[00:37] <shawnb> So I'm bazaar branching the documentation of natty and precise; I'm going to be asking a few questions but I'll look through these documents first
[00:38] <Unit193> Natty?
[00:39] <knome> shawnb, don't be fooled by the command saying natty. it's called that because the precise docs are essentially natty docs with s/11.04/12.04/
[00:39] <knome> (11.10 actually, so we failed even that)
[00:40] <shawnb> yeah oneiric; I was going through the mailing list information today; so was 12.04's documentation updated at all? or is it just missing a few items?
[00:40] <shawnb> got it knome
[00:41] <knome> the branch we're working with now is copied from 13.10
[00:41] <knome> the -old branch is basically what was the documentation for 11.04
[00:42] <knome> that's purely for reference
[00:42] <shawnb> so we're trying to do 12.04.2's right? we're not working on 13.10s
[00:43] <knome> yes, we're trying to get the "precise" branch to match the situation in 12.04.2
[00:44] <knome> but we've taken the 13.10 docs branch, because that's much better than the old docs
[00:44] <shawnb> makes sense
[01:08] <shawnb> I'm reading through the new documentation (I compiled it to read through it easier); and I was wondering if we could do apt links for software we reference to automatically install things for the user like omgubuntu does
[01:09] <knome> that would be something for the development (13.10) branch, and we'd have to see how we can handle apt:-links automatically
[01:09] <knome> i don't think we're doing that currently by default
[01:09] <shawnb> apt://minitube-ubuntu - that's how omgubuntu does it off their site
[01:10] <knome> shawnb, that opens a "choose an application" window, and there isn't any applications that are handling those links
[01:10] <shawnb> odd I use chrome and it prompts me to run xdg-open
[01:11] <knome> right, that works
[01:11] <Unit193> Do you have apturl-gtk?
[01:11] <knome> firefox didn't propose that, but running 'xdg-open apt://appname' worked
[01:11] <shawnb> mine prompted to open ubuntu software centre - uh.. not sure lemme check
[01:12] <Unit193> Task: ubuntu-desktop, ubuntu-usb, edubuntu-desktop, edubuntu-usb, lubuntu-desktop, ubuntu-gnome-desktop
[01:12] <shawnb> no apturl isn't
[01:13] <knome> Unit193, i've a pretty default installation, and i've definitely installed anything that would open apt://-links, so there needs to be some magic
[01:14] <Unit193> apturl-common is installed, but doesn't help me, maybe USC is required?
[01:15] <shawnb> probably USC
[01:15] <shawnb> I'm torrenting a xubuntu 12.04.2 iso I can check and see if it works in that
[01:29] <shawnb> I can confirm in a default install of Xubuntu 12.04.2 it does prompt to launch Ubuntu Software Center when clicking on apt links
[01:30] <Unit193> Well alright.
[01:30] <knome> i mean, gweh
[01:30] <knome> sure, we could do that
[01:31] <knome> but rather than using our limited time on that, let's focus on other things which need reworking
[01:31] <knome> if we end up having time, sure, we can do that as well
[01:31] <knome> i would say we would need to test the apt://-links though.
[01:31] <knome> and that's the reason why i'm not sure about that
[01:33] <knome> shawnb, you missed at least two of my messages, let me repaste:
[01:33] <knome> 04:31  knome: i would say we would need to test the apt://-links though.
[01:33] <knome> 04:31  knome: and that's the reason why i'm not sure about that
[01:33] <knome> (yes, the timestamp is to indicate that it is 4:30am here)
[01:33] <shawnb> dang need to do my updates; my audio crashed my system - oh wow 4:30am
[01:33] <shawnb> yeah like I said in the default install it does open USC; that's a new fresh install of xubuntu 12.04.2
[01:34] <shawnb> *prompt for install via USC
[01:35] <knome> yup, but we still should smoketest that change
[01:35] <shawnb> true
[01:35] <knome> and we might be a bit too tight on time for that for the SRU
[01:35] <knome> depends so much how the rest of the stuff comes along
[01:37] <shawnb> absolutely; it'd be an idea to keep for future releases though
[01:37] <knome> yup, we can work on that for the 13.10 docs
[01:37] <knome> for those, we have a looser schedule
[01:41] <knome> woo!
[01:41] <knome> http://status.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-s/group/topic-s-flavor-xubuntu.html
[01:44] <Unit193> You renamed it.
[01:45] <knome> yeah, i was told it wasn't showing up because of that
[01:45] <knome> the topic blueprints used to be topic-raring-* though, so...
[01:48] <shawnb> knome - how would you like me to go about the documentation changes - put them in a document and mail it to the mailing list or discuss them on here?
[01:49] <knome> shawnb, the optimal way would be merge proposals
[01:49] <knome> shawnb, want me to go through that now? :)
[01:50] <shawnb> yes that would be great
[01:50] <knome> okay
[01:50] <knome> so how familiar were you with bzr?
[01:50] <shawnb> I've used it in the past to download packages like you do with git for compilation
[01:51] <shawnb> I haven't committed any changes or anything like that
[01:51] <knome> ok
[01:51] <knome> so let's assume you have branched the docs and done some changes
[01:52] <knome> then you would want to commit and push it. commit happens locally, pushing... pushes the code online
[01:52] <knome> so first, the commit:
[01:52] <knome> bzr commit
[01:52] <knome> that will open you a text editor where you should write the commit message
[01:53] <shawnb> anything specific e.g. chapter 6 where it says xyz changed line ____ to ____
[01:53] <knome> no, you don't need to be that specific
[01:53] <knome> more in the lines of:
[01:54] <shawnb> quick question, are we using the old documentation interface (natty/oneric) to update or the new one (precise)
[01:54] <knome> "Reviewed chapter 6, updated application names and removed a mention of XYZ, which doesn't exist in 12.04"
[01:54] <knome> the new one
[01:55] <shawnb> ok, thank you
[01:55] <knome> so basically, a commit message is a descriptive but brief comment about the changes you've made
[01:55] <knome> if you write a good one, we can repurpose that in the changelog, which is awesome
[01:55] <shawnb> do you commit per change or do all the changes then commit?
[01:56] <Unit193> You may want to  bzr whoami  first.
[01:56] <knome> use common sense: try to group meaningful subgroups into commits
[01:57] <knome> eg. committing every spelling error fix is bad
[01:57] <knome> otoh, totally rewriting a few sections and doing one commit is bad as well
[01:58] <shawnb> bzr whoami - Shawn Barnes <slooksterpsv@gmail.com>
[01:58] <knome> yup, that looks good
[01:58] <knome> (let's see if you also need to do other things...)
[01:58] <shawnb> sections meaning chapters or sections meaning pieces of the chapter
[01:58] <knome> anyway, once you've committed, you want to push
[01:58] <knome> sections meaning chapters :)
[01:59] <knome> as i said, just use common sense
[01:59] <knome> it's humans who review it anyway, so anything that you think is sensible bunch of changes is probably fine
[02:00] <knome> so once you've committed once or twice or how many times you need to, type:
[02:00] <knome> bzr push
[02:00] <knome> ...and forget that.
[02:00] <knome> you will need to specify a different push location, so:
[02:00] <knome> bzr push lp:~yourlpnick/xubuntu-docs/precise-branchname
[02:01] <knome> you can do a test commit/push now so we can go through it
[02:01] <knome> it can be anything, even just something silly.
[02:01] <shawnb> so bzr push lp:~slooksterpsv/xubuntu-docs/precise-????
[02:01] <knome> yup
[02:02] <shawnb> nothing where the ??? is right?
[02:02] <shawnb> or branch
[02:02] <knome> and the complete branchname could be for example precise-chapter6
[02:02] <knome> or something descriptive
[02:03] <knome> it doesn't really matter what it is - you will need to enter something
[02:03] <shawnb> ok so it'll create a branch via my name for that
[02:03] <knome> yes
[02:04] <knome> so go ahead and change something, then bzr commit and bzr push
[02:04] <knome> then we'll go through what that does and how you'd do the actual merge proposal
[02:05] <shawnb> ok I compiled the docs is that going to be a problem when I try the push?
[02:05] <knome> no, the built docs are ignored
[02:05] <knome> (there's a line in .bzrignore for that)
[02:06] <shawnb> bzr: ERROR: Not a branch: "/home/shawn/Xubuntu Community/Documentation/".
[02:07] <knome> right. you need to be in the xubuntu-docs-precise directory
[02:07] <shawnb> oh ok
[02:07] <knome> or whatever your branch directory is
[02:07] <knome> same with bzr commit and push
[02:08] <shawnb> ok so it's finding revisions and uploading
[02:08] <knome> great!
[02:08] <shawnb> oops I did push not commit
[02:08] <shawnb> commit first then push right?
[02:09] <knome> yep
[02:10] <shawnb> can I delete this branch?
[02:10] <knome> let's do the fake merge request first
[02:11] <knome> as you probably noticed, it appeared in https://code.launchpad.net/~slooksterpsv
[02:11] <knome> on https://code.launchpad.net/~slooksterpsv/xubuntu-docs/precise-testpush, you have a link that says "propose for merging"
[02:11] <knome> click that
[02:11] <shawnb> ok
[02:11] <knome> the target branch for the precise docs is: lp:xubuntu-docs/precise
[02:11] <knome> you'll have to enter that manually
[02:12] <shawnb> ok
[02:12] <knome> (or click choose, but you'll end up writing almost as much)
[02:12] <shawnb> haha yeah
[02:12] <knome> then in the description field you can write a description of *all* the commits you did
[02:12] <knome> i would be fine if that spot mentioned which chapters you touched.
[02:13] <knome> you can leave the reviewer empty
[02:14] <shawnb> okay
[02:14] <knome> i'll catch the xubuntu merge proposals anyway, and that leaves it open for others if they have time
[02:14] <knome> then just click propose merge
[02:14] <shawnb> you want me to click propose merge now?
[02:14] <knome> (this time, add knome as the reviewer, and click propose merge now)
[02:14] <shawnb> *do you - wow I can't type today;
[02:14] <knome> (so we won't email other people)
[02:15] <shawnb> any extra commit messages or that
[02:15] <knome> nope, you can always leave the advanced stuff as they are
[02:16] <shawnb> alrighty; now can I delete the merge and branch lol
[02:16] <knome> great, so now https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-doc/xubuntu-docs/precise tells me there are 2 branches proposed
[02:16] <knome> and your merge proposal is at: https://code.launchpad.net/~slooksterpsv/xubuntu-docs/precise-testpush/+merge/174595
[02:16] <knome> that page will show everybody the diff
[02:17] <knome> (nothing in this case, since you didn't change anything
[02:17] <shawnb> oh ok
[02:17] <knome> and the fantastic thing
[02:17] <knome> after we've reviewed that, it's super easy to merge into the actual documentation
[02:17] <knome> so by doing the merge request, you help us merging things in the docs
[02:18] <knome> rather than sending documents where we need to see what's changed etc
[02:18] <shawnb> awesome; that makes it a lot easier than I thought it would be
[02:18] <knome> with MP's, everything is in the docbook format so we don't need to copypaste anything
[02:18] <knome> (and you can *now* delete the branch :))
[02:18] <shawnb> that's awesome
[02:18] <knome> (i just deleted the MP)
[02:19] <shawnb> awesome I delete the branch
[02:19] <knome> great
[02:19] <knome> so now you know how to do a merge proposal
[02:19] <knome> before you start working on anything,
[02:19] <shawnb> yay I'm excited that's awesome
[02:20] <knome> you might want to email the mailing list telling you're working on X
[02:20] <knome> to cooperate and make sure nobody else is doing the same
[02:20] <shawnb> ok I'll start small for now till I get the hang of things
[02:20] <knome> but other than that, there's no limits
[02:20] <knome> the documentation should have pretty good examples of all docbook markup you might need
[02:20] <knome> so just look at the other files
[02:21] <shawnb> yeah I was looking through a lot of it earlier today and its just like you said xml
[02:21] <knome> if you think you need something that's not done yet - think again - and if you still insist - ask other first :)
[02:21] <knome> *others
[02:21] <knome> i pretty much used docbook to its limits
[02:21] <knome> so it's possible there just isn't a better way to do something
[02:22] <knome> if you end up needing to add chapters
[02:23] <knome> you can just follow the example in the index file and before committing, run 'bzr add .' (which adds all new files into your branch)
[02:23] <knome> ...or you can ask me to lay the groundwork for you
[02:31] <knome> does that all make sense to you or would you like to ask something?
[04:02] <knome> huhu, Unit193 reconnecting
[04:03] <Unit193> Figured I'd do so since things are slow, and it was bugging me. :P  I've been checking the blueprints, and only thing I can see that I could technically do is review of docs (again.) :/
[04:04] <knome> is there something else you could do if somebody helped you with it?
[04:04] <knome> also, there are testcases, which are not exactly documentation...
[04:05] <knome> and what about helping out with the flyer content? (i know, that's boring writing too...)
[04:06] <knome> and i don't think it's mentioned on the blueprints
[04:07] <knome> tbh, we don't have too many things in there
[04:07] <knome> if you filed those bugs i've said "file and let's get them sorted", please link them to -development blueprint
[04:20] <Unit193> I had thought they were wiki'd, but can't find it.  Some are already looked at, and jockey was part of it.  I'm supposed to be tracking libdvdcss-{pgk,installer}, and nothing new there for a while now.
[04:20] <knome> mhm
[04:20] <Unit193> (Also did some grepping.)
[04:20] <knome> what about the popup menu thingy?
[04:20] <Unit193> Oh, wasn't thinking that one, was more a RFC. :P
[04:23] <knome> start thinking
[04:23] <Unit193> As in, if at least one other person thinks it's a good idea I could try a merge proposal.
[04:23] <knome> you've done well with speaking up (and in correct channels too), now time to start using more of the brain ;)
[04:24] <Unit193> Hah, well just need to make sure it's not a hair brain idea.  Checking about pulling an older jockey.desktop file too.
[04:25] <knome> ah, yes, that one too
[04:30] <Unit193> Natty didn't do translations, so it'd seem? http://paste.openstack.org/show/Atyf2PvRuhHTd1wSRNc8/
[04:30] <knome> hmm.
[04:31] <knome> apparently not
[04:31] <Unit193> http://pastebin.com/hqRBUCK7 from updated natty.
[04:32] <Unit193> xubuntu-icon-theme still carries the icon, BTW.
[04:32] <knome> right
[04:33] <Unit193> And on another note: https://bugs.launchpad.net/mir/+bugs?field.tag=entering-saucy we need to prep anything for that?
[04:33] <knome> umpf
[04:33] <knome> no idea
[06:08] <shawnb> thank you knome - I'll start working on this asap; I had a family thing come up due to having a viewing and funeral in the next 2 days so that's why I disappeared
[06:11] <knome> shawnb, no problem
[06:11] <knome> all the best with those
[06:12] <pleia2> knome: saturday is my day off :) (I was out all day, will be back in my AM)
[06:12] <knome> pleia2, no problemo
[06:12] <knome> pleia2, didn't remember you had such things, you used to work all days like a mad one :P
[06:13] <knome> pleia2, good night!
[06:13]  * pleia2 has been trying to take 1 per week ;)
[06:14] <pleia2> gian1: btw, the only invite I have on deviantart is from 2 days ago and it has expired
[06:15] <knome> tabfail
[06:15] <pleia2> haha, oops
[06:15] <knome> and yeah, i fully support people taking days off and other breaks
[06:15] <pleia2> I am too tired
[06:15] <pleia2> gridcube isn't here
[06:15] <knome> YOU?
[06:15] <pleia2> gian1: sorry :)
[06:15] <knome> it's 9am+
[06:15] <knome> and i haven't slept for a minute
[06:15] <pleia2> crazy person
[06:16] <knome> i just had breakfast and now there's some coffee
[06:16] <pleia2> hehe
[06:16] <knome> i usually do a few allnighters per year
[06:16] <knome> planned or unplanned..
[06:17] <pleia2> my brain turns to mush when I don't sleep
[06:17] <knome> i've been filling crosswords and stuff like that :P
[06:17] <pleia2> :)
[06:17] <knome> so apparently mine behaves the other way
[06:17] <pleia2> alright, sleepies time for me
[06:17] <pleia2> good luck ;)
[06:17] <knome> nighty night!
[06:59] <Noskcaj> Can someone have a look at the new xfce4-indicator-plugin's patches? i think the patch is unnecessary
[07:00] <knome> which patch
[07:08] <Noskcaj> debian/patches/migrate-xfcerc-xfconf.patch: Handle the blacklist migration to Xfconf.
[07:08] <Noskcaj> either unnecessary or broken
[07:11] <knome> morning elfy 
[07:12] <elfy> hi knome 
[07:13] <elfy> no good tellin Unit193 to talk to forestpiskie - he has Unit193 on /ignore or did I mean /what? 
[07:14] <knome> heh
[07:16] <elfy> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-lincolnshire-23296285
[07:16] <elfy> about 40 seconds in - that'd be noisy ... 
[07:18] <knome> huhu
[07:20] <elfy> d'oh thought this was the offtopic channel ...
[07:23] <Noskcaj> knome, the conflict (and the area the patch affects) is at http://paste.ubuntu.com/5873350/ and t
[07:32] <Noskcaj> elfy, i can't help but feel the first two tests in XFCEDisplay are slightly redundant
[07:33] <elfy> open and close ones? I feel the same - but we need to test it works I guess
[07:33] <elfy> we're supposed to be testing it - not testing what we think we should be testing
[07:34] <elfy> I feel that the parole one shouldn't rely on someone having an active internet connection
[07:35] <Noskcaj> Not the open/close per-se, more the fact that after that, you explicitly tests opening it
[07:35] <Noskcaj> And near the very bottom, you seem to have repeated part
[07:36] <elfy> just comment on it - I'm not looking at it or pretty much anything at all today :)
[07:36] <Noskcaj> I agree that parole should need a connection, but we have no sample media
[07:36] <Noskcaj> I'll fix it and merge, it's mostly just removing a few redundant/repeated parts
[07:37] <elfy> don't do that - just comment - I'll fix it tomorrow 
[07:37] <elfy> Noskcaj: don't merge it either - I need to practise that - comment and I'll fix when it's approved I'll do the merge
[07:38] <Noskcaj> oh, you have merge rights now?
[07:38] <elfy> have had for ages - just never done it - I'm wanting to keep on top of our tests so I know where we are 
[07:43] <Noskcaj> I've reviewed it, back to pretending i understand package merging
[07:44] <elfy> k
[07:44] <elfy> I'll sort it out tomorrow
[17:15] <pleia2> hm, still no gridcube
[17:23] <elfy> interwebs aren't fun sometimes :(
[19:55] <Unit193> knome: No idea if I did the translations thing right, and guessing not: https://code.launchpad.net/~unit193/+junk/xubuntu-default-settings
[19:56] <Unit193> (http://paste.openstack.org/show/1JO21NRVd2QISpbuWSrW/)
[19:57] <Unit193> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~xubuntu-dev/xubuntu-default-settings/trunk/revision/408 using that as a base.
[23:18] <Noskcaj> Is anyone willing to help merge the latest xfce4-indicator-plugin?