cubHi xequence how's the debconf?09:51
xequencecub: Very nice09:52
cubAre you staying the whole week?09:52
xequencecub: You said something about the menu after I left last time09:53
xequenceEditing the menu manually with gui tools wont work with the custom menu09:53
xequenceor, it didnt before anyway09:53
cubhaha yes, there was an app to change the menus09:53
xequenceThere are a few09:53
cubhmm I did some tests on my 13.04 and added a "Audio Programming" item with an app in it09:53
xequencealacarte is the one commonly used on gnome09:53
xequenceAdding your own stuff, yes, but how about the existing custom menu entries?09:54
cubI don't remember the menu exactly but settings - main menu something09:54
xequenceAdding stuff to those09:54
cubI didn't test but they were there so I suppose I would be able to hide things or add new items09:54
cubcould do a test during lunch time09:55
cubAnother thing, if you have the time. You mentioned earlier that the low-latency kernel might use a bit more resources than the general, so using more battery on a laptop09:56
cubHow much difference do you think it is?09:56
cubI'm running US on my eee pc now and it has low battery time as it is. I won't do any audio work on it so I was thinking if I would get a few minutes more if running a general kernel09:57
xequencecub: Ive never measured, but having been running lowlatency on this machine for many hours, I dont think its a huge difference, if there is one09:58
cubOk, I won't bother then.09:58
xequencethe biggest difference between the two is probably throughput. -lowlatency has 10% less throughput, from what Ive understood09:59
xequenceThis is mostly bad for servers09:59
cubyeah not a problem for my browsing and libre office work. :P09:59
xequence-lowlateny might be a good desktop kernel09:59
cubI'm quite swamped at home for a couple of weeks, but I'm trying to take a look at that Accessability for visually impaired from the devel-maillist10:15
cubJosh, the OP, seems to have been quite active on the Vinux support groups so he might have some good input10:16
cubhttp://vinuxproject.org/ , "Vinux is a Ubuntu derived distribution optimised for the needs of blind and partially sighted users."10:17
cubfrom what I've seen most applications are available in the repos. The main point I think is to include Orca and maybe Brltty in the DVD so it can be started in Live mode and work during the installation process.10:19
xequencecub: I'd really prefer to stay out of that completely. Seems like there are people who know their stuff, and if someone just proposes some changes, I can help make them.10:40
xequenceI'm currently working on a couple of debian packages10:40
xequencegoing to try get ardour3 uploaded soon10:40
cubWhy not? Standard Ubuntu include Orca on installation10:40
xequenceWhy not, what?10:41
cubcub: I'd really prefer to stay out of that completely.10:42
cubWhy should we stay out of accessibility?10:42
xequenceMe, personally10:42
xequenceI have enough to do as it is10:42
xequenceAnd I don't know anything about that stuff either10:42
xequenceso, if someone comes up with a good list of changes we could make, I'll happily make them10:43
cubabsolutely, I was thinking I would look into how others do it, what we would need to include in the DVD. But then someone would have to do the magic to get it in there.10:43
cubAs I have worked with visually impaired tools before I jumped into it.10:43
xequencemight be as easy as just adding a couple of packages to our seeds10:43
cubI think so.10:43
cubI used to work as a sound tech and then later IT tech at "Synskadades Riksförbund" here in Stockholm10:45
xequenceYou should have the best experience in that then10:45
xequenceOh, I took a picture of myself with the t-shirt today10:46
xequencegoing to send it to the list10:46
cubIt was some time ago, but yeah. I hope to get good feedback from Josh who can do the "real" testing10:46
cubnice. I'm waiting for my package to arrive.10:46
smartboyhwHello xequence 11:02
DarkEraheya smartboyhw and the others11:06
smartboyhwHey DarkEra haven't seen you for a while:)11:06
DarkErathat's true, been busy renovating the house, family came over for a visit and i'm still on my netbook. I think i'll be able to get a new machine somewhere in the first quarter of 201411:08
smartboyhwDarkEra, oh11:10
xequenceHey everyone11:12
DarkErahi xequence 11:12
xequenceJust posted a pic of me wearing the t-shirt11:12
smartboyhwxequence, where?11:12
xequencehoping it doesnt get blocked11:12
xequenceon our devel mail list11:12
smartboyhwxequence, haven't received it yet11:13
xequenceIt requires approval11:13
smartboyhwxequence, wait, why do YOU need approval?11:13
xequencebecause of the jpg file11:14
smartboyhwxequence, just can't you approve yourself?11:14
xequenceJust about to11:15
smartboyhwxequence, LO11:16
* smartboyhw proposes to set that image as the default wallpaper for Ubuntu Studio 13.10.11:16
DarkEranice :)11:19
smartboyhwxequence, real nice11:19
smartboyhwxequence, Any changes of products should go through one or more of the leading11:20
smartboyhwmembers. Myself and madeinkobaia in particular, before released.11:20
smartboyhwIt's important for me that we maintain a nice quality and well designed11:20
smartboyhwI think I would rather write a proposal on that:P11:20
xequenceThere are currently only three people involved in the webshop11:22
xequenceme, madeinkobaia and ttoine - who runs it11:22
smartboyhwxequence, yep:)11:23
xequencePretty much everything needs to go through me, but if there is a good routine in place, I can just trust the people who are working on it11:23
smartboyhwI think though, we should be able to get it out soon11:23
smartboyhwttoine, do respond to the mail:)11:23
smartboyhwI do have the question in mind of who gets the money of the profits generated by the product sales11:24
smartboyhwI really don't know11:24
smartboyhwxequence, are you in your home while taking the photo?11:24
xequencemy sisters place here in Switzerland11:28
xequencesmartboyhw: We are on top of the problems surrounding the webshop. If you have questions aside from those presented in my email, please answer it11:29
xequencesmartboyhw: Otherwise, as I've suggested to you many times. Find something to work on, and do your best to do that work well11:30
smartboyhwxequence, ?11:30
xequencesmartboyhw: you are a member of many teams, but you spend most of the time jumping into all sorts of discussions11:31
xequenceyou are 14 years old, right?11:31
xequenceit would be good if you take some time to think about the difference in age and experience you have11:32
smartboyhwxequence, 15 now, actually11:32
xequenceand act according to your age a bit more11:32
xequenceif you want to help, please do11:32
xequencebut, find something to work on11:32
smartboyhwxequence, um, what are YOU expecting as to "act according to my age"?11:33
smartboyhwFrom my parent's perspective, it's study... study... study...11:33
xequencefor one thing, dont start arguing with people here for no reason11:33
smartboyhwxequence, I don't start arguing here with no reason11:34
xequenceNegating foolishly is one type of arguing11:36
xequenceWhat we do here is try to improve multimedia for Debian/UBuntu11:36
xequenceIt is good to keep that in mind in every situation and try not to spend energy on unimportant details11:38
cubsmartboyhw, I asked ttoine about the prices and possible earnings from the shop. There won't be any earnings, which was also part of the licencing IIRC11:43
cubxequence, the Settings -> Main Menu managed to change in the custom menus as well, just tested on my 13.04.11:47
xequencecub: Cool. I assume thats the original menu?12:00
xequencemeaning, you didnt add what Len has been working on during saucy12:00
cubNo this is my test VM for 13.04. Just ordinary apt-get updates done on it12:01
smartboyhwxequence, OK so if you want me to find something to work on, give me a list at least...12:01
smartboyhwcub, great:)12:01
cubSince I run a Mac at work I installed a VM to be able to check ubuntuforms stuff while at work. Since that's my best contributions so far . :P12:01
xequencesmartboyhw: linux-rt, testing documentation, developing ubuntustudio-controls, look at the packages we have in the repo and clean out those we dont use (ubuntustudio-sounds)12:03
smartboyhwxequence, actually, I do want to do linux-rt:)12:03
smartboyhwMaybe I should play with it12:03
xequenceI cant promise you will be the one who uploads it, but if you do the work, I'll make sure to give you the credit for it12:04
smartboyhwxequence, here's the problem: I do remember compiling the 3.10 -rt patch failed for me;P12:04
xequencesmartboyhw: you'll need to do it the ubuntu way12:05
xequenceusing dpkg tools12:05
smartboyhwxequence, any docs?12:05
xequencesmartboyhw: use linux-lowlatency as an example. Create a debian.rt flavor12:06
smartboyhwxequence, sure, where's your saucy linux-lowlatency git code?12:06
* smartboyhw thinks that is more convenient 12:06
xequenceI dont have it myself yet12:06
smartboyhwxequence, uh oh, apw doesn't have the saucy code online12:07
xequencehmm, doesn't seem like apw has it up either12:08
xequenceyou can get the source with apt-get or pull-lp-source though12:08
smartboyhwxequence, yeah12:08
xequenceyou can then make it a git repo if you want12:08
* smartboyhw goes ask in #ubuntu-kernel to get apw make a git repo for -lowlatency12:08
xequencesmartboyhw: no12:09
smartboyhwxequence, oh?12:09
smartboyhwsaucy I mean...12:09
xequencesmartboyhw: I'll be taking over the development repo soon enough12:09
smartboyhwxequence, OK, /me parts #ubuntu-kernel12:09
xequenceMaking a git repo is good if you want to keep track of your commits12:10
* smartboyhw likes vcs :)12:10
smartboyhwUh, but cloning the vanilla Ubuntu kernel git code takes a lot of time...12:10
smartboyhwxequence, saucy will probably include the 3.11 kernel, so we will only be shipping 3.10 if we want -rt...12:14
smartboyhwFortunately, that will not happen for 14.04 LTS:P12:14
xequenceI was thinking we add the rt kernel for 14.04, so no hurry12:15
xequencebut its good if we can build it soon12:15
smartboyhwxequence, sure thing:)12:16
ttoinecub, smartboyhw I confirm: no benefit at all with the current licence.12:17
smartboyhwttoine, yeah....12:18
ttoinezequence, when will we speak about the shop ?12:18
smartboyhwttoine, please ping xequence now:)12:18
ttoinewho is xequence ?12:18
smartboyhwxequence, = zequence 12:18
smartboyhwIn debconf12:18
xequencettoine: I'm not at home right now, an cant login to my server at home12:18
ttoinedefinitive ?12:18
xequencettoine: I wrote an email on the list. Did you read it?12:19
ttoinexequence, ok.12:19
ttoineno, I didn't see this email. but I was thinking more about anouncement on the blog and social networks12:19
ttoineand a link on our website menu12:19
xequencettoine: Yes, but I think there are a few details Id like to go through first12:20
ttoineyes ?12:20
xequenceBasically, as I wrote in the email, I would like it if you could sum up the legal details, so I can use that as reference12:21
xequenceand, I'd like to look at what more we can do for the webshop. To design it12:21
xequenceWe should settle for something, and the run with it12:22
xequenceat least until 14.0412:22
xequenceand changes for products should always go trough me and madeinkobaia. 12:22
xequencebefore making them available, that is12:22
ttoineto design it ?? we can't design a lot of stuff in spreadshirt...12:22
xequenceWell, maybe I should create my own account there, so I can see how it works12:23
ttoinexequence, I won't create new available stuff, but I will continue to play with spreadshirt and see how we can create more stuff12:24
ttoinethe next step is to add vectorial stuff for embrodery, I am on the way for that (baseball cap, polo, etc...)12:24
ttoinexequence, why wait until 14.04 ???12:25
xequenceI meant about the look of the webshop12:25
ttoinexequence, there is 5 themes12:25
xequenceand some art will only be available after 14.0412:25
xequence5 themes, nothing more?12:25
ttoinethe other way is to insert it to our website through iframe code12:25
cub"you can get any colour you like, as long as it's black."12:25
ttoinexequence, something like that. Not a lot of option. Otherwise we have to pay 60 € per year to become a premium partner12:26
ttoinecub, for shirt12:26
ttoinenot for the shop12:26
xequencettoine: I see.12:27
xequencettoine: Could you send me the iframe code by email? I'll try playing with that while making the page for the webshop.12:27
ttoinexequence, cub http://i.imgur.com/BIwodSi.png12:29
cubxequence, that reminds me, have you heard anything from nick on the progress with the wordpress stuff?12:29
ttoinehere is the look and feel options12:29
xequencecub: No. He kind of disappeared12:29
cubOh ttoine there seems to be baby clothes in the shop? My daughter wants one, I'm sure. :D12:30
ttoineyou select a theme, and then you can change some stuff12:30
ttoinexequence, So at the moment, the work I did is useless12:31
cubmhm they would want to keep some features and design for the premium partners.12:31
ttoinethe same for the work of madeinkobia12:31
ttoinecub, yes12:32
xequencettoine: What do you mean by useless?12:33
ttoineif it is confidential for 9 monthes...12:33
ttoineit means that for 14.04 you may want to produce new artwork and stuff12:34
ttoineI think we should launch the shop now12:34
ttoineand get feedback12:34
xequencettoine: For 14.04, we will have new artork that is specific to that release. Doesn't mean we will be cancelling what we did now12:34
xequencettoine: the time it takes is not up to me12:34
xequenceit takes the time it takes12:34
xequencethe important thing is that the work is good12:35
xequencewe are all busy12:35
xequenceno reason to be in a hurry12:35
ttoinebut you think the work is not good enough at the moment ?12:35
xequenceit takes you many months to get something done, then you expect everyone else should be lightning fast12:35
cubAren't you kind of in agreement? Launch a shop now with the designs that is in there. Then a overhaul in time for 14.04?12:35
xequencelets just take the time we need12:36
ttoinexequence, what does it miss ? I can't understand why we need more time ?12:36
ttoineit is online, we have nice stuff available12:36
xequencettoine: So, I should just post a link at our website and we are all done?12:37
xequencettoine: did you read my email yet?12:37
xequencettoine: Lets just work together, ok?12:38
xequencepreparing the art for the t-shirts was not easy12:38
xequencesome things take time12:39
xequencewe waited for you for two months12:39
xequencebut, theres no hurry after all12:39
cubxequence, about the accessibility things, I suppose I need to have something done before the 22nd of Aug, feature freeze?12:44
xequencecub: Yes. That's really the date when all our changes should be done. After that, we only fix bugs, if any are found12:45
xequenceI can't get the code to ubuntustudio-controls12:47
ttoinexequence, watch your mails12:47
xequenceIf anyone wants to try, its: bzr branch lp:ubuntustudio-controls12:47
smartboyhwxequence, why you can't get?12:47
ttoinexequence, actually, If I would have the artwork before summer, I could have open the shop earlier. in June and July, I had no time.12:48
xequencettoine: I'm not a magician, neither is madeinkoabia12:49
smartboyhwxequence, I can get the code here I think...12:49
xequencettoine: We just have to work with what we have12:49
ttoinexequence, me too12:49
ttoineI know that12:49
xequencettoine: Thanks for the email. Very informative12:49
ttoinexequence, all that is in the email was already discussed on this channel, it is just a summary ;-)12:49
xequencettoine: Its better you sum it up, who have the details. I would never have remembered that your name was involved, for instance12:50
ttoinexequence, it is just that I am involved in Ubuntu Studio for a long time now. And sometime it is frustrating to see how long it takes to get things done...12:51
ttoinethey just need a legal contact12:51
smartboyhwThat's because we are a small team I think, and we all have our lifes *sigh*12:51
xequencesmartboyhw: YOu had no problems getting the source?12:52
ttoineby the way, it means that if we do something bad with the licence, I am the legal contact, so please, don't play ;-)12:52
smartboyhwxequence, well at least gitting the source isn't a good idea;P I ran apt-get source instead12:52
xequenceI need to be able to upload to the branch as well12:53
xequenceseems like there's a LP bug12:53
smartboyhwxequence, or you mean ubuntustudio-controls?12:53
smartboyhwI thought xequence is talking about linux:P12:53
* cub thinks the new theme on the spreadshirt site looks better.12:54
smartboyhwxequence, hmm I can't branch it12:54
smartboyhwIt seems stuck in the midle12:54
xequenceIll file a bug12:56
smartboyhwxequence, !?12:56
xequencejust cleaning my keyboard :D12:56
smartboyhwxequence, LOl12:56
knomethat looked like a secure password though12:56
smartboyhwknome, +1 12:58
DarkEralol, yeah it did12:58
ttoineknome, +113:01
knomewonder if pwgen could produce characters with accents13:01
xequenceknome: You mean like, with a French accent (jk)?13:06
knomexequence, yes ;)13:07
smartboyhwgood jk13:07
xequenceFinnish accent is like a bad speech synthesizer that speaks all the letters as they are13:08
xequenceso, basically, accentless13:08
xequenceFound a nice example of an indicator app that also works for gnome (gir)13:11
xequencegoing to try to hack something up before feature freeze, for ubuntustudio-controls13:12
xequencesmartboyhw: would you mind confirming the bug LP: #121131713:53
ubottuLaunchpad bug 1211317 in Launchpad itself "lp:ubuntustudio-controls may be corrupt" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/121131713:53
* smartboyhw confirms13:54
xequencesmartboyhw: Thanks13:54
cubHmm does Ubuntu Studio run on Apple macbooks?13:55
smartboyhwcub, no.13:55
xequencesmartboyhw: Why do you say that?13:56
smartboyhwxequence, maybe yes...13:56
smartboyhwBut we don't provide images do we?13:57
xequencecub: It's been a while since I tried it. Have never installed, but live images used to work in the past without problems13:57
xequencesmartboyhw: We don't provice Mac specific images no.13:57
smartboyhwYou can install through pat-get13:58
smartboyhwBut no images:P13:58
cubI have to try that. I stumbled across a questions about it on askubuntu and got curious. A collegue is running Fedora on his Macbook here.13:58
xequencecub: I installed debian on a ibook without problems. But that's powerpc13:59
cubsure I installed Debian recently on my ancient iMac14:00
xequenceMaybe there's something specific about the booting?14:00
cubbut it would be cool to dual boot US at work and shut down the "Fedora rules" arguments at work. ;)14:00
xequenceEFI instead of BIOS14:01
cubI'll bring a USB stick tomorrow.14:01
xequencecub: Try installing onto usb stick first14:01
xequencethat way you wont mess anything up14:01
xequenceor a separate usb drive14:02
cubyeah, that's how he's running Fedora at the moment.14:02
cubbut they recommend usb314:02
xequencebut, make sure to install GRUB onto the right harddrive14:02
xequenceusb3 is much faster of course14:02
cubmy macbook is too old for that.14:02
xequenceits just loading time that is slower14:03
xequenceapps are just as fast otherwise14:03
xequenceapplications are loaded into RAM, and as long as you arent writing to disk at 100% capacity, its just RAM and CPU working while you use the app14:04
xequenceHCS+ is not writable to my knowledge14:05
xequenceonly readable14:05
xequencethe MAC file system with journaling enabled14:05
cubMostly web based systems here so14:05
xequenceThere's a bunch of developers her gathered around a round table, standing. Writing git stuff on a big card board14:06
xequenceThey've been at it for about two hours now14:07
xequenceI got the indicator working with our logo and everything. Working in Gnome3. Nothing more then a menu of starters for now, but that will have to do, if I dont have time for anything else14:08
xequenceshould work on all DEs14:08
xequencePoettering is having a talk about systemd in 20 minutes14:09
xequencethat should be fun14:09
cubdefine fun? ;)14:10
cubHave you got a screenshot of the indicator?14:10
xequencecub: It'll be fun if opinions are apart, which they should be14:11
xequencewell, seem to be anyway14:11
ubottuFor posting multi-line texts into the channel, please use http://paste.ubuntu.com | To post !screenshots use http://imagebin.org/?page=add | !pastebinit to paste directly from command line | Make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the channel topic.14:12
cubooh nice14:14
xequenceneed to save batteries. bbl14:15
=== kubotu_ is now known as kubotu
xequenceOvenWerks: I was just trying ubuntustudio-installer. I'm on precise, so not the best way to test, but - starting with the desktop file opens a terminal when you run it14:31
xequenceOvenWerks: Starting from the terminal does not show any options to install14:32
xequenceOvenWerks: Is this only me?14:32
xequenceOvenWerks: I'm about to rewrite ubuntustudio-controls from scratch, making it an indicator app, with a starter for ubuntustudio-installer among other things14:33
xequenceSo, that's why I was interested in seeing how to start ubuntustudio-installer14:39
smartboyhwxequence, if you want updates on the -rt work, check out https://github.com/smartboyhw/ubuntu-saucy-rt15:16
xequenceApparently edubuntu has a lot common with us, on not being desktop orientated17:47
xequenceIt's too late in the game to start changing our desktop. But, for 14.04, we should prepare this stuff17:50
OvenWerkszequence: been away for a bit will back track and answer some questions in a bit.22:21

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