phillwSergioMeneses: hi, I have let the laptop team know that you are not available that week for the classroom sessions. If it becomes impossible, then we can have a chat with the classroom team and arrange that for a different week.00:29
SergioMenesesphillw, but we have more members in the group... I'm not the only one00:32
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pittiGood morning04:37
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jibelgood morning07:05
Noskcajhas everyone added themselves to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/WhoWeAre09:39
* pitti adds himself09:41
Noskcajyay, one more person09:43
Noskcajnow if only kirkland and roaxsoax would stop having lives, my work items for S cycle would be complete09:44
Noskcajpitti, if only you'd put yourself in the right spot ( +1 goes above +2)09:47
* Noskcaj fixes09:47
pittiNoskcaj: well, jibel's +2 is really the same TZ that I'm in09:47
pittiNoskcaj: perhaps fix jibel's to say UTC+1 ? DST applies to all of us, after all09:48
Noskcajok, sounds better09:48
pitti(and CEST → CET)09:48
pittiIMHO it's a bit pointless to keep mentioning  DST in every other row09:48
Noskcaji thin kit's all fixed09:49
Noskcaj*think it's09:49
pittiNoskcaj: not quite, CET = UTC+1, CEST = UTC+2, I'll fix09:50
Noskcajok, ty09:51
* Noskcaj doesn't understand European or Us timezones09:51
pittiNoskcaj: you don't have DST?09:51
pittioh, nevermind09:51
Noskcajpitti, i do, but i mean i don't know the abbreviations etc.09:51
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balloonssmart scopes is here if your on saucy :-)15:20
DanChapmansweet :D15:21
SergioMenesesballoons, nice!15:23
asachello ... is there someone specified what exactly is done here: http://reports.qa.ubuntu.com/memory/arch/armhf/ ?16:03
asace.g. at what time do we measure for "Fresh Install - touch" ?16:03
asacand what does "Daily Upgrade - desktop" mean?16:03
asacwho knows anything about that?16:04
asacplars: ?16:04
plarsasac: at one time, we were doing these tests on ubuntu desktop image running on nexus 7. For a long time, preseeding didn't work right so we were doing day-day upgrades16:05
asacah i see16:06
plarsasac: you can ignore those now though, as the desktop nexus7 images are no longer an issue. I've asked to have it removed or at least archived from the view16:06
asacit just means: this is not a fresh install, but something we upgraded as we didnt know any better16:06
asacbut its still the same measurement point.16:06
plarsasac: also, be aware, there is a problem with jenkins publishing right now, so all the results you are seeing are old16:06
asacso what is measured here?16:06
asacright after login?16:06
plarsjobs are still running, but not getting published properly16:06
asacwhat does that mean?16:07
plarsafter boot, it was auto-login though, so effectively the same16:07
plarsmultiple runs though16:07
asacbut log in to desktop?16:07
asacor just headless?16:07
plarsyes, it's logged into the desktop16:07
asacwhy did our stddev increase so much recently?16:08
asac(assuming the black line is that)16:08
asaci guess the big spiked are really infrastructure bustages or soemthing16:09
asacbut seems we settled on afar higher value than 1 month ago16:09
asacplars: also, do we wait after logging in until the system has settled? how are we doing that?16:10
plarsasac: at the moment, we just give it 5 min, then we run smem every minute, 30 times for each run16:11
plarsasac: also there are some things that get disabled16:12
plarsasac: like the cron job for apt-update-xapian-index16:12
plarsonly applicable on desktop of course16:12
asacbut you work on revamping that in the way tvoss proposed in the doc?16:12
asacor is that already worked in?16:12
plarsyes, we've been talking to tvoss about that16:12
asacare those changes underway?16:12
plarsyes, javier is working on that piece16:13
asacfelt reasonable and hopefyully would mkake the number more useful16:13
asacwhen do you think will that land?16:13
plarsno idea at the moment, there's a lot to be done there, and last I talked to javier he was running into some issues with autopilot on it16:13
plarsso we may have to come up with a different approach if those cannot be resolved16:14
plarssome of the events we need to wait for are ui events though, so we hoped it would be a good fit16:14
asacstop :)16:14
asaci dont undersatnd how autopilot comes into picture16:14
asacis that part of the use casese we wanted to measure16:14
* asac opens the doc16:14
plarsasac: because some of the things that were requested require driving the ui16:15
asacmy understanding is wee want to measure these with reboots in between X times:16:15
asac 1. Phone booted16:15
asac  2. Browser started16:15
asac3. Browser finished loading16:15
asacplars: ah ok... autopilot is used to drive UI for those16:15
asacbut we talk about the same list, correct?16:16
asacok so we have two things:16:16
asac1. move to different approach on how we measure (with reboots in between)16:16
plarsautopilot seemed like the most direct approach, but if it doesn't work out, other possibilities will be investigated16:16
asac2. land use case measures from doc16:16
asaccan we have 1. before 2.?16:16
asaci believe 1. can be delivered pretty soon, while 2. might take a bit as you need to model the test cases in autopilot16:18
plarsasac: what do you mean by moving to a different approach?16:18
asachave you checked if they have similar autopilot tests?16:18
asaci guess there might be something close enough to avoid redoing that16:18
plarswell, you still need to make sure that you measure at *exactly* the same place16:18
asacplars: i cant remember exactly. tvoss said you discussed changing how you measure to get better results16:18
asac i believed it was about not measuring 20 times aftrer one boot16:19
asacbut rather booting 20 times16:19
asacand measure after certain events16:19
plarsif I recall correctly from the meeting, even rebooting 20 times was something he felt like was overkill, and maybe worth trying once to see if it was consistent, but also agreed that if we aren't seeing large fluctuations from one day to the next, we are effectually doing the same thing16:20
asacplars: the current chart shows high stddevs16:20
asacthose numbers are not very good16:20
asacand will not allow very tight steering of our memory barriers16:20
plarsasac: yes, I've looked at those16:23
asacright. ok lets chat on monday when tvoss is back16:23
plarsthe biggest thing at the moment is that we have a few processes, mainly one in particular16:23
plarshang on, the name escapes me...16:24
plarsthat pops on at the beginning16:25
plarswe could wait a bit longer and wait for that to go away16:25
plarsmy understanding is that it's just active 1. right after boot and 2. when there's activity16:25
asacmaybe we can turn services that we dont want to measure off?16:26
asac"quiesce" the system?16:26
doanac`plars, asac: trying to catch up, but tvoss wants something orthogonal to the current test we have16:26
plarsI was looking into that late last week. delaying isn't ideal, but it's also not much better to check for the presence of arbitrary processes16:26
plarsthere could always be "something new"16:26
asacdoanac`: dont try, we are far faster in writing than you can think :)16:27
asacsorry its friday afternoon16:27
plarsdoanac`: indeed, I don't think we want to change what we have, so much as we want to add to it16:27
asacdoanac`: really? can you give me your story?16:27
plarsasac: I know! :)16:27
doanac`let me find the link16:27
plarsI think waiting an extra 5 min would do it16:28
plarsas far as this problem goes16:28
doanac`so its measuring memory at certain times, but also measuring the process itself not just the whole system16:28
doanac`ie - how much memory does browser-app take16:29
plarshud service seems to disappear by the 4th run on the results I've looked at16:29
doanac`so there are more distinct things you measure16:29
doanac`and compare16:29
plarswhich means 5min delay, +4  once/min runs16:29
plarsso that would be 2 min buffer16:29
doanac`i guess you still have to wait for the system to quiece though since that's one of the memory metrics that are listed16:30
plarsfor now, I think it makes sense to change the delay at least, which should tighten up the stddev quite a bit I believe16:31
asacplars: we should impleemnt real triggers16:31
asacnot do arbitrary sleeps16:31
asacjust as a general thing16:31
plarsasac: true, so you want the system to tell us when it's quiesced?16:31
asacand i am sure doanac` agrees16:31
plarsthat's what I was saying earlier too16:32
asacmaybe a voting daemon16:32
plarsbut how does it know?16:32
asacmultiple components saying that they are ready16:32
asacand once all are done, fire off16:32
plarsif you know of a better way than waiting or watching processes that is16:32
asacrequires work16:32
asaclook at all the stuff that starts16:32
asacensure it can tell you when its feinished16:32
asac(will be custom solutions for each thing for sure)16:32
asacand see16:32
asacalso figure if we can shut down stuff16:33
asacbut thats not really good. we want full experience16:33
plarsasac: want to talk to the touch foundations folks and see if they have something like this that could be worked in?16:33
plarsasac: or is that something we should talk to tvoss about?16:33
asacwell, you guys could do analysis of what is noisy16:33
asacthen we can work together to ensure you can get triggers16:34
plarsasac: it's hard for me to say that word :)16:34
asaclets really check monday16:34
plarsasac: I can tell you what's noisy now, I just did16:34
plarsasac: it's that one process at the moment16:34
asactvoss is on vacation :) ... so we can blame him anyway until then16:34
plarsasac: but I can't guarantee it will always be that way in the future16:34
plarshaha, ok16:34
asacand have a good weekend16:34
asacplars: so 1% stddev is good16:35
asac2% is acceptable16:35
asaceverything beyond isnt really that nice16:35
asacits a reproducible machine after all ... should be very very low16:36
asacif we do it right16:36
plarsdoanac`, asac: for the moment, I'm going to extend the quiesce delay at least and see where that gets us. It's certainly wrong to have some runs with hud-service active and others without it16:36
plarsasac: indeed16:36
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asacyeah lets see16:44
asacdo extra runs over weekend so we see a pattern16:45
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DanChapmanballoons after my update today i've lost totem. Is it planned to be removed? Curious since we have just merged the totem test17:31
balloonsDanChapman, lol..not to my knowledge. I'm guessing you got a partial upgrade17:32
balloonsthat means not everything hit the archive at the same time.. happens in the dev release. You have to be careful how you upgrade and make sure it doesn't want to do something wacky like remove half your desktop packages17:33
DanChapmanahh right i see. Its the only thing that went as far as i can see. Will be more careful :D17:34
balloonsit's simple enough to re-install.. make sure you still have ubuntu-desktop meta package too17:35
gemaasac: we will land the first test next week18:30
gemaasac: and soon after it'll start reporting18:31
balloonsLetozaf_, hello again ;-)19:08
Letozaf_balloons, Hello :)19:08
balloonsI just saw your MP.. time to finish this!19:08
Letozaf_balloons, yes19:08
Letozaf_balloons, pitty that drop shadow does not work :p19:08
balloonsLetozaf_, trying to convince me to hack on it a bit more :-p19:10
Letozaf_balloons, :) only if you think you can solve the problem, but I was already preparing to file a bug :p19:11
balloonsindeed.. we'll let it go to the bug19:11
Letozaf_balloons, ok :-)19:11
balloonsit's in.. I'll push to the production branch too19:12
balloonswhew.. excellent19:12
Letozaf_balloons, good !19:14
Letozaf_balloons, I reported but number 118878119:36
balloonsbug #118878119:36
ubot5bug 1188781 in Autopilot "autopilot fails to detect screenshot attribute" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/118878119:36
Letozaf_balloons, sorry bug19:36
Letozaf_not but19:36
Letozaf_balloons, yes right :p19:37
balloonsLetozaf_, perfect.. we should try and make sure we open bugs when we get stuck or otherwise leave an open feature19:38
balloonsat any rate, excellent work19:38
Letozaf_balloons, ok, thanks :p19:38
balloonsso we cleared through everything :-)19:39
balloonsnot bad for a little over a month eh? Remember the brokenness in April :-)19:39
Letozaf_balloons, yes looks like19:39
Letozaf_balloons, yes great job19:40
Letozaf_balloons, we have a lot of tests working now19:40
balloonsLetozaf_, yes everything in the production branch works.. and will always work19:41
balloonsthe qa team is working on integrating that so they'll be running everyday19:41
balloonsit should happen this month19:41
balloonsso yay!19:41
Letozaf_balloons, cool! nice to know it    YAY!!!!19:41
balloonsso enjoy your weekend.. lots of things to be happy about..19:41
Letozaf_balloons, sure and thanks for your help :)19:42
Letozaf_balloons, hope you enjoy your week-end too19:42
Letozaf_balloons, hopefully it will stop raining here in Itlay this week-end, I am really sick of rain :p19:43
balloonssun came out again here Letozaf_19:43
balloonswe had a tropical storm dumping rain and wind for several days here19:43
balloonsbut it's gone today finally19:43
Letozaf_balloons, also here, today was quite fine, but until yesterday it kept on raining and it was cold19:44
balloonswild.. is that normal for summertime?19:45
Letozaf_balloons, noooo!!! this year is really odd, well it's still spring, but this time of the year shouldn't be so cold and rainy19:46
balloonsstill spring? lol I suppose19:46
balloonsit's June!19:47
Letozaf_balloons, well officially summer starts the 21st of June :p19:47
balloonswhere I used to live last year it was like 8 c at this time while I was visiting.. very crazy cold for no reason19:47
balloonssorry.. I was visiting last year, the place I grew up19:47
Letozaf_balloons, I think it's better in Florida, weather wise19:48
balloonsyea, I think so :-p19:48
balloonsbut people who want "perfect" weather tend to hit the california coast. You can have 16 C year round19:49
balloonsor in san diego 23 c year round :-)19:49
Letozaf_balloons, thats great!19:49
Letozaf_balloons, next time I decide  to go and live somewhere else I will go to S.Diego19:49
balloonsI prefer the variation I get here.. but in general no cold for me thanks :-)19:49
balloonsLetozaf_, lolololol19:50
Letozaf_balloons, neither do I like cold19:50
balloonsSouth Africa and California I think are very similar climate and geographywise19:50
Letozaf_balloons, but this year weather was really bad up to now, hope things will change19:50
balloonsnot sure how long you lived in SA19:50
Letozaf_balloons, yeah South Africa has great weather19:50
Letozaf_balloons, I left SA when I was only 10 I was born there19:51
Letozaf_balloons, so I lived there 10 years19:51
balloonslol. just a kid :-) But old enough to remember a bit perhaps19:51
balloonsif you have better memory than me19:51
balloonsI've no idea what I did at 1019:51
Letozaf_balloons, well I remember all the nice things, my friends, school, my house the good weather19:52
balloonsthat's the best way to remember :-)19:52
Letozaf_balloons, yes19:52
Letozaf_balloons, I remember I used to hate Africaans, infact do not remember much19:53
balloonsLetozaf_, hmm.. More than me.19:58
Letozaf_balloons, :)19:58
balloonshello Noskcaj20:10
Noskcajhey balloons20:10
Noskcaji think i've got everyone onto thw WhoWeAre page20:11
balloonsnice.. how's the testdrive and using dev release page coming?20:12
Noskcajballoons, the page is finished except for screenshots.20:37
Noskcajand i need kirkland and roaxsoax to stop having lives outside of ubuntu20:37
balloonsNoskcaj, lol20:38
balloonsit's hard sometimes20:38
balloonsit's winter for you but summer for everyone else20:38
Noskcajon a different topic, i have a topic for vUDS, but my timezone doesn't allow me to do anything about it. Get Magnet links in Ubuntu20:39
balloonsNoskcaj,  I would open a blueprint and share it.. Sadly if you can't but there it's a little tough20:42
Noskcaji'll try20:42
Noskcajback to testdrive: i also need howard to live in a place that doesn't have a huge exam period, like australia20:42
balloonslol.. he's in a compatible timezone though!20:43
balloonsit could be much worse20:43
balloonsone more week and he's done20:43
Noskcajgood point20:52
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