[12:08] <bac> 0/
[12:45] <benji> teknico1: I just saw your email.  How goes it?
[13:02] <tekNico> benji: all good, thanks, just some scheduling mishap. also back from lunch :-)
[13:02] <benji> tekNico: cool; I'll leave you to the card then and I'll pick a new one, if that's all right
[13:03] <tekNico> benji: sure, thanks again for your interest!
[13:03] <benji> no problem
[13:04] <benji> We have thunderstorms here, hopefully my internet connection and power will hold up.
[13:09] <benji> gary_poster: Is your "Fix broken CI tests" card ready to move to landing?
[13:10] <gary_poster> benji, thanks and sorry!  moved to daily call
[13:10] <benji> cool, thanks
[13:10]  * benji makes a release.
[13:14] <rick_h> jcsackett: will bring up on the call in a sec but https://code.launchpad.net/~rharding/charmworld/reviewed-icons/+merge/169769 should hopefully be the good/fix for it all
[13:21] <bac> gary_poster: i am available for raleigh sprint.  will be in nags head the previous week so travel should be cheaperish.  norfolk-rdu-pr
[13:21] <gary_poster> bac, cool!
[13:23] <gary_poster> hey sinzui, I was looking at https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/document/edit?hgd=1&id=1FSFJIxOMBPYzXZ06WQeF0804vw75nOgUVTLjOwY3Pu0# to prep for meeting.  Did orange squad fully deliver categories, and initially deliver related charms, as hoped?
[13:25] <sinzui> gary_poster, I cannot bring myself to say fully deliver. There is not world for us to do since we have fixed all the bugs. I think there are some layout issues still
[13:26] <sinzui> No one has  reported an issue about it...I think I am the only person who wont give my browser 1300px
[13:26] <gary_poster> luca__, hi. similar question for you.  Doing quick prep for our meeting in an hour and a half.  I think UX delivered "first use: explore" wireframes, and...maybe "first use: what is available" wireframes too?  Is that right?  and did Huw get whatever assets he needs for charm browser enhancements, as mentioned on that doc (https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/document/edit?hgd=1&id=1FSFJIxOMBPYzXZ06WQeF0804vw75nO
[13:26] <gary_poster> gUVTLjOwY3Pu0#)?
[13:27] <luca__> gary_poster: I've spoken to Huw, he's making a list for me
[13:27] <luca__> gary_poster: we delivered both of those scenarios
[13:27] <gary_poster> sinzui, ack.  so, maybe delivered but needs full qa?
[13:27] <gary_poster> luca__, great thank you, I'll record as such on the doc
[13:28] <sinzui> gary_poster, yes, lets say that. Maybe someone will agree that the right margin disappears and it is a problem
[13:28] <gary_poster> sinzui, cool.  related charms: what remains?  did we have something new to show there?
[13:29] <sinzui> We are working on the UI. We expect it in QA this week
[13:29] <gary_poster> ack thanks sinzui 
[13:29] <sinzui> gary_poster, We are working in  the social sharing menu. Probably for QA next week
[13:30] <gary_poster> luca__, one more thing for you.  we were hoping to have user feedback form integrated in GUI today.  have you thought about where/how we can link to the form from the GUI?
[13:32] <luca__> gary_poster: We have an idea of what we can do, I'll see if Jamie can get the asset to who ever is implementing it.
[13:32] <gary_poster> luca__, cool thanks.  toss it to me (or juju-gui list, or I can make a bug if you prefer), please
[13:33] <luca__> gary_poster: I'll mail it to you
[13:33] <gary_poster> perfect thanks luca__ 
[13:34] <luca__> gary_poster: both Ale and Jamie are in a meeting at the moment
[13:34] <gary_poster> ack luca__ 
[13:36] <benji> the charm browser being open by default is intentional, right?
[13:37] <benji> (it doesn't seem like a good idea to me, so I wanted to check before releasing it that way)
[13:38] <gary_poster> benji, yes
[13:38] <benji> k
[13:38] <benji> thanks
[13:38] <gary_poster> benji, maybe share your concern on list?
[13:38] <gary_poster> but for now release is good
[13:38] <benji> sure
[13:38] <benji> k
[13:44] <hatch> morning
[13:45] <gary_poster> morning
[13:57] <bac> jujugui: i'm about to sit in on my first juju-core hangout.  have others found them interesting?
[13:58] <gary_poster> bac, a couple have, a couple have not.  Leave
[13:58] <gary_poster> after the kanban
[13:58] <bac> ok
[13:58] <gary_poster> unless you are really interestred
[13:58] <bac> gary_poster: that swap day policy after travel.  is that only for work-related travel?
[13:59] <gary_poster> bac, yes.  the rationale is that canonical wants to "reimburse" you for travel days that you took on its behalf.  If there's something for which there's a similar argument, lemme know.
[14:00] <bac> gary_poster: oops, i forgot my :)
[14:00] <gary_poster> heh, ok :-)
[14:00] <jcsackett> rick_h: icon branch looks good to me, and tests and behavior all work.
[14:03] <rick_h> jcsackett: awesome, abentley can you do reviewer please? https://code.launchpad.net/~rharding/charmworld/reviewed-icons/+merge/169769
[14:04] <abentley> rick_h: Sure thing.
[14:04] <rick_h> abentley: thanks, let me know if you have any ? on why something was changed. It's a chain reaction of doom 
[14:06] <abentley> rick_h: The way the API works is all public functions are exposed to the web.  Is that what you mean to do?
[14:06] <abentley> rick_h: By making get_api_id public?
[14:07] <rick_h> abentley: no, it was to make it available in the views/charms.py. We talked about that briefly on friday. I guess that's a side-effect. Maybe I should move that into a utils thing instead so it's shared a bit cleaner
[14:08] <abentley> rick_h: The id could be API-specific.  That's why it's a method on the API class.
[14:09] <rick_h> abentley: ok, so would you prefer that the views/charms.py call the _ method? Or blacklist non-api callable methods?
[14:10] <abentley> rick_h: Let's call the _ method for now, and maybe circle back and update the API design later.
[14:10] <rick_h> abentley: ok, I'll change that back. 
[14:22] <abentley> rick_h: Have you tested API 1?  I would expect it needs the same route changes as API 2.
[14:23] <rick_h> abentley: I was actually giong to ask if we could remove it as a follow up since it's not in use any longer?
[14:23]  * rick_h forgot to add that note to the MP
[14:24] <rick_h> abentley: the first 'release' with the browser on by default is today which is using api2
[14:24] <rick_h> abentley: juju-gui release that is
[14:24] <abentley> rick_h: I'm happy to have API1 removed.
[14:25] <abentley> rick_h: I just don't know if we should break it before removing it.
[14:25] <rick_h> abentley: ok, I can remove it here. It just started to get astray of "add charm icon".
[14:26] <abentley> rick_h: Yeah, I'm not saying you have to do it here.  We could just apply the same route changes to API 1.
[14:27] <abentley> That would be just a few lines to add.
[14:27] <rick_h> abentley: ok. Will do that then. 
[14:27] <rick_h> abentley: yea, feels strange to add the lines and then go back and delete but it's the smaller of the two diffs for sure
[14:30] <rick_h> abentley: changes pushed, waiting on full test run to complete.
[14:30] <abentley> rick_h: r=me with those changes.
[14:30] <rick_h> abentley: ty
[14:31] <gary_poster> jujugui, orangesquad, hi. we are planning on linking the following form to the GUI as soon as we get the necessary UX plan and visual assets.  please take a look and share feedback soonish.  https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/forms/d/1Me4macMBX6KydCYyCC6YEjKnpCKakQCYlGlGxIB6Z0w/viewform .  Feel free to fill out form and submit if you desire; I'll clean out results before we add this to the code.
[14:32] <hatch> on it
[14:32] <gary_poster> UX plan and visual assets would be for the link in the GUI: the form itself would look as is.
[14:32] <hatch> gary_poster: What are you doing today (or most recently) with Juju? and What would you say is Juju’s most attractive feature? should probably be textareas
[14:33] <gary_poster> hatch, ack, was originally.  I changed to try to keep the form from being even more giganto than it is now.  
[14:34] <jcastro> gary_poster: I have a topic for today's call
[14:34] <gary_poster> I thought those answers could be tackled briefly.  I'll wait for more feedback
[14:34] <jcastro> gary_poster: I'd like to discuss errors.u.c and the GUI on behalf of evan
[14:34] <gary_poster> jcastro, please add to https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/document/edit?hgd=1&id=1FSFJIxOMBPYzXZ06WQeF0804vw75nOgUVTLjOwY3Pu0# or I'll do it for you
[14:34] <jcastro> I'll add it!
[14:34] <gary_poster> jcastro, I'll add
[14:34] <gary_poster> ok thank you jcastro :-)
[14:34] <jcastro> ok
[14:34] <gary_poster> you do it :-)
[14:34] <jcastro> nod
[14:35] <bac> gary_poster: where do we provide feedback on the form wording?
[14:35] <gary_poster> bac, here or email
[14:36] <bac> gary_poster: dropdown on 'how many services' s/from// and s/More/More than 50/ or 50+
[14:37] <gary_poster> bac, then similar on units question.  ok, will change
[14:37] <bac> s/attractive/most useful/
[14:39] <bac> s/Where you provide us with personal data please see/See/
[14:39] <bac> wordy!
[14:39] <rick_h> gary_poster: only feedback is it's long. Most rules of thumb I've seen for good review/feedback requests are 5-10 max items. 
[14:40] <gary_poster> bac, made all changes except the last one.  That is from lawyer, so I'm not going to touch it.
[14:40] <bac> gary_poster: yeah, they get paid by the word
[14:40] <gary_poster> :-)
[14:40] <rick_h> gary_poster: ah, so no chance of chaning up the ?'s then eh?
[14:40] <rick_h> changing that is ...ugh monday
[14:41] <gary_poster> rick_h, no I have already.  what would you suggest?  I've already collapsed and removed some questions
[14:41] <gary_poster> rick_h, because definitely agree
[14:42] <sinzui> orangesquad: anyone have time to review https://code.launchpad.net/~sinzui/charmworld/tools-use-charm-model/+merge/169813
[14:43] <rick_h> gary_poster: so we ask them about juju's most useful feature? Do we need that in GUI feedback? the 3-things to change I think we could easily cull from other questions. Simpler questions "What tasks do you prefer to use the Gui for?" "Which tasks do you prefer the command line for?" Combine the last two questinos about comments/suggestinos and things that they could not do in the gui
[14:44] <gary_poster> bac, since I have to get a re-review I'll propose the change anyway.  I modified it slightly from your suggestion. if you reload you will see
[14:44] <gary_poster> rick_h, ack, thanks, thinking
[14:45] <bac> a work of art gary_poster
[14:45] <gary_poster> :-P thanks bac
[14:46] <rick_h> gary_poster: and that last one Please enter your email address if we mayb contact you again to ask for additional feedback, etc" vs the two parts there. 
[14:47] <gary_poster> ack rick_h, easy agree.  on it
[14:47] <sinzui> gary_poster, I am disappointed that I cannot add comments to the form. How should I send feedback?
[14:48] <rick_h> lol, more meta please!
[14:48] <gary_poster> :-)
[14:48] <gary_poster> sinzui, here or email
[14:49] <sinzui> gary_poster, my one comment is "What are you doing today (or most recently) with Juju?" should be a textarea shouldn't it. The small box doesn't let me say I stage and deploy m.jc.com
[14:50] <gary_poster> ok sinzui you and hatch both said, so will expand.  I was trying to shorten form visually.  a mistake.  I'll pursue rick's approach instead
[14:50] <sinzui> thank you gary_poster
[14:50] <gary_poster> than you!
[14:50] <gary_poster> k
[14:50] <hatch> :)
[14:50] <rick_h> gary_poster: let me know if it'd be helpful to try to pull out some exact wordings/combining thoughts there. Or if it'd help to hangout and hear things out loud
[14:51] <gary_poster> rick_h, since you offer, yes!  guichat?
[14:51] <rick_h> gary_poster: sure thing
[14:51] <gary_poster> thx
[14:52] <rick_h> sinzui: I can look after the call if no one else grabs it
[14:54]  * benji changes the license on the GUI LP page to "GNU Affero GPL v3"
[14:55]  * benji also fixes the broken link to uistage
[15:01] <hatch> if you deploy a service at charm version X - what is the story to upgrade that charm in the gui? do we have one yet?
[15:02] <rick_h> sinzui: anyone looked at your branch then? if not I'll start. 
[15:04] <sinzui> rick_h, no one yet
[15:13] <rick_h> sinzui: r=me with a couple of questions
[15:15] <sinzui> I have just learned I can kill hangouts while I forget I have charmworld up and ingesting.
[15:16] <hatch> benji: re bug 1191835 is that the interior pages that are going away very soon?
[15:16] <_mup_> Bug #1191835: Vertical scroll bars on interior pages <juju-gui:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1191835>
[15:17] <benji> hatch: yep... for some definition of "soon"; I'll take bets ;)
[15:17] <hatch> haha
[15:18] <hatch> since it's kind of in my control I'll take that bet :P
[15:18] <rick_h> over/under set at 2 weeks? :P
[15:18] <hatch> this is like price is right you can't go over
[15:19] <abentley> orangesquad: Could you please review https://code.launchpad.net/~abentley/charmworld/max-retries-exceeded/+merge/169828 ?
[15:19] <hatch> or rick_h if you do drew cary will hit you with his microphone
[15:20] <sinzui> abentley, I can in 10 minutes
[15:20] <abentley> sinzui: Thanks.
[15:26] <tekNico> hatch: time for a quick javascript hangout?
[15:26] <hatch> can do
[15:39] <benji> release finished
[15:42] <abentley> rick_h: I'm happy to remove API 1.
[15:42] <hatch> tekNico: crud - I think what i just told you won't work
[15:42] <tekNico> hatch: oops :-)
[15:42] <hatch> sorry one second I'll look further
[15:42] <tekNico> hatch: sure, thanks
[15:54] <Makyo> jujugui call in 6,kanban now.
[15:54] <gary_poster> thanks Makyo 
[15:58] <gary_poster> jujgui call in 2
[16:01] <gary_poster> benji call ping
[16:01] <benji> oh!
[16:05] <rick_h> abentley: that'd be awesome
[16:13] <BradCrittenden> hatch: https://layervault.com/luca_paulina/Juju/Juju_Wireframes.ai/1
[16:13] <hatch> thanks bac
[16:15] <gary_poster> hatch forwarded email weith link
[16:15] <gary_poster> with
[16:15] <hatch> thanks
[16:15] <bac> gary_poster: yay, now i can see comments.
[16:16] <gary_poster> bac, and it was so obvious!
[16:37] <rick_h> luca__: for the bugs around the header and such, I don't think those get tagged charmbrowser. 
[16:37] <luca__> rick_h: oh
[16:37] <luca__> rick_h: sorry hehe
[16:38] <rick_h> luca__: np, definitely keep that tag for things in the left panel, fullscreen, etc though. 
[16:38] <luca__> rick_h: right, will do.
[16:46] <hatch> luca__: can these ai's be exported to a paged pdf and then uploaded to google drive and be commented on there?
[16:46] <hatch> I find it hard to go through these comments (and I'm sure you do too) :)
[16:47] <luca__> hatch: actually, I have some insider knowledge that commenting on static images in gdocs will disappear very soon.
[16:47] <hatch> oh awesome
[16:47] <hatch> this layervault is pretty cool but I don't think that the people who made it have actually used it :P
[16:47] <luca__> hatch: haha
[16:48] <luca__> hatch: it makes it a lot easier for me to control revisions that can be seen
[16:48] <luca__> hatch: commenting is a bit weird but I'm kinda using it differently to what it's been designed for
[16:48] <luca__> hatch: the next revision I might change the set-up to how it should be used
[16:48] <hatch> ahhh - isn't that always the case with us? "X was designed to do this....but we do it like this..." haha
[16:49] <luca__> hatch: yeah lol
[16:49] <luca__> hatch: I was meant to have 1 screen per document
[16:49] <luca__> hatch: but that's not how I make my files, I make all screens in 1 document as a flow
[16:50] <hatch> ahhhh ok that makes sense
[16:50] <luca__> hatch: I contacted them and they said they'll have that functionality real soon though so it should be better
[16:50] <hatch> I'm surprised your mac mini has enough ram to have all of these layers on on a single document :)
[16:56] <rick_h> luca__: you have a sec? 
[16:56] <luca__> rick_h:  for a video chat?
[16:56] <rick_h> luca__: don't think it, but wanted to grab your attention :)
[16:56] <luca__> rick_h: ah haha
[16:56] <luca__> rick_h: you have it :D
[16:56] <rick_h> luca__: I'm working on the related charms work and I want to make sure I'm looking at what I should
[16:56] <rick_h> luca__: so the display of related charms aren't using the whole charm-token widget we use elsewhere
[16:57] <luca__> rick_h: I see
[16:57] <rick_h> luca__: the last thing I recall seeing is the stuff in this 13.04 folder https://drive.google.com/a/canonical.com/?pli=1#folders/0BwhxhFfxY6uqVVRXNUZKaXllS1E
[16:57] <rick_h> luca__: is that still about right? small icon, name, description?
[16:57] <luca__> rick_h: that is old
[16:58] <luca__> rick_h: sending you the right stuff now
[16:58] <rick_h> luca__: yea, I figured. Help point me in the best new place to look around? 
[16:58] <rick_h> luca__: thanks, appreciate it
[16:58] <rick_h> luca__: once this is up I'll be adding them to the interfaces tab as well
[16:58] <rick_h> luca__: so if there's anything there I should see please include that along for the ride
[16:59] <luca__> rick_h: we haven't done work on the interfaces tab
[16:59] <luca__> rick_h: but the content shouldn't change from what is shown in the token in the image I just sent you
[16:59] <rick_h> luca__: ok, I'll look and hit you up with any questions I run into
[16:59] <luca__> rick_h: cheers :)
[17:01] <hatch> luca__: slide 15 the full page search results - what do the coloured vs grey icons mean under the providers/charm categories/ubuntu series?
[17:01] <luca__> hatch: orange ones are active
[17:02] <luca__> hatch: grey ones are not
[17:02] <luca__> hatch: visual filtering
[17:02] <luca__> hatch: though it's been noted that this needs to be looked into in greater depth
[17:02] <luca__> hatch: as filtering by providers isn't that useful
[17:02] <luca__> hatch: and categories might not be useful
[17:02] <hatch> yeah, after reading through all of the current comments the only thing that I had to add was about that so I'll leave it be :)
[17:03] <luca__> hatch: I did that page really quickly so people could give me some ideas hehe
[17:03] <luca__> hatch: it's a tricky one
[17:04] <hatch> yeah I'm really not sure what the best approach is - imho filtering by provider is valuable...filtering by series would be only if charms don't work on one or the other
[17:04] <hatch> categories would only be if we have a lot of charms
[17:08] <abentley> sinzui: Every time golang afficionados refer to "gopher", it makes me think of the gopher protocol.
[17:28] <sinzui> abentley, :)
[17:35] <rick_h> bah, luca ran away hah
[17:39] <rick_h> abentley: sinzui we need some more data in the backend for the updated related charms look. Should I pause front end to go do that or will one of you have bandwidth in the next dayish?
[17:39] <abentley> I have bandwidth.
[17:39] <sinzui> I expect to be free to help tomorrow
[17:40] <rick_h> abentley: ok, I've added a card and listed the new attributes required in it. I'll keep going on the front end then and pretend the data's there but empty
[17:41] <abentley> rick_h: commit count and download count are for the past 30 days?
[17:41] <rick_h> abentley: yes, just as per the current charm data 
[17:42] <abentley> rick_h: Okay, looks easy.
[17:42] <rick_h> abentley: thanks
[17:43] <gary_poster> rick_h, wdyt? https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/forms/d/1Me4macMBX6KydCYyCC6YEjKnpCKakQCYlGlGxIB6Z0w/viewform 
[17:43] <rick_h> gary_poster: looking 
[17:43] <rick_h> ooh, looks cleaner off the bat
[17:43] <gary_poster> nothing like removing almost 2/3 of the questions ;-)
[17:44] <rick_h> gary_poster: I <3 this man
[17:44] <gary_poster> cool :-)
[17:44] <rick_h> yea, I mean this reads/seems a LOT nicer imho and can't wait to spread the link around. jcastro should pimp it with marcoceppi :)
[17:45] <rick_h> when it's final/approved and all that
[17:45] <gary_poster> heh cool thanks rick_h .  :-) I'll send it to lawyer
[17:45] <marcoceppi> I like it
[17:45] <marcoceppi> but I have no say in anything
[17:46] <gary_poster> cool, thanks.  what do you mean you have no say, marcoceppi ?! :-)
[17:46] <jcastro> hey so we can link it from juju.u.c/survey
[17:46] <jcastro> and then I can pimp
[17:46] <jcastro> is what gary_poster used the canonical URL?
[17:46] <rick_h> jcastro: not yet, has to go through approval
[17:46] <jcastro> ok lmk when
[17:46] <rick_h> jcastro: we're just submitting out feedback atm and gary_poster cleaned it up a bunch
[17:46] <gary_poster> awesome jcastro thanks.  do you do the linking or do I?  yeah, that's canonical URL, but wait till I have alwyer review
[17:46] <gary_poster> thanks
[17:48] <jcastro> theoretically anyone in the right teams can edit juju.u.c/survey, but I can do that for you far faster than you digging around
[17:48] <gary_poster> awesome thanks.  will ping when we are ready
[19:35] <hatch> Makyo: (idea) is it possible to put a timeout on the d3 drag handler for the services ? I have noticed that I will frequently drag when I mean to open the popup
[19:36] <Makyo> hatch, there already is.
[19:36] <hatch> oh :)
[19:36] <hatch> maybe I'm just slow today
[19:37] <Makyo> hatch, search for longClickTimer in app/views/topology/service.js for an example.
[19:37] <hatch> ahh will do
[19:37] <hatch> ugh...just spent the past 2 hours tracking down a 2line bug in the databinding class
[19:38] <Makyo> hatch, as it is , it's checking to see if the mouse has been moved within a minimum radius that it should consider dragging before it goes on to do the long-click action, something similar might be done for your case.
[19:38] <Makyo> ie: check that the duration of the click was slow and the service was only moved within a 3px radius or something.
[19:38] <hatch> yeah that could work - it could just be that I've done it 1000x times this morning to so I'm fatigued :)
[19:39] <Makyo> hatch, fair :)
[19:39] <hatch> well now that I have tracked down this bug I can finally get onto doing what I was doing 2h ago haha
[19:55] <hatch> w00t databinding refactor 'complete'
[19:56] <hatch> you can tell when something is written properly when a refactor is only 10 lines
[19:56] <hatch> lol
[19:56] <hatch> of course I broke every test :/
[20:23] <hatch> poo another bug
[20:23] <hatch> soo close
[20:32] <hatch> smushed!
[20:34] <gary_poster> eww, bug guts.
[20:36] <hatch> but these are the good kind
[20:36] <gary_poster> http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2013/05/can-we-end-hunger-by-eating-bugs/275997/
[20:36] <gary_poster> "the good kind"
[20:37] <hatch> haha
[20:37] <hatch> hey, if they could make vegan food taist good, they can make anythign taist good :P
[20:37] <gary_poster> heh
[20:41] <hatch> hmm
[21:32] <hatch> gary_poster: are you still around?
[21:32] <gary_poster> hatch I am though I was about to reboot
[21:32] <hatch> 2 secs
[21:32] <hatch> if a field is in conflict, should we allow the user to leave it in conflict?
[21:32] <hatch> or force them to either overwrite or accept?
[21:33] <gary_poster> hatch for the first cut let's treat allowing it as their overwrite mechanism.  I assume this will be relatively easy to change later
[21:34] <gary_poster> sound good?
[21:34] <hatch> sounds good
[21:34] <gary_poster> cool.  back in a few, but then gone :-)
[23:01] <hatch> BOOM done
[23:01] <hatch> and only 1 minute past EOD
[23:01] <hatch> well ok it's just the prototype but still :)