[00:00] <brousch> old laptop
[00:01] <brousch> I don't see a practical use for that thing
[00:52] <jrwren> $45 beagle bone black runs full ubuntu
[00:52] <jrwren> only $10 more than rpi typeb
[12:15] <brousch> hehe http://www.frompythonimportpodcast.com/2013/07/30/not-quite-dead-yet
[12:27] <snap-l> Yeah, Mike was mentioning he wanted to get the podcast back underway
[12:31] <brousch> I bugged him about it Friday night when we were hanging out in the lounge
[12:32] <rick_h> yea, he tried to get some bits going but doesn't have permission to the server he had hoped
[12:39] <rick_h> jrwren: what's the 'irrational dislike' thing? It comes across as part joke part confusion
[12:40] <snap-l> jrwren: I have a 12 step program for overcoming irrational dislike
[12:40] <snap-l> 1: Watch Fox news
[12:41] <snap-l> 2: Dremel out your prefrontal cortex
[12:42] <snap-l> 3-12: ...
[12:43] <snap-l> Congratulations! You have overcome your fear of irrational dislike.
[12:44]  * snap-l is going to try the DEF CON Radio Music for Hacking channel on Soma.fm
[12:46] <snap-l> Also: I like big banks and I cannot lie
[12:46] <snap-l> Those fees I can't deny
[12:50] <rick_h> ouch http://missingm.co/2013/07/identical-droplets-in-the-digitalocean-regenerate-your-ubuntu-ssh-host-keys-now/
[12:51] <rick_h> as D/O came up at pyohio
[12:52] <snap-l> Nice.
[12:52] <snap-l> Sounds like something that the good guys are just finding out about and the bad guys knew all along
[12:55] <brousch> Dangit
[12:56] <brousch> We moved the Grand Rapids Localwiki to DO a month or two ago
[12:56] <rick_h> update those keys!
[12:56] <snap-l> brousch: Congratulations.
[12:56] <snap-l> This is also awesome for shared hosting. :)
[12:57] <snap-l> And passing around virtualbox / vagrant images
[12:57] <snap-l> Wonder if it also affects LXC containers.
[12:58] <rick_h> it was specific to the ubuntu images DO used
[12:58] <snap-l> Right, but I'm curious how many images are out there that don't regen keys
[12:59] <snap-l> ie: on init regen fingerprint / server keys
[12:59] <jrwren> irrational dislike... becasue... wel... i have no idea.
[12:59] <jrwren> its confusion I suppose.
[12:59] <snap-l> seems a shortcut that some might not know they're taking
[13:00] <jrwren> sometimes i feel like my dislike of certain things is not rational. then i remember that it probably is rational and when it isn't shared by others its becuase htey are irrational or have vastly different experience than me.
[13:00] <snap-l> jrwren: I think part of it is folks don't know any better
[13:01] <snap-l> ie: my dislike of Windows having come from Linux / Macintosh
[13:01] <jrwren> it was actually quicken loans which inspired the two tweets. I just used other things which i also disliek
[13:02] <snap-l> It's OK to dislike Quicken Loans
[13:02] <snap-l> their advertising really turned me off back in the day.
[13:02] <jrwren> I think I need reminding that bad company can still do good things.
[13:02] <brousch> I have an immediate dislike of them because I have Quicken and Quickbooks
[13:02] <snap-l> It's also like my dislike of Focus Hope and other "charitable orgs" in Detroit
[13:02] <brousch> I hate, not have
[13:03] <snap-l> There's money to be made in prolonging the problem
[13:03] <jrwren> quicken loans has zero affiliation with quicken software
[13:03] <brousch> But it has the same name
[13:04] <brousch> It's an example of an irrational dislike
[13:04] <jrwren> yes, there is a stupid aquisition spinoff story around that.
[13:04] <jrwren> so this is a nice story: http://keithelder.net/2013/07/29/meet-quicken-loans-intern-waleed-johnson-future-mayor-of-detroit/
[13:04] <jrwren> and it reminds me that i like their approach to building everything themselves. they don't buy off hte shelf solutions.
[13:05] <jrwren> adn I think that is cool, but htey are so koolaide oriented, and their sales team is more aggressive than any used car salesmen I've met.
[13:06] <snap-l> jrwren: Compuware is another one
[13:06] <snap-l> They're building amazing things in Detroit
[13:07] <snap-l> but their consulting arm and software leave a bit to be desired
[13:07] <rick_h> jrwren: meh, I say run with it. What's it matter in the end? You're a creature of your history and if you don't use quicken loans how is your life significantly changed?
[13:08] <jrwren> its not.
[13:08] <jrwren> I think you are right. it is all good.
[13:08] <jrwren> some occasional self doubt is healthy. I'll move on.
[13:08] <rick_h> seems to me you're wasting more time/worry about having irriational feelings than it's worth
[13:08] <jrwren> rick_h: right on. i'm moving on.
[13:09] <snap-l> Heh
[13:09] <rick_h> jrwren: all good, hate on, that's my motto :)
[13:09] <jrwren> haters gonna hate.
[13:09] <jrwren> don't hate the hater, hate the hatee
[13:09] <jrwren> on that note... anyone seen http://www.datomic.com/ ?
[13:09] <jrwren> i'm thinking it is snake oil :)
[13:10] <rick_h> http://www.datomic.com/uploads/3/5/9/7/3597326/6646785_orig.jpg scares me
[13:10] <rick_h> 'so where did my query go bad?'
[13:10] <jrwren> a lot of things about it scare me.
[13:10] <jrwren> a trusted person told me it is awesome.
[13:11] <rick_h> everything is awesome for some use case I guess
[13:11] <jrwren> i read a bit, and I htink it is interesting, and see so many points where I would not do it that way :)
[13:11] <jrwren> great point.
[13:11] <snap-l> Their overview reads like a requirements document that came from offshore
[13:12] <snap-l> Wow this gets expensive quick.
[13:13] <snap-l> Is Datomic just for JVM languages?
[13:13] <snap-l> At the moment, yes. We have ideas for how to enable Datomic on non-JVM languages while preserving as much of the embedded power as possible. Stay tuned for future developments.
[13:16] <rick_h> ugh, chromecast is coming on the slow boat from china. Shipping notice two days ago, today UPS says it'll show up on monday.
[13:16] <rick_h> laptops from china ship faster than this
[13:17] <snap-l> Patience grasshopper.
[13:17] <snap-l> That's two days before you were previously promised.
[13:28] <jrwren> yeah, I think datomic might be a great idea, but i wish it were open source ;)
[13:29] <jrwren> i'm watching this presentation for it, it is not bad.
[13:29] <jrwren> http://oredev.org/2012/sessions/exploring-datomic-a-database-deconstructed
[13:29] <jrwren> some of the design decisions I really like.
[17:46] <rick_h> :( http://blog.canonical.com/2013/07/30/ubuntu-forums-are-back-up-and-a-post-mortem/
[17:46] <rick_h> and salted and hashed (using md5) passwords for 1.82 million users
[17:47] <brousch> What took you so long?
[17:47] <rick_h> ?
[17:47] <rick_h> what took me what so long?
[17:48] <greg-g> where "you" == "Canonical"
[17:48] <brousch> Right
[17:59] <rick_h> http://www.indiegogo.com/projects/e-inkey-dynamic-keyboard
[18:00] <rick_h> hah! so e-ink > oled
[18:00] <rick_h> man, if it was 10less I'd be tempted for a travel keyboard
[18:08] <brousch> That's kind of cool
[18:08] <brousch> But you'd have to look at your keyboard to notice it
[18:08] <brousch> rick_h: Do you look at your keyboarD?
[18:09] <rick_h> brousch: no, but what's that got to do with anything :P
[18:10] <brousch> What's the point of changing keys if you never see them?
[18:15] <brousch> What Ting device should I get? https://ting.com/devices/buy
[18:15] <jrwren> iphone
[18:16] <snap-l> brousch: JoDee likes her Galaxy Nexus
[18:16] <rick_h> the gnex is going long in the tooth though
[18:16] <snap-l> Seems to be a nice balance between good phone and OMG I paid how much?
[18:16] <rick_h> end of year I'm ditching mine. Will be tough to keep up on software for two more years
[18:16] <greg-g> gah! stupid apple keyboard design :(
[18:17] <brousch> greg-g: You misspelled stupendous again
[18:17] <snap-l> Heh
[18:18] <rick_h> either the HTC One or GS4 if you're going to hold onto it for a while
[18:18] <rick_h> but new phones coming out here in the fall :/
[18:19] <rick_h> which one will they let you get 4.3 on?
[18:19]  * greg-g kicks brousch 
[18:19] <brousch> I assume Galaxy Nexus will get 4.3
[18:19] <rick_h> I'm not sure how it gets out. It's not asop so you have to get carrier updates
[18:20] <rick_h> I won't get 4.3 on my galaxy nexus on verizon for months if at all
[18:20] <rick_h> not sure how ting/galaxy fit together
[18:20] <snap-l> I'm not sure if JoDee's Galaxy Nexus is on 4.2 yet
[18:20] <snap-l> I haven't checked honestly
[18:20] <rick_h> ugh, I did get 4.2 from verizon after about 6mo
[18:20] <snap-l> But you're getting 4.1 at least
[18:20] <brousch> Can I run CyanogenMod on my Ting device?
[18:21] <snap-l> I don't see any reason why not
[18:22] <snap-l> https://help.ting.com/home
[18:22] <snap-l> Seems to be tolerated, if not approved
[18:23] <snap-l> https://help.ting.com/entries/25040602-Unlocking-the-HTC-one-GSM
[18:24] <rick_h> does the google phone come with ting radios?
[18:24] <rick_h> per that link ^^?
[18:24] <snap-l> I don't know
[18:25] <snap-l> My assumption is because we haven't seen a Nexus 4 device it might not work.
[18:25] <brousch> S4 looks really nice
[18:25] <snap-l> https://help.ting.com/entries/23867307-Can-we-BYOD-a-Nexus-4-from-Google-Play-
[18:25] <snap-l> short answer- not yet.
[18:26] <rick_h> jcastro: how's your phone thing working out?
[18:26] <rick_h> didn't you go to ting's sister...I mean alternate on t-mobile and BYOD?
[18:28] <snap-l> brousch: Re: best phone: if I were looking to buy a new phone I'd get the Galaxy Nexus for now and then resell it to get the new hotness when Fall arrives
[18:29] <snap-l> or buy one refurbed
[18:29] <snap-l> https://ting.com/devices/used
[18:30] <snap-l> I like my Galaxy SII Epic 4G Touch Championship Edition 2 Turbo Orta
[18:30] <jcastro> rick_h: mine is simplemobile
[18:30] <jcastro> rick_h: tldr; $90 a month total for jill and I
[18:30] <rick_h> jcastro: ah right. I was thinking simple but confused with the bank
[18:30] <rick_h> BYOD and happy camper?
[18:32] <jcastro> for sure
[18:32] <jcastro> $299 BYO Nexus
[18:32] <jcastro> you don't even need the spreadsheet to figure it out
[18:33] <jcastro> however I switched before tmo's new BYOD flat plans
[18:33] <jcastro> and their new "$10 a month extra upgrade to any phone twice." thing
[18:33] <jcastro> which looks like a good deal
[18:35] <snap-l> Yeah, my only complaint about Ting is Sprint has a dead zone that is essentially my house
[18:35] <snap-l> AT&T, TMobile also had problems there
[18:35]  * rick_h wonders if any nexus devices support that t-mobile wifi calling stuff. 
[18:36] <rick_h> get around some of that at home
[18:36] <snap-l> If I face east while performing a downward dog scissor maneuver< i think I can get one extra bar of reception
[18:37] <snap-l> I've seriously considered getting an Airave, but that's $250 to work around Sprint's problem
[18:37] <rick_h> yea
[18:37] <rick_h> looks like there's apps to use with Google voice to be able to do wifi calling. might work on ting/sprint as well? https://support.t-mobile.com/thread/41526?start=0&tstart=0
[18:37] <rick_h> if you use your google voice as primary phone #
[18:37] <brousch> ahahahah, Ting can import my last 3 verizon bills into their calculator. Verizon has to love that
[18:38] <brousch> I will only save $82/mo with Ting
[18:38] <snap-l> rick_h: Hm, that's an option
[18:39] <jrwren> saving $82/mo is a lot!
[18:39] <snap-l> brousch: Only? :)

[18:40] <jcastro> that's 3.2 new nexuses you could buy a year
[18:40] <brousch> Buying 2 gnex's it comes out to about $600/yr
[18:40] <jcastro> or one awesome ubuntu edge pledge!
[18:41] <snap-l> So four bills and you'll almost have paid for the Nexus
[18:42] <brousch> Yeah. I don't see how I could not do this
[18:42] <snap-l> Plus you could get a referral code for $25 off your first device
[18:42] <jcastro> you don't even need to buy a new nexus a year
[18:42] <jcastro> because they backport new android to the previous model too
[18:43] <jcastro> so even if you go "every other nexus", which is what Jill and I do, you save the money
[18:43] <snap-l> https://z6oc11q87.ting.com/
[18:44] <snap-l> And if it doesn't work ouot, you can cancel at any time
[18:45] <brousch> Well my wife needs a phone too, so the other Nexus would be hers
[18:45] <snap-l> Yep
[18:45] <snap-l> JoDee, her dad, and I are on the same plan
[18:45] <snap-l> averages $50 a month
[18:46] <snap-l> that said, I was also having lovely connectivity issues down in Ohio
[18:46] <snap-l> 4G would start up, and then crap out
[18:46] <snap-l> I believe this is because Ohio hates me
[18:46] <snap-l> Even though I have shown it nothing but love
[18:47] <snap-l> Well, most of the time
[18:47] <brousch> I had fun in my hotel room, but mostly with wireless
[18:47] <snap-l> I did besmirch their stupid Buckeye mascott
[18:47] <brousch> I was at the nd of the hall, then turn left and at the end of the little hall
[18:47] <brousch> I had no wifi by the window, but if I sat by the door I had 3 bars
[18:48] <snap-l> Yeah, that hotel had strange wifi
[18:48] <snap-l> Made browsing in the can a real pain
[18:48] <snap-l> (TMI)
[18:50] <brousch> Hm. No SD card on the gnex
[18:51] <rick_h> no sdcard on nexus anything from what I recall
[18:51] <snap-l> No SD card on any Nexus AFAIK
[18:52] <brousch> barbaric!
[18:52] <brousch> I'll probably go with the S4
[18:52] <brousch> gnex for the wife
[18:54] <snap-l> ++
[18:55] <brousch> snap-l: What's your referal code?
[18:55] <snap-l> https://z6oc11q87.ting.com/
[18:56]  * snap-l should make a bitly short link for that. :)
[18:56] <rick_h> it'll be just as long :P
[18:56] <snap-l> Yeah, but then I could call it "TingCraig" or something
[18:57] <snap-l> SomeTingForCraig
[19:00] <brousch> I used yours instead of Linux Action Show's
[19:07] <brousch> I ended up getting the SIII
[19:11] <snap-l> I really appreciate it
[19:11] <snap-l> Thanks!
[19:23] <snap-l> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/9058804/writers%20block.jpg
[19:25] <brousch> You deserve it. You were the first person I heard it from
[19:32] <snap-l> Hopefully you won't want to smack me nex titme we see each other. :)
[19:33] <brousch> Well we have a year for the rage to build
[19:33] <brousch> Crap. I forgot the Stardock game t-shirts
[19:37] <snap-l> Ah, no worries
[19:37] <snap-l> if you want to drop them into a priority mail box, I'll pay shipping