ali1234use a text editor for text entry00:35
ali1234then format it in word or whatever00:36
Azelphurheh, or just use a editor that doesn't suck :P00:36
Azelphurfailure to save on crash, failure to autosave, and crashing on save, 3 counts of fail :(00:36
* Azelphur punishes it to apt-get remove :P00:36
daftykinshate to be Captain Hindsight, but i must admit if it's going to be something a fair amount of effort is going into, i tend to save pretty early :(00:38
Azelphuryea, it was supposed to be on auto save00:38
Azelphurand I didn't exactly expect it to fall over and die from a simple action such as "save" :P00:39
daftykinsdoes that really do anything prior to saving once though? i was imagining you meant you were sort of still in 'Untitled' mode00:39
Azelphurdaftykins: no, I was editing an existing document, and it's supposed to auto-save every 5 minutes00:39
daftykinsoh right00:40
Azelphurit stopped auto saving for a good hour, at least, without saying anything00:40
daftykinsthat's worse still then :(00:40
Azelphurand then crashed on save00:40
daftykinswhat you need is a good reliable system like the one i just had a fiddle with00:40
Azelphurheh, well libreoffice has crash recovery, as do most sane office suites00:40
daftykinswee laptop underneath ;)00:40
Azelphurdaftykins: lol00:40
daftykinsalso i know, i know, i don't have as many screens as you :(00:41
Azelphuris that the logitech speaker with a screen on it?00:41
daftykinsbut they are nice ones00:41
daftykinsin the middle? nah that's just the centre channel on its' little feet00:41
ali1234no, the thing witht he bright blue stripe on it to the right of the right monitor00:43
ali1234and the big dial00:43
daftykinsthat's the control unit00:43
daftykinsweirdly inputs go into there then go over what is basically a 9 pin serial cable to the amp in the subwoofer box on the floor00:44
daftykinsusing digital coaxial of late00:44
=== Lcawte is now known as Lcawte|Away
neurowell, that's my star trek deep space nine marathon finished01:19
neuroforgot how bloody good it is01:19
ali1234the other day on a whim i decided to download and rewatch wild palms01:40
ali1234for a 20 year old show it's pretty good... if anything it was ahead of it's time01:41
ali1234well, i've only watched the first episode so far...01:42
neurowow, that's going back a bit01:48
neurodon't think i ever watched it01:48
neuroholy crap, the cast looks awesome01:48
neuroah, brad dourif, everyone's favourite movie nutjob01:48
ali1234yeah and he is a good guy in it01:49
neuroIt is by the juice of sapho that thoughts acquire speed, the lips acquire stains, the stains become a warning. It is by will alone I set my mind in motion.01:49
neuroah, god bless youtube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EMBb_tPPA8E01:50
ali1234some of the things they got right: teleconference holograms, patent lawyers causing trouble01:51
neurowhat, wild palms?01:51
ali1234things they got wrong: everyone is old and wears a suit. lol01:51
neuroit's funny how many 80s and 90s scifi occasionally predicted something pretty close to what we've got now01:52
neuroonly occasionally, mind01:52
ali1234indeed. often the little things too, more than the obvious stuff too01:52
neuroand then there's scifi influencing tech; star trek has a lot to answer for!01:53
neurocrazy boffin types trying to invent anti-matter and warp speed01:53
ali1234i don't think wild palms influenced anyone... it was critically panned and forgotten01:53
neuroi'm pretty sure these are the guys who will get the planet sucked into a black hole, never mind the LHC01:53
neurobear in mind it's the kids who grew up as geeks watching scifi who turned into the engineers who have ended up building a lot of this stuff, be it hardware, software or the convergence between the two01:54
neuroso maybe some proto-engineer watched wild palms and thought "... hey!"01:54
ali1234also they have a dig at scientology before it was cool to do that01:55
neuroremember scientology has been around since the late 50s :)01:55
ali1234of course, but it wasn't really on the radar back in 199301:56
neuroyou'd be surprised01:56
ali1234most people back then probably wouldn't even have got the reference01:56
neurojust that there wasn't the same penetration of internet access to propogate it01:56
neurowell in the states, maybe01:56
neuroi've been reading a lot about it lately01:56
neurosome of the shenanigans that go on, if they can be proved, are pretty heinous01:57
neurosorry, got sucked into this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pVkVWnvmjl002:03
neuroi love these guys02:03
ali1234the lighting in that game is amazing02:06
neurolooking straight into the sun kinda sucks at times02:07
neurothey've fixed that in battlefield 4 apparently02:07
neuroi'm pretty good with the Beretta, just not quite as good as that guy :)02:07
ali1234why is there a wilhelm scream at 2:11? is that actually in the game??02:08
neurono :)02:08
neurohe added the KLONK followed by the wilhelm02:08
neurothe rest of the audio is as-is02:08
neurosounds amazing in surround02:08
ali1234yea i don't even understand how anyone knows what is going on in this game... it's just like a massive pileup of carnage02:12
neuroyou catch on quickly :)02:12
neurothere are a lot of audio and visual cues to help you out02:13
ali1234"shoot guys with orange writing on them"02:13
neurowell most of the game modes are objective based, so if that's all you did, you'd suck02:13
ali1234it's really hard to tell from these videos02:14
neurocapture/defend this area, destroy/defend that crate, CTF, etc etc02:14
neuroravic is playing Conquest in all of those clips02:14
neuroif you look at the map at bottom left, there are red and blue boxes, some of which are flashing02:15
neurobasically these are flag points on the map you need to capture02:15
neuroA, B, C, etc02:15
neuronumbers vary from map to map depending on size etc02:15
neuroif you stay within the flag area, you can capture it02:16
neuroif there are more of their guys in the area than yours, you can't capture it02:16
neuroboth teams have 'tickets', default usually about 100-20002:16
neuroevery time a player dies and respawns, that eats a ticket02:16
neuroif a team holds >50% of the flags, then the opposing team's tickets start decreasing at about 1 every 2 seconds02:17
neurofirst team to lose all their tickets, loses02:17
neurosounds complicated, but you pick it up very very quickly02:17
neuroif one of those boxes down at bottom left is flashing, someone is capturing it, reversing it from red (opfor) to blue (your team) or vice versa02:18
neurooh and if you hold a flag, you can spawn at it, rather than at your deployment at the edge of the map02:18
neuroand optionally, if you are in a squad (of up to 4), and at least one of them is alive and on the ground or in a vehicle with a spare seat, you can spawn on them too02:19
neuroi've been playing this since release in oct 2011 (and battlefield bad company 2 and battlefield 1943 before it), so i'm used to it now :)02:20
neurooh, this *does* work if you're not signed in ... http://battlelog.battlefield.com/bf3/soldier/evilneuro/stats/115000054/xbox/02:23
neuro'tis I02:23
=== Hornet- is now known as Hornet
ubcqtml/join #yrs07:18
brobostigongood morning everyone,09:05
MartijnVdS\o brobostigon09:07
brobostigonmorning MartijnVdS09:07
=== Lcawte|Away is now known as Lcawte
=== Hornet- is now known as Hornet
bigcalmGood morning peeps :)12:23
bigcalmHowdy popey12:25
bigcalmpopey: which country are you in today?12:25
popeybigcalm: home12:41
neuroi wonder if ...12:58
* neuro is listening to "Canyon Battle" by M83, Anthony Gonzalez, Joseph Trapanese, from the album Oblivion. 256kbps AAC 12:58
neuroouch, edge now nearly 11m off the pace :(13:08
neurothey basically need to repeat some of the biggest crowdfunding campaigns13:10
neuroevery day13:10
penguin42Gah, Scottish power don't seem to know how to do live updates; all their systems for doing meter entry seem to be down - both web and phone15:29
penguin42anyone used coccinelle?15:52
MartijnVdSpenguin42: what is it?16:02
penguin42MartijnVdS: It's a 'semantic patch' program - you give it a description of some C and it generates a patch to change it; e.g. if you added an extra parameter to every use of foo() you could get it to go through your code and add it, or search for a particular common type of mistake16:07
penguin42except I can't get it to take the really neat use one of the developers has just posted; it finds errors of the form           a = b,   c=d;    where the , should be a ;16:15
markie-Wow everything is exactly how i left it18:09
popeyEvening all20:09
AlanBellhi popey20:11
penguin42hey Popey20:18
daftykinshey all \o20:18
* penguin42 had better take this music player off loop - it's been doing The Eagles for a few hours20:27
AlanBellyou can check out any time you like but you can never leave20:41
AzelphurIs anyone aware of a decent, p2p encrypted chat network?21:21
Azelphurali1234: bitmessage seems more like an email deal21:30
Azelphurali1234: torchat looks pretty cool :)21:40
moreatiAzelphur: re you looking for IRC style chat rooms or IM one to one style?21:45
Azelphurmoreati: IM, IRC would be cool too though21:46
moreatifor the later there's OTR21:46
Azelphurmoreati: OTR is a bit naf, as it still lets the service owner know who you are talking to, when, and for how long21:46
moreatisupported by Pidgin I believe21:46
moreatiah, yes21:46
moreatiwould jabber over SSL have the same weakness? Would that differ if both parties were on the same/different servers?21:47
Azelphurmoreati: yea, it would have the same weakness21:47
moreatiEve could tell when you were connected certainly21:47
AzelphurI've found a few things I plan on using regularly after seeing them21:48
AzelphurBitmessage seems to be a very good secure email alternative, TorChat2 looks like it'll be a pidgin plugin really soon which will be sweet21:48
Azelphurso that gets you email & IM21:48
moreatiah, statistical analysis of packet times would show who was chatting with who21:48
shaunojabber over ssl still requires that you trust the service provider21:49
MattJJabber \o/21:50
Seeker`Jabber \o/21:50
AzelphurMattJ: jabber is getting downvoted in this conversation :P21:50
Azelphur(sorry!) :P21:50
MattJJabber/XMPP can be used via Tor, it can be completely anonymous...21:51
AzelphurMattJ: even if you use it via tor, that doesn't stop the service provider from knowing who is talking to who21:51
shaunowell, that A is talking to B.  the upshot of that method is the service provider may have no idea or A or B are21:52
MattJThough you can get quite far sometimes21:53
MattJBut at that point you run your own servers...21:53
MattJwhich can also communicate over tor :)21:53
MattJ( https://blog.thijsalkema.de/blog/2013/06/11/xmpp-federation-over-tor-hidden-services/ - by an Adium dev actually)21:54
Azelphurthat's pretty sweet21:56
Azelphurare there any public servers that implement that?21:56
MattJNone that I know of, yet21:56
MattJI know several that are already accessible as hidden services21:56
Azelphurlooks interesting :)21:58
shaunoI still find freenet interesting, but it won't (and can't) do realtime22:00
shaunoon the topic of tinfoil, I can't seem to find any vps in Iceland that aren't either unrealistically expensive, or owned by non-icelandic parent companies22:02
ali1234what's the difference between email and instant messaging?22:10
shaunomostly the client these days.  but email doesn't present any status22:12
shaunoI don't know if you're online, busy, etc.  I can't be certain an email has actually been delivered yet, let alone seen22:12
ali1234well, such things are quite hard to do in an anonymous, encrypted way22:14
shaunoI mean, if you take the linked example - jabber as a hidden service over tor.  each user maintains a connection to the jabber server.  all status ordinarily available over jabber still applies22:16
penguin42well you could encrypt the responses based on public key and only give people you know an online status22:16
ali1234because encryption isn't really enough22:22
daftykinsgot a dead disk in a simple RAID array to sort this week22:26
daftykinsgot the report at midnight Friday night that one's popped its' clogs ^_^22:26
penguin42daftykins: Now the question is will the spare last until you get the new one in?22:26
daftykinsto be honest the storage isn't even used actively now, so it wouldn't even matter if it totally failed22:27
daftykinswarranty's gone too though22:27
penguin42oh that's ok, in that case it won't fail - only critical things fail viciously22:27
daftykinsand it's a 1.5TB disk which it seems aren't even available anymore :>22:27
daftykinstoo true22:28
ali1234penguin42: because as mentioned, encryption doesn't hide who is talking to who22:30
daftykinsi wonder if, since the forum fiasco, they'll actually honour my request to have my account deleted this time22:31
daftykinsi was told they refuse to delete accounts even if you ask ¬_¬22:31
shaunohence the addition of tor; you have no idea who 'who' is22:32
penguin42ali1234: Oh I see, the problem though is that the only way of stopping spam is to be able to know who you're talking to22:32
ali1234bitmessage uses proof of work to prevent spam22:32
* penguin42 looks22:33
penguin42ali1234: Hmm that's quite neat22:35
ali1234tor doesn't provide as much security as most people think. if your connection is monitored, and the chat server connection is monitored, it doesn't really matter what path the packets take in between22:36
ali1234bitmessage + tor is probably quite effective though22:36
ali1234since there's no server and everything is broadcast22:37
Azelphurali1234: what's your opinion on torchat?22:41
ali1234never looked at it22:42
AzelphurI'm thinking that might be good22:42
Azelphurtorchat2 looks particularly cool22:42
AzelphurI'm on bitmessage now anyway, someone say hello so I can see how it works :) BM-2D94ExvKBzVRiCj81BmXrjC4rhep81jY9g22:42
ali1234not sure if my client still works22:46
Azelphurali1234: http://pastebin.com/PpF5PkTB I did this :)22:48
ali1234i'm using bashrc's ppa22:48
ali1234it has indicators22:48
ali1234oh there we go, it connected22:48
ali1234tbh i would prefer a command line client like bitcoind22:49
popeythere's an indicator with the python one from github22:50
ali1234the new version is supposed to support "chans" whatever that means22:50
ali1234oh cool, maybe he got the patch upstream?22:50
popeyguess so22:50
popeyAzelphur: sent you a test message22:50
Azelphurcool :)22:50
Azelphurhow long do they typically take to arrive?22:50
* popey shrugs22:51
popeymine looks like its processing other messages22:51
Azelphuryea, I'll probably leave mine open 24/7 to help out with processing.22:51
ali1234a couple of minutes usually22:51
ali1234the first one can take longer due to ... stuff22:51
Azelphurstuff \o/22:51
popeyso does it make sense for you to have one identity for establishing contact, publicly known?22:52
popeyand then move to other addresses per person / task?22:52
Azelphurpopey: I think so, since nobody can tell who mail is addressed to.22:52
popeyis it safe to use the first message to "switch channel" to another address mentioned in the reply?22:53
AzelphurI don't see why not22:53
ali1234it can be any less safe than just carrying on with the original channel22:53
Azelphurnobody can do anything without the private keys, I think22:53
Azelphurbitmessage needs a message received sound, that'd be handy :)22:55
popeyAzelphur: get it yet?23:00
Azelphurnope :<23:00
daftykinsmost secure messaging EVAR23:00
daftykinsnobody knows you did it! not even you23:00
AzelphurI have got 10 connections and I'm processing messages like mad23:01
ali1234it's like bitcoin - you have to catch up23:01
ali1234also i suspect it got a bit more popular in the past few days23:01
popeywill leave it running overnight i think23:02
ali1234so first "real" test of the network if you like23:02
Azelphurali1234: there's no way to tell when you're caught up it seems though, hehe23:02
popeyyellow blob turns green?23:02
Azelphurpopey: yellow blob is it whining about wanting a port forwarded23:02
ali1234looks like mine has crashed23:04
popeymine has stopped processing23:08
ali1234oh, it finally got azelphur's pubkey23:08
popey4713 person to person messages, 505 broadcast messages23:08
Azelphurali1234: oh? how'd you know?23:08
ali1234because it says on the debug log23:09
Azelphurah :)23:09
popey"Message sent: waiting on acknowledgement"23:10
AzelphurI still got nothin ;)23:12
popeygreat tool ☻23:16
penguin42popey: It's waiting for the NSA to read it first23:17
Azelphurindeed :P23:17
ali1234yeah it seems to be crashing while trying to solve the proof of work when sending the message23:53
ali1234HEAD is probably broken23:53
Azelphurali1234: haha, joining #bitmessage too I see :)23:54
AzelphurI just joined myself to ask about this23:54

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