
[03:32] <zequence> I'm preparing a youtube channel. More on that later
[03:36] <TheDrums> I'd assume you've seen docs.xubuntu.org, I personally don't do a lot of multimedia, at least not in the form that US is made for.
[03:57] <zequence> TheDrums: Yes. But, that is more in the line of regular desktop usage, which is something we can just redirect our users to, not matter which DE they use. If XFCE, the Xubuntu docs are good
[12:48] <madeinkobaia> Hi all : )
[13:21] <OvenWerks> zequence: just in case you missed it... I be Len. I have gone to irssi running in screen.
[13:22] <OvenWerks> madeinkobaia: Hi :)
[13:22] <madeinkobaia> OvenWerks : Hi Len :)
[14:29] <zequence> OvenWerks: Ah, you're running a server now then
[14:30] <zequence> That's how I'm doing it too
[17:13] <holstein> DarkEra: if ive learned anything from the support channels, its "assume nothing"
[17:14] <holstein> DarkEra: i dont remember that guy at all... but we are on the right track now
[17:14] <holstein> or at least, a lot better
[17:14] <DarkEra> that's what i learned too right now ;)
[17:15] <DarkEra> his previous nick doesn't really ring a bell
[17:16] <holstein> could have been months ago.. who knows
[17:16] <holstein> the intel stuff is usually well supported, so its probably just a matter of using the proper tool for dual head
[17:17] <holstein> to configure dual head
[17:17] <holstein> of course, i dont know why installing 12.04 isnt an option
[17:17] <holstein> i dont like it when folks dont seem eager to try suggestions
[17:17] <DarkEra> yep, if i knew it was intel i would have suggested using Arandr$
[17:17] <holstein> if dreamstudio worked, i would run it live at least, and look and see what is supporting the hardware
[17:18] <holstein> i would have no problem doing an install of it and looking
[17:18] <holstein> folks seem like installing is such a big deal
[17:18] <holstein> i can reinstall in like 20 minutes...
[17:18] <holstein> anyways, i dont think it'll be a big deal
[17:18] <holstein> i was thinking more about the nvidia xorg.conf's that get made
[17:18] <DarkEra> depending on the hardware yes, i can install in 10 to 15 minutes
[17:20] <DarkEra> his rebooting and getting back online takes a while so i guess it's a older machine
[17:21] <holstein> you literally never know.. even that could have been a mis-communication
[17:23] <DarkEra> hmmm... true
[17:55] <holstein> well, nothing kills the vibe like talking about where hardware support should come from ;)
[22:44] <OvenWerks> holstein: quite honestly we do have a less than good way of dealing with dual monitors.
[22:45] <OvenWerks> xfce 4.12 coming out real soon now, is supposed to fix a lot of that
[22:45] <OvenWerks> We should be able to remove arandr. and the settings sholod be saved from boot to boot.
[22:46] <OvenWerks> *should
[22:47] <OvenWerks> I think if dual monitors works right OOTB, more people will just use the free drivers because that will do what needs to be done.