[02:06] <littlegirl> Hey there. (:
[02:07] <littlegirl> ahoneybun are you at keys?
[02:07] <ahoneybun> hello littlegirl :)
[02:07] <ahoneybun> what?
[02:08] <ahoneybun> at keys
[02:08] <ahoneybun> ?
[02:08] <littlegirl> You put the how-to line above the important line - you might want to switch those around. Also, did you and Valorie decide not to have the GUI (Muon) instructions in that section at all?
[02:08] <littlegirl> Ah, at keys is my way of saying at the keyboard. Sorry. (:
[02:08] <ahoneybun> lol
[02:09] <ahoneybun> I just removed the part dealing with the source.list
[02:10] <littlegirl> The part with Muon also got removed. If you do a diff you can see it. (:
[02:11] <littlegirl> I made sure and put GUI and command line instructions for everything, and there are now just command line instructions on that section. (:
[02:13] <littlegirl> Also, the "Add a PPA" subheading is gone from the "Managing Personal Package Archives" section. You might want to put that back as well. (:
[02:13] <ahoneybun> I don't see anything about muon on ppas
[02:14] <ahoneybun> I see
[02:16] <ahoneybun> check it now :)
[02:18] <smartboyhw> Hey guys:P
[02:19] <ahoneybun> smartboyhw: hey
[02:20] <smartboyhw> ahoneybun: How's docs?
[02:20] <ahoneybun> smartboyhw: coming along :)
[02:20] <smartboyhw> ;)
[02:20] <ahoneybun> https://trello.com/board/kubuntu-docs-saucy-salamander/518d39bc9433cf5507000173
[02:21] <littlegirl> ahoneybun: Almost perfect. (:
[02:22] <ahoneybun> littlegirl: almost?
[02:22] <ahoneybun> smartboyhw: https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/KubuntuDocs
[02:22] <littlegirl> ahoneybun: Now you got rid of Valorie's changes at the bottom. If you replace [02:23] <ahoneybun> omg thanks
[02:23] <littlegirl> heh
[02:23] <littlegirl> She probably would have realized it and fetched them. (:
[02:24] <ahoneybun> littlegirl: but more work for her 
[02:24]  * littlegirl nods at ahoneybun
[02:24] <littlegirl> Hey there, smartboyhw. (:
[02:24] <littlegirl> Are you another docs contributor?
[02:24] <ahoneybun> bad if we just erase each others work
[02:24] <smartboyhw> littlegirl: o/ packager
[02:25] <littlegirl> Not a problem, though, because you can revert or at least copy and paste from the history. (:
[02:25] <smartboyhw> tester also
[02:25] <littlegirl> smartboyhw: Oh! That's something I've never tried. (:
[02:25] <littlegirl> Tester I've been and will probably always be. (:
[02:26] <littlegirl> ahoneybun, what still needs doing that I can do?
[02:26] <ahoneybun> well I have lordievader on something but he has been busy
[02:27] <ahoneybun> not sure If I should just take him off
[02:27] <ahoneybun> don't want to seem mean
[02:27] <littlegirl> Yeah, don't do that. I'd wait and see if he says he can'
[02:27] <littlegirl> can't do it. (:
[02:28] <littlegirl> Is there anything else?
[02:28] <ahoneybun> I think we could use more content
[02:28] <ahoneybun> not sure what though
[02:29] <littlegirl> Then I guess that can wait until you know what it ought to be. (:
[02:29] <ahoneybun> well we have have gone over connecting to the internet, managing all the software
[02:30] <ahoneybun> what you get in the included software and the technology behind those apps
[02:31] <ahoneybun> smartboyhw: since you are a packager and tester could you give some insight to what the development page should have?
[02:31] <ahoneybun> If I'm right that's the last thing for the software page
[02:31] <smartboyhw> ahoneybun: You mean development software or!?
[02:31] <ahoneybun> dev software
[02:32] <smartboyhw> KDevelop, Eclipse…
[02:32] <ahoneybun> smartboyhw: https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/KubuntuDocs/Software/Development
[02:32] <smartboyhw> ahoneybun: ^
[02:32] <ahoneybun> yea that
[02:32] <ahoneybun> 's in there
[02:33] <smartboyhw> QtCreator? 
[02:33] <ahoneybun> yep
[02:35] <smartboyhw> ahoneybun: That'll do…
[02:35] <ahoneybun> smartboyhw:  why the "...":
[02:35] <smartboyhw> ahoneybun: Why not the "…"?
[02:36] <ahoneybun> yea
[02:38] <ahoneybun> littlegirl: I guess we need some brainstorming
[02:47] <littlegirl> ahoneybun: Okay, but that sounds like a group thing - maybe for one of those meetings you guys hold. (:
[02:48] <ahoneybun> well Darkwing is busy with his kids
[02:50] <ahoneybun> I do wish to have another meeting
[02:57] <valorie> o/
[02:57] <ahoneybun> valorie: hey!
[02:58] <valorie> meeting sounds like a good thing, but there is no hurry, imo
[02:58] <valorie> hi
[02:59] <valorie> we've got the list -- it's a bit slower that way, but aside from ever more linking to the ubuntu and KDE sources, I think we have the bulk of what we need, done
[02:59] <ahoneybun> valorie: I think we should have another soon to look at where we are and where we want to go now
[02:59] <valorie> right, but we can proceed on the list
[02:59] <valorie> it's summer now, and things will move more slowly
[03:00] <ahoneybun> no one talks back on the list
[03:00] <valorie> it's the nature of foss projects
[03:00] <valorie> that's ok
[03:00] <ahoneybun> I'm a bit more available
[03:00] <valorie> we've got a LOT done now
[03:01] <valorie> and I think we have a good working relationship now
[03:01] <littlegirl> Nice to meet you, valorie. (:
[03:01] <valorie> hi again, littlegirl
[03:01] <valorie> I've been around forever
[03:01] <valorie> welcome back
[03:02] <littlegirl> Oh, hehe, sorry about that. My life has been very upside down lately and I've been away from the computer for quite some time. (:
[03:02] <littlegirl> And thanks. (:
[03:03] <ahoneybun> I guess I'm just looking for more to do
[03:03] <ahoneybun> valorie: you think we got a lot done?
[03:03] <valorie> yes
[03:03] <valorie> one suggestion I have is to hang out in #kubuntu and maybe the forums, and notice what common questions come up
[03:04] <valorie> we should answer those; maybe in the form of an FAQ, or maybe we've already covered them
[03:04] <ahoneybun> valorie: I added the ppa from #kubuntu
[03:04] <valorie> not bugs, but just common questions
[03:04] <valorie> the ppa from #kubuntu?
[03:04] <ahoneybun> valorie: someone was aasking about it
[03:04] <valorie> not sure what you are referring to, or on what page.....
[03:04] <ahoneybun> in there
[03:05] <ahoneybun> there was nothing about ppas in any of our work so far
[03:05] <ahoneybun> I saw someone was having problems with ppa
[03:05] <ahoneybun> so littlegirl and I added that
[03:05] <valorie> oh, you mean you added to the managing repository page because of a question that was asked in #kubuntu?
[03:05] <valorie> cool
[03:06] <valorie> I read backlog, but sometimes lack context
[03:06] <ahoneybun> it was missing ppa info
[03:06] <valorie> yes
[03:06] <valorie> not that we advocate their use, for beginners especially
[03:07] <valorie> but as people go along, sometimes they need backports, or betas
[03:08] <ahoneybun> yea
[03:09] <valorie> also, offering support in #kubuntu is good for those who plan on becoming Kubuntu Members
[03:09] <valorie> :-)
[03:09] <valorie> and on the forums as well
[03:10] <ahoneybun> valorie: I never liked forums too much
[03:10] <ahoneybun> hard to find things to help out in
[03:10] <ahoneybun> I love IRC though
[03:10] <valorie> well, that is the major way new people find us
[03:11] <valorie> because google sends them there -- forums along with our documentation
[03:11] <valorie> I think it's hard here because we don't have a bot which announces new questions
[03:11] <ahoneybun> is there going to be a docs.kubuntu.org?
[03:12] <valorie> for instance, in #amarok, every new Amarok forum post is announced by a bot
[03:12] <ahoneybun> that is cool
[03:12] <valorie> ahoneybun: that's a worthwhile question
[03:12] <ahoneybun> yea
[03:13] <valorie> there are wibbly sort of plans for our own kubuntu server
[03:13] <valorie> where we could install our own wiki
[03:13] <ahoneybun> I have heard about it before
[03:13] <valorie> or whatever we like
[03:14] <valorie> but when you feel that we're 'nearly there' -- bring it up to the -devel list, and see if you can get the Council to make that happen
[03:15] <ahoneybun> do you feel we are nearly there?
[03:15] <valorie> I do
[03:16] <ahoneybun> you are part of the council
[03:16] <valorie> what else do you think we need to help our our new users?
[03:16] <valorie> I am indeed
[03:16] <ahoneybun> do we have a part about installing new languages?
[03:16] <valorie> and what else do you think we need to help people find our docs?
[03:17] <ahoneybun> I'm not to sure what we can do about that on our part
[03:17] <valorie> what exactly do you mean by installing new languages?
[03:17] <ahoneybun> just thinking out loud
[03:17] <ahoneybun> setting up a pc for a new user
[03:17] <valorie> do you mean changing from Eng. to something else in the install process?
[03:18] <ahoneybun> maybe have a install thing to walk them though the install process?
[03:18] <valorie> it might be cool to have an Installation page/s 
[03:18] <valorie> yes, exactly
[03:18] <valorie> lots of images
[03:19] <ahoneybun> that could be one page
[03:19] <valorie> perhaps even mostly the slides used on the DVD/usb
[03:19] <ahoneybun> but a main page
[03:19] <ahoneybun> making a dvd/usb
[03:19] <ahoneybun> ?
[03:19] <valorie> I think that would be helpful for people deciding whether or not to install
[03:19] <valorie> if they see the entire process, it seems very non-scary
[03:20] <ahoneybun> yes
[03:20] <valorie> and we can do links to the fiddly bits like installing beside windows
[03:20] <ahoneybun> just how to get the images
[03:20] <valorie> etc.
[03:20] <valorie> those are all available, but I don't know where
[03:20] <valorie> the list will know though
[03:21] <ahoneybun> google to the rescue
[03:21] <valorie> we looked before, as i recall, but I didn't find them
[03:22] <valorie> I especially would have appreciated a guide to reinstalling over a hosed install, next to windows, using an SSD
[03:22] <ahoneybun> valorie: http://www.google.com/imgres?client=ubuntu&hs=YN1&sa=X&channel=fs&biw=1920&bih=901&tbm=isch&tbnid=B8BJCph1sCpnlM:&imgrefurl=http://www.webupd8.org/2013/04/see-whats-new-in-kubuntu-1304-raring.html&docid=OlL0qgNJNfn5SM&imgurl=http://img.netupd8.com/kubuntu-13.04-installer.png&w=1022&h=766&ei=L4y6UYjUJ4bU8wSljoGADA&zoom=1&ved=1t:3588,r:8,s:0,i:106&iact=rc&page=1&tbnh=182&tbnw=243&start=0&ndsp=32&tx=191&ty=93
[03:22] <valorie> because my other laptop is still unusable
[03:22] <ahoneybun> sorry
[03:22] <ahoneybun> http://img.netupd8.com/kubuntu-13.04-installer.png
[03:22] <valorie> until I get my son to fix either grub, the fstab file, or the bios
[03:22] <valorie> not sure what exactly needs fixing
[03:23] <valorie> well, I'd like to see all the slides
[03:23] <ahoneybun> yes I know
[03:23] <valorie> our artwork is so great!
[03:25] <ahoneybun> the installer?
[03:25] <ahoneybun> valorie: http://www.webupd8.org/2013/04/see-whats-new-in-kubuntu-1304-raring.html
[03:26] <valorie> that does have some of them
[03:26] <valorie> and that's a good website, for sure
[03:28] <ahoneybun> I could just use a VM to get the images lol
[03:28] <valorie> anyway, that website author found the slides somewhere
[03:28] <valorie> so can we
[03:28] <valorie> they are in the ISO, for starters
[03:29] <valorie> which means, to me, that they are in a file on launchpad somewhere
[03:29] <valorie> the packagers will know where
[03:30] <ahoneybun> I could just take them from the installation of the iso in a VM ;)
[03:31] <valorie> ok
[03:32] <ahoneybun> got them all :)
[03:33] <valorie> cool
[03:34] <valorie> obviously they all need to be shrunk to a more reasonable size
[03:35] <ahoneybun> yea
[03:35] <valorie> I was thinking it would be cool to have one image per page, and have a link at the bottom of each, after any necessary text, to just go forward and back
[03:35] <valorie> just like the actual install process
[03:36] <valorie> and make sure any links to outside pages are in a new tab, rather than navigating people away
[03:36] <ahoneybun> not sure about the new tab thing
[03:37] <ahoneybun> check trello and lay it out
[03:37] <valorie> I know when I'm doing something for the first time, I like to be able to get aquainted with the new thing as much as possible
[03:37] <ahoneybun> so a main to link to the subpages
[03:37] <ahoneybun> like
[03:37] <valorie> I'd like to make fed-up Windows users comfortable
[03:37] <valorie> to make this their first Linux
[03:37] <valorie> wouldn't that be great?
[03:37] <smartboyhw> Hey valorie
[03:38] <valorie> hi smartboyhw
[03:38] <valorie> how are you?
[03:38] <ahoneybun>  /Install/DiskSetup
[03:38] <ahoneybun>  /Installing/DiskSetup
[03:51] <valorie> I think we lost littlegirl
[03:55] <ahoneybun> seems
[03:55] <ahoneybun> valorie: https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/KubuntuDocs/Installing
[03:56] <valorie> nifty!
[03:56] <ahoneybun> refresh the page
[03:57] <valorie> it seems shrunken a bit too much
[03:57] <ahoneybun> and then click the image
[03:57] <ahoneybun> I had to scale with gimp
[03:57] <ahoneybun> that opens the full image
[03:57] <valorie> yeah
[03:57] <ahoneybun> yep :)
[03:58] <valorie> what percentage did you shrink it?
[03:58] <valorie> I'm just wondering if either a bit more or less would be more clear
[03:58] <valorie> see how the fonts look funky?
[03:58] <ahoneybun> I know
[03:58] <ahoneybun> I made the width 550px then the height resized
[03:58] <valorie> worth playing with a bit
[03:59] <valorie> because we could do 600 or 500 and it might look better
[03:59] <valorie> with 600, centered
[03:59] <ahoneybun> 725 and it still looks a but funky
[04:00] <valorie> try an even number
[04:00] <valorie> sometimes odd numbers do that
[04:01] <valorie> what is the raw size width?
[04:01] <valorie> gads, need the rest of my dinner
[04:01] <valorie> back in a min
[04:04] <ahoneybun> k
[04:28] <valorie> any luck with other sizes?
[04:31] <ahoneybun> not really
[04:35] <valorie> oh, well
[04:35] <valorie> aren't the originals svgs?
[04:37] <ahoneybun> no
[04:37] <ahoneybun> png
[04:37] <ahoneybun> working on it
[04:40] <valorie> k
[04:44] <ahoneybun> I think would I could
[04:44] <ahoneybun> I did my best
[04:47] <valorie> I wonder why the ISO has png instead of svg
[04:47] <valorie> very odd
[04:47] <ahoneybun> no
[04:47] <ahoneybun> I took a snapshot
[04:47] <valorie> why?
[04:47] <ahoneybun> thought that was best
[04:47] <valorie> we have access to the originals
[04:47] <ahoneybun> oh
[04:48] <valorie> sec
[04:57] <ahoneybun> brb
[04:59] <ahoneybun> back
[05:02] <valorie> I'm working on a short para to kick off the series of slides
[05:04] <ahoneybun> oh where are the images at
[05:04] <valorie> I thought you were getting the raw images off the ISO
[05:05] <valorie> if not, then I would look on launchpad
[05:06] <ahoneybun> can't find them on the iso
[05:06] <valorie> I wouldn't know how to do that either
[05:11] <valorie> ahoneybun: https://launchpad.net/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu
[05:11] <valorie> looks like they can just be checked out like anything else
[05:12] <ahoneybun> that is ubuntu though
[05:12] <valorie> Provides the slideshows that are shown while installing Ubuntu, Kubuntu and other....
[05:13] <ahoneybun> I see
[05:18] <ahoneybun> I can't copy them from there well without coping the branch
[05:20] <valorie> sure
[05:20] <valorie> I figured that the branch would have to be checked out, yeah
[05:30] <valorie> added my text
[05:30] <valorie> just a suggestion
[05:31] <ahoneybun> what text?
[05:32] <valorie> https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/KubuntuDocs/Installing
[05:32] <valorie> at the top
[05:33] <ahoneybun> nice
[05:34] <ahoneybun> I'm off for the night, I will post to the list later
[05:37] <valorie> cool
[05:37] <valorie> thanks for your work, ahoneybun
[05:38] <valorie> funny how we had the same idea at the same time
[06:04] <soee> good morning
[08:37] <Riddell> hmm, I'm not convinced any of these are ours http://people.ubuntuwire.org/~wgrant/rebuild-ftbfs-test/test-rebuild-20130614-saucy.html#kubuntu
[08:38] <wgrant> kubuntu inherits the seeds that contain them.
[08:51] <seaLne> something that might be worth adding to the todo list when releasing packages of new kde releases would be updating http://community.kde.org/KDE_SC/Binary_Packages i added .3 and .4, not sure how many people would look there but i think it looks good to have kubuntu listed 
[08:52] <valorie> good thought, seaLne
[08:52] <seaLne> and its easier now, as the list used to be in svn with special permissions needed to update
[08:54] <valorie> gosh, the major releases of Kubuntu are all still available
[08:54] <valorie> we could expand that list a LOT
[08:54] <valorie> probably not very useful though
[08:57] <Riddell> seaLne: thanks added to ninjas
[08:58] <Riddell> shadeslayer: how is 4.10.80 doing?
[08:58] <Riddell> "SDO Needs updating" shadeslayer what's SDO?
[08:59] <Riddell> http://kyofel.dyndns.org/kubuntu/build_status_4.10.80_saucy.html  hmm could be worse I guess
[08:59] <mck182> sdo = shared desktop ontologies
[09:06] <Riddell> ah hah
[09:26] <yofel> queeestion: why does debian have kde-sc-dev-latest again? 
[09:26] <yofel> Only reason I can think off is to prevents having to manually do rebuilds if like kdepimlibs disables a feature because kdelibs is too old which leads to other packages not building something as well
[09:28] <Riddell> so they only have to update one entry in the Build-Depends: list rather than all of them?
[09:28] <yofel> hm, no. One ends up wrong linking too
[09:28] <yofel> Riddell: no, I meant why have it at all. But on second thought it makes sense
[09:29] <yofel> means I'll have to fix 4.10.80 though, as that has >= 4.10.4
[09:29] <Riddell> Quintasan: you know anything about libgadu?  is it still useful?  (it doesn't compile in saucy)
[09:35] <valorie> is gadugadu even working anymore?
[09:35] <Riddell> I don't know
[09:35] <valorie> I've never known a single person who made use of it
[09:35] <Riddell> it's only ever been popular in poland as I understand it
[09:35] <valorie> ah
[09:36] <Riddell> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gadu-Gadu  yep still up says wp
[09:41] <yofel> shadeslayer: you only pushed kdelibs to bzr, right?
[09:41] <smartboyhw> Hey yofel, shadeslayer
[09:42] <yofel> *sigh*
[09:42] <yofel> morning smartboyhw
[09:42] <shadeslayer> yofel: nope, everything :(
[09:43] <shadeslayer> sorry about the screw up :/
[09:43] <yofel> shadeslayer: really o.O? I looked at kdepimlibs, konsole and kde-workspace and they don't have the changelog update...
[09:43] <shadeslayer> aha
[09:43] <shadeslayer> some of them were not pushed
[09:43] <shadeslayer> see notepad
[09:43] <shadeslayer> eh
[09:43] <shadeslayer> invoke-rc.d: initscript android-tools-adbd, action "start" failed.
[09:44] <yofel> mhm, you're right
[09:45] <yofel> meh
[09:45] <shadeslayer> yofel: so, how do we fix this screw up in a way that does not involve manually fixing each branch :(
[09:46] <yofel> shadeslayer: could you push whatever isn't pushed?
[09:47] <yofel> then simply running a small script over everything should work...
[09:48] <shadeslayer> yofel: everything is pushed, except the packages that were moved to manual, should I push those too? 
[09:48] <smartboyhw> shadeslayer: You don't normally mess up do you? (Only I do…)
[09:48] <shadeslayer> smartboyhw: yeah, I was doing multiple things yesterday
[09:48] <shadeslayer> and I managed to lose track of one thing in the madness that was yesterday
[09:49] <yofel> shadeslayer: they should simply not build, otherwise I need to put a changelog check into the script
[09:49] <smartboyhw> shadeslayer: Humans can't multitask (even if you DARE to think you can)
[09:50] <smartboyhw> You haven't watched National Geographic's "Test your brain" ...
[09:50] <shadeslayer> yofel: uh, for those manual packages debuild -S -sa doesn't even complete, and it's most likely because of patch failiures
[09:50] <shadeslayer> smartboyhw: I keep thinking I can :/
[09:50] <yofel> shadeslayer: I know
[09:50] <smartboyhw> lol
[09:50] <smartboyhw> What's the prob here? 4.11 beta 1?
[09:51] <shadeslayer> yofel: right so, just make your script skip those packages?
[09:51] <yofel> smartboyhw: yeah, the initial upload of it went a bit wrong
[09:51] <shadeslayer> I've documented the list on the etherpad
[09:51] <smartboyhw> :(
[09:51] <yofel> hm...
[09:51] <yofel> true, I could just take the saucy package list, remove then and loop over the result
[09:51] <yofel> *them
[09:51] <shadeslayer> yep
[09:52] <yofel> I should have something done in ~2h, it's lunch time in a few min. here
[09:52] <shadeslayer> \o/ power 
[09:52] <yofel> ^^
[09:52] <shadeslayer> yofel: np
[09:53] <yofel> Riddell: you didn't do any PPA-only work on 4.10.80 yet, right?
[09:54] <yofel> shadeslayer: on second thought... those packages should really be pushed even if they fail. Otherwise you need to do the dep update by hand as well...
[09:54] <yofel> (which is only really fine as long people remember to do it)
[09:55] <shadeslayer> okay, I'll push those as well
[09:55] <yofel> thanks!
[09:56] <yofel> I need to teach kubuntu-initial-upload to do the same
[09:57] <Riddell> yofel: nope
[09:57] <yofel> o
[09:57] <yofel> k
[09:58] <shadeslayer> yofel: all done
[09:58] <shadeslayer> oddly : Pushing kdeartwork
[09:58] <shadeslayer> No new revisions or tags to push.                                                                                                                                                 
[09:59] <yofel> oh, debcommit is run after bzr-buildpackage-ppa
[09:59] <yofel> so it didn't even commit
[10:00] <yofel> hm, then moving the package build part below committing and pushing should fix it
[10:06] <Riddell> new files in calligra beta, it is a beast http://paste.kde.org/773492/
[10:08] <smartboyhw> Riddell: Hurray!
[10:14] <soee> valorie, gadu gadu is/was most popular  instant messaging client here in Poland
[10:17] <Riddell> soee: library got fixed, gadu in kopete is safe :)
[10:29] <soee> Riddell, the kids in school will be happy :) they are using it most
[10:46] <BluesKaj> 'Morning folks
[10:59] <shadeslayer> yofel: btw I saw a build dep on kde-sc-dev-latest this morning
[10:59] <shadeslayer> I was half asleep though, so I don't recall where I saw it
[10:59] <shadeslayer> didn't we get rid of that last cycle?
[10:59] <yofel> shadeslayer: probably slipped in with a merge, shouldn't have any effect though?
[11:00] <shadeslayer> I thought so too, just wanted to confirm if we are still using that
[11:17] <soee> hmm you should give public access to ninjas notes, now i dont know how 4.11 beta builds :<
[11:18] <shadeslayer> it is public
[11:18] <shadeslayer> you just have to signup on identity.kde.org
[11:18] <shadeslayer> and http://kyofel.dyndns.org/kubuntu/build_status_4.10.80_saucy.html
[11:20] <soee> why i cant use custom nickname ?
[11:21] <shadeslayer> custom nickname where?
[11:21] <shadeslayer> on i.ko?
[11:21] <yofel> ask kde sysadmins...
[11:21] <soee> shadeslayer, it generates few option bye first and second name i entered
[11:21] <soee> but there is not option to use custom one :<
[11:22] <shadeslayer> thats how it works :P
[11:22] <soee> thats bad :/
[11:58] <shadeslayer> alright, our first autopilot test : lp:~rohangarg/+junk/autopilot
[11:59] <Quintasan> Riddell, valorie: Yeah, people still use gg in Poland
[11:59] <shadeslayer> just branch, cd into the autopilot dir and run autopolit run kubuntu
[11:59] <Quintasan> The question is how many IM cliets use that
[11:59] <Quintasan> Riddell: I can see kopete and ekg using that
[12:00] <shadeslayer> needs the default kicker in the panel + the kicker should have the shortcut of alt+f1
[12:28] <smartboyhw> Now now Riddell, which alpha are we not in this cycle?
[12:32] <Riddell> well we did say no alpha 2
[12:32] <Riddell> but it's being moved about and alpha 3 dropped
[12:32] <Riddell> so I expect we'll do both alphas
[12:37] <smartboyhw> Alpha 3 dropped?!
[12:37]  * smartboyhw misses too much during his exam.
[12:39] <Riddell> it's still in discussion on -release
[12:42] <smartboyhw> Riddell: Sure. Lubuntu has the same thought as you guys.
[12:42] <smartboyhw> That's what I heard from mailing lists.
[12:43] <ScottK> Riddell: Please let them know if it's OK with us to move Alpha 1 a week later on top of KDE 4.1 beta 2 or not.
[12:43] <Riddell> oh move alpha 1 as well
[12:44] <ScottK> OK.  Tell infinity/skaet/etc.
[13:02] <Riddell> hum
[13:02] <Riddell> alt+left arrow moves to the text virtual terminal
[13:02] <Riddell> that was scary,thought X had crashes
[13:02]  * shadeslayer needs ideas for ui testing
[13:02] <Riddell> shadeslayer: context?
[13:02] <shadeslayer> Riddell: doesn't switch for me
[13:03] <shadeslayer> Riddell: writing autopilot tests
[13:03] <Riddell> shadeslayer: saucy?
[13:03] <shadeslayer> but can't think of what exactly can I write for ui tests
[13:03] <shadeslayer> yes
[13:03] <shadeslayer> Riddell: https://code.launchpad.net/~rohangarg/+junk/autopilot
[13:04] <shadeslayer> wrote a simple test to see how one goes about writing autopilot tests, seems simple enough
[13:04] <shadeslayer> I started with rekonq, but rekonq doesn't support introspection I think
[13:04] <shadeslayer> Dolphin does
[13:04] <smartboyhw> shadeslayer: \o/
[13:05] <smartboyhw> Hmm, let me really plan for the ISO testing Classroom session…
[13:05] <shadeslayer> wrote a test_dolphin.py : http://paste.kde.org/773594/
[13:05] <shadeslayer> though I can't quite figure out what methods the app proxy supports
[13:11] <shadeslayer> yofel: news on 4.11 fixes
[13:12] <shadeslayer> ah, seems like you pushed to bzr already?
[13:14] <shadeslayer> smartboyhw: go write tests :P
[13:16] <smartboyhw> shadeslayer: I don't write autopilot tests...
[13:18] <yofel> shadeslayer: brr, errored out on kdeplasma-addons, I'll upload what I have and re-run it
[13:18] <shadeslayer> okay
[13:18] <yofel> (rsync failed for some reason...)
[13:20] <shadeslayer> 0.o
[13:42] <Riddell> shadeslayer: is there a new shared-desktop-ontologies ?
[13:42] <shadeslayer> yes
[13:42] <Riddell> oh yes there is
[13:42] <shadeslayer> needed by 4.11
[13:43] <yofel> that's already in saucy though
[13:43] <Riddell> this is confusing http://sourceforge.net/apps/trac/oscaf/ doesn't show it
[13:43] <Riddell> and neither does this http://oscaf.sourceforge.net/
[13:43] <shadeslayer> odd
[13:43] <shadeslayer> vHanda: ^^
[13:44] <Riddell> but http://sourceforge.net/projects/oscaf/files/shared-desktop-ontologies/ does
[13:44] <Riddell> why is sourceforge using trac? aren't they direct competitors?
[13:44] <shadeslayer> probably just not announced on the site
[13:44] <vHanda> Please use this - http://sourceforge.net/projects/oscaf/
[13:44] <vHanda> Riddell: beats me - Sourceforge allows using trac internally
[13:45] <vHanda> it's one of their internal options
[13:45] <vHanda> so I doubt they are competitors
[13:46]  * vHanda will ask trueg to update the other pages as well
[13:53] <shadeslayer> yofel: I've retried kde4libs as well
[13:53] <shadeslayer> since attica was updated
[13:58] <yofel> shadeslayer: could you update-the build-dep? Just so it ends up in dep-wait for the backports instead of failing
[13:59] <shadeslayer> will do
[14:02] <yofel> thanks
[14:08] <shadeslayer> yofel: done
[14:09] <yofel> shadeslayer: thanks!
[14:09] <yofel> yay, done here too
[14:10] <shadeslayer> nepomuk-core needs a bit of fixing too
[14:13] <therazr> sorry folks but what is the best kubuntu release for a new install? 12.04 or 13.04? thank you
[14:14] <smartboyhw> 12.04 definitely
[14:14] <therazr> smartboyhw: why? thanks
[14:14] <therazr> because it is LTS, doesn't it have older packages? like kernel version and such
[14:15] <smartboyhw> It's supported for a much longer time and is stable (and you can install new kernels in 12.04.2, it includes newer kernels)
[14:16] <smartboyhw> Don't forget, 13.04 is there for 9 months ONLY.
[14:16] <therazr> smartboyhw: So when 13.10 comes out I can't upgrade from 12.04 to 13.10 but I can upgrade from 13.04 to 13.10 right?
[14:16] <therazr> And when a new LTS comes out, should I upgrade directly from 12.04?
[14:17] <smartboyhw> This discussion should happen in #kubuntu actually…
[14:17] <shadeslayer> I don't see why you can't upgrade from 13.04 to 13.10
[14:18] <therazr> shadeslayer: I said I could, not from 12.04 though
[14:18] <Riddell> therazr: correct
[14:18] <Riddell> therazr: which is best to install depends on your needs, ask in #kubuntu for more help
[14:18] <shadeslayer> oh okay, I read that wrong
[14:19] <therazr> I'll ask there :), sorry
[14:25] <Quintasan> Riddell: If it doesn't compile and needs some work I think I can pester the developer of that to update if he is still planning to work on that
[14:25] <Quintasan> talking about libgadu
[14:26] <Riddell> Quintasan: it got fixed
[14:26] <Quintasan> Oh
[14:26] <Quintasan> I see.
[14:26] <Riddell> so problem over
[14:27] <Quintasan> The last update was last year so I was kind of wondering if the development is still going on
[14:27] <Riddell> shadeslayer: need any help on 4.10.80?
[14:27] <Riddell> I see lots of dep waits
[14:27] <shadeslayer> Riddell: should be sorted once kde4libs is done building
[14:28] <therazr> Is KDE5 coming with Kubuntu 14.04?
[14:28]  * Quintasan goes back to books
[14:28] <shadeslayer> dunno, I'd rather not drop KDE5 on an LTS
[14:28] <ScottK> therazr: KDE5 isn't really what it will be and probably not.
[14:29] <shadeslayer> maybe as a tech preview in a PPA 
[14:29] <therazr> ScottK shadeslayer and how is KDE going to support Mir since it's what Ubuntu chose?
[14:29] <Riddell> therazr: project neon is working on early packages now
[14:29] <shadeslayer> therazr: it won't
[14:29] <shadeslayer> therazr: it'll support wayland / X11 / whatever upstream decides to do
[14:29] <smartboyhw_> therazr: We won't use Mir (for sure) …
[14:29] <Riddell> shadeslayer: how come lots are green and lots of dep wait on 4.10.80?  were build-deps not updated?
[14:30] <shadeslayer> Riddell: Minor screw up
[14:30] <therazr> smartboyhw_: Are we having proprietary drivers support? graphics drivers
[14:30] <ScottK> therazr: One of three things happens: Mir is compatible with what KDE is doing, we (Kubuntu team) figure out how to integrate it), or Kubuntu dies.
[14:30] <smartboyhw_> lol
[14:30] <therazr> ScottK: are you serious? Can't you use Xserver or Wayland?
[14:30] <ScottK> smartboyhw_: Not kidding.
[14:31] <Riddell> that reminds me,I should start a conversation about flavours and Mir on ubuntu-devel mailing list
[14:31] <ScottK> therazr: In the long run, not really.
[14:31] <ScottK> Long run is measured in years though.
[14:31] <smartboyhw_> therazr: They will kill Wayland one day (for sure)
[14:31] <therazr> I Think Mark Shuttleworth would not be very happy to have KDE/Xfce and all the others dropped from Ubuntu
[14:31] <Riddell> I expect us to use Wayland in the long run
[14:31] <smartboyhw_> Riddell: Do it!
[14:31] <shadeslayer> what Riddell SAID
[14:32] <shadeslayer> erm
[14:32] <Riddell> smartboyhw_: who will kill Wayland?
[14:32] <shadeslayer> also depends on patchery to mesa
[14:32] <smartboyhw_> For Ubuntu Studio, that isn't much a problem, we are making multi-DE:P
[14:32] <Riddell> smartboyhw_: multi-DE?
[14:32] <smartboyhw_> Riddell: Ubuntu devs? (in 10 years?) In the Ubuntu archive?
[14:32] <ScottK> shadeslayer: That's why I think we end up figuring out how to integrate with Mir or the Mir people figure out how to maintain compatibility with the rest of the world.
[14:33] <smartboyhw_> Riddell: Yep, we are aiming for users to choose whatever desktop environment they want.
[14:33] <Riddell> I think figuring out how to integrate with Mir is unlikely
[14:34] <Riddell> finding the best way for Mir and Wayland to coexist is about the best we can hope for
[14:36] <Riddell> shadeslayer: ooh lots of blue now
[14:37] <yofel> blue because I just re-uploaded most of it, should be in dep-wait shortly
[14:46] <shadeslayer> hooray :)
[14:46] <shadeslayer> my WiFi is broken again
[14:47] <smartboyhw_> :(
[15:00]  * Riddell spams kubuntu-devel ML with merge requests
[15:01] <smartboyhw_> 404 Not found....:P
[15:01]  * smartboyhw_ is aiming for full mark in his computer literacy exam.
[15:03] <Riddell> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2013-June/037250.html  non-Unity flavours and Mir
[15:04] <smartboyhw_> I'm asking our flavour lead to review the Studio bits.
[15:07] <Riddell> ooh Mirv is a handy chap, was just looking to do qtwebkit and he's fixed it already :)
[15:08] <Riddell> murthy: how's the merges?
[15:12] <shadeslayer> new symbols on kde4libs
[15:12] <Riddell> there usually are
[15:13] <Riddell> shadeslayer: you taking care of it?
[15:13] <shadeslayer> yus
[15:13] <Riddell> yo da man
[15:15] <shadeslayer> I don't suppose you know off hand what optional=templinst means?
[15:15] <shadeslayer> I remember seeing documentation about it
[15:15] <shadeslayer> but Google can't find it
[15:16] <Riddell> it means there's a voodoo spell that'll shrink your head
[15:17] <ScottK> shadeslayer: If you ask nicely on #debian-qt-kde, probably svuorela or MoDaX can tell you.
[15:18] <shadeslayer> ack
[15:18] <shadeslayer> I'll do some more google magic before asking though
[15:18] <shadeslayer> I distinctly remember this being documented
[15:31] <shadeslayer> template instantiations
[15:31] <shadeslayer> it's sort of documented on the man page
[15:45] <Riddell> shadeslayer: which man page?
[15:45] <shadeslayer> dpkg-gensymbols
[15:48] <Riddell> "A  symbol  marked as optional can disappear from the library at any time and that will never cause dpkg-gensymbols to fail." jolly good
[15:48] <Riddell> obvious question is why have it at all in the symbols file
[15:50] <Riddell> groovy merges trello card all done except pykde which ScottK says he'll do when the time is right
[15:54] <shadeslayer> so it seems to me it's fine for template instantiation symbols can disappear
[15:55] <shadeslayer> and hence it doesn't cause ABI breakage
[15:55] <shadeslayer> just waiting for i386 to finish
[15:55] <Riddell> yep
[15:57] <ScottK> Now that 4.10.4 is in Experimental, I can probably do that.
[15:59] <Riddell> shadeslayer: "SRU soprano 2.9.2" is that still going to happen (am looking at trello items)
[15:59] <Riddell> I seem to remember it's not needed except for with 4.11? vHanda?
[15:59] <shadeslayer> I think upstream suggests using that one for supported versions
[16:00] <Riddell> apachelogger: "kmix leaks the memory" got a bug number for that?
[16:01] <Riddell> and isn't it in 4.10.3/4?
[16:02] <shadeslayer> okay, I've updated bzr
[16:02] <shadeslayer> will upload the package in a bit
[16:06] <Riddell> +       _silentlyCreateInitialWallet = walletGroup.readEntry("Silently Create Initial Wallet", false);
[16:06] <Riddell> do we want to turn that on by default in kwallet?
[16:06] <Riddell> I think we do
[16:13] <Riddell> ah harald already did it, moving to done
[16:14] <Riddell> shadeslayer: moved upload poppler to Done too
[16:18] <Riddell> agateau: you still plan to do bug 215383 ?
[16:24] <shadeslayer> ScottK: are the arm boxes still up?
[16:25] <ScottK> shadeslayer: Not at the moment.
[16:25] <shadeslayer> okay
[16:26] <ScottK> I need to do some eglibc magic to make it possible to use them for raring/saucy.
[16:26] <ScottK> I haven't had time.
[16:26] <ScottK> If someone needs to build for an older release, I can fire them back up next time I'm at home.
[16:26] <shadeslayer> nah, I needed saucy :P
[16:27] <shadeslayer> I'll just use emulation
[16:27] <shadeslayer> ScottK: what was the hardware called though?
[16:28] <ScottK> Efika MX Smarttop.
[16:28] <ScottK> No longer available though.
[16:28] <shadeslayer> right
[16:28] <shadeslayer> well, cheaper options now
[16:28] <shadeslayer> if you just want a arm builder
[16:28] <ScottK> Nah.  I got mine for free.
[16:28] <shadeslayer> haha
[16:29] <shadeslayer> I've had my eye on this one : http://www.hardkernel.com/renewal_2011/products/prdt_info.php for some time :P
[16:29] <shadeslayer> as a home server
[16:33] <Riddell> mm I should set up a pandaboard so it's accessible
[16:35] <Riddell> apachelogger: can you explain this to me (or on trello card)? "/etc/grub/* contains Ubuntu exclusive handling"
[16:35] <soee> what was the page with 4.11 beta status for saucy ?
[16:37] <Riddell> soee: see https://notes.kde.org/p/kubuntu-ninjas
[16:37] <shadeslayer> http://kyofel.dyndns.org/kubuntu/build_status_4.10.80_saucy.html
[16:38] <soee> +1 for shadeslayer :)
[16:38] <soee> +  0.5 for Riddell for good intentions :D
[16:38] <Riddell> hey, I was trying to help you learn how to find it! :)
[16:38] <shadeslayer> haha
[16:40] <soee> hmm my brother tries to copy cd with Nero and he failed :D i gave him k3b and hi did it with few clicks :)
[16:40] <soee> *tried
[16:45] <Riddell> ryanakca: http://www.heraldscotland.com/politics/viewpoint/as-others-see-us-the-view-from-quebec.2012088963  the soverigntists see a nirvana while the federalists see drugs and poverty :)
[16:47]  * Riddell puts muon-discover on the images
[16:53] <ryanakca> Riddell: On that note, I had a bit of a chuckle the other day when the Quebec Health Minister announced: "Quebec will within the next two years be the first country to have digitised its health system at the national level." (http://argent.canoe.ca/nouvelles/sante-linformatisation-sera-completee-en-2015-28052013 , second paragraph) ;)
[16:54] <Riddell> the english wasted billions trying to do that
[16:55] <Riddell> still plenty of paper used in the scottish nhs, their computing stuff is hopelessly inefficient, maybe my NHS Hackday stint is the beginnings of change
[16:55] <shadeslayer> :D
[16:58] <genii> Hm, so they're already announcing they're a counry now?
[16:58] <genii> *country
[16:58] <ryanakca> I also think the miniter's editor forgot to run "sed -e 's/country/province/g;s/national/provincial/g'" before handing off the speech :D
[17:03]  * Riddell out
[17:10]  * shadeslayer pokes qemu to go faster
[17:17] <shadeslayer> hum
[17:17] <shadeslayer> #MISSING: 4:4.10.80# _ZNK8Analitza11PlotBuilder6createERK6QColorRK7QStringPNS_9VariablesE@Base 4:4.9.80
[17:17] <shadeslayer> that doesn't look good
[17:23] <ahoneybun> Riddell: maybe place links for now on the kubuntu.org/support
[17:25] <shadeslayer> oh my
[17:25] <shadeslayer> apol: ping
[17:25] <shadeslayer> apol: ef3fb2f79079a769612d2d377abc955be0f4ac55 in analitza , does that not break ABI?
[17:30] <shadeslayer> AFAICT PlotBuilder is a public class and you just changed the signature of the public function create
[17:30] <shadeslayer> correct me if I'm wrong :)
[17:46] <apol> shadeslayer: yes it does
[17:47] <shadeslayer> :)
[17:47] <shadeslayer> apol: please be bumping so version then ?
[17:49] <apol> uh
[17:49] <apol> i'll do that
[17:49] <shadeslayer> thx
[17:49]  * shadeslayer will monitor repo and use the patch for Kubuntu
[17:52] <apachelogger> Riddell: last I checked markey complained about it leaking but did not push for a fix in .10
[17:52] <apachelogger> Riddell: the grub stuff is for me :P
[17:52]  * apachelogger needs to give grub a detailed check for ubuntuism
[17:58] <Quintasan> lol
[18:00] <shadeslayer> Quintasan: should I finalize Monday for PA4 meeting?
[18:00] <Quintasan> hell no
[18:00] <Quintasan> At least not this monday
[18:00] <shadeslayer> bah :/
[18:01] <Quintasan> 17th, 19th and 24th = exams
[18:02] <shadeslayer> I might be going on vacation from 20th to 30th
[18:02] <shadeslayer> Quintasan: postpone to Akademy? :P
[18:02] <Quintasan> I'm not going to Akademy but we can do it online while you are there and have some free time
[18:03] <Quintasan> is yofel going to Akademy as well?
[18:03] <shadeslayer> we can do it during KDS
[18:03] <Quintasan> K
[18:06] <Quintasan> Mentlegen
[18:06] <Quintasan> well
[18:06] <Quintasan> As expected, asian input works after install out of box
[18:06] <Quintasan> Riddell: Can we switch to fcitx if I get proper QA done?
[18:07] <ScottK> Quintasan: Does it support all the same languages?
[18:07] <ScottK> Last I heard, it didn't.
[18:07] <Quintasan> ScottK: It does
[18:07] <Quintasan> We just didn't have a package for Anthy
[18:08] <Quintasan> And it turned out there are more backends now in saucy
[18:08] <ScottK> OK.
[18:08] <ScottK> That was my only objection.
[18:10] <Quintasan> plus it has better KDE intergration
[18:11] <Quintasan> unlike *cought* ibus*cough*
[18:12] <ScottK> Right.  I think it's a good idea now that it won't narrow our language support.
[18:12] <ScottK> It's more than just QA though.  IIRC there's some language pack related magic that would need updating.
[18:13] <Quintasan> I did that and apachelogger kind of fixed it, but now I know what I did wrong so that's out of the way
[18:13] <Quintasan> ScottK: That said I'm not thinking about saucy, more like saucy+1
[18:13] <Quintasan> Or even +2 but that would be the worst case
[18:13] <ScottK> OK.
[18:14] <Quintasan> Unless I get a lot of people for testing - saucy+1
[18:20] <shadeslayer> whaaaa
[18:20] <shadeslayer> make[4]: *** No rule to make target `/usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/libQtWebKit.so', needed by `lib/libkdewebkit.so.5.11.0'.  Stop.
[18:20] <shadeslayer> !find /usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/libQtWebKit.so
[18:20] <shadeslayer> !find /usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/libQtWebKit.so saucy
[18:21] <shadeslayer> why this does not make any sense at all
[18:21] <shadeslayer> both libqtwebkit4 and libqtwebkit-dev are installed
[18:22] <shadeslayer> and it built fine in my chroot before I uploaded it
[18:26] <apachelogger> Quintasan, ScottK: if we are serious about input methods I think we need a whole set of ISO tests targetted at the entire l10n experience
[18:28] <Quintasan> apachelogger: As in testcases for iso.qa.ubuntu.com?
[18:29] <Quintasan> I think it's doable
[18:32] <shadeslayer> anyone on saucy?
[18:35] <apachelogger> Quintasan: yes
[18:36] <apachelogger> well, doesn't really matter, probably could be a less frequent test
[18:36] <apachelogger> but definitely something to run before release
[18:36] <genii> shadeslayer: Yup
[18:36] <shadeslayer> genii: on Kubuntu, when you lock the screen, are you also missing the 'switch session' button?
[18:37] <genii> shadeslayer: Lemme check
[18:37] <shadeslayer> genii: and can you suspend via the kickoff / homerun ?
[18:37] <shadeslayer> I had to install pm-utils to get the suspend button
[18:38] <shadeslayer> still no idea why it doesn't show a switch session button on the lock screen
[18:46] <yofel> Quintasan: FWIW, I'm going
[18:46] <genii> shadeslayer: I have classic menu... Anyhow, when I go K..  Leave...Lock... In same area as Lock under "Session" is also Logout and Save Session. Under "System" I have Sleep, Restart, Shutdown.  After I do Lock, on activity all there is is just: The session has been locked by username  box with username not editable, and a password text entry field.
[18:47] <shadeslayer> genii: no unlock button at the bottom?
[18:48] <shadeslayer> below the password field
[18:48] <genii> Yes, that too, sorry :)
[18:48] <shadeslayer> yofel: awesome, I can give you back your wifi dongle
[18:48] <shadeslayer> genii: and no switch session button?
[18:48] <genii> shadeslayer: None at all.
[18:48] <shadeslayer> okay, so that's just not me
[18:49] <shadeslayer> *not just me
[18:49] <yofel> shadeslayer: \o/ (I could actually use it for my raspberry pi now ^^)
[18:49] <genii> shadeslayer: Maybe if only one user logged in it doesn't show?
[18:49] <shadeslayer> genii: dunno, it appeared on raring just fine
[18:50] <genii> Hm.
[18:50] <shadeslayer> which is why I noticed it in the first place
[18:52] <yofel> hm...
[18:52] <yofel> about that
[18:52] <shadeslayer> *grumble* debootstrap can't work properly when the partition is mounted with nodev :/
[18:52] <yofel> upower always depended on pm-utils
[18:52] <shadeslayer> atleast for foreign arch's
[18:52] <yofel> in saucy, it depends on pm-utils | systemd-services
[18:52] <yofel> how did you get pm-utils removed?
[18:52] <shadeslayer> fun
[18:52] <shadeslayer> yofel: it was not on the install media
[18:52] <yofel> fun indeed
[18:52] <shadeslayer> I have systemd-services installed OTOH
[18:54]  * apachelogger wonders if Riddell will write up a summary of that very long thread he started
[18:54] <shadeslayer> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/kubuntu/daily-live/pending/saucy-desktop-amd64.manifest
[18:54] <yofel> well, we do have to do the consolekit deprecation too, so maybe PM stuff needs attention as well
[18:54] <shadeslayer> manifest says systemd-services
[18:54] <apachelogger> yofel: I suggest you go upstream with consolekit crap
[18:54] <apachelogger> consolekit is deprected so using it in KDE software is not very nice
[18:55] <yofel> true, there's a trello pad somewhere, needs bugfiling
[18:57] <genii> shadeslayer: I went Switch User and logged a second one in to see if switching is then enabled on Lock.... it's not, stilll the same.
[18:58] <shadeslayer> genii: aha, so a bug possibly
[18:58] <shadeslayer> was the upstart user session stuff deployed?
[18:58] <shadeslayer> could be because of that?
[18:59] <shadeslayer> though I'm doubtful, because all that script did was run startkde
[19:00] <genii> Each of these users has saved session, those come up fine. 
[19:02] <yofel> Riddell: wrt. Qt JS bug: that bug on LP talks about Qtwebkit, all references I have to mine are from Qt/QtScript
[19:03] <genii> shadeslayer: The weird thing was, looks like it locks your session automatically now if you Switch User. Because I did Switch user, it kicked me out to lightdm, I logged in secondary, then went Switch User from ther back to lightdm... then when I logged into the first user again, when desktop came up it was locked already
[19:03] <shadeslayer> oh yeah
[19:03] <genii> ( I don't usually use this feature so not sure what the regular behaviour is supposed to be)
[19:03] <shadeslayer> that's a bug I think
[19:03] <shadeslayer> that was in raring as well IIRC
[19:04]  * shadeslayer rages at tar
[19:04] <shadeslayer> stupid tar in the recovery
[19:04] <shadeslayer> tar: invalid tar magic
[19:04] <yofel> what the hell...
[19:04]  * yofel reads the mir thread...
[19:05] <ScottK> apachelogger: Makes sense.  And they need to be well enough written that people like me that know nothing about input methods can do the test.
[19:25] <shadeslayer> this build failiure makes no sense -.0
[19:25] <shadeslayer> -.-
[19:28] <shadeslayer> anyway, I'm sleeping, night
[19:32] <soee> hmm do you have problems playing youtube video in 2 separate tabs in latest firefox ?
[19:39] <genii> soee: On 21 if i have multiple youtube tabs then leave them and go do something else for a while, the plugin-container starts hogging resources until flash crashes. 
[19:40] <genii> Then it recovers after a minute to 90 seconds and I can refresh the tabs and it plays again
[19:40] <soee> in my case only one video is played but not without problems, some strange things happen with it
[19:41] <genii> soee: If nvidia, maybe try disable vdpau/hardware acceleration in the player
[19:43] <genii> For a while, everyon in my videos looked like The Hulk and sometimes at wrong speed until i disabled it
[19:47] <soee> :)
[19:47] <soee> now it started to work oO
[19:50] <soee> context menu doesn't work
[19:50] <soee> i think ill back to chrome
[21:47] <ahoneybun_> Hello all
[21:53] <Riddell> hi ahoneybun_ 
[21:53] <ahoneybun_> Riddell: hello
[21:55] <ahoneybun_> Riddell: how's the 4.11?
[21:58] <Riddell> dunno shadeslayer and yofel were putting it through the system
[22:01] <ahoneybun_> Oh ok
[22:02] <ahoneybun_> So is there talk of our own server?
[22:04] <Riddell> not heard anyone else but I've sort of wanted one for a while but not got enough excuse for one
[22:04] <ahoneybun_> Just one in general or for the docs?
[22:05] <ahoneybun_> Also maybe place it at Kubuntu.org/support
[22:05] <Riddell> yep
[22:05] <ahoneybun_> Oh cool
[22:05] <Riddell> but we don't have any practical way to put it on the kubuntu.org server
[22:05] <ahoneybun_> Oh
[22:06] <ahoneybun_> Maybe have it docs.Kubuntu.org?
[22:06] <soee> what are requirements for such server ?
[22:06] <ahoneybun_> Not sure
[22:08] <ahoneybun_> Riddell: what are the requirements?
[22:10] <Riddell> dunno, not much
[22:10] <Riddell> ability to ssh in and run apache
[22:10] <Riddell> bytemark would be a good candidate
[22:10] <Riddell> they might even give us one for free
[22:13] <ahoneybun_> Can a raspberry pi run it?
[22:14] <ahoneybun_> Riddell: I could run it on there
[22:14] <Riddell> it could but it wouldn't be very reliable
[22:16] <yofel> ahoneybun_: 4.11 coming along slowly, see ninja pad
[22:16]  * yofel put the full package split list there now
[22:18] <ahoneybun_> yofel: thanks ^^
[22:18] <Riddell> I'll ask bytemark if they can do us a server
[22:19] <ahoneybun_> Riddell: sweet I'll help where I can ^=^
[22:39] <valorie> do we have a sysadminish person to care for a server?
[22:39] <valorie> and will canonical sysadmins play well with us
[22:40] <ahoneybun_> valorie: I can try
[22:40] <ahoneybun_> ;)
[22:41] <valorie> have you administered a server before?
[22:41] <ahoneybun_> A bit on my raspberry pi
[22:42] <ahoneybun_> I would love to learn
[22:44] <valorie> you might hang out in #kde-sysadmin and hear what it's like to run a huge system
[22:44] <ahoneybun_> Yea
[22:44] <valorie> I think we'll need at least two people
[22:44] <valorie> this is high-volume compared to a personal server on a pi
[22:45] <ahoneybun_> Agreed 
[22:45] <ahoneybun_> I can put it on a old p4
[22:45] <valorie> the amarok team finally gave up their server and moved everything to KDE infra
[22:46] <valorie> because it was too hard for the sysadmins to keep up
[22:46] <valorie> I would think we get at least as heavy use as Amarok was
[22:46] <valorie> I think putting anything on an old p4 is a bad idea
[22:47] <valorie> we need professional equipment, and people will enough time to do proper monitoring, etc.
[22:47] <valorie> which is why we've never had a server of our own up till now
[22:47] <soee> what would you like to have on such server ?
[22:47] <soee> and you are talking about dedic, vps, shared ?
[22:48] <valorie> we've been talking about having docs there
[22:48] <valorie> and now some support stuff
[22:48] <ahoneybun_> Oh well I have time during the Summer but I can make time
[22:48] <valorie> since it's doubtful canonical would like another company to be supported on their servers
[22:49] <ahoneybun_> This is for the docs 
[22:49] <valorie> I'm just trying to say, ahoneybun_, that this is a much bigger scale than you might realize
[22:49] <ahoneybun_> I know 
[22:50] <ahoneybun_> I realize that now but still would like to try it
[22:50] <bkerensa> http://fridge.ubuntu.com/2013/06/14/certificates-for-ubuntu-members/
[22:50] <bkerensa> Now we need Kubuntu Certs
[22:50] <bkerensa> ;p
[22:52] <ahoneybun_> bkerensa: members?
[22:52] <valorie> nice
[22:52] <valorie> bkerensa: have you applied for yours?
[22:53] <bkerensa> valorie: I did
[22:53] <valorie> cool
[22:53] <bkerensa> ahoneybun_: yar
[22:53] <valorie> I can just imagine mark gritting his teeth as he signs yours
[22:53] <ahoneybun_> Cool so Kubuntu members would get that?
[22:53] <valorie> :-)
[22:53] <valorie> yes, ahoneybun_
[22:53] <soee> http://elv13.wordpress.com/2013/06/14/sflphone-kde-1-2-3-released/
[22:53] <ahoneybun_> Cool
[22:53] <valorie> sec
[22:54] <bkerensa> valorie: I can see jono gritting his teeth when he sees the request heh ;p
[22:54] <bkerensa> is ok though ;)
[22:55] <ahoneybun_> valorie: I still want to be a member btw
[22:55] <bkerensa> ahoneybun_: idk how that works I believe its limited to Ubuntu Members there was no mention of flavors 
[22:55] <bkerensa> ahoneybun_: I would e-mail Michelle or ask Jono
[22:56] <ahoneybun_> bkerensa: cool but I would still want to be a member
[22:56] <jono> bkerensa, I never grit my teeth
[22:56] <jono> I am English, my teeth might fall out if I grit them :-)
[22:56] <bkerensa> jono: its not a good practice ;p
[22:56] <bkerensa> LOL
[22:56] <jono> :-)
[22:56] <ahoneybun_> bkerensa: jono bacon? But I'm almost 1 1/2 months in
[22:56] <jono> ahoneybun_ yup
[22:57] <valorie> ahoneybun_: when one gets kubuntu membership, that is also ubuntu membership
[22:57] <ahoneybun_> jono:  I have only been helping for over a month
[22:57] <jono> ahoneybun welcome! :-)
[22:57] <jono> and thanks for your contributions :-)
[22:58] <bkerensa> ahoneybun_: so per jono ^ Kubuntu Members can get one 
[22:58] <ahoneybun_> jono: thanks and NP :-) I would like membership status 
[22:58] <valorie> anyway: my last word on a server - if it will be crappy in any way, we shouldn't do it at all
[22:58] <ahoneybun_> If I can
[22:58] <ahoneybun_> valorie: agreed
[22:58] <valorie> nothing is better than crappy
[22:58] <bkerensa> valorie: servers are always crappy... you have to maintain them and such
[22:59] <bkerensa> ;)
[22:59] <ahoneybun_> bkerensa: even without I want membership
[22:59] <ahoneybun_> Lol
[22:59] <valorie> bkerensa: I think you lack a bit of context; my point was top-notch support
[22:59] <ahoneybun_> bkerensa: valorie if I do it I would make it the best I could
[22:59] <bkerensa> valorie: yar :) what would the server be used for? 
[23:00] <valorie> our docs
[23:00] <valorie> mostly
[23:00] <valorie> moinmoin is really not a great wiki
[23:00]  * yofel has experience in how to not maintain a server
[23:00] <yofel> time's the bigger issue though
[23:00] <ahoneybun_> valorie: it lacks a few important features
[23:01] <valorie> my worry is that anything else without a lot of work won't be any better
[23:01] <yofel> wasn't it just the canonical installation that was missing features?
[23:01] <valorie> the KDE mediawiki instance, has a LOT of work into it
[23:01] <yofel> (of moinmoin)
[23:01] <valorie> theming, language/translation support
[23:02] <valorie> etc.
[23:02] <valorie> right now we have no language/translation support at ALL
[23:02] <ahoneybun_> yofel: as it might be too late to do it for this release
[23:02] <valorie> yofel: dunno
[23:02] <valorie> ahoneybun_: for sure
[23:02] <valorie> hurry isn't important
[23:02] <valorie> quality is all we want
[23:02] <yofel> ahoneybun_: too late for what? If it's just exporting, wouldn't c&p of the wiki pages to a local install work?
[23:03] <yofel> (images would be an issue ofc)
[23:03] <valorie> yofel: if we do just that, there is no point
[23:03] <ahoneybun_> valorie: Darkwing  wanted them HTML so it would export languages
[23:03] <valorie> in fact, it would be worse than what we have, because right now we have canonical support
[23:03] <yofel> valorie: I mean for the part that ends up on the install image
[23:04] <valorie> yofel: work on that has not yet begun
[23:04] <yofel> ok, then I'm quiet
[23:04] <ahoneybun_> yofel: that was the plan I believe then access over the internet for more work
[23:04] <valorie> Darkwing is in charge of that, and he's busy with his kids right now
[23:04] <ahoneybun_> More detail
[23:04] <ahoneybun_> Yea
[23:04] <valorie> right now we're just going wild on the wiki
[23:05] <ahoneybun_> Lil wild
[23:05] <valorie> the docs for the image will be a tiny subset of that
[23:05] <ahoneybun_> Yes
[23:06] <valorie> and we hope for excellent translation coverage of that, since it will be small and mostly unchanging
[23:06] <ahoneybun_> We hope for excellent everywhere valorie :)
[23:06] <valorie> right
[23:07] <valorie> I'm working for that on the wiki version too
[23:07] <ahoneybun_> I know laugh out load
[23:07] <ahoneybun_> Lol
[23:11] <ahoneybun_> valorie: can we host the wiki on KDE user base somehow?
[23:12] <valorie> we discussed that, as I recall, and came up with no answers
[23:12] <valorie> I think we would have to come up with a good proposal to KDE
[23:13] <juancarlospaco> was reading the package re-vamping proposal, interesting...
[23:13] <valorie> .... and might be better on Community
[23:13] <valorie> not sure
[23:14] <ahoneybun_> Yes
[23:14] <juancarlospaco> I hope they consider Binary Deltas and UDP based delivery protocol, because we are on 2013
[23:17] <ahoneybun_> Community.kde.org
[23:28] <valorie> right
[23:28] <valorie> sec, restarting after updates
[23:45] <valorie> ok, off for dinner and dad-night
[23:47] <yofel> usr/share/dbus-1/interfaces/org.kde.nepomuk.FileWatch.xml goes into nepomuk-core-dev, right?