[00:32] <Azelphur> ali1234: happen to know how LVM fares in the event of disk failure, if I was to combine drives like you recommended the other day?
[00:32] <ali1234> it depends how you combined them
[00:32] <Azelphur> I see
[00:32] <Azelphur> well, I havn't combined them yet, so what are the options?
[00:32] <ali1234> the usual raid modes
[00:33] <Azelphur> ali1234: yea, there's like raid stripe, and LVM stripe, right?
[00:34] <Azelphur> I know raid stripe is one drive failure = all data lost
[00:34] <Azelphur> so what about the LVM option?
[00:35] <ali1234> same
[00:35] <Azelphur> oh, so basically, it doesn't depend
[00:35] <Azelphur> either way you're fucked.
[00:35] <Azelphur> xD
[00:35] <ali1234> well don't use striping then
[00:36] <Azelphur> does that mean not using LVM?
[00:36] <ali1234> no
[00:36] <Azelphur> I like the idea of having one big partition, but not at the expense of loosing all my data if the drive fails
[00:36] <Azelphur> whats the other option then? :P
[00:37] <daftykins> you just want standard RAID5/6
[00:38] <Azelphur> daftykins: I don't think so, I think I want what ali1234 is vaguely hinting at :P
[00:38] <daftykins> i've no experience with LVM so i don't know how that relates
[00:38] <daftykins> hehe
[00:38] <daftykins> Azelphur: you just have to work for it? ;)
[00:38] <Azelphur> indeed :)
[00:39] <daftykins> i am curious what can be 5 or 6 like and still grow
[00:39] <daftykins> i think my 3ware controller can grow a RAID but it seems risky to me
[00:39] <daftykins> it tends to be old enough that new disks are needed by the time they're full
[00:40] <Azelphur> hehe
[00:40] <Azelphur> yea, I mean I will be periodically adding disks to my setup
[00:40] <daftykins> i give up dropping a grand on disks though =|
[00:41] <daftykins> so i fear for my data :(
[00:44] <ali1234> there isn't really a way to have a logical volume across two disks and only lose half the files if one disk breaks
[00:44] <ali1234> you either have mirroring or parity and lose nothing at the cost of disk space, or you have striping and lose everything
[00:44] <Azelphur> I see
[00:44] <Azelphur> I suppose I'll avoid LVM then, and just keep separate drives
[00:58] <daftykins> as long as you monitor them closely, you can spot impending deaths and transfer off
[07:04] <popey> Azelphur: i do that with btrfs.
[07:05] <popey> Azelphur: started with 4 disks in RAID 1 btrfs, then just kept adding disks to grow the volume over time. btrfs allows you to add disks of different sizes too, so I started with 2TB disks but will probably buy 3TB disks and add those in
[07:15] <popey> morning TheOpenSourcerer
[07:15] <TheOpenSourcerer> \o popey
[07:25] <diplo> Morning all
[07:37] <dwdorig> Ah, netsplits. I'd almost forgotten about them.
[07:38] <dwdorig> (This like discovering my nickname had "expired", and realising it'd been over a decade since I'd last used IRC properly)
[07:45] <ali1234> !info gcc-mingw-w64
[08:07] <AlanBell> morning
[08:09] <DJones> Morning all
[08:28] <JamesTait> Good morning all, happy Industrial Workers of the World Day! :)
[08:28]  * popey gets back down t'pit
[08:29]  * DJones lends popey a flat cap and a ferret
[08:32] <DJones> With you saying "t'pit" reminds of going to a war/prison camp museum (I think somewhere in Yorkshire) a few years back and walking through a mock up of a wartime coal mine & seeing the conditions the miners had, made me appreciate the conditions my grandfather worked in for 50+ years of his life
[08:33] <DJones> Ah, Eden Camp - That was it
[08:33] <dwdorig> On the wall in my office, I have the display plans for the "new" pit windings for Kirkby Colliery.
[08:34] <dwdorig> Dated 1904. Reminds me that despite various job titles, I don't really do "proper" engineering. :-)
[08:37] <DJones> dwdorig: Was Kirkby COlliery actually in Kirkby, or did that extend eastwards towards Bold & Sutton Manor?
[08:37] <dwdorig> It's more normally called "Top Pit".
[08:37] <hoover> Morning folks
[08:38] <DJones> Hmmh, just realised there is more than one Kirkby, so could be a completely different area
[08:39] <DJones> If its where I think, its Nottinghamshire rather than Lancashire
[08:39] <dwdorig> Yes, indeed, there's lots of Kirkbys. This one is in Derbyshire I think.
[08:40] <DJones> Right, when you said Kirkby I though it was the one at the end of the East Lancs Road between Bootle & ST Helens, there's two former mines at Bold & Sutton Manor there
[08:45] <dwdorig> Oh, perhaps I'm wrong - Kirkby-in-Ashfield looks like the one, in Nottinghamshire.
[08:46] <dwdorig> Although that does look like the wrong company. Now I'm confused...
[08:48] <DJones> Heh, When I looked it up I got to the Kirkby-in-Ashfield one as well
[08:52] <dwdorig> Ah, no, it's the "top pit" bit that I suspect I've got wrong. But I can't find the company who ran Kirkby Colliery. I'm expecting it to be Butterley.
[08:54] <bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
[08:54] <DJones> dwdorig: Found this http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/SearchUI/Details/AssetMain?iaid=C6031760 "Kirkby in Ashfield: Lands west of Kirkby Colliery; Butterley & Co Ltd"
[08:55] <DJones> Bears out what you were expecting
[08:56] <dwdorig> DJones, That'll be it, thanks.
[09:05] <brobostigon> good morning everyone.
[09:30] <bigcalm> Morning brobostigon
[09:31] <neuro> 'ning all
[09:32] <neuro> today is shaping up to be a pretty cool technological day
[09:32] <neuro> i found out that paypal can send cash to your bank acct in < 2hrs
[09:32] <neuro> i found a whole new bunch of albums in my amazon autorip folder
[09:32] <neuro> i got my digg reader invite through
[09:33] <neuro> and just for sheer cuteness, check out what happens when you search for "gay" on google!
[09:33] <brobostigon> morning bigcalm and neuro
[09:33] <neuro> lo brob
[09:34] <bigcalm> That is cute
[09:35] <bigcalm> Amusing that it also returned a load of LGBT dating sites for my area
[09:35] <bigcalm> Putting geolocation to good use
[09:47] <popey> the gay thing has been on google for some time
[10:01] <davmor2> Morning all
[10:22] <bigcalm> Morning davmor2
[10:23] <bigcalm> davmor2: you missed a cracking LUG last night. I didn't get home until 12.30am
[10:27] <davmor2> bigcalm: and you missed an evening of amusement, befuddlement, misdirection, trickery and magic :)
[10:27] <davmor2> bigcalm: otherwise known as the reason I couldn't make it :)
[10:45] <bigcalm> davmor2: ah, we thought you were at Canonical
[10:47] <bigcalm> davmor2: or, as Jenny called it, Calonical
[10:48] <Laney> a calonic irrigation
[10:48] <davmor2> bigcalm: no the magic shop owner has lectures every now and again this time it happened to land on Wednesday, but the guy was absolutely amazing
[10:49] <davmor2> bigcalm: I've never met anyone quite so deft with cards.
[11:06] <bigcalm> This auto-rip on amazon is fun. Just re-discovered a few albums I had bought many years ago
[11:06]  * bigcalm sways to Pentaphobe
[11:09] <DJones> Not that I've bought many albums from Amazon, but the ones it'd added to my autorip folder are albums that I'd later sold the original cd
[11:09] <bigcalm> Yes, the legality is some what questionable
[11:16] <DJones> I was just glad I hadn't bought any 'dodgy albums' from Amazon for it to be recorded for all posterity :)
[11:17] <popey> "We've added 29 songs from your CD purchases for free
[11:17] <popey> "
[11:17] <popey> \o/
[11:17] <popey> one cd
[11:17] <popey> which was a present
[11:18] <DJones> I had 2 cd's worth and that was a double album
[11:19] <bigcalm> 27 albums -> 422 tracks
[11:47] <dwdorig> Amazon's autrip thing is terrifying.
[11:48] <dwdorig> Mostly because I almost never buy music (by which I mean, the music I listen to is generally freely downloadable), and instead it's my wife buying CDs for her, her mother, the kids, etc.
[11:54] <DJones> I'll be more impressed when/if they start giving electronic copies of paper books I'd previously bought from them
[11:54] <popey> ..with no drm
[11:55] <DJones> Ideally with no drm, but I wouldn't complain if they were drm'd
[11:56] <BigRedS> I've largely made peace with DRMed ebooks. Which is weird given my rabid hippyness elswhere
[11:57] <BigRedS> I view it as essentially a subscription service; it's a kindle thing and should work as long as I have a kindle
[11:57] <BigRedS> and if I want to keep it longer than that I'll get it in dead tree
[11:58] <dwdorig> I'm frantically searching Amazon's privacy clauses to make sure this list can never be public.
[11:58] <dwdorig> It's got "I love a Party", by "Russ Abbot" - and that's not the worst thing on here.
[11:59] <DJones> There's one book I bought from Amazon that was lent out to somebody before I'd had chance to read it and was promptly lost/misplaced so I wish I could track it down
[12:00] <BigRedS> dwdorig: I left my spotify account logged in for a party and my '90s Megamix became public knowledge :/
[12:01] <dwdorig> The '90's has music?
[12:02] <DJones> Most things after the 80's sound like white noise to me :) Now, get off my lawn
[12:02] <BigRedS> heeel yeah. B*witched, All Saints, Des'ree, East 17
[12:03] <dwdorig> Were B*witched the weird Irish girls in denim?
[12:03] <lornajane> dwdorig: does that narrow it down?
[12:03] <dwdorig> lornajane, Good point, well made.
[12:03] <BigRedS> haha
[12:04] <BigRedS> but, yeah, they were some of them
[12:04] <lornajane> I shouldn't be rude about them though, pretty sure you would find b*witched on the music server if you looked
[12:05] <lornajane> I stopped buying digital music from amazon when they started making me download it a track at a time from a horribly inaccessible interface
[12:05] <lornajane> haven't found an alternative supplier though really
[12:05] <popey> you can download full albums with the app can't you?
[12:05] <BigRedS> I use spotify generally
[12:05] <BigRedS> so much easier than managing multiple GB of audio files
[12:05] <popey> ah, clamz is the command line download tool
[12:06] <popey> that too
[12:06] <dwdorig> popey, Speaking of apps, can Ubuntu-Fondle run Android apps?
[12:06]  * dwdorig hates to drag discussion back to compters, but...
[12:07] <popey> Nope
[12:07] <lornajane> ha, don't worry.  I'm only really here because I'm upgrading and I think I've broken something!
[12:07] <popey> We don't ship dalvik or the java classlibraries
[12:09] <dwdorig> Ah, right. There's plenty of times I'd prefer a more traditional UNIX on my tablet especially, but I also don't want to lose Android entirely.
[12:10] <dwdorig> lornajane, Anyway, what's broke?
[12:10] <mungbean> "We've added 102 songs from your CD purchases for free"
[12:10] <mungbean> including one CD i lost for a few years
[12:11] <mungbean> but only just found
[12:11] <dwdorig> mungbean, That's why it's just been added. They *know*.
[12:11] <mungbean> i wish there was "snd to google music" button
[12:11] <mungbean> cloud player on linux is fail
[12:11] <lornajane> dwdorig: well, aptitude is still running, so maybe nothing.  But it's giving me this gdk-pixbuf error quite a few times as it goes along
[12:12] <dwdorig> lornajane, What error?
[12:12] <lornajane> it includes the phrase "This likely means that your installation is broken" which is ringing alarm bells!
[12:12] <mungbean> sometimes the CD is same price as mp3
[12:12] <lornajane> dwdorig: it says "(gtk-update-icon-cache:11523): GdkPixbuf-WARNING **: Cannot open pixbuf loader module file '/usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/gdk-pixbuf-2.0/2.10.0/loaders.cache': No such file or directory
[12:13] <dwdorig> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+2.0/+bug/1156927 ?
[12:13] <popey> mungbean: there is a google music app on ubuntu
[12:14] <dwdorig> Smells similar, doesn't it.
[12:14] <mungbean> yes, but amazon cloud player support sucks
[12:14] <mungbean> and you would have to download from amazon first
[12:14] <dwdorig> lornajane, That bug includes the output:
[12:14] <dwdorig> Try running the command
[12:14] <dwdorig>   gdk-pixbuf-query-loaders > /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/gdk-pixbuf-2.0/2.10.0/loaders.cache
[12:14] <dwdorig> to make things work again for the time being.
[12:15] <lornajane> dwdorig: yep, that bug is what I see.  The command doesn't run though
[12:15] <dwdorig> I'm not sure that's safe to run *while* you're installing, anyway.
[12:15] <lornajane> aptitude is giving me lots of "Setting up .." now so I'll try it again when it's done
[12:16] <popey> lornajane: what are you doing with aptitude out of interest?
[12:16] <popey> upgrading from what to what?
[12:16] <lornajane> popey: that's a really good question
[12:16] <lornajane> this machine was first installed with mint + LXDE
[12:16] <popey> ruh-roh
[12:16] <dwdorig> lornajane, Oh, you're doing one of *those* upgrades...
[12:16] <popey> i see where this is going
[12:17] <lornajane> now it's really mint and XFCE, but with all the ubuntu sources included, so most of my packages seem to be ubuntu-esque for stuff that isn't X
[12:17] <dwdorig> popey, Hey, don't knock it. That's how I cross-installed Ubuntu in the first place.
[12:18] <lornajane> mint released olivia for XFCE this week and I'm not on site for a couple of days so I thought I'd just go for it
[12:18] <popey> Good luck with that ☻
[12:19] <lornajane> I really should install xubuntu but ... eh, just can't get enthusiastic about getting everything properly set up again
[12:19] <lornajane> I use so many various tools, it takes literally months to get round and discover all the broken things
[12:20] <christel> 6/3
[12:20] <christel> er
[12:20] <mungbean> 2
[12:20] <christel> <3
[12:20] <dwdorig> Yes, and more than 1, like 2 normally is.
[12:20] <diddledan> lol
[12:22] <dwdorig> They don't call me Mr Helpful for nothing, you know. I have to pay them.
[12:22] <diddledan> so dickie stallman is in the internet hall-of-fame now?
[12:22] <dwdorig> Gosh, so he is. I didn't even read that announcement.
[12:23] <mungbean> never heard of it
[12:23] <dwdorig> And Jimmy Wales.
[12:23] <dwdorig> mungbean, It's an Internet Society thing.
[12:24] <mungbean> nevr heard of that either :P
[12:24] <dwdorig> mungbean, They operate the IETF.
[12:25] <mungbean> ok. and they have a list of people they like?
[12:25] <popey> it was only established last year!
[12:25] <popey> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_Hall_of_Fame
[12:25] <DJones> Will he ever read that he's in the internet hall of fame though? I didn't think he read anything on the internet (could just be an urban myth)
[12:25] <dwdorig> DJones, Right, he has people to do that kind of thing for him.
[12:26] <popey> DJones: its not a myth
[12:26] <mungbean> it was true at one point about the way he read his mail
[12:26] <popey> http://stallman.org/stallman-computing.html
[12:27] <DJones> I guess that means he won't getting Amazon AutoRip albums downloaded into his Amazon drive then
[12:27] <mungbean> we all knowpeople like him, i'm just surprised he managed to get so far
[12:27] <popey> "When I use a search engine, it is always from a machine that isn't mine and that other people also use. I never identify myself to the site, of course."
[12:27] <mungbean> he's searching for how to feed parrots
[12:28] <popey> ☻
[12:28] <mungbean> you don't have to be a visionary to assume that ghcq and nsa are reading your unencrypted comms
[12:28]  * dwatkins wonders if Stallman's computer has a free BIOS as well
[12:29] <mungbean> yes
[12:29] <mungbean> he has a machine called ollong tea for something, its well documented
[12:29] <dwatkins> is the firmware for all the chips open as well?
[12:30] <BigRedS> I think it is now
[12:30] <BigRedS> well. He doesn't mind whether the firmware is free or not, he just doesn't use it if it's not free
[12:30] <BigRedS> so had no WiFi on his OLPC because that was non-free
[12:31] <popey> rmspostcomments
[12:31] <popey> bah
[12:31] <BigRedS> He is surprisingly accepting of non-free software, he just doesn't want to be part of the reason it is anywhere.
[12:31] <dwatkins> fair enough
[12:32] <mungbean> 1rms
[12:32] <dwatkins> I agree with his stance on the OLPC.
[12:32] <mungbean> !rms
[12:32] <BigRedS> popey: one tweet announcing its existence...
 Sorry, I don't know anything about 'rms'
[12:32] <BigRedS> Oh! It's for auth only...
[12:32] <mungbean> we have this convo a lot, maybe a factoid :P
[12:33] <Gary> I wonder if my old !gary still works :p
[12:33] <BigRedS> But RMS would rather a bot not know anything about him :)
[12:33] <Gary> aww
[12:35] <directhex> sigh, rms
[12:35] <diddledan> I think I popped the cork with the genie getting out of the bottle
[12:36] <diddledan> who knew one person could evoke so much conversation?! :-p
[12:39] <mungbean> modelzone in administration :(
[12:44] <lornajane> okay, I think I fixed that pixbuf problem.  Let's see if I can reboot after all that
[13:09] <popey> ali1234: what ever happened to that wayland fork, soreau was maintaining wasn't he
[13:09] <popey> northwood?
[13:22] <lornajane> I'm stuck in a situation where a tool requires a package that aptitude doesn't know about, what can I do at this point?
[13:23] <lornajane> google just knows about some instances of error messages regarding this missing package, not the package itself
[13:25] <bigcalm> hi lornajane :)
[13:25] <bigcalm> lornajane: is it available in a ppa?
[13:25] <lornajane> bigcalm: how would I find out?  I'm not getting hits when I search for it (it's gee-1.0)
[13:27] <bigcalm> lornajane: looks like it might be part of gir1.2-gee-1.0
[13:27] <lornajane> bigcalm: I am not sure how to explain that to the thing I'm trying to compile.  Already commented bits out of the CMakeLists.txt :)
[13:28] <bigcalm> Ah
[13:28] <bigcalm> If you install that package, does the error go away?
[13:28] <lornajane> it is installed
[13:28] <bigcalm> Oh
[13:28] <bigcalm> symlink?
[13:28] <lornajane> I thought maybe it was doing a check for a wrong package name ... but I'm not sure how to stop that
[13:29] <bigcalm> I know rather little about make files :/
[13:29] <lornajane> yeah symlink maybe, not sure what would link to what
[13:29] <lornajane> well I'm trying to compile Vala.  Because there's a tool that exists in vala, and this is open source, right?
[13:29] <bigcalm> Can you find a file with 'gee' in the name using locate?
[13:30] <lornajane> I seem to have libgee2 things and gir1.2-gee-1.0 things
[13:31] <bigcalm> Vala is available as a ppa
[13:31] <lornajane> I think I have vala, I'm trying to compile something made of it
[13:32] <bigcalm> Oh, I see :)
[13:32] <lornajane> I have done this before, but then I upgraded and the project updated and I need to recompile ... been putting this off for months
[13:32] <lornajane> because I knew I'd be in dependency hell :(
[13:32] <bigcalm> Not procrastinating writing a talk? ;)
[13:33] <lornajane> well, at some point I need to be able to compile my presenter tool, which is what this is
[13:33] <bigcalm> Ah, all related so that's okay :)
[13:33] <davmor2> bigcalm: you don't write talks you speak them, man I thought you was the clever one ;)
[13:33] <lornajane> I'm about 8 weeks from *needing* this tool to work, I'm only giving a couple of talks that I don't particularly need the presenter view for
[13:33] <lornajane> 8 weeks is about as good as it gets, so the time is now
[13:33] <bigcalm> Fair enough
[13:34] <lornajane> the tool is getting better but I do have some custom build bits in there so I need to be able to compile it
[13:35] <lornajane> apparently I'm the only person in the world who ever starts not at the first slide of a presentation, for example
[13:35] <bigcalm> Re-order your slides? :)
[13:36] <lornajane> bigcalm: it's the training courses, which can be several hundred slides and take a few days
[13:36] <bigcalm> Oh, that makes sense
[13:36] <popey> vala is in the repo
[13:36] <popey> dont need a ppa for that
[13:36] <popey> given chunks of unity are written in vala...
[13:36] <bigcalm> Rich was jumping about all over the place when he did Symfony2 training
[13:37] <lornajane> popey: I think I have vala, but in trying to compile some vala, I get missing packages - but we think the package names have changed is all
[13:37] <lornajane> bigcalm: yeah, I'm like that too.  Nothing is as tiring as a day's training - because I'm bouncing about and thinking and talking all day!
[13:37] <popey> ah
[13:37] <popey> superfun
[13:38] <popey> how can i see what program is using a kernel module I am trying to unload?
[13:38] <popey> Error: Module uvcvideo is in use
[13:38] <popey> but I dont know what is using it
[13:38] <bigcalm> modprobe uvcvideo ?
[13:39] <popey> i am trying to rmmod it
[13:39] <bigcalm> Actually, I think that might try to load it
[13:39] <bigcalm> modinfo maybe?
[13:39] <popey> nope
[13:39] <bigcalm> lsmod will list what mods are being used by other mods
[13:39] <bigcalm> Can you see anything using /dev/video* ?
[13:39] <popey> yeah, its being used by something else
[13:39] <diplo> lsof ?
[13:40] <popey> ah yeah, lsof
[13:40] <popey> aha
[13:40] <bigcalm> Skype?
[13:40] <popey> chromium
[13:40] <bigcalm> Hangouts
[13:40] <popey> yup
[13:40] <popey> oof, just lost the entire chromium
[13:40] <bigcalm> Ouch
[13:41] <popey> I hope my tabs come back when I open it
[13:41] <popey> \o/
[13:44] <mungbean> i never understand when it says ..umm can't open the tabs, but i know what they were
[13:45] <mungbean> click to open them
[13:45] <lornajane> mungbean: my chrome does it I think in case something inside one of them is causing the crash
[13:45] <lornajane> so it won't crash again until you ask it to
[13:48] <dwatkins> I tend to save my open tabs with cloud tab sometimes, just in case
[13:48] <lornajane> progress! As in, I get a different error now :)
[13:48] <popey> i just have chromium set to re-open whatever was open when it closed/died
[13:48] <dwatkins> Tab Cloud, even: https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/tabcloud/npecfdijgoblfcgagoijgmgejmcpnhof?hl=en
[13:48] <dwatkins> been burned once too many times by CCleaner
[13:49] <diplo> really? Ccleaner works well for me
[13:50] <bigcalm> I don't appear to have a volume icon/controller on my desktop. How do I get it back?
[13:51] <lornajane> bigcalm: run alsamixer
[13:51] <bigcalm> lornajane: that's a CLI app
[13:52] <lornajane> bigcalm: yes, but it's what I've been using since I don't have clickable audio controls
[13:52] <bigcalm> Ah :)
[13:55] <Azelphur> popey: but in your setup, if you loose one drive, do you loose all data?
[13:55] <bigcalm> lornajane: apparently this fixes itsudo apt-get install indicator-sound
[13:55]  * bigcalm logs out to find out
[13:56] <popey> Azelphur: no, of course not
[13:56] <popey> RAID1
[13:56] <Azelphur> oh, raid 1 is mirror, right?
[13:57] <popey> yeah, btrfs doesn't do RAID1 like hardware RAID or MD RAID
[13:57] <Azelphur> I see
[13:57] <popey> but the effect is the same, data is spread over more than one disk
[13:57] <bigcalm> lornajane: that fixed it :)
[13:57] <Azelphur> yea, I was hoping to get a "one big partition" but if one drive fails, I just loose the data on that drive, type scenario
[13:58] <Azelphur> could probably get away with it doing something funky with symlinks tbh, haha
[13:59] <popey> er, okay
[13:59] <popey> why do you want to lose data?
[13:59] <Azelphur> popey: because I don't wanna fork out for 2x the drive space, and it's just tv shows which can be re-grabbed
[13:59] <Azelphur> loosing one drives worth of tv shows ain't so bad, loosing all drives worth of tv shows, bad :p
[14:00] <diddledan> I need to do some tv show downloading.. I have zero footprint in the piracy market these days
[14:00] <diddledan> I fancy watching babylon5 end-to-end again.. awesome series!
[14:01] <ali1234> popey: i dunno, you can go ask him in #norwood or #northfield or something
[14:01] <popey> norwood, that's it, I thought it was northwood
[14:01] <Azelphur> diddledan: I have a pretty cool setup, my I have a web panel where I can add TV shows and my system will auto-grab stuff as it comes out :P
[14:01] <ali1234> much like wayland, it's not usable yet and doesn't look like it will e any time soon
[14:01] <diddledan> how fast does raspberry pi encode h264 using it's super fancy co processor?
[14:02] <Azelphur> and the web service uses a recommendation engine based on what I've already watched, which is cool too
[14:02] <ali1234> (and mir too lest you think i am being biased)
[14:02] <diddledan> Azelphur: is it available for others?
[14:02] <Azelphur> diddledan: yup
[14:02] <Azelphur> I'm using flexget+trakt.tv
[14:03] <Azelphur> diddledan: http://trakt.tv/user/Azelphur/library/shows/all my library for example, :P
[14:04] <ali1234> diddledan: babylon 5 is only available in super low quality... like VHS... they threw out all the 3D models and the live show was filmed on TV cameras, not film like TNG
[14:04] <diddledan> :-(
[14:04] <diddledan> that sucks
[14:04] <ali1234> yeah but what can you do
[14:04] <diddledan> I suppose it reduced the cost when they were filming it
[14:04] <ali1234> yeah it was single camera
[14:05] <ali1234> everything about it was really cheap... if they had the footage on film it would just make the makeup look bad
[14:06] <diddledan> I was musing the other day over the transition between film and video before hi-def video - we've got like a decade of lost material where it was recorded direct to videotape where we can't improve the quality for hi-def video
[14:06] <ali1234> a decade? more like 50 years
[14:07] <diddledan> now with 4k around the corner it's only getting worse
[14:07] <ali1234> it's not the end of the world
[14:08] <ali1234> i mean if a show is good it does not matter
[14:08] <mgdm> didn't realise TNG was film
[14:08] <ali1234> it was, that's how they were able to do the HD re release recently
[14:09] <mgdm> ah yes, of course
[14:09] <lornajane> bingo!  It built :)
[14:09] <diddledan> well done, lornajane
[14:09] <diplo>  I've written my own thing like the trakt.tv thing Azelphur
[14:09] <Azelphur> o.O
[14:09] <diplo> Your list is very much like my personal one :)
[14:10] <Azelphur> nice
[14:12] <diplo> not seen under the dome though
[14:12] <diplo> Actually hadn't heard of it
[14:13] <popey> i always thought TNG was video
[14:15] <dwdorig> popey, Made by Paramount, who're a film company at heart.
[14:21] <ali1234> popey: it looks like video because it was all edited on video and then converted to PAL from that
[14:22] <ali1234> but they kept the film masters and so were able to remake it all
[14:22] <ali1234> at massive cost
[14:22] <popey> ahh
[14:22] <popey> did they recoup that from the HD releases?
[14:22] <popey> I imagine there's a fair few fans who would buy that stuff
[14:23] <davmor2> popey: I though TNG was the startrek with picard at the helm
[14:23] <popey> I didn't say it wasn't ☻
[14:24] <ali1234> no idea, but i guess they thought they would or they wouldn't have done it
[14:25] <mungbean> is it OK to have an ldif file with lots of  add: userid  lines after the usual changetype:modify etc?
[14:25] <directhex> ali1234, the worst bit is all the B5 CG was rendered interlaced
[14:25] <ali1234> haha lol
[14:25] <mungbean> don't worry, it's yes
[14:25] <dwdorig> directhex, Right, it was NTSC only and all sorts. I seem to recall the showed it slightly letterboxed on C4.
[14:26] <ali1234> interlace is great if you have an interlaced display otherwise it's a complete nightmare
[14:26] <directhex> the image quality on the main portions of B5 is actually okay, on the DVD releases. there are just occasional sections that look utterly dreadful
[14:26]  * TheOpenSourcerer is having an odd kind of day. Not seemingly able to focus on anything... Might go and mow the lawn instead.
[14:26] <directhex> typically sections with CG composited into the background
[14:26] <ali1234> yeah it's watchable... it looks like the old TNG repeats on cheap satellite channels. you wouldn't accept it from a show made today but it is watchable
[14:27] <dwdorig> It was ground-breaking for its time, though. All those NewTek video toasters and stuff.
[14:27] <dwdorig> Still tragic that the best space scenes remain in 2001, though, which didn't have any CG at all.
[14:27] <diddledan> does it still claim the title as the only space scifi that shows a toilet?
[14:28] <diddledan> b5 I mean
[14:28] <ali1234> i'm pretty sure red dwarf must have had a toilet in it at some point
[14:28] <ali1234> also i don't remember the toilet in b5
[14:28] <diddledan> you'd hope so :-p
[14:28] <popey> did HHGTTG not have a loo?
[14:28] <popey> well, they teleported from a cubicle
[14:29] <dwdorig> 2001 also had a toilet scene, I think.
[14:29] <popey> from within the ship powered by bistromathics
[14:29] <directhex> b5 felt real. real people. star trek was far too utopian to feel realistic
[14:29] <bashrc> bistromathics?
[14:29] <lornajane> bashrc: it is what it sounds like it's going to be
[14:29] <directhex> and then they say "oh, oops, it's not utopian at all" in their series set on a space station next to a jumpgate
[14:29] <directhex> erm, wormhole
[14:29] <directhex> whoops, how did i possibly make that error
[14:30] <diddledan> bashrc: bistromaths is the mathematics of how many spits the waiter is going to put in your soup today
[14:30] <diddledan> and related things
[14:30] <bashrc> :-)
[14:30] <ali1234> directhex: yeah i always say that TNG feels like propaganda and the truth is that star fleet is a lot more like the US millitary than the federation citizens know
[14:30] <popey> that is relfected in the new Star Trek
[14:30] <ali1234> ie it's a lot more like DS9 in reality
[14:31] <popey> but they put it down to one bad guy in the ranks
[14:31] <mgdm> DS9 \o/
[14:31] <dwdorig> http://davidszondy.com/future/space/zero_g_toilet.htm - 2001's toilet instructions. Actual toilet wasn't shown I think.
[14:31] <diddledan> I still haven't seen Into Darkness yet
[14:31] <directhex> b5 had its crap episodes, sure, but i think it did a great job of presenting a warts-and-all view of how much the future sucks
[14:31] <ali1234> everyone hated DS9 at the time but it is actually quite good looking back
[14:32] <bashrc> Maybe the future is like the past.  Imagine if all the oil runs out.
[14:32] <brobostigon> and avery brooks happens to be a good singer and pianist.
[14:32] <directhex> i was ambivalent about it at the time. i haven't changed my opinion since then
[14:32] <ali1234> directhex: but you are like that about everything
[14:33] <dwdorig> directhex, Firmly ambivalent, or just vaguely so?
[14:33] <diddledan> can one be vaguely ambivalent?
[14:33] <bashrc> maybe in the future there will be not so many spaceships and more horses and carts
[14:33] <directhex> ali1234, no, sometimes i hate things too
[14:33] <diddledan> isn't the whole point of ambivalence that it's somewhat vague?
[14:33] <bashrc> meh
[14:33] <directhex> 'I do not know with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones'
[14:34] <diddledan> bashrc: as long as the internet works ok, I'm happy
[14:34] <dwdorig> directhex, Churchill, wasn't it? Or am I misattributing?
[14:35] <ali1234> einstein
[14:36] <dwdorig> ali1234, I was close.
[14:36] <dwdorig> Well, close-ish. It's all relative.
[14:37] <ali1234> ha
[14:37] <diddledan> *groan*
[14:37]  * dwdorig bows
[14:44] <diplo> Anyone here use beautifulsoup module in python ?
[14:44] <Seeker`> tried it
[14:45] <diplo> much luck?
[14:45] <Seeker`> didn't seem to be able to parse the whole of the page, and silently cut off half of what I wanted to scrape
[14:45] <diplo> I can do most things so far, Trying to display anything inside of a span with a class
[14:46] <Seeker`> ended up using perl instead :P
[14:46] <diplo> :)
[14:46] <Seeker`> which is a complete mess. But it works.
[14:47] <popey> i have used beautifulsoup to scrape my online banking
[14:48] <diplo> My code sucks I guess
[14:49] <diplo> So, I have  a <span class="name"> loads of lis etc here </span>
[14:49] <diplo> And I want to retrieve from span to /span and all inside and dump it into a db
[14:49] <diplo> All I get is the first <h2> and then it stops
[14:50] <diplo> http://www.hotlines-uk.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=81685
[14:50] <diplo> If anyone has any suggestions on anything other than beautiful soup I'm all ears :)
[14:51] <BigRedS> when did hotlines start selling bikes?
[14:51] <diplo> They don't afaik
[14:51] <diplo> Supplying them ?
[14:52] <BigRedS> that looks a lot like a shop...
[14:52] <diplo> No basket though ?just RRP's
[14:52] <BigRedS> oh yeah
[14:52] <popey> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2013/06/mir-display-server-to-ship-default-in-ubuntu-13-10
[14:52] <BigRedS> slightly more OT, though, I'd not get that one
[14:53] <BigRedS> generally, full sus < £1500 is pretty poor
[14:53] <BigRedS> though I've been not really listening for about the past five years...
[14:55] <ali1234> popey: good.
[14:55] <ali1234> pity it won't work with proprietary drivers though
[14:56] <popey> yeah, fallback for those
[14:56] <ali1234> this pretty much means you'll have to choose between mir and steam. guess which one is going to win...
[14:56] <BigRedS> hah. Be amusing to see Ubuntu going from the "Your computer looks too free" prompt to explicitly not supporting closed graphics drivers :)
[14:57] <ali1234> it's the same as the situation with the first release of unity really
[14:58] <diddledan> I guess it's the only way to drive the gfx vendors to crating drivers for mir/wayland/etc.
[14:58] <ali1234> nah, they won't do it anyway
[14:58] <diddledan> it sucks because the opensource gfx drivers for my amd card cause the fan to spin stupid fast
[14:58] <ali1234> it will be at least 3 years before you see a wayland or mir driver from nvidia
[14:58] <popey> they will
[14:59] <ali1234> for desktop that is
[14:59] <ali1234> they might make drivers for phone BSPs
[14:59] <ali1234> but those aren't much use
[14:59] <bashrc> Does that mean that Mir will be incredibly slow?
[14:59] <ali1234> also they'll probably only do it for brand new cards
[14:59] <popey> no bashrc
[14:59] <ali1234> bashrc: it means it won't work at all if you have a real graphics card
[14:59] <bashrc> i.e. no 3D acceleration
[15:00] <ali1234> unless you cripple it with the open source drivers
[15:00] <bashrc> is that a feature? ;-)
[15:00] <bashrc> as exhibit A I cite Gnome Shell without 3D acceleration
[15:01] <diddledan> I read an interesting interview with raspi's eben upton in linuxformat this month - he pointed out that the graphics processor on the pi is the only non-gl backend currently available for wayland, and opengl backends suck in general because gl is evil
[15:02] <ali1234> bashrc: it's not really about 3d
[15:03] <ali1234> gnome shell doesn't use most of what a 3d card does and the stuff it does need is in the open source drivers
[15:03] <bashrc> but without 3D acceleration Gnome Shell is so slow as to be unusable
[15:03] <ali1234> when it uses the software fallback it's slow because it is now 100% software
[15:03] <ali1234> it doesn't use that mode on eg nouveau though
[15:04] <ali1234> the problem is nouveau can't run games
[15:04] <ali1234> so mir will be fast but games will be slow, crash, or just plain not work at all
[15:04] <bashrc> that might rain on the steam parade
[15:04] <ali1234> yes quite
[15:05] <ali1234> i do wonder what valve thinks about having to port all of it's games to a new driver architecture after they just finished doing it for the existing one
[15:06] <bashrc> So without the support of the graphics card suppliers Mir could be a shot in the foot for Canonical, at a time when Ubuntu seems just about to become a possible commercial gaming platform
[15:06] <diddledan> valve is going to go console-based using linux so it doesn't really matter what the desktops are using
[15:06] <diddledan> imo
[15:14] <bashrc> OTOH the games industry could just stick with 12.04 for the next 4 years, by which time anything could have happened
[15:15] <diddledan> the second coming and the heralded apocalypse?
[15:15] <bashrc> Zombies.  Alien invasions.
[15:15] <bashrc> In 4 years time netbooks might be back in fashion
[15:16] <diddledan> HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!
[15:16] <lornajane> well, we're all using tablets with keyboards ... which looks a lot like a netbook to me
[15:16] <diddledan> sorry, but, seriously?! :-p
[15:16] <bashrc> a crappy netbook
[15:16]  * BigRedS still wants a psion
[15:16] <BigRedS> all the netbooks were a bit too big for me - small enough that the keyboard is poor, but too big to go in a pocket
[15:16] <lornajane> I have a phone with a keyboard, it's very useful
[15:17] <BigRedS> I've been eyeing up a small tablet and a keyboard recently
[15:17] <bashrc> I should get one of those vintage IBM keyboards and try connecting it up to a tablet
[15:17] <lornajane> yeah I'm hanging on for more news of a new nexus 7
[15:17] <BigRedS> bashrc: I have seen a bluetoothed model M somewhere
[15:18] <BigRedS> just a ps/2->usb adaptor and a usb->bluetooth one hidden inside the case
[15:20] <diddledan> I think it's hungrytime
[15:20] <mgdm> lornajane: me too - I was about to buy a 7 before my brother told me there was a new one on the way
[15:22] <lornajane> mgdm: I'm watching for that and the s4 mini - but not sure I can afford both!
[15:22] <lornajane> my phone is on it's way out however, battery is dying and mechanically it's falling apart
[15:22] <lornajane> why nobody makes a phone with a keyboard nowadays, I really don't know
[15:22] <lornajane> I actually want a candybar with number buttons and the ability to tether :)
[15:22] <mgdm> there was one I saw the other day that I *think* ran recent android
[15:22] <mgdm> but I can't rememebr what it was
[15:23] <lornajane> mgdm: the other problem is that I can very rarely get a phone of decent spec into my pocket
[15:23] <bigcalm> Coo, couple of bi-planes just flew over head. Strange to see planes flying slowly around here
[15:23] <lornajane> ladies are really supposed to have handbags but I fail at that!
[15:23] <mgdm> heh heh
[15:25] <dwdorig> lornajane, I can cope with "big enough screen" over keyboard on a phone, but for the tablet, I use an ASUS transformer that has a real keyboard.
[15:25] <bigcalm> Why do they make lady's trouser pockets so small?
[15:26] <dwdorig> lornajane, That said, there's a bunch of slightly older US imports that have keyboards. Or you can grab a bluetooth keyboard, too.
[15:26] <lornajane> I currently have the xperia mini pro which is fabulous - but *tiny* so it's really hard to read on
[15:26] <lornajane> that said I mostly use my phone for email, so the keyboard is used a lot and I find it really useful.  Even on a table (husband has a nexus 10) I find the soft keyboards unreasonably hard to use, dunno why
[15:27] <dwdorig> lornajane, For prose typing, I find Swype good enough.
[15:27] <lornajane> dwdorig: I think I do need to learn a new input technique, yes
[15:27] <BigRedS> yeah, I've just started using a swipey keyboard and it's way better than the soft ones I've been settling for since the demise of my G1
[15:27] <dwdorig> lornajane, But only on the phone - on the tablet it's too big, I anything longer than a sentence I dock it.
[15:28]  * brobostigon likes hackers keyboard, as it has normal keys other soft keyboards dont have.
[15:28] <dwdorig> brobostigon, Yes, for SSH and code.
[15:28] <dwdorig> brobostigon, But for prose - like emails - Swype is my weapon of choice.
[15:28] <brobostigon> dwdorig: on my nexus7, i have that set as standard.
[15:29] <brobostigon> dwdorig: but yes, on smaller screens, it wouldnt be practical.
[15:30] <lornajane> I have yet to see any touch screen input faster than typing t9 on an old-style phone keypad.  And you could do that one-handed and not looking
[15:30] <lornajane> I also touch type at the computer, so that makes everything else seem crazy slow!
[15:31] <diddledan> I only pretend to touch type
[15:31] <lornajane> I'm a 90 WPM girl when I know what I want to say
[15:31] <brobostigon> you could probably use dasher on handed.
[15:31] <diddledan> I make too many mistakes for it to be valid
[15:31] <brobostigon> one*
[15:31] <dwdorig> lornajane, Swype - real Swype, not the copies - is extremely impressive. It approaches around 60 WPM when you're in the flow of things.
[15:32]  * lornajane is taking notes of things to try - probably on borrowed tablet rather than underpowered phone
[15:32] <dwdorig> lornajane, The copies are OK, mind, but tend not to do punctuation and capitalization in the same flow, so it's not quite as good.
[15:32] <lornajane> or I have a spare HTC Sensation
[15:33] <dwdorig> Of course, touch-typing on an iPad is much better, because it has the little dots on F and J to help you. ;-)
[15:34] <Gary> I love those dots
[15:35] <diddledan> o_O
[15:36] <diddledan> touchtyping on the ipad is evil because you can't rest on any of the keys without it picking up as a keypress
[15:36] <diddledan> that and you have to put the pad down on something
[15:37] <mgdm> actually, I really like the keyboard inside the lid of a Surface
[15:37] <mgdm> it's a nice idea (I've not tried the one with actual keys, but the one with a keyboard printed on is surprisingly good)
[15:37] <dwdorig> mgdm, I've not tried that - it reminded me on a ZX Spectrum when I saw it though. I take it it feels better?
[15:39] <mgdm> well, you're typing on a dead surface that doesn't react, same as an iPad, but you're not typing on the actual screen so there's more space to see what you're up to
[15:39] <mgdm> and you can prop it up properly
[15:42] <dwdorig> Right, yes, and in addition I suppose it's not very bulky.
[15:42] <mgdm> aye
[15:43] <dwdorig> I've a TF101 and TF700T, where you get additional bulk from the dock, but you get additional battery too - for me that's a great trade-off.
[17:44] <ali1234> how can i write this piece of C++11 code so that it compiles with gcc-4.6?
[17:44] <ali1234> Racer::Racer(SceneManager *mSceneMgr, int n) : Racer(mSceneMgr, n, new PilotAI(this)) {;}
[17:45] <ali1234> it doesn't work with --std=C++0x
[17:51] <ali1234> i guess i should just update the compiler
[17:56] <ali1234> xnox: any idea when we might see mingw-w64 gcc-4.7+ in debian and/or ubuntu?
[18:25] <ali1234> hmm opensuse has 4.8.1
[18:25] <ali1234> maybe i should just switch to OBS
[18:35] <directhex> https://launchpad.net/~directhex/+archive/monoxide/+packages?field.name_filter=&field.status_filter=published&field.series_filter=raring
[19:31] <Laney> grargh
[19:31] <Laney> I keep missing the GRUB timeout
[19:31] <Laney> did it like three times in a row
[19:31] <Laney> want to get to gameOS
[19:32] <popey> I am happily using GameOS™ much less these days
[19:32] <popey> Thanks to Steam™
[19:33] <MartijnVdS> So.. anyone looking for a coder? ;)
[19:33] <popey> oof.
[19:33] <popey> You looking for a job?
[19:33] <MartijnVdS> popey: they just announced plans to eliminate my team by April
[19:33] <MartijnVdS> so.. yeah
[19:33] <popey> Sounds harsh.
[19:34] <MartijnVdS> yeah, 30% of the company is being kicked out
[19:34] <popey> I mean, they could just fire you.
[19:34] <popey> elimination seems overkill (as it were)
[19:34] <popey> sorry for making light of it
[19:34] <MartijnVdS> popey: I've been making jokes all day, don't worry
[19:34]  * popey pokes MartijnVdS with a pm
[19:35] <MartijnVdS> eww
[19:35] <popey> you love it
[19:36] <MartijnVdS> popey: not in public ;)
[19:41] <BigRedS> MartijnVdS: aren't you in a weird place?
[19:41] <BigRedS> Holland or somewhere
[19:41] <MartijnVdS> BigRedS: yes, I am
[19:42] <MartijnVdS> and it's not "official" yet, they have to jump through some (law) hoops for a few weeks first
[19:43] <BigRedS> Booking.com appear to be always hiring perl types round there
[19:43] <MartijnVdS> BigRedS: they are
[19:43] <MartijnVdS> BigRedS: they're always at YAPC::EU and ::NA with a huge recruitment stand
[19:44] <BigRedS> Yeah, they turn up at London.pm stuff, too, trying to get people to emigrate
[19:44] <BigRedS> I've much booking.com branded tat :)
[19:44] <MartijnVdS> BigRedS: I have a few things as well 8-)
[19:45] <shauno> hm, is there no alternate CD anymore?  how does one force a textmode install these days?
[19:45] <MartijnVdS> shauno: www.debian.org :P
[19:45] <DJones> shauno: Minimal iso
[19:45] <DJones> !minimal
[19:45] <shauno> I was trying to avoid that because I won't be able to get my wifi up :(
[19:46] <DJones> I think the last alternate iso was 12.04
[19:46] <shauno> hm, that might be good enough, ta
[19:46] <Laney> you could use a server cd
[19:47] <shauno> the real install is throwing me into a 'low graphics mode' which doesn't actually work
[19:58] <mungbean> need to settle a dispute with my wife
[19:59] <mungbean> who has kids around 3, 3.5 in age?
[20:08] <alistair> hello is there anyway i can uninstall a package and turn it into a tarball or .deb package so i can reinstall it later if i want to?
[20:10] <BigRedS> if it was installed as a deb package it might still be knocking around in apt's cache
[20:13] <alistair> many thanks :-)
[20:13] <shauno> hm, server and alternate both fail to find the cdrom because it was booted with grub loopback
[20:14] <popey> alistair: or apt-get -d <package>  which will download only the deb
[20:15] <popey> and put it in /var/cache/apt/
[20:17] <BigRedS> yeah, if it's still in the archives
[20:18] <ali1234> is anyone on GameOS right now?
[20:19] <popey> just booting it
[20:19] <ali1234> want to test my windows build?
[20:19] <popey> fancied some portal 2
[20:19] <popey> yeah!
[20:19] <ali1234> i just had to rewrite the constructors because no delegating constructors
[20:19]  * MartijnVdS wants Portal 2 for Linux
[20:19] <popey> +1
[20:19] <ali1234> do you have an xbox or ps3 joypad?
[20:20] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: I have a PS3-shaped USB joypad
[20:20] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: also a PS3 joypad but that's linked to the PS3 ;)
[20:20] <ali1234> that isn't good enough unless it's one f the supported logitech types
[20:20] <popey> I have a USB attched gamecube one ☻
[20:20] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: it's a Logitech
[20:20] <popey> or ouya one
[20:21] <MartijnVdS> [178441.747808] logitech 0003:046D:C218.0004: Force feedback for Logitech RumblePad/Rumblepad 2 by Anssi Hannula <anssi.hannula@gmail.com>
[20:21] <MartijnVdS> seems to be at least a bit supported
[20:21] <diddledan> surely that's a rumblepad, not a joypad (I have no idea on what either are!)
[20:22] <MartijnVdS> diddledan: http://www.pcdistrict.com/modules/productcatalog/product_images/125125-logitech-rumblepad-2-2581.jpg
[20:22] <ali1234> it has to be one of these: http://hg.libsdl.org/SDL/file/c7346a060a7d/src/joystick/SDL_gamecontroller.c#l92
[20:22] <MartijnVdS> Bus 003 Device 022: ID 046d:c218 Logitech, Inc. Logitech RumblePad 2 USB
[20:22] <MartijnVdS> it has all the PS3 buttons
[20:22] <ali1234> or you have to configure your joypad in steam big picture mode and then send me the line from the config file and i patch it into SDL
[20:23] <popey> heh
[20:23] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: OK :)
[20:23] <popey> effort++
[20:23] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: which config file do I look in?>
[20:24] <ali1234> grep for the name you saved the joypad config as (it prompts you)
[20:24] <ali1234> you'll see a line like those ones ^
[20:24] <ali1234> i can't remember the exact file and my internet has gone strange
[20:25] <ali1234> anyway you don't need joypad to test...
[20:25] <ali1234> you just won't be able to drive
[20:26] <popey> ooh! http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2013/06/half-life-2-sequel-turn-stable-on-steam-for-linux
[20:27] <MartijnVdS> config.vdf:	"SDL_GamepadBind"		"030000006d04000018c2000010010000,Logitech RumblePad 2,a:b1,b:b2,y:b3,x:b0,start:b9,back:b8,leftstick:b10,rightstick:b11,leftshoulder:b4,rightshoulder:b5,dpup:h0.1,dpleft:h0.8,dpdown:h0.4,dpright:h0.2,leftx:a0,lefty:a1,rightx:a2,righty:a3,lefttrigger:b6,righttrigger:b7,"
[20:27] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: ^
[20:27] <ali1234> that was done on linux?
[20:27] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: yes
[20:28] <MartijnVdS> just now
[20:28] <ali1234> ok let me see how to patch this in to the source
[20:28] <dwdorig> This Steam conversation reminds me - has anyone got Garrys Mod working on 13.04 64-bit yet?
[20:28] <ali1234> the mappings are different on windows and linux
[20:29] <ali1234> maybe i should just read this from a file
[20:29] <MartijnVdS> dwdorig: trying now
[20:29] <MartijnVdS> dwdorig: could not load library
[20:30] <dwdorig> MartijnVdS, Right, that's what I get. I wondered if there was a solution.
[20:34] <dwdorig> MartijnVdS, I also wondered if it just hated me.
[20:34] <ali1234> actually on windows the game controllers might "just work"
[20:35] <MartijnVdS> as long as you have the 50MB driver installed
[20:36] <directhex> joysticks should just be HID
[20:36] <directhex> and the xbox 360 controller as "standard" means games basically have all the calibration data out of the box
[20:36] <MartijnVdS> directhex: sure, and printers should just speak PCL or PS ;)
[20:37] <directhex> all pads these days should be emitting 360-style mappings & calibration data, so onscreen prompts etc just line up
[20:37] <MartijnVdS> my USB pad is older though
[20:37] <directhex> e.g. logitech pads act as 360 pads
[20:37] <MartijnVdS> directhex: this one is from the PS2 era
[20:37] <MartijnVdS> so no X360-compayt
[20:37] <directhex> oh
[20:38] <MartijnVdS> G-UF13  (http://www.logitech.com/en-us/support/288)
[20:38] <directhex> monogame used to have a gui for configuring joypads. getting it removed is one of my finer moments
[20:38] <popey> heh
[20:38] <directhex> t'was closed source
[20:42] <popey> now, do i trust this random binary from some internet person
[20:43] <ali1234> well you probably should not *shrug*
[20:43] <ali1234> otoh it's only windows, you should have anything private on it anyway
[20:43] <ali1234> +n't
[20:43] <mungbean> mate of mine impounded a glow in the dark lambo outside harrods
[20:44] <mungbean> looks hideous
[20:44] <ali1234> tbh it probably won't even work
[20:44] <popey> libgcc_s_slj-1.ddll missing
[20:44] <ali1234> hmm :/
[20:45] <popey> libgcc_s_sjlj-1.dll missing rather
[20:45] <ali1234> probably in the toolchain somewhere... searching for it
[20:47] <ali1234> uploading
[20:47] <popey> ahh, mingw
[20:47] <ali1234> yeah everything is cross compiled
[20:47] <ali1234> that's why i've been moaning about ubuntu only having 4.6 all day
[20:47] <popey> there is an advert on your download page
[20:47] <ali1234> and also why i have never tested it on windows
[20:47] <ali1234> yup
[20:47] <popey> how odd
[20:47] <ali1234> i know :)
[20:48] <popey> wtf
[20:48] <ali1234> i've made £5 so far lol
[20:48] <popey> haha
[20:48] <bigcalm> Good evening peeps :)
[20:48] <popey> brilliant
[20:49] <popey> doesn't like that dll
[20:49] <ali1234> my upload is so slow :(
[20:49] <popey> oh, not finished?
[20:49] <ali1234> yeah it only just finished downloading
[20:49] <ali1234> *up
[20:50] <popey> missing libstdc++-6.dll ☻
[20:50] <ali1234> *sigh*
[20:51] <ali1234> i bet that one is huge as well
[20:56] <ali1234> popey: uploaded
[20:57] <popey> k
[20:57] <popey> Nice!
[20:57] <popey> It's like watching one of your youtube videos
[20:58] <ali1234> decent framerate then?
[20:58] <popey> yeah
[20:58] <ali1234> if all the cars drive themselves, it means your joypad is not supported by SDL's built in definitions
[20:58] <popey> solid
[20:58] <mungbean> do me a solid
[20:59] <mungbean> i've been using that phrase (ironically) a lot this week
[20:59] <popey> ☻
[20:59] <ali1234> it sounds painful
[20:59] <popey> ali1234: it stops after a while?
[21:00] <ali1234> er... yeah after all the cars complete 3 laps or die by falling off
[21:01] <ali1234> i'm surprised it even runs to be honest
[21:01] <ali1234> literally none of the libraries are supposed to be cross compiled and i had to fix all of them in many ways
[21:04] <popey> ali1234: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bSmR8h93Lsg
[21:05] <shauno> How do I configure xorg if it doesn't manage auto?
[21:05] <popey> what video card?
[21:05] <ali1234> nice one :)
[21:05] <ali1234> MartijnVdS: the linux tgz is up, pm'ing url. you should not need any of these funny dlls...
[21:07] <popey> hah
[21:08] <shauno> not entirely sure :) lspci just calls it intel 2nd generation core family integrated
[21:08] <shauno> But I think using inteldrmfb is getting in the way
[21:08] <popey> is it a mac?
[21:08] <popey> ali1234: framerate on my laptop is terrible, unsurprisingly
[21:09] <shauno> Yeah
[21:09] <ali1234> well yeah
[21:09] <popey> is it dual cards?
[21:09] <popey> intel + nvidia
[21:09] <shauno> yup, but I have the radon disabled
[21:09] <ali1234> you will need recent nvidia or ati because it is doing some complex stencil buffer shadow effects
[21:09] <shauno> radeon (sorry, phone is spelling for me)
[21:10] <popey> strange xorg should just figure it out
[21:10] <shauno> The catch is I'm trying to boot with efi, so I have to disable the amd card else it fails
[21:14] <shauno> it's not doing a bad job with the video itself, but it's not finding any input devices.  so I get to this; http://cl.ly/image/401A36260C1y
[21:14] <shauno> but can't use the keyboard/mouse to hit Okay  (but can ctrl+alt+F1 to get to a term)
[21:15] <bigcalm> Oooo. HL2 et al are no longer showing as "Beta" in Steam. I wonder how close we are to a Portal 2 release
[21:15] <MartijnVdS> bigcalm: half life 3 confirmed!
[21:16] <dwatkins> MartijnVdS: whaaaaa? :D:D:D
[21:16] <bigcalm> MartijnVdS: no wai!
[21:16] <MartijnVdS> that's the default reddit reply to steam news
[21:16] <bigcalm> HL3 or HL2 ep 3?
[21:17] <dwatkins> ah
[21:17] <MartijnVdS> bigcalm: Gabe Newell was in the Clang kickstarter video though:
[21:17] <MartijnVdS> http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/260688528/clang?ref=live
[21:17] <dwatkins> you meanie, MartijnVdS :-p
[21:17] <dwdorig> MartijnVdS, You're a cruel, heartless man.
[21:17] <MartijnVdS> ^ around 3 minutes into the video
[21:18] <MartijnVdS> Gabe hammering a red-hot crowbar "Is it ready?" "These things take time"
[21:18] <dwatkins> I like the idea that HL3 might be Linux only - unlikely, but it amuses me to think that might be the case
[21:18] <ali1234> for HL3 they should license full life consequences
[21:18] <ali1234> it's got a better story than anything valve have come up with
[21:19] <dwatkins> :A delayed game is eventually good, but a rushed game is forever bad." - Shigeru Miyamoto
[21:19] <dwatkins> s/:/"/
[21:19] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: that, AND concerned
[21:19] <ali1234> is that the webcomic?
[21:20] <ali1234> yeah :)
[21:20] <MartijnVdS> yeah, with Frohman
[21:20] <ali1234> that was pretty good too
[21:20] <dwdorig> dwatkins, Three words for you.
[21:20] <dwdorig> dwatkins, "Duke Nukem Forever"
[21:21] <dwatkins> dwdorig: precisely
[21:21] <dwatkins> one can delay too long
[21:21] <MartijnVdS> Daikatana
[21:21] <MartijnVdS> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_commercial_failures_in_video_gaming
[21:22] <ali1234> i was reading that page the other day
[21:22] <ali1234> rise of the robots is missing from it
[21:22] <dwatkins> Pac Mac was majorly hyped for the Atari 2600, but was a complete let-down, it contributed to the decline of the games industry at the time
[21:23] <popey> gosh, had never seen clang
[21:23] <dwatkins> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pac-Man_(Atari_2600)#Reception
[21:23] <MartijnVdS> popey: read Snow Crash, you'll know where he got his idea ;)
[21:23] <dwatkins> I assume Snow Crash was the inspiration for The Matrix.
[21:23] <ali1234> i don't see how clang can work without haptic feedback
[21:23] <dwatkins> ...and Second Life
[21:24] <MartijnVdS> ...and minecraft
[21:50] <bashar_> hi m8s
[21:51] <bashar_> anyone watch chil porn?
[21:52] <shauno> and I thought I was off-topic
[21:55] <dwatkins> !coc
[21:58] <xnox> ali1234: it's been a while since i was involved in any of that. ask debian maintainer, there have been uploads recently.
[21:59] <ali1234> ok, thanks
[23:13] <BigRedS> acpi
[23:13] <BigRedS> oop