[05:37] Morning everyone [06:03] Ji [06:25] morning superfly and others [06:26] Hi kilos [06:26] goeie môre [06:26] lo theblazehen [06:37] Dagsê [06:38] hi HawkiesZA [06:45] hi tonberryE352 [06:46] morning [07:23] hiya maiatoday [07:27] hi Kilos === Spaceghost is now known as Guest60889 [07:50] hi smile4ever [07:52] Hi Kilos :D [07:52] I have very good news for you [07:52] :D [07:52] tell smile4ever [07:53] I graduated :) I got 73% [07:53] I was first :D [07:53] I had 88% (average) for my IT subjects [07:55] well done laddy [07:55] Now the next step :) To college :) [07:56] good [08:06] Kilos: Will you assist me? :D [08:06] Smile4ever : well done [08:06] with what lad? [08:06] hi Kilos [08:06] hoi smile4ever :D [08:06] hi theblazehen [08:06] hi psyatw [08:06] smile4ever, ik zit in Polen, he :D [08:07] Hi psyatw [08:07] Leuk! :D [08:08] psyatw: met lekkere meisies? ;) [08:11] smile4ever: ja, veel mooie meiden hier op werk en overal eigenlijk :) [08:12] :D [08:54] Hi jotrago [08:57] good day everyone [08:57] hi magespawn [09:01] how are things today, still cold? [09:01] yeah [09:02] max 22°c [09:02] and that usaully happens around 12:31 only [09:03] ya and then windy [09:03] sigh [09:03] sheep okay? [09:05] ya they love cold man. big wool blankets them things [09:09] well then all normal with world pretty much [09:09] hehe [09:10] Kilos: did anyone bring up Software freedom day at the last meeting? [09:11] i dunno [09:11] i will check the logs [09:11] only the g+ hang i think [09:11] i just got some mail from the dlug about it [09:32] good [09:33] maybe remember it for the guy that does event etc === Guest60889 is now known as Spaceghost [09:57] wb Spaceghost [09:57] Thank you Kilos. [09:57] Hi spaceghost [09:57] Hello theblazehen. [09:58] did you see my message last night to you Spaceghost ? [09:58] No, which one? [09:59] at 19.11 [09:59] and the off topic was above that [10:02] https://lists.afrinic.net/pipermail/rpd/2013/003415.html [10:02] lol [10:02] I think I just pulled a pin on a grenade and tossed it [10:03] and I have no idea where its going to land, but shit is about to get real [10:17] heloo [10:18] hi Squirm === Spaceghost is now known as Guest72964 === Guest72964 is now known as Spaceghost [11:49] hi Vince-0 [11:55] Hi === trander is now known as trender [12:14] hi charl [12:16] hi Kilos [12:16] how's it goign [12:16] going [12:17] good ty and you? [12:17] i goign as well [12:17] lol [12:18] i'm doing well, i was in leiden yesterday [12:18] very nice city [12:19] what for you went there? [12:20] just for the lols [12:20] took a day off from work [12:20] first shopping in utrecht and then went through to leiden and walked around a bit [12:20] ah [12:20] actually want to go back and go on a boat through the city [12:20] i only saw it on my way back to the station [12:24] i am downloading linux mint olivia cinnamon from the university of free state mirror [12:24] over ipv6 at approx 7MBps [12:24] it momentarily went up to 10MBps [12:25] wow thats nice [12:25] now my question - what's up with the rest of s. african internet [12:25] done [12:25] Connecting to mirror.ufs.ac.za (mirror.ufs.ac.za)|2001:4200:5000:fffd::6|:80... connected. [12:25] the rest of south african internet does not have a nice 10gb fiber backbone [12:25] oh my dont even talk [12:25] 2013-06-26 14:25:24 (6.83 MB/s) - ‘linuxmint-15-cinnamon-dvd-64bit.iso’ saved [959447040/959447040] [12:26] 10gb fiber backbone only for academic networks [12:26] bad maintainance and leaving upgrading till there isnt a choice anymore [12:26] so the only way to have decent internet is to work at a university? [12:26] or to be very rich [12:27] pretty much, or one of the telco/bank/service providers [12:27] the uni seems to be the most open with the access [12:27] what a mess [12:28] but i just downloaded mint courtesy of the south african academic community [12:28] thanks :) [12:28] last mile is a really big issue as well [12:28] a lot of old copper that is not getting replaced [12:29] some do not even have the copper [12:32] look at http://protea.tenet.ac.za/mrtg-new/tofs-mc-ipnet-summary.asp but when i click on one of the graphs i get a 404 [12:33] oh no, that's http://www.cut.ac.za/ [12:35] they link to www.tenet when they should link to protea.tenet [12:36] try http://graphs.tenet.ac.za/iris/custom/home [12:43] got it [12:43] they don't seem to be doing much with that internet [12:43] they average less than 100Mbps [12:44] i just made their network graphs jump with my download lol [12:45] My university has vacation now so they could as well, but yes, comparatively tiny bandwidth usage [12:45] most universities here have policies like pay per MB or usage caps to drive usage down [12:46] oh yes of course, the holidays [12:46] since they don't want to pay for more bandwidth if they dont have to [12:46] wow that's terrible, so they are the only ones with decent internet in the country and then people can't use it [12:46] sounds like a hopeless situation [12:47] its not that expensive to use internet at university but it does tend to add up after a while [12:48] hrm, if you guys wanna help african internet [12:48] I need you guys to subscribe to the afrinic rpd list, and state support for policy AFPUB-2013-GEN-001-DRAFT-03 [12:49] and I need it urgently from as many people as possible [12:49] like, anyone you can get to subscribe to that list and voice support, we *NEED* that policy but I need people to back it [12:49] else its not gonna fly [12:50] * Kerbero has been summoned here [12:50] hi Kerbero [12:50] o/ [12:50] and anyone who wants to know what that policy is about or see it, feel free to ask and I'll give details [12:50] details. [12:50] but seriously for the benefit of africa and academia, this is important [12:51] tell me what to do [12:51] Kerbero, lemme find the policy url first then will explain [12:51] Bye everyone [12:51] https://lists.afrinic.net/pipermail/rpd/2013/003332.html [12:51] thats the policy itself there [12:52] I basically need people to subscribe the resource policy discussion list and voice support for that policy [12:52] if you dont agree with it, fine, discuss that with me, but if it makes sense to you, we need backing [12:52] on that list [12:53] sounds interesting, reading [12:54] while the implications of that policy itself are pretty simple, the implications of getting it passed are far wider, and far more important, right now, certain frankaphone elements are attempting to hijack the afrinic policy process and afrinic itself, and if they manage to squash this policy through shouting loudest, then they pretty much succeed [12:54] so passing this policy is both positive in terms of the policy and stopping that [12:54] https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rpd <=== you can subscribe to the list here [12:56] (as regards to what to say to support it, something along the lines of "I have read through policy academic-ipv4-allocation-afpub-2013-gen-001-draft-03, and believe it is in the interests of the African Continent and hence, I would like to voice my support for it" [12:57] Symmetria, 3.5, is the "not less than 5 ipv4 address" a typo? [12:58] 5 seems a lot [12:58] kerbero no, 5 is correct and lemme explain why [12:59] 1 outta 5 in that is for infrastructure, and it generally holds true, the numbers of switches, wifi aps, servers, etc etc etc on a campus is *huge* [12:59] then, you have all the lab pcs, residence rooms, desktops etc [12:59] that takes it 2 [12:59] the other 3 is about wifi networks [13:00] almost everyone today has a smartphone with wifi capability [13:00] everyone has a notebook [13:00] and a helluva lot of people have tablets [13:00] in testing and research we have done, we've found the average concurrency on academic wifi networks per person is 3.2 devices [13:00] thats where that number comes from [13:00] sounds reasonable [13:00] ok if that is the case i agree [13:01] but does afrinic have enough free ipv4 space for that? [13:01] kerbero, afrinic is one of the last places on earth that has ipv4 space left, and they have about 3.8 /8s left [13:02] the problem is, if we dont use that, africa will lag behind the rest of the world in terms of getting ipv6 [13:02] because the isps here will be arguing forever more than there is enough v4 space left and they dont need v6 [13:02] ahh i see [13:02] the only way to accelerate v6 deployment on the continent is to burn the v4, the same way as the rest of the world has done [13:02] so one of the other objectives behind this policy is to increase the burn rate substantially [13:03] why are a few people so against it? [13:03] too afraid of running out of v4 space? [13:03] tonberry heh, the west african contingent right now will oppose ANYTHING not coming out of west africa for one thing [13:03] ah [13:03] wow that is so childish [13:03] the policy was proposed by a south african, thats enough reason to oppose it ;p its a geo-political / ethnicity issue [13:03] charl yes it is, but its reality [13:04] so yeah, if you guys can subscribe and send messages supporting it similar to what I said above [13:04] every voice in favour helps right now [13:05] we need aother 20 or so people to climb on there and say "we support" and it will pass [13:05] i agree regarding NAT, it's terribly limiting [13:05] i would like to support this but i am not a resident of any african country [13:05] so i don't know if my support counts [13:05] charl you dont ahve to be [13:06] the rules say that anyone on that list has the right to indicate support or lack thereof [13:06] because its a global community [13:06] so by the rules, you can subscribe, and you can state support, and it counts [13:06] very good then i will support it [13:06] and I'd ask you to do that :) and ask anyone else you know that can help us with voices of support to do the same [13:06] we NEED the voices loud and clear [13:07] is this an ANC youth rally...VIVA comrade!! [13:08] coff* afternoon [13:08] trender seriously, this isnt a joke, its importanmt [13:09] relax :) [13:09] sounds like its inevitable [13:10] change follows logic eventually [13:10] trender it wont pass if I dont get the voices on that list sadly, the west africans are fighting like hell [13:11] well the whole world is based on illution surely the right illution can be manufactured here [13:11] isnt this what we all do [13:12] illusion [13:12] even [13:13] businesses live and dive by the flames off illusion whether real or fabricated [13:13] die = dive [13:14] surely its not hard to find 20 names... by the right encouragement [13:15] Symmetria: so basically we have to use up our ipv4 space before we can get assigned ipv6? [13:16] magespawn basically isps will not go the v6 route unless they have a reason to do so [13:16] the best reason to do so is to ensure there is no more v4 space ;p [13:17] i see, is there a clear benefit to using ipv6? [13:17] whats the real urgency behind pushing v6 quickly ??? [13:18] most people wait till the car wont drive before fixing the engine [13:18] its human nature [13:19] indeed [13:19] hi Steve7h3Ripper [13:19] welcome to ubuntu-za [13:19] trender errr [13:19] the rest of the world is outta v4 space [13:19] so people in the rest of the world are being slowly forced to go v6 only [13:20] unless africa wakes up and goes v6, you will find portions of the internet start disappearing [13:20] and become inaccessible [13:21] hrm... [13:21] the ones still hosted only on v4 space? [13:21] magespawn if a site goes v6 only and you have no v6 on your pc [13:21] you will not be able to access that site [13:21] period [13:21] they dont talk to each other [13:21] this sounds like it may effect some of my preffered media content :( [13:21] so you will then have to tunnel it [13:24] is there away to check if your equipment can take v6? [13:24] i also wanna know that [13:25] magespawn depends which equipment [13:25] if its running linux, yes, if its running android, yes, if its running osx, yes, if its running anything windows 7 or later, yes, if you're talking about networking gear [13:26] switches are l2, so they dont really need it [13:26] laptops, phones, tablets and routers [13:26] routers, that depends on the model [13:26] tablets, android supports v6 [13:26] phones, android and ios supports v6 [13:26] laptops, thats all about the operating system [13:26] okay google here we come [13:26] name the router model and I can probably find it for you [13:26] but please, please, please get on that list and voice support [13:26] :( [13:27] let me have read [13:27] that will cost about 1 bitcoin [13:27] i will join the list anyway [13:28] ai yai yai [13:28] the list is worth being on, it gets really interesting actually [13:28] and you're always free to participate in it because anyone is [13:28] the router is a d-link dsl-2640u [13:28] give the link again [13:29] Symmetria: subscribed to the list but now i have a problem - i can't reply to the thread because i don't have the original mail [13:30] i cant officially be on any list for personal reasons but naturally i wholeheartedly support the cause [13:30] ok got it [13:30] Charl, you can say you follow the list by Digest, that or I will send another email and the moment you get it, you can reply to it [13:30] would you still use NAT? [13:31] Symmetria: cool i'll reply when i get the mail [13:31] mail inbound from me ;p [13:31] you can just reply to that one stating along the lines of what I said above, just make sure you name the policy in your email as I put it above [13:32] Im looking at that dlink magespawn, mmmm when you go to the configuration on it [13:32] does it show you any v6 options [13:32] because Im not seeing much on google about support for it [13:32] not that i could find [13:32] going through its manual now [13:33] is this v6 gonna effect routers mainly ?? [13:33] hrm, I dont think so because its manual never mentions v6 :( [13:33] trender this v6 will effect *everything* [13:33] here, let me show you [13:33] do we still use such old machinery ? [13:33] it does not allow it on my side of the router for sure [13:33] try and ping leecher6.alstonnetworks.net [13:34] it wont let you ping that, or access it, or go near it, unless you have ipv6 enabled on your machine and ipv6 capable routing from your isp [13:34] ok let me test [13:34] infact if you type ping leecher6.alstonnetworks.net it might tell you it cant even resolve, so try ping6 leecher6.alstonnetworks.net and you will see it will attempt to ping it using ipv6 [13:35] if you have v6 support or your machine is teredo enabled (an auto translate mechanism) it MIGHT ping on teredo [13:35] but it wont be native :) [13:35] Invalid confirmation string: 2b8a84b0947dd01e86b7b5e8c5b49215135aa644. [13:35] grrr [13:36] damn cant ping it [13:36] what the **** [13:36] cannot even find the ost [13:36] trender *nod* thats because almost no south african providers support it yet even though there is stuff going v6 only already in the rest of the world [13:36] same here [13:36] ping6 leecher6.alstonnetworks.net [13:36] connect: Network is unreachable [13:36] watch: [13:37] is that server in europe somewhere? i get like a 16 ms ping [13:37] ndrews-MacBook-Pro:~ aalston$ ping6 leecher6.alstonnetworks.net [13:37] PING6(56=40+8+8 bytes) 2001:4200:5000:300:426c:8fff:fefe:fefe --> 2a01:300:666:4::2 [13:37] 16 bytes from 2a01:300:666:4::2, icmp_seq=0 hlim=46 time=211.495 ms [13:37] 16 bytes from 2a01:300:666:4::2, icmp_seq=1 hlim=46 time=215.118 ms [13:37] 16 bytes from 2a01:300:666:4::2, icmp_seq=2 hlim=46 time=211.443 ms [13:37] ^C [13:37] charl yeah it is [13:37] its in the UK :) [13:37] ah i see, that explains it [13:37] right next door :) [13:37] charl but see, you can reach it, you have v6, us people in africa, our isps have done bugger all [13:37] so how do i get around this problem quickly ? [13:38] www.tunnelbroker.net and get a v6 tunnel [13:38] it should explain on there how to set it up [13:38] quite frankly my cable isp has done nothing with it either [13:38] but see now why we need support? [13:38] i have no native v6 at home [13:38] charl aahh you tunneling it? [13:38] if i want any v6 whatsoever i need to tunnel [13:38] no, at work we have native v6 [13:39] hrm... [13:39] charl *nod* but the reality is, native v6 is accelerating, it has to, there is *NO* more v4 space in europe [13:39] ok that makes sence [13:39] its finished, gone, no more, all done [13:39] yeah they are just dragging it out [13:39] Asia has been outta v4 space for months already [13:39] but the isps still each have their own pool [13:39] the US is due to run out in september [13:39] charl but those pools are running low, very low [13:39] i'm sure [13:39] you cant extend those forever [13:39] charl did you get that email to reply to? it shoulda arrived [13:40] although, considering most people are moving to ftth, i think ziggo's cable subscribers will become less [13:40] i suspect the ftth isps are already on v6 [13:40] yup just got it [13:40] will reply in a sec [13:40] so v6 problem is actually on my isp ??? [13:40] trender yes [13:40] Symmetria, do they chrage for the tunnel [13:40] kilos no, not at the moment [13:41] so i just sign up there? [13:41] kilos the thing is, if everyone is forced to start tunneling, sooner or later the tunnel providers are going to charge, because it will cost them money to run it [13:41] yeah [13:41] whew [13:41] its kinda like the tunnel i have to allow my chinese girls to see blocked youtube [13:41] Kilos did you subscribe to the list and throw some support for the policy? :) [13:42] is is expensive to run both? [13:42] i cant get in there [13:42] kilos cant get in where? www.tunnelbroker.net? [13:42] damn annoying [13:42] Invalid confirmation string: 2b8a84b0947dd01e86b7b5e8c5b49215135aa644. [13:42] no that other page [13:42] hrm, is that the confirmation it sent you back when you tried to subscribe? [13:42] via email? [13:42] so basically when we get website errors it can be a v6 issue ?? [13:43] where we must approve your stuff [13:43] trender yes [13:43] Kilos, basically, you subscribe to the list and then post a message of support on it [13:43] they sent me one but thats the link that cant get in [13:43] https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo.cgi/rpd [13:43] that page [13:44] you put your name and email address in there [13:44] turn off digests I suggest [13:44] and hit subscribe [13:44] it should then send you a confirmation link [13:44] the site apprears gone but its really there we just dont get to see it cus we cannot resolve the ip [13:44] double click on the link and it should subscribe you [13:44] appears [13:44] sucks [13:45] there are many ways of tunneling to fix this issue but thats still gonna get overloaded fast [13:45] where you turn off digests [13:46] essentially you using annother machines BW to tunnel right ?? [13:48] something similar to a proxy ? [13:48] double click on what link?? [13:49] i see rpd list run by list-admin at afrinic.net, ernest at afrinic.net [13:49] rpd administrative interface (requires authorization) [13:49] Overview of all afrinic.net mailing lists [13:49] and python and mail thing and a goat [13:49] kilos umm digests should be off by default [13:49] anyway [13:49] so the moment you put your name and email in and hit subscribe [13:49] and then just double click on the link the email sends back to you for confirmation [13:49] oh ok [13:50] you can also just reply to the confimation email [13:50] im just gonna start paying my isp 50% of the bill and see what happens :) [13:52] yeah that also works :) [13:52] magespawn you subscribed now? [13:52] it says i am subscribed [13:52] now how to get back to where we approve is another prob [13:52] sigh [13:53] Kilos once you're subscribed [13:53] you can email rpd@afrinic.net to post to the list [13:54] oh that sounds easier [13:54] and if you put the policy name in the subject, you can say "I have been following this discussion on the website and on the digests, and I want to voice my support for it as I believe it is in the best interests of the African continent" [13:54] or something to that effect [13:54] what i put in the mail? [13:54] :) word it how you want, just name the policy in question [13:54] AFPUB-2013-GEN-001-DRAFT-03 [13:54] this is actually a monumental stuffup [13:55] is that the policy? [13:55] thats the policy name [13:56] you put that in the subject line? [13:56] does this problem effect all our isps ??? [13:56] or is it a case of choose mweb and forget about it ? [13:57] kilos yeah [13:57] you can put that in the subject line [13:57] its just like any other email to any other mailing list [13:58] I just suggest putting that int he subject line so people know which policy you are referring to [13:58] ok i see the discussion but no approve button [13:58] trender ALL dsl isps in this country at the moment have this problem other than potentially IS who you could ask [13:58] Kilos, there is no approve button, its all about the emails to the list [13:58] aha [13:58] all the emails to the list are evaluated by the PDWG chairs [13:58] and they then declare consensus or lack thereof [13:59] interesting [13:59] Symmetria: yes [14:00]