[07:47] <brobostigon> good morning everyone,
[07:53] <diplo> Morning all
[07:53] <brobostigon> morning diplo
[07:56] <MartijnVdS> hey, the G+ indicator changed!
[07:57] <MartijnVdS> it's no longer a number but a little bell
[07:57] <diplo> A few days ago I think
[07:58] <MartijnVdS> diplo: it just happened for me. Yay gradual rollouts ;)
[07:59] <diplo> I still don't understand that, why it takes so long to roll out but Iguess I've never played with an infrastructure that large
[08:00] <MartijnVdS> diplo: if there's a bug, you don't want it to affect everyone at once (you want to be able to roll back :)
[08:00] <MartijnVdS> diplo: so you do it over the course of several days
[08:01] <MartijnVdS> while monitoring all kinds of statistics to see if it's actually working
[08:01] <MartijnVdS> (improving click-throughs, etc.)
[08:05] <popey> heh, i have a bell on one account, and not on the other
[08:05] <popey> damn you google and your slow rolloutts
[08:05] <popey> -t
[08:06] <MartijnVdS> popey: maybe you logged in as the wrong Alan (Bell)
[08:06] <MartijnVdS> (jpc)
[08:08] <brobostigon> lol
[08:09] <diplo> MartijnVdS: I understand a few days, theirs can take a lot longer though at times
[08:10] <popey> morning btw
[08:10] <brobostigon> morning his popey'ness.
[08:18] <mungbean> realised that if i put salt on this chocolate eclair then i get in the red zone for all categories
[09:08] <JamesTait> Good morning all, Happy Friday and Happy World Music Day! :)
[09:08] <MartijnVdS> JamesTait: http://www.unicode.org/charts/PDF/U1D100.pdf
[09:09] <JamesTait> MartijnVdS, very topical!
[09:09] <MartijnVdS> JamesTait: exactly :)
[09:44] <ali1234> warning: delegating constructors only available with -std=c++11 or -std=gnu++11 [enabled by default]
[09:44] <ali1234> what does ths mean?
[09:45] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: it means delegating constructors are a feature of the 2011 standard of C++
[09:45] <ali1234> i know
[09:45] <MartijnVdS> which is enabled by default
[09:45] <ali1234> but what is a delagting constructor
[09:45] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: http://www.stroustrup.com/C++11FAQ.html#delegating-ctor
[09:46] <ali1234> oh i see
[09:46] <ali1234> i'm surprsed it took until 2011 for something so obvious to be supported
[09:48] <MartijnVdS> I'm surprised they haven't run out of ways to expand C++ yet
[09:56] <ali1234> does anyone know how to expand the comments stream on sound cloud?
[09:56] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: click on the "comment count" number, on the right side of the song's page
[09:57] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: under the waveform
[09:57] <ali1234> ok and now how to sort them by track time?
[09:58] <MartijnVdS> http://developers.soundcloud.com/ :)
[10:01] <bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
[10:01] <mgdm> C++ is 'orrible
[10:01] <bigcalm> Has anybody here put CM onto their SGS3?
[10:03] <MartijnVdS> bigcalm: I guess people must have.. but I don't know anyone who has
[10:04] <bigcalm> I'm getting fed up of my phone freezing on me which causes me to reset the phone by taking the battery out
[10:04] <mgdm> MS Office for the Mac is also 'orrible
[10:05] <MartijnVdS> the Mac is also 'orrible
[10:05] <shauno> heretics!
[10:05] <mungbean> have a legit visio key but no media :(
[10:05] <MartijnVdS> mungbean: you can download those from MS I guess
[10:05] <mungbean> MS don't let you download do they?
[10:06] <MartijnVdS> mungbean: they will, if you register the key to your "Live" account
[10:06] <mgdm> MartijnVdS: That's a matter of opinion, Office being 'orrible is a fact
[10:06] <MartijnVdS> mgdm: true
[10:06] <mungbean> top link is TPB so i guess no
[10:07] <shauno> http://www.microsoft.com/office/downloads/  looks promising (for 2007 values of promising)
[10:07] <mungbean> visio aint office, but nice try
[10:07] <davmor2> Morning all
[10:07] <mgdm> It's part of office, so it's a reasonable place to look
[10:08] <mgdm> Hungarian notation is also 'orrible
[10:08] <shauno> was curious if it'd break out the part you're entitled to when you feed it your key  (they chomp on your key before the d/l stage)
[10:08] <MartijnVdS> mungbean: you can log in on office.microsoft.com I think, then add the product code to your account
[10:08] <MartijnVdS> and THEN download the ISO you need
[10:08] <MartijnVdS> or .ex
[10:08] <MartijnVdS> e
[10:09] <mungbean> i think they are for office apps, and visio is not part of office pro plus
[10:10] <MartijnVdS> mungbean: http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/products/download-back-up-restore-microsoft-office-products-FX103427465.aspx ?
[10:10] <MartijnVdS> mungbean: at the bottom, enter the 2007/2010 product key
[10:10] <mungbean> visio was not part of office :(
[10:10] <MartijnVdS> it was and is!
[10:10] <MartijnVdS> (or: what happened when you tried? :)
[10:10] <mungbean> trying now
[10:11] <MartijnVdS> mungbean: the sidebar claims "Applies to: [lots of products, including Visio 2010]"
[10:12] <mungbean> The Office 2007 Product Key provided is not recognized as an eligible product for free download. Please re-enter your Product Key and try again, or check the list of eligible products.
[10:12] <MartijnVdS> ah it's 07
[10:12] <MartijnVdS> no idea :(
[10:12] <mungbean> my code was for 07
[10:12] <mungbean> looks again
[10:12] <MartijnVdS> \o/ free software
[10:14] <ali1234> mungbean: you need MSDN subscription to download media
[10:14] <mungbean> yeah, dreamspark etc
[10:14] <mungbean> i could go and rummage in my old office but that will end in frustration
[10:15] <ali1234> someone actually asked me to find office 2007 iso for them but i could not find a verifiable one
[10:19] <directhex> which office 2007?
[10:19] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: I might have MS Works (for DOS!) on floppies around here somewhere
[10:20] <directhex> pro? ultimate? home & student?
[10:20] <ali1234> yeah i have that
[10:20] <ali1234> i found it in a box the other day while cleaning out junk
[10:32] <kaushal> Hi
[10:34] <kaushal> We have around 100 Servers which are colocated. Any open source software to draw rack elevation diagram and populate it with all asset details viz IP, hard disk and memory sizes?
[10:55] <diplo> There are I believe but all a bit ahem, not very good
[10:55]  * diplo trying to remember names
[10:55] <diplo> Visio is still much better at it :/
[10:56] <ormiret> If you're looking for something visio like then possibly dia (though it is a bit primitive by comparison).
[10:56] <mungbean> yeah, they all suck a bit
[10:57] <diplo> Yep :/
[10:58] <mungbean> cannot install 64 bit visio because 32bit office was oinstalled on your pc
[11:00] <diplo> Sounds like you're having fun mungbean
[11:09] <MartijnVdS> mungbean: mug for you: http://www.zazzle.com/say_raah_mugs-168783956030796784
[11:47] <AlanBell> ooh I like the weather integration in Saucy unity
[11:47] <AlanBell> err, whut, maybe I don't
[11:49] <shauno> now that's what I call divisive
[11:49] <MartijnVdS> shauno: left brain/right brain
[11:49] <AlanBell> ah, it shows you the weather in "termoloi, italy" if you type term in the search box
[11:50] <AlanBell> I thought itwas going to be 32 degrees tomorrow, which had me all excited
[11:50] <popey> you running saucy?
[11:50] <AlanBell> so you have to search for london to find weather here
[11:50] <popey> or farnborough?
[11:50] <AlanBell> yes, I got unity running on a spare laptop, my upgraded saucy laptop won't start unity properly
[11:51] <MartijnVdS> oh I disabled on-line searches
[11:51] <MartijnVdS> so no weather for me \o/
[11:51] <MartijnVdS> I only use Alt+F2 anyway ;)
[11:51] <popey> yeah, i have disabled all online stuff on mine
[11:52] <ali1234> firefox has a bug where it just stops making connections
[11:52] <MartijnVdS> fd leak?
[11:52] <ali1234> requires a restart before it will load any web page
[11:52] <AlanBell> 17 degrees tomorrow
[11:53] <ali1234> that will be annoying for anyone trying to use webapps
[11:53] <AlanBell> "weather in a city that sounds like the application you are trying to launch" is an interesting feature
[11:53] <ali1234> AlanBell: well that could be more accurately summed up as "a load of irrelevant rubbish that you don't care about every time you try to do anything"
[11:54] <ali1234> that way it covers gnome shell too
[11:56] <Laney> unfortunately for me the weather comes below files, music and amazon results so I can't see it without scrolling
[11:56] <AlanBell> well in theory the smart scopes should figure that out and eventually realise that nobody typing "weather" wants to scroll down to find the weather in weatherford, US
[11:57] <ali1234> yeah, not gonna happen
[11:57] <MartijnVdS> it's "smart scopes" though, not "SkyNet Scopes"
[11:57] <Laney> I suspect it only learns when people click on stuff, not when they scroll down to look at it
[11:58] <ali1234> basically the only way you could make the dash even slightly good is to give control of the entire thing to google and let them decide what should appear in it
[11:58] <Laney> if I could get the server to never enable More suggestions for me I might leave that option on
[11:58] <mungbean> synapse seems to get it right for me
[11:59] <mungbean> local search , but has plugins
[11:59] <ali1234> google gets it right about 40% of the time for me
[11:59] <MartijnVdS> Google Now gets it right for me
[12:00] <ali1234> everything else is so bad that i end up having to specifically modify queries just to get what i want
[12:00]  * Laney is getting an "at800 filter" because of 4G
[12:01] <MartijnVdS> Laney: why though?
[12:01] <ali1234> because 4G interferes with DVB frequencies in the UK
[12:01] <Laney> https://at800.tv/press-releases/at800-updates-estimate-of-likely-impact-of-4g-at-800-mhz-on-freeview/
[12:01] <MartijnVdS> oh, they cleared those frequencies of DVB here
[12:02] <mungbean> only some areas affected
[12:02] <mungbean> allegedly
[12:02] <ali1234> they only just cleared them *for* freeview here
[12:04] <ali1234> the corporate branding on that site is awful
[12:04] <ali1234> someone decided that the site needs to be clear
[12:04] <ali1234> they have ensured that this is the case by using the phrase "let's be clear" every third sentence
[12:05] <popey> heh
[12:35] <AlanBell> what is a fast way of transferring lots of stuff over gigabit ethernet?
[12:36] <AlanBell> 100GB or so of stuff between two laptops
[12:37] <ali1234> tar | nc
[12:38] <dogmatic69> not quite right http://i.imgur.com/zADSnKX.png
[12:39] <dogmatic69> icon counter things are skew ^
[12:39] <dogmatic69> left / right monitor
[12:42] <mungbean> realised that pencil app is better than any dia, etc
[12:43] <AlanBell> mungbean: yeah, but PNG export is a bit busted at the moment
[12:43] <AlanBell> it drops a .svg in /tmp but fails to convert it to a raster png image
[12:44] <AlanBell> I was debugging it the other day, but lost the will to live halfway through
[12:48] <mungbean> AlanBell: http://askubuntu.com/questions/270836/pencil-export-page-as-png-does-not-work
[12:48] <mungbean> easy fix
[12:48] <mungbean> revert to 2.0.2
[12:48] <mungbean> or manually use xulrunner
[12:48] <AlanBell> that isn't a fix
[12:49] <AlanBell> I was going to fix it
[12:49] <mungbean> s/fix/workaround
[12:49] <mungbean> ah ok
[12:49] <mungbean> there's a few dupes for that bug, i wonder if it's been patched unofficlally
[12:49] <AlanBell> I don't think so (I did look)
[12:50] <mungbean> it's certainly easier than other alternatives to use, so you'd be doing a service to the community :D
[12:52] <AlanBell> somewhere in /usr/share/pencil/content/pencil/common/svgRasterizer.js
[12:52] <AlanBell> I think
[12:53] <AlanBell> I couldn't figure out quite how to debug xul applications
[12:57] <AlanBell> heh, going out on a limb here, but a hard coded export path of     var path = "/home/dgthanhan/Desktop/tmp.png"; might not help
[12:58] <AlanBell> can't quite figure out where that gets used but line 164 of /usr/share/pencil/content/pencil/common/svgRasterizer.js looks very very wrong
[12:58] <mungbean> png export has a black baground..weird
[12:58] <AlanBell> oh, he commented out the wrong line
[12:59] <AlanBell> lulz
[12:59] <AlanBell>     //this.saveURI(dataURL, path); shoudl not be commented out
[12:59] <mungbean> must have been drunk
[13:03] <mungbean> doesn't fix the prob though
[13:04] <AlanBell> nope, it doesn't
[13:05] <mungbean> i have it working with v16 of xulrunner but not v22
[13:05] <AlanBell> hmm, how would it work with xulrunner if that was the bug . . .
[13:05] <AlanBell> must be going through some other codepath because that one can't work
[13:06] <mungbean> androidSupports.js:    var output = "/home/dgthanhan/Desktop/foo.png";
[13:06] <mungbean> has a habit of it
[13:07] <AlanBell> heh
[13:13] <mungbean> has anyone heard of xCAT?
[13:17] <directhex> mungbean, ibm xcat?
[13:17] <bigcalm> Feline species realignment?
[13:17] <mungbean> yes directhex
[13:17] <directhex> i used it around... 2005, i guess?
[13:17] <directhex> on a cluster of dual pentium 3's running red hat 7
[13:18] <mungbean> it appears to do mass deployment of VMs and nodes etc
[13:18] <directhex> yes. although i expect it's changed a bit in 8 years
[13:18] <mungbean> so what can't it do vs open/cloudstack?
[13:20] <directhex> mungbean, in 2013? i have no idea. when i last used xcat, the cloud didn't exist
[13:20] <directhex> hell, nobody was talking about "grid" yet either
[13:22] <mungbean> allegedly it (now) stands for xtreme cloud admin toolkit
[13:29] <mungbean> our workplace gets a lot of IP infringement emails to the security team
[13:29] <mungbean> e.g someone downloaded star trek into darkness via BT
[13:29] <aquarius> gnaaaah. Virtualisation makes no sense to me. Every guide in the world assumes that you know what you're doing :(
[13:30] <mungbean> From: paramount@copyright-compliance.com
[13:30] <dwdorig> aquarius, You don't *actually* do anything, you only *virtually* do things. I think that's the idea, anyway.
[13:31] <aquarius> hahaha. Funny. :)
[13:31] <dwdorig> aquarius, Indeed. I'll bet your virtually laughing.
[13:31] <popey> aquarius: whats the goal?
[13:31] <davmor2> aquarius: what's up dude
[13:31] <dwdorig> popey, Thing with a net at the end of the pitch.
[13:32] <aquarius> popey, run a downloaded IE8+WindowsXP OVA virtual machine with virt-manager (not VirtualBox).
[13:32] <davmor2> dwdorig: a driving range?
[13:32] <aquarius> popey, I'm not trying to do anything complex here ;)
[13:33] <popey> uhm, okay
[13:33] <popey> so kvm, right?
[13:33] <popey> (i.e. kvm, not virtualbox)
[13:33] <aquarius> this OVA file seems to be a tarball of an OVF file (a definition file for the VM) and a vmdk disk image. So I started virt-manager and told it to create a new VM and pointed it at the VMDK as the disk image, and... it says it's not bootable :(
[13:33] <aquarius> yep, kvm.
[13:33] <aquarius> well, I think so
[13:34] <aquarius> I do not understand this stuff. Am I running kvm? qemu? qemu-kvm? I don't think I get it ;)
[13:34] <popey> does kvm support vmdk these days?
[13:34] <popey> (I don't think it can)
[13:34] <aquarius> the internet seems to think that it can
[13:35] <popey> ok, I bow to the Internet's superior knowledge
[13:35] <aquarius> but I think maybe it is full of lies
[13:35] <aquarius> and i need to convert it to this qcow thing
[13:35] <popey> yes
[13:35] <popey> and that is hassle
[13:35] <aquarius> I am trying to avoid converting an 800MB vmdk file if I can avoid it, because I am really short of disk space ;)
[13:35] <popey> use virtualbox then?
[13:35] <popey> (which does support vmdk files)
[13:36] <shauno> qemu-img is getting pretty good at vmdk, I don't believe kvm is natively
[13:36] <aquarius> virtualbox just flat doesn't work :( It hangs the whole machine, or it won't boot the Windows VM except in safe mode and *then* hangs the whole machine.
[13:36] <aquarius> that's what the previous two hours were about :)
[13:36] <AlanBell> it can do vmdk, just not the multiple chopped up 2gb vmdk things
[13:36] <mungbean> aquarius: just install vmware player
[13:36] <AlanBell> because FAT
[13:36] <mungbean> file -> open OVA
[13:36] <mungbean> job done
[13:36] <davmor2> aquarius: you could just install vmware viewer  it should be in the partners repo
[13:37] <aquarius> orly?
[13:37] <aquarius> I never thought of that
[13:37]  * aquarius checks USC
[13:37] <MartijnVdS> *sigh* neighbors who can't drive
[13:38] <mungbean> also there's command line apps for it if you want to start them from CLI without a console running
[13:38] <mungbean> so you can rdp into it instead
[13:38] <aquarius> can't see vmware player in USC :(
[13:38] <aquarius> there is a VMware View Open Client but that seems to not be it
[13:38] <mungbean> nope
[13:39] <popey> aquarius: out of interest where did you get virtualbox from?
[13:39] <aquarius> popey, the repo.
[13:39] <popey> right, the one from virtualbox.org may be better
[13:39] <popey> (I use it daily)
[13:39] <aquarius> I do not like installing things from random third parties which require compiling some sort of kernel module
[13:39] <popey> it doesnt
[13:39] <aquarius> becuase I don't understand wtf I am doing :(
[13:39] <MartijnVdS> dkms does it for you, I guess
[13:39] <popey> its a deb, you install, job done
[13:39] <aquarius> virtualbox needs kernel modules for, like, everything
[13:39] <popey> i found vmware on ubuntu to be pain
[13:39] <popey> shush
[13:40] <popey> its a deb
[13:40] <popey> you install it
[13:40] <MartijnVdS> kvm + virt-manager works fine though
[13:40] <MartijnVdS> it's a bit bare-bones, but for dev work it's fine
[13:40] <popey> kvm doesn't support vmdk MartijnVdS
[13:40] <aquarius> MartijnVdS, well, that's what i planned to use, because it's all there in the repository. So: I have an OVA file. How do I use kvm+virt-manager to run it?
[13:40] <MartijnVdS> popey: http://opentox.github.io/installation/2012/08/02/converting-ova-images-to-kvm/
[13:41] <popey> thats convert, not open
[13:41] <popey> read upwards
[13:41] <MartijnVdS> popey: after conversion, you can open it
[13:42] <popey> 14:35:32 < aquarius> I am trying to avoid converting an 800MB vmdk file if I can avoid it, because I am really short of disk space ;)
[13:42] <MartijnVdS> ah, that above ;)
[13:42] <MartijnVdS> not top of the web page
[13:42] <shauno> everything converts ova, it's a tarball
[13:42] <AlanBell> it *can* use vmdk, just not splitted vmdk
[13:42] <aquarius> I will convert if I have to. However, as far as I can tell, qemu-img can convert vmdk files by itself. Which suggests that that page, MartijnVdS, is out of date. I mistrust out of date pages.
[13:43] <AlanBell> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/KVM/FAQ#Using_and_Converting_VMWare_Virtual_Disk_Files
[13:43] <MartijnVdS> aquarius: good point
[13:43] <aquarius> AlanBell, I used virt-manager to create a new VM, and told it to use the existing VMDK disk. When I then boot that VM, it says that the hard disk is an unbootable device.
[13:44] <shauno> ova is an archive format, it's a tarball containing config files, vmdk, manifests, etc.  so unpacking it is going to demand disk space no matter what route you choose
[13:44] <AlanBell> did you change the type to vmdk in the xml file?
[13:44] <aquarius> AlanBell, I have no idea whether that's because I've done something wrong, or because whatever i'm doing doesn't read vmdks, or because this is a weird vmdk. And the documentation all assumes that you know what you're doing, hence original complaint.
[13:44] <aquarius> AlanBell, er! no.
[13:44] <aquarius> AlanBell, what xml file?
[13:44] <aquarius> shauno, right, and I have unpacked it to a vmdk file and an ovf definition file.
[13:45] <shauno> ah, gotcha
[13:46] <AlanBell> xml file in /etc/libvirt/qemu aquarius
[13:46] <aquarius> AlanBell, I saw that, but... it seems to be owned by root ;(
[13:46] <AlanBell> erm, yeah, they will be
[13:47] <aquarius> ahaha1
[13:47] <aquarius> there is an advanced disk option in virt-manager!
[13:48] <aquarius> which I have now used to set the type to vmdk. Victory.
[13:48]  * aquarius watches machine start to boot.
[13:48] <AlanBell> woot
[13:48] <MartijnVdS> *\o/*
[13:48] <aquarius> hrm.
[13:48] <AlanBell> (that will change the xml file in /etc/libvirt/qemu)
[13:49] <aquarius> now, it does a text boot for a bit, then you get a windows textual BSOD for a microsecond, and then it restarts :)
[13:49] <aquarius> but this is progress!
[13:49] <aquarius> perhaps the vmdk got screwed by my earlier attempts to use it in virtualbox. I'll unpack it again :)
[13:49] <MartijnVdS> aquarius: are these the MSIE tryout images?
[13:49] <AlanBell> sounds like the authentic windows experience
[13:49] <aquarius> MartijnVdS, they are
[13:49] <MartijnVdS> aquarius: is this a*
[13:49] <MartijnVdS> aquarius: I've spend 2 days getting those to work in KVM, somehow Windows doesn't like the (virtual) hardware
[13:50] <MartijnVdS> aquarius: Never got them to work though :(
[13:50] <MartijnVdS> spent*
[13:51] <aquarius> oh really?
[13:51] <aquarius> hrm
[13:51] <aquarius> I'll give it a brief try, then, and then I'll download virtualbox from the site as popey suggests.
[13:51] <MartijnVdS> I *think* it's the disk controller driver
[13:51] <popey> if you do that, remove all trace of virtualbox first
[13:51] <aquarius> popey, I have tried to do so
[13:53] <AlanBell> aquarius: there are an assortment of virtual graphics cards it can present, cirrus is the default bit vit-manager can do several others
[13:53] <aquarius> which should I choose?
[13:54] <AlanBell> no idea which is better/worse, but that is something I would tinker with if you are not getting a desktop
[13:54] <MartijnVdS> try each one in turn
[13:54] <aquarius> ok
[13:54]  * aquarius tries with clean disk and cirrus
[13:54] <aquarius> bsod.
[13:54] <aquarius> :)
[13:55] <dwdorig> aquarius, Always wondered how to get one of those on Linux. Now I know what virtualization is for.
[13:56] <ali1234> the bluescreen probably isn't caused by the graphics card
[13:56] <ali1234> it is more likely to be caused because you did/did not enable io-apic
[13:56] <popey> yeah, windows should have drivers for the base cirrus stuff
[13:56] <popey> its well old
[13:56] <mungbean> purple screen on vmware i see a lot
[13:57] <mungbean> gonna try and ask the bank about paying off my mortgage \o/
[13:57] <aquarius> oh, brilliant. I changed the video card from cirrus to qxl (which also failed) and now I can't change it away again because virt-manager put a "ram" option in the xml and doesn't know how to take it away. Sigh.
[13:57] <aquarius> AlanBell, um, what is an io-apic?
[13:57]  * AlanBell directs aquarius to ali1234 :)
[13:58] <ali1234> io-apic is a piece of hardware found on motherboards
[13:58] <ali1234> it is something to do with plug and play
[13:58] <popey> yeah, you do need that turned on.
[13:58] <ali1234> in virtualbox you can enable or disable it
[13:59] <aquarius> OK. This is a thing that I need to turn on in the virtual machine configuration?
[13:59] <ali1234> yes
[13:59] <aquarius> or a thing that I need to turn on on my actual computer?
[13:59] <ali1234> or turn off if it is turned on
[13:59] <popey> it needs to be on
[14:00] <AlanBell> overview, machine settings
[14:00] <AlanBell> in virt-manager
[14:00] <aquarius> enable APIC is ticked.
[14:03] <aquarius> have now tried booting with apic ticked and not ticked, and with all the different video cards, and I get the same thing: textual progress bar, followed by bsod, followed by automatic power cycle.
[14:03] <aquarius> oh well. so much for kvm, then.
[14:04]  * aquarius downloads virtualbox.
[14:05] <ali1234> this is why nobody uses kvm
[14:05] <MartijnVdS> lack of working apps?
[14:06] <ali1234> no, because it is just impossible to make it work for anything other than an incredibly small number of specific set ups
[14:06] <mungbean> :-|
[14:07] <popey> or servers
[14:09] <directhex> virtualbox has never worked right for me
[14:09] <directhex> well, that's a lie. it worked as packaged as part of the webos sdk
[14:09] <AlanBell> virtualbox on the desktop, kvm on the server for me
[14:09] <directhex> but i've had every imaginable issue with virtualbox, right down to hand-editing /var/lib/dpkg/status to obliterate it from my system
[14:09] <ali1234> i once tried to use kvm and it not only didn't work, it also made virtualbox not work
[14:10] <directhex> aquarius, virt-manager is pretty dumb
[14:11] <AlanBell> virt-manager is pretty good for remote management of VMs
[14:11] <AlanBell> somewhat poor if it is local
[14:14] <davmor2> ohhh update to torchlight means your character has a head still when he has a headgear on
[14:15] <ali1234> lol they finally fixed that one eh?
[14:16] <Laney> why is it poor?
[14:18] <aquarius> directhex, yeah -- but ideally I wouldn't need smartness. I don't need clever things, I just want to run this existin vmdk of a Windows XP image in a window on my Ubuntu desktop. Now, I'm sure there's all sorts of clever things that *can* be done, and reasons why this is more complex than I would like it to be...
[14:18] <popey> aquarius: http://popey.com/~alan/vm.png worked first time in virtualbox
[14:18] <popey> aquarius: https://gist.github.com/magnetikonline/5274656 followed those steps
[14:18] <aquarius> ali1234, er... I now have kvm installed. Is having that installed going to sod up virtualbox?
[14:19] <mungbean> if you are a noob then vmware player is v friendly
[14:19] <ali1234> yes, it will if you don't unload the kvm kernel module
[14:19] <ali1234> although ironically it will only affect windows guests
[14:19] <aquarius> ali1234, oh. Should I uninstalll kvm, then?
[14:19] <ali1234> linux guests will run correctly in virtualbox whether kvm module is loaded or not
[14:19] <popey> i would unload the module
[14:20] <aquarius> popey, that's *really* useful. Thank you. not sure why I didn't find that in searching!
[14:20] <popey> sudo rmmod kvm-intel
[14:20] <popey> np
[14:20] <ali1234> kvm-amd in my case
[14:20] <ali1234> or something
[14:20] <aquarius> popey, well, I should uninstall whatever package provides it, right? (I'm not using it, and I don't want to have to remember to rmmod it on every boot?)
[14:21] <directhex> i use kvm for my desktop virtualization, since my experiences with virtualbox are dreadful and vmware doesn't support your kernel version ever
[14:21] <directhex> plus, kvm works fine for me to run a company's it on it
[14:21] <directhex> incl. windows
[14:21]  * aquarius installs virtualbox
[14:22] <popey> aquarius: sure, uninstall if you're not using it
[14:31] <aquarius> yeaaah, and it starts
[14:31] <aquarius> nice one popey. thank you :)
[14:32] <popey> yay
[14:34] <bigcalm> My SGS3 is freezing on me randomly several times a week. Do I take to t-mobile or put CyanogenMod on it?
[14:34] <bigcalm> If I take it to t-mobile, I imagine that I'll have to pay them something and be without a phone for weeks if it goes off for repair
[14:36] <aquarius> blimey XP is weird and annoying.
[14:44] <mungbean> AlanBell: i also can't seem to do curvy lines in the 2.0.3 pencil
[14:52] <mungbean> i also didn't realise you can use it for mockups
[14:52] <mungbean> has gtk widgets etc
[14:53] <directhex> xp is 11 years old at this point, i don't know why anyone would expect it to behave like a modern os
[14:54] <popey> so is GNOME ☻
[14:54] <ali1234> i don't know why anyone would want it to behave like a modern OS. i mean, have you seen them?
[14:55] <popey> comedy gold, he's here all week ladies and gentlemen
[14:56] <scott_> bigcalm: mine was doing the same. I took it back to my provider (three) and they ""fixed"" it for free because it was in its two year warranty. First day it came back it crashed.
[14:57] <scott_> When asked what was done, they said updated the software that was not available to us. To which i though "Bull!". Ive had Cyanogen on it since and its running fine.
[15:12] <directhex> smartphones suck and the software is terrible
[15:13] <mungbean> everyone's grumpy today cos of the weather
[15:13] <MartijnVdS> nah directhex is always like that ;)
[15:13] <mungbean> i thought that was ali1234
[15:13] <directhex> ali1234 is differently grumpy
[15:13] <Laney> he hasn't said anything about bees yet so it can't be that bad
[15:13] <directhex> ali1234 pines for a byegone era, much like http://xkcd.com/1227/
[15:14] <MartijnVdS> directhex & ali1234: the new Waldorf & Statler
[15:14] <directhex> whereas i just think everything is terrible now, and was terrible before, and will likely be terrible in the future
[15:14] <MartijnVdS> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:StatlerAndWaldorf.jpg
[15:16] <ali1234> y'know, just because it took from 1871 until now for letter writing to completely die doesn't mean every quote in that comic isn't absolutely correct
[17:09] <DJones> Hmmh, twitter spam email, Do you know.....  Er, yes I do, I blocked them and reported them for spam some months ago
[17:11] <daftykins> i keep getting automated phone calls on my mobile from 0845 and swansea numbers of late =/
[17:25] <diplo> evening all
[17:28] <daftykins> diplo: hi o/
[17:30] <diplo> How's things daftykins ?
[17:31] <daftykins> not bad ty sir
[17:31] <daftykins> i've started getting all these small flying brown/black bugs in my house
[17:31] <daftykins> no idea what they are
[17:31] <diplo> Still working, or at home now ?
[17:31] <daftykins> but other than that ok :>
[17:31] <diplo> :(
[17:31] <daftykins> i'm at home yep
[17:32] <daftykins> how are thee?
[17:32] <diplo> Not had many bugs luckily, and one big benefit since the wife left... I never have spiders anymore, we used to be overrun when she was here
[17:32] <diplo> They followed her to her new house \o/
[17:32] <daftykins> lmao
[17:32] <daftykins> that's weird
[17:32] <diplo> Not to bad thanks, just picked my kids up and they went straight out so thought i'd do some web work
[17:32] <diplo> :)
[17:32] <daftykins> sounds like a win win!
[17:33] <daftykins> actually not requiring pick-up probably would've qualified as that
[17:33] <diplo> Well would be nice to see them.. but if they're happy
[17:33] <daftykins> :D
[17:33] <diplo> I always seem to do drop off/pick up but it's not that bad
[17:39] <diplo> Been playing with ISPConfig 3 today, it's not that bad tbh
[17:41] <daftykins> how far is it from home to the schools?
[17:41] <daftykins> ah yeah? i've got a BigV VPS from bytemark, their 'symbiosis' system is pretty neat for simple admin
[17:43] <diplo> Ah yeah, was going to try that as well
[17:44] <diplo> Will have to get some vm's set up to test other ones
[17:45] <daftykins> :D
[17:46] <diplo> Ah it's pick up from the ex's house at 5 after work, not school, only pick up/drop off to school monday and tuesday morning
[17:46] <daftykins> ah right
[17:46] <diplo> and about 1/4 mile from the house but 3 /12 miles from work
[17:47] <diplo> Suppose I better find them actually, getting a little late now :D
[17:47] <daftykins> i feel kinda proud of always getting myself to and from school cycling since primary school over the years
[17:47] <daftykins> i'd want to force the same on any blighters i might have - perish the thought XD
[18:10] <diplo> I'll let the boys walk in a year or so
[18:10] <diplo> defo more dodgey now
[18:14] <daftykins> ah
[18:14] <daftykins> i still remember the funny things my parents would say to try and keep you away from harm as a youngster
[18:15] <daftykins> in the local park 'don't go in the hedges back there, strange people are there that will hurt you'
[18:15] <daftykins> mmk
[18:16] <zleap> diplo, take em to basic self defence classes,
[18:17] <diplo> zleap: Just about to sign eldest up to karate lessons, biggest issue is the ex... lazy :)
[18:17] <diplo> So have to find something running when I have them to take them
[18:19] <diplo> But self defence won't stop someone in a van picking up one of the boys, only 5 & 6
[18:20] <directhex> as predicted, 75% off crusader kings 2
[18:21] <popey> wossat
[18:21] <zleap> diplo, i guess,  but isn't 5/6 kinda young for walking to school on their own anyway
[18:21] <popey> yes
[18:21] <diplo> I was replying to daftykins about walking to school since primary :)
[18:21] <diplo> They don't walk anywhere on their own atm
[18:22] <popey> although our kids school is miles away so that would be hard
[18:22] <daftykins> he's easing them into society
[18:22] <popey> well 3.3 miles
[18:22] <diplo> They're allowed to play out the front, all the houses point in on grassed walkway on my estate so kids are fairly safe out the front
[18:23] <diplo> It's why I moved here
[18:23] <popey> ours play in the road
[18:24] <daftykins> with the cars
[18:24] <daftykins> Guernsey style, that :)
[18:26] <daftykins> are there any log files worth looking in after a server's seized up? granted it'd be impressive for an OS to write about its' own failure before curling up into a ball, but i figured it worth asking :)
[18:27] <diplo> syslog/kern.log are the only two I guess, grep -i error * ? :)
[18:27] <diplo> Might have some noticed of something happening before it locks up
[18:28] <daftykins> ty sir
[18:28] <daftykins> Austrian guy reckons the weather's hotting up so who knows how he lost his 1U beastie :)
[18:29] <diplo> :)
[18:42] <diddledan_> WEEEE FRIDAY
[18:43] <popey> +1
[18:43] <popey> "Like"
[18:46] <daftykins> -1 "Social Media"
[18:50] <diddledan_> lol
[18:54] <daftykins> i had to hop on facebook to message a friends sister about laptop fixing i was doing for her
[18:54] <daftykins> saw my brother and his wife having a publicised domestic
[18:54] <daftykins> i didn't know such things had gone multiplayer
[18:55] <DJones> daftykins: Isn't that called IRC
[18:56] <daftykins> if married types are on it i suppose, yes
[18:56] <daftykins> right time to depart and get some things done i expect
[18:56] <diplo> Not a great fan of social media, but I do like G+, more for news / info
[18:57] <daftykins> i've not tried
[18:59] <diddledan_> I like facebook for randomly useless memes
[19:00] <MartijnVdS> diddledan_: you need more reddit in your life
[19:00] <MartijnVdS> diddledan_: it's WAY better for useless memes ;)
[19:00] <diddledan_> :-)
[19:00] <diddledan_> I have never read reddit in earnest
[19:01] <diddledan_> I've occasionally been there as a result of a search but quickly found dross and left
[19:02] <MartijnVdS> it is full of rubbish
[19:02] <MartijnVdS> but you can just disable the "subreddits" that suck the most
[19:05] <zleap> i use g+ but gnu social looks interesting
[19:05] <MartijnVdS> zleap: except nobody will ever use it
[19:06] <zleap> well we are looking at setting up a gnu social page for the dclug mainly to play around but it could be useful
[19:10] <MartijnVdS> ooh - http://googlesystem.blogspot.nl/2013/06/google-mine.html
[19:15] <popey> that makes no sense to me ☻
[19:15] <popey> I need to read it 3 more times
[19:15] <MartijnVdS> popey: Google is adding sharing of real-world things to G+ :)
[19:19]  * DJones puts on his tinfoil hat and thinks its a way of google finding out what 'stuff' you have at home/to hand so they can target adverts based on non-web based information
[19:22]  * AlanBell wonders if it works for chickens
[19:23] <MartijnVdS> DJones: you mean like census data, what kind of people live in what areas etc.?
[19:23] <MartijnVdS> DJones: "Oh you live in a rich neighborhood, better advertise expensive things"
[19:23] <MartijnVdS> "Poor neighborhood? Lots of loans!"
[19:23] <DJones> MartijnVdS: That probably sounds believable
[19:24] <MartijnVdS> DJones: "Ooh lots of families with young/newborn children in your area. *ad for diapers*"
[19:26] <brobostigon> or if you live in bachelor towers it advertises other kinds of stuff.
[19:26] <MartijnVdS> brobostigon: "single women in your area"?
[19:26] <brobostigon> MartijnVdS: yeah, that kind of thing.
[19:28] <DJones> MartijnVdS: I thought they were advertised on business cards in phone boxes
[19:29] <MartijnVdS> DJones: sure but if you live in an area full of potential clients.. why not have google advertise?
[19:29] <MartijnVdS> DJones: who uses phone boxes!
[19:29] <DJones> I was just trying to think where my nearest phone box is... And can't think of any
[19:31] <MartijnVdS> Cornwall is full of them
[19:31] <MartijnVdS> every town has one
[19:36] <brobostigon> concept, now that would be an interesting google glass app, "google glass, launch gooogle plus dating app please."
[19:37] <MartijnVdS> brobostigon: the real-world sharing bit isn't out yet
[19:38] <brobostigon> MartijnVdS: yes, but some ideas, like that at a singles party, or a speed dating party, could be interesting.
[19:41] <brobostigon> copyright brobostigon, 2013.
[19:45] <mungbean> AlanBell: happened to notice there is a 2.0.4 version of pencil
[19:45] <mungbean> just no deb for it.
[19:45] <mungbean> might have those bugs fixed
[19:45] <AlanBell> interesting
[19:45] <mungbean> i think fedora has it OOTB
[19:46] <mungbean> have a baby in one hand so let me know if u try it :D
[19:47]  * AlanBell is baby free
[19:48] <mungbean> i'm preferring to visio atm
[19:49] <mungbean> if only the page creation was a bit easier, but it has nice features like fit to diagram+padding
[19:50] <diplo> Never tried it, will have to take a look
[19:51] <mungbean> has features for mockups too
[19:51] <mungbean> like balsamiq
[19:53] <diplo> Installing now
[19:55] <mungbean> version?
[19:56] <diplo> 2.03 from the website
[19:57] <mungbean> beware of the png export bug
[19:57] <mungbean> haven't got enough hands free to look at whats involved wuth installing from the 2.0.4,tar,gz
[20:01] <diplo> heh, something just locked the laptop right up, had to unity --reset
[20:01] <diplo> :P
[20:01] <diplo> Hmm, still not right I don't think
[20:02]  * diplo gets work laptop out 
[20:16] <mungbean> about to blow away a win8 laptop - will win7 installer ask me about keeping original partitions?
[20:16] <mungbean> i.e the factory reset one
[20:17] <directhex> mungbean, yes.
[20:17] <diplo> You can go through disk partitions with win7
[20:17] <diplo> Need to click a link first though
[20:17] <diplo> From memory
[20:17] <directhex> mungbean, when you load the installer, you can do an upgrade or a custom. it will likely grey out the upgrade option in this instance since it's a downgrade
[20:17] <directhex> then it'll ask you which partition to install onto, allowing you to delete existing ones and create new ones
[20:18] <mungbean> sweet ,ta
[20:18] <mungbean> dont have win8 disk so in trouble if the drivers on win7 dont work
[20:19] <directhex> yeah, annoying that you can't just download a win8 iso easily
[20:19] <directhex> win7 isos are downloadable by all
[20:20] <directhex> fwiw, MSDN win8 media works with OEM keys
[20:23] <mungbean> there's a win8 iso at work but i'd have to wait
[20:23] <mungbean> and its a full on fail either way :D
[20:23] <mungbean> shame cos mother in law only uses for gmail and openoffice, but not really my place to offer ubuntu
[20:26] <mungbean> this laptop is massive
[20:26] <mungbean> 17inch+
[20:29] <mungbean> first time looking at win8,within 1 sec i accidentally moved a tile somwhere
[20:29] <diplo> :P
[20:29] <mungbean> help me out guys - how to get to desktop?
[20:29] <mungbean> ah, win-D
[20:30] <diplo> aobut to say, not tried it but it used to be win-d
[20:30] <mungbean> no start menu tho
[20:30] <zleap> there is in 8.1 aparently
[20:31] <mungbean> touchpad clicks seem unrepsonsive
[20:31] <mungbean> weird
[20:35] <mungbean> this is hideous
[20:35] <mungbean> its going
[20:35] <mungbean> in the bin
[20:39] <directhex> start menu you press the windows key, or move the cursor to the bottom-left corner and left click
[20:39] <directhex> there's no start *button*, but there is a start menu
[20:40] <mungbean> directhex: brings the tile display up
[20:40] <mungbean> no way to actually run notepad
[20:41] <mungbean> ok, started tpying blindly
[20:41] <mungbean> pops up with a thing
[20:42] <directhex> mungbean, typeahead find exists in the start screen
[20:42] <mungbean> yep, was expecting a launcher, but just type
[20:42] <mungbean> even gnome3 is better than this tripe
[20:43] <directhex> well, if you want to get technical, you can get the full apps list without typing by bringing up the start screen, then clicking on the search charm
[20:45] <mungbean> have two pages of complaints about this
[20:45] <mungbean> gmail not working in firefox, etc ,etc
[20:45] <mungbean> seems to work but she's probably not doing what i'm doing (win-D run firefox)
[20:46] <mungbean> no reboot button..
[20:49] <mungbean> gonna stop making obvious observations now...
[20:54] <mungbean> except that the win7 installer has hung :(
[21:02] <mungbean> http://imgur.com/a8jVy02
[21:02] <mungbean> could be a bad dvd/iso..
[21:07] <diddledan_> mungbean, methinks you're doing it wrong
[21:07] <diddledan_> here: www.ubuntu.com/download
[21:07] <diddledan_> :-p

[21:09] <mungbean> definitely agree
[21:09] <mungbean> hate windows with passion
[21:10] <mungbean> HA!
[21:10] <mungbean> "I ran into the same problem with a Toshiba laptop that had Windows 8 on it. I had to change a setting in the BIOS under Boot Mode from UEFI Boot to CSM Boot. As soon as I did this, I could boot from any of my CD/DVDs and USB devices.
[21:10] <mungbean> "
[21:10] <mungbean> btw ubuntu would have been same
[21:10] <diddledan_> ubuntu supports uefi boot
[21:11] <mungbean> "Wouldn't boot off the USB, wouldn't boot Ubuntu with the cd.
[21:11] <diddledan_> windows 7 _should_ support it
[21:11] <mungbean> Was going to try and format the drive with Linux but couldn't get it to boot."
[21:11] <mungbean> tosh hobbled it
[21:11] <diddledan_> hmm
[21:11] <diddledan_> sounds like my half-assed BIOS from gigabyte - hybrid-efi my arse!
[21:11] <mungbean> gonna tackle this tomorrow
[21:12] <mungbean> too hot and sweaty for windows
[21:12] <diddledan_> sexytime with a hot sweaty ubuntu?
[21:12] <diddledan_> ooh yeah baby!
[21:13] <diddledan_> uuuu .... buuuuuun .... TUUUUU :-p
[21:19] <mungbean> gonna create a forum account to thank that internet stranger
[21:19] <diddledan_> must have been an awesome post :-p
[23:07] <dogmatic69> oh man, what has happened to rhythm box in 13.04?
[23:07] <dogmatic69> Tried playing music on my NAS and now my HDD is full :/
[23:08] <dogmatic69> though it was strange it was taking long to load the songs, in 12.04 it took around 30 seconds to load 8k songs
[23:08] <dogmatic69> now it literally imports them