| racarr | Well, just I am trying to get all the focus policy in to one object | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| racarr | this object, basically, makes the assosciation, this surface is the focused one (only above this, does "focus" really exist) | 00:00 |
| racarr | and, ties up the bits to implement focus | 00:01 |
| kdub | racarr, sounds useful (although hard to say for sure...) | 00:02 |
| racarr | i.e. raises the surface when it receives focus and targets it for keyboard events. (this could be a seperate mechanism object still, not sure how helpful it really is) | 00:02 |
| racarr | mm. still hard to say XD | 00:02 |
| kdub | i'm just trying to detangle the surface ownerships | 00:02 |
| racarr | so the problem is | 00:02 |
| racarr | some surface is focused | 00:02 |
| racarr | and it's destroyed | 00:02 |
| racarr | how does this object know to choose a new mechanism for focus | 00:02 |
| racarr | err | 00:03 |
| racarr | a new surface | 00:03 |
| racarr | I don't want to | 00:03 |
| racarr | pass this object down through the session manager and session like before, and have the those bits contain the logic | 00:03 |
| kdub | like, just floating up the factories and untangling the objects ownerships, i'm starting to see how it'll happen | 00:04 |
| racarr | "when surface is destroyed, focus the last surface", etc | 00:04 |
| kdub | still too early to say though | 00:04 |
| racarr | so I am wondering about | 00:04 |
| racarr | some sorst of change_callback system | 00:04 |
| kdub | it kinda feels like those zelda levels, where if you go in the wrong door, you have start the maze over at this point in time | 00:04 |
| racarr | to mirror what we have on the graphics side... | 00:04 |
| racarr | Haha. yeah .... | 00:05 |
| kdub | racarr, that makes sense | 00:05 |
| kdub | the callback for input | 00:05 |
| racarr | I guess I am just brought it up because it kind of ties in to the EventSink bits...how do various portions of msh:: notify eachother | 00:05 |
| racarr | on shell side state changes | 00:05 |
| racarr | I just had a crazy idea | 00:07 |
| racarr | the FocusArbitrator/Setter/Whatever | 00:07 |
| racarr | could hand out like... | 00:08 |
| racarr | surface->receive_focus(std::unique_ptr<FocusToken>)... | 00:08 |
| racarr | and the destructor knows what to do | 00:08 |
| kdub | well, what if you want to get that token back though | 00:11 |
| kdub | like, a manual reassignment of focus | 00:11 |
| racarr | kdub: std::move XD | 00:11 |
| racarr | I'm not sure... | 00:12 |
| racarr | I find a certain appeal to this but may jjust have C++ addiction | 00:14 |
| RAOF | Not *every* problem needs to be modelled in the type system :) | 00:20 |
| RAOF | But it does have a certain charm. Also parallels desrt's focus-stealing-prevention idea. | 00:20 |
| racarr | it's a nice way to be explicit about the signalling needed (surface destroyed) | 00:21 |
| racarr | I think without clogging up other listener interfaces, or using generic change callbacks | 00:21 |
| racarr | etc | 00:21 |
| racarr | which will end up with more coupling | 00:21 |
| racarr | but im still not sure | 00:21 |
| racarr | I think ill let it stew until tomorrow | 00:21 |
| RAOF | So, how close are we to having a "focus-gained" and "focus-lost" signal on our surfaces? | 00:22 |
| racarr | well | 00:22 |
| racarr | the session_listener has | 00:22 |
| racarr | focused and unfocused | 00:22 |
| racarr | and the EventSink will probably give them eventually | 00:22 |
| racarr | I dunon that's the thing though, we don't really want signals so to speak | 00:23 |
| racarr | i.e. this same problem could be solved by having the focus bit do | 00:23 |
| RAOF | Let me rephrase: at what point will XMir be able to tell when it's not focused, and give up input? | 00:23 |
| racarr | surface.subscribe_to_signal("about_to_close" | 00:23 |
| racarr | now! | 00:23 |
| racarr | oh | 00:23 |
| racarr | I made that up | 00:23 |
| RAOF | Woo! How! | 00:23 |
| racarr | soon | 00:23 |
| RAOF | Oh ☹ | 00:23 |
| racarr | no I made that up ignore me | 00:23 |
| racarr | XD | 00:23 |
| racarr | if xmir needs that | 00:23 |
| racarr | I can finish it soon | 00:23 |
| racarr | well | 00:24 |
| racarr | xmir does need that | 00:24 |
| RAOF | Only if you'd like to be able to switch sessions without all sessions getting all input :) | 00:24 |
| racarr | RAOF: *shrug* I'm not too picky | 00:27 |
| thomi | hey guys, what's required to run openarena on mir? | 00:45 |
| thomi | is there a custom build somewhere? | 00:45 |
| RAOF | Does that just need SDL? | 00:53 |
| RAOF | Or do you want to run it in XMir? | 00:53 |
| bschaefer | thomi, it should work on Mir with the SDL package in the ppa (I haven't tried yet though) | 00:54 |
| bschaefer | tried openarena that is | 00:54 |
| thomi | ok, I'll give that a go | 00:56 |
| thomi | RAOF: I'll tackle xmir soon | 00:56 |
| thomi | just mir right now | 00:56 |
| RAOF | duflu: I don't think I can drop the varargs annoyance in the open() wrapper. Or, at least, I don't think I want to. | 01:57 |
| duflu | RAOF: Oh? Why not? | 01:57 |
| RAOF | If I drop it, it no longer interposes. | 01:58 |
| duflu | RAOF: In C/C++, the caller determines how many parameters to pass. It can be any number. So to assume it is 2 or 3 is pretty simple and safe | 01:58 |
| RAOF | I suspect it's because it no longer matches the prototype in the libc header, so doesn't get the symbol version applied, so the linker doesn't consider it. | 01:58 |
| duflu | RAOF: That's weird. I suggest it's maybe because it's got C++ linkage and needs C. Look at "nm" | 01:58 |
| duflu | RAOF: Yeah just do an 'extern "C"', or put it in a C file | 01:59 |
| RAOF | I'm pretty sure I checked. | 02:00 |
| RAOF | Oh, except that I may have had the ‘please demangle my symbols’ option enabled... | 02:01 |
| RAOF | Which would somewhat defeat the purpose of that check :) | 02:01 |
| duflu | RAOF: Yeah don't use the -C option. Just nm -D | 02:18 |
| RAOF | Why do we make it so hard to set an environment variable in a CMake test? | 02:28 |
| duflu | Ahhhh why can't we keep trunk stable enough to build any more? | 02:28 |
| duflu | It's a new FTBFS every day | 02:28 |
| robert_ancell | duflu, why are you still consuming mir on raring? | 02:39 |
| duflu | robert_ancell, because that's my desktop. Hence much faster to do some jobs | 02:40 |
| duflu | ... than the suacy laptops | 02:40 |
| duflu | *saucy | 02:40 |
| robert_ancell | duflu, well, it's just wasting time fixing bugs in raring | 02:40 |
| duflu | robert_ancell, It's not a waste if other distros get the same errors, and they are real errors in our code | 02:41 |
| duflu | It would be nice to catch them before they land, is all | 02:41 |
| robert_ancell | duflu, just require those other distros to use gcc 4.8. It's not a difficult dependency | 02:41 |
| duflu | robert_ancell, I think that would be arrogant of us. If the fix to support existing compilers is simple | 02:41 |
| robert_ancell | duflu, that's not arrogant - all dependencies have minimum versions. It's not a problem to apply patches if someone else takes the time to find them but we have no need to | 02:42 |
| duflu | Supporting multiple platforms/archs/environments is the single easiest way to build code quality, because each new one will show you errors you previously missed | 02:42 |
| robert_ancell | disagree | 02:43 |
| duflu | I know this from experience. Supporting up to 15 platform combos at once | 02:43 |
| duflu | Bah, we can argue about "easiest" forever | 02:45 |
| robert_ancell | Can I get a review on https://code.launchpad.net/~robert-ancell/lightdm/unity-sys-comp-release-vt2/+merge/171190? | 02:46 |
| * duflu fears the number of code reviews he's now got involved in and needs to chase up today | 02:47 | |
| robert_ancell | duflu, :) | 02:49 |
| RAOF | Um, why do we have a hunk of parsing code to emit CTest test files? | 02:55 |
| RAOF | Rather than just using add_test? | 02:55 |
| robert_ancell | duflu, in that fix you made for plymouth you call 'plymouth deactivate' every time in the loop - was that intentional? | 03:11 |
| duflu | robert_ancell: Yes but now you mention it, it could probably only happen once | 03:12 |
| duflu | There's no reason to repeat it | 03:12 |
| robert_ancell | ok, cool | 03:12 |
| duflu | robert_ancell: That's the result of many iterations. You get leftovers of previous algorithms | 03:12 |
| robert_ancell | heh | 03:12 |
| duflu | RAOF: Was it feasible to resolve the libdrm_radeon issue? (https://launchpad.net/~mir-team/+archive/staging/+build/4741584) | 03:15 |
| RAOF | Eh, screw it. I'll just copy saucy's libdrm into the PPA for you :) | 03:16 |
| robert_ancell | duflu, I'm looking at the plymouth source and it does appear to block on deactivate correctly | 03:26 |
| robert_ancell | duflu, are you sure that was causing the problem? | 03:26 |
| duflu | robert_ancell: Yes, absolutely. The lightdm log shows it has to try twice before success | 03:26 |
| duflu | And inserting a sleep works also :) | 03:27 |
| robert_ancell | duflu, hmm, I think it only works because of the sleep - the termination condition is !plymouth_has_active_vt() - but that only contacts Plymouth once | 03:34 |
| robert_ancell | So effectively all the patch has done is add a sleep(1) | 03:34 |
| duflu | robert_ancell, I also clear the cache to force it to contact each time | 03:34 |
| robert_ancell | duflu, ah, missed that | 03:35 |
| duflu | So that part is working | 03:35 |
| duflu | And I get two attempts logged in my lightdm.log | 03:35 |
| duflu | So it takes somewhere inside a second to complete | 03:35 |
| duflu | robert_ancell: We could enhance plymouth to honour --wait with deactivate, or just not crash. But I figured we in too much hurry to corrdinate fixes across multiple projects and add new ones to the PPA | 03:37 |
| duflu | -"not crash" +"not spin" | 03:37 |
| robert_ancell | duflu, yeah, I'm just trying to merge it into master, so need to work out the correct fix | 03:37 |
| duflu | Well, see previous comment :) | 03:37 |
| robert_ancell | duflu, I suspect it's the drm plugin that's not working correctly | 03:37 |
| duflu | robert_ancell: Yes, I think I mentioned that. It's about DRM mastership... stuff | 03:38 |
| robert_ancell | RAOF, do you know - does drmDropMaster() work immediately? | 03:38 |
| duflu | If Mir jumps in too soon it confuses plymouth's drm plugin | 03:38 |
| robert_ancell | yeah | 03:38 |
| RAOF | robert_ancell: I think it waits before returning. Let me check. | 03:39 |
| RAOF | ARGH. How do you specify an environment variable for a cmake test? | 03:39 |
| RAOF | Hint: Setting CTEST_ENVIRONMENT does *not* do what you want. Or, as far as I can tell, anything. | 03:40 |
| duflu | RAOF: setenv in code? | 03:44 |
| RAOF | Too late for LD_PRELOAD! | 03:44 |
| duflu | RAOF: I'm not sure the universe wants us to achieve that goal. It's a bit wrong :) | 03:46 |
| RAOF | Why are all build systems so ridiculously broken? | 03:52 |
| RAOF | Why is there always something that should be trivial but ends up being a huge pain in the arse? | 03:55 |
| duflu | RAOF: Well if you mean CMake then yeah... so many things Make can do that CMake prevents you from doing | 03:58 |
| thomi | did we stop shipping binaries in the mir-demos package at some point? i.e.- mir_demo_server? | 04:20 |
| thomi | or am I going stupid | 04:20 |
| thomi | WTF? why are the demo binaries now in /usr/lib/x86-linux-gnu/mir/examples ? | 04:22 |
| robert_ancell | thomi, ask didrocks. It seems stupid to me | 04:31 |
| thomi | ugh | 04:33 |
| thomi | me too | 04:33 |
| robert_ancell | Did someone just update mir in the system-compositor PPA? u-s-c has a broken dep now | 04:57 |
| robert_ancell | It looks like a RAOF to me | 04:57 |
| RAOF | I did indeed. | 04:58 |
| robert_ancell | thomi, ^ | 04:58 |
| thomi | RAOF: any chance you could push the matching libmirserver0 please? | 04:58 |
| thomi | otherwise it's uninstallable | 04:58 |
| thomi | thanks robert_ancell | 04:58 |
| RAOF | thomi: I was waiting for the mir to publish. I've just copied u-s-c; once it's rebuilt, all will be well. | 04:58 |
| RAOF | thomi: Are you pulling from system-compositor-testing? | 04:59 |
| thomi | RAOF: yes | 04:59 |
| RAOF | Should I be bouncing through *another* PPA to ensure atomic updates of system-compositor-testing? | 04:59 |
| thomi | RAOF: I don't think the words "atomic" and "PPA" can ever appear within a mile of each other | 05:00 |
| thomi | but I might be wrong. I certainly don't know how to push several packages in an atomic fashion | 05:01 |
| robert_ancell | RAOF, if you copied u-s-c 0.0.1bzr29saucy0.87 at the same time it should work without rebuilding right | 05:01 |
| robert_ancell | then we'd just have a break if the copies are out of sync (assuming they will be) | 05:02 |
| RAOF | robert_ancell: That's true. I just don't trust the staging PPA to be in a consistent state at an arbitrary time. | 05:02 |
| robert_ancell | thomi, any chance we can get the mir revision number in the u-s-c build so it's easier to tell which ones match | 05:02 |
| thomi | robert_ancell: you want the lp:mir revno in the u-s-c package version? | 05:03 |
| robert_ancell | thomi, yeah, then you could tell exactly which version of mir u-s-c was compiled against | 05:03 |
| thomi | robert_ancell: don't we already do that with the Depends line? | 05:04 |
| robert_ancell | thomi, yes, I guess so - though that is harder to read from the list of packages in the PPA | 05:04 |
| robert_ancell | (I'm guessing the answer is too hard) | 05:04 |
| robert_ancell | This will all get solved by didrocks in the next week or so as it hits universe | 05:05 |
| thomi | robert_ancell: I don't know the answer, I'll fire off an email to people who will know though | 05:05 |
| thomi | yeah, it's all crazy distro stuff | 05:05 |
| robert_ancell | thomi, I don't think it will be worth it in time | 05:05 |
| thomi | ok | 05:05 |
| RAOF | thomi, robert_ancell: Either of you know how to wrangle an environment variable into our unit-tests? | 05:06 |
| robert_ancell | RAOF, no | 05:06 |
| thomi | RAOF: how do you mean? | 05:06 |
| RAOF | thomi: I want to LD_PRELOAD a library for running the unit-tests (as I'm interposing a libc symbol). | 05:07 |
| RAOF | thomi: This is https://code.launchpad.net/~raof/mir/prober-drm-device-probe/+merge/170765 by the way, which passes the tests *just fine* locally. | 05:07 |
| tvoss | good morning all :) | 05:08 |
| thomi | RAOF: that's some crazy stuff right there O.0 | 05:08 |
| thomi | hi tvoss | 05:08 |
| robert_ancell | tvoss, welcome | 05:08 |
| RAOF | Or maybe a wild tvoss knows! | 05:08 |
| tvoss | thomi, hey, welcome back :) | 05:08 |
| thomi | tvoss: thank | 05:08 |
| thomi | s | 05:08 |
| tvoss | RAOF, how can I help? | 05:08 |
| RAOF | thomi: We're already interposing libdrm and libgbm symbols, it's no more weird than that :P | 05:08 |
| RAOF | tvoss: Do you know how to get an environment variable set in our unit-test's environment. | 05:09 |
| RAOF | tvoss: Specifically, to set LD_PRELOAD=lib/lib-mir-test-double-platform.so | 05:09 |
| tvoss | RAOF, why not alter the env with cmake? | 05:09 |
| RAOF | Hm, will that work? | 05:10 |
| * RAOF investigates. | 05:10 | |
| tvoss | RAOF, mind giving me some background? | 05:10 |
| robert_ancell | RAOF, Any thoughts on the ARM builds failing due to that broken dep (https://bugs.launchpad.net/mir/+bug/1194002). I did some investigation, but the sticking plaster of just explicitly adding the dependency would solve the immediate problem - can you make that change in your git branch | 05:10 |
| ubot5 | Launchpad bug 1194002 in Mir "Mesa armhf builds don't depend on libmirclient" [High,Triaged] | 05:10 |
| RAOF | robert_ancell: I thought I already had made that change? | 05:10 |
| robert_ancell | RAOF, it doesn't appear so | 05:11 |
| robert_ancell | RAOF, ok, I see it in git... | 05:11 |
| tvoss | RAOF, is that still about the prober-mp? | 05:12 |
| RAOF | tvoss: Context is https://code.launchpad.net/~raof/mir/prober-drm-device-probe/+merge/170765 - I've worked around the double-ctor problem, but can't get the open() wrapper to interpose in CI. | 05:12 |
| thomi | RAOF: so I guess the problem is the environment in the package build | 05:13 |
| tvoss | RAOF, okay :) did my mail help? | 05:13 |
| thomi | you're setting it locally when you run the test yourself? | 05:13 |
| RAOF | thomi: Actually, I don't *need* to set it locally. Which is another oddity. | 05:14 |
| thomi | RAOF: !?? | 05:14 |
| RAOF | But that's fragile, as it depends on the linker loading the right symbol first. | 05:14 |
| thomi | that's a bit strange, isn't it? | 05:14 |
| RAOF | Yes. | 05:16 |
| RAOF | But not totally outlandish; trying to interpose a libc symbol is fairly niche :) | 05:16 |
| veebers | tvoss, racarr: hello, have you had the chance to follow up on the input stack issue I queried about? | 05:17 |
| tvoss | veebers, could you remind me real quick, only had one coffee so far :) | 05:17 |
| veebers | tvoss: heh :-) This is regarding keyboard mapping entering characters like '$' etc. using uinput on the devices. I can fwd the previous email if that helps | 05:18 |
| tvoss | veebers, ah, no that helps. So the question becomes, if we want to do it for the official phone images right now | 05:19 |
| veebers | tvoss: ah ok. I might mention that fixing this will fix the bug in autopilot that is blocking gemas work on the memory/power usage tests | 05:20 |
| tvoss | veebers, that's only for the browser, right? | 05:21 |
| veebers | tvoss: at this stage I believe so (anything that needs to type 'shifted' characters) | 05:21 |
| tvoss | veebers, okay, couldn't we add bookmarks for the pages we want to access and then open the bookmarks? | 05:21 |
| veebers | tvoss: if the intention of the test is to ensure loading a page works (and measuring usage while that happens) as opposed to testing entering a url and hitting enter etc. | 05:23 |
| thomi | tvoss: veebers: that would still leave us without test coverage for a very large part of the app (and other apps too). | 05:24 |
| veebers | thomi: agreed | 05:24 |
| tvoss | thomi, sure, but: fixing it in the current official images right now would mean touching the ubuntuappmanager, which is going away with Mir | 05:24 |
| thomi | tvoss: I see | 05:25 |
| tvoss | thomi, trying to find out what we lose by not doing it right now | 05:25 |
| thomi | tvoss: what's the timeline for introducing mir? | 05:25 |
| tvoss | thomi, asap,we have an alternate image running it | 05:26 |
| thomi | veebers: perhaps you could try the alternate image then? | 05:27 |
| tvoss | thomi, not recommended right now for quality stuff | 05:27 |
| thomi | tvoss: that's with --flipped, right? | 05:27 |
| veebers | thomi, tvoss: It would be interesting to run it and ensure the issue we were experiencing are solved | 05:27 |
| tvoss | thomi, not only, it's flipped + mir. an alternate alternate image, if you want so | 05:27 |
| thomi | haha | 05:27 |
| tvoss | veebers, hold on, let's focus on unblocking gema here: if you really can't workaround the keymap issue, I will work with racarr to fix it in the ubuntuappmanager, but: we might try to be create to unblock gema | 05:28 |
| tvoss | s/create/creative | 05:29 |
| thomi | tvoss: if the flipped & mir image is the way of the future, surely gema can/should be testing that anyway? and if it "just works", wouldn't that be the path of least resistance? | 05:30 |
| tvoss | thomi, I'm pretty sure it won't just work, and our timelines on resource measurement are tight. | 05:32 |
| tvoss | veebers, do you have a bug open somewhere about the keymapping behavior? | 05:33 |
| veebers | veebers: yep, one moment | 05:33 |
| veebers | tvoss: https://bugs.launchpad.net/autopilot/+bug/1181216 | 05:33 |
| ubot5 | Launchpad bug 1181216 in Autopilot "Autopilot does not type : (colon) on devices" [Critical,In progress] | 05:33 |
| thomi | tvoss: ack | 05:34 |
| tvoss | veebers, for the bug: why do you need a : to open a webpage? | 05:40 |
| tvoss | www.cnn.com should work, too | 05:40 |
| veebers | tvoss: I suspect the test is typing http: . . . | 05:40 |
| veebers | tvoss: that is a good point | 05:41 |
| tvoss | veebers, well, the short term workaround might be to get rid of the http: | 05:41 |
| veebers | tvoss: I'll look into getting those tests update w/ the workaround | 05:41 |
| thomi | RAOF: got a sec? the u-s-c package you pushed seems a little broken to me | 05:41 |
| tvoss | veebers, thx a lot | 05:41 |
| RAOF | thomi: Boo. In what way? | 05:41 |
| veebers | tvoss: thanks for pointing that out :-) | 05:42 |
| thomi | RAOF: it depends on bzr773 libmirserver0, but 774 is the latest version, and the one that's built in the PPA | 05:42 |
| thomi | so I'm not sure how that is possible | 05:42 |
| tvoss | veebers, yw | 05:42 |
| tvoss | thomi, staging? | 05:42 |
| thomi | RAOF: shouldn't it take the package version number from whatever it built against? | 05:42 |
| thomi | tvoss: no, the compositor test ppa | 05:43 |
| tvoss | thomi, hmmm | 05:43 |
| RAOF | Correct. | 05:43 |
| thomi | although I note that the package version is the same in both PPAs,except staging has a newer mir | 05:43 |
| tvoss | veebers, I will add a comment to the bug report | 05:44 |
| veebers | tvoss: awesome, thanks | 05:44 |
| RAOF | thomi: amd64 certainly depends on 774. | 05:44 |
| * RAOF checks i386 | 05:44 | |
| tvoss | veebers, done | 05:45 |
| RAOF | thomi: As does i386. | 05:45 |
| RAOF | thomi: You're installing the wrong u-s-c. | 05:45 |
| thomi | RAOF: WTF? why does my laptop insist it's 773? | 05:45 |
| thomi | maybe I just missed the update or something? | 05:45 |
| RAOF | You have both system-compositor-testing and staging PPAs enabled? | 05:45 |
| thomi | RAOF: nope | 05:45 |
| thomi | RAOF: should I? | 05:46 |
| RAOF | No, but that could cause this sort of problem :) | 05:46 |
| thomi | hmmm: W: Failed to fetch bzip2:/var/lib/apt/lists/partial/ppa.launchpad.net_mir-team_staging_ubuntu_dists_saucy_main_binary-amd64_Packages Hash Sum mismatch | 05:46 |
| thomi | \o/ works now :) | 05:47 |
| RAOF | The plot thickens! | 05:47 |
| thomi | it seems I must have apt-get update'd a few minutes too early | 05:47 |
| RAOF | :) | 05:49 |
| robert_ancell | that hash sum mismatch makes me really wary about our infrastructure - I see that too often | 05:50 |
| thomi | hmmmm | 05:51 |
| thomi | I think I may have broken lightdm | 05:51 |
| thomi | after changing lightdm.conf to enable u-s-c I seem to be stuck at boot on the 'ubuntu' spinning dots screen | 05:51 |
| tvoss | thomi, do we have autopilot integration for udevmock? | 05:53 |
| thomi | tvoss: I'm not sure what udevmock is. so probably not :) | 05:54 |
| RAOF | thomi: You may have double-enabled it - /etc/lightdm/lightdm.conf.d should have a snippet automatically enabling u-s-c | 05:54 |
| RAOF | tvoss: Ooooh, good idea! | 05:54 |
| thomi | RAOF: no, it turns out lightdm is not installed because it relies on a newer glib than I have available... FFS | 05:55 |
| thomi | nothing seems to be working for me today | 05:55 |
| RAOF | Win! | 05:55 |
| tvoss | RAOF, trying to address the testing issue | 05:55 |
| robert_ancell | thomi, really? That's odd | 05:55 |
| RAOF | Are you trying this on saucy? | 05:55 |
| thomi | RAOF: yes | 05:55 |
| thomi | did a dist upgrade this morning, and I have no pending updates | 05:55 |
| robert_ancell | RAOF, duflu, racarr, kdub, tvoss, hikiko meeting reminder | 05:57 |
| tvoss | robert_ancell, yup, I'm on a broadband connection, sitting in the tax office :) Mind if I participate via irc? | 05:57 |
| robert_ancell | tvoss, np | 05:57 |
| duflu | tvoss: Sounds like fun | 05:58 |
| tvoss | duflu, totally _not_ | 05:58 |
| thomi | can someone please link me the hangout link? | 05:58 |
| robert_ancell | tvoss, is audio-only not fast enought? | 05:58 |
| thomi | for some reason my calendar does not show it | 05:58 |
| tvoss | duflu, building a display server is the one thing, german tax is the other :) | 05:58 |
| robert_ancell | tvoss, zing! | 05:58 |
| alf | thomi: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/a9abbc8e84f85360faaab30196768ca2d9129d09 | 05:58 |
| tvoss | robert_ancell, let me try to find a quiet spot | 05:58 |
| robert_ancell | kgunn, if you're actually here (I hope not) ^ | 05:59 |
| RAOF | Time for another exciting round of "how crap is my internet today?! | 05:59 |
| tvoss | robert_ancell, sorry, quiet spot found but only edge :/ | 06:03 |
| robert_ancell | tvoss, :( | 06:03 |
| robert_ancell | tvoss, we're discussing multi-monitor at the moment | 06:03 |
| tvoss | robert_ancell, argh ... | 06:04 |
| === sg is now known as Guest63927 | ||
| thomi | ugh, internet issues, you all sound like chipmunks every 10 seconds or so | 06:15 |
| veebers | thomi: issue or feature :-) | 06:17 |
| didrocks | robert_ancell: hey, what happens when someone runs manually unity-system-compsitor? | 06:54 |
| robert_ancell | didrocks, it complains you didn't set up the pipes to talk to it | 06:54 |
| didrocks | robert_ancell: should it be in libexec rather? | 06:54 |
| robert_ancell | didrocks, no | 06:55 |
| didrocks | as lightdm and others will only be able to run it? | 06:55 |
| robert_ancell | libexec is stupid | 06:55 |
| didrocks | well, shipping in /usr/bin when most people can't run it is stupid :) | 06:55 |
| robert_ancell | there's loads of stuff in /usr/bin | 06:55 |
| didrocks | most of them, people can run them and see a result | 06:56 |
| didrocks | but fine, not my project | 06:56 |
| robert_ancell | it should be in sbin though | 06:57 |
| didrocks | robert_ancell: I'm more ok with this | 06:58 |
| robert_ancell | didrocks, it's the same as lightdm | 06:58 |
| didrocks | yeah, sbin makes sense | 06:58 |
| didrocks | robert_ancell: I'll move it while proposing my fixes | 06:58 |
| robert_ancell | didrocks, ok | 06:59 |
| didrocks | robert_ancell: do you want me to make MP for lightdm and unity-greeter for daily release as well? | 06:59 |
| robert_ancell | didrocks, yes, as long as we have the integration tests to confirm they work together | 07:00 |
| didrocks | robert_ancell: do you have them? I think it's like xmir, qtmir and unity-system-compositor, there isn't any? | 07:00 |
| didrocks | robert_ancell: I can prepare the package for a ppa then, daily releasing there until you have them | 07:00 |
| robert_ancell | didrocks, I sent an email about it | 07:01 |
| didrocks | robert_ancell: I answered I guess ;) | 07:01 |
| didrocks | I should use https://code.launchpad.net/~lightdm-team/lightdm/mir-packaging I guess | 07:02 |
| didrocks | robert_ancell: one part of daily release is to have the packaging inlined, it's not the case for lightdm and unity-greeter I think? | 07:03 |
| robert_ancell | didrocks, we're using ~lightdm-team/lightdm/trunk-packaging for the CI | 07:04 |
| robert_ancell | didrocks, u-g has inline packaging now | 07:04 |
| robert_ancell | didrocks, I'm trying to work out what we can do for lightdm inline packaging that makes sense | 07:05 |
| robert_ancell | didrocks, sorry, I have to go - please email me any other questions. I'm here late tomorrow so we'll have overlap then too | 07:05 |
| didrocks | robert_ancell: ok, have a good night! | 07:07 |
| hikiko | RAOF, and alf sorry:) I thought we are still in the hangout | 07:11 |
| tvoss | RAOF, did the vt-fix propagate to the ppa, yet? | 07:11 |
| tvoss | cannot switch to vt after an upgrade | 07:11 |
| didrocks | alf: hey! do you have time this morning? | 07:12 |
| RAOF | tvoss: Should have. | 07:13 |
| tvoss | RAOF, so whre do I find the VT? ctrl+alt+? | 07:14 |
| RAOF | F1-F12? | 07:14 |
| alf | hikiko: You were welcome to stay :) | 07:14 |
| tvoss | RAOF, hmmm, that leaves me with the desktop on screen and no login prompt | 07:15 |
| alf | didrocks: sure, I will work on top of your branch if that's ok | 07:15 |
| RAOF | Hm. So we may have one additional VT bug. | 07:15 |
| didrocks | alf: perfect! thanks :) | 07:15 |
| mlankhorst | RAOF: will the mir system compositor replace kmscon? :P | 07:15 |
| RAOF | mlankhorst: Absolutely@! | 07:16 |
| RAOF | #dontcheck | 07:16 |
| RAOF | Sorry, in joke. | 07:16 |
| mlankhorst | I find your failed attempt at humor amusing. :) | 07:16 |
| tvoss | RAOF, mind repinging me the udev mock thingy on google? | 07:18 |
| tvoss | s/google/chromium | 07:18 |
| RAOF | https://code.google.com/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=248824 ? | 07:18 |
| alf | mlankhorst: I think I found a race in the radeon driver cs thread. In particular, if trying to flush from two contexts sometimes one of them may hang. | 07:19 |
| alf | mlankhorst: (in Mesa/Gallium) | 07:19 |
| alf | mlankhorst: are you the right person to talk to? | 07:19 |
| mlankhorst | probably | 07:21 |
| mlankhorst | I don't think I've ever tried flushing from 2 threads though | 07:23 |
| mlankhorst | but what is it hanging on? | 07:24 |
| tvoss | RAOF, thx | 07:26 |
| didrocks | alf: should the source be name qtmir or qmir? | 07:28 |
| didrocks | also, do you have any packaging somewhere? :) | 07:28 |
| didrocks | hey RAOF, do you have a minute to discuss about xmir? | 07:30 |
| RAOF | didrocks: Sure. | 07:30 |
| alf | mlankhorst: In radeon_drm_cs_flush() the code is waiting for the cs_queue to become empty pipe_condvar_wait(cs->ws->cs_queue_empty,...). In the case that we flush from two different (but shared) contexts sometimes it gets stuck there. | 07:30 |
| RAOF | didrocks: Probably not more than 5 minutes, though (I'll be available later, too, if necessary) | 07:31 |
| didrocks | RAOF: ok, let's try to be short: how do you want that we treat xmir? | 07:31 |
| didrocks | as if it was a canonical upstream for us? with dailies? | 07:31 |
| mlankhorst | alf: hm what I thought, change pipe_condvar_signal to pipe_condvar_broadcast in radeon_drm_cs_emit_ioctl ? | 07:31 |
| didrocks | or you keep everything in git? | 07:31 |
| RAOF | didrocks: I guess as a patch on top of the regular X package? | 07:31 |
| didrocks | RAOF: ok, so X source + patch for having an additional binary package | 07:32 |
| didrocks | right? | 07:32 |
| alf | mlankhorst: I tried that, but it didn't work, although I didn't investigate more | 07:32 |
| didrocks | not a separate source, nothing… | 07:32 |
| RAOF | didrocks: No extra binary package, although I could create one if we wanted. | 07:32 |
| didrocks | RAOF: oh, I don't really, as long as it's part of the same X source, I'm fine (so no dailies for it) | 07:32 |
| didrocks | RAOF: the only question is how would you treat mir ABI then? | 07:33 |
| didrocks | and it's not stable AFAIK | 07:33 |
| RAOF | mirclient ABI *is* stable. | 07:33 |
| alf | mlankhorst: I will investigate more and let you now | 07:33 |
| alf | mlankhorst: know | 07:33 |
| didrocks | RAOF: ah ok, so no biggie I guess :) | 07:33 |
| duflu | RAOF: ABI yes, not API ;) | 07:33 |
| RAOF | At least, it's stable enough that I bumped the SONAME recently. | 07:33 |
| didrocks | RAOF: so, for mesa + xmir, I have nothing to do, nothing to daily release, right? | 07:34 |
| RAOF | didrocks: Right. | 07:34 |
| didrocks | \o/ | 07:34 |
| didrocks | thanks RAOF :) | 07:34 |
| alf | didrocks: tvoss: Didn'd we abandon qmir/qtmir in favor of qtubuntu with a mir backend? | 07:34 |
| didrocks | ah? | 07:34 |
| tvoss | alf, I would think so for the time being. We should keep it around, though | 07:35 |
| didrocks | tvoss: so qtubuntu binary package contains the mir backend? | 07:35 |
| didrocks | and that's what Saviq's team is using? | 07:35 |
| tvoss | didrocks, exactly | 07:35 |
| mlankhorst | alf: afaict glisse reworked the whole thread code, no wonder it looked a lot more complicated than before ;P | 07:36 |
| mlankhorst | I don't see why the ncs member is atomic either, considering it's always protected by cs_stack_lock | 07:38 |
| duflu | Out of curiosity, has anyone tried a native GL (not ES) client in Mir? I can't remember seeing anyone having done so | 07:38 |
| alf | duflu: yes, glmark2-mir works | 07:39 |
| duflu | alf: Cool. I thought that was a port of "-es" ? | 07:39 |
| alf | duflu: Not really a port, the glmark2 code can produce binaries for both GL and GLES2.0, depending on the --with-flavors= you pass | 07:41 |
| duflu | alf: So you tested both? | 07:41 |
| duflu | Which is in the PPA? | 07:41 |
| * duflu looks | 07:41 | |
| mlankhorst | alf: but the whole thread code looks messy to me :/ | 07:42 |
| alf | mlankhorst: I will try to come up with a minimal example that hangs, so we can investigate (and prove the problem upstream) easier | 07:43 |
| mlankhorst | ok | 07:43 |
| * duflu realizes no glmark2 is in the testing PPA :/ | 07:43 | |
| mlankhorst | if you have one I'll fix it | 07:43 |
| alf | mlankhorst: great, thanks | 07:43 |
| tvoss | veebers, mind pinging me the bug number again? | 07:52 |
| mlankhorst | alf: but that code looks like a mess, needs more locking :P | 07:52 |
| mlankhorst | radeon_drm_cs_flush looks like it could deadlock if called from 2 threads simultaneously, might be by design though.. | 07:53 |
| alf | mlankhorst: that would be a strange design... :) | 07:55 |
| mlankhorst | alf: I'm not sure it's legal to flush the same cs twice, but I'll know more with the reduced testcase | 07:56 |
| veebers | tvoss: sure: https://bugs.launchpad.net/autopilot/+bug/1181216 | 07:56 |
| ubot5 | Launchpad bug 1181216 in Autopilot "Autopilot does not type : (colon) on devices" [Critical,In progress] | 07:56 |
| tvoss | veebers, thx | 07:56 |
| veebers | tvoss: nw | 07:57 |
| alf | mlankhorst: is the cs per process or per context? | 07:57 |
| mlankhorst | per context | 07:57 |
| alf | mlankhorst: and shared contexts also share the cs? | 07:58 |
| mlankhorst | I'll wait for the testcase first I guess, then I know if what you're doing is ok or not :p | 08:00 |
| alf | mlankhorst: ok | 08:00 |
| * tvoss is impressed by the brain to totally ignore the second cursor after some time of painful practice | 08:05 | |
| * duflu thinks it's still handy to have a "watermark" | 08:10 | |
| duflu | Because it tells me which display server I'm really using | 08:11 |
| duflu | But then so does the absence of VT switching :( | 08:11 |
| cking | thomi, ping | 08:13 |
| tvoss | duflu, RAOF I thought the vt switching was solved | 08:15 |
| duflu | tvoss: Nope. Just retested. Asked Robert if he thinks I'm missing any packages | 08:16 |
| duflu | tvoss: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1192429 | 08:16 |
| ubot5 | Launchpad bug 1192429 in Unity System Compositor "unity-system-compositor is on multiple simultaneous (and random) VTs" [High,New] | 08:16 |
| tvoss | duflu, ack, thx for the bug | 08:17 |
| === sg is now known as Guest52435 | ||
| * tvoss off to kubuntu-desktop world | 08:34 | |
| RAOF | BAH! | 08:36 |
| RAOF | Of course! | 08:36 |
| RAOF | I'm not mocking out enough. | 08:37 |
| RAOF | tvoss: Argh! I I realised why the device-probing branch isn't passing CI. There are no devices to probe under CI! | 08:54 |
| thomi | cking: hey, I'm kind of here, if it's quick. | 08:55 |
| cking | thomi, oh, I sent an email, it may be quick for you, not for me | 08:56 |
| RAOF | tvoss: Sending a mock through the GBMPlatform it is :) | 08:56 |
| * thomi looks | 08:56 | |
| tvoss | RAOF, :) | 08:57 |
| RAOF | But tomorrow; I'm not going to have time to get that all ready before I need to sleep, so it can wait to tomorrow. | 08:57 |
| tvoss | RAOF, ack, I will see if I can get the powerful google udev stuff pulled out in a sane way somehow | 08:59 |
| alf | didrocks: https://code.launchpad.net/~afrantzis/mir/move-lttng-libs/+merge/171492 | 09:22 |
| alf | duflu: @SnapshotStrategy, I tried to avoid verbified nouns, but in essence it is a Snapshotter or SnapshotTaker. Perhaps SnapshotTakingStrategy? | 09:25 |
| alf | duflu: oops that's nounified verbs | 09:26 |
| duflu | alf: I find *Strategy confusing. If you can communicate better with my feeble brain then I'm sure others might benefit similarly | 09:26 |
| alf | duflu: I am open to suggestions, but I couldn't find anything better without going to noun-ified verbs. | 09:28 |
| duflu | alf: Not sure about suggestions until I can understand what it is | 09:28 |
| alf | duflu: It's an interface (a role) that provides the functionality to take snapshots of surfaces | 09:30 |
| duflu | alf: A "camera" takes snapshots. I wonder if there's a good simile of "camera" | 09:31 |
| alf | duflu: I thought of "camera", but I found e.g. SessionCamera more confusing in terms of what it really is | 09:32 |
| duflu | alf: Yeah agreed it's not a good word. I think we're still in the realm of naming things according to what they do instead of what they are | 09:33 |
| duflu | Which sometimes suggests the functionality should not be in that class, but the class that uses it | 09:33 |
| duflu | But that might be over-generalizing | 09:34 |
| duflu | alf: What varies between different SnapshotStrategies? | 09:34 |
| alf | duflu: Many classes, however, are just helper classes that have a very specific role to play (also for TDD). It's hard to describe these in terms of a noun/object. | 09:35 |
| duflu | alf: Being more concrete doesn't eliminate TDD. Just makes it harder to think of the right words :) | 09:36 |
| duflu | But once you do, many people will benefit | 09:36 |
| alf | alf: Right now nothing, since we have only one production SnapshotStrategy. Potentially, everyything. You tell it to take a snapshot, and it can do it any way it likes. | 09:37 |
| alf | duflu: ^^ | 09:37 |
| didrocks | alf: src/shared/lttng/tracepoint_provider.cpp is pre-processed? | 09:38 |
| didrocks | ({MIR_TRACEPOINT_LIB_INSTALL_PATH} is replace?) | 09:38 |
| alf | didrocks: it's a preprocessor definition (see src/shared/lttng/CMakeLists.txt) | 09:39 |
| didrocks | alf: interesting, didn't know that cmake had that! better than manually processing a config.h | 09:40 |
| didrocks | alf: approving then, thanks! | 09:40 |
| duflu | alf: Abstained. If neither of us can think of better names yet then it's not worth blocking on | 09:40 |
| alf | duflu: thanks, perhaps the US has some more suggestions | 09:41 |
| katie | tvoss_, time for a catch up in 3 mins? | 09:57 |
| tvoss_ | katie, yup, let me grab coffee :) | 09:57 |
| katie | tvoss_, mpt is joining too | 10:00 |
| alf | didrocks: typo in MP, fixing | 10:00 |
| didrocks | ok :) | 10:01 |
| === francisco is now known as Guest17761 | ||
| dholbach | Could anyone brainstorm with me which information we have which could go into fixing these docs bugs? https://bugs.launchpad.net/mir/+bugs?field.tag=docs | 12:44 |
| === mmrazik is now known as mmrazik|afk | ||
| didrocks | michi___: small question on unity-api, from what I see, the .pc files won't be different per archs, right? | 13:12 |
| didrocks | ah, you -L the multiarch path in it (shouldn't be needed) | 13:13 |
| === mmrazik|afk is now known as mmrazik | ||
| mterry | racarr, you might want to merge platform-api/mir-with-packaging with trunk for that `ua_ui_session_properties_set_remote_pid' issue I ran into yesterday | 13:24 |
| didrocks | mterry: speaking of platform-api, mind having a quick look at https://code.launchpad.net/~didrocks/platform-api/changelog-cleanup/+merge/171476? | 13:54 |
| mterry | didrocks, what do you mean you detect the arches we can't build for? | 14:09 |
| mterry | didrocks, but we don't change the control file, so we are still uploading to archive and causing dep-wait packages, right? | 14:10 |
| didrocks | mterry: detect the arch -> yeah, we don't live in stone age! :) | 14:11 |
| didrocks | mterry: basically I'm checking if we build-dep for an unimportant arch in distro | 14:11 |
| didrocks | (from last uploda) | 14:11 |
| didrocks | upload* | 14:11 |
| didrocks | if so, I'm ignoring the arch state in daily release | 14:11 |
| didrocks | (right now, "important archs" are i386, amd64, armhf) | 14:12 |
| kdub | morning all | 14:53 |
| alf | kdub: Hi! Long time no see :P | 14:57 |
| kdub | indeed | 14:57 |
| kgunn | kdub! | 15:00 |
| kdub | hello! | 15:00 |
| alf | status: [spike] Investigating how our components (mainly the compositor and friends) react to display configuration changes, and how we can solve the problems that come up. | 15:05 |
| * kdub is trying to drain the msh::Surface/ms::Surface swamp a bit :) also investigating how to hook the shell up to a signal to turn the screen off | 15:06 | |
| kdub | we should have a moratorium on classes with 'surface' in them for a while :) | 16:14 |
| mterry | greyback_, racarr : in compiling unity8-integrate-mir, I get: | 16:15 |
| mterry | /usr/include/mirserver/mir/default_server_configuration.h:21:28: fatal error: mir/cached_ptr.h: No such file or directory | 16:15 |
| mterry | which looks more like just a mir bug actually, since it's from a mir include | 16:16 |
| greyback_ | mterry: that should be in /usr/include/mircommon, is that installed? | 16:17 |
| mterry | hmm, mirserver.pc requires mircommon.pc which has the right includes | 16:17 |
| mterry | greyback_, yes | 16:17 |
| greyback_ | mterry: I'm not sure so. What's the compiler line "VERBOSE=1 make" | 16:19 |
| mterry | greyback_, oh weird. main.cpp uses "#include <mirserver/mir/run_mir.h>" but I would expect it to use "#include <mir/run_mir.h>" with the appropriate -I cflags | 16:21 |
| mterry | and CMakeLists.txt doesn't seem to use the pc files | 16:22 |
| mterry | greyback_, but since this is a team branch I can fix myself | 16:22 |
| greyback_ | mterry: it was hacked together to work, nothing more :) | 16:22 |
| greyback_ | mterry: please do | 16:23 |
| mterry | racarr, it might be convenient if your other mir-packaging branches were team based too | 16:23 |
| mterry | greyback_, let's say I get unity8-integrate-mir built and installed on my phone. How do I use it? Like, how do I stop surfaceflinger from starting? | 16:28 |
| mterry | oh, he's gone | 16:29 |
| mterry | greyback_, let's say I get unity8-integrate-mir built and installed on my phone. How do I use it? Like, how do I stop surfaceflinger from starting? Or do I just have to use the ./run -m -i script? | 16:29 |
| greyback_ | mterry: the script works when you execute it from your PC | 16:30 |
| greyback_ | mterry: else manually, adb root, "stop" to stop SurfaceFlinger | 16:31 |
| greyback_ | mterry: make sure unity8 is not running | 16:31 |
| greyback_ | then in the ubuntu chroot, run "QT_QPA_PLATFORM=ubuntumirserver unity8" | 16:32 |
| mterry | greyback_, hmm... I bet there's a way to install it and modify the upstart jobs to not run surfaceflinger and to use that QT_QPA_PLATFORM variable. I'll look into that in a bit (I'm trying to actually test final on-phone integration) | 16:33 |
| greyback_ | mterry: the android side runs surface flinger, it's not upstart | 16:33 |
| mterry | guh, hm | 16:33 |
| mterry | greyback_, is this where flipped mode comes in? | 16:34 |
| greyback_ | mterry: ultimately, it will help a lot, yes | 16:34 |
| kdub | mterry, i'd advise a stronger, 'make sure that surfaceflinger has never ran' | 16:39 |
| mterry | kdub, you mean "never ran this boot", not that surfaceflinger makes some permanent filesystem changes that are bad, right? | 16:40 |
| kdub | right | 16:40 |
| mterry | k.. I guess I need flip mode for that, and to modify how we start the android side... | 16:40 |
| * mterry is in unfamiliar territory | 16:40 | |
| kdub | its just that sometimes, surfaceflinger hands out resources to the clients that persist after sf's actual death | 16:41 |
| kdub | and causes mir problems | 16:41 |
| greyback_ | yep, I've noticed that. I make sure all UI apps are killed after stopping SF, before I run Mir | 16:46 |
| mterry | racarr, heyo. So I realized that my goals with testing Mir are a little different than yours with that sketchpad. I'm looking to have a fully installed Mir, rather than the ability to run a branch from your pc on the phone. So rather than have two sets of instructions on the sketchpad, I started a new in-progress wiki page: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Testing/Mir | 18:49 |
| racarr | mterry: Yay. Thanks. | 19:15 |
| gotwig | hello world | 19:21 |
| gotwig | is there a PPA for Unity + Mir ? | 19:23 |
| gotwig | oh I found this http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=MTM5Mzc | 19:24 |
| racarr | kdub: http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=MTM5NTg | 19:27 |
| racarr | congratulations, you've won the official phoronix most revisions award | 19:27 |
| racarr | I'll be picking up your trophy at the engraver | 19:27 |
| kdub | haha :) | 19:28 |
| gotwig | guys have you seen this? | 19:39 |
| gotwig | http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=MTM5NDU | 19:39 |
| gotwig | racarr, nice | 19:40 |
| kgunn | mhall119: ping | 19:41 |
| mhall119 | kgunn: pong | 19:44 |
| kgunn | mhall119: do you happen know why on this automagic site http://unity.ubuntu.com/mir/installing_prebuilt_on_pc.html | 19:44 |
| kgunn | that the numbering stays on one ? | 19:44 |
| kgunn | when the *.md file source that populates it, is clearly 1,2,3,4, etc | 19:45 |
| kgunn | (i'm considering just removing the #s....will that be easier?) | 19:45 |
| mhall119 | is that doxygen generated? | 19:45 |
| kgunn | mhall119: from *.md to wiki...i dunno (i thot you had helped us with this? i'm wrong?) | 19:47 |
| mhall119 | no, I can publish docs, but I'm not the one who gets them put together | 19:48 |
| mhall119 | it might have been thomi ? | 19:48 |
| gotwig | why havent you talked to the wayland devs, in "the secret development process" of mir? | 19:51 |
| thomi | morning guys | 19:55 |
| thomi | (and girls) | 19:55 |
| === francisco is now known as Guest78995 | ||
| gotwig | you should read the "Mir Development Stats Dominated By Canonical comments http://phoronix.com/forums/showthread.php?81653-Mir-Development-Stats-Dominated-By-Canonical&p=338644#post338644 | 20:00 |
| gotwig | or this http://phoronix.com/forums/showthread.php?81653-Mir-Development-Stats-Dominated-By-Canonical&p=338687#post338687 | 20:02 |
| gotwig | it would be nice if someone could answer me | 20:05 |
| gotwig | mhall119, ? | 20:05 |
| racarr | gotwig: I'm not sure what you are asking :) | 20:09 |
| gotwig | racarr, well, have you read the posts? | 20:09 |
| racarr | We have talked to Wayland devs, and the development process, isn't particular secret | 20:09 |
| gotwig | I mean right at the beginning of the development | 20:10 |
| gotwig | I know what commit logs are.. | 20:10 |
| gotwig | racarr, have you read the last post I linked? | 20:12 |
| gotwig | he basicly says that in wayland apps can run without a compositor, and can directly talk to GPU | 20:12 |
| gotwig | in Mir, however, he states that the concept is similar to Xorg | 20:12 |
| racarr | :) I think it's pretty normal to develop some confidence in your ideas before going public with them, espescially when you are a large organization under a lot of scrutinity and with a lot of responsibility to your users. | 20:13 |
| racarr | I | 20:13 |
| racarr | don't really understand the post sorry | 20:13 |
| racarr | it seems to be quibbling about the fact that 'wayland' is just a specification | 20:13 |
| racarr | on the other hand, I think anyone can talk about "wayland" | 20:14 |
| racarr | and it's understood what they mean ;) | 20:14 |
| gotwig | racarr, you really dont understand it? | 20:14 |
| racarr | Mir applications can access the frame buffer | 20:14 |
| racarr | directly | 20:14 |
| racarr | no, I don't. I don't think it makes sense | 20:14 |
| racarr | it's setting up a false dichotomy, i.e. | 20:15 |
| gotwig | well, I am not such a die hard core level dev, so I just want to find something intressting to read, so I can understand it better | 20:15 |
| racarr | Mir is a server, whereas wayland is a specification, therefore mir applications can't access the framebuffer directly | 20:15 |
| gotwig | and I found these answers | 20:15 |
| racarr | but | 20:15 |
| racarr | that's not true | 20:15 |
| gotwig | why would apps want to access the framebuffer directly | 20:16 |
| racarr | Imagine you have made a video fullscreen, it seems pretty wasteful to wake up the compositor every time | 20:16 |
| racarr | the video changes right? | 20:16 |
| gotwig | why do you go with this "server" way? Because you want to have something more practical than in theory? | 20:16 |
| gotwig | greyback_, howdy =) | 20:17 |
| racarr | gotwig: It's not so different, a weston compositor is a 'server' too | 20:17 |
| gotwig | racarr, but wayland apps dont have to use a compositor | 20:17 |
| greyback_ | gotwig: hi there | 20:17 |
| racarr | gotwig: Well, yes, if you want to run one at a time from a virtual terminal | 20:17 |
| racarr | in any real use cases though, it doesn't make a difference, because you either need to composite, or sometimes you can let apps skip composition (like fullscreen videos) | 20:18 |
| gotwig | racarr, he says that its better with the "wayland" way for fullscreen games, which dont need any overload from any system compositor stuff ;X | 20:18 |
| racarr | and it's something both wayland, X11, and mir all support pretty easily. | 20:18 |
| racarr | gotwig: There's no overhead :) | 20:18 |
| racarr | that's why I don't understand the post | 20:19 |
| mhall119 | gotwig: Weston is the Wayland compositor, IIRC | 20:19 |
| gotwig | but as of today compositing can also be disabled on Xorg | 20:19 |
| gotwig | what is different here? | 20:19 |
| gotwig | as of today I think is the wrong phrase ;D | 20:19 |
| gotwig | mhall119, I know =) | 20:20 |
| mhall119 | gotwig: I think whomever wrote this doesn't have a clear understanding of what is what | 20:20 |
| racarr | in non composited Xorg, rather than having offscreen memory buffers (in GPU of course) for window regions | 20:20 |
| mhall119 | or at least they didn't do a good job of communicating it | 20:20 |
| racarr | the applications all share the framebuffer | 20:20 |
| racarr | this is why, in non composited, when you drag a window off from another one, sometimes you can see | 20:21 |
| racarr | it takes a while to update. | 20:21 |
| racarr | Mir and Wayland only support uncomposited in the case of a single fullscreen surface | 20:21 |
| gotwig | are there any major things which are going to be faster/slower in Mir/Wayland? | 20:22 |
| gotwig | flaws, from the concept | 20:22 |
| kgunn | gotwig: can you make a proposal what might be faster/slower in terms of a concept ? | 20:23 |
| kgunn | thomi: just checking...do we have stress as part of CI ? | 20:23 |
| gotwig | kgunn, no, that is because I ask this question... | 20:23 |
| kgunn | gotwig: surely you could propose something you might consider a potential ? | 20:23 |
| gotwig | Mir is going to be the always wanted "System Compositor" for Ubuntu, as far as I understand it | 20:24 |
| mhall119 | gotwig: both Mir and Wayland are likely to be much faster than X11 because of their design | 20:24 |
| mhall119 | they will probably be comparable in terms of speed between them | 20:25 |
| kgunn | gotwig: keep in mind regardless of a name, any compositor can be "bypassed", this is industry standard practice | 20:25 |
| mhall119 | so the poster seems more familiar with Wayland, and I think is trying to address inaccurate descriptions of Wayland's features | 20:26 |
| mhall119 | I don't think he's saying there's anything wrong with Mir | 20:26 |
| kgunn | mhall119: sure...just trying to help....because statements like "apps can run without a compositor, and can directly talk to GPU" | 20:27 |
| kgunn | just aren't sensible | 20:27 |
| kdub | yeah | 20:28 |
| mhall119 | it seems he's saying that technically you could run a single Wayland client, which wouldn't require a compositor like Weston (or Gnome Shell) | 20:29 |
| kgunn | gotta go | 20:29 |
| mhall119 | but in reality nobody's gonna do that, they're going to have a session compositor and multiple windows | 20:30 |
| mhall119 | and only bypass the compositor for things like fullscreen games | 20:30 |
| mhall119 | which is the same in X.org, Mir and Wayland | 20:30 |
| racarr | plus you can use libmirserver to run without compositor ;) | 20:30 |
| racarr | like unity does | 20:30 |
| racarr | it's compositors all the way up and down | 20:31 |
| racarr | :p | 20:31 |
| mhall119 | gotwig: so tl;dr, there's not that much conceptual difference between Wayland and Mir | 20:31 |
| gotwig | thx | 20:32 |
| === seb128_ is now known as seb128 | ||
| gotwig | you may want to read this http://www.phoronix.com/vr.php?view=MTM5NDU | 20:47 |
| gotwig | Xserver integration in the linux kernel for a performance boost | 20:47 |
| === seb128_ is now known as seb128 | ||
| kdub | racarr, starting to see the light at the end of the tunnel with msh::Surface :) | 21:04 |
| racarr | kdub: Yay | 21:08 |
| racarr | I am trying to pass the socket credentials up through the frontend...it's pretty mundane :p | 21:09 |
| thomi | kgunn: not yet, hoping to get that done this week | 21:10 |
| racarr | class that receives (pid, app-id) (desktop file) | 21:12 |
| racarr | and says hey you can connect or hey go away | 21:12 |
| racarr | SessionAuthorizer, Approver? | 21:13 |
| robert_ancell | Hmm, has olli actually gone sailing or is that his standard quit message? | 21:15 |
| robert_ancell | kgunn, ^ | 21:15 |
| racarr | robert_ancell: I think I have seen that before | 21:22 |
| racarr | olli went sailing 2/3 times he quit today XD | 21:23 |
| robert_ancell | olli, that was a quick sail :) | 21:27 |
| olli | :) | 21:27 |
| robert_ancell | kgunn, https://code.launchpad.net/~kgunn72/mir/instructional_updates/+merge/171654 updated | 22:06 |
| kgunn | robert_ancell: ta! | 22:07 |
| thomi | robert_ancell: I finally got all the u-s-c stuff installed, now when I reboot I get the "low graphics mode" dialog box, and my mouse doesn't work. Any ideas? | 22:08 |
| robert_ancell | thomi, look at lightdm.log | 22:08 |
| robert_ancell | it failed to start X it seems | 22:08 |
| kgunn | robert_ancell: approved https://code.launchpad.net/~robert-ancell/mir/instructional_updates/+merge/171677 | 22:09 |
| robert_ancell | kgunn, you'll have to manually merge it, see the "to merge this branch" line at the top. Then push it to your branch to update your MP | 22:09 |
| olli | RAOF, ping | 22:10 |
| kgunn | robert_ancell: so "bzr merge lp:~robert-ancell/mir/instructional_updates" merges it locally(on my box) ? or remote as well ?....e.g. then do i have to do a subsequent push ? | 22:12 |
| robert_ancell | kgunn, just locally, then bzr commit it, the bzr push it to LP | 22:12 |
| kgunn | robert_ancell: thanks again for your patience :) | 22:13 |
| robert_ancell | kgunn, I thought it would be a good example of bzr so I did it this way :) | 22:13 |
| thomi | robert_ancell: the log looks fine to me: http://paste.ubuntu.com/5803018/ | 22:14 |
| robert_ancell | thomi, [+16.12s] DEBUG: Process 1423 terminated with signal 6 - that's u-s-c crapping out. Look at unity-system-compositor.log | 22:14 |
| robert_ancell | readable error that followed: [+16.12s] DEBUG: Stopping Unity seat, compositor terminated | 22:15 |
| robert_ancell | thomi, what hardware btw? | 22:15 |
| thomi | robert_ancell: http://paste.ubuntu.com/5803023/ | 22:15 |
| thomi | robert_ancell: I believe it's a radeon something something | 22:16 |
| robert_ancell | terminate called after throwing an instance of 'boost::exception_detail::clone_impl<boost::exception_detail::error_info_injector<std::runtime_error> >' | 22:16 |
| robert_ancell | what(): Failed to schedule page flip | 22:16 |
| robert_ancell | RAOF, any idea? | 22:16 |
| robert_ancell | thomi, that's the problem.. | 22:16 |
| thomi | robert_ancell: no, I tella lie, it's an intel i915 | 22:17 |
| robert_ancell | and it looks like X locked up, because it didn't respond to signal 15, or die when u-s-c died | 22:17 |
| robert_ancell | thomi, can you check versions of lightdm, u-s-c, x to confirm? | 22:18 |
| thomi | sure | 22:18 |
| thomi | lightdm is 1.7.3bzr1628saucy0.71u-s-c is 0.0.1bzr29saucy0.87 | 22:18 |
| thomi | what package should Ibe looking at for x? 'xorg'? | 22:19 |
| robert_ancell | thomi, xserver-xorg-core | 22:21 |
| thomi | xserver-xorg-core is 2:1.13.3+xmir1-0 | 22:21 |
| robert_ancell | thomi, I have an older u-s-c, I'll update and see if I get the problem | 22:22 |
| thomi | ok, thanks | 22:22 |
| robert_ancell | thomi, I'm 00:02.0 VGA compatible controller: Intel Corporation Core Processor Integrated Graphics Controller (rev 18) for the record | 22:23 |
| mterry | kdub, hello! So let's say I have a unity8 binary that I think should work. Do I need to start a system compositor first, or will just running that binary autostart all the necessary mir bits? | 22:26 |
| olli | robert_ancell, one quick q | 22:27 |
| kdub | mterry, i think it should work just like that | 22:28 |
| olli | why do we need to pin mir | 22:28 |
| olli | to make sure the ppa has always a higher prio? | 22:28 |
| robert_ancell | olli, otherwise an update in main might drop the additional features, e.g. lightdm | 22:28 |
| olli | ok | 22:28 |
| robert_ancell | you would be safe, but you'd stop using Mir every time it would happen | 22:28 |
| mterry | kdub, hmm, ok. It seems to be running, but nothing shows on device screen. Will dig deeper | 22:29 |
| thomi | robert_ancell: any luck upgrading u-s-c? | 22:43 |
| robert_ancell | thomi, just in the middle of a mir build, will try once that's complete | 22:44 |
| thomi | ok, I'll try and be a bit more patient :) | 22:44 |
| kgunn | thomi: so i see above you had issues.... | 22:45 |
| kgunn | i was about to wade into the deep....were you building | 22:45 |
| kgunn | or using staging or using sys-comp-testing | 22:45 |
| kgunn | ? | 22:45 |
| thomi | kgunn: I'm running the sys-comp-testing PPA | 22:45 |
| kgunn | thomi: eeeewwww, giving me second thots | 22:46 |
| thomi | kgunn: heh | 22:46 |
| thomi | kgunn: if robert_ancell can reproduce, then I guess we have a problem | 22:46 |
| kgunn | thomi: hmmm, think i'll hold off....go do my personal errands and check IRC a bit later :) | 22:46 |
| thomi | BTW, why the need for a second PPA? | 22:46 |
| robert_ancell | thomi, for the sys-comp-testing ppa over the staging PPA? | 22:56 |
| robert_ancell | 92%... | 22:56 |
| thomi | robert_ancell: the sys-comp-testing ppa | 22:56 |
| thomi | I don't have the staging PPA enabled | 22:56 |
| RAOF | olli: Pong. | 22:56 |
| robert_ancell | thomi, were you asking why we have both PPAs? | 22:56 |
| RAOF | robert_ancell, thomi: That would be what it says on the box - Mir failed to schedule a pageflip (ie: to actually display something), which probably means the GPU hung. | 23:00 |
| robert_ancell | RAOF, did we do the correct behaviour in this case, i.e. give up? | 23:01 |
| RAOF | I think give up is a perfectly reasonable response. | 23:01 |
| thomi | RAOF: why would that be though? the mir_demo_server always works on this machine | 23:02 |
| thomi | I don't understand why it would fail now? | 23:02 |
| RAOF | thomi: Does dmesg have anything radeonish? | 23:03 |
| thomi | RAOF: I was mistakedn about it being radeon, it's an intel i915 | 23:03 |
| thomi | ...and I would tell you, but I just tried rebooting it, and now it hangs somewhere in the boot phase with a blank screen | 23:04 |
| robert_ancell | thomi, you might want to look at https://code.launchpad.net/~robert-ancell/mir/mir-demos-install-path/+merge/171685. In particular I'm not sure how your lttng libs are supposed to work, thought that might be related to bug 1194555? | 23:05 |
| ubot5 | bug 1194555 in Mir "needs to move the lttng in <libdir>/mir/tools/" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1194555 | 23:05 |
| kgunn | thomi: this is weird...but have you tried hitting keys to inject noise/slow down...and see if it boots | 23:05 |
| robert_ancell | ok, trying new u-s-c now.. | 23:05 |
| thomi | ugh. black kscreen hang, no response to any keys, cannot ssh in :-/ | 23:06 |
| kgunn | i had same boot to hung screen (black) | 23:06 |
| kgunn | right....start hitting as soon as its booting.... | 23:06 |
| kgunn | frighteningly...i have to do this currently to get into my machine on boot now :) | 23:07 |
| thomi | kgunn: nope, no difference | 23:07 |
| kgunn | thomi: eeewww....now i'm really not gonna try the latest | 23:07 |
| thomi | I guess it's time to start downloading a new raring image then | 23:07 |
| thomi | good thing it's my testing laptop, not my main | 23:07 |
| robert_ancell | thomi, from cold-boot to session with new u-s-c, no problems | 23:10 |
| thomi | robert_ancell: I'll reinstall the machine. Kind of worrying that it's possible to brick a laptop with this PPA though :-/ | 23:12 |
| thomi | well | 23:12 |
| thomi | not "brick", but make unrecoverable | 23:12 |
| robert_ancell | thomi, couldn't you uninstall u-s-c from low graphics mode? | 23:12 |
| thomi | robert_ancell: I have no keyboard or mouse in low graphics mode. The machine is basically frozen | 23:13 |
| robert_ancell | we really should have some support to detect if you made it to a shell, but a bit harder to add | 23:13 |
| thomi | Ctrl+Alt+F1 does nothing either | 23:13 |
| RAOF | Huh. | 23:15 |
| RAOF | If you wave your mouse around in low graphics mode you should eventually get a cursor. | 23:15 |
| RAOF | The cursor doesn't show up until it's over the dialog box. | 23:15 |
| RAOF | Which is silly, yes. | 23:15 |
| thomi | well, while I'm downloading the new image I might head into town to run some errands. BBL | 23:16 |
| robert_ancell | thomi, bye | 23:18 |
| robert_ancell | RAOF, do we have enough info to debug what thomi is seeing? Is there anything else we could add? | 23:22 |
| RAOF | robert_ancell: Not really enough info. *Some* sort of log would be handy! | 23:24 |
| robert_ancell | RAOF, from mir? | 23:24 |
| RAOF | From anything - mir, dmesg, lightdm. But mir would be an obvious candidate. | 23:24 |
| RAOF | Even booting without splash and seeing where it hangs would be good. | 23:25 |
| olli | robert_ancell, I was looking at the VT bugs... trying to find one that describes how my password (when entered in Xmir/u7) ends up on console | 23:31 |
| olli | is that reported yet? | 23:31 |
| robert_ancell | olli, I'll get you the bug | 23:31 |
| olli | https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity-system-compositor/+bug/1192429 | 23:32 |
| ubot5 | Launchpad bug 1192429 in Unity System Compositor "unity-system-compositor is on multiple simultaneous (and random) VTs" [High,New] | 23:32 |
| olli | https://bugs.launchpad.net/lightdm/+bug/1193207 | 23:32 |
| ubot5 | Launchpad bug 1193207 in Light Display Manager "Issues when swiching sessions when using Unity system compositor" [High,Triaged] | 23:32 |
| olli | it's neither of these imho | 23:32 |
| robert_ancell | nope | 23:32 |
| robert_ancell | olli, bug 1102756 | 23:33 |
| ubot5 | bug 1102756 in Mir "System compositor input events passed to console" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1102756 | 23:33 |
| robert_ancell | bug #4 on the list :) | 23:33 |
| ubot5 | bug 4 in Launchpad itself "Importing finished po doesn't change progressbar" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/4 | 23:33 |
| olli | robert_ancell, thx | 23:34 |
| * olli adds a "don't try at home" disclaimer | 23:34 | |
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