[09:51] Hi xequence how's the debconf? [09:52] cub: Very nice [09:52] Are you staying the whole week? [09:53] cub: You said something about the menu after I left last time [09:53] Editing the menu manually with gui tools wont work with the custom menu [09:53] or, it didnt before anyway [09:53] haha yes, there was an app to change the menus [09:53] There are a few [09:53] hmm I did some tests on my 13.04 and added a "Audio Programming" item with an app in it [09:53] alacarte is the one commonly used on gnome [09:54] Adding your own stuff, yes, but how about the existing custom menu entries? [09:54] I don't remember the menu exactly but settings - main menu something [09:54] Adding stuff to those [09:54] I didn't test but they were there so I suppose I would be able to hide things or add new items [09:55] could do a test during lunch time [09:56] Another thing, if you have the time. You mentioned earlier that the low-latency kernel might use a bit more resources than the general, so using more battery on a laptop [09:56] How much difference do you think it is? [09:57] I'm running US on my eee pc now and it has low battery time as it is. I won't do any audio work on it so I was thinking if I would get a few minutes more if running a general kernel [09:58] cub: Ive never measured, but having been running lowlatency on this machine for many hours, I dont think its a huge difference, if there is one [09:58] Ok, I won't bother then. [09:59] the biggest difference between the two is probably throughput. -lowlatency has 10% less throughput, from what Ive understood [09:59] This is mostly bad for servers [09:59] yeah not a problem for my browsing and libre office work. :P [09:59] -lowlateny might be a good desktop kernel [10:15] I'm quite swamped at home for a couple of weeks, but I'm trying to take a look at that Accessability for visually impaired from the devel-maillist [10:16] Josh, the OP, seems to have been quite active on the Vinux support groups so he might have some good input [10:17] http://vinuxproject.org/ , "Vinux is a Ubuntu derived distribution optimised for the needs of blind and partially sighted users." [10:19] from what I've seen most applications are available in the repos. The main point I think is to include Orca and maybe Brltty in the DVD so it can be started in Live mode and work during the installation process. [10:40] cub: I'd really prefer to stay out of that completely. Seems like there are people who know their stuff, and if someone just proposes some changes, I can help make them. [10:40] I'm currently working on a couple of debian packages [10:40] going to try get ardour3 uploaded soon [10:40] Why not? Standard Ubuntu include Orca on installation [10:41] Why not, what? [10:42] cub: I'd really prefer to stay out of that completely. [10:42] Why should we stay out of accessibility? [10:42] Me, personally [10:42] ah [10:42] I have enough to do as it is [10:42] And I don't know anything about that stuff either [10:43] so, if someone comes up with a good list of changes we could make, I'll happily make them [10:43] absolutely, I was thinking I would look into how others do it, what we would need to include in the DVD. But then someone would have to do the magic to get it in there. [10:43] As I have worked with visually impaired tools before I jumped into it. [10:43] might be as easy as just adding a couple of packages to our seeds [10:43] I think so. [10:45] I used to work as a sound tech and then later IT tech at "Synskadades Riksförbund" here in Stockholm [10:45] You should have the best experience in that then [10:46] Oh, I took a picture of myself with the t-shirt today [10:46] going to send it to the list [10:46] It was some time ago, but yeah. I hope to get good feedback from Josh who can do the "real" testing [10:46] nice. I'm waiting for my package to arrive. [11:02] Hello xequence [11:06] heya smartboyhw and the others [11:06] Hey DarkEra haven't seen you for a while:) [11:08] that's true, been busy renovating the house, family came over for a visit and i'm still on my netbook. I think i'll be able to get a new machine somewhere in the first quarter of 2014 [11:10] DarkEra, oh [11:12] Hey everyone [11:12] hi xequence [11:12] Just posted a pic of me wearing the t-shirt [11:12] xequence, where? [11:12] hoping it doesnt get blocked [11:12] on our devel mail list [11:12] *blink* [11:13] xequence, haven't received it yet [11:13] It requires approval [11:13] xequence, wait, why do YOU need approval? [11:14] because of the jpg file [11:14] Hmm... [11:14] xequence, just can't you approve yourself? [11:15] Just about to [11:16] xequence, LO [11:16] *LOL [11:16] * smartboyhw proposes to set that image as the default wallpaper for Ubuntu Studio 13.10. [11:19] nice :) [11:19] xequence, real nice [11:20] xequence, Any changes of products should go through one or more of the leading [11:20] members. Myself and madeinkobaia in particular, before released. [11:20] It's important for me that we maintain a nice quality and well designed [11:20] products. [11:20] I think I would rather write a proposal on that:P [11:22] There are currently only three people involved in the webshop [11:22] me, madeinkobaia and ttoine - who runs it [11:23] xequence, yep:) [11:23] Pretty much everything needs to go through me, but if there is a good routine in place, I can just trust the people who are working on it [11:23] I think though, we should be able to get it out soon [11:23] ttoine, do respond to the mail:) [11:24] I do have the question in mind of who gets the money of the profits generated by the product sales [11:24] I really don't know [11:24] xequence, are you in your home while taking the photo? [11:28] my sisters place here in Switzerland [11:29] smartboyhw: We are on top of the problems surrounding the webshop. If you have questions aside from those presented in my email, please answer it [11:30] smartboyhw: Otherwise, as I've suggested to you many times. Find something to work on, and do your best to do that work well [11:30] xequence, ? [11:31] smartboyhw: you are a member of many teams, but you spend most of the time jumping into all sorts of discussions [11:31] you are 14 years old, right? [11:32] it would be good if you take some time to think about the difference in age and experience you have [11:32] xequence, 15 now, actually [11:32] and act according to your age a bit more [11:32] if you want to help, please do [11:32] but, find something to work on [11:33] xequence, um, what are YOU expecting as to "act according to my age"？ [11:33] From my parent's perspective, it's study... study... study... [11:33] for one thing, dont start arguing with people here for no reason [11:34] xequence, I don't start arguing here with no reason [11:36] Negating foolishly is one type of arguing [11:36] What we do here is try to improve multimedia for Debian/UBuntu [11:38] It is good to keep that in mind in every situation and try not to spend energy on unimportant details [11:43] smartboyhw, I asked ttoine about the prices and possible earnings from the shop. There won't be any earnings, which was also part of the licencing IIRC [11:47] xequence, the Settings -> Main Menu managed to change in the custom menus as well, just tested on my 13.04. [12:00] cub: Cool. I assume thats the original menu? [12:00] meaning, you didnt add what Len has been working on during saucy [12:01] No this is my test VM for 13.04. Just ordinary apt-get updates done on it [12:01] xequence, OK so if you want me to find something to work on, give me a list at least... [12:01] cub, great:) [12:01] Since I run a Mac at work I installed a VM to be able to check ubuntuforms stuff while at work. Since that's my best contributions so far . :P [12:03] smartboyhw: linux-rt, testing documentation, developing ubuntustudio-controls, look at the packages we have in the repo and clean out those we dont use (ubuntustudio-sounds) [12:03] xequence, actually, I do want to do linux-rt:) [12:03] Maybe I should play with it [12:04] I cant promise you will be the one who uploads it, but if you do the work, I'll make sure to give you the credit for it [12:04] xequence, here's the problem: I do remember compiling the 3.10 -rt patch failed for me;P [12:05] smartboyhw: you'll need to do it the ubuntu way [12:05] using dpkg tools [12:05] xequence, any docs? [12:06] smartboyhw: use linux-lowlatency as an example. Create a debian.rt flavor [12:06] xequence, sure, where's your saucy linux-lowlatency git code? [12:06] * smartboyhw thinks that is more convenient [12:06] I dont have it myself yet [12:07] xequence, uh oh, apw doesn't have the saucy code online [12:07] :( [12:08] hmm, doesn't seem like apw has it up either [12:08] Damn:P [12:08] you can get the source with apt-get or pull-lp-source though [12:08] xequence, yeah [12:08] you can then make it a git repo if you want [12:08] * smartboyhw goes ask in #ubuntu-kernel to get apw make a git repo for -lowlatency [12:09] smartboyhw: no [12:09] xequence, oh? [12:09] saucy I mean... [12:09] smartboyhw: I'll be taking over the development repo soon enough [12:09] xequence, OK, /me parts #ubuntu-kernel [12:10] Making a git repo is good if you want to keep track of your commits [12:10] * smartboyhw likes vcs :) [12:10] Uh, but cloning the vanilla Ubuntu kernel git code takes a lot of time... [12:14] xequence, saucy will probably include the 3.11 kernel, so we will only be shipping 3.10 if we want -rt... [12:14] Fortunately, that will not happen for 14.04 LTS:P [12:15] I was thinking we add the rt kernel for 14.04, so no hurry [12:15] but its good if we can build it soon [12:16] xequence, sure thing:) [12:17] cub, smartboyhw I confirm: no benefit at all with the current licence. [12:18] ttoine, yeah.... [12:18] zequence, when will we speak about the shop ? [12:18] ttoine, please ping xequence now:) [12:18] who is xequence ? [12:18] xequence, = zequence [12:18] In debconf [12:18] ttoine: I'm not at home right now, an cant login to my server at home [12:18] definitive ? [12:19] ttoine: I wrote an email on the list. Did you read it? [12:19] xequence, ok. [12:19] no, I didn't see this email. but I was thinking more about anouncement on the blog and social networks [12:19] and a link on our website menu [12:20] ttoine: Yes, but I think there are a few details Id like to go through first [12:20] yes ? [12:21] Basically, as I wrote in the email, I would like it if you could sum up the legal details, so I can use that as reference [12:21] and, I'd like to look at what more we can do for the webshop. To design it [12:22] We should settle for something, and the run with it [12:22] at least until 14.04 [12:22] and changes for products should always go trough me and madeinkobaia. [12:22] before making them available, that is [12:22] to design it ?? we can't design a lot of stuff in spreadshirt... [12:23] Well, maybe I should create my own account there, so I can see how it works [12:24] xequence, I won't create new available stuff, but I will continue to play with spreadshirt and see how we can create more stuff [12:24] the next step is to add vectorial stuff for embrodery, I am on the way for that (baseball cap, polo, etc...) [12:25] xequence, why wait until 14.04 ??? [12:25] I meant about the look of the webshop [12:25] xequence, there is 5 themes [12:25] and some art will only be available after 14.04 [12:25] 5 themes, nothing more? [12:25] the other way is to insert it to our website through iframe code [12:25] "you can get any colour you like, as long as it's black." [12:26] xequence, something like that. Not a lot of option. Otherwise we have to pay 60 € per year to become a premium partner [12:26] cub, for shirt [12:26] not for the shop [12:27] ttoine: I see. [12:27] ttoine: Could you send me the iframe code by email? I'll try playing with that while making the page for the webshop. [12:29] xequence, cub http://i.imgur.com/BIwodSi.png [12:29] xequence, that reminds me, have you heard anything from nick on the progress with the wordpress stuff? [12:29] here is the look and feel options [12:29] cub: No. He kind of disappeared [12:30] Oh ttoine there seems to be baby clothes in the shop? My daughter wants one, I'm sure. :D [12:30] you select a theme, and then you can change some stuff [12:31] xequence, So at the moment, the work I did is useless [12:31] mhm they would want to keep some features and design for the premium partners. [12:31] the same for the work of madeinkobia [12:32] cub, yes [12:33] ttoine: What do you mean by useless? [12:33] if it is confidential for 9 monthes... [12:34] it means that for 14.04 you may want to produce new artwork and stuff [12:34] I think we should launch the shop now [12:34] and get feedback [12:34] ttoine: For 14.04, we will have new artork that is specific to that release. Doesn't mean we will be cancelling what we did now [12:34] ttoine: the time it takes is not up to me [12:34] it takes the time it takes [12:35] the important thing is that the work is good [12:35] we are all busy [12:35] no reason to be in a hurry [12:35] but you think the work is not good enough at the moment ? [12:35] it takes you many months to get something done, then you expect everyone else should be lightning fast [12:35] Aren't you kind of in agreement? Launch a shop now with the designs that is in there. Then a overhaul in time for 14.04? [12:35] please [12:36] lets just take the time we need [12:36] xequence, what does it miss ? I can't understand why we need more time ? [12:36] it is online, we have nice stuff available [12:37] ttoine: So, I should just post a link at our website and we are all done? [12:37] ttoine: did you read my email yet? [12:38] ttoine: Lets just work together, ok? [12:38] preparing the art for the t-shirts was not easy [12:39] some things take time [12:39] we waited for you for two months [12:39] but, theres no hurry after all [12:44] xequence, about the accessibility things, I suppose I need to have something done before the 22nd of Aug, feature freeze? [12:45] cub: Yes. That's really the date when all our changes should be done. After that, we only fix bugs, if any are found [12:47] I can't get the code to ubuntustudio-controls [12:47] xequence, watch your mails [12:47] If anyone wants to try, its: bzr branch lp:ubuntustudio-controls [12:47] xequence, why you can't get? [12:48] xequence, actually, If I would have the artwork before summer, I could have open the shop earlier. in June and July, I had no time. [12:49] ttoine: I'm not a magician, neither is madeinkoabia [12:49] xequence, I can get the code here I think... [12:49] ttoine: We just have to work with what we have [12:49] xequence, me too [12:49] I know that [12:49] ttoine: Thanks for the email. Very informative [12:49] xequence, all that is in the email was already discussed on this channel, it is just a summary ;-) [12:50] ttoine: Its better you sum it up, who have the details. I would never have remembered that your name was involved, for instance [12:51] xequence, it is just that I am involved in Ubuntu Studio for a long time now. And sometime it is frustrating to see how long it takes to get things done... [12:51] they just need a legal contact [12:51] That's because we are a small team I think, and we all have our lifes *sigh* [12:52] smartboyhw: YOu had no problems getting the source? [12:52] by the way, it means that if we do something bad with the licence, I am the legal contact, so please, don't play ;-) [12:52] xequence, well at least gitting the source isn't a good idea;P I ran apt-get source instead [12:53] I need to be able to upload to the branch as well [12:53] seems like there's a LP bug [12:53] xequence, or you mean ubuntustudio-controls? [12:53] I thought xequence is talking about linux:P [12:54] * cub thinks the new theme on the spreadshirt site looks better. [12:54] xequence, hmm I can't branch it [12:54] It seems stuck in the midle [12:54] *middle [12:56] yes [12:56] Ill file a bug [12:56] ü0p9o7gz65teqayqawertzpü$ [12:56] xequence, !? [12:56] just cleaning my keyboard :D [12:56] xequence, LOl [12:56] that looked like a secure password though [12:58] knome, +1 [12:58] lol, yeah it did [13:01] knome, +1 [13:01] wonder if pwgen could produce characters with accents [13:06] knome: You mean like, with a French accent (jk)? [13:07] xequence, yes ;) [13:07] good jk [13:08] Finnish accent is like a bad speech synthesizer that speaks all the letters as they are [13:08] so, basically, accentless [13:08] hehe [13:11] Found a nice example of an indicator app that also works for gnome (gir) [13:12] going to try to hack something up before feature freeze, for ubuntustudio-controls [13:53] smartboyhw: would you mind confirming the bug LP: #1211317 [13:53] Launchpad bug 1211317 in Launchpad itself "lp:ubuntustudio-controls may be corrupt" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1211317 [13:54] * smartboyhw confirms [13:54] smartboyhw: Thanks [13:55] Hmm does Ubuntu Studio run on Apple macbooks? [13:55] cub, no. [13:56] smartboyhw: Why do you say that? [13:56] xequence, maybe yes... [13:57] But we don't provide images do we? [13:57] cub: It's been a while since I tried it. Have never installed, but live images used to work in the past without problems [13:57] smartboyhw: We don't provice Mac specific images no. [13:58] You can install through pat-get [13:58] *apt-get [13:58] But no images:P [13:58] I have to try that. I stumbled across a questions about it on askubuntu and got curious. A collegue is running Fedora on his Macbook here. [13:59] cub: I installed debian on a ibook without problems. But that's powerpc [14:00] sure I installed Debian recently on my ancient iMac [14:00] Maybe there's something specific about the booting? [14:00] but it would be cool to dual boot US at work and shut down the "Fedora rules" arguments at work. ;) [14:01] EFI instead of BIOS [14:01] I'll bring a USB stick tomorrow. [14:01] cub: Try installing onto usb stick first [14:01] that way you wont mess anything up [14:02] or a separate usb drive [14:02] yeah, that's how he's running Fedora at the moment. [14:02] but they recommend usb3 [14:02] but, make sure to install GRUB onto the right harddrive [14:02] usb3 is much faster of course [14:02] my macbook is too old for that. [14:03] its just loading time that is slower [14:03] apps are just as fast otherwise [14:04] applications are loaded into RAM, and as long as you arent writing to disk at 100% capacity, its just RAM and CPU working while you use the app [14:05] HCS+ is not writable to my knowledge [14:05] only readable [14:05] the MAC file system with journaling enabled [14:05] Mostly web based systems here so [14:06] There's a bunch of developers her gathered around a round table, standing. Writing git stuff on a big card board [14:07] They've been at it for about two hours now [14:07] :d [14:08] I got the indicator working with our logo and everything. Working in Gnome3. Nothing more then a menu of starters for now, but that will have to do, if I dont have time for anything else [14:08] should work on all DEs [14:09] Poettering is having a talk about systemd in 20 minutes [14:09] that should be fun [14:10] define fun? ;) [14:10] Have you got a screenshot of the indicator? [14:11] cub: It'll be fun if opinions are apart, which they should be [14:11] well, seem to be anyway [14:12] !paste [14:12] For posting multi-line texts into the channel, please use http://paste.ubuntu.com | To post !screenshots use http://imagebin.org/?page=add | !pastebinit to paste directly from command line | Make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the channel topic. [14:14] http://imagebin.org/267278 [14:14] ooh nice [14:15] need to save batteries. bbl === kubotu_ is now known as kubotu [14:31] OvenWerks: I was just trying ubuntustudio-installer. I'm on precise, so not the best way to test, but - starting with the desktop file opens a terminal when you run it [14:32] OvenWerks: Starting from the terminal does not show any options to install [14:32] OvenWerks: Is this only me? [14:33] OvenWerks: I'm about to rewrite ubuntustudio-controls from scratch, making it an indicator app, with a starter for ubuntustudio-installer among other things [14:39] So, that's why I was interested in seeing how to start ubuntustudio-installer [15:16] xequence, if you want updates on the -rt work, check out https://github.com/smartboyhw/ubuntu-saucy-rt [17:47] Apparently edubuntu has a lot common with us, on not being desktop orientated [17:50] It's too late in the game to start changing our desktop. But, for 14.04, we should prepare this stuff [22:21] zequence: been away for a bit will back track and answer some questions in a bit.