[00:00] wallyworld: bigjools needs gwacls updated on the bot ? [00:00] * bigjools needs gwacl updating on there so I can land a dependent core branch [00:00] i think i can. never done it. let me try [00:00] mucho grassy ass [00:07] bigjools: i can ssh into the bot machine and i've found the src tree but when i do a bzr status in the gwacl directory i get: bzr: ERROR: No such file: u'/home/tarmac/trees/src/launchpad.net/gwacl/.bzr/checkout/shelf' [00:07] nfi [00:07] can you just do a "bzr up" [00:07] seems like it's a checkout [00:08] why wouldn't bzr status work? [00:08] nfi [00:08] does bzr info work? [00:08] yes [00:09] there's a lock preventing update right now. but there's also a build running [00:09] i'll try again after the build [00:09] how often does tarmac run? [00:09] you might need to disable it temporarily [00:09] actually, it's a permission denied [00:10] O_o [00:10] because i'm logged in as ubuntu and it seems i need to be ~tarmac [00:11] and i don't know the password to su [00:11] i'll see if it's in an email somewhere [00:11] can you ssh tarmac@ ... ? [00:12] no, permission denied public key [00:12] ah well [00:12] i'll try and find a password [00:12] thanks man [00:23] bigjools: done [00:23] wallyworld: \o/ thanks [00:23] coffee++ [00:23] np. rev is 207 [00:23] yeah coffee [01:10] wallyworld: while you are in the landing bot, care to update loggo? [01:10] heads up, 1.12.0 has been released https://launchpad.net/juju-core/1.12/1.12.0 [01:10] thumper: sure [01:12] heya davecheney and thumper! [01:12] hi jcastro [01:13] jcastro: sup! [01:13] shiny 1.12! [01:14] jcastro: yeah, just doing the paperwork now [01:14] wallyworld: to deploy wordpress in a container on machine 0 I can do `juju deploy wordpress --to lxc:0` ? [01:15] wallyworld: and for a new machine "--to lxc" [01:15] thumper: supposedly :-) [01:15] ? [01:15] wallyworld: I'll try [01:15] my eyes are funny [01:15] the --to lxc doesn't work i don't think [01:15] I think it is lack of oxygen or something [01:15] I deployed an entire wordpress stack to one AWS node today, it was glorious [01:15] jcastro: yeah, saw the blog post [01:16] * thumper waits for scp so he can bootstrap [01:16] then I can go do something else while it boots [01:16] jcastro: do you have any test maas environments? [01:17] thumper: loggo on tarmac says no new revisions to pull [01:17] thumper: nope [01:17] wallyworld: check to see if it is a branch or checkout [01:17] wallyworld: also check revno [01:17] thumper: I do know the world wants constraints for the maas provider [01:18] wallyworld: want 39 [01:18] thumper: yep, it is [01:18] oh... ok [01:18] seems updated then [01:18] \o/ [01:18] coolio [01:19] jcastro: perhaps I should ask sabdfl for access to his maas :) [01:20] I was going to recommend that exact thing [01:20] mims is on holiday so it's probably sitting idle [01:20] https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/document/d/1eeHzbtyt_4dlKQMof-vRfplMWMrClBx32k6BFI-77MI/edit#heading=h.o3idq0wwl0yz [01:20] * thumper turns the lights on in bigjools's room [01:20] ^ nudge, please add agenda items for tonight [01:20] evilnickveitch: ping [01:21] davecheney: ack [01:21] [01:23] still can't access all hands ... [01:30] thumper: i didn't know bigjools liked it with the light on? [01:31] true, you normally turn it off for us [01:31] yep, but then i can't watch :-( [01:34] axw: do you think https://canonical.leankit.com/Boards/View/103148069/105051172 is done ? [01:35] (sorry if you don't have perms for leankit) [01:35] davecheney: looking [01:35] I do now [01:35] davecheney: it works fine for me [01:35] I have the 13.04 packaged version [01:36] never saw any of the weirdness that was logged in the LP bugs [01:36] cool, assign to yourself and move it to the RHS [01:36] okey dokey [01:36] davecheney, hi [01:37] m_3: marcoceppi: thanks for the replies. could you copy to the list also so others can see your thoughts? sorry, i should have cc'ed you to the original juju-dev email [01:37] wallyworld: yeah, just joined the juju-dev mailing list. Surprised I wasn't already on it [01:38] axw: how about this one ? https://canonical.leankit.com/Boards/View/103148069/106071705 [01:38] davecheney: no. thumper has something in the works that changes logging, so I'm holding off for now [01:38] * thumper is back [01:38] wallyworld: cc'd [01:38] thanks :-) [01:39] ok [01:39] davecheney: yeah I have a branch pending that messes with logging somewhat [01:40] thumper: ok [01:40] cool [01:41] hey, remove-unit also takes the instance down right? [01:41] davecheney: when you say move to the right, do you mean into the review column? [01:41] jcastro: yes [01:42] that's what I thought [01:42] axw: at your judgement, if it isn't reviewable, then drop it in merged [01:42] i look in that column when writing the release notes [01:42] ok [01:47] wallyworld: so... how do I deploy something into a new machine in a container [01:47] what's the syntax? [01:47] thumper: let me check. i thought you needed to use add-machine first [01:48] there was a constraint also [01:48] right [01:48] I'm hoping I can just go 'juju deploy mysql --constraints container=lxc [01:48] something like that [01:50] thumper: yes that will work [01:50] but it's not what big mark likes [01:51] :) [01:51] he prefers add-machine [01:51] to create a container [01:51] then --to to select [01:51] * thumper tries it [01:51] thumper: we haven't publicised the constraints version [01:51] because it is verboten [01:51] ok, that is starting [01:52] but the code was already committed [01:52] * thumper waits 25 minutes [01:52] I have wordpress coming up in 0/lxc/0 [01:52] and mysql in 1/lxc/0 [01:52] thumper: I see node 2 startting [01:52] yay [01:52] and we'll see if they can talk to each other [01:52] that one has a VGA cable on it :) [01:52] don't forget to add a relation [01:52] bigjools: yep, up it comes [01:53] relation added [01:53] now we wait [02:10] if anyone's bored, I would appreciate some more eyes on this: https://codereview.appspot.com/12019043/ [02:10] davecheney: I yoinked the code out of your old branch for debug-hooks [02:11] thanks [02:11] :) [02:11] thumper: it's booting locally now [02:12] \o/ [02:15] thumper: might be done [02:22] bigjools: no, it is downloading the cloud image for the container now [02:23] thumper: my interwebs don't look that busy, so I suspect not [02:23] ah... dumb bug [02:23] I saw the same bug on ec2 [02:25] bigjools: how's those interweb tubes now? [02:25] thumper: busy [02:26] I see blinkenlights [02:26] \o/ [02:26] two lots of routers, three lots of switches and a modem all looking furious with you [02:38] oh fark [02:38] * thumper stabs maas [02:38] the uniter internally dies inside the container [02:39] /var/lib/juju/MAASmachine.txt: no such file or directory [02:39] is container a verb here? :) [02:39] * thumper hacks something [02:40] * davecheney containers something [02:40] aahgg [02:40] * thumper stabs the nearest thing [02:41] * davecheney goes for lunch [02:44] poo bum [02:44] * thumper grrs [02:45] I know what that failed now [02:47] bigjools: hey [02:47] yarp [02:47] bigjools: is there a monitor attached to your maas controller? [02:47] and keyboard? [02:47] bigjools: if you hit http://10.0.0.208 what do you see? [02:47] bigjools: I'm hoping for a wordpress error page [02:47] saying no db configured [02:48] you mean the server or one of the nodes? [02:48] or something like that [02:48] bigjools: just something on the 10 net [02:48] bigjools: the server is fine [02:48] I don't, I would only ssh into the server and use wget [02:49] :( [02:49] ok [02:49] but you can do that too :) [02:50] * thumper noes [02:50] the 10. network is totally isolated for safety, I only access via ssh to the maas server [02:50] you could port forward with ssh [02:50] remember how -L works [02:51] -L localport:remotehost:remoteport [02:51] where remotehost is the IP as seen from the host you're sshing into [02:55] oh yeah... [02:56] wallyworld: definitely got a problem with the machine watcher [02:56] on new machines [02:56] wallyworld: where it is looking for containers [02:56] wallyworld: it isn't getting initial state [02:56] that bit was rewritten by william i think [02:57] :( [02:57] there was a large refactoring some weeks back [03:13] agent-state-info: 'hook failed: "config-changed"' [03:13] jpw dp O fox tjat? [03:13] hehe [03:13] how do I fix that? [03:13] that was an unintentional weird right hand shift cypher [03:44] * thumper sets up two ssh tunnels [03:44] * thumper wonders if this weird shit will work [03:44] * thumper has broken juju in a number of ways today [03:54] *sad face* [03:54] * thumper needs debug hooks [04:08] thumper: https://codereview.appspot.com/12019043/ ;) [04:08] shortly, off to make a coffee and drown my woes in caffeine [04:09] heh :) [04:21] axw: do you think debug hooks will land this week ? [04:36] axw: I have a feeling that review is going to take longer than I can actually give right now [04:36] * thumper hands it to wallyworld [04:36] * thumper writes up learnings [04:36] * wallyworld is trying to get ^#@!%^^! tests to pass [04:40] davecheney: sorry, was making lunch. not sure - still at 0 LGTMs ;) [04:41] thumper: nps [04:56] * thumper back for the meeting later === thumper is now known as thumper-afk === tasdomas_afk is now known as tasdomas [06:07] wallyworld: https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/document/d/1WpyfTgaChhmYFqPESBvfavbqLD1Fsj16NLW5PhmWxis/edit# [06:07] ^ as you've made everyone very happy with the --to flag [06:07] could you write a line or two about it [06:07] natefinch: bonjour! [06:08] davecheney: when is the release? friday? [06:09] yup [06:09] or next week [06:09] but it's been two weeks since we did one [06:09] davecheney: i have to go get my kid from school, i'll do it a bit later [06:09] wallyworld: no hurry [06:11] davecheney: --to was already released in 1.11.3 [06:11] wallyworld: really ? [06:11] did we call it out ? [06:11] yeah [06:11] i just checked the relese notes [06:11] oh well, ignore it then [06:12] ok :-) [06:12] * wallyworld drives to do school pickup [06:33] wallyworld: https://codereview.appspot.com/12232043/ [06:34] ^ won't this CL drive bigjools even more mental ? [06:34] ie, we're moving state out of the state, back to the local disk ? [06:54] davecheney: it's not state but rather configuration [06:55] stuff that was in env.yaml but will now be separate [06:55] it's as per big mark and william's design [06:55] fair enough [06:55] i'm sure they know what they are doing [06:55] let's hope so ;-) [06:55] config is a cluster fuck [06:55] yep [06:55] it' can't get any worse [06:56] yep :-) [06:56] this will make it much easier for users [06:56] it's one step of many [06:56] i'm sure it's written down [06:56] to clean up env.yaml [06:56] i just missed it [06:57] davecheney: https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/document/d/1ncsNzDHauV_9Fwsm59GjX0-O-_g48UYnObefwtBStG0/edit [06:57] that's the ticket [06:57] mornin' all [06:57] davecheney: hiya [06:57] g'day [06:57] davecheney: do you know where i can get hold of a copy of juju v1.12 ? [06:58] rogpeppe: https://launchpad.net/juju-core/1.12/1.12.0 [06:58] davecheney: does that have the dependencies too? [06:58] rogpeppe: yes [06:59] davecheney: great, thanks! [06:59] untar it, set your GOPATH to the base of the tar [06:59] go install ... [06:59] davecheney: the idea with config is that bootstrapping gives us a nugget of information that we store to the local disk (or in some other service). [06:59] davecheney: we then use that to connect back to the environment [07:00] davecheney: it's definitely a change of model, but i think it makes some kind of sense [07:00] davecheney: and we've already moved in that direction by storing the CA cert locally [07:01] rogpeppe: wallyworld not arguing with you two in anyway [07:01] but bigjools with go ape balls [07:01] that may or may not be a concern [07:01] davecheney: i'm interested in your reaction, because this is definitely a change in direction and i don't think it's been widely discussed [07:02] davecheney: and i'm interested what concerns bigjools might have too [07:02] rogpeppe: in as much as I am repeating what bigjools said, he doesn't like all the stuff we store in ~/.juju [07:02] i take no position on the matter as I have not been invovled in the design [07:03] the long term goal is to store it in the cloud, for jaas etc [07:03] it's all in the doc [07:03] davecheney: do you know why he doesn't like the stuff we store in ~/.juju ? [07:03] rogpeppe: he has more than one computer [07:03] hence the long term goal :-) [07:03] davecheney: presumably he has to replicate his environments.yaml across all his computers [07:04] and this isn't adding anything more locally [07:04] just moving the deck chairs a little [07:04] davecheney: i guess he only has to do that once though (now), for a given environment [07:04] wallyworld: actually i think this *is* adding more locally [07:04] and it will still be only once [07:04] wallyworld: it's manufacturing a control bucket [07:04] we do that *now* [07:04] with juju init [07:05] wallyworld: that's different [07:05] wallyworld: you don't need to use juju init [07:05] but most people do [07:05] wallyworld: and it's a manual editing step [07:05] i've read that documenta nd mow even more confused [07:05] sorry, whats manual? [07:05] wallyworld: and it only happens once for a given environment, no matter how many times that env is bootstrapped [07:05] wallyworld: you edit environments.yaml manually [07:05] that's all that happens with the new stuff too [07:06] it's on;y done once [07:06] no need to edit env.yaml with juju init [07:06] so long as your env variables contain creds [07:06] wallyworld: so you don't create a new .environments/xxx file every time an env is bootstrapped? [07:06] nope [07:06] just the first time [07:06] for a given environment [07:07] wallyworld: hmm, interesting. i'm not sure that's right actually, but i'll reserve judgement [07:07] so new env.yaml + local = old env yaml [07:07] so same info, just now in 2 places [07:07] env.yaml is the user facing bit [07:07] we want to make that as simple as possib;e [07:08] users don't need to edit admin secret or control bucket [07:08] that's internal juju magic [07:08] that shouldn't be exposed [07:09] wallyworld: oh, so is this CL just hiding those two config options and setting them automatically ? [07:09] you're not actually deleteing hte concept of a control bucket ? [07:09] yep [07:09] nope :-) [07:09] wallyworld: the difficulty is that now we're assuming that the control bucket we automatically generate (out of the user's control) is going to be ok to use for all time [07:09] right, objection withdrawn, i completely misunderstood what you were proposing [07:09] +1, carry on [07:09] :-) [07:10] rogpeppe: i gotta take the dog for a walk, happy to discuss later [07:10] wallyworld: enjoy! === axw_ is now known as axw [07:14] someone remind me to reboot five mins before the meeting please :) [07:14] wallyworld: I don't understand all the implications, but I was confused by those things in environments.yaml when I came across them. Wasn't sure what, if anything, I was meant to do with them. [07:29] * bigjools reads scrollback and thinks that davecheney thinks I'm an ogre [07:29] bigjools: you're not? [07:29] bigjools: :-) [07:30] I am simply impatient with fuckwittery :) [07:31] bigjools: makes you scary to all us fuckwits :-) [07:31] ha [07:31] it's probably the meds I am taking, they make me do crazy things [07:31] bigjools: i am interested in your thoughts on this direction BTW [07:32] can you summarise? I didn't read scrollback in detail [07:32] morning [07:32] bigjools: basically, we're moving towards a model where bootstrapping an environment yields a nugget of information that's later used to connect to that environment [07:32] bigjools: i was recalling your conversation when you found out how much environment specific state we stored on the client [07:33] bigjools: that will currently be stored in local disk, but later can be stored in the cloud [07:33] ah right [07:33] TOO THE CLOUD! [07:33] my thoughts are that this should be as HA as anything else [07:33] https://twitter.com/riskybusiness/status/362456762521120768 [07:33] bigjools: this makes it possible to elimininate currently manually specified attributes such as control-bucket, and possibly admin-secret and others [07:33] I know that film... [07:34] rogpeppe: +1 to config elimination [07:34] rogpeppe: it sounds like you and wallyworld are working at cross purposes [07:34] wallyworld: is just making them take sensible defaults [07:34] and you are trying to move them [07:35] bigjools: obviously we can't eliminate config *entirely* because we need cloud credentials [07:35] davecheney: i don't *think* so [07:35] well obviously, but there's some stuff that's always been unnecessary [07:36] davecheney: there's no sensible default for control-bucket, because of s3's global name space [07:36] rogpeppe: a guid is a sensible default [07:36] davecheney: sure, but then you need to store that guid somewhere [07:36] rogpeppe: hence why i say that you and wallyworld are working at cross purposes [07:37] davecheney: you may well be right [07:37] davecheney: i'm coming from my understanding of fwereade and big mark's discussions [07:37] i read that document [07:37] davecheney: which may well be critically flawed [07:37] it appears unrelated [07:38] davecheney: btw I'll let you know tomorrow about azure improvements [07:38] davecheney: search for "# write local state as follows:" in the document [07:39] davecheney: that's the related piece [07:49] wallyworld: it looks to me from https://codereview.appspot.com/12232043/diff/1/cmd/juju/bootstrap.go that the local state *is* written every time we call Bootstrap [07:53] natefinch: it's dangerous to go alone, take this https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/calendar/bWFyay5yYW1tLWNocmlzdGVuc2VuQGNhbm9uaWNhbC5jb20.mut2dk4mvoj39eq8jqni20ukoc?authuser=1 [07:54] mgz: 5 mins (or so) [07:55] davecheney: thanks [07:56] axw: ta! [08:01] fwereade: meeting? [08:02] fwereade: meeting? [08:02] wallyworld: ^^ [08:28] mramm: I'm counting on you cancelling the managers meeting in 2.5 hours :) === thumper-afk is now known as thumper [08:29] mramm: just saw the notification \o/ [08:30] thumper: cool [08:30] see you in a couple of days ;) [08:31] mramm: yep [08:31] travel safe [08:36] ok, back to bed for me. [08:36] night [08:36] fwereade, wallyworld: lost you [08:48] rogpeppe: dimitern: stupid network died again, will talk to you guys after dinner [08:48] wallyworld___: ok [08:52] ([a-z]+:)?[0-9]+(/[a-z]+/[0-9]+)* [08:53] enlightening [08:53] mgz: :-) [08:53] doesn't match [08:54] lxc:0/kvm/12 [08:54] rogpeppe, lxc:0/kvm/12 is meaningless, I think [08:54] ah I see [08:54] fwereade: orly? [08:55] rogpeppe, yeah, ignore me [08:55] rogpeppe, wallyworld___, dimitern: my internets seem to be maybe functional again [08:56] rogpeppe, wallyworld___, dimitern: so I'm back in the team meeting hangout if I'm wanted [08:56] fwereade: i'm suggesting that we should have something in the names package that understands that syntax, and knows at least how to split off the new container part [08:56] rogpeppe, still don't really think it's about names [08:57] rogpeppe: are you okay with my response to your destroy-environment comments? okay to land? [08:59] rogpeppe: dimitern: try again? [09:06] wallyworld___: i filed bug 1207230 for it [09:06] <_mup_> Bug #1207230: cmd/juju/addmachine.go might fail with unsupported container [09:07] it's not urgent, i'll take care of it today or tomorrow [09:07] dimitern: there error is that is not rejecting a machine id as an arg with a friendly message [09:07] wallyworld___: oh? [09:08] wallyworld___: isn't it supposed to accept both type:machine and machine? [09:08] the arg has to be either an container type (lxc) or a container with machine (lxc:1) [09:08] no [09:08] remember it is adding a machine [09:08] exactly, that's what i was saying [09:08] add-machine machine-id makes no sense [09:08] aaa [09:08] ok [09:09] so it should be "type:machine" or "type" only [09:09] the error is the syntax check above the split is broken [09:09] yes [09:09] yep, ok will amend the bug [09:09] thanks, sorry that i was initially unclear [09:09] i had to cast my mind back [09:11] no worries, thanks for clarifying [10:22] * fwereade back much later [10:23] rogpeppe, TheMue: https://codereview.appspot.com/12198044 - StringsWorker [10:26] good night [10:35] dimitern: you've got a review [10:35] TheMue: cheers [10:36] rogpeppe: ping [10:36] dimitern: pong [10:36] rogpeppe: can you take a look at https://codereview.appspot.com/12198044 [10:36] dimitern: will do [10:37]