[05:56] <MooDoo> morning all
[05:57] <Myrtti> hiya B-)
[06:02] <MooDoo> guess it's just us up eh Myrtti
[06:03] <Myrtti> indeed
[06:03] <Myrtti> but then again I'm two hours ahead of you
[06:03] <MooDoo> there is that
[06:04] <jussi> Im also in same tz as Myrtti, and Im awake :)
[06:04] <jussi> MooDoo: early shift again?
[06:04] <MooDoo> yeah
[06:04] <Myrtti> I'm just listening to Stevie Wonder
[06:05] <jussi> I have wild blueberries and yoghurt for brakfast :D
[06:05] <jussi> and they are NOM
[06:05] <Myrtti> apparently I should make a cake
[06:07] <jussi> Myrtti: why is that?
[06:08] <Myrtti> cakeday today
[06:10] <MooDoo> yay cake
[07:03] <neuro> Myrtti: happy cake day!
[07:05] <Myrtti> neuro: ♥
[07:06] <Myrtti> thanks
[07:06] <neuro> just think of it less as another year older, but more as an excuse to caek
[07:06]  * neuro is listening to "Viva Las Vegas" by Dead Kennedys, from the album Fresh Fruit for Rotting Vegetables. 256kbps AAC 
[07:07] <neuro> ^ happy tuesday
[07:08] <Myrtti> I've had this in my head since yesterday, because not only do I have a cakeday, but it seems like my luck is taking a turn for better, finally
[07:08] <Myrtti> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FchMuPQOBwA
[07:09] <neuro> HOLY CRAP, that was close
[07:09] <neuro> that played for like 0.5 seconds
[07:10] <Myrtti> :-D
[07:10] <MartijnVdS> dead kennedys at 256kbps AAC? does that really make a difference? ;)
[07:11] <neuro> no idea, it's what streamed down off iTunes Match
[07:11] <Myrtti> MartijnVdS: could be worse
[07:11] <Myrtti> could be nickelback
[07:11] <MartijnVdS> Myrtti: low blow :)
[07:12] <neuro> I am proud to say ...
[07:12] <neuro> grissom:Music neuro$ find . -name Nickelback
[07:12] <neuro> grissom:Music neuro$
[07:12] <MartijnVdS> finn . -iname \*nickelback\*
[07:12] <MartijnVdS> find*
[07:16] <neuro> grissom:Music neuro$ find . -iname \*nickelback\*
[07:16] <neuro> grissom:Music neuro$
[07:16] <neuro> my collection is pure
[07:17] <MartijnVdS> I have one Nickelback song. On a festival sampler CD I got for free once.
[07:17] <neuro> burn it
[07:17] <MartijnVdS> Muziek/Various Artists/2002 - A Campingflight to Lowlands Paradise 2002/1-01 Nickelback - Where Do I Hide.flac
[07:17] <MartijnVdS> it's the first track.. of the first disc..
[07:17] <neuro> destroy
[07:18] <MartijnVdS> neuro: but it also has Dimmu Borgir on it!
[07:18] <neuro> so?
[07:18] <MartijnVdS> .. to compensate?
[07:18] <neuro> there is no compensation for Nickelback
[07:18] <jussi> I cant see the fuss about nickelback... they are no worse than some of the other crap out there, miley cyrus comes to mind :P
[07:18] <neuro> your collection is unpure
[07:19] <neuro> it must be purged
[07:19] <MartijnVdS> neuro: http://www.discogs.com/Various-A-Campingflight-To-Lowlands-Paradise-2002/release/803057 :)
[07:19] <jussi> neuro: you are thinking about nickel back... and you just lost the game :P Having a bad day?
[07:19] <jussi> :P
[07:19] <neuro> i haven't lost anything
[07:19] <MartijnVdS> jussi: Q: What concert costs $0.45?
[07:20] <MartijnVdS> jussi: A: 50 cent, featuring Nickelback.
[07:20] <jussi> oh dear....
[07:20] <jussi> worse than my fathers jokes...
[07:28] <dwatkins> jussi tells jokes about fathers.
[07:28] <jussi> dwatkins: grammar nazi :P
[07:28] <dwatkins> well it did change the meaning, jussi ;-p
[07:28] <jussi> dwatkins: true, but SSSSSSSSSSHHH
[07:29] <jussi> :P
[07:29]  * dwatkins goes to put the oven on for grandma
[07:29] <TheOpenSourcerer> A rather nicely composed piece on Canonical for once: http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2013/08/why-ubuntus-creator-still-invests-his-fortune-in-an-unprofitable-company/
[07:33] <MooDoo> nice read
[07:35] <MooDoo> They will have to hurry up and give Redhat a run for their money
[07:38] <TheOpenSourcerer> Hmmm - same price as HS2 approximately: http://arstechnica.com/business/2013/08/hyperloop-a-theoretical-760-mph-transit-system-made-of-sun-air-and-magnets/
[07:38] <knightwise> morning
[07:40] <neuro> not heard of this "Redhat" ... are they new?
[07:40] <MartijnVdS> neuro: alternative name: Little Red Riding Hood
[07:40] <MooDoo> neuro: yeah recent company
[07:43] <neuro> I'm going to start saying "Ubunto" :)
[07:43] <neuro> right, brekkie (in so much as breakfast counts as breakfast when you've been up and working for 5.5 hrs)
[07:47] <MooDoo> neuro: ever heard of this thing called sleep?  new concept i know ;)
[07:47] <neuro> early shift
[07:47] <MooDoo> ah
[07:48] <neuro> went to bed at 8 last night
[07:48] <MooDoo> 7am start for me
[07:57] <AlanBell> HS2 can stop at stations on the way though :)
[07:57] <AlanBell> and probably won't squish passengers into a smooth pate if something goes wrong
[07:57] <MartijnVdS> AlanBell: except high-speed trains shouldn't do that
[07:57] <MartijnVdS> AlanBell: because it takes time to accelerate/decelerate
[07:57] <TheOpenSourcerer> Train wouldn't  be very fast if it kept stopping.
[07:58] <TheOpenSourcerer> Currently it's about £50bn for a saving of 20 mins
[07:58] <MartijnVdS> also, USA = big. Really big. You just won't believe how vastly hugely mindbogglingly big it is...
[07:58] <TheOpenSourcerer> could build ~5 hyperloops for that (and SF to LA is a bit further than London to Birmingham)
[08:06] <AlanBell> hyperloop does look cool
[08:06] <jussi> does the pdf not work for anyone else?
[08:06] <directhex> i live by the current london/birmingham line
[08:07] <directhex> it's a well-run line compared to most
[08:07] <AlanBell> document is damaged jussi
[08:07] <jussi> AlanBell: yeah, I cant get it to open at all
[08:07] <jussi> google chromes built in pdf reader or okular
[08:08] <MartijnVdS> teslamotors.com seems to be having a hard time with the pdf
[08:08] <MartijnVdS> http://www.spacex.com/sites/spacex/files/hyperloop_alpha-20130812.pdf works
[08:08] <MartijnVdS> (Musk's other company ;))
[08:09] <mungbean> does shuttleworth really wear velcro shoes?
[08:09] <mungbean> (from the ars pic)
[08:09] <mungbean> millionaires can do what they want i suppose
[08:09] <MooDoo> billionaries ;)
[08:10] <mungbean> citation needed
[08:10] <mungbean> http://www.therichest.com/celebnetworth/celebrity-business/entrepreneurs/mark-shuttleworth-net-worth/
[08:10] <MooDoo> I stand corrcted
[08:11] <MartijnVdS> Bazillionaires.
[08:11] <mungbean> is he married?
[08:11] <ivanka_> height N/A hehehe
[08:11] <MooDoo> no
[08:11] <TheOpenSourcerer> "Mark Shuttleworth Height" N/A ;-)
[08:12] <ivanka_> TheOpenSourcerer, :-) ^
[08:12] <MooDoo> he's a dwarf just the camera angles make him look tall ;)
[08:12] <ivanka_> TheOpenSourcerer, first thing that made me chuckle too
[08:12] <MooDoo> lol does it really matter?
[08:12] <TheOpenSourcerer> no - but it's just amusing.
[08:12] <TheOpenSourcerer> He's not the tallest chap in the world...
[08:13] <MooDoo> I'm too tall sometimes lol
[08:13] <ivanka_> neither is he what you would describe as short
[08:13] <MartijnVdS> MooDoo: hence the squatting on your blog/profile pic? ;)
[08:13] <MooDoo> MartijnVdS: yeah ;)  I used to have long hair until I started banging my head on door frames ;)
[08:14] <popey> Morning.
[08:14] <MooDoo> good morning popey
[08:14] <mungbean> wow. just reading this article http://www.engagecsi.co.za/docs/Mark%20Shuttleworth%20on%20CSI.pdf
[08:14] <mungbean> who will inhreit the shuttleworth fortune?
[08:15] <MooDoo> mungbean: the cat
[08:15] <MooDoo> ;)
[08:15] <TheOpenSourcerer> Like the line about Miss World - so very South African...
[08:16] <popey> the dogs more likely
[08:16] <popey> and the bees
[08:16] <mungbean> BEEES
[08:17] <MooDoo> he'll donate it all back to the ubuntu community $10 for every ubuntu member ;)
[08:17] <popey> yeah, your ubuntu membership certificate is your voucher ☻
[08:17] <MooDoo> hehe :D
[08:19] <popey> ☻   /  ☹
[08:19] <popey> was hoping for a meeting date to be added there
[08:19] <mungbean> when you're a gazillionaire you can reverse vasectomies i suppose
[08:20] <AlanBell> yeah, I was looking at that TBA as I did that
[08:21] <brobostigon> good morning everyone,
[08:21] <MooDoo> morning
[08:22] <brobostigon> morning MooDoo
[08:22] <MooDoo> hope you're well
[08:22] <popey> mungbean: the article says he put some swimmers on ice, so no need to reverse it
[08:22] <popey> and from what I've seen he lives a pretty frugal life
[08:22] <brobostigon> MooDoo:  not bad, unsettled sleep, otherwise fine. and you?
[08:23] <MooDoo> brobostigon: yeah good thanks, building my neice an ubuntu pc :D
[08:23] <brobostigon> MooDoo: :)
[08:23] <MooDoo> brobostigon: had a few friends ask about me building them one too so she's the ginue pig :) lo
[08:24] <brobostigon> MooDoo: cool, hope it works out.
[08:24] <MooDoo> brobostigon: yeah me too :d
[08:24] <brobostigon> MooDoo: :)
[08:25] <mungbean> today on the train i saw a bizarre commuter: shirt and jacket..OK, then neckbeard and headscarf..hmm..then cargo shorts and socks and sandals ARRRGH
[08:26] <MartijnVdS> mungbean: so.. someone who works for a startup?
[08:27] <mungbean> it was near shoreditch
[08:27] <MartijnVdS> so, a startup? :)
[08:28] <mungbean> they didn't look good.
[08:28] <MooDoo> MartijnVdS: probably a lecturer at the uni mungbean works at ;) or a mature student :D
[08:28] <MartijnVdS> MooDoo: Ah, someone with tenure :)
[08:28] <mungbean> there weren't going towards uni
[08:29] <mungbean> although once i saw a comp sci student wearing a utility belt that had laptops and tablets in
[08:29] <popey> a virginity belt.
[08:29] <popey> or chastity belt rather
[08:30] <MooDoo> lol
[08:30] <mungbean> i've never seen one that can accomodate laptops
[08:31] <mungbean> mother in law has 8 of these puppies atm http://i.imgur.com/NiBDdZi.jpg
[08:32] <mungbean> baby ewoks
[08:41] <bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
[08:42] <DJones> mungbean: What breed are they
[08:42] <mungbean> pomerians i think
[08:42] <bigcalm> And big congratulations to christel (even though she isn't in here)
[08:43] <DJones> mungbean: They look nice and cute anyway
[08:43] <mungbean> free to a good home ;)
[08:44] <DJones> Heh, I'd love one, but mine would probably think it was a squeaky toy
[08:44] <mungbean> i have a jack russell who loves to kill squeaks
[08:45] <Myrtti> I need a smack on the face, I'm way too happy for myself
[08:45] <DJones> All of mine and my parents dogs all do the same, they'll lie down with a toy and just nibble with their front teeth until they find the squeak and then kill it
[08:45]  * bigcalm smacks Myrtti with a HAPPY BIRTHDAY!
[08:45]  * MooDoo smacks Myrtti with a wet fish leaving a happy birthday imprint on her forehead
[08:46] <Myrtti> I may have gotten a job offer yesterday, so I'm super duper happy
[08:46] <bigcalm> Yay
[08:46] <bigcalm> You're not sure if you got an offer or not?
[08:46] <popey>            ,,,,,
[08:46] <popey>           _|||||_
[08:46] <popey>          {~*~*~*~}
[08:46] <popey>        __{*~*~*~*}__
[08:46] <popey>       `-------------`
[08:46] <bigcalm> Hehe
[08:46] <AlanBell> that cake is not a lie
[08:46] <DJones> Myrtti: Must be something wierd going on, I share the same birthday with you and I've just had a job offer confirmed this morning
[08:46] <popey> \o/
[08:47] <dwatkins> hippy burpday, DJones and Myrtti :)
[08:47] <Myrtti> bigcalm: it's pending negotiations about who pays, what are they paying for, how they pay, when they pay, etc
[08:47] <DJones> Thanks
[08:47] <bigcalm> Ah
[08:47] <DJones> Hope you get the right deal for you
[08:47] <Myrtti> DJones: happy birthday buddy!
[08:48] <Myrtti> and thank you ♥
[08:48] <popey> bigcalm: happy unbirthday buddy!
[08:48] <DJones> Thank you, same to you
[08:48] <bigcalm> popey: and a very happy unbirthday to you!
[08:48] <mungbean> group hug
[08:48] <Myrtti> group hug!
[08:48] <DJones> Heh
[08:49] <JamesTait> Good morning all, happy Lefthanders' Day! :-D
[08:49] <mungbean> YAY
[08:49] <mungbean> how can i celebrate?
[08:50] <DJones> A day early, but SKy had the episode where Ned Flanders opened his left handed shop on last night
[08:51] <JamesTait> mungbean, I don't really know.  Hug someone who's left-handed?
[08:51] <MooDoo> I'm ambigextrous :D
[08:51] <MooDoo> or however you spell it
[08:51] <Seeker`> ambidextrous
[08:51] <dwatkins> Ambidextrous?
[08:52] <DJones> Ah well, job offer now means I've got to plan sorting, organising and filling boxes with ancient junk from my predecessor
[08:52] <MooDoo> DJones: you moving jobs?
[08:53] <mungbean> maybe i'll shake peoples hands with my left hand only today
[08:53] <JamesTait> mungbean, that's the handshake of the Scouting movement.  Or used to be, at least.
[08:53] <MartijnVdS> JamesTait: yay! a day for me!
[08:54] <DJones> Not really, been working here as self employed on a part time basis since February, they've just asked me to go full time and take over the full job so the guy who'd ding it now can retire
[08:54] <mungbean> high fives MartijnVdS with his left hand
[08:54] <Myrtti> uhoh
[08:54] <DJones> I thought left handed shakes were the Freemasons
[08:54] <MartijnVdS> DJones: only in private
[08:54] <MooDoo> well kinda congrats then ;)
[08:54] <mungbean> they do funny finger things
[08:54] <MartijnVdS> mungbean: that's gangstas
[08:55] <mungbean> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2MZOBleh0uk
[08:55] <mungbean> i think freemasonry was just a childrens club invented in a garden shed
[08:56] <MooDoo> one sock up one down?
[08:56] <DJones> MooDoo: Thats just school kids
[08:56] <DJones> At least the ones from the local comprehensive anyway
[08:56] <MooDoo> heh
[08:56] <mungbean> was up feeding baby last night so i thought i'd have a look at the perseids. bit overrated, no?
[08:57] <MooDoo> never saw any myself.
[08:57] <DJones> The nearest I got to seeing them was flashing lights when I shut my eyes just before snoring
[08:57] <dwatkins> mungbean: http://i.imgur.com/zRmjIRb.jpg ;)
[08:58] <mungbean> lovely dwatkins i'll send to my wife for her laptop wallpaper :D
[08:58] <DJones> dwatkins: The original photo for that would make a great desktop wallpaper
[08:58] <dwatkins> mungbean: in that case, there's a gallery here http://imgur.com/a/wGZUA?gallery
[08:58] <mungbean> the perseids are about one streak/shooting star effect every few minutes
[08:58] <dwatkins> no idea where the photo is from
[08:59] <dwatkins> that reminds me, I should look out for them tonight, although I doubt I could get an exposure photo this awesome: http://pcdn.500px.net/42957746/63ddc3a5d612260ca52ef9ffd98bcae58c65de5e/2048.jpg
[08:59] <MartijnVdS> dwatkins: cool!
[08:59] <MooDoo> dwatkins: yeah you could
[09:00] <dwatkins> I might have to take my 350D into the Pentlands with a tripod.
[09:00] <mungbean> perseids only look good on a long exposure, rather than naked eye ;)
[09:00] <dwatkins> ah ok, I was hoping I'd at least see the odd shooting star or two
[09:01] <dwatkins> no idea about long exposure stuff, I'd need to read up on times and aperture settings
[09:01] <dwatkins> I have a lens that goes down to F1.8, though.
[09:01] <JamesTait> I used to understand all that stuff.
[09:01] <JamesTait> I'll have to relearn it.
[09:01] <mungbean> i took a picture of the moon in the city
[09:02] <dwatkins> I was tempted to make a controller for my camera for the Nintendo DS.
[09:02] <mungbean> my neighbours security light kept coming on though
[09:02] <JamesTait> Instead, I spent a couple of hours experimenting with settings and getting some nice photos of stars, with the occasional streak across them.
[09:02] <dwatkins> http://www.gizmag.com/nintendo-ds-digital-slr-controller/14746/ for the curious
[09:02] <MooDoo> dwatkins: 1.8's are good, i have a 35mm
[09:07]  * dwatkins discovers custom searches in Chrome
[09:08] <dwatkins> that makes life a lot easier
[09:08] <neuro> wp stuff
[09:08] <neuro> tis a handy one
[09:08] <MartijnVdS> custom searches?
[09:08] <brobostigon> fiber will be installed tmrw, yay
[09:08] <neuro> although searching for google becomes troublesome, so you have to prepend searching for google something with either ? or google
[09:09] <bigcalm> brobostigon: to the house?
[09:09] <neuro> brobostigon: moved to the states, have we? :)
[09:09] <brobostigon> bigcalm: not sure, i havent read all the details from my dad.
[09:09] <brobostigon> neuro: no.
[09:09] <neuro> brobostigon: just curious since you said "fiber" ;)
[09:09] <MartijnVdS> le fibre
[09:10] <bigcalm> Heh
[09:10] <neuro> brobostigon: what speeds are you going to get?
[09:11] <brobostigon> neuro: they are claming 100mbps i think.
[09:11] <neuro> who's they, just out of interest?
[09:11] <brobostigon> neuro: BT.
[09:11] <neuro> hmm
[09:11] <neuro> their FTTC only goes to 80
[09:12] <neuro> FTTP is 160-300
[09:12] <brobostigon> hmmm
[09:12] <neuro> not sure how you'd not get 160 with FTTP
[09:12] <dwatkins> MartijnVdS: http://cogdogblog.com/2011/04/08/search-shortcuts/
[09:13] <brobostigon> neuro: me neither, i am going to wait an see.
[09:13] <neuro> unless you're getting something that isn't consumer broadband, e.g. a WEES or something
[09:13] <dwatkins> now I can type "de Eintrag" and get Chrome to search http://dict.leo.org/ for example
[09:13] <neuro> but that is ridiculously expensive
[09:13] <brobostigon> agreed neuro
[09:13] <neuro> 100 each way would be nice though :D
[09:14] <brobostigon> neuro: oh yes, :)
[09:14] <neuro> for purely lawful reasons of course
[09:14] <neuro> *cough*
[09:15] <brobostigon> lol. :D
[09:15] <neuro> mind you, watching an ubuntu torrent run at 100Mbps is rather scary
[09:15] <neuro> i've done that a few times on one of my dedicated thingies
[09:16] <brobostigon> i use mirror.ox.ac.uk/debian myself, pretty fast already.
[09:16] <neuro> no, i mean watching the uploads
[09:17] <brobostigon> ah,
[09:17] <neuro> watching iftop is just nuts :)
[09:17] <brobostigon> :)
[09:19] <neuro> i'm waiting patiently for vodafone to get back to me
[09:19] <DJones> Ooh, Fibre to cabinet for my exchange is scheduled to go live from 1st September
[09:19] <neuro> to omit a stupidly long story, they decided to waive an ETF for me, and put an extra credit on my account
[09:19] <neuro> got my bill yesterday: no credit, and ETF added.
[09:19] <neuro> have mailed them back and said "thanks for lying to me"
[09:19] <neuro> will see how they take it.
[09:20] <neuro> i've asked them for the earliest date I can cancel my contract as well (without incurring additional cost) just to drive the point home
[09:20] <neuro> really unimpressed with voda lately :(
[09:21] <neuro> funny thing is, i missed a call from their "we have special offers for you" types yesterday. if they phone today, they're getting a right earful.
[09:22] <brobostigon> question, if it is fttc, then what would our connnection to that be? equal to adsl to it ?
[09:22] <neuro> depends on line length to the cab and the product selected
[09:22] <neuro> there's usually a substantial uplift from ADSL2+ speeds, especially on long lines to the exchange
[09:23] <neuro> my folks get 3Mbps at the moment, they should get 60-70 on VDSL
[09:23] <brobostigon> the nearest to here is about a mile away, roughly,
[09:24] <brobostigon> the exchange is about 2/3 mile away i would guess, i can see it from my bedroom window.
[09:24] <directhex> for me, the best part was reliability
[09:24] <directhex> my adsl2+ dropped multiple times per day. vdsl is rock solid
[09:24] <neuro> as the crow flies distance isn't always useful
[09:24] <neuro> my exchange is ~ 750m away
[09:24] <neuro> but my line lengths are 1.6-1.7km
[09:24] <brobostigon> so directhex is that most liely what Bt will do ?
[09:25] <neuro> directhex: i still get the occasional drop on sky, but pfsense just punts me over to BT automatically, then switches everything back when sky comes back up
[09:25] <neuro> BT line usually rock solid
[09:27] <neuro> DJones: don't forget that cabs need to be installed or upgraded as well, so the exchange being enabled is only step 1
[09:27] <DJones> neuro: Thats why I'm happy, they;ve just put a new cabinet in about 50 yards from our house
[09:28] <directhex> you can spot a fttc cabinet
[09:28] <directhex> they're taller, narrower, and darker, than regular cabinets
[09:28] <neuro> and they have big posters on them saying "FASTER BROADBAND IS HERE!"
[09:28] <directhex> with lots of vents for cooling
[09:28] <directhex> neuro, my cab doesn't have that branding
[09:29] <neuro> mine does
[09:29] <DJones> This one still has bollards and a trench around it
[09:29] <directhex> http://community.bt.com/t5/image/serverpage/image-id/16436iEA095A7E1BBE7C0A/image-size/original?v=mpbl-1&px=-1
[09:32] <brobostigon> just checked, yes apparently it is fttc, and uses vdsl for the lest bit.
[09:40] <popey> do other countries have cabinets by the side of the road like that?
[09:41] <mungbean> wow thats massive
[09:41] <mungbean> a friend of mine is deaf is one ear due to coming round the bend on his bike too fast aged about 10 and smacking into one
[09:41] <popey> our local one is half open
[09:41] <popey> all the time
[09:42] <MartijnVdS> popey: we have them at the side of houses
[09:42] <mungbean> yeah, i shared earlier about one on bethnal green that the druggies use as drop offs
[09:42] <MartijnVdS> popey: or in areas that are "green" anyway
[09:42] <mungbean> often filled with vomit
[09:42] <mungbean> that looks about 6ft tall, would ruin a view from a house
[09:42] <MartijnVdS> http://goo.gl/maps/DleN3
[09:43] <MartijnVdS> http://goo.gl/maps/I0paX
[09:44] <MartijnVdS> http://goo.gl/maps/GbUxK
[09:46] <popey> its funny how these things just sit there and are mostly ignored by 99% of the population
[09:46] <brobostigon> native ipv6 would also be cool, but that would be such a huge longshot, it would be basically impossible.
[09:47] <mungbean> hiding in plain sight
[09:47] <neuro> brobostigon: BT are planning native v6 for this year
[09:47] <mungbean> the last one, why is it not next to the wall?
[09:47] <brobostigon> like those innocous black cubes, in that Dr Who ep.
[09:47] <brobostigon> neuro: wow, amazing,
[09:49] <MartijnVdS> everyone is "planning it"
[09:49] <brobostigon> neuro: thats good to hear, where are the details of this?
[09:49] <MartijnVdS> nobody is actually "doing" it
[09:52] <neuro> brobostigon: it's buried in a release about their CGNAT pilot: http://www.thinkbroadband.com/news/5818-bt-retail-in-carrier-grade-nat-pilot.html
[09:52] <brobostigon> neuro: i see, ok let me read.
[09:53] <neuro> it's a single sentence, it won't take you long :)
[09:53] <brobostigon> i suspect i will still have to use my rpi with my tunnel and radvd, for some time to come.
[09:54] <neuro> well, yeah
[09:55] <mungbean> i think my two msot hated words atm are: phablet and xbone
[09:56]  * popey runs phablet-flash
[09:59]  * neuro is waiting patiently for the xbox one release date
[09:59] <mungbean> did anyone read the article about hacking hard drive controller boards?
[09:59] <neuro> hope it's not too much longer after the battlefield 4 release date :P
[09:59] <mungbean> http://spritesmods.com/?art=hddhack
[10:03] <davmor2> Morning all
[10:04] <MooDoo> morning da
[10:04] <MooDoo> morning davmor2
[10:07] <davmor2> morning Moo hit enter instead of tab did we ;)
[10:07] <MooDoo> davmor2: no just being street this morning word.... ;)
[10:07] <MooDoo> ahem
[10:07] <davmor2> haha
[10:10] <mungbean> weird. i have a strimmer with a nylon type of "blade" line, but it breaks if you fart if the vicinity of it
[10:16] <mungbean> makes it useless
[10:17] <MooDoo> well don't fart then
[10:18] <popey> or fart further away
[10:19] <mungbean> i think even a spider fart will break the linie
[10:19] <mungbean> breaks every 30 seconds
[10:22] <popey> dunno where I got mine from, but mine doesn't break
[10:23] <mungbean> you have real blade though?
[10:23] <popey> no
[10:23] <mungbean> oh
[10:23] <popey> thick wire
[10:23] <mungbean> thought you had super duper strimmer
[10:23] <popey> it's petrol, but still has plastic wire stuff
[10:23] <mungbean> gonna do some ebaying/amazonning for some stronger wire
[10:24] <mungbean> trouble is, the grass i wanna cut is off the lawn, so interspersed with thicker weeds
[10:24] <MooDoo> mungbean: just get a thicker grade strimmer wire, although to be honest they all break quite a lot
[10:25] <mungbean> man, work is boring during summer season
[10:25] <mungbean> cannot do anything because everyone else is off
[10:26] <dwatkins> I have more and more cases each day in the summer.
[10:26] <jussi> mungbean: Frustrating is the word I have for it...
[10:26] <MooDoo> we get quieter as more and more are of, come sept, it'll be a knightmare
[10:26]  * TheOpenSourcerer drilled out the hole a bit in his strimmer and went from a 1.8mm to a 2.4mm line - that's much better.
[10:26] <jussi> (given Im a sales man, and Finland is off in July, rest of europe in august)
[10:26] <TheOpenSourcerer> Petrol strimmer.
[10:27] <mungbean> have to test an application running on 50 pcs later
[10:27] <jussi> TheOpenSourcerer: good idea. what kind do you have?
[10:27] <mungbean> gonna be tedious
[10:27] <MooDoo> mungbean: all linux or windows/mac/other
[10:28] <mungbean> gonna be x-displaying application from a cluster to a win box, massive kludge
[10:28] <TheOpenSourcerer> Can't recall now - it's fairly small and has the bend in the main tube (so it's not as robust as the completely straight fixed drive models professionals use).
[10:28] <mungbean> need to test if the 50 pcs can do it simulatenously without a bottleneck
[10:30] <MooDoo> anyone got $23 million to get the edge made?
[10:30] <dwatkins> Shuttleworth?
[10:30] <jussi> TheOpenSourcerer: not a Partner brand?
[10:30] <jussi> TheOpenSourcerer: I have one of these: http://www.alpinagarden.com/products/en/brushcutters-trimmers/white-range/petrol-brushcutters/b-28-j.html
[10:31] <MooDoo> dwatkins: I doubt even he'd put the rest in
[10:31] <dwatkins> shame, MooDoo
[10:31] <TheOpenSourcerer> jussi: Yours has the straight drive so should be able to cope with thick line easily.
[10:32] <jussi> TheOpenSourcerer: yeah, not sure whats on it now anyway, but it breaks quite often and the tap and go on that thing is rubbish
[10:32] <mungbean> i think i have this http://www.amazon.co.uk/Bosch-Easytrim-Electric-Trimmer-Diameter/dp/B0007P24UW
[10:33] <TheOpenSourcerer> I bought mine from B&Q *years* ago (~12) and still going strong. Cost £99 IIRC.
[10:33] <TheOpenSourcerer> It's got a small Briggs & Stratton motor
[10:34] <mungbean> "This is incredibly useless and a complete waste of money. Just does not do what it is sold to. I have yet to trim the grass edge yet for more than five seconds without the trimming line breaking. Then it takes two minutes to feed through again. I am so annoyed at this happening I have come in from the garden specifically to write this review as it happens every single time. Now going to go back out into the garden with a pair of scissors for t
[10:35] <TheOpenSourcerer> Strimming cord varies from manufacturer to manufacturer. Even the same weight I find breaks really easily from some places and not from others.
[10:35] <TheOpenSourcerer> tl;dr When you find a line that's strong enough buy loads of it.
[10:35] <AlanBell> I have a little petrol strimmer from Argos, was about £50
[10:36] <AlanBell> I have no idea how they manage to make a petrol engine for that price
[10:36] <mungbean> should the cord last for more than a couple of minutes?
[10:36] <TheOpenSourcerer> depends what your are trying to strim with it mungbean
[10:37] <AlanBell> you are supposed to just let the end of the cord do the cutting
[10:37] <AlanBell> don't press it up hard against things
[10:38] <mungbean> oooer
[10:38] <AlanBell> every few minutes you would thump it down to release a bit more cord
[10:38] <TheOpenSourcerer> Mine auto-feeds
[10:42] <mungbean> also, on the topic of gardens
[10:42] <mungbean> my shears are rubbish and blunt
[10:42] <mungbean> should i get a nice pair or buy a sharpening stone?
[10:52] <popey> yes
[11:01] <MooDoo> yay just got my first ever 1TB drive....lol
[11:02] <DJones> mungbean: Forget shears, go for one of these http://www.trueswords.com/grim-reaper-monster-scythe-80in-p-3350.html
[11:02] <DJones> And then get the sharpening stone
[11:04] <mungbean> wow
[11:04] <mungbean> "The reaper scythe is the most ubiquitous symbol known to mankind"
[11:07] <DJones> I don't know whether I'd agree with that, I only ever think of it in terms of Bill & Teds Excellent Adventure
[11:08] <mungbean> and family guy
[11:09] <DJones> Never watched that
[11:16] <dwatkins> How can something be the "most ubiquitous" anything?
[11:16] <MartijnVdS> the very most ubiquitousest
[11:17] <dwatkins> the most omnipresent thing which was found everywhere the most...
[11:27]  * DJones looks out of the window at the amount of rain coming down, blames friends from Finland coming here and going camping
[11:28] <MartijnVdS> DJones: wait.. it only rains if there are people visiting from overseas?
[11:28] <MartijnVdS> s/if/when/
[11:28] <brobostigon> no rain here yet.
[11:28] <DJones> MartijnVdS: Not quite, it only rains when there's people camping
[11:30] <mungbean> after we were talking about these , i noticed one as i was going to the cafe for lunch
[11:30] <mungbean> http://i.imgur.com/SgKIWtX.jpg
[11:31] <mungbean> you have to look for them to notice them, massive as they are
[11:31] <mungbean> also, what you people think happens in here? http://i.imgur.com/1jAfBax.jpg
[11:34] <MartijnVdS> mungbean: freenode hq
[11:34] <mungbean> fact: there used to be a nuclear reactor in there
[11:34] <MartijnVdS> iReactorCore?
[11:35] <shauno> those green street cabinets have been driving me nuts lately.  I had to snail mail something for the first time in 10+ years. the post office here use little green boxes.  turns out, *everyone* uses little green boxes here.  phone, electric, cable ..
[11:35] <Myrtti> it's pissing down here too, so don't blame us
[11:35] <MartijnVdS> shauno: where's that?
[11:35] <shauno> ireland
[11:35] <MartijnVdS> shauno: those aren't little, are they?
[11:35] <MartijnVdS> shauno: I mean.. http://www.flickr.com/photos/treenaks/8136316676/
[11:36] <shauno> went looking for a postbox, and have been seeing little green boxes *Everywhere* ever since
[11:36] <MartijnVdS> they're quite obviously post boxes
[11:36] <DJones> Myrtti: Ah well, can't blame Finland then
[11:36] <shauno> ours look nothing like that
[11:36] <MartijnVdS> shauno: that one is in Ireland..
[11:36] <mgdm> There's a particular style of green street cabinet used in Glasgow. They all appear with a similar railing and a distinctive manhole nearby. Apparently, it's the vents for some kind of utility tunnel
[11:37] <mgdm> once you see them once, you see them everywhere ;-)
[11:37] <mgdm> well, along the line
[11:38] <shauno> MartijnVdS: around here I'm more likely to find something like http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-35sHBVDfQnI/TlWNpckQOSI/AAAAAAAAJOY/hUSg9LdUbfA/s1600/2011-08-25+001+002+%2528375x500%2529.jpg
[11:38] <MartijnVdS> shauno: awwww, cute :)
[11:41] <shauno> I just never realised how many of these street cabinets there are until I went looking for a "little green box".  Turns out there's three within 10 meters of my house, and I apparently completely tuned them out
[11:42] <mungbean> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fnord
[11:42] <mungbean> It is a subliminal message technique, a word that the majority of the population since early childhood has been trained to ignore (and, of course, trained to forget both the training and the fact that they are ignoring it), but which they associate with a vague sense of unease. Upon seeing the word, readers experience a panic reaction. They then subconsciously suppress all memories of having seen the word, but the sense of panic remains. They t
[11:47] <MartijnVdS> they t....
[11:47] <MartijnVdS> it cut off
[11:48] <shauno> heh, it's enough to see the parallel
[11:49] <shauno> it's also left me wondering what on earth I'm goign to do with 9 spare airmail stamps.  at my current rate of usage, I'll be dead before I've finished this little book
[11:50] <mungbean>  They then subconsciously suppress all memories ofhaving seen the word, but the sense of panic remains.
[11:50] <mungbean> which reminds me, i have a load of virgin media junk mail to return
[11:59] <MartijnVdS> mungbean: imagine being dyslexic and not being able to see "Ford"
[12:00] <shauno> not a great example, you wouldn't be missing much
[12:00] <mungbean> or skyrim..http://i.imgur.com/5MeYa4n.jpg
[12:00] <MartijnVdS> shauno: "You crashed into *another* Ford?"
[12:00] <MartijnVdS> shauno: </insurance-agent>
[12:22] <mungbean> cover of this months time magazine..BEEEEES! http://www.time.com/time/magazine/europe/0,9263,901130819,00.html
[12:27] <SuperMatt> huh, just looking at an article on ars about canonical
[12:27] <SuperMatt> someone spouting that canonical just doesn't commit as much to the kernel as red hat does
[12:27] <SuperMatt> 0.8% compared to 8%
[12:28] <SuperMatt> then I looked at the numbers. Red hat has about 10x as many employees as canonical
[12:28] <mungbean> is that an old article?
[12:28] <MartijnVdS> SuperMatt: those people always come out of the woodwork
[12:28] <MartijnVdS> mungbean: no, today's article I think
[12:28] <SuperMatt> so if we do the math, on a per employee basis, canonical is doing just as well as red hat
[12:28] <mungbean> also, its the kernel. i thin the kernel is in good health
[12:28] <MartijnVdS> the salespeople should write kernel patches too!
[12:29] <SuperMatt> considering canonical's far smaller staffing, you've really got to hand it to them for doing what they're doing!
[12:29] <mungbean> i think they are doing too much
[12:30] <SuperMatt> it's possible they may stretch themselves too thin
[12:30] <mungbean> yes
[12:30] <mungbean> very
[12:30] <directhex> mungbean, what's the matter? you can't stand the sight of a strong fnord woman?
[12:30] <mungbean> rapid expansion tends to make your cake collapse
[12:31] <SuperMatt> I also don't like that people say that canonical never contribute. Redhat 6 and Debian 5 both use upstart
[12:32] <SuperMatt> wait, no
[12:32] <SuperMatt> debian never got around to upstart
[12:32] <mungbean> most people who complain are blogtards or "media"
[12:32] <SuperMatt> but chromeos and android us it
[12:34] <mungbean> i've finished reading the internet
[12:34] <mungbean> bored now
[12:35] <SuperMatt> aww man
[12:35] <SuperMatt> that must suck
[12:35] <MartijnVdS> mungbean: have you read reddit's /new?
[12:35] <SuperMatt> especially as it means you've probably watched all the porn too
[12:35] <SuperMatt> you must be a little sore
[12:36] <mungbean> feeling demotivated
[12:37] <SuperMatt> did I just see click packages appear in my updates?
[12:37] <SuperMatt> yes I did :)
[12:37] <SuperMatt> oh sneaky, they appeared a week ago!
[12:38]  * mungbean hasn't moved from 12.04
[12:38] <davmor2> SuperMatt: no I think it is the click system rather than a click package maybe
[12:38] <SuperMatt> sure sure
[12:38] <SuperMatt> that's what I meant
[12:38] <mungbean> no compelling features since then
[12:38] <SuperMatt> but it means my pc now has the ability to install them
[12:39] <davmor2> SuperMatt: that has been in for a while it just got updated
[12:39] <SuperMatt> oh right /o\
[12:39] <SuperMatt> show how much attention I'm paying
[12:40]  * mungbean takes a look at owncloud 5.x
[12:40] <SuperMatt> I hope that other distros pick up click packages, it'd be nice to finally have one package management system that is consistant across distros
[12:40] <SuperMatt> mungbean: it's awesome
[12:41] <SuperMatt> I've been running my own for a few months now
[12:41] <mungbean> vs v4 ?
[12:41] <mungbean> i've run v4 for lon gitme
[12:41] <mungbean> logtime
[12:41] <mungbean> agh
[12:41] <SuperMatt> I don't know about vs v4
[12:41] <SuperMatt> all I know is that I got tired of relying on other companies for stuff like this, and 5 had just been released
[12:41] <SuperMatt> so I dived in
[12:42] <mungbean> it saved my butt when a colleague kicked over my pc and the drive died
[12:42] <SuperMatt> ouch
[12:43] <mungbean> i do worry about security though
[12:43] <SuperMatt> anything in particular?
[12:43] <mungbean> only have firewall allowing by IP atm
[12:44] <mungbean> upgrading OC is manual atm
[12:44] <mungbean> and you miss the updates
[12:44] <mungbean> or too busy and your precious data could get pwned
[12:47] <mungbean> oh, it's on repos now for 12.04 and above
[12:56]  * SuperMatt nods
[12:56] <SuperMatt> and they have their own repos, which I install from
[13:35] <Azelphur> ali1234: https://www.dropbox.com/s/x3mdtug3uu6qnqq/2013-08-13%2014.28.21.jpg
[13:38] <popey> they arrived then?
[13:40] <Azelphur> popey: they did indeed :)
[13:40] <popey> nice, they chugging along?
[13:40] <Azelphur> I love how ghetto engineering they are, USB cables that don't fit, no power supplies, not painted properly, rickety fans and they literally smell.
[13:40] <popey> hah
[13:40] <Azelphur> but yep, chugging along :D
[13:41] <Azelphur> this is what $4k gets you in bitcoinland, haha
[13:41] <popey> hah
[13:47] <popey> once everyone has their BL asic, will the difficulty ramp up quickly do you think?
[13:50] <Azelphur> popey: everybody does have it, and difficulty is ramping up quickly
[13:50] <Azelphur> that was expected, though
[13:51] <Azelphur> difficulty is set to jump from 37 mill to 50 mill
[13:51] <popey> yeah
[13:52] <Azelphur> so while I'm making £160/day right now
[13:52] <Azelphur> that's gonna drop real fast
[13:53] <Azelphur> prolly be £100/day by the end of the week :p
[14:23] <Seeker`> Azelphur: did you really spend $4k on bitcoin mining?
[14:23] <Azelphur> Seeker`: yup
[14:23] <Seeker`> why?
[14:23] <Azelphur> because...profit?
[14:24] <shauno> it sounds like that's where the 4k came from in the first place, so re-seeding some of it seems sensible enough
[14:24] <davmor2> Seeker`: at £160-£100 per day 4K is made back in just over a month
[14:24] <Azelphur> shauno: correct :)
[14:25] <Azelphur> davmor2: your math is dodgy, it's just over two weeks.
[14:25] <Azelphur> :P
[14:26] <davmor2> Azelphur: I was basing it on the £100 a day rather than the 160
[14:27] <Azelphur> davmor2: ah :)
[14:27] <shauno> £100-160 is 2-3 weeks if $4K is USD rather than lazy typists
[14:28] <Azelphur> yea, it's USD
[14:28] <Azelphur> technically it was 3.9, but I say 4 because lazy.
[14:28] <Azelphur> but yea, why did I buy them? because...buttloads of money.
[14:28] <Azelphur> :D
[14:39]  * DJones tries to think of a reason not to wait for the release of the nexus 7-2 as he wants a new tablet and work will be paying
[14:45] <DJones> Wonder what the chances of getting an Ubuntu install on it will be
[14:59] <mungbean> reddit enhancement suite now wants to access data on 14 other websites ...hmm
[15:00] <neuro> yeah
[15:00] <neuro> sites it pulls images from
[15:00] <neuro> like imgur, meme sites, etc
[15:01] <mungbean> seemed to work before, what changed?
[15:01] <neuro> new sites
[15:01] <SuperMatt> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-23680689
[15:01] <SuperMatt> if anything proves that web filters don't work, it's this
[15:02] <mungbean> will probably block the bible too
[15:03] <neuro> aha here it is
[15:03] <neuro> 2 new sites added to the image viewer
[15:03] <neuro> so it's gone from 12 to 14 sites
[15:03] <neuro> shows how concerned you were when you installed it ;)
[15:04] <mungbean> maybe i'd like the option not to include extra sites..
[15:04] <neuro> then you'll lose functionality
[15:04] <neuro> http://www.reddit.com/r/Enhancement/search?q=permissions&sort=hot&restrict_sr=on
[15:05] <mungbean> its foolish to do it atm though
[15:05] <mungbean> people are twitchy about snooping
[15:06] <neuro> because?
[15:06] <mungbean> nobody was missing those feature so they probably lost a whole bunch of users now
[15:06] <mungbean> i don't use the image expandos
[15:06] <neuro> nobody was missing the inline image expandos?
[15:07] <mungbean> A bunch were added: livememe, mediacrush, etc. -- especially after quickmeme got kibbutzed.
[15:07] <neuro> i would have missed it :)
[15:07] <mungbean> i don't visit subs with memes
[15:07] <mungbean> nor do lots of other users
[15:08] <neuro> so why don't you fork res and make your own?
[15:08] <neuro> one that doesn't do inline images
[15:08] <mungbean> or just disable it
[15:10] <neuro> you'd need to remove the feature
[15:10] <neuro> even if the feature is click-enableable/disableable (are they words?!), the plugin still needs the perms to do stuff when the feature is enabled
[15:11] <neuro> and perms are set at install/upgrade time in chrome
[15:12] <neuro> and yes, Inline Image Viewer has a big ass "on/off" button in the res settings :)
[15:12] <neuro> just that the permissions are required because you may actually switch it on
[15:19] <mungbean> i guess so
[15:19] <mungbean> chrome doesn't help in that it wouldn't tell you the sites
[15:19] <dwatkins> perhaps there's a plugin to monitor other plugins...
[15:25] <daftykins> ah-har another patch tuesday is here
[16:00] <neuro> bah
[16:00] <neuro> bloody apple display crapped out on me
[16:00] <neuro> had to reboot :(
[16:00] <neuro> i feel slightly filthy having to reboot a mac
[16:03] <bigcalm> neuro: you're the one using a mac in the 1st place
[16:03] <neuro> wut? :)
[16:04] <daftykins> uh-oh, don't go there
[16:04] <neuro> i mean filthy as in having to reboot a unix system
[16:04] <daftykins> neuro: can't you recover from that?
[16:05] <neuro> daftykins: i opened the macbook to bring it out of clamshell and eventually it deigned to give me the internal display back, but unplugging and unplugging the mini DP didn't bring the lcd back
[16:05] <neuro> so decided to reboot
[16:05] <neuro> i've had a few gpu related funnies lately, i'm starting to think the intel 3000 isn't designed for hard use
[16:07] <daftykins> what's 'hard use' ?
[16:07] <neuro> driving a 27" LCD
[16:07] <neuro> a lot
[16:07] <neuro> while in clamshell mode (hot)
[16:08] <neuro> i'm starting to think my 15" mbp should be my primary machine for work, not my 13"
[16:08] <neuro> at least it has a GT650M
[16:08] <neuro> pain in the bum to switch over though
[16:09] <popey> wondering what to do with an old laptop
[16:09] <daftykins> i certainly wouldn't be blaming the on-die graphics just for driving an external display
[16:09]  * popey checks ebay for current prices
[16:09] <daftykins> popey: what kind of spec?
[16:09] <neuro> daftykins: i'm hoping it's a one off tbh
[16:09] <popey> oldish
[16:09] <daftykins> hah
[16:09] <neuro> 386?
[16:09] <neuro> 486?
[16:10] <popey> http://www.ebay.co.uk/ctg/Toshiba-Portege-M400-12-1-Tablet-PC-Customized-/118259882
[16:10] <popey> one of them
[16:10] <neuro> Centrino?
[16:10] <popey> ish
[16:10] <popey> c2d
[16:10] <neuro> waaaaaat?
[16:10] <neuro> dude, that laptop is like well broken
[16:10] <daftykins> centrino is a combination of intel processor, chipset and wireless card, not a processor
[16:10] <popey> hah
[16:10] <neuro> the screen's like hanging off man
[16:10] <popey> :D
[16:10] <neuro> daftykins: yes yes i know
[16:10] <daftykins> :P
[16:11] <neuro> i've lived through it all
[16:11] <popey> never ever used it as a touch thing
[16:11] <daftykins> and yet misused it :(
[16:11] <neuro> centrino, vPro, yadda yadda
[16:11] <neuro> not necessarily
[16:11] <diddledan> vPro doesn't make sense to me
[16:11]  * neuro avoids the rest of this conversation thread :)
[16:11] <neuro> they always seem to get me into trouble :)
[16:11] <diddledan> lol
[16:11] <daftykins> XD
[16:12] <daftykins> mistakes do that :<
[16:12] <daftykins> ;)
[16:12] <daftykins> right, should really do something about this RAID with a dead disk
[16:12] <neuro> yes
[16:12] <neuro> please do something other than start to wind me up :)
[16:12] <diddledan> yes, do that
[16:12] <daftykins> though people that don't reply to emails frustrate me
[16:12]  * diddledan pushes archive on daftykins ' email
[16:12] <neuro> vodafone not replying is frustrating me
[16:12] <neuro> i may have to hassle their twitter types
[16:13] <daftykins> diddledan: harsh :(
[16:13] <diddledan> neuro, write to the big cheese
[16:13] <diddledan> neuro, my brother did that and got a load of discounts and freebie phone
[16:14] <neuro> hehe
[16:14] <daftykins> must be a really impatient guy
[16:14] <daftykins> 'oh just pay them off and get rid of them!'
[16:14] <neuro> streisand effect
[16:14] <neuro> companies don't want hassle
[16:15] <neuro> and CEOs generally don't want hassled, full stop
[16:15] <diddledan> he complained about a salesperson trying to convince him to stay by stating that vodafone's mobile signal is better than EE's because , and I quote, "our transmitters are connected via fibre optic cables"
[16:15] <daftykins> neuro: i love how you take what we're all thinking and type it <3
[16:15] <daftykins> diddledan: lmao, that's ace
[16:16] <neuro> PAs will interdict crap like that and bounce it off to the full monty customer retentions
[16:16] <neuro> daftykins: i'm awesome that way
[16:16] <neuro> diddledan: and EE's aren't? :)
[16:16] <neuro> "Hi, we're EE, we have an awesome 4G LTE network, but our mast backhaul network is made up of the intertwined fur from kittens!"
[16:16] <diddledan> neuro, it doesn't matter whether they are or not. how does connecting it via fibre improve wireless propagation?
[16:16] <neuro> exactly
[16:16]  * AlanBell wonders how ali1234's race game is getting on
[16:17] <neuro> to be honest, the frequency is more of an issue
[16:17] <neuro> 900MHz beats 1800MHz
[16:17] <daftykins> nothing like a spot of QAM in the afternoon
[16:18] <diddledan> tasty
[16:18] <neuro> :)
[16:18] <neuro> i love the smell of GSM in the morning
[16:19] <MartijnVdS> QEMM386?
[16:20] <diddledan> o_O
[16:20] <diddledan> I don't know that reference
[16:20] <neuro> the memory management geeks are over that way ->
[16:20] <diddledan> aah
[16:20] <neuro> i guess that's one way to estimate the age of someone :)
[16:20] <diddledan> dos days
[16:20] <neuro> CONFIG.SYS mofo!
[16:20] <popey> so doesn't look like Id get much for my laptop
[16:21] <popey> its a bit tatty
[16:21] <neuro> hold onto it then
[16:21] <popey> it runs ubuntu fine
[16:21] <daftykins> popey: did look a fair bit chunky
[16:21] <neuro> maybe give it away / sell it cheap at a LUG meet or something?
[16:21] <diddledan> neuro, I kinda missed the emm386 days because my pc was too old to have extended/expanded ram and I jumped from that straight to w95
[16:21] <neuro> the windows 95 startup sound just played in my head
[16:21] <popey> DOS=HIGH
[16:22] <neuro> that was a bit harrowing
[16:22] <diddledan> popey, DOS=HIGH,UMB ftw
[16:22] <neuro> UMB \o/
[16:22] <popey> indeed
[16:22] <neuro> i replaced my startup sound with the PlayStation boot noise
[16:22] <diddledan> gotta remember to put it in the UMB
[16:22] <neuro> best boot noise ever
[16:22] <popey> i used to get calls from friends to go to their house to optimise their config.sys
[16:22] <popey> dont know that noise
[16:22] <neuro> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ekqYhP8PhMg
[16:23] <popey> ya, tis good
[16:23] <diddledan> popey, shame linux wasn't mainstream enough back then
[16:23] <popey> [APPROVED]
[16:23] <popey> nah, shame I wasnt into linux back then
[16:23] <popey> some fat oaf at college first showed it to me
[16:23] <popey> i later saw him on the beer train, a year or two back
[16:24] <popey> i should thank him.
[16:24] <diddledan> neuro, I'd forgotten all about that awesoem startup noise of the ps1
[16:24] <daftykins> haha
[16:24]  * popey looks for other things to ebay
[16:25] <AlanBell> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/181194059541
[16:25] <AlanBell> is what I am ebaying at the moment
[16:25]  * popey cringes at games out of their boxes
[16:26] <AlanBell> yeah, we threw them all away
[16:26] <AlanBell> all cd and DVD cases too
[16:26] <diddledan> popey, aye, games without boxes are evil incarnate!
[16:26] <diddledan> I miss the old-style boxes that took up loads of shelf-space
[16:27] <AlanBell> unneccessary bulk :)
[16:27] <diddledan> thankyou mist
[16:28] <diddledan> now, to reset my password..
[16:28] <diddledan> :-p
[16:28] <diddledan> I wonder what's actually broken
[16:28] <diddledan> sysadmin in me wants to know
[16:30] <popey> http://myworld.ebay.co.uk/popeydc  <- stuff I am ebaying :D
[16:30] <daftykins> but the scratch potential!
[16:32] <AlanBell> is a second hand YubiKey a good idea?
[16:32] <celesteh> Hello, I'm working on an art project about surveillance and I just read that London bins are recording the MAC addresses of everyone who walks by.  Is there an easy linux tool to do this with?
[16:32] <popey> its not second hand
[16:32] <AlanBell> the london bins are not doing that any more celesteh
[16:33] <celesteh> AlanBell: that's good but I still am interested in doing it for a small art installation (data would not be kept afterwards...)
[16:33] <daftykins> yeah it got called off already
[16:34] <ali1234> http://www.aircrack-ng.org/
[16:34] <daftykins> or just 'kismet'
[16:34] <ali1234> kismet never worked for me
[16:34] <daftykins> uh-huh
[16:35] <celesteh> ta alil234
[16:35] <diddledan> yeah, tab-complete ftw
[16:37] <diddledan> this sucks, I need to install photoshop
[16:39] <diddledan> I would say I hate when clients bypass our internal design team by providing their own psd's but it does give me more leeway when it comes to slicing and dicing the file to usable assets
[17:36] <Guest2162> Hello?
[17:38] <Guest2162> Can anyone see these messages?
[17:38] <popey> Guest2162: yes
[17:38] <Guest2162> Oh. Sorry, I thought I might have to make an account or something.
[17:38] <Guest2162> This is basically an open support chatroom, right?
[17:39] <popey> yeah, effectively
[17:40] <Guest2162> Great. I'm just about to set up Windows 8 and Ubuntu 13.04 Dual Boot and wanted to make sure I'd have some on the spot help.
[17:40] <popey> #ubuntu is the official support channel, but we're here too
[17:41] <daftykins> probably easier to follow here ^_^
[17:41] <Guest2162> If I know you're on UK soil, I can find you and kill you when you trick me into burning my hard-drive.
[17:42] <Guest2162> I'll be sure to ignore any advice involving lighters.
[17:42] <neuro> wtf?
[17:42] <diddledan> hint, petrol + maritime flare
[17:42] <popey> oooooohkay
[17:42] <Guest2162> Oh. Thanks, diddledan. I guess that'll do it. I'll be right back with the results.
[17:43] <diddledan> :-)
[17:43] <popey> its okay I'm busting open a laptop power supply, I'll be dead before you get here
[17:43] <diddledan> ergh, Jono, kill the lawyers! :-p
[17:44] <Guest2162> You'll live on in this channel forever.
[17:47] <popey> well, till the logs get deleted anyway
[17:48] <neuro> rm -f $(grep -iw -e neuro -e popey -e bum -e lollipops -e "Windows 8" /data/logs/*.log | cut -d: -f1 | sort | uniq)
[17:48] <Guest2162> Does anyone know if I might be able to run Windows 8 in a Virtual Box by using recovery media?
[17:49] <popey> yay, fixed without dying
[17:49] <Guest2162> I don't have the installation media but it's the next best thing.
[17:49] <Guest2162> And congratulations.
[17:49] <neuro> laptop power supply?
[17:49] <neuro> pshaw
[17:49] <neuro> what's that, like 3A?
[17:50] <neuro> i had a poweredge PSU electrocute me once, that wasn't fun
[17:50] <Guest2162> Electrify. Electrocution is when you die. Sorry to be a pedant.
[17:50] <diddledan> an old CRT power rail will give you the biggest jolt out of consumer electronics
[17:50] <neuro> Guest2162: vmware workstation used to be able to do something like that
[17:50] <neuro> and pedantry is fine in my book
[17:51] <neuro> i do it all the time in here
[17:51] <neuro> bloody CRTs
[17:51] <neuro> glad to see the back of them
[17:51] <diddledan> me too
[17:51] <neuro> before my hearing started to go i could hear them whine
[17:51] <neuro> hated it
[17:51] <diddledan> 12000V isn't a good idea to have in your living-room
[17:52] <neuro> do you keep gas lasers in your living room or something?
[17:52] <diddledan> CRTs use something around there, don't they?!
[17:52] <neuro> to the internets!
[17:53] <Guest2162> Sorry to interrupt, but the messages with the yellow nametag, are those part of the private chat thing I see in XChat?
[17:53] <neuro> good question
[17:53] <popey> its just people who mentioned your name
[17:53] <popey> i think
[17:53] <diddledan> they go up from 5kV to 30kV ish probably more
[17:54] <neuro> 20-50kV for NTSC 15.734 kHz devices
[17:54] <diddledan> BINGO!
[17:55] <diddledan> either that or "you sunk my submarine!"
[17:55] <neuro> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q5pESPQpXxE
[17:56] <neuro> sunk my battleship, shurely?
[17:56] <neuro> Guest2162: and feel free to interrupt. If we're talking crap about flyback transformers and the like, I'd say ubuntu chat takes precedence :)
[17:57]  * neuro swears at EA
[17:57] <neuro> yet again, the yanks get battlefield before us :P
[17:57] <Guest2162> I'll be sure to interrupt very frequently with my annoying quasi-issues.
[17:57] <popey> Guest2162: please do
[17:58] <neuro> and now i need to pray that the stars align and microsoft decide that the 1st of November is Novembery enough to release the xbox one on
[17:58] <ali1234> the chat on ubuntu-phone about app security and sandboxing...
[17:58] <neuro> is it boring?
[17:58] <ali1234> it's like android never happened
[17:58] <neuro> or is it a clusterfrak?
[17:58] <ali1234> the latter
[17:59] <neuro> the dangers of creating a new OS
[17:59] <neuro> wheel reinvention and shed painting
[17:59] <diddledan> the problem is ubuntu wants to still be linux whereas android doesn't
[17:59] <neuro> heh
[17:59] <ali1234> that's not really the problem at all
[17:59] <neuro> the abstraction layers are interesting
[17:59] <neuro> Google: it's Android, not Linux!
[18:00] <Guest2162> Cross your fingers everyone, I'm about to reboot into the new dual boot system.
[18:00] <neuro> Samsung / Amazon: it's not Android!
[18:00] <ali1234> Canonical: It's Ubuntu, not Linux!
[18:00] <Guest2162> And no offense intended to any amputees.
[18:00] <neuro> fingers crossed
[18:00] <neuro> lol
[18:00] <ali1234> try to find the word "linux" anywhere on ubuntu.com
[18:00] <neuro> stand back everyone, we've got a comedian here
[18:00] <diddledan> Guest2162, at least you didn't mention the midgets
[18:00] <neuro> googling for site:ubuntu.com linux gives: About 1,280,000 results (0.28 seconds)
[18:01] <diddledan> wow
[18:01] <ali1234> neuro: click on the first hit, ctrl-f, "linux" - oh look it's not there
[18:01] <diddledan> the fora aren't even hosted on a subdomain of that either
[18:01] <popey> http://www.ubuntu.com/about/about-ubuntu
[18:01] <neuro> ali1234: yeah, i know
[18:01] <neuro> i don't even know where that text is coming from
[18:02] <neuro> it's not in the meta tags
[18:02] <neuro> tho there is a "linux" keyword
[18:02] <ali1234> popey: it's not on that page either
[18:02] <popey> yes, yes it is.
[18:02] <ali1234> oh wait, i have case match turned on
[18:02] <popey> 4 occurrances
[18:02] <ali1234> yeah, it's on there, let me chek the main page again
[18:02] <neuro> melbourne:~ neuro$ curl -s http://www.ubuntu.com/about/about-ubuntu | grep -ic linux
[18:03] <neuro> 3
[18:03] <diddledan> hmm, I get the homepage first
[18:03] <popey> twice on one line neuro
[18:03] <Guest2162> Everything seems just peachy. I was worried Ubuntu wouldn't play well with my weird graphics card.
[18:03] <popey> Guest2162: how weird?
[18:03] <diddledan> with the snippet "Official site; Commercially sponsored Debian-derived Linux distribution that focuses on usability, a regular 6-month release cycle, and a commitment to at least" which I can't find on the page
[18:03] <neuro> diddledan: my point exactly
[18:03] <popey> Maxtrox Parhelia weird or SiS weird?
[18:04] <neuro> nvidia quadro?
[18:04] <Guest2162> It's an AMD card but I'm pretty sure it's one they've stopped supporting and the general concensus is that it's crap.
[18:04] <popey> aren't all AMD cards crap?
[18:04] <Guest2162> It doesn't support bloom or something. Maybe there's a technical term for it.
[18:04] <diddledan> amd eyefinity ftw
[18:05] <diddledan> Guest2162, ancient?
[18:05] <diddledan> that's a technical term for lots of breakage
[18:05] <Guest2162> Just got it up, it's the AMD HD 7660D.
[18:05] <diddledan> that's modern
[18:06] <diddledan> 7660 is that an integrated unit or discrete?
[18:06] <Guest2162> Maybe the only reason people call it crap is because of that lighting thing. I was on a gaming forum when I saw that it was evil incarnate.
[18:06]  * neuro sighs
[18:06] <neuro> seems even the voda twitter types don't want to help me
[18:06] <Guest2162> I don't know enough about computers to answer that question. Don't crucify me.
[18:07] <neuro> Guest2162: is it on the motherboard or is it an add-in card
[18:07] <Guest2162> I'm guessing it's on the motherboard. It came with the thing anyway.
[18:07] <diddledan> google says it's part of the A10 CPU
[18:07] <neuro> A10? ouch
[18:07] <Guest2162> I've got some cheapo Medion Akoya shtick that was partnered with ASDA.
[18:08] <Guest2162> At least it wasn't partnered with LIDL or something.
[18:08] <neuro> Medion: the mark of quality
[18:08] <popey> dont think I've ever been in a Lidl
[18:08] <neuro> popey: they do some good stuff in lidl actually
[18:08] <Guest2162> I don't know if there's one near me. I know there's an ALDI.
[18:08] <popey> yeah, so people keep telling me
[18:09] <neuro> probably worth a nosey one day
[18:09] <popey> there's a new morrisons near me, which apparently has a very nice selection of herbs and veg
[18:09] <popey> yeah, true
[18:09] <neuro> yeah, we're supposed to be getting a morrisons next year
[18:09] <neuro> do they do home deliveries off their interwebby site? i've never bothered to look
[18:10] <Guest2162> I've never heard of them doing home deliveries and I've never seen a delivery van of theirs.
[18:10] <diddledan> I'm a sainsbury's fanboi
[18:10] <neuro> i shall look at their website, for that is what one must do if one doesn't know something
[18:11] <neuro> ah, they're doing a deal with ocado to enable home deliveries
[18:11] <neuro> ocado already do deliveries for waitrose
[18:11] <Guest2162> They're doing a deal or it's done?
[18:11] <neuro> partnership signed in may apparently
[18:11] <neuro> morrisons buying an ocado distribution centre in warwickshire for 170m
[18:11] <neuro> http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/news/shopping/2013/05/morrisons-to-launch-home-deliveries-after-signing-ocado-deal
[18:12] <diddledan> waitrose do their own deliveries but ocado do deliveries with waitrose products available
[18:12] <neuro> ah ok
[18:12] <diddledan> ocado was originally waitrose-sponsored but waitrose have been trying to end the deal and run their own service afaicr
[18:13] <neuro> fair enough
[18:13] <neuro> waitrose are an unknown quantity to me
[18:13] <neuro> we don't have them up 'ere
[18:13] <diddledan> they're the poshyposh
[18:13] <neuro> up in the hinterlands
[18:13] <neuro> yeah, i know that much
[18:13] <Guest2162> I think there's one a little way towards Manchester near me.
[18:14] <Guest2162> Never been in one.
[18:14] <diddledan> kate of cambridge shops in waitrose on anglesea
[18:14] <ali1234> waitrose in manchester? wut
[18:14] <popey> http://jalopnik.com/google-maps-has-an-incredible-dr-who-easter-egg-1121878011
[18:14] <popey> need "old" gmaps for it to work
[18:15] <Guest2162> Is the "new" one default now or is it still opt-in?
[18:15] <neuro> opt-in
[18:15] <neuro> i still get "preview" in the url when i go there
[18:16]  * neuro opens link in incognito mode :)
[18:16] <popey> exactly what i did
[18:18] <diddledan> incognito mode: for pr0n and google maps
[18:18] <neuro> looks like something from one of those dr who experience thingamabobs
[18:19] <neuro> this is funny though: http://jalopnik.com/google-street-view-car-captures-google-street-view-bike-531205395
[18:19] <neuro> diddledan: i have no idea what you're talking about
[18:20] <Guest2162> Do you reckon they'd recover the footage if he got ran down?
[18:21] <neuro> THE FOOTAGE IS ALL THAT MATTERS
[18:21] <diddledan> Guest2162, of course, it's got important personal details of everyone nearby
[18:21] <diddledan> google needs that for adsense
[18:24] <MattJ> XMPP \o/
[18:24] <MattJ> (kinda)
[18:24] <diddledan> o_O
[18:26] <luke__> And I'm back.
[18:27] <daftykins> woohoo
[18:27] <diddledan> phew
[18:27] <luke__> How come on my laptop, I was Guest26 whatever and I have a nickname on here?
[18:28] <neuro> because the first time you joined, you joined as "luke", and someone on freenode has registered that name with nickserv
[18:28] <neuro> so nickserv changed your nick to Guestyaddayadda because you didn't auth (or couldn't auth)
[18:28] <luke__> Ah. Gotcha.
[18:29] <Myrtti> I feel like I'm spoiling myself, bought Daim cake as a birthday cake and some Angry Birds blueberry handlotion
[18:29] <Myrtti> orange Daim cake even
[18:29] <neuro> i thought you were *making* caek?
[18:29] <jussi> Myrtti: you didnt end up making one?
[18:29] <jussi> hehe
[18:29] <neuro> :)
[18:29] <Myrtti> yeah, laziness won
[18:29] <Myrtti> decided to save myself the stress
[18:29] <popey> \o/ laziness
[18:30] <jussi> btw Myrtti, a big happy birthday from all of us here.
[18:30] <jussi> Myrtti: Sari still remembers you :)
[18:30] <Myrtti> thanks
[18:32] <daftykins> Daim cake as in a cake of Daim bars? D:
[18:37] <popey> woah, since when did The Cloud become a sky company?
[18:37] <neuro> ages ago
[18:38] <neuro> january 2011, according to the internets
[18:39] <neuro> basically bootstrapped their wifi-for-broadband-customers offering fast so they could compete with BT
[18:39] <popey> blimey
[18:44] <luke__> Does anyone here use PlayOnLinux or Wine with any popular PC games?
[18:45] <daftykins> looked at Steam?
[18:45]  * neuro unfortunately uses Windows 8 to play popular PC games
[18:45] <diddledan> neuro, charlatan!
[18:45] <diddledan> that's a word I've not used, or seen used, in forever
[18:45] <neuro> wut?
[18:45] <luke__> Yeah, daftykins. A few of the games I was after are on there like Guns of Icarus Online but I wanted WoW as well.
[18:46] <neuro> you keep using this word, i do not think it means what you think it means
[18:46] <luke__> A person falsely claiming to have a special knowledge or skill; a fraud.
[18:46] <daftykins> ok just checking.
[18:46] <neuro> diddledan: you know fine well that I don't use any Linuxes on the desktop :) or at least you should
[18:47] <diddledan> heretic!
[18:47] <neuro> how does that make me a heretic?
[18:47] <diddledan> I'll get back to you on that one when I've figured out an argument
[18:47] <neuro> lol
[18:48]  * neuro points to the staggering number of ubuntu, debian and rhel servers he's had access to over the years
[18:48] <neuro> at second life, it was in the thousands
[18:48]  * diddledan glazes over
[18:50] <luke__> Do you guys know if I can open up a terminal and check on an installation is USC? PlayOnLinux has been applying changes for a good 10 minutes.
[18:50] <luke__> An installation in USC, even.
[18:50] <ali1234> USC always does that
[18:50] <ali1234> the best thing to do is not use it
[18:51] <luke__> Use Terminal instead?
[18:51] <ali1234> there is a way to check the progress
[18:51] <ali1234> but it is really complicated and i can't remember it
[18:51] <ali1234> i use synaptic for package searching and browsing
[18:51] <neuro> ps axu | grep -iw dpkg ?
[18:51] <ali1234> nah, that won't tell you much
[18:51] <ali1234> other than "dpkg is running" (or not)
[18:51] <neuro> well it would tell you if shenanigans were occurring
[18:51] <neuro> yeah
[18:52] <ali1234> USC normally gets stuck because the package DB is locked
[18:52] <ali1234> it doesn't bring up a message when that happens, it just waits forever
[18:53] <ali1234> the DB can be locked by update manager
[18:53] <hamitron> USC?
[18:53] <ali1234> software center
[18:53] <hamitron> ah yeh, I stopped using the default install because of it
[18:54] <luke__> United Space Centre.
[18:54] <luke__> I'll probably have to wait until it's stopped doing whatever it's doing to install Synaptic as well.
[18:55] <hamitron> aptitude ftw
[18:55] <hamitron> ;)
[18:55] <neuro> Unilateral Sausage Confectionery
[18:55] <neuro> aptitude, bleugh
[18:55] <luke__> You took a while thinking of that one, didn't you, Neuro?
[18:55] <neuro> why don't you just run something in java instead
[18:55] <neuro> luke__: no, not really
[18:55] <neuro> was doing something else and didn't have irc in focus :)
[18:56] <luke__> Sure. You're just making us think you're some acronym genius.
[18:56] <neuro> i am
[18:56] <ali1234> aptitude really is horrible - it has all the problems of a GUI (confusing complicated layout) combined with all the problems of a terminal app (need to memorize lots of comlicated keyboard controls) and none of the advantages of either
[18:57] <hamitron> ali1234, but it.... has a cool name
[18:57] <hamitron> ;)
[18:57] <hamitron> tbh, I like the search function
[18:57] <luke__> Is it safe for me to quit USC with this thing in progress or will that not even stop it?
[18:57] <ali1234> luke__: that probably won't even stop it
[18:58] <diddledan> it'll carry on in the background
[18:58] <ali1234> luke__: however, the background daemon that is trying to do the install has probably crashed anyway
[18:58] <luke__> I'll go and get the lighter to melt my hard drive.
[18:58] <hamitron> just install flash
[18:58] <hamitron> ;/
[18:58] <hamitron> gets my machine every time
[18:58] <luke__> ali1234, is there a way I can exorcise the demon you mentioned?
[18:59] <luke__> I think I have the new testament upstairs.
[18:59] <ali1234> luke__: the package database has a lock anyway, so if you can install packages from the terminal or some other app, it means USC isn't actually doing anything
[18:59] <ali1234> only one app can install things at a time
[18:59] <luke__> I'll see if I can install Dungeon Crawler.
[19:00] <luke__> It says something or other is in use.
[19:00] <ali1234> ok so USC daemon is still running
[19:00] <ali1234> in that case leave it for a bit
[19:00] <ali1234> how long have you been waiting so far?
[19:00] <luke__> Will speaking in tongues help? And it's been about 7-10 minutes
[19:01] <ali1234> davmor2: whhere's that log that tells us what USC is really doing again please?
[19:01] <ali1234> (brb, checking log for last time he told me)
[19:02] <diddledan> there's /var/log/apt/{history,term}.log
[19:02] <davmor2> ali1234: ~/.cache/software-center
[19:03] <ali1234> luke__: ok so try this: tail -f ~/.cache/software-center/software-center.log
[19:04] <ali1234> davmor2: thanks
[19:04] <luke__> There's some error to do with not finding typelib for LaunchpadIntegration.
[19:04] <luke__> Something to do with skipping some exhibits.
[19:05] <luke__> And at the end it says it found a running software-center on dbus, reconnecting.
[19:05] <ali1234> hmm that looks exactly the same as mine
[19:05] <ali1234> maybe this isn't the right one
[19:05] <luke__> I'm guessing I can't just pay its fare for dbus?
[19:07] <daftykins> XD
[19:07] <luke__> There's some stuff on the interwebs that says to kill the dpkg process. Do I have to find its ID or something first?
[19:07] <daftykins> loved that :)
[19:08] <daftykins> yeah process ID (PID), from ps -ef for example
[19:08] <luke__> Thanks. I'm here all week. Try the veal.
[19:08] <daftykins> :D
[19:10] <luke__> I found one mention of the unholy demon and one of "dpkg". You reckon I should just kill the one with it in the name?
[19:10] <luke__> In fact, there's a few demons. I'm blind.
[19:11] <Myrtti> oh dear.
[19:12] <luke__> Damn straight. Call me a priest.
[19:13] <luke__> I'm going to kill nautilus-drop because someone on a forum told me to.
[19:13] <ali1234> no i don't think you should kill things
[19:13] <luke__> That's not what the voices in my head tell me.
[19:15] <luke__> Well, that did bugger all.
[19:18] <luke__> I'ma relog and see if it fixes it.
[19:19] <diddledan> I wonder how many packages I'm compiling for a full openwrt archive
[19:20] <diddledan> hmm, about 2000
[19:20] <diddledan> according to wiki.openwrt.org/doc/packages
[19:22] <luke__> Huzzah! Call off the priest, it worked.
[19:22] <daftykins> i was all about to shout 'The power of Tux compells you' 'n' all :(
[19:23] <diddledan> I now pronounce you penguin and wife
[19:23] <diddledan> wait, what?
[19:23] <daftykins> that's my line
[19:24] <diddledan> hmm. my desktop needs to be bigger
[19:24] <diddledan> desk*
[19:24] <diddledan> I'm completely room'd out
[19:25] <luke__> Uhhh... How do I install Synaptic from the terminal? Is it just called synaptic?
[19:25] <diddledan> I've taken to plonking on laptop directly on top of the closed other laptop
[19:25] <diddledan> one*
[19:25] <diddledan> luke__, yeah
[19:26] <luke__> Magical.
[19:26] <diddledan> although there might be gtk and qt versions
[19:26] <diddledan> in which case they'll be suffixed -gtk and -qt
[19:26] <luke__> I don't know what that means so I'm going to assume I don't need them.
[19:27] <diddledan> by default the desktop you look at uses gtk-based ui (buttons, sliders, scrollbars, etc.)
[19:27] <hamitron> it is gtk init?
[19:27] <diddledan> hamitron, I believe so. was just throwing the possibility out there
[19:31] <luke__> Jesus Christ...
[19:32] <luke__> Is anyone seeing an updated YouTube homepage?
[19:33] <mgdm> I'm not often on it enough to know the difference
[19:33] <hamitron> the huge advert?
[19:34] <luke__> I don't think much has changed but for me the Guide GUI seems a bit different and it's not open by default
[19:34] <hamitron> it is such a "clever" site, "knowing" the type of thing I watch :(
[19:34] <mgdm> the huge advert is nothing new
[19:35] <mgdm> they have them for occasional campaigns here and there
[19:35] <luke__> I get lucky sometimes and there'll be an interview with a GoT cast member there that I haven't seen.
[19:36] <hamitron> amazing, they "know" I wanted some exercise gear and the exact thing I want is available at amazon
[19:37] <hamitron> I'm so going to give up browsing
[19:37] <ali1234> hey i've got a question
[19:38] <ali1234> why is it ok to say "turn off ad block if you like our website" but not ok to say "click on all the adverts and don't buy anything if you like our website" - ?
[19:38] <daftykins> ooh, do share.
[19:38] <daftykins> come now, you know the answer to that
[19:38] <ali1234> no, i don't
[19:38] <ali1234> as far as i am concerned they are exactly the same
[19:39] <hamitron> one is actively stopping adverts, and the other is actively milking them
[19:39] <hamitron> ;)
[19:39] <daftykins> in my opinion one provides the opportunity to legitimately consider adverts, whilst the second falsifies interest to the sponsors
[19:40] <hamitron> adverts are cool, they give you reason to be distracted and spend money
[19:40] <hamitron> ;/
[19:41] <daftykins> some make sounds i do not enjoy
[19:41] <hamitron> :\
[19:41] <mgdm> if you run video adverts on your site you get paid for them being viewed even if nobody clicks
[19:41] <ali1234> what's the difference between looking at an advert you wouldn't normally look at vs visiting a webpage you wouldn't normally visit?
[19:41] <luke__> I jump when the toaster pops up or when the kettle clicks. I get terrified when some booming voice asks me if I want to make money fast.
[19:42] <shauno> it's probably nice and straight-forward.  asking your users to click adverts is non-organic traffic that google etc will kick you off adsense for
[19:42] <ali1234> but so is asking users to turn off ad-block on just your site
[19:42] <shauno> that's not something google will banhammer you for though
[19:43] <hamitron> no, that is asking them to view the website as its creators intended
[19:43] <ali1234> i know, but that doesn't mean it's not morally the same thing
[19:43] <hamitron> ;)
[19:44] <hamitron> personally I think adblock is a really bad thing, almost as bad as invasive adverts
[19:44] <luke__> I'm pretty sure there's a window open that is' on my launchpad thing and won't show up in Alt+Tab is there any other way to get to it?
[19:44] <luke__> Sorry, "isn't on my launchpad thing".
[19:44] <ali1234> almost as bad but not quite bad enough to make me stop using it :)
[19:45] <ali1234> luke__: you mean the launcher right? launchpad is a website
[19:45] <luke__> Yeah. I was just testing you.
[19:45] <hamitron> ali1234, haha, yeh, I'm thinking from the point of view of the financial viability of some online services
[19:46] <ali1234> luke__: if it's not on the launcher and it's not on alt-tab, and you can't see any part of the window on the screen... then no. it's gone forever
[19:46] <luke__> Damn. Oh well. I don't think it's that important.
[19:48] <luke__> Well, bye guys. I'm off to sleep on a park bench.
[19:48] <daftykins> enjoy
[19:49] <hamitron> what he mean by that?
[19:49] <daftykins> the sleeping on a park bench bit?
[19:49] <hamitron> yeh
[19:49] <daftykins> not the faintest of ideas
[19:49] <daftykins> just a bit of a joker i think
[21:37] <shauno> popey: that "streisand effect" you mentioned yesterday.  if you want a cheap laugh, someone else has control of their twitter account now
[21:56] <diddledan> streisand effect?
[21:56]  * diddledan prods shauno 
[21:56] <neuro> diddledan: google it
[21:58] <linuxliam> im trying to compile aptana from source but when i cd to the source dir and run make it syas no makefile found
[21:58] <linuxliam> from here TJ https://github.com/aptana/studio3/tree/release
[22:00] <neuro> what source directory?
[22:01] <linuxliam> the source cod was taken from the github url
[22:02] <neuro> yeah but what are you trying to compile?
[22:02] <linuxliam> the IDE itself
[22:02] <linuxliam> sorry lil noobisj at this sort of thing
[22:02] <neuro> it doesn't look like that kind of source release
[22:03] <neuro> looks like they've released their code to core parts of the IDE and that's it
[22:03] <neuro> ah, i see
[22:03] <neuro> aptana is basically a bunch of add-ons for eclipse
[22:04] <neuro> so you'd need to build eclipse first
[22:04] <neuro> why are you trying to compile it anyway? what's wrong with their prebuilt downloads?
[22:05] <linuxliam> just trying to package it
[22:05] <neuro> as a deb?
[22:05] <linuxliam> yup yup
[22:06] <neuro> i'd download the eclipse plug in files and package those with eclipse as a dependency
[22:07] <neuro> the source code on github just looks like it's there to meet their chosen GPL requirements
[22:07] <linuxliam> the github code confused me a lil
[22:08] <diddledan> aparently the prebuilt package has been downloaded 6 meelion times (according to aptana.com)
[22:08] <neuro> looks pretty straightforward to install: http://www.samclarke.com/2012/04/how-to-install-aptana-studio-3-on-ubuntu-12-04-lts-precise-pangolin/
[22:08] <neuro> so i guess i'd just duplicate steps 3-4 in the deb
[22:09] <neuro> except modifying the paths appropriately to fit packaging conventions
[22:09] <neuro> and then making sure it works, i guess :)
[22:09] <linuxliam> yea i know how to install it just a few people have asked why it hasn't been packaged
[22:10] <diddledan> looks like it's EOL as aptana studio
[22:10] <diddledan> appcelerator have renamed it titanium-studio and retargetted it as a javascript ide for their mobile development sdk
[22:11] <neuro> yeah, news page is broken, twitter and facebook not updated for over a year
[22:11] <diddledan> http://www.appcelerator.com/platform/titanium-studio/
[22:11] <diddledan> no mention of webdev... at.. all
[22:14] <linuxliam> i mean i could look for a better IDe for web dev but idk i haven't found many
[22:14] <linuxliam> any ideas
[22:14] <neuro> vim
[22:15] <linuxliam> i was looking for somthing along the lines of webmatrix
[22:15] <diddledan> there aren't many full-blown IDEs. I tend to use sublime text
[22:16] <neuro> that was going to be my next suggestion :)
[22:16] <neuro> best $70 (or whatever) I've spent in a long time
[22:17] <neuro> linuxliam: best way to do web dev is to have as little abstractions as possible
[22:17] <neuro> and you're talking to someone who's done web dev on and off since 1994
[22:18] <neuro> vim, sublime text, et al ... any serious editor will do code highlighting
[22:19] <linuxliam> its more of a hobby for me used to do some when i was in college
[22:20] <linuxliam> i'd like to learn python but i cant get my head around it
[22:20] <neuro> http://www.diveintopython.net/
[22:20] <neuro> http://www.diveinto.org/python3/
[22:26] <linuxliam> neuro: thanks