shawnb | yes, I have made my own XML markup for a few apps I made - was going to use it as the way to organize my music library in a music app I want to create | 00:00 |
---|---|---|
knome | docbook definitely is something you can get a grasp in just hours | 00:00 |
shawnb | html - I play with jquery a lot as of lately | 00:00 |
knome | great - then you basically know docbook apart from the tags... but that's fine, because we have examples in the documentation ready! | 00:00 |
shawnb | awesome! =D | 00:00 |
knome | would you like to dig in some of that now, or would some other time suit you better? | 00:01 |
shawnb | another time would probably be better; I'm reading through the Xubuntu documentation and have had a couple of exams for work I took today | 00:01 |
knome | sure :) | 00:01 |
knome | when you have time for that, just join this channel again and shout for people to help you with things | 00:02 |
knome | both me and pleia2 can give you a better look at the docs at least, and most of us are familiar enough with bzr to get you started with that | 00:02 |
shawnb | that's good to know; I'm reading through the offline documentation seeing how fluid it is - I've done call center where I've worked with the most basic of people and I'm wondering what area you want to target in the documentation areas | 00:05 |
knome | as i said, we recently (for 12.10) did a complete rewrite | 00:06 |
knome | and by complete i mean... we pretty much touched almost everything | 00:06 |
knome | so what we have should be valid, but due to the same reason, it can definitely be lacking | 00:06 |
shawnb | in the 13.04 I'm reading on chapter 3, it talks about the desktop have two panels top visible and bottom hidden when not in use. I personally can see a notation that states how to access the bottom panel just in case | 00:07 |
shawnb | just in the top clip note | 00:08 |
knome | i'm not sure i follow | 00:08 |
knome | right; so you're proposing to add an information box? | 00:09 |
shawnb | it is clarified how to access it in the heading Bottom Panel but under the main heading Desktop it just mentions it - I would personally | 00:09 |
knome | sure | 00:10 |
knome | improvements like that are most welcome | 00:10 |
shawnb | symlink has no definition in the information box on the page; it just says you can symlink your backgrounds to /usr/share/xfce4/backdrops/ - better information on how to do that would be more helpful | 00:11 |
knome | (as long as we don't start saying all things twice...) | 00:11 |
knome | yep, some of the things are definitely rough | 00:11 |
knome | correct, but rough and lacking | 00:11 |
knome | otoh we might consider if we want to talk about "symlinking" in our end-user docs anyway | 00:12 |
shawnb | I'll be honest I"ve used Ubuntu and Xubuntu and variants since 4.10 came out, but I'm learning new things in this documentation as well | 00:12 |
knome | it's endless - one learns new things every day | 00:12 |
shawnb | yeah that's a bit more advanced; if a program were made to do it for you (I had one I made for that specific issue haha) users would be more inclined to use it | 00:13 |
knome | yup | 00:13 |
shawnb | or even a program to upload backgrounds to the Xubuntu system for access to all users | 00:13 |
knome | so probably just -"or symlink" there | 00:13 |
* Unit193 uses his name on IRC, mailing list, and LP. | 00:13 | |
knome | Unit193, you're cheating. | 00:13 |
Unit193 | Am I? | 00:14 |
knome | yes you are sir. | 00:14 |
bluesabre | stickers! | 01:38 |
* knome sticks one in bluesabres nose | 01:39 | |
bluesabre | lol | 01:39 |
bluesabre | took forever to go through all the backlog | 01:39 |
knome | sure | 01:40 |
bluesabre | Unit193: I am around now, but my crash was identical to the one that pleia2 had pasted yesterday | 01:40 |
Unit193 | bluesabre: Yeah, I was looking for what card you had at the time. | 01:43 |
=== ochosi_ is now known as ochosi | ||
bluesabre | Unit193: NVIDIA Corporation G98M [Quadro NVS 160M] (rev a1) | 01:50 |
Unit193 | bluesabre: Coolio, already sent to the list, but could add it to the etherpad if it'll come in handy later. | 01:55 |
bluesabre | added | 01:59 |
bluesabre | thanks Unit193 | 01:59 |
Unit193 | Heh, I was going to, but cool. | 01:59 |
Unit193 | Thanks. | 02:00 |
ochosi | bluesabre: holy moly, gtk3.10 will deprecate stock items. one more thing to keep in mind when porting something... | 02:01 |
ochosi | (in case anyone is interested in the not-too technical read: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1KCVPoYQBqMbDP11tHPpjW6uaEHrvLUmcDPqKAppCY8o/pub ) | 02:05 |
skellat | knome: Sorry, just saw that 3 hours later. The music festival board meeting that I was clerking tonight got interesting and I had to track down a band leader for us to talk to on speakerphone. Your status.u.c explanation seems sensible to me. | 02:06 |
bluesabre | ochosi: yep, that sucks | 02:23 |
bluesabre | and that means the standard is moving towards text-only buttons (though they can be packed however one chooses) | 02:23 |
Unit193 | Well, Gnome wasn't using it, so who cares. :P | 02:26 |
micahg | skellat: where was that link? | 04:19 |
=== stephan is now known as steffie | ||
=== steffie is now known as stephan | ||
=== forestpi1kie is now known as forestpiskie | ||
ochosi | bluesabre: yeah, i guess less icons to maintain for me ;) | 07:30 |
elfy | hello mikodo | 07:47 |
mikodo | elfy, Have a good sleep? | 07:47 |
elfy | I did thanks :) | 07:48 |
mikodo | elfy, I am just going off to it myself. Thanks for the meeting tip again, I enjoyed it. It was a little hard to keep up, the re-read on the UF made it all clearer | 07:49 |
elfy | irc can be if you're not used to it | 07:49 |
elfy | if you subscribe to the xub-dev m/l or even check the wiki you can see when there is a meeting and check later for the logs | 07:50 |
mikodo | Kinda scares me where Xubuntu will be having to go to with Mir looming for 14.04. I get that talking about it here is not optimum. | 07:51 |
elfy | we 'chat' in #xubuntu-offtopic - not logged there | 07:52 |
elfy | you should pop by some time :) | 07:52 |
mikodo | Oh, OK! Thx. an G'nite. | 07:52 |
elfy | mr_pouit: hi - when you've got a few free minutes can you ping me please :) | 10:15 |
mrpouit | elfy, ping | 10:16 |
mrpouit | hello there | 10:16 |
knome | LP merge 173120 done. | 14:46 |
knome | meeting minutes from yesterday are up at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Meetings | 15:06 |
ochosi | ah cool | 15:07 |
jjfrv8 | knome, thanks for the merge. Re skellat's point, should I be updating the changelog when I do these proposals? | 15:25 |
skellat | jjfrv8: Running dch -a before you commit then merge will add you easily to the changelog | 15:25 |
knome | jjfrv8, if you're comfortable with it, go ahead; if not, i'll make sure i do that | 15:26 |
knome | (done that with my push) | 15:26 |
jjfrv8 | That's a "devscripts" app that I have to install and then run that command before I do my local commit? | 15:27 |
knome | yup, running that before your commit would do it | 15:27 |
jjfrv8 | OK, I'll try that next time. | 15:28 |
knome | thanks :) | 15:28 |
jjfrv8 | knome, will the 12.04 rewrite project have a formal kickoff. There is no trunk for that yet, true? | 15:29 |
knome | yes, we will have to send some kind of call for that, and probably create a new branch | 15:29 |
jjfrv8 | Alrighty | 15:30 |
knome | jjfrv8, if you would like to get hands dirty with that already, i should talk with pleia2 today and get that done | 15:30 |
jjfrv8 | I'm working on the testcases right now but I just didn't want to miss out on the action with 12.04 :) | 15:31 |
knome | sure | 15:31 |
knome | if i'll get ahold of pleia2 today, i can go ahead with the 12.04 SRU stuff | 15:32 |
knome | (note how awesome i am in highlighting pleia2 again and again so she can't say she missed my messages?) | 15:33 |
bluesabre | pleia2 ^ | 15:41 |
knome | bluesabre, why are you ^ing pleia2? | 15:41 |
bluesabre | to help make sure she doesn't miss your messages :D | 15:42 |
knome | bluesabre, oh pleia2? | 15:42 |
bluesabre | yeah, pleia2 | 15:42 |
knome | right, that's why you were ^ing pleia2 | 15:42 |
rowboatnick | lol | 15:42 |
bluesabre | yup, thats the reason I was ^ing pleia2 | 15:42 |
knome | bluesabre, good, i hope pleia2 doesn't miss that | 15:43 |
bluesabre | I don't think pleia2 will | 15:43 |
knome | yeah, pleia2 usually doesn't miss stuff like that | 15:43 |
bluesabre | indeed, pleia2 is usually pretty reliable about getting messages left for her | 15:44 |
knome | that might be one of the reasons her nick is pleia2, maybe the first version had worse reliability | 15:45 |
bluesabre | lol | 15:46 |
pleia2 | you all suck :) | 16:02 |
* elfy has a sad :( | 16:03 | |
pleia2 | elfy: just kidding, only knome and bluesabre | 16:03 |
elfy | :p | 16:03 |
pleia2 | knome: so the plan with 12.04 is to only review the docs for accuracy (not backport the entire 12.10 rewrite), I can put out the call to do that any time | 16:03 |
elfy | bet you can't do it last week ... | 16:04 |
pleia2 | elfy: changed my mind, you suck too | 16:05 |
pleia2 | :P | 16:05 |
elfy | :D | 16:05 |
knome | pleia2, uhm, wait... | 16:05 |
knome | pleia2, we do want the new looks, don't we? | 16:05 |
pleia2 | knome: isn't that just css changes or something? | 16:05 |
knome | there was a bunch of other changes and cleanup with the new docs too | 16:06 |
knome | so tbh, i would rather go the backportish way... | 16:06 |
knome | (we can merge the appropriate, deleted-for-12.10 stuff back in) | 16:06 |
pleia2 | ah, wow, ok | 16:07 |
knome | if you want, i can do a diff on the two branches | 16:07 |
pleia2 | I think the diff will be unusable | 16:07 |
pleia2 | it's too rewritten | 16:07 |
knome | lol | 16:07 |
knome | i was thinking to see the changes outside the actual content files | 16:07 |
pleia2 | ah ok | 16:08 |
pleia2 | we should probably help the doc writers out a bit by remembering what changed between 12.04 and 12.10 | 16:08 |
pleia2 | 12.10 is when we dropped gimp and gnumeric, so we'll want people to add those pack (referencing 13.04 for that could do) | 16:09 |
knome | well that's the first task | 16:09 |
pleia2 | s/pack/back | 16:09 |
pleia2 | what else? | 16:09 |
knome | depends which way we want to go | 16:09 |
knome | i would say the new docs are much much better in fluency and all other literal stuff too | 16:09 |
knome | it would be silly to use the old docs that tell the same things worse | 16:10 |
jjfrv8 | Lot's of stuff moved from System to Settings Manager | 16:10 |
knome | that's a relatively easy change | 16:10 |
knome | just edit the entities file | 16:10 |
pleia2 | I think we pretty much ignore the current 12.04 docs | 16:11 |
pleia2 | just tell them to look at 12.10 and remove/add as needed | 16:11 |
knome | so, should either | 16:11 |
pleia2 | the 12.04 docs aren't accurate either, so not so useful | 16:11 |
knome | 1) just overwrite the precise branch (which actually doesn't exist); or | 16:11 |
knome | 2) create a new branch and work with that until it's ready and then merge with the 12.04 branch? | 16:12 |
* pleia2 vote #1 | 16:12 | |
knome | the problem is that it doesn't exist | 16:13 |
knome | we've build the precise docs off the natty branch | 16:13 |
knome | so what if i just created the precise branch and then we'd just go ahead and leave that as the precise branch, and not touch the natty (precise) branch? | 16:13 |
pleia2 | yeah | 16:14 |
knome | would be easier to diff/look at the differences, since you can just pull two branches and their trunk/main state is what you work with | 16:14 |
knome | ok, now i need to remind myself how to create a new branch | 16:14 |
pleia2 | :) | 16:15 |
knome | does it make much sense if i base off the 12.04 docs from current or 12.10? | 16:15 |
jjfrv8 | I would think from 12.10 because, as you said, the whole style changed | 16:17 |
knome | 12.10 already has the new style | 16:17 |
jjfrv8 | That's what I mean. We would use that style for 12.04 | 16:17 |
knome | so what i'm wondering if there were more changes that made it more unlike 12.04, or if most of the changes between 12.10->now were mostly grammar fixes | 16:18 |
knome | because i can't think of *too* many things we've documented change from 12.10 | 16:18 |
jjfrv8 | Yeah, I think it's mostly menu locations and titles | 16:19 |
knome | ok, then i'll just rebase from now | 16:20 |
knome | which is what i actually did already :P | 16:20 |
knome | so, | 16:31 |
knome | https://launchpad.net/xubuntu-docs/precise | 16:31 |
knome | there we go | 16:31 |
knome | pleia2, our website says "Janary" @ help/ | 16:31 |
knome | i'll go fix that and drop oneiric and lucid from the supported releases | 16:33 |
pleia2 | sometimes I make up months | 16:34 |
knome | it might have well been me that did that :P | 16:34 |
pleia2 | you too! | 16:34 |
knome | weren't you away on raring release time? | 16:34 |
pleia2 | yeah, honeymoon | 16:35 |
knome | exactly | 16:35 |
knome | can't make months up on honeymoon | 16:35 |
knome | https://launchpad.net/xubuntu-docs | 16:36 |
knome | isn't the series view wonderful? | 16:36 |
knome | only four branches to maintain! | 16:36 |
pleia2 | it looks like we have our act together! | 16:36 |
knome | yup, looks | 16:37 |
knome | pleia2, bzr branch lp:xubuntu-docs/natty-oneiric xubuntu-docs-precise | 16:38 |
knome | um, no | 16:38 |
knome | fsst | 16:38 |
knome | idiocy warning! | 16:38 |
knome | pleia2, bzr branch lp:xubuntu-docs/precise | 16:38 |
knome | pleia2, bzr branch lp:xubuntu-docs/precise xubuntu-docs-precise | 16:39 |
knome | ^ that one | 16:39 |
jjfrv8 | Gotta go. Will read the logs tonight for updates. | 16:39 |
knome | jjfrv8, we'll send an email with important information. have fun! | 16:39 |
jjfrv8 | thx | 16:40 |
pleia2 | knome: the last one? | 16:40 |
knome | oh wait | 16:40 |
knome | crap. | 16:40 |
knome | to get the old precise docs: | 16:40 |
knome | bzr branch lp:xubuntu-docs/natty-oneiric xubuntu-docs-precise-old | 16:40 |
knome | to get the new precise docs: | 16:41 |
knome | bzr branch lp:xubuntu-docs/precise xubuntu-docs-precise | 16:41 |
knome | somebody more wise with packaging could tell us what we need to do with the changelog, btw... | 16:42 |
pleia2 | since we're doing an SRU, changelog with dates from the quantal cycle is ok | 16:43 |
pleia2 | s/is/are | 16:43 |
pleia2 | ENGLISH | 16:43 |
knome | haha | 16:43 |
knome | ok, i'll let you handle that | 16:43 |
pleia2 | it's still early | 16:43 |
pleia2 | ok | 16:43 |
knome | i just pushed the initial commit to make the docs say 12.04 | 16:45 |
pleia2 | \o/ | 16:46 |
pleia2 | shall I draft a mail to the list? | 16:46 |
* pleia2 openetherpad | 16:46 | |
knome | yes please | 16:46 |
knome | and paste the link so i can mess up | 16:46 |
knome | :P | 16:46 |
pleia2 | http://etherpad.ubuntu.com/AOSmBvQEgu | 16:47 |
=== torstehu_ is now known as torstehu | ||
knome | pleia2, i think the mail is pretty good. | 17:14 |
pleia2 | ok, I'll send it out | 17:15 |
elfy | looks ok - just got it :) | 17:23 |
knome | ok, i'm off for now | 17:33 |
knome | will be back later today | 17:33 |
Noskcaj | elfy, does the XFCE4 Window Manager test really need to have the lines " <dt>Open Window Manager from Settings dialogue</dt> <dd>Window Manager opens to Style tab, theme set to default</dd>" in twice? | 21:21 |
Noskcaj | dammit elfy | 21:22 |
Unit193 | knome: http://paste.openstack.org/show/RkLw3EeQkVMhytGBflcv is a mock-up for the additional drivers tag, would look like: https://www.dropbox.com/s/leben28fa8ovgms/control.png (May need some changes, of course.) | 21:24 |
pleia2 | Noskcaj: that tone really isn't necessary here | 21:24 |
Noskcaj | pleia2, ok, it was a joke | 21:25 |
pleia2 | Noskcaj: noted, but we have a lot of new folks coming through here lately, we don't want to think that's how we interact with each other :) | 21:25 |
Noskcaj | ok | 21:26 |
knome | Unit193: i'm most open for that patch | 21:27 |
knome | wondering if we can snatch up a list of translations from some old jockey .desktop file | 21:27 |
Unit193 | knome: I whiped it up to confuse bluesabre real quick, sooo. :P | 21:28 |
knome | i see, i see (well done) | 21:28 |
bluesabre | haha | 22:15 |
bluesabre | confused I was | 22:15 |
Unit193 | Oh, and next meeting isn't on the Fridge calendar, if you wanted it there... | 22:44 |
knome | pleia2, | 22:46 |
pleia2 | knome | 22:47 |
knome | <3 | 22:47 |
knome | would you update our calendars | 22:47 |
pleia2 | I updated ours, but not fridge | 22:48 |
pleia2 | I didn't know we were doing that, since we don't meet in -meeting | 22:48 |
knome | i know the process isn't too painful, but it should be easier. :) | 22:48 |
pleia2 | the fridge meeting calendar is typically for scheduling time in #ubuntu-meeting | 22:48 |
knome | right, i was thinking we didn't do fridge before | 22:49 |
knome | do you think we should, or not? | 22:49 |
pleia2 | I don't think s | 22:49 |
pleia2 | o | 22:49 |
knome | oki | 22:49 |
knome | Unit193, ffuuu | 22:49 |
Unit193 | :3 | 22:49 |
Unit193 | I've known other teams to do it, but not making anything out of nothing. :P We don't link to our calendar, do we? | 22:50 |
knome | not too much at least | 22:50 |
pleia2 | knome: now now | 22:55 |
knome | wot? | 22:56 |
pleia2 | I was going to link it to our meetings page, but then I forgot or went to eat cookies or something | 22:56 |
knome | mmm... cookies... | 22:56 |
* skellat remains unsure of what to make of this | 22:56 | |
pleia2 | Unit193: other teams do it, then people look at the fridge and think they can't schedule their meeting, so then they complain to pleia2 that the need a -meeting-alt and then I have to open everything up on the calendar and say "no wait, don't worry, that meeting isn't in -meeting!" | 22:56 |
pleia2 | it's annoying and means I have more work :) | 22:56 |
knome | lol | 22:56 |
skellat | So pleia2 has spoken, so shall it be? | 22:57 |
pleia2 | I've been slowly weaning people off doing that | 22:57 |
knome | it shouldn't be called the fridge calendar then, it should be called the #ubuntu-meeting calendar | 22:57 |
pleia2 | "This is the official Fridge Calendar. It is used for #ubuntu-meeting" | 22:57 |
Unit193 | pleia2: Sure, and I understand the annoyance, but that should be their problem (yes, I know it's not. I'll shutup. :P ) | 22:58 |
knome | the term fridge calendar is possibly misleading to people who have a short attention span. | 22:58 |
pleia2 | I don't even know what "fridge calendar" means | 22:58 |
knome | wait, what were we talking about? | 22:58 |
Unit193 | I don't remember... | 22:58 |
pleia2 | http://fridge.ubuntu.com/calendars/fridge/ | 22:58 |
Unit193 | pleia2: Fridge, it's where all the information goes. | 22:58 |
knome | i suppose it's supposed to be an analogy of a calendar in your fridge that allows everybody in the household see shared/important events | 22:59 |
pleia2 | maybe in the 1950s | 22:59 |
knome | *to see | 22:59 |
pleia2 | :) | 22:59 |
knome | we have one! | 22:59 |
pleia2 | I think an old person made fridge | 23:00 |
knome | well, not in the fridge, but... you know | 23:00 |
pleia2 | that's because your polar bear can't use a computer | 23:00 |
knome | or on the fridge door. :P | 23:00 |
pleia2 | still needs to know what's what | 23:00 |
knome | are you calling my wife a polar bear? | 23:00 |
knome | hmm... | 23:00 |
skellat | I have a blotter calendar hanging on a nail via a yarn triangle | 23:00 |
pleia2 | knome: no, the pet one you keep in the igloo | 23:00 |
knome | my wife marks her work shifts on the calendar. easy to check if you need the information and don't have devices at your hand | 23:01 |
knome | and no syncing worries | 23:01 |
knome | it's just there | 23:01 |
knome | pleia2, ;) | 23:01 |
drc | the joys of the analog revolution | 23:01 |
knome | definitely | 23:02 |
Unit193 | So we going to have one of those creepy faces on the internet things? | 23:07 |
knome | yummy blueberry pie | 23:08 |
knome | analog pie wins digital pie | 23:08 |
drc | pie wins...period | 23:08 |
drc | time to fill the pie-hole. | 23:09 |
knome | ok, i'm off for today. more action tomorrow | 23:29 |
knome | good night! | 23:29 |
pleia2 | night knome | 23:30 |
Unit193 | Am I supposed to bump anyone/thing about that desktop file? ;P | 23:31 |
ochosi | Unit193: you could file a bugreport | 23:38 |
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