/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/07/14/#ubuntu-uk.txt

brobostigongood morning everyone,08:01
brobostigonis it possible to setup bitlbee to only allow connections from very specific ips/hostnames ?08:16
=== Hornet- is now known as Hornet
popeybrobostigon: you could firewall it with iptables10:05
brobostigoni am just looking at that possibility.10:06
popeythanks directhex ☻  just bought system shock 2 and fez10:12
=== duncan is now known as Guest11566
DJonesIf anybody has a 13.04 machine to hand, can you check the repositories to see if you have ttp://ppa.launchpad.net/gwendal-lebihan-dev/cinnamon-stable/ubuntu For some reason I've that included in mine and I can't see why, can't remember adding it as a repo, none of the software in the repo is installed and doesn't appear to be anything I would have installed12:49
penguin42I doubt it would add a ppa by itself12:52
popeyindeed12:53
popeyeither you installed it or something else added it during install12:53
popeyyou could grep /var/log/dpkg.log for mentions of cinnamon12:53
DJonesNothing there12:55
popeywell, there may be in older dpkg.logs12:55
popeyalan@deep-thought:/var/log$ ls -l dpkg* | wc -l12:55
popey1012:56
DJonesJust looking through the others, nothing in them either12:56
DJonesI'll remove it anyway12:57
popeywhere was it?12:57
popeyin /etc/apt/sources.list ?12:57
popeyor in a separate list file12:57
DJonesJust trying to work out where its coming from, its not in sources.list13:01
DJonesDoesn't show in a .list file in sources.list.d13:02
popeywhere are you seeing it then?13:05
DJonesI'm looking in Synaptic -> Settings -> Repositories13:05
DJonesUnder Other software13:05
popeyif it's enabled then it must be in /etc/apt/sources.list or somewhere in /etc/apt/sources.list.d/13:06
DJonesFound it, its been added in Insync.list13:11
DJonesI've already removed Insync, so removed it from sources13:12
DJonesI knew I hadn't conciously added a cinamon repo13:12
DJonesEngland 1 - Australia 0 yay13:23
SuperEngineerwatch out, watch; there's a SuperEngineer about ;)13:48
penguin42oh oh13:49
SuperEngineerwatch out, watch out even - idiot me13:49
SuperEngineerI hope everybody is well & happy on this wonderful day13:51
popeyHOT!13:52
* popey makes some burgers13:55
SuperEngineerturn on fans - hang wet towels - wait till later - pat self on back - cook on barbeque13:56
* penguin42 puts choc biscuits in fridge13:56
* popey switches off the pool heater. 33 degrees is warm enough I think!13:57
SuperEngineerpopey: not yet! that's only one degree above it turning into ice!14:00
* SuperEngineer can hear the reaching of C->f table from here14:01
penguin42only enough 250 degrees or so  until it gets comfortable14:02
SuperEngineerjust checked disk[s] health stats ... & then checked free space14:11
=== emmy is now known as Guest49810
SuperEngineerhealth is all cool - free space: 30gig left on Ubuntu partion, 25 on backup disk - storage partions ok14:12
SuperEngineerconclusion... Steam & Glastonbury are bad for disk space ;)14:12
SuperEngineer...but fun14:13
* SuperEngineer just watching interview on BBC Click with Humble Bundle man - nice one beeb!14:46
brobostigonyes, saw that yesterday.14:47
SuperEngineergood, huh14:47
SuperEngineer[some of us were working yesterday]14:48
SuperEngineerhmmm... why would SMPlayer be asking me which version of mplayer in use [<1.3, 1.3 >1.3] when synaptic shows it at 2.something15:35
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: but.. vlc!15:36
SuperEngineer....could understand if hadn't added it from software Centre... come on SMP - get it right boys15:37
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: time for some bug filings?15:37
SuperEngineerI have a long vid I want the  last "played up to" position remembered... to me that read, need SMP15:37
SuperEngineerMartijnVdS: methinks you might be right15:38
SuperEngineer...& if only bugs = wish listas, dear VLC please add.... ;)15:40
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: what do you need in vlc?15:41
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: Not just click file, play music/video, done?15:41
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: or a playlist?15:41
SuperEngineerMartijnVdS: the abilty to remember last "played up to point" & to carry on next time from there15:41
SuperEngineer[the only reason I downloaded SMP15:42
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: http://trac.videolan.org/vlc/ticket/531515:42
* SuperEngineer opens link15:42
SuperEngineer...& sees he's not the only one with that wish15:44
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: .. nice weekend volunteer project? ;)15:44
SuperEngineerif only the plugin wasn't a windows plugin - & if only it was in the official build15:45
SuperEngineerMartijnVdS: :-)15:45
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: make it an all-platform enhancement in the VLC codebase :)15:45
SuperEngineerhmmmm....15:46
SuperEngineer[p.s apart from that slight defect... VLC! wow!15:46
MartijnVdSyeah it can play ALL the things15:47
SuperEngineeryup - I had a 1 track music vid from a while back.... nothing would play it...15:48
SuperEngineerVLC would15:48
MartijnVdSit can also play from DLNA shares15:48
SuperEngineerit can probably play as yet uninvented formats I reckon!15:49
penguin42by sending the codecs backwards in a time machine?15:49
MartijnVdSpenguin42: yes15:50
SuperEngineer...now you are pointing the finger ;)15:50
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: you and your TARDIS15:50
SuperEngineerI learnt to do without a TARDIS ever since The Dr. stole mine! - now I have learnt to travel without one15:51
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: DeLorean driver then?15:51
SuperEngineerMartijnVdS: lol15:52
SuperEngineer[mine is cleverly disguised as Skoda... noone will guess!]15:52
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: that'll never hit 99mph though15:53
moreati88 mph15:53
MartijnVdSuh yes15:53
MartijnVdS8815:53
SuperEngineerMartijnVdS: you sure about that?  mine does15:53
MartijnVdSmoreati: still won't hit that speed :)15:53
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: and it's a Skoda? Are you really sure?15:54
SuperEngineer...unless any police on channel atm in which case - 28mph is all it can do!!!15:54
SuperEngineerMartijnVdS: GPS verified at 98 - with a bit of spare actually15:54
SuperEngineerno - I did *not* say GP{S verified!!!! - that invalidates insurance15:55
SuperEngineerso 28mph max it is then15:55
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: well, maybe you verified it in Germany, on the Autobahn15:56
SuperEngineerMartijnVdS: yes - I am 100% sure... & yes, of course... how forgetful of me. Of course that's were I verified it!15:57
* penguin42 had assumed it was in the local Super market car park15:57
SuperEngineerit just looked so similar to a certain m'way I use, easy mistake to make ;)15:57
SuperEngineerpenguin42: no - I leave those for doughnutting idiuots15:58
SuperEngineer*idiotsa15:58
* penguin42 assumes that isn't related to the sweet bread like confection15:59
SuperEngineerpenguin42: please tell me your not a doughnutting idiot16:00
SuperEngineerpleeeeeeeese16:00
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: what if he's a doughnutting smart guy 8-)16:00
SuperEngineerMartijnVdS: then that's cool - he will be doing it his own time - not the public16:01
penguin42SuperEngineer: Well only if they're chocolate coated - preferably with some extra chocolate sprinkles16:02
SuperEngineerPendulum: stop making me feel hungry! it's too hot for that sort of treat16:04
penguin42yes, more ice cream weather16:04
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: you need a "Broeders" ;)16:04
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: http://www.vandestreek-bier.nl/en/our-beer/16:04
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: ask AlanBell how it tastes ;)16:04
AlanBellnom16:05
SuperEngineer...with choccy prinkles, choccy flake, choccy sauce..... & a dribble of raspberry just for interest16:05
MartijnVdSAlanBell: have you tried a Dark Roast yet?16:05
AlanBellnot yet, just the one pale ale16:06
penguin42 'be surplrised' !16:09
MartijnVdSpenguin42: typos -> info@vandestreek-bier.nl16:10
* penguin42 must try making chocolate sorbet - there is an ice cream place near here that sells it and it's *gorgeous*16:15
SuperEngineerMartijnVdS: just seen the "Broeders" bit - like the organic bit but wheart beer & I don't usually get on too well16:17
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: it's only 30% wheat16:18
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: also, it's "clear", not cloudy like Weizen16:18
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: but there's always Dark Roast ;)16:19
SuperEngineerMartijnVdS: hmm.... know - *that* doesa make it appealing16:19
SuperEngineer[Dark Roast - as in chocolate malt? - no sprinles I hope!]16:20
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: nah, "coffee stout"16:20
SuperEngineerMartijnVdS: I will try to find some16:21
SuperEngineer[locaaly that is]16:21
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: where in the UK are you? :)16:21
SuperEngineerMartijnVdS: Gloucestershire16:21
penguin42SuperEngineer: http://youtu.be/XEEU1nQeGNA?t=32s   reminds me of16:22
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: it's going to be hard to find local Dutch brews there ;)16:22
SuperEngineerMartijnVdS: but I travel a fair bit for work [ 1,000 miles/week in bad times]16:22
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: but my brother is going to drive aroud the UK in is VW van in a few weeks, if you shoot him a mail he might bring you sime16:22
MartijnVdSsome*16:22
penguin42MartijnVdS: Heck he might miss our summer16:22
* SuperEngineer likes that idea16:22
MartijnVdSpenguin42: he's already having summer in the Netherlands, I think he's going to the UK to see English weather16:23
SuperEngineerMartijnVdS: Marti"Vds", "vandestreek" beer - do I detct a family connection there?16:26
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: they're my brothers :)16:26
SuperEngineerMartijnVdS: wow!16:27
SuperEngineerso emailing would be ok?16:27
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: just mail info@vandestreek-bier or use the contact form, saying you'd like some beer if he's in the area16:28
SuperEngineerMarti said you are to bring to me crates of free beer!16:28
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: +.nl somewhere in there16:28
MartijnVdSಠ_ಠ16:28
SuperEngineer:D16:28
penguin42MartijnVdS: I guess it's a hard life having to test beer for your brothers16:28
MartijnVdSpenguin42: yeah, horrible16:28
shaunoI hope your siblings are nothing like mine.  I'm not sure I'd trust their freebies ;)16:29
MartijnVdSpenguin42: they make special edition beers for family birthdays and everything16:29
SuperEngineerMartijnVdS: I made a celebration once - now it's on sale in supermarkets! that was not my intention16:29
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: your celebration is on sale?16:30
MartijnVdShow does that even work? ;)16:30
SuperEngineer[it proved so popular with press & guests ... I dare not allow it to be a one-off as intended16:31
SuperEngineerMartijnVdS: ....Exmoor Gold16:31
SuperEngineer..& the first to append or prefix "Gold" to a beer name16:32
shaunoo_O16:32
SuperEngineer[seemed better than Exmoor[brew number] as original called]  ;)16:32
shaunohm, I quite regularly drink a beer called golden something that's a good 50 years going.  I'd consider it a wild claim that you were the first to go there ;)16:34
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: yeah, my brothers first used numbers for their brews as well16:35
penguin42shauno: So good you can't remember the full title?16:35
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: they still do for their research brews16:35
shaunopenguin42: more that I'm unsure of the translation, it's Zlatý Bažant16:35
SuperEngineerwe didn't actually use brew numbers - the standardd beer was Exmoor Ale - this was a one off for reaching a milestone...16:36
penguin42shauno: Golden Pheasant according to Google16:36
shaunothat'd explain why I'm not familiar with the second word :)16:36
MartijnVdSwell v/f sounds become "b" in lots of other languages16:37
MartijnVdSand "fazant" should give a hint that it's like pheasant ;)16:37
SuperEngineerbut to sell commercially a number was not a good idea - so I [as brewer, and therfore witha good say in the matter] put forward exmoor Gold as name to keep to brand name16:37
MartijnVdS(actually, that's the Dutch name of the bird ;))16:37
shaunoheh, I see your logic in retrospect.  although the B really is a B16:38
SuperEngineerand shauno if that is correct - I swallow my pride - & change to "name of modern era beers"16:38
MartijnVdSshauno: in Spanish, things written with a "v" tend to be pronounced with a "b" instead16:39
HoT|2fC^iPadlo MartijnVdS :-)16:40
HoT|2fC^iPadIs there a Server version of ubuntu?16:40
MartijnVdSthere is16:40
MartijnVdSit's called, surprisingly, "Ubuntu Server"16:40
MartijnVdSyou can find the installation ISOs in the same place as the desktop ISOs16:41
SuperEngineer...& if anyone is wondering - I have my original test brews in a case at home - signed HMCE.16:41
HoT|2fC^iPadAh nice I might install it on a ol Dell desktop I have using a Intel Cel D :D16:41
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: that's cool :)16:41
SuperEngineerI call it my "ritirement policy" ;:16:41
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: you should really email my brothers then, as a beer guru ;)16:41
SuperEngineerMartijnVdS: the idea gets more & more interesting16:42
HoT|2fC^iPadOk thanks :-) currently on a train so cant do it yet lol.16:42
SuperEngineerMartijnVdS: if the bros are r***** &s****** I've found an email address16:47
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: they are, just use info@vandestreek-bier.nl though16:48
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: that goes to both16:48
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: and into the correct folder in their mail apps ;)16:48
SuperEngineerMartijnVdS: cool - will do16:48
SuperEngineercelebration time folks - just regained use of headphones [plugged in front of pc socket] back16:58
MartijnVdS\m/16:58
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: something to listen to: http://open.spotify.com/album/79pZVE4kIdBwRwP27Fw1yJ16:59
SuperEngineerMartijnVdS: "To enjoy Spotify, please install Adobe Flash. It's free." - not in my browser!. but thanks anyway17:01
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: you can jsut install the .deb instead, of spotify17:02
MartijnVdShttps://www.spotify.com/nl/download/previews/17:02
MartijnVdSthat's Dutch.. wait a minute17:02
MartijnVdShttps://www.spotify.com/en/download/previews/17:02
SuperEngineer[I have flash installed - I can "release" it on most pages if reallly needed - but Spotify wanmts to go try all on it's on!  No!17:02
SuperEngineertrying that last link17:03
SuperEngineerMarti would that be an advert supported version by any chance?17:09
SuperEngineerMartijnVdS:  would that be an advert supported version by any chance?17:09
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: by default it's ad-supported, you can buy a subscription to get rid of the ads17:09
* MartijnVdS 's ISP pays for the subscription though \o/17:09
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: let me find a better way to stream for you17:10
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: http://grooveshark.com/#!/album/Lysandre/842309117:10
* SuperEngineer opens that link... feels better about that one!!! cheers17:15
SuperEngineerhmmm - it had a problem opening flash - yup, that would be because it didn't ask for permission [snigger]17:17
* SuperEngineer punches chest with fists - Tarzan stylie!17:17
SuperEngineer& knows he wins17:18
penguin42anyone know how pkgcofnig is supposed to work when cross building with debs?17:35
MartijnVdSpenguin42: you should probably ask the raspbian guys17:36
MartijnVdSpenguin42: they cross-built (build?) a lot of their archive17:37
MartijnVdSSheffield is on fire: http://i.imgur.com/qJYiv51.jpg17:37
penguin42MartijnVdS: Was a pretty big fire in Manchester yesterday, I see Sheffield is always late....17:38
MartijnVdS8-)17:38
* SuperEngineer currently watching glastonbury performance from Alabama Shakes - she is mostly motionless - except for the mouth - & wow!!17:42
MartijnVdSAlabama Shakes are great :)17:42
SuperEngineer+117:42
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: you should see Ed Harcourt as well17:43
SuperEngineerMartijnVdS: will go hunt17:45
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: it's on iplayer17:46
SuperEngineer[what I thought was a Rolloing Stones only vid is actually an extended full-on "Best Of" - wiondered why it was so large ;)17:47
SuperEngineerMartijnVdS: downloaded via get- [then remanmed and moved and backed up - no expire]!17:47
* SuperEngineer slaps wrist17:48
SuperEngineer[sorry about typos - hard to type when so distracted by that voice!]17:49
MartijnVdShm.. MOT day tomorrow :|17:51
MartijnVdS(well APK, but that's the same thing but Dutch)17:51
SuperEngineerquick self tyres, washers, lights and dashborad indicators check time - saves a fortune [but you know that already]17:58
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: yeah, it's service time as well17:59
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: so they're going to do some basic fixes first :)17:59
MartijnVdSI hope the adventure with the curb near popey's house didn't break anything other than my tyre18:00
SuperEngineerMartijnVdS: get them to check the boot as well -there mightr still be popey chickens in it!18:04
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: it's a SMART, it doesn't have much of a boot18:04
SuperEngineerMartijnVdS: lol18:04
MartijnVdSSuperEngineer: https://plus.google.com/photos/100189567362844794281/albums/5877491002319853233/5877491010391899122?pid=5877491010391899122&oid=10018956736284479428118:04
SuperEngineerjust checked it - no damage - tell them it's a "pass"18:05
MartijnVdS\o/18:05
popeySuperEngineer: no chickens here18:25
* SuperEngineer hums "ain't nobody here but us chickens"18:25
SuperEngineer...& invents next podcast title at same same!!!18:30
popeyWe have a pattern for podcast titles18:34
SuperEngineerdarn18:37
AlanBellUbuntu Run18:37
popeythat wont fit either18:42
AlanBelltrue, Chicken Ubuntu then18:43
popey18:44
penguin42is that like Chicken Kiev?18:44
MartijnVdSpenguin42: is that like Chicken Chernobyl?18:45
penguin42MartijnVdS: Similar, but you can get it served cold18:46
MartijnVdStop gear o'clock18:58
brobostigonnew top gear, bbc2.18:59
brobostigon:)18:59
MartijnVdSand hunt vs lauda after that18:59
brobostigongibralter airport,19:01
brobostigondamn, nope.19:01
MartijnVdSbrobostigon: pissing of the Spanish by calling Gibraltar "Here in Britain"19:01
MartijnVdSoff19:02
brobostigonlol19:02
penguin42sigh I hate libtool19:06
MartijnVdSthat's ok, it hates you back19:09
MartijnVdSin fact, it hates everyone19:09
penguin42nod19:11
popeynot seen any of this season of top gear19:37
popeyor the previous season, despite having a ticket to go to the studio audience.19:37
popeyTop gear jumped the shark about 3 seasons or so back19:37
* penguin42 hasn't watched it in a while, but there again I'm not a car penguin19:39
shaunoI'm not really a car person, but I am basically an overgrown 12yo.  apparently their core audience19:40
AlanBellI have recorded it for later watching19:40
AlanBellbut yeah, it probably is time for a change of format/change of presenters19:41
popeyi enjoy the Drive youtube channel much more19:41
popeyhttp://www.youtube.com/user/drive19:41
MartijnVdSpopey: does it have POWAAAAR19:43
popeymeh19:43
popeyits fun, more entertaining than the rather formulaeic top gear19:43
AlanBellcontains more car19:43
AlanBelland less "last of the summer wine"19:44
popeymuch less ego19:44
AlanBellheh, a comparison that has been made before :) http://www.newsbiscuit.com/2011/04/08/top-gear-producers-angrily-deny-any-resemblance-to-last-of-the-summer-wine/19:45
mungbeani find cars boring, which is why i enjoy topgear19:50
brobostigoni find the idioticism funny, almost like i am expecting boris johnson to appear.19:52
popeyi like old cars, but don't really care about cars I'll never have any chance to own19:52
* popey has the holy grail going on his other screen19:52
mungbeanrecords the returned for another night19:53
mungbeanand switches off telly19:53
ali1234"loosely car-based sitcom" HAHAHA20:04
hcfdIf you were going to deploy Ubuntu on 50 school desktops, tomorrow, would you choose 10.04 or 12.04?20:05
ali123412.0420:06
hcfdSupport/upgrade issues aside, still 12.04?20:07
hcfdThe reason I have some doubts is that I have found 12.04 to be much flakier.20:07
ali1234yes20:07
ali1234that is easily fixed20:07
ali1234simply don't use unity or compiz20:07
hcfdWhat's the quickest way back to Gnome 2.x?20:08
ali1234sudo apt-get install gnome-session-fallback20:08
hcfdMagic. Thank you ali1234 :)20:08
ali1234this will stop working soon though20:09
ali1234but hopefully by then consort-session or mate-session will be a reasonable replacement (they currently aren't unfortunately)20:09
hcfdCase in point: I am installing 12.04.2 LTS VM at the minute, and I'm running the first batch of updates, which fail, because one dependency requires 2.0 but 2.2 is installed. *sigh*20:09
penguin42hcfd: That's odd - what package?20:10
hcfdFor my own system I have 10.04.4 and I've chopped and changed various bits as I go, but for a fresh deployment I'd like to use 12.04 if I could make it more reliable.20:11
hcfdpenguin42, just a sec...20:11
penguin42a clean 12.04.2 should just work; are you adding any PPAs or the like?20:11
ali1234should...20:11
hcfdDepends: python-minimal (= 2.7.3-0ubuntu2) but 2.7.3-0ubuntu2.2 is installed20:12
ali1234that's a bug20:12
hcfdThis is a clean and full-auto/default install20:12
hcfdYes.20:12
ali1234someone typod the debian/control20:12
ali1234what package has that dependency?20:12
hcfdpython20:12
ali1234whut20:13
ali1234python depends on python minimal?20:13
hcfdheh20:13
ali1234i suppose that makes sense20:13
hcfdThat's what it's trying to tell me, yep.20:13
ali1234!info python precise20:13
lubotu3python (source: python-defaults): interactive high-level object-oriented language (default version). In component main, is important. Version 2.7.3-0ubuntu2.2 (precise), package size 162 kB, installed size 658 kB20:13
hcfdAnd now Update Manager has closed unexpectedly.20:13
ali1234!info python-minimal precise20:13
lubotu3python-minimal (source: python-defaults): minimal subset of the Python language (default version). In component main, is required. Version 2.7.3-0ubuntu2.2 (precise), package size 28 kB, installed size 159 kB20:13
brobostigon!info testing20:13
lubotu3Package testing does not exist in quantal20:13
hcfdI should still risk pain and suffering for 12.04?20:13
brobostigon!info python testing20:14
lubotu3python (source: python-defaults): interactive high-level object-oriented language (default version). In component main, is standard. Version 2.7.5-2 (testing), package size 173 kB, installed size 553 kB20:14
brobostigon!info python3 testing20:14
lubotu3python3 (source: python3-defaults): interactive high-level object-oriented language (default python3 version). In component main, is optional. Version 3.2.3-7 (testing), package size 42 kB, installed size 216 kB20:14
brobostigoni personally, would either go with *buntu lts or debian stable for such applications.20:15
ali1234hcfd: did you apt-get update before updating?20:15
hcfdWell this *is* Ubuntu 12.04 LTS20:15
hcfdali1234, yes20:15
ali12342.7.3-0ubuntu2 appears to be the version from the initial release20:15
ali1234anyway, you're not going to have any better luck with 10.0420:16
popeyhcfd: 12.04.2?20:16
hcfdpopey, yes20:16
ali1234the older releases tend to slowly fall apart even when they are still officially supposed to be maintained20:16
popeythis is a cleanly installed system which you're running update manager on?20:16
hcfdali1234, except my experience over the last 3 years has been good with 10.04.20:16
ali1234yeah well it will be if you are constantly updating it20:17
hcfdpopey, yes. It's the 64bit version on the latest VirtualBox atop of Windows 7, but that's by-the-by.20:17
popeyI'll try and reproduce it20:17
ali123410.04 LTS 5 year support only applies to server stuff btw, not desktop. that's right isn't it popey? 2 or 3 years for desktop?20:17
hcfdpopey, okay, appreciated.20:17
popeyyes20:18
penguin42hcfd: That sounds like you've got half a set of updates - i.e. it's found one new python package but not the other, which mirror are you using?20:18
popeysee http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Releases20:18
hcfdpopey, I just downloaded from http://www.ubuntu.com/download/desktop and chose 12.04 LTS 64-bit20:18
ali1234really there's no way i would even consider using 10.04 for a new desktop deployment today20:18
* popey downloads20:18
popeyi installed 12.04 recently and dont recall this issue20:19
ali1234i suspect it's something to do with initial apt-get update20:19
hcfdpenguin42, could be. I was idly clicking through the GUI and let it choose whatever mirror it automagically determined was best.20:19
ali1234something that you'll only ever see once per install, if you see it at all20:19
popeyit should do an apt-get update post-install20:20
ali1234there's that word again20:20
hcfd's/should/will\ hopefully'20:21
penguin42hcfd: You could try paste bin'ing the output of   apt-cache python20:21
popeyalso pastebin your /var/log/dpkg.log20:21
penguin42hcfd: I think the trick with the python packages must match - i.e. the main and the minimal20:21
hcfdSure20:21
popeyhah, just downloaded the iso20:22
popeyalready had it from last friday - oops20:22
ali1234there also that option in the installer "download updates..."20:22
popeyshows how recently I installed it20:22
popeyhcfd: did you tick "download updates while installing" or "install third-party software" in the installer?20:23
hcfdBoth20:24
popeyk20:24
hcfdapt-cache: http://paste.ubuntu.com/5875288/20:26
hcfddpkg: http://paste.ubuntu.com/5875290/ (1MB)20:27
ali1234"unpacked python2.7 2.7.3-0ubuntu3.2" 3.2?20:28
hcfdo_O20:28
ali1234apt-cache says it knows about 2 and 2.220:29
ali1234but not 3.220:29
ali1234that is very strange20:29
popeyits not 3.2 though20:31
popeyit's 2.7.3..20:31
penguin42hcfd: What about apt-cache policy python20:31
penguin42actually, that's the 1st bit20:32
penguin42hcfd: What does apt-cache policy python-minimal say ?20:32
ali1234popey: 2.7.3-0ubuntu2 vs 2.7.3-0ubuntu2.2 vs 2.7.3-0ubuntu3.220:32
hcfdhttp://paste.ubuntu.com/5875313/20:32
popeysorry, thought you were implying it was python 3.220:33
penguin42hcfd: OK, so that can get a 2.2 and the main python can get a 2.2 - so hmm what's the problem?20:33
hcfdhttp://paste.ubuntu.com/5875315/20:34
hcfdpenguin42, <hcfd> Depends: python-minimal (= 2.7.3-0ubuntu2) but 2.7.3-0ubuntu2.2 is installed20:34
penguin42hcfd: Yeh, I can't see why it isn't installing python 2.7.3-0ubuntu2.2 to solve that20:35
hcfd254 updates in the queue but they won't install because ^20:35
hcfdI'm sure I can coax it to20:35
hcfdBut, fresh install.. I expect the initial updates to work20:35
penguin42nod so would I20:35
penguin42hcfd: What's the lines before the Depends: python-minimal .... - can you pastebin the full text?20:36
popeyright, precise installed20:36
* popey snapshots20:36
hcfdThanks popey20:36
hcfdpenguin42, That is the full text, with one exception: Prepend "python: " and you've got it all.20:37
popeyso what should I do, login, wait for update manager to appear?20:37
hcfdpopey, yeah, so I logged in, waited for update manager, clicked install all... If it wanted a reboot I let it, rinse, repeat20:37
popeyk20:37
penguin42hcfd: The thing I'm confused by is it seems to be possible for it to upgrade the python and it knows that, so I'm curious why it's not just updating the python as well20:38
hcfdSure20:38
hcfdShall I go ahead and see if I can coax it to proceed?20:38
penguin42give Popey a chance first20:39
hcfdNo problem20:39
penguin42hcfd: But I'd try doing an apt-get update just to make sure it has got the latest set, and then I'd try doing an apt-get install python   and see what happened20:39
hcfdAnd off it goes, 2.2 installed.20:40
hcfdIt's worth pointing out again that Update Manager crashed after it errored on unmet dependency for python.20:42
hcfdIt's proceeding fine with the other updates now.20:42
popeyright, update manager has popped up20:42
popey278 updates20:42
penguin42hcfd: do you have anything in /var/crash ?20:43
* popey runs "apt-get -s upgrade >> aptgetupgrade20:43
popeyand apt-get -s dist-upgrade >> aptgetupgrade20:43
popeyor similar20:43
hcfdpenguin42, I do indeed.20:44
penguin42hcfd: What?20:44
hcfd_usr_bin_update-manager.100.crash20:44
hcfd_usr_bin_update-manager.100.upload20:44
popeyhttp://paste.ubuntu.com/5875349/20:44
hcfd_usr_bin_update-manager.100.uploaded20:44
popeyhttp://paste.ubuntu.com/5875350/20:44
hcfd.1000. rather20:44
hcfdThe .crash is 183K20:45
* popey hits "install updates" in update manager20:45
penguin42now that .uploaded means it's been submitted to somewhere doesn't it?20:45
popeyyes20:45
popeyerrors.ubuntu.com20:45
popeyhcfd: how much ram has your vm got?20:46
popeymine has 2GB20:46
hcfdAh, just 1GB20:46
popeyjust a thought20:46
hcfdValid20:46
popeyapplying changes...20:46
penguin42hcfd: You could unpack that crash file and see the actual backtrace if you felt enthusiastic20:46
popeyor create a bug and apport-collect it into teh bug report20:47
hcfdpenguin42, if I had more time20:47
hcfdpopey, I'm waiting to see if you can reproduce it at all20:47
penguin42hcfd: Nod,  in principal if you've got an lp account then just doing   ubuntu-bug and the path to the crash file should do it all for you20:48
penguin42then we could see what you hit20:49
hcfdubuntu-bug ran at the time of the crash20:50
hcfdI should do more?20:51
hcfdForgive my ignorance20:51
penguin42ah do you have a bug number?20:52
hcfdNo, but I agree that'd be the next step20:52
hcfdLet me create the ticket20:52
penguin42hmm if ubuntu-bug ran doesn't it give you a bug number?20:52
penguin42(or does the default send that to errors.ubuntu rather than launchpad)20:52
hcfdI think it zooms to errors.ubuntu and that's that.20:53
hcfdYeah, that's all.20:53
penguin42yeh so I think you should be able to get ubuntu-bug to send it to lp if you run it like I said above20:53
penguin42hcfd: Or use apport-cli to unpack and then you can just find the python backtrace and see if there is an existing bug20:54
hcfdThis is new to me. Running ubuntu-bug with one argument (path to crash file) sends to errors.ubuntu20:55
popeyright, so first run of update manager has finished20:55
popeyit now says I need to reboot20:55
* popey does that20:55
* popey opens update manager and checks for updates post-reboot20:56
hcfdpenguin42, ah okay, so it's a duplicate of http://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/87143020:56
lubotu3Ubuntu bug 871430 in update-manager (Ubuntu) "update-manager crashed with python in _run_in_dialog(): Depends: python-minimal (= 2.7.2-7ubuntu1) \u043d\u043e 2.7.2-7ubuntu2 \u0443\u0436\u0435 \u0443\u0441\u0442\u0430\u043d\u043e\u0432\u043b\u0435\u043d" [High,Triaged]20:56
popeyno updates20:56
popeyso no, i cant reproduce it20:56
popeyI'll burn this and do it again with 1GB RAM20:57
hcfdSee link above.20:57
hcfdDuplicate of existing bug, original reporter was on 11.10..20:57
hcfdHmm.20:57
penguin42hmm 2 years old, triaged, high but failing again with a different package version on 2 years newer version odd - some type of race?20:57
popey11.1020:57
hcfdBrian Murray (brian-murray) on 2011-10-11 importance: Undecided -> High20:58
penguin42hcfd: Are you sure that's the crash as opposed to the version error - or is it really the same problem?20:58
penguin42hcfd: 32 bit or 64?20:58
hcfd6420:58
hcfdI'm certain that's the crash20:59
* popey does the same updates in update manager again but with 1GB RAM20:59
hcfdWhether the crash is related to the version error.. it's temporally proximal, but I can't assert it's related.20:59
penguin42I see lots of other bugs with people hitting python-minimal stuff on upgrades - but not fresh installs - except for that one21:00
popeyfinished okay with 1GB RAM21:02
popeysorry hcfd21:02
hcfdNo worries, great effort to reproduce. :)21:03
penguin42popey: It does look like the same bug 871430 bug though so I guess he's not just making it up to test us :-)21:03
lubotu3bug 871430 in update-manager (Ubuntu) "update-manager crashed with python in _run_in_dialog(): Depends: python-minimal (= 2.7.2-7ubuntu1) \u043d\u043e 2.7.2-7ubuntu2 \u0443\u0436\u0435 \u0443\u0441\u0442\u0430\u043d\u043e\u0432\u043b\u0435\u043d" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/87143021:03
hcfd'strue! :-)21:03
popeyhehe21:03
popeynp21:04
penguin42hcfd: I'd say report the bug with ubuntu-bug anyway if you can, explain what you did to work around it and add a comment saying it looks like 871430 and also add a comment on 871430 saying you managed to trigger it on 12.04.221:04
penguin42 <afk>21:05
hcfdConsider it done21:05
hcfdThanks guys21:05
popeynp21:07
popeyfun ☻21:07
=== emmy is now known as Guest56276
mgdmThe DSL here syncs at 8Mbit but I get 30kbytes/sec do:(21:32
mgdms/do$/down/21:32
* mgdm blames BT and their wet string21:32
moreatigive them some credit. It takes a lot of watering cans to keep string wet in this weather21:34
moreatihttp://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1604965156/ubuntu-theater-project-summer-festival-breaking-ch?ref=home_spotlight no relation AFAICT21:38
mgdmmoreati: sadly this is NW Scotland, and it's just got a bit damp up here again, just in time for me to arrive21:39
mgdm(and the backhaul to the mainland is a microwave link from Stornoway to Dingwall, which is not keen on rain)21:41

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