| zequence | OvenWerks: No, icons go with icons. If there's a problemw with how the menu works, I'd rather fix it upstream | 01:36 |
|---|---|---|
| zequence | Sorry to be repetetive on that, and it's perhaps not the time to do that actively | 01:37 |
| zequence | But, that should be the goal | 01:37 |
| zequence | Ah, PA just got into -proposed | 01:40 |
| zequence | So, time to test it, and give it the green flag | 01:40 |
| zequence | Luke is a ubuntustudio-contributor now | 01:42 |
| OvenWerks | zequence: so ardour should have their icon included in gnome-icons? | 02:41 |
| OvenWerks | An apps icons go in the apps package. The studio menu is like an app and should include it's own icons, needed to make it work. | 02:42 |
| OvenWerks | An icon theme is something that can be switched in an out | 02:42 |
| OvenWerks | an apps icons are there by default. | 02:43 |
| OvenWerks | Any icons that belong in /usr/share/icons/hicolor belong in the package of the app that uses them | 02:43 |
| OvenWerks | Our workflow menu merge should continue to work even if the user chooses another icon theme | 02:44 |
| OvenWerks | This becomes important when adding studio to another flavour. | 02:46 |
| zequence | We aren't shipping an app | 02:51 |
| OvenWerks | My sense is that gnome-icons should already have the icons we need, upstream. But our menu should not depend on a theme. | 02:51 |
| OvenWerks | our menu is the same kind of thing. | 02:52 |
| zequence | We're customizing the menu, which IMO, we should do as little as possible | 02:52 |
| OvenWerks | If I am running KDE and install some studio metas and want the studio menu, I should not have to load US-icon_theme to make it work | 02:52 |
| zequence | The settings depend on the icons | 02:53 |
| OvenWerks | Nor should the user need to select the US theme | 02:54 |
| zequence | No, they shouldn't | 02:54 |
| zequence | It's a flaw | 02:54 |
| OvenWerks | Right | 02:54 |
| zequence | IMO | 02:54 |
| OvenWerks | The way to fix the flaw is to include the needed icons with the menu. | 02:54 |
| zequence | Or, to redesign the menu, so it works with upstream | 02:54 |
| zequence | Or, develop a standalone package that is called ubuntustudio-menu | 02:55 |
| OvenWerks | That is the same as using the stock menu | 02:55 |
| OvenWerks | That is what I am doing | 02:55 |
| OvenWerks | There is already a package with that name | 02:55 |
| zequence | I know | 02:55 |
| OvenWerks | I have already started fixing it. | 02:56 |
| zequence | Have you thought about how you could push changes upstream yet? | 02:56 |
| zequence | And which changes would be relevant upstream | 02:57 |
| OvenWerks | First would be to get the extra categories | 02:57 |
| zequence | I suppose it might prove best to make all DEs work first, with as much generic work as possible | 02:57 |
| OvenWerks | I think the sub menus we have could make sense in any distro dedicated to these workflows or even only one of them. | 02:58 |
| zequence | I'd really appreciate if you could find solutions that work on all DEs | 02:58 |
| zequence | Not all DEs use menus | 02:58 |
| OvenWerks | That is exactly my plan | 02:58 |
| OvenWerks | I understand that. | 02:58 |
| zequence | What unites all DEs are the categories | 02:59 |
| zequence | You know better than me, what unites the menu based DEs | 02:59 |
| OvenWerks | But those that do have a standard and a menu that merges fixes those at least. | 02:59 |
| OvenWerks | We could (it would be a lot of work) make a whole new set of desktop files too. | 03:00 |
| zequence | You mean for all the different applications? | 03:01 |
| OvenWerks | All the apps in our workflows... No I am not volumteering :) | 03:01 |
| zequence | It will need to be done | 03:01 |
| zequence | I can work on that, from Debian | 03:01 |
| OvenWerks | upstream would be better | 03:02 |
| OvenWerks | It would allow oru menus to be less custom too | 03:02 |
| OvenWerks | s/oru/our | 03:03 |
| zequence | Then it's the best path | 03:03 |
| OvenWerks | The parts of our menu that require heavy customization are done. | 03:03 |
| zequence | The XFCE menu, or the menus for all DEs? | 03:04 |
| OvenWerks | For all xdg compliant menus | 03:04 |
| OvenWerks | I have it working on KDE here | 03:04 |
| OvenWerks | I have a lubuntu copy I will try it on too | 03:05 |
| OvenWerks | Because it is a small menu on it's own, it could also be used on it's own on a menuless desktop as well | 03:05 |
| OvenWerks | using one of the many small pannels for example | 03:06 |
| OvenWerks | I don't know if that is a good idea or not though | 03:06 |
| zequence | I can have a quick test with lxde and also cinnamon to see how it works | 03:08 |
| OvenWerks | That is why I want to have a package | 03:09 |
| OvenWerks | installing a list of files manually is no fun. | 03:09 |
| zequence | It would be better in deed to have the menu on its own | 03:10 |
| OvenWerks | My plan is to be able to leave the stock menu in any DE alone and just add our workflows | 03:11 |
| OvenWerks | In the same way wine adds their little menu. | 03:11 |
| OvenWerks | It would mean loosing anything I have done on settings, and the set of apps at the top of our xfce menu... but it means less up keep. | 03:13 |
| OvenWerks | I think one of the things xfce has been working has been cleaning settings up anyway. | 03:14 |
| zequence | PA checks out. I gave it the green flag. Hopefully it'll be in -updates within the week | 03:14 |
| OvenWerks | Or we can use xubuntu's menu | 03:14 |
| OvenWerks | is that for 12.04 | 03:14 |
| OvenWerks | ? | 03:14 |
| zequence | 12.04 and 12.10 | 03:14 |
| OvenWerks | good | 03:14 |
| OvenWerks | zequence: when It is easy to install our metas with the other flavours, I would like to do some performance testing and comparing. | 03:15 |
| zequence | Let's make sure the categories are really well though out in a couple of months, and I can do the work on changing the desktop files upstream | 03:16 |
| OvenWerks | So far, on this machine, KDE (kubuntu) does better than the studio ISO | 03:16 |
| zequence | That might be interesting for the people with older machines, so perhaps start a wiki page about that. Would be best to get more machines involved in testing too before release, on that particular subject | 03:17 |
| zequence | If we find that one DE is best for older machines, it could be recommended | 03:18 |
| zequence | Or, a set of DEs | 03:18 |
| OvenWerks | Ya, one would expect lxde to be best for that, but I will see. | 03:18 |
| OvenWerks | is zeinty common to all the flavours? | 03:19 |
| zequence | What's that? | 03:20 |
| OvenWerks | I am thinking of using it to make a studio meta installer. | 03:20 |
| OvenWerks | it is a dialog tool for scripting. | 03:20 |
| OvenWerks | like xmessage, but with more options. | 03:20 |
| zequence | I'd like to see what it is before you do any actual work on that | 03:21 |
| OvenWerks | It doesn't need extra libs like python does. | 03:21 |
| zequence | The choice of tools should be something that works best with the Debian installation | 03:21 |
| zequence | Could be just a simple bash script | 03:21 |
| OvenWerks | I am doing it for my use. If you like it I have no problem with it being used else where | 03:21 |
| OvenWerks | I am realizing testing would be so much easier If I have a tool. | 03:23 |
| OvenWerks | I have found out that kubuntu has their whole own section of ubiquity and the distro upgrader with non-gtk libs. | 03:24 |
| OvenWerks | I don't want to follow that. | 03:24 |
| zequence | OvenWerks: Here https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuStudio/DesktopEnvironmentTesting | 03:25 |
| OvenWerks | I don't want to load extra gtk libs on a kde system either... though I guess some of our apps will anyway. | 03:25 |
| OvenWerks | OK, That is the place to add results and things to test. | 03:26 |
| zequence | Time for breakfest, and then school. | 03:27 |
| OvenWerks | Enjoy | 03:27 |
| OvenWerks | zequence: on Kubuntu, pulse seems to do an auto fallover to jack sink if the defaukt is busy... or maybe just because jacksink is there. It pops a notice up with an option to decline that action. Nice. | 14:01 |
| zequence | Someone doing a Strokes cover using Ubuntu Studio https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JxieG2YXczk | 14:53 |
| zequence | He's done a few covers like that | 14:55 |
| holstein | i was thinking some kind of cover page ;) | 14:55 |
| holstein | nice video work too | 14:55 |
| zequence | I suppose Ubuntu Studio would work for that too | 14:56 |
| zequence | This one was cool. Too bad about the xruns. Guess he didn't have any decent kernel (if he wasn't using a PPA) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sfiU6fCo48Q | 15:00 |
| zequence | I have to try using a vocoder some time | 15:00 |
| zequence | A bit nostalgic now to see the old Gnome2 desktop with the old theme | 15:01 |
| holstein | i know | 15:02 |
| zequence | There's an autogenerated channel for Ubuntu Studio here https://www.youtube.com/channel/HCkGK6Zv5-b0I/feed?filter=2 | 15:03 |
| zequence | I'm setting up a channel for us, as soon as I get ownership of the G+ page, which I want to link it to | 15:04 |
| zequence | Would be good to do a couple of videos ourselves | 15:04 |
| holstein | yup.. tutorials | 15:08 |
| zequence | OvenWerks: I would think pulseaudio works the same way on all DEs | 16:21 |
| zequence | Just that KDE has different gui controls for it | 16:21 |
| holstein | i have to say, i havent upgraded my studio machine since i installed it | 19:30 |
| holstein | i figured, what the hey.. i bet its OK now to just upgrade | 19:30 |
| holstein | i will go back to *never* upgrading my studio production machine again | 19:31 |
| holstein | i mean, dont get me wrong, im sure its an nvidia thing.. but still.. its a drag | 19:31 |
| zequence | holstein: What happened? | 19:33 |
| zequence | a studio machine that works, I never upgrade either | 19:34 |
| holstein | well, i rebooted into only one screen of my dual head.. with just half a panel | 19:34 |
| holstein | i went and setup nvidia settings again, and i have the dual head again.. but one monitor is half the resolution it was before | 19:34 |
| holstein | so, i most recently tried using the line from the old xorg with the resolutions in the newer one.. and now, i just have the boot logo stuck on both screens | 19:35 |
| holstein | i tried booting an older kernel... i suppose i can downgrade the nvidia driver | 19:35 |
| holstein | i like the "appliance" approach | 19:36 |
| holstein | i thought the newer kernel might be "better" or something | 19:36 |
| holstein | at least i did it *after* getting some work done | 19:36 |
| zequence | those kernels have pretty big changelogs, and you rarely see that much fixes done to any piece of software in such a short time | 19:37 |
| holstein | thats why i thought booting the older kernel would "fix" it | 19:38 |
| zequence | But, who benefits? Hard to say. Should not cause nvidia regressions though | 19:38 |
| holstein | tbh, ive *always* had issues like this with dual head on the studio machin | 19:38 |
| holstein | machine | 19:38 |
| holstein | intel.. amd.. whatever | 19:38 |
| holstein | i just got in the habit of not upgrading | 19:39 |
| holstein | and, i just remembered why ;) | 19:39 |
| OvenWerks | holstein: hard drives are cheap. I buy a new one for the new install. I have three versions of ubuntustudio on different drives. | 20:07 |
| holstein | OvenWerks: oh, i have 3 installs on here | 20:13 |
| holstein | the 10.04 ubuntustudio, a testing partition, and my 12.04 production area.. which is the one that i "broke" | 20:13 |
| holstein | i added a ppa to try newer versions of nvidia | 20:14 |
| holstein | i'll just get a knoppix live CD and use it to create the resolution | 20:14 |
| holstein | i just shouldnt have to | 20:14 |
| OvenWerks | Ya, I have been surprised that kubuntu seems to run better than our own xfce | 20:16 |
| holstein | i hope this is not DE releaste.. i didnt even think about that | 20:16 |
| OvenWerks | Video in particular | 20:16 |
| holstein | related* | 20:16 |
| holstein | yeah, it would be nice to get falk in here and do the KDE stuff | 20:16 |
| OvenWerks | I am not so sure. | 20:16 |
| OvenWerks | KDE runs with our metas pretty good as is. | 20:17 |
| OvenWerks | I want to try doing the same with xubuntu, to see if it is the same if that runs better then some of our system settings are off | 20:18 |
| holstein | lol | 20:26 |
| holstein | that would be interesting | 20:26 |
| holstein | to say the least | 20:26 |
| OvenWerks | Sometimes settings that work with one kernel (I think we tried them at 3.1 or 3.5) don't work so well with another | 20:27 |
| holstein | i know, but i booted my older kernel and tested | 20:32 |
| holstein | its odd | 20:32 |
| holstein | its like the nvidia driver negated the resolution i need | 20:33 |
| holstein | and, it *was* running on there | 20:33 |
| OvenWerks | holstein: in case you missed it, I am working on a menu that should work with any DE (that is xdg compliant). With the idea that a user could just install some metas on top of any Ubuntu flavour and go. | 20:46 |
| holstein | OvenWerks: i think thats a great idea | 20:46 |
| holstein | OvenWerks: let me know if i can test it somewhere.. mabye openbox/lxde | 20:46 |
| OvenWerks | I am pretty sure I could do that with KDE, xfce, lxde etc. Gnome session should work but the menu may not show same with unity. | 20:47 |
| OvenWerks | (I have it working with KDE now, but it was a manual install) | 20:48 |
| OvenWerks | Luke is working on Cinnamon as well | 20:50 |
| madeinkobaia | For those who's on board, I salute you : ) | 22:40 |
Generated by irclog2html.py 2.7 by Marius Gedminas - find it at mg.pov.lt!