[08:07] <DJones> I wonder which retailer will have Nexus 7-2's availble in their stores on release day
[08:10] <MartijnVdS> Google's own play store?
[08:11] <DJones> I'm hoping to pick one up in a store rather than via mail order
[08:14]  * mungbean checking in
[08:15]  * TheOpenSourcerer wishes he could check out.
[08:16] <bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
[08:16] <TheOpenSourcerer> Customer's data (~.5million rows) of a flat file spreadsheet. Spent the last 4 days trying to devise interesting methods to break it into related entities to import into a proper CRM. Thank god for Talend, but it's still a right PITA.
[08:17] <MartijnVdS> pivot table magic :)
[08:17] <TheOpenSourcerer> nope - the data isn't clean enough.
[08:18] <MartijnVdS> *shudder*
[08:18] <TheOpenSourcerer> all free text - no consistency
[08:19] <MartijnVdS> that's.. horrible
[08:19] <TheOpenSourcerer> yep.
[08:19] <bigcalm> Outsource to children
[08:19] <dwatkins> dirty data is the bane of my life
[08:20] <TheOpenSourcerer> hmmm.
[08:20] <mungbean> dave cameron wants to fix that
[08:20] <dwatkins> What's even worse is that the CRM I use capitalises half the fields, including e-mail.
[08:20] <TheOpenSourcerer> Talend is really rather cool, but it can;t magically clean stuff.
[08:24] <dwatkins> the place I used to work at had a fairly clean database already, but we (as support engineers) were asked to flag any duplicate entries and correct minor errors in a customer's information. It was probably easier than someone going through all the records, since many of them were correct.
[08:25] <dwatkins> You can easily write (in fact download) a bit of JavaScript to validate a telephone number, yet many databases still fail at storing them in anything like a useable format.
[08:29] <mungbean> what happens if unstamped mail is sent to a PO box?
[08:30] <DJones> They probably delivery with a note attached asking the recipient to go into a post office to pay the postage
[08:31] <mungbean> virgin media are the scum
[08:31] <MartijnVdS> virgin media send unstamped mail?
[08:31] <mungbean> so after getting junk mail every week
[08:32] <mungbean> if i return their post selltaped to a brick
[08:32] <mungbean> they probably won't have to pay and they can choose to refuse it
[08:33] <MartijnVdS> mungbean: '''write on the front of the envelope: "NOT KNOWN AT THIS ADDRESS, RETURN TO SENDER"'''
[08:33] <mungbean> its the mystery of the internet age. how to get removed from their lists
[08:33] <MartijnVdS> '''score through the address with a pen'''
[08:33] <mungbean> MartijnVdS: they send to the address, not named person
[08:33] <mungbean> its is literally impossible to get removed from the list
[08:33] <mungbean> there is a loophole
[08:34] <MartijnVdS> mungbean: http://www.adviceguide.org.uk/england/consumer_w/consumer_post_e/consumer_problems_with_post_e/consumer_problems_with_unwanted_or_junk_mail_e/how_can_you_stop_un-addressed_junk_mail.htm ?
[08:34] <mungbean> and it fills me with rage
[08:34] <DJones> Might not even be 'posted mail' could just be the junk mail the post office gets mass batches of just to put through every door addressed to the occupier
[08:34] <mungbean> its none of those
[08:35] <mungbean> i opted out of door to door
[08:35] <mungbean> they do that too though
[08:35] <mungbean> they have a fake stamp called "delivered by royal mail"
[08:35] <MartijnVdS> it's just "To whomever -- your address -- your town" ?
[08:35] <mungbean> the occupier
[08:35] <MartijnVdS> you should be able to opt-out of that
[08:35] <mungbean> legally you cannot force them and they know it
[08:36] <mungbean> once you opt out of their name+address junk mail
[08:36] <mungbean> they send you "the householder"
[08:36] <MartijnVdS> Oh, .nl anti-spam laws work for email AND real mail
[08:37] <MartijnVdS> and phone as well
[08:38] <Myrtti> hello sweetiepies
[08:38] <Myrtti> how is world today for you ♥
[08:40] <MartijnVdS> Myrtti: a second company asked my to come talk to them :)
[08:40] <Myrtti> nice, what about? you're in the market for a new job?
[08:42] <mungbean> according to the evening standard it helps to go gay if you are loking for work in london
[08:42] <popey> "go gay"
[08:42] <Myrtti> "plim! you're now gay"
[08:43] <Myrtti> derp
[08:43] <Myrtti> evening standard, eh
[08:43] <jpds> http://is.gd/ChFN1Z
[08:43] <bigcalm> I'm happy
[08:43] <popey> http://www.standard.co.uk/lifestyle/london-life/why-the-gay-geek-is-the-most-soughtafter-worker-in-london-8773838.html
[08:44] <popey> I don't think the article says "go gay" anywhere in it.
[08:44] <mungbean> well i'm not gay, but the message is that joining the gay club would help
[08:45] <mungbean> OTOH i never divulge any details to employers that they don't need to know
[08:45] <popey> careful mungbean, your prejudice is showing
[08:45] <mungbean> since they love to say "hey we have a lot of gingers!"
[08:46] <Myrtti> mungbean: I don't read it that way tbh
[08:46] <bigcalm> I keep thinking that it is Monday. This isn't a good start to a Tuesday
[08:46] <Myrtti> it quotes a study from US that says that LGBT people are usually well trained
[08:46] <mungbean> "It is a cliché but the average professional gay person tends to be clever, "
[08:46] <MartijnVdS> Myrtti: yeah, current company wants to dispose of the software devs, so I'm looking around a bit
[08:47] <MartijnVdS> Myrtti: Got several offers out of the blue :)
[08:47] <Myrtti> then that the average gay people can dedicate more time to the job rather than their other engagements like family life.
[08:47] <mungbean> my employer doesn't need to know if i have a family
[08:47] <bigcalm> :
[08:47] <MartijnVdS> mungbean: .. until you're self-employed
[08:47] <dwatkins> Gay people don't have families? That's news to me, all my gay colleagues do.
[08:48] <Myrtti> dwatkins: yeah, beats me where they got that idea
[08:48] <popey> dwatkins: offspring
[08:48] <mungbean> any of this imnformation can prejudice an employer either way
[08:48] <dwatkins> popey: nope, still incorrect ;) I know at least two women with kids who happen to be gay.
[08:48] <popey> i didnt say they didnt have them
[08:48] <popey> i was clarifying what "family" meant
[08:48] <dwatkins> fair enough
[08:49] <popey> most of the gay people I know have dogs
[08:49] <dwatkins> I just think any discrimination like this is at best silly, and verging on positively dangerous.
[08:49] <mungbean> my point is that bringing personal stuff into the interview room isn't good. you are being hired for the 9-5
[08:49] <MartijnVdS> popey: lots of straight people I know have dogs too
[08:49] <Myrtti> MartijnVdS: if you're interested in traveling the world in search of a new job... ;-)
[08:50] <dwatkins> I have a pet rat, should that affect my employability?
[08:50] <directhex> yes.
[08:50] <MartijnVdS> dwatkins: Depends, is it Pinky or The Brain?
[08:50] <directhex> you might have hantavirus
[08:50] <dwatkins> haha
[08:50] <Myrtti> dwatkins: is it Peter Pettigrew?
[08:50] <directhex> MartijnVdS, those are mice
[08:50] <Myrtti> have you checked?
[08:50] <mungbean> i went onto the HR system and they ask for your ethnicity, sexual preferences, religion etc
[08:50] <MartijnVdS> directhex: not lab rats?
[08:50] <dwatkins> Myrtti: she's quite smart
[08:50] <MartijnVdS> mungbean: that's not allowed, is it?
[08:50] <directhex> MartijnVdS, lab mice
[08:50] <mungbean> they don't demand it, but strongly urge it
[08:50] <MartijnVdS> directhex: oh, ok.
[08:51] <mungbean> just so they can say they are ginger-friendly etc
[08:51] <mungbean> despite seeing massive sexism where i work.
[08:51] <mungbean> ticking boxes does not change the culture
[08:51] <Myrtti> in my recruitment processes that information has always been given to the recruitment process in a separate form without names
[08:52] <MartijnVdS> mungbean: "We're not a soul-crushing place to work! We have gingers working for us, they don't even HAVE souls to crush!"
[08:52] <mungbean> there is a tendency for some people to incorrectly think that somebody caleld abdul al-shaqa can't speak good english
[08:53] <dwatkins> I can't stand to work with people with green eyes.... (only kidding, I'm referring to this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VeK759FF84s )
[08:53]  * popey covers his eyes
[08:53] <dwatkins> popey: I have green eyes ;)
[08:53] <mungbean> what do you say if an interviewer asks you what you do on a saturday night?
[08:53] <MartijnVdS> dwatkins: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gmyq9tIiu8g
[08:54] <popey> depends mungbean if you're a normal person or if you're you
[08:54] <mungbean> try normal person
[08:54]  * dwatkins pauses Psy Chill DI radio
[08:54] <popey> might mention that my daughter is in a ballet competition
[08:55] <popey> you have a very unusual barrier between your personal life and your work life
[08:55] <popey> I've known a few people like that at work
[08:55] <dwatkins> mungbean: I used to work with a sales guy whose interview process included taking the victim out on a Friday night and getting them drunk, to see how they handled it
[08:55] <bigcalm> I need some tunes to drown out the wailing child next door. Any suggestions? (need to be coding friendly)
[08:55] <mungbean> i think maybe i've been hurt by public sector. private sector i never had an issue. public has the worst examples of everything (sexism, bullying, violent behaviour, etc)
[08:56] <mungbean> bigcalm: lullaby by mozart
[08:56] <bigcalm> mungbean: it's music for me, not her
[08:56] <dwatkins> My boss usually knows what I'm doing on a Friday night, as we often go to the pub as a team.
[08:56] <MartijnVdS> bigcalm: A Long Way to Fall by Ulrich Schnauss
[08:57] <popey> bigcalm: http://open.spotify.com/album/1T6VXkSGLyGwJ1l0555IBb
[08:57] <popey> :D
[08:57] <bigcalm> Gah
[08:57] <bigcalm> I stopped Orbital for that playlist
[08:57]  * bigcalm kippers popey
[08:57] <MartijnVdS> bigcalm: http://open.spotify.com/user/martijnvds/playlist/1g55QqilucQ0qr1x4Sv5fw  ?
[08:57] <dwatkins> MartijnVdS: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iNSsdVUK4HI
[08:58] <mungbean> i am reminded of when i joined a bank in november 1999 and i asked if they'd done their y2k work? of course. then when i joined it turned out they'd done the paperwork and i had to upgrade 100 servers.
[08:58] <mungbean> companies that pride themselves on investors in people should deal with bad bullying and sexism etc
[09:00] <dwatkins> I suspect if anyone did anything like that here, people would just stare at them in disbelief uyntil they left out of shame
[09:00] <mungbean> hehe
[09:00] <bigcalm> MartijnVdS: Listening to A Long Way to Fall, it's good :)
[09:01] <Myrtti> oh man
[09:01] <Myrtti> Finnish newspaper has gone full retard
[09:01] <Myrtti> "The university has published the list of the new name days"
[09:01] <MartijnVdS> ಠ_ಠ
[09:02] <Myrtti> "You can check your own given names from for example your driving license"
[09:02] <Myrtti> (caption under a picture of a driving license)
[09:02] <Myrtti> whut
[09:02] <MartijnVdS> Myrtti: maybe average intelligence dropped?
[09:02] <mungbean> summer staff?
[09:03] <MartijnVdS> Cucumber time! (as we call it in Dutch)
[09:03] <Myrtti> mungbean: Finnish summer ended last week, as schools started
[09:03] <mungbean> holiday hangover?
[09:03] <MartijnVdS> Myrtti: New hires then?
[09:03] <Myrtti> maybe
[09:03] <dwatkins> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Name_day doesn't even list the UK
[09:03] <MartijnVdS> Just-out-of-school journos
[09:04] <mungbean> is there a Myrtti day?
[09:05] <Myrtti> mungbean: 30th of April
[09:05] <MartijnVdS> The birthday of our king's grandmother
[09:06] <Myrtti> well, for my given name, not my nick
[09:06] <mungbean> exact match?
[09:06] <mungbean> or you have to choose one if yours isn't listed?
[09:06] <mungbean> ah, mine is listed
[09:07] <mungbean> 19 october is cool. Viking
[09:07] <Myrtti> mungbean: it's even the first one on the list as it's alphabetically first
[09:18] <dvee> good morning  all
[09:20] <popey> Hello dvee
[09:22] <dvee> Hiiii
[09:24]  * neuro yawns profusely
[09:24] <neuro> 'ning all
[09:24] <bigcalm> Morning
[09:25] <neuro> troubleshooting mysql on *windows* is not my idea of fun, but that's what i spent last night doing
[09:25] <neuro> i feel dirty
[09:25] <bigcalm> neuro: sqlyog :)
[09:25] <neuro> nah
[09:25] <bigcalm> It's one of the very few windows applications that I still use in Linux
[09:25] <neuro> mysql workbench + sequel pro + cygwin openssh
[09:26] <neuro> i had to install some software last night to give windows server 2008 the capability to make a ramdisk
[09:26] <neuro> windows server 2008!
[09:26] <neuro> i bet 2012 doesn't do it natively either
[09:26] <popey> gosh, 10:30 and no brekkie yet
[09:27] <popey> Wizard needs food, badly.
[09:27]  * neuro has two rolls and sausage sitting beside him
[09:27] <neuro> can't face eating them yet
[09:27] <popey> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7mMJio2MO6w
[09:27] <neuro> cuppa getting colder by the second
[09:27] <popey> used to love that game
[09:27] <neuro> fag hanging out of mouth
[09:27] <neuro> i'm so screwed up this morning
[09:27] <hamitron> aww guys, I'm cutting down and this chat isn't helping :/
[09:27] <Laney> gauntlet?
[09:28] <Laney> I had Gauntlet II on the NES
[09:28] <Laney> so good
[09:28] <neuro> hamitron: sorry! keep it up!
[09:28] <neuro> the NES?
[09:28] <neuro> pffff
[09:28] <mungbean> i had the acorn version called dunjunz
[09:28] <Laney> haha
[09:28] <Laney> I didn't mean to turn it into a "who has the oldest computer" war
[09:28] <popey> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ATARI-GAUNTLET-NON-JAMMA-VIDEO-GAME-BOARD-/281142020219?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item41755ec87b
[09:28] <Laney> So Internet
[09:28] <popey> buy the original arcade board ☻
[09:28] <neuro> virtually no 8-bit systems could do decent coin-op conversions
[09:28] <neuro> 'cept the PC Engine
[09:28] <mungbean> completed it with my mates, i was the only one left, felt like a hero
[09:29] <neuro> popey: niiiiice
[09:29] <popey> might dig out my arcade boards sometime
[09:29] <popey> now I have a supergun
[09:29] <neuro> o rly
[09:29] <mungbean> lots of chips there
[09:29] <popey> yeah, bunch of boards in the loft
[09:29] <neuro> somebody somewhere should make a supergun 2 with hdmi and all the trimmings
[09:30] <mungbean> from before you were married or after?
[09:30] <neuro> lol
[09:30] <neuro> ziiiiing
[09:30] <popey> Scramble, Side Arms, R-Type, R-Type II, R-Type Leo, Ghosts & Goblins, Bomb Jack, Nemesis..
[09:30] <neuro> oh man
[09:30] <popey> apres kids
[09:30] <mungbean> but you lost your man cave :(
[09:30] <neuro> sir, your taste in games is top class
[09:30] <popey> haha
[09:30] <popey> I gave my upright cabinet to london hackspace
[09:31] <popey> along with a Neo Geo 6-slot and a bunch of games
[09:31] <neuro> popey: i had no idea you were such a games geek
[09:31] <popey> but yes, a supergun + hdmi would be awesome
[09:31] <popey> displayport might be easier
[09:31] <neuro> ooh yeah
[09:32] <popey> http://www.ebay.com/itm/MINI-SUPERGUN-CONSOLIZED-PRO-HDMI-VGA-HDTV-ATOMISWAVE-ARCADE-JAMMA-NEO-GEO-CPS2-/160996335778?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item257c2120a2&nma=true&si=PXqG2b%252BA5OESnhoSGJzP2L5lMfU%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557
[09:32] <popey> whaaaaat
[09:32] <neuro> if you could find a nice big 4:3 display that would be awesome
[09:32] <neuro> wtf
[09:33] <neuro> omgomg
[09:35] <mungbean> http://www.stylist.co.uk/books/every-doctor-who-annual
[09:35] <popey> heh, just found a photo of me online at a games meetup
[09:35] <popey> http://www.stickycarpet.com/malc/gameon.html
[09:35] <mungbean> got some of these oldies in the loft alongside the beano
[09:36] <neuro> good domain name
[09:36] <popey> yeah
[09:36] <mungbean> sticky anything just reminds me of teenage boys :S
[09:37] <popey> gameboy r-type was pretty good
[09:37] <neuro> yeah, it wasn't bad
[09:37] <neuro> used the greyscale quite effectively iirc
[09:37] <mungbean> did you ever use your yubikey popey ?
[09:38] <popey> yes
[09:39] <mungbean> what's a typical use case?
[09:39] <popey> gmail, lastpass, launchpad
[10:13] <popey> Good morning TheOpenSourcerer
[10:13] <TheOpenSourcerer> yo? Sup?
[10:13] <popey> s'cool, 'scool
[10:14] <popey> anyone got 20M USD they don't need?
[10:14]  * shauno checks the back of the couch
[10:18] <MartijnVdS> shauno: your hide-from-Daleks-spot? ;)
[10:21] <dwatkins> Can't My Shuttleworth put up the remaining cash?
[10:21] <dwatkins> *Mr
[10:22] <mungbean> money down the drain
[10:22] <directhex> related note: i'm waiting for mr. post office man to deliver my firefox os phone
[10:25] <TheOpenSourcerer> correction $20,266,500
[10:27] <directhex> huh, i've got my µSD and µSIM adapter, but no phone
[10:27] <davmor2> Morning all
[10:27] <DJones> Hopefully peoples jobs with Canonical aren't at risk if the project doesn't go ahead
[10:28] <Myrtti> I doubt they've manufactured the devices beforehand :-P
[10:28] <directhex> DJones, eventually canonical needs a money spinner of some kind
[10:28] <directhex> DJones, lots of their projects have been a bust - e.g. ubuntu tv
[10:30] <mungbean> people's jobs at canonical are always at a risk while sabdfl bankrolls the company. although i assume they are break even atm?
[10:30] <DJones> directhex: Was reading this last night http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2013/08/why-ubuntus-creator-still-invests-his-fortune-in-an-unprofitable-company/ which was quite interesting
[10:31]  * AlanBell suspects Canonical have a plan
[10:31] <mungbean> if you're a gazillionaire you want to make a difference, a big splash, rather than a humdrum company
[10:31] <jpds> AlanBell: A what-now?
[10:31] <mungbean> the phones were a toe in water
[10:32] <directhex> a single platform that spans everything from phones and tablets to PCs, servers, and my butt.
[10:32] <directhex> cloud-to-butt <3
[10:34] <xnox> mungbean: in the rankings sabdfl's net-worth is still 500M+ (as off 2012), considering canonical is quoted to be ~30M per year operation and has been going for 10 years now, this leads to assume that canonical is actually making profit.
[10:34] <mungbean> he made other money too
[10:34] <mungbean> $100m from some other spin off
[10:35] <mungbean> you need a toy project to invest 10-20% of your portfolio that could change the world ;)
[10:35] <mungbean> except bill gates waited until he retired and is now giving money away for good causes. good guy bill
[10:36] <mungbean> was an utter jerk at MS
[10:38] <mungbean>  man tw_cli
[10:38] <mungbean> No manual entry for tw_cli
[10:38] <mungbean>  tw_cli --help
[10:38] <mungbean> Error: (CLI:041) Invalid shell command.
[10:38] <mungbean> thanks 3ware for your wonderful software
[10:47] <directhex> mungbean, `tw_cli ?`
[10:47] <mungbean> 3ware raid controller query tool
[10:48] <mungbean> tw_cli help did something
[10:48] <mungbean> lame tool thoug
[10:48] <DJones> mungbean: Must admit, I though Bill had passed away & that was why the charitable foundation was doing things
[10:48] <mungbean> :-|
[10:49] <popey> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B_M_eO3okzU novel, never seen a tablet with a swappable battery before
[10:49] <mungbean> i only know of 2 melindas
[10:50] <directhex> mungbean, note the backticks.
[10:50] <mungbean> ah :P
[10:51] <directhex> root@tava:~# /root/ilmdaiwtki/bin/tw_cli ?
[10:51] <directhex> Copyright(c) 2004-2006 Applied Micro Circuits Corporation(AMCC). All rights reserved.
[10:51] <directhex> AMCC/3ware CLI (version 2.00.06.007)
[10:51] <mungbean> ah yeah, does the same as help
[10:51] <mungbean> tw_cli /c0 show is pretty sparse on detail
[10:51] <directhex> mungbean, /c0 show all
[10:52] <mungbean> still doesn't tell me which disks are in the raid5
[10:52] <daftykins> excellent, i received the new DC jack for that laptop today - all working now :D
[10:52] <mungbean> p15   DEVICE-ERROR   u?   931.51 GB SATA  15  -            ST31000528AS
[10:52] <daftykins> took apart the second one and it's confirmed as the exact same fault \o/
[10:52] <daftykins> so back to ebay i went for a £3.45 DC jack ;)
[10:52] <directhex> mungbean, the raid array is a unit, e.g. "u0    RAID-10   OK             -       -       64K     4190.92   ON     ON     "
[10:52] <daftykins> £6.90 to fix two laptops - can't be bad \o/
[10:52] <directhex> mungbean, so look for disks with matching unit number
[10:53] <mungbean> p15 shows u?
[10:53] <mungbean> doing the maths, i think its u1
[10:53] <directhex> mungbean, implies it's not part of the array. hotspare?
[10:53] <daftykins> sounds like someone would appreciate the 3DM2 web interface being installed, mungbean \o/
[10:54] <directhex> mungbean, there's also /c0/p15 show all
[10:54] <mungbean> http://pastebin.com/ZUY6Ccea
[10:55] <mungbean> unclear whether it is a HS or not
[10:57] <directhex> mungbean, /c0/u1 show all
[10:57] <mungbean> /c0/u1 status = OK
[10:57] <mungbean> hence not degraded. phew
[10:57] <directhex> none are degraded
[10:57] <mungbean> ah this is what i was after, thanks
[10:58] <directhex> i.e. no degraded arrays
[10:58] <daftykins> looks like a nice system :)
[10:58] <mungbean> the size was misreported
[10:58] <directhex> /c0 Total Optimal Units = 2
[10:58] <directhex> /c0 Not Optimal Units = 0
[10:58] <Monotoko> I hate insurance companies :(
[10:59] <daftykins> evil aren't they?
[10:59] <mungbean> cheers directhex i can wait till person returns from holiday if the array is OK
[10:59] <mungbean> i don't know where/if there are replacement drives you see
[10:59] <Monotoko> daftykins: horrible - they won't replace my lost phone because it didn't have a SIM
[10:59] <daftykins> what O_O
[10:59] <Monotoko> exactly
[11:00] <daftykins> so an insurance contract allegedly requires a SIM be in a phone now? D:
[11:00] <mungbean> is that specified in small print?
[11:00] <Monotoko> mungbean: sadly yes
[11:00] <mungbean> insurance sucks
[11:00] <Monotoko> in the massive list of "exclusions"
[11:00] <daftykins> that's like saying the car insurance is only valid if the spare tire is present in the boot
[11:00] <mungbean> i had MRI and i got made rednudant, but got no payments on the mortgage
[11:01] <Monotoko> I'm kicking up a stink and complaining like hell, but I don't know if I will get anywhere
[11:01] <daftykins> needless to say i've not ever bought car insurance, so... :D
[11:01] <Monotoko> 15 months left on the contract :(
[11:02] <mungbean> have a weird XFS issue
[11:03] <mungbean> occasionally the filesystem enters a situation where io utilation goes to 100% and doesn't recover
[11:03] <mungbean> eventually you have to reboot the storage server
[11:03] <daftykins> erk
[11:04] <mungbean> experienced it on more than 1 server
[11:04] <daftykins> what kind of data is on that volume? lots of small files?
[11:04] <mungbean> its a cluster, so probably all sorts of stuff, but yes
[11:04] <mungbean>  is an xfs filesystem on an LVM lv on a RAID5 volume on the 3Ware controller. Under "certain circumstances" IO becomes very slow, affecting jobs running on the cluster as well as interactive performance on the headnode. I believe this is caused by large numbers of small writes which are less than the RAID stripe width but could do with doing more investigation to establish this.
[11:04] <mungbean> ^^ comment on the wiki page
[11:05] <mungbean> iowait goes to 60% and util is 100%
[11:05] <daftykins> the 12TB RAID6 i run on a 3ware runs with XFS
[11:05] <daftykins> mostly media, a guy's DVD collection imaged 1:1 in ISOs
[11:05] <daftykins> when i created the XFS volume it had an almost stripe size variable to it itself i think
[11:06] <daftykins> perhaps a mismatch between that and the RAID stripe can make things go wobbly 0o
[11:08] <mungbean> may not be 3ware related, i need to check the other server
[11:08] <directhex> contact SGI support!
[11:09] <directhex> you have an Enhanced XFS support contract, right?
[11:09] <daftykins> yeah, i guess it'd be software
[11:10] <mungbean> the other one is LSI
[11:11] <daftykins> LSI bought 3ware though
[11:11] <daftykins> so might just be the rebranding?
[11:12] <mungbean> lspci looks quite different, certainly different cards
[11:12] <daftykins> ah
[11:13] <mungbean> moving to GPFS soon so ready to bin this anyway
[11:13] <mungbean> is the egyptian dude  mohammed badie a goodie or a baddie?
[11:17] <mungbean> "The Ubuntu Edge shortfall is the same as it cost Mark to go into space." -mjg59 ..there u go dwatkins
[11:22] <Monotoko> When is the Ubuntu phone coming out?
[11:22] <popey> Monotoko: there will be a software release in sync with 13.10 in October
[11:23] <Monotoko> popey: how much? And do they take regular SIM cards?
[11:23] <Monotoko> (I meant the actual phone, not the OS)
[11:23] <daftykins> #ubuntu-touch
[11:23] <daftykins> ^i think that's the channel with all the details and so forth
[11:25] <Monotoko> cheers daftykins (now to work out how to join a new channel with irssi)
[11:25] <daftykins>  /j #chan ;)
[11:25] <Monotoko> same as always then :P
[11:26] <Monotoko> Can I connect to multiple networks?
[11:26] <daftykins> yep i'm on 2
[11:26] <marxjohnson> Monotoko: #irssi ;)
[11:26] <marxjohnson> but yes, you can
[11:26] <Monotoko> thanks, I will have a Google around first
[11:26] <mungbean> i have to write all my irssi commands down as i forget them if irssi crashses
[11:27] <popey> Monotoko: we don't have a release date for a phone yet
[11:27] <popey> other than the ubuntu edge
[11:27] <popey> http://www.indiegogo.com/projects/ubuntu-edge/x/1051579
[11:27] <directhex> Monotoko, "the ubuntu phone" isn't coming out, unless someone sinks $20M into it within a couple of days
[11:27] <daftykins> hehe, i just did them once to set it up initially, so now i don't have a clue how to do stuff \o/
[11:27] <popey> directhex: no
[11:27] <popey> the ubuntu _edge_
[11:27] <popey> Ubuntu Phone != Ubuntu Edge
[11:28] <MartijnVdS> Ubuntu Phone ∋ Ubuntu Edge ;)
[11:28] <Monotoko> Ack... 20 mil to go
[11:29] <daftykins> ^_^
[11:29] <daftykins> i almost don't want it to get a time extension so i won't have to hear about it anymore \o/
[11:29] <popey> Nice.
[11:30] <directhex> a time extension won't help with the missteps that lead to this point
[11:31] <dvrr> popey
[11:31] <popey> dvrr: other people are available
[11:32] <daftykins> if you have a question, ask away!
[11:32] <popey> Is this going to be a java performance related question perhaps?
[11:33] <dvrr> yes
[11:33] <dvrr> i have already discussed
[11:33] <directhex> give it more RAM.
[11:34] <dvrr> ya now available 16gb ram
[11:35] <Monotoko> give it more RAM... the solution to everything
[11:35] <Monotoko> or a reboot
[11:35] <Monotoko> either or
[11:35] <daftykins> except 'why isn't more RAM working? :('
[11:35] <daftykins> :D
[11:35] <MartijnVdS> Faster SSDs!
[11:35] <daftykins> MOAR
[11:36] <dvrr> ya i reboot  server also
[11:38] <directhex> daftykins, there's an answer to that too
[11:38] <directhex> java has a hard limit on how much ram it uses, set by the -Xmx flag
[11:38] <popey> useful for making sure minecraft doesn't kill your server
[11:40] <dvrr> i set Xmx 6000MB in catalina.sh file
[11:40] <MartijnVdS> how much RAM do you have?
[11:40] <dvrr> 16G RAM i have
[11:43] <daftykins> directhex: true, doh
[11:44] <dvrr> java cpu usage http://paste.ubuntu.com/6006117/  open this url
[11:46] <ali1234> what are you doing that is using so much ram?
[11:48] <dvrr> ,apache,mod_jk, mysql ,two tomcat servers  section replication
[11:48] <Monotoko> ... who on earth named a freenode server moorcock?
[11:49] <daftykins> i know right.
[11:49] <daftykins> had to be a joke
[11:50] <Myrtti> might have been a suggestion from the sponsor, or could have been a slow day at the freenode office ;-)
[11:50] <Myrtti> I can't remember if I've ever read anything of his
[11:54] <Monotoko> I accidentally put my question in the main #ubuntu channel before here >.<
[11:54] <daftykins> you're lucky you didn't get chased out by an army of penguins
[11:55] <Monotoko> still getting used to this irssi stuff... I'm a sysadmin, so it looks like I'm working
[11:56] <DJones> Its not the army of penguins, its the sharp pointy stick of doom you have to watch out for :)
[11:57]  * Monotoko bangs head on keyboard
[11:57] <Monotoko> I hate SQL
[11:57] <lornajane> I love SQL but I'm not sure it always feels the same way about me
[11:58] <Monotoko> my joins are wrong and I can't figure out how to fix them :(
[11:58] <popey> I am ambivalent about SQL
[11:58] <lornajane> Monotoko: can we help?
[11:59] <Monotoko> lornajane: you're free to have a go... basically I need to get Rotarians.MemEmail, but I'm not sure how to join the Rotarians table without it bringing back an empty set: http://pastie.org/8253227
[12:02] <lornajane> Monotoko: which columns do Clubs or clubofficeholders have in common with Rotarians?
[12:04] <daftykins> DJones: i never see who wields it, i only feel the occasional sharp jab...
[12:05] <Monotoko> lornajane: there is a RotID in both clubofficeholders and Rotarians
[12:06] <Monotoko> so basically the clubofficeholder, for example 'webmaster', is in the clubofficeholders table with a ClubID and a RotID... which I then have to go looking for (it's not the best designed table... and wasn't designed by me)
[12:07] <lornajane> okay so you can LEFT JOIN (right before the WHERE) Rotarians on (clubofficeholders.RotID = Rotarians.RotID)
[12:08] <lornajane> then you can add your Rotarians.MemEmail into the select list and if that exists for this person, it'll show up, and otherwise it'll be NULL in that column
[12:10] <Monotoko> lornajane: let me give that a go, thank you
[12:42] <mungbean> i have a weird massive red rash on my arm
[12:43] <mungbean> after exposure to sunlight for 5-10 mins although its not sunburn
[13:20] <Monotoko> Gah... doesn't look like their going to honour the insurance
[13:20] <mungbean> scummers
[13:20] <mungbean> has it ever had a sim?
[13:26] <Monotoko> mungbean: Yeah - it's in my crappy phone atm as I have just come back from holiday
[13:27] <Monotoko> and didn't want to take my iPhone in case I lost it abroad... go figure
[13:27] <mungbean> how would they know?
[13:27] <mungbean> and why would they care?
[13:28] <Monotoko> I stupidly told them on the claim form, mentioned that I had it IMEI blocked anyway so no other UK network could use it
[13:28] <Monotoko> didn't realise it was an exclusion
[13:43] <joshmyers> hey guys, looking for a regexp to match a pattern that is stats.x.x.deployments
[13:44] <bigcalm> MartijnVdS: love the bass in A Ritual In Time And Death
[13:48] <MooDoo> afternoon all
[13:48] <bigcalm> Morning
[13:49] <Monotoko> I can't get this join right, so far this is working and getting all the secretaries for clubs that don't have a webmaster position. The webmaster position is defined by: clubofficeholders.cluboffid = 36 - I need to somehow JOIN clubofficers (cluboffid is in both) and get the MailUser from there instead so I can plug in webmaster, president etc
[13:49] <Monotoko> http://pastie.org/8253468
[13:49] <Monotoko> anyone got any ideas how I'd go about this? It's killing me :(
[13:50] <davmor2> joshmyers: sure just "cat file | grep -e ^stats.*.*.deployments" will be enough then  but I'm no expert
[13:51] <joshmyers> cheers davmor2 :)
[13:55] <mungbean> anyone use goodreads?
[13:57] <Monotoko> diddledan_: was it you who I remember knowing SQL?
[13:58] <diddledan_> I know enough to get by :-)
[13:58] <Monotoko> can you give us a hand? I'm completely stuck :(
[13:58] <Monotoko> I may need to repaste the messages?
[13:58] <Monotoko> :P
[13:59] <diddledan_> what's the issue?
[13:59] <Monotoko> < Monotoko> I can't get this join right, so far this is working and getting all the secretaries for clubs that don't have a webmaster position. The webmaster position  is defined by: clubofficeholders.cluboffid = 36 - I need to somehow JOIN clubofficers (cluboffid is in both) and get the MailUser from there instead so I  can plug in webmaster, president etc
[13:59] <diddledan_> I'll do my best
[13:59] <Monotoko> 13:49 < Monotoko> http://pastie.org/8253468
[13:59] <Monotoko> basically that
[13:59] <bigcalm> Monotoko: I think you might have to use "having"
[14:00] <bigcalm> Join on one field and then use having on the others
[14:00] <Monotoko> ... not heard of having, can I have an example?
[14:01] <bigcalm> http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.0/en/group-by-extensions.html
[14:01] <bigcalm> Consider that this is from an idle glance
[14:01] <diddledan_> AND clubofficeholders.cluboffid = 36 AND clubofficeholders.YrID=109 needs to be someplace after the WHERE?
[14:02] <Monotoko> I noticed that, but I'm not using group by and looking at those examples, I can't think how I'd use it?
[14:03] <diddledan_> try with http://pastie.org/8253515
[14:03] <Monotoko> diddledan_: the query works fine right now... when I'm just using cluboffid=36 (webmaster) but I basically need instead of clubofficeholders.cluboffid = 36 to have clubofficers.MailUser='webmaster'
[14:03] <Monotoko> so I need to join the clubofficers table somehow...
[14:03] <diddledan_> oic
[14:04] <ali1234> i think you need an invite for the captain's table
[14:04] <mungbean> ooo-arrrr
[14:04] <mungbean> capn fishy
[14:04] <Monotoko> captain's table?
[14:04] <MooDoo> Monotoko: he was being silly
[14:05] <mungbean> everyones a bit drunk on sunshine
[14:05] <mungbean> fortunately my arm is no longer bright red. was worried for a bit
[14:05] <MooDoo> i think you'll find thats you ;)
[14:05] <Monotoko> :( I've dealt with too much SQL today to deal with sunshine
[14:05] <mungbean> i'm also a bit bored
[14:06] <MooDoo> anyone know convert and how to convert nef to jpg nefs are split between folders?
[14:06] <diddledan_> what about a fake join? http://pastie.org/8253525
[14:06] <mungbean> i thought there was a fire alarm at the hospital but it was just all the smokers having a fag at the gate
[14:06] <MooDoo> getting fedup with ufraw-batch lol
[14:06] <mungbean> #britishproblems
[14:07] <ali1234> MooDoo: convert -format jpg foo.nef
[14:07] <diddledan_> afaik that's the same as an innerjoin
[14:07] <ali1234> MooDoo: assuming IM supports nef, that should be enough
[14:07] <diddledan_> WHERE clubofficers.cluboffid = clubofficeholders.cluboffid
[14:07] <mgdm> MooDoo: find . -name \*.nef -exec convert {} ${}.jpg \;
[14:07] <mgdm> MooDoo: find . -name \*.nef -exec convert {} {}.jpg \;
[14:08] <MooDoo> ali1234: yeah i know that, but I want the nefs from folder1 folder2 and folder3 converting to jpegs in backup/folder1 folder2 etc
[14:08] <mgdm> MooDoo: find . -name \*.nef -exec convert {} backup/{}.jpg \;
[14:08] <Monotoko> diddledan_: let me have a go..
[14:08] <MooDoo> mgdm: i'll try that, thanks
[14:09] <Monotoko> diddledan_: where do I want to be putting my clubofficers.MailUser='webmaster' rule?
[14:10] <Monotoko> which would then make clubofficeholders.cluboffid = 36 redundant (hopefully)
[14:10] <diddledan_> Monotoko, you can put that in after WHERE
[14:11] <Monotoko> diddledan_: Bah, ERROR 1054 (42S22): Unknown column 'Clubs.ClubID' in 'on clause'
[14:11] <diddledan_> o_O
[14:12] <Monotoko> Yeah... I find that odd too
[14:12] <diddledan_> that's part of the original query which worked
[14:12] <Monotoko> Clubs.ClubID exists
[14:12] <ali1234> you've got to look at the order of the operators
[14:12] <daftykins> i hope you're giving them a cut of your pay, Monotoko ;)
[14:12] <diddledan_> yes please :-p
[14:13] <Monotoko> diddledan_: where abouts in the UK are you? I could buy you a drink if you're not too far :P
[14:13] <diddledan_> hehe, I'm in basingstoke
[14:14] <Monotoko> diddledan_: if you're ever in the Devon area let me know ;)
[14:14] <diddledan_> right-o :-)
[14:15] <daftykins> my word, only 17-9 deg C out there and yet i'm melting after a cycle back 'n' forth
[14:15] <daftykins> i've got 6km to go tomorrow - that's going to be... tough
[14:15] <daftykins> fair bit uphill
[14:16] <Monotoko> diddledan_: this is the kind of thing I'm after, http://pastie.org/8253558
[14:16] <Monotoko> but for some reason... that's only bringing me back two results...
[14:16] <Monotoko> two correct results
[14:16] <Monotoko> but only two
[14:17] <daftykins> cor, glad i'm not you, sir
[14:17] <ali1234> Monotoko: do you have your schema and a precise statement of what you are trying to do?
[14:19] <Monotoko> ali1234: is my statement of what I'm trying to do not clear enough? (I know it's confusing...) and how do I get a schema?
[14:19] <diddledan_> here's a useful diagram on how joins work: https://plus.google.com/111053008130113715119/posts/5TdpUKQXxpu
[14:19] <Monotoko> (Yeah.. I don't do much SQL)
[14:19] <ali1234> well, i don't know what you're trying to do besides write an SQL query
[14:20] <ali1234> the schema is the layout of the tables in your database, ie what fields each one has
[14:21] <Monotoko> ali1234: basically as it stands, this query works: http://pastie.org/8253468 - it gets all the clubs without a webmaster (number 36) and rewrites the null email address so it forwards to the secretary, this can then be put through postfix no problems.
[14:22] <Monotoko> but it will only work for the webmaster, as I used the number 36 - instead of getting joining clubofficers and getting MailUser
[14:23] <ali1234> mailuser is what?
[14:23] <ali1234> what is the actual problem that you are trying to solve?
[14:23] <ali1234> in english
[14:24] <bigcalm> Anybody had thunderflies die inside their monitor? I've got a lovely one right in the middle. Tried this http://superuser.com/questions/76153/removing-dead-thunderflies-stuck-inside-an-lcd-monitor but it didn't work for me. Anybody with ideas of removing them?
[14:24] <ali1234> eg "i have a database of clubs and i want to find the ones which don't have a member marked as the webmaster"
[14:25] <ali1234> bigcalm: you could try putting a spider inside the monitor
[14:25] <Monotoko> that's basically it ali1234, I have that list - but I now need to do it for every post which is defined in the mailuser column (webmaster, president, etc)
[14:26] <Monotoko> so postfix will pass in %u which is the bit before the @, eg: president@rotary1170.org
[14:26] <ali1234> ok, so you need to join with the table that maps IDs to roles, ie 36 -> "webmaster" etc?
[14:26] <Monotoko> then it will send to all presidents (that bit is done) and any club who doesn't have a president, it will send to their secretary instead
[14:26] <Monotoko> yeah that's it
[14:26] <mungbean> bigcalm: got a pic of yours?
[14:26] <ali1234> rather than hardcoding 36 and "webmaster"
[14:27] <Monotoko> Yeah
[14:27] <bigcalm> o.O
[14:27] <ali1234> yeah i see the problem here
[14:27] <bigcalm> mungbean: same as the one in that link really
[14:27] <ali1234> the problem being you're trying to find something that isn't in the database
[14:27] <mungbean> looked like a bunch of dead pixels
[14:27] <ali1234> where as SQL is designed to find things that are in the database :)
[14:27] <ali1234> it's possible to do this though
[14:27] <bigcalm> mungbean: it's a tiny fly
[14:28] <mungbean> what manufacturer?
[14:28] <bigcalm> Of fly?
[14:28] <bigcalm> Erm, nature
[14:28] <Monotoko> ali1234: I hope so, I've been banging my head against it all day
[14:28] <ali1234> thing is, if you take that existing query and add another inner join at the end, it will just drop all null results, which of course is what you are after - because the missing entries are null
[14:28] <bigcalm> mungbean: dell
[14:29] <mungbean> montiro size?
[14:29] <bigcalm> 22"
[14:29] <Monotoko> ali1234: Ahhh that makes sense... I did that, got an empty set
[14:29] <ali1234> yeah... if you select all the entries that don't exist - you'll get a null set :)
[14:29] <mungbean> if it takes up more than 5 pixels i'd take the back off
[14:29] <bigcalm> Googling for just "thunderfly" returns a page full of dead ones in screens
[14:30] <bigcalm> It's irritating
[14:30] <mungbean> although i got a spec of dirt on my tablet thats about 1px and really annoys
[14:30] <Monotoko> ali1234: I'm going to murder, in cold blood, whoever designed this thing
[14:30] <mungbean> i had a 5px streak on my laptop and dell repalced it
[14:30] <ali1234> Monotoko: so what do you exactly expect from the query, at the end?
[14:30] <mungbean> 1 week before 3yr warranty expired
[14:31] <Monotoko> ali1234: a list of secretaries, which is currently being done for the webmaster group: eg: secretary@babbacombestmarychurch.rotary1170.org
[14:31] <ali1234> hmm
[14:31] <Monotoko> that's coming from here: IFNULL(clubofficeholders.FwdEmail, CONCAT("secretary@", Clubs.FwdDomain))
[14:31] <ali1234> hmm i still don't quite understand this
[14:32] <ali1234> the existing generates a list of clubs and their secretaries which do not have an exlicitly defined webmaster?
[14:32] <bigcalm> mungbean: http://discworld.cuth.eu/dump/thunderfly.jpg
[14:33] <Monotoko> ali1234: exactly
[14:33] <ali1234> and you want to do this for all job types
[14:33] <Monotoko> ali1234: Yeah, defined in clubofficers.mailuser
[14:33] <ali1234> but if you do that... how will you know the difference between a club that has no webmaster and a club that has no president?
[14:33] <mungbean> bigcalm: sucks dude
[14:34] <bigcalm> mungbean: yus
[14:34] <mungbean> i need to clean my screen, it looked liek u had loads
[14:34] <bigcalm> LOL
[14:35] <mungbean> i have a 4 screen setup atm
[14:35] <Monotoko> ali1234: well at the moment webmaster is hardcoded in: clubofficeholders.cluboffid = 36
[14:35] <ali1234> yes
[14:35] <diddledan_> I want moar monitors
[14:35]  * popey is back to 1 monitor
[14:35] <diddledan_> problem is I'm running on a laptop atm
[14:36] <diddledan_> so I've got the inbuilt and the external
[14:36] <mungbean> synergy
[14:36] <Monotoko> this is why I need to use the mailuser instead... because when someone emails webmaster@, this query will run and generate a list of all the clubs that don't have that mailuser
[14:36] <ali1234> Monotoko: so what happens if you delete that line/clause?
[14:36] <mgdm> if I open tmux, ssh to a remote machine, and then run htop there, it doesn't update
[14:36] <ali1234> you will get a list of every unfilled role in every club (in theory)
[14:36] <Monotoko> ali1234: sounds about right
[14:37] <Monotoko> ali1234: it's bringing back two rows
[14:37] <Monotoko> .....
[14:37] <ali1234> the problem though is if you inner join that with the id->role table, it will drop all the null lines, which are the ones you are looking for
[14:38] <ali1234> what's this other table called btw?
[14:38] <ali1234> clubofficers?
[14:38] <Monotoko> ali1234: which one? The one with the mailuser? Yeah
[14:39] <ali1234> so you want to inner join clubofficeholders and clubofficers first
[14:39] <mungbean> isn't that a dodgy shop selling cheap shoes?
[14:39] <ali1234> then right join that with clubs
[14:39] <Monotoko> before the left joins?
[14:40] <ali1234> yes
[14:40] <ali1234> which means you'll then have to use a right join instead since the order is reversed
[14:41] <ali1234> something like this: http://pastie.org/8253628
[14:42] <ali1234> obviously i don't know all the field names
[14:43] <ali1234> the key point here is you don't necessarily start with the most obvious table
[14:43] <ali1234> also this might all be nonsense, i don't do much SQL
[14:43] <Monotoko> ali1234: For some reason, that's coming back with every club in the district
[14:44] <Monotoko> even ones with a webmaster :(
[14:44] <ali1234> yes
[14:44] <ali1234> if they have a webmaster but not some other rle
[14:44] <Monotoko> how do I make it do just webmaster at this point?
[14:45] <Monotoko> then bring in %u variable from postfix... and it should do webmaster, etc then, right?
[14:45] <ali1234> AND clubofficers.rolename = "webmaster" <- should do that
[14:46] <Monotoko> ... that's in there on line 8??
[14:46] <Monotoko> or should it be after the where as well?
[14:46] <ali1234> yes, but it's not necessarily the right field name
[14:46] <daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/lx87130zdih6r7o/IMG_20130820_154446.jpg
[14:46] <Monotoko> it's clubofficers.mailuser, I already changed it
[14:46] <daftykins> two almost identical Acer laptops DC jacks, both with their negatives detached D:
[14:47] <daftykins> cost of a pint each to fix 2 laptops? aww yeah
[14:47] <ali1234> Monotoko: if you delete the whole right join you should get a list of all officers who hold some position
[14:48] <ali1234> if you add clubofficers.mailuser to the select line you'll see their role in that output too
[14:49] <Monotoko> ali1234: http://pastie.org/8253648
[14:49] <Monotoko> it's giving me an empty set >.<
[14:50] <ali1234> yess
[14:50] <ali1234> look at line 7 and 8
[14:50] <ali1234> mailuser canot = 36 *and* "webmaster" at the same time
[14:50] <ali1234> this is why i asked for schema :P
[14:50] <Monotoko> ohhhhhh, got it
[14:51] <Monotoko> thank you so much for this btw
[14:51] <Monotoko> same goes for you, if you're anywhere near Devon any time give me a shout and il buy you a drink
[14:51] <ali1234> the key thing to take from this is each time you do a join it operates on "everything up to this point" <-> the thing you join it to
[14:52] <ali1234> so that inner join is building a table like clubofficeholders except it also has a row with the textual version of role name
[14:52] <ali1234> *column sorry
[14:52] <ali1234> or field
[14:54] <Monotoko> I see, I will have to play around a bit more with joins once this is all done so I can understand them better
[14:54] <ali1234> this is actually the identical problem i faced last time i tried to do some SQL
[14:54] <ali1234> someone asked for a list of all items that aren't x,y, or z
[14:55] <ali1234> i'm looking at what i did, and yeah, i had to do the inner join first because of the nulls
[14:57] <davmor2> joshmyers: did that work by the way?
[14:58] <ali1234> fun fact: SQL was intended for non-technical users to interact with databases
[14:58] <ali1234> at least that's what they told me in university
[14:59] <daftykins> 0o
[14:59] <daftykins> if i had to work in MS circles i would not be able to bring myself to say 'sequel'
[14:59] <daftykins> crazy how some industry terms can be rooted in complete inaccuracy ¬_¬
[15:00] <mungbean> how do you pronounce Qt
[15:00] <ali1234> the thing it's based on was called SEQUEL though
[15:00] <daftykins> yep
[15:00] <mungbean> keoootee or cute
[15:00] <daftykins> but then it was no longer the same thing
[15:00] <ali1234> i like to call it "squeal"
[15:00] <daftykins> :D
[15:01] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: "suckle"
[15:01] <daftykins> definitely the reaction to using it
[15:01] <daftykins> squirrel would be good
[15:01] <ali1234> mungbean: coyote? nobody pronounces it like that. Q.T. or cute
[15:01] <daftykins> gotta work on some squirrel today
[15:01] <mungbean> i mean Q.T or cute
[15:02] <ali1234> mungbean: cute is the official way but even the high up project people will often say "Q.T." accidentally when they get excited
[15:02] <mungbean> RHS of atlantic = q.t. LHS=cute?
[15:02] <bigcalm> cutie?
[15:02] <mungbean> ducky?
[15:03] <mungbean> gif is jif. but jif is now cif.
[15:03] <ali1234> jif is yiff
[15:04] <directhex> jraphics interchange format
[15:04] <mungbean> jif the kitchen cleaner
[15:04] <daftykins> was
[15:04] <ali1234> yeah, that's why they renamed it
[15:04] <mungbean> cos of spaniards?
[15:04] <ali1234> yiff means... something you wouldn't want in yur kitchen
[15:05] <mungbean> poo?
[15:05] <ali1234> no
[15:05] <directhex> they standardized the brand globally
[15:05] <directhex> well, partially
[15:05] <directhex> it's still Jif in Australia, New Zealand, Middle East and the Nordic countries
[15:06] <mungbean> i still call oil of ulay, oil of ulay
[15:06] <MooDoo> rubbish it's coz people couldn't say jif
[15:07] <MooDoo> they why they renamed it
[15:07] <ali1234> who can't say jif?
[15:07] <mungbean> they can, but pronounce it wrong
[15:08] <MartijnVdS> just call it Cif
[15:08] <mungbean> or smb
[15:08] <MooDoo> it's like i still call them opal fruits and marathons :) lo
[15:08] <mungbean> i was in russia and there was something twix-like called raider
[15:09] <mungbean> Twix was called Raider in Austria, Belgium, Denmark, Finland, France, Germany, Greece, Italy, Luxembourg, the Netherlands, Norway, Poland, Portugal, Spain,..
[15:09] <directhex> marathon bars!
[15:09] <davmor2> mungbean: Q Toolkit
[15:09] <directhex> opal fruits!
[15:09] <daftykins> this conversation is getting way out of hand D:
[15:09] <mungbean>  for many years before its name was changed in 1991
[15:10] <MartijnVdS> it's that old?
[15:10] <mungbean> cam out in 1967
[15:10] <MartijnVdS> QT?
[15:10] <mungbean> twix
[15:10] <MooDoo> pah people thing 1991 is old :( lol
[15:10] <MartijnVdS> I remember they had a big renaming here
[15:10] <MartijnVdS> from Raider to Twix
[15:11] <MooDoo> opal fruits to starburst
[15:11] <MooDoo> marathon to snickers
[15:11] <MartijnVdS> and later from "Smith's" to "Lay's" (which you call "Walkers")
[15:11] <mungbean> in 2013 Mars, Inc changed the size of the Twix standard bars from 58g down to 50g.
[15:11] <mungbean> rip off britain
[15:11] <MooDoo> you all know about - http://www.aquarterof.co.uk/ ?
[15:12] <MartijnVdS> MooDoo: do now ;)
[15:12] <ali1234> fizzy cola bottles
[15:12] <daftykins> MooDoo: ty sir
[15:12] <ali1234> i used to love those
[15:12] <mungbean> i still eat them
[15:12] <MooDoo> that site is dangerous to my wallet
[15:12] <mungbean> i have 2 every night after dinner
[15:12] <daftykins> + teeth?
[15:12] <MooDoo> yup :D
[15:12] <ali1234> i'm just imagining someone eating them with a knife and fork
[15:12] <davmor2> MooDoo: Space dust
[15:13] <ali1234> as the dessert course of a posh dinner
[15:13] <daftykins> ali1234: cola bottles? hahaha
[15:13] <MooDoo> davmor2: heh we gave my daughter some of that the other week lol
[15:13] <daftykins> delectable dessert O_.
[15:13] <ali1234> this amuses me more than it probably should
[15:13] <mungbean> i knew i shouldn't introduce quidco to my missis. she bought something that wasn't eligible in order to get an offer . no cash back, and wasn't going to buy the thing in the first place
[15:13] <popey> there's a shop round the corner from here which sells loads of that stuff
[15:14] <popey> http://www.americansweets.co.uk
[15:14] <MooDoo> OMG TWINKIES
[15:14] <davmor2> popey: there is one of those in Bridge North too
[15:25] <mungbean> woo desktop pc  16:24:56 up 502 days,  1:12,  3 users,  load average: 1.29, 0.40, 0.26
[15:25] <MooDoo> ah looks like it needs a reboot ;)
[15:26] <mungbean> nevarrrr
[15:26] <daftykins> power cut... right about... nao
[15:26] <Myrtti> oh dear I don't want to buy a new laptop but it finally seems to be the time to let this old horse go
[15:26] <daftykins> Myrtti: what's it doing wrong? :(
[15:27] <Myrtti> first the encrypted partition went haywire last week, I think I hear some minor side noise now, and it's dead slow
[15:27] <Myrtti> so I think it's really starting to go
[15:28] <mungbean> how old?
[15:28] <daftykins> disk healthy? memtest? take it apart \o/
[15:28] <Myrtti> 2007 or so
[15:28] <Myrtti> mind you it's Dell so it's already lasted longer than I expected
[15:29] <daftykins> hah
[15:29] <mungbean> my dell is 5 years old,
[15:29] <Myrtti> if it were only the harddrive I'd change it, but the screen is somewhat shot too
[15:29] <Myrtti> with dead bugs inside and the LED's losing luminosity
[15:29] <daftykins> ah, sounds like you've given it as much as you could
[15:30] <daftykins> Haswell time \o/
[15:30] <mungbean> thunder flies?
[15:30] <Myrtti> yup
[15:30] <MartijnVdS> the tiny tiny ones
[15:30]  * daftykins makes a rumbling sound with a wobble-board beside mungbean 
[15:30] <Myrtti> they've died, gone to heaven, and left black and bright glitches on the screen
[15:30] <mungbean> bigcalm: ^^
[15:30]  * bigcalm looks in?
[15:31] <mungbean> thunderflies, look!
[15:31] <bigcalm> Ug
[15:31] <bigcalm> Myrtti: I feel your pain
[15:31] <mungbean> 26 nodes won't turn on with IPMI :(
[15:32] <Myrtti> http://www.flickr.com/photos/myrtti/3671872678/in/datetaken/
[15:33] <jpds> Myrtti: Dell == Doesn't Ever Last Long?
[15:33] <mungbean> business ones definitely do
[15:33] <popey> wakka wakka wakka
[15:33] <popey> i used to love my latitude
[15:33] <popey> even had a nipple!
[15:34] <mungbean> latitude d630 here
[15:34] <mungbean> blue flat niplle
[15:34] <Myrtti> mungbean: yeah, that's the one I have
[15:34] <mungbean> core2duo?
[15:34] <popey> yeah
[15:35] <Myrtti> Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU     T7100  @ 1.80GHz
[15:35] <popey> i had an i7 one before I left $last_job
[15:35] <popey> was very nice
[15:36] <Myrtti> I was sure I had more ram...
[15:36] <daftykins> hehe
[15:36] <mungbean> looks like this? http://i.imgur.com/LJbz7Jl.jpg
[15:36] <daftykins> it snuck away!
[15:36] <popey> http://www.amazon.co.uk/TINY-WIRELESS-BLUETOOTH-ADAPTER-DONGLE/dp/B0013BFQUE/ref=pd_bxgy_rec-spk_text_y
[15:36] <popey> 34p!
[15:36] <Myrtti> well I suppose four is all I have then
[15:37] <Monotoko> ali1234: worked wonderfully... got it into postfix like magic \o/
[15:37] <mungbean> an SSD might give you bit more life in it
[15:37] <ali1234> Monotoko: cool :)
[15:37] <mungbean> i got a fsaer disk some years ago and really felt the speed
[15:38] <davmor2> popey: I have an i7 and I can confirm it's very nice :)
[15:38] <Myrtti> mungbean: http://www.flickr.com/photos/myrtti/3200416133/in/datetaken/ when I got it
[15:38] <Myrtti> I've changed the keyboard twice since then
[15:38] <Monotoko> ali1234: thank you so much, I wouldn't have got as far as I did in not nearly as little time if you weren't around
[15:38] <mungbean> yay for dell d630
[15:38] <daftykins> oh my word
[15:39] <daftykins> that looks like the old d505s
[15:39]  * popey has two workmen in his house
[15:39] <daftykins> D:
[15:39] <mungbean> is that a euphemism?
[15:39] <popey> heh, no
[15:39] <popey> building ikea furniture for me \o/
[15:39] <daftykins> O_O
[15:39] <mungbean> i think my d630 should last a bit longer
[15:39] <daftykins> where's the fun in that :(
[15:39] <MartijnVdS> but that removes all the fun from ikea furniture!
[15:39] <popey> the fun is it arrives then it's built
[15:39] <popey> and I didnt have to do anything
[15:39] <mungbean> had a new screen and hinge on warranty
[15:40] <popey> (other than move out the way)
[15:40] <mungbean> i bought my 630 for £450 from outlet
[15:40] <Monotoko> you should bill them extra for having to move out of the way
[15:40] <MartijnVdS> I had people build and install my Ikea kitchen for me
[15:40] <Monotoko> especially if it was in the way of the kettle
[15:40] <mungbean> Myrtti: i preferred my picture because of doggy ;0
[15:41] <davmor2> popey: you idle toad, paying someone else to build your ikea furniture is a new low :D
[15:42] <popey> we had a room decorated, floor layed, added "make the furniture" on top because he offered :p
[15:42] <daftykins> he even gets shopping delivered :(
[15:42] <daftykins> ;)
[15:42] <mungbean> whatever keeps the wife happy...
[15:43] <davmor2> popey: fair enough then
[15:43] <popey> exactly
[15:44] <davmor2> popey: plus of course it doesn't fall apart the minute you sneeze in it's general direction ;)
[15:44] <Myrtti> mungbean: I prefer mine because Marimekko box ;-P
[15:46] <davmor2> Myrtti: I love my ideapad Y580, the only issue I have is the stupid touchpad with it's fake buttons that are still part of the pad.
[15:46] <popey> davmor2: thats partly why, he puts it together better than me
[15:47] <mungbean> i was hoping the asus transformer would have taken over the world by the time i needed a new lappy
[15:47] <davmor2> popey: haha I actually enjoy putting ours together it's like lego and meccano for adults
[15:48] <popey> nah, lego and meccano you can do on a desk
[15:48] <popey> this thing is massive
[15:48] <MartijnVdS> hence the 'for adults' bit :P
[15:48] <davmor2> popey: however trying to move the things after is no fun at all :)
[15:48] <popey> https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-qVs2AWhY2Ow/UhOODVNdFlI/AAAAAAAAd-w/TKZRShJxQls/w1204-h903-no/IMG_1784.JPG
[15:49] <MartijnVdS> popey: PAX?
[15:49] <popey> ya
[15:49] <MartijnVdS> ph34r my l33t IKEA recognising sk1llz
[15:50] <ali1234> has anyone come up with a trick to make linux steam run the windows games in wine?
[15:51] <Myrtti> I've got four preferred companies that I'd like the lappy be made by, but the whole UEFI thing is a bit spooky, and I've so badly fallen off the wagon in keeping my knowledge up about what's good nowadays. And of course the hardest part is making decisions.
[15:52] <Myrtti> well, obviously it can't be made by all four, but one of the four. And in my dream universe it would have Intel chipset.
[15:52] <daftykins> so far i've seen a lot of situations where you can still disable UEFI
[15:53] <daftykins> time may well be running out on that front though :(
[15:53] <popey> Why would you want to disable UEFI?
[15:53] <Myrtti> well considering my list includes Samsung, it is really really spooky
[15:53] <popey> I mean, I can understand why you'd want to disable Secure Boot..
[15:54] <MartijnVdS> ALso, "disabling UEFI" usually means "enabling a BIOS-emulator inside UEFI"
[15:54] <popey> UEFI is a Good Thing™
[15:54] <davmor2> popey: I had an entire bedroom, office, livingroom to fit out plus a bathroom cabinet.  The heaviest thing by far even with the draws our is this http://www.ikea.com/gb/en/catalog/products/S29902933/
[15:55] <daftykins> because certain methods of bypassing Windows 7 activation only work on legacy installs ;)
[15:55] <daftykins> *whistle*
[15:55] <popey> moving on
[15:55] <popey> I do like the slide Bear Grylls has installed on his island in wales
[15:55] <popey> https://twitter.com/BearGrylls/status/369363102644457472
[15:55] <MartijnVdS> !piracy | daftykins
[15:55] <MartijnVdS> :P
[15:56] <daftykins> please don't waste my time with that
[15:56] <daftykins> that's a nice slide
[15:56] <mungbean> a slide?
[15:56] <popey> ya
[15:56] <MartijnVdS> Bear Grylls' slide
[15:56] <davmor2> popey:  I love the bump at the bottom of it to push it out past the rocks :D
[15:58] <mungbean> my son got a new slide
[15:59] <mungbean> he slides down, gets up and goes on it again, ad inifintum
[15:59] <mungbean> smiling the whole time
[15:59] <popey> slides rock
[15:59] <daftykins> ^_^
[15:59] <Myrtti> Samsung NP900X3C-A02 looks very nice
[15:59] <popey> if I had one I'd do the same
[15:59] <mungbean> lol
[15:59] <mungbean> sometimes he says weeeeeeeeeeeee
[15:59] <Myrtti> is it true that the newer kernels don't brick Samsungs anymore?
[15:59] <daftykins> Myrtti: my friend has one of the earlier ones of those, nice little systems if battery life isn't a great concern
[15:59] <daftykins> yeah they fixed that by now i'd have thought
[16:01] <popey> Myrtti: nice but odd resolution
[16:01] <popey> i really dont like these laptops that give you the illusion they're thin
[16:01] <daftykins> i saw a death watch beetle (woodworm type) on the front of my house today =|
[16:02] <davmor2> Myrtti: Uefi is no problem unless you want to dual boot then it is a bit more work than it used to be.  The only drawback if you can call it that is you need to install Ubuntu 64bit as it is the only one that supports UEFI out of the box.
[16:02]  * popey suspects Myrtti would install debian
[16:03] <davmor2> popey: Myrtti ah then it might be :)
[16:03] <Myrtti> ohmygawd NP530U3C is available in pink
[16:03] <bigcalm> 2nd hand Galaxy Nexus for 143 +6.63 P&P : worth it?
[16:03]  * Myrtti swoons
[16:03] <mungbean> pink laptops never get stolen
[16:03] <mungbean> ...or re-sold
[16:03] <Myrtti> bigcalm: almost bought one for my sister at about that price
[16:04] <Myrtti> mungbean: well it seems that I use my laptops to the death
[16:04] <daftykins> Myrtti: just had one of those in with a broken screen, friends sisters. they're pretty terrible
[16:04] <daftykins> well, hers was the 535U3C-A01UK
[16:04] <mungbean> do you have dell outlet in finland?
[16:04] <Myrtti> so reselling isn't really an issue
[16:04] <Myrtti> mungbean: debatably yes
[16:05] <davmor2> bigcalm: mine was 163 from CEX so it's about the going rate it seems :)
[16:05] <bigcalm> Humm
[16:05] <bigcalm> davmor2: better to buy from a CEX shop rather than amazon?
[16:05] <Myrtti> in which debatably means that the best stuff is only sold if you have a tax number
[16:06] <Myrtti> and selection even then is questionable
[16:06] <davmor2> bigcalm: no it's just cex take money which is what I had for Christmas :)
[16:06] <bigcalm> Aha, yes
[16:07]  * bigcalm takes a punt with Amazon
[16:08] <davmor2> bigcalm: you after a galaxy to put ubuntu touch on :)
[16:08] <bigcalm> davmor2: yes
[16:08] <bigcalm> davmor2: seems the cheapest option
[16:08] <davmor2> bigcalm: the bug has finally bitten you then :)
[16:08] <bigcalm> davmor2: there are some things I want to try out :)
[16:09] <davmor2> bigcalm: yeah next would be the n4 if you want to edge your bets
[16:09] <bigcalm> davmor2: yes, except 270 quid is a little much just to play with ubuntu touch :)
[16:10] <davmor2> bigcalm: you'll start swiping on android phones and not understand why it doesn't work I warn you :)
[16:10] <bigcalm> Oh dear
[16:11] <bigcalm> No swiping?
[16:11] <bigcalm> davmor2: where's your sgs3 now?
[16:12] <bigcalm> "Please limit your text to less than 4,000 characters."
[16:12] <davmor2> bigcalm: in a draw in the livingroom where it sits till I need a satnav or a phone for holiday where I need to share the t'interwebz
[16:12] <bigcalm> Damn you Amazon, that should be "fewer"
[16:13] <bigcalm> davmor2: does it take a micro sim?
[16:13] <bigcalm> Though I'm unlikely to put a sim in one any time soon
[16:13] <bigcalm> Like my sgs3 too much :)
[16:13] <davmor2> bigcalm: the galaxy nexus takes a regular sim, but you can get a converter for next to nothing
[16:14] <bigcalm> I have a converter. Bought one just before taking my sgs3 to t-mobile for repair. Knew the loan phone would need it
[16:15] <bigcalm> Trying to think what questions to ask the seller before ordering
[16:16] <davmor2> bigcalm: age, modded, scratches, does it all work, how long is the battery lasting
[16:17] <bigcalm> "Unlocked to all networks and upgraded to latest 4.3 android jellybean. Normal wear and tear with some but screen is excellent. Comes with original box and accessories (except headphones), white cover and extra battery (useful for travelling)."
[16:17] <davmor2> bigcalm: oh and ensure it is the gsm version not the cdma one
[16:17] <bigcalm> davmor2: how would one know?
[16:18] <davmor2> should be in the description :)
[16:18] <bigcalm> It's not, so how does one find out?
[16:18] <davmor2> bigcalm: ask the seller?
[16:19] <davmor2> you were looking for questions
[16:19] <Myrtti> does it mention t-mobile in the description? if buying from US
[16:19] <bigcalm> Sure, in case they don't know, how can I help them find out?
[16:20] <bigcalm> Myrtti: it doesn't. It's also the .co.uk site. Can't see the location of the seller but the P&P is 6.63
[16:20] <davmor2> bigcalm: I'm assuming it is to be honest as it is unlocked for all networks and you are on amazon.co.uk
[16:21] <bigcalm> http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/aag/main?ie=UTF8&asin=&isAmazonFulfilled=&isCBA=&marketplaceID=A1F83G8C2ARO7P&orderID=&seller=AR133AU9FZPCI
[16:24] <bigcalm> GSM/CDMA is only if I want to use a sim on it surely? Ubuntu Touch will work with either?
[16:24] <Myrtti> if the ASIN changes between GSM/CDMA, then that one is GSM
[16:24] <popey> GSM only
[16:24] <bigcalm> I have no idea what that means :)
[16:24] <popey> We don't yet support CDMA
[16:24] <bigcalm> popey: okay, thanks
[16:24] <Myrtti> because searching with the ASIN it turns up the US Amazon where it is sold as unlocked GSM
[16:26] <Myrtti> well, I don't think it actually was ever made as anything than gsm version, but afaik it needs to be t-mobile version... dunno tho
[16:26] <bigcalm> Email sent.
[16:26] <bigcalm> Oh
[16:26] <davmor2> bigcalm: the version gt-i9250 is the one you want which is on the label under the battery
[16:26] <bigcalm> Gah, just sent the email
[16:26] <bigcalm> Will wait for a response
[16:26] <davmor2> bigcalm: hence me saying ensure it is the gsm version :)
[17:00] <bigcalm> Walkies!
[17:02] <Monotoko> ... I'm having a horrible day
[17:02] <Monotoko> I forgot the root password of the server I set up last week -.-
[17:05] <mgdm> have you got physical access to it?
[17:05] <Laney> hunter2
[17:05] <MartijnVdS> Laney: *******
[17:06] <Laney> good to see that still works
[17:18] <popey> hmm
[17:18] <popey> i appear to need to compile a kernel
[17:18] <mgdm> oh, fun
[17:18] <popey> with a one line patch
[17:19] <mgdm> that's not something I've had to do in ages
[17:19] <popey> I'm running http://kernel.ubuntu.com/~kernel-ppa/mainline/v3.10.7-saucy/ so i grabbed https://www.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/v3.x/linux-3.10.7.tar.xz
[17:19] <popey> and then patched with the 0001, 2, 3 in the ppa folder
[17:19] <popey> then I will add my one line patch
[17:19] <popey> I stupidly thought I could "debuild" it
[17:19] <popey> but noooo
[17:21] <ali1234> hehehe, the kernel package is super weird
[17:22] <popey> yay, don't need to now
[17:22] <popey> found out it's in 3.11-rc6
[17:22] <popey> which we have here http://kernel.ubuntu.com/~kernel-ppa/mainline/v3.11-rc6-saucy/
[17:22] <popey> WIN!
[17:22] <ali1234> oh wait, you're not even attempting to build a package?
[17:22] <davmor2> popey: you got the kernel team to build it :D
[17:22] <popey> i was going to build  akernel package
[17:22] <popey> but dont need to now
[17:22] <ali1234> yeah the kernels on kernel.org don't have debian packaging
[17:22] <popey> yeah, but thats ok, because the patches do
[17:22] <popey> http://kernel.ubuntu.com/~kernel-ppa/mainline/v3.11-rc6-saucy/0001-base-packaging.patch does
[17:23] <popey> anyway, not going to build it now, panic over
[17:24] <ali1234> yeah... even then, you don't build then with debuild
[17:28] <popey> yeah, not done it for so long
[17:29]  * popey reboots into 3.11-ec6
[17:29] <popey> *rc
[17:29] <MartijnVdS> good luck
[17:30]  * popey leaves a ping running rather than walk 15 feet to the machine
[17:31] <MartijnVdS> popey: I do that with my openwrt routers :)
[17:31] <popey> always nice to see the transition...
[17:31] <popey> From 192.168.1.115 icmp_seq=89 Destination Host Unreachable
[17:31] <popey> 64 bytes from 192.168.1.2: icmp_seq=90 ttl=64 time=2009 ms
[17:32] <popey> Linux homeserver 3.11.0-031100rc6-generic #201308181835 SMP Sun Aug 18 22:35:54 UTC 2013 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux
[17:32] <popey> \o/
[17:32] <MartijnVdS> \o/
[17:32]  * popey scrubs
[17:33] <popey> and hopes it doesn't OOM this time
[17:33] <popey> https://patchwork.kernel.org/patch/2697501/  being the one line patch i needed ☻
[17:33] <MartijnVdS> popey: I have some rc installed as well, because it fixes a Haswell USB3 bug 8-)
[17:34] <MartijnVdS> The controller is newer than the older driver expected
[17:34] <MartijnVdS> bad lubotu3
[17:37] <daftykins> 2TB WD Red drive arrived today \o/
[17:38] <diddledan> what am I doing wrong? http://paste.ubuntu.com/6007238/
[17:38] <daftykins> £68.48
[17:38] <diddledan> daftykins, nice price
[17:38] <daftykins> i'm afraid i'm cheating in no VAT land
[17:38] <daftykins> ;)
[17:38] <MartijnVdS> diddledan: have you tried supplying the whole path?
[17:38] <MartijnVdS> diddledan: not just "vg0/mirror"
[17:39] <diddledan> that reports no pool with matching name ''
[17:39] <MartijnVdS> and just 'mirror'?
[17:39] <diddledan> ERROR    Error with storage parameters: Storage volume must be specified as vol=poolname/volname
[17:40] <MartijnVdS> it looks very weird though
[17:42] <daftykins> does it not get weirded out by the space in "--disk vol" ?
[17:42] <popey> top - 18:42:06 up 10 min,  1 user,  load average: 14.69, 11.92, 6.18
[17:42] <popey> poor little microserver
[17:42] <daftykins> wowzer
[17:42] <daftykins> you're killing it :'(
[17:42] <popey> its "busy" ☻
[17:42] <popey> just been rebooted to the daap server is scanning all the.. uh... "media"
[17:42] <popey> and btrfs scrub running, and wget mirroring another site
[17:42] <popey> busy busy busy life of a microserver
[17:43] <daftykins> :>
[17:43] <daftykins> ah reminds me
[17:43] <diddledan> daftykins, if it's not liking the space then what should it be?
[17:43] <daftykins> finished playing game with friend, must restart downloaderisings
[17:44] <daftykins> diddledan: was just a guess, given your errors it probably is taking it correctly
[17:44] <popey> btrfs is kicking the crap out of all 12 disks
[17:44] <popey> \o/
[17:44] <diddledan> 12?!
[17:44] <diddledan> in a microserver? is there even enough room in one of those?
[17:44] <popey> http://paste.ubuntu.com/6007262/
[17:44] <popey> scrub scrub scrub
[17:45] <popey> external 8-way array
[17:45] <diddledan> aah, nice
[17:45] <MartijnVdS> popey: how much space is that in total?
[17:45] <popey> I ♥ btrfs
[17:45] <popey> /dev/sdc         22T   12T   10T  53% /srv
[17:45] <MartijnVdS> that's.. quite a bit of space
[17:45] <diddledan> 22T?! yowzers
[17:45] <daftykins> what are the drives?
[17:45] <diddledan> I want now
[17:45]  * popey shrugs
[17:46] <MartijnVdS> popey: just dmesg | pastebinit  and they'll be happy
[17:46] <popey> http://paste.ubuntu.com/6007270/
[17:46] <popey> tea time
[17:47] <daftykins> samsungs 0o
[17:48] <daftykins> ruh-roh
[17:48] <daftykins> http://forums.seagate.com/t5/Desktop-HDD-Desktop-SSHD/BEWARE-the-so-called-Samsung-HD204UI/td-p/166118
[17:49] <daftykins> "These are cheap, unreliable Seagate drives, made in China and with the poor quality underlined by Seagate's new 1 year warranty policy."
[17:49] <diddledan> ouch
[17:49] <MartijnVdS> Yay RAID
[17:49] <MartijnVdS> I wonder what I have
[17:50] <diddledan> what are the WD RED actually like in use?
[17:50] <MartijnVdS> Crucial_CT120M500SSD1 & ST3000DM001-1CH166
[17:50] <daftykins> how can you not even know
[17:50] <daftykins> diddledan: dunno, first one i've bought and it's only to replace someones dead 1.5TB RAID member
[17:52] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: I forget the brands :)
[17:52] <diddledan> WD marketing will have you believe they're the best thing since sliced bread for NAS use
[17:52] <MartijnVdS> of course, that's one of the few places people still buy spinning rust for
[17:53] <MartijnVdS> until the 2-3TB SSDs start to come down in price, next year or maybe the year after that
[17:53] <diddledan> I still like the longevity of spinning rust
[17:53] <diddledan> SSD still has a write limit whether you want to believe it or not
[17:53] <diddledan> spinning rust will keep going as long as the motors are working
[17:54] <MartijnVdS> diddledan: http://uk.hardware.info/reviews/4178/10/hardwareinfo-tests-lifespan-of-samsung-ssd-840-250gb-tlc-ssd-updated-with-final-conclusion-final-update-20-6-2013
[17:55] <daftykins> trust me, you can still hit SSD issues way before write longevity
[17:55] <daftykins> my intel X25-M G2 160GB has been rather quirky of late
[17:55] <MartijnVdS> whet kind?
[17:56] <daftykins> it was stalling then BSOD'ing windows if it read a certain sector ~the 75% mark
[17:56] <daftykins> i had to secure erase it to recover
[17:56] <ali1234> that's pretty standard
[17:56] <ali1234> HDs do the same thing
[17:56] <daftykins> no, they queue the sector for reallocation
[17:56] <ali1234> yes
[17:56] <daftykins> and it works
[17:57] <ali1234> and in the mean time, if windows attempts to read it, it will bluescreen
[17:57] <ali1234> then, the only way to get the sector out of the queue and back into working order, is to force write to the block
[17:57] <ali1234> ie exactly what you described
[17:58] <daftykins> i've not required that with HDDs
[17:58] <ali1234> i've seen this happen on about 10 harddrives so far this year
[17:58] <MartijnVdS> you must see a lot of disks
[17:59] <ali1234> i only see them when "it's broken"
[17:59] <daftykins> yeah i see a lot of dead ones too
[17:59] <ali1234> about 50% of the time, this is exactly what has happened
[17:59] <daftykins> such as http://i.imgur.com/Q3DRt6A.png
[17:59] <ali1234> 1 bad sector, windows bluescreens on read, force write + fsck restores the computer to 100% working
[18:00] <MartijnVdS> unless that one sector is part of some important dll
[18:00] <daftykins> yeah maybe it's just down to probability
[18:00] <ali1234> consider that a typical windows install is like 16GB these days
[18:00] <daftykins> 'cause i think this sector was in my spare area
[18:00] <ali1234> and most people have about 100MB of photos and everything else is in the cloud
[18:00] <daftykins> oh they definitely spit out pictures more than that
[18:00] <ali1234> so yeah there is a very high chance the bad sector is somehting important
[18:01] <ali1234> anyway, this behaviour is by no means limited to SSDs
[18:01] <daftykins> that was never the point
[18:02] <daftykins> it was kinda amusing, i'd basically not be able to interact with explorer anymore, i might be able to keep web browsing for a bit
[18:02] <daftykins> but mostly UI elements were locked
[18:02] <Myrtti> gosh I miss Google Reader
[18:02] <daftykins> so do i :(
[18:02] <daftykins> i don't like feedly
[18:02] <diddledan> Myrtti, unfortunately google reader doesn't miss us
[18:03] <Myrtti> I just spent 15 minutes waiting for my laptop to cope using Feedly
[18:03] <daftykins> it was quite annoying because it fixed it so i couldn't just get warranty going, as i had 1 month left of warranty by that point and i was about to move house where i'd be without the use of the computer
[18:03] <Myrtti> 115 unread and it took forever
[18:03] <daftykins> do you have all the feeds in the world? :>
[18:04] <Myrtti> daftykins: I'm a news junkie, so Guardian headlines, Google News headlines, Finnish YLE news headlines, etc...
[18:04] <diddledan> daftykins, there's that many feeds?!
[18:04] <ali1234> 115 feeds?
[18:04] <diddledan> I figured maybe a dozen at most
[18:04] <diddledan> teh worlds is teeny
[18:05] <daftykins> now now diddledan, we said we'd work on the sanity ;)
[18:05] <Myrtti> ali1234: unread news
[18:05] <Myrtti> not feeds
[18:05] <diddledan> dammit xchat autocorrecting teh to the
[18:05] <ali1234> 115 *items* and your computer could not cope?
[18:06] <Myrtti> 218 sources
[18:06] <Myrtti> ali1234: yeah
[18:07] <ali1234> i only use RSS to get my youtube subscriptions, so that i don't have to look at the youtube homepage
[18:07] <Myrtti> could grief
[18:07] <Myrtti> my laptop can't cope with browsing for a new laptop from the dell website
[18:07] <Myrtti> must not turn laptop hulk
[18:07] <daftykins> XD
[18:08] <diddledan> Myrtti, I think you need a newbie
[18:08] <ali1234> yeah i think you have a serious problem there
[18:09] <ali1234> either that or a really old laptop
[18:09] <diddledan> _really_ old
[18:09] <diddledan> 286?
[18:09] <daftykins> 2007/8 she said
[18:09] <ali1234> netbook or something
[18:09] <daftykins> nope
[18:09] <Myrtti> Dell Latitude D630 from 2007
[18:09] <diddledan> aah, slower than the old 286 then :-p
[18:09] <daftykins> this whole convo was earlier :>
[18:10] <Myrtti> with 4gigs of ram
[18:10]  * daftykins sends Myrtti one of the i5s he's working on
[18:10] <Myrtti> I think the harddrive might be going
[18:10] <daftykins> anything from the SMART info?
[18:10] <Myrtti> but the display is shoddy too so an upgrade might be in order
[18:11] <ali1234> that should run ubuntu ok... ish
[18:11] <ali1234> as long as you don't try to use unity
[18:11] <ali1234> actually even that should be ok
[18:12] <ali1234> i would check the temperatures as well, it's probably full of dust
[18:12] <Myrtti> unity was fine when I used it
[18:12] <Myrtti> I'm on Debian now
[18:12] <Myrtti> the temp is fine, under 60 now
[18:12] <ali1234> heh
[18:12] <ali1234> so 59.9?
[18:14] <ali1234> it could still be clocking down to prevent overheating
[18:15] <Myrtti> http://www.flickr.com/photos/myrtti/9512199206/ <-- last week
[18:15] <ali1234> well, what does smart say about the drive status?
[18:15] <Myrtti> just installing smartmontools as we speak
[18:16] <MartijnVdS> *after* retrieving the "offline data"
[18:31] <DJones> Heh http://mashable.com/2013/08/20/too-much-internet/
[18:46] <DJones> mungbean: After yesterday morning conversation, this was the decision, say hello to Jack http://dancol2012.files.wordpress.com/2013/08/cimg1229.jpg?w=640
[19:51] <daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/85k2p3m1wyj8j85/IMG_20130820_192009.jpg
[19:51] <daftykins> the excitement that is - Guernsey Milk \o/
[19:52] <DJones> Sheesh, thats expensive for milk
[19:52] <daftykins> yeah?
[19:52] <daftykins> what would a litre be where you are?
[19:53] <diddledan> we buy in pints
[19:53] <daftykins> doh
[19:53] <DJones> Maybe not for branded milk, I picked up a 4 pint bottle for £1 tonight
[19:53] <daftykins> hrmm
[19:53] <daftykins> Guernsey bans import to promote local
[19:53] <DJones> Only supermarket own brand, but milk is milk to me
[19:55] <DJones> Jersey milk in the supermarket is £1/litre so comparable with your prices
[19:56] <daftykins> *shakes fist at Jersey*
[19:57] <ali1234> milky milky?
[19:57] <daftykins> it's all about the Guernsey Gold (cow)
[19:58] <mungbean> mmmm sainsburys choc mousse with 1ml of rum on top
[19:58] <diddledan> don't call me a cow
[19:59] <diddledan> or were you referring to ali1234 ? :-p
[19:59] <mungbean> DJones: aha woof woof
[20:02] <Myrtti> well then... http://paste.debian.net/27668/
[20:02] <MartijnVdS> Myrtti: it got too hot
[20:02] <MartijnVdS> once
[20:02] <MartijnVdS> In_the_past
[20:02] <Myrtti> that's not surprising, this is Dell
[20:02] <Myrtti> :-D
[20:02] <MartijnVdS> Myrtti: have you done an "extended" test? you could try that.
[20:02] <Myrtti> that should be it
[20:03] <daftykins> are you sure it's not just got clogged vents due to age? or do you give it a nice spring clean disassemble Myrtti ?
[20:03] <daftykins> as in, contributing
[20:03] <Myrtti> I did in the spring
[20:03] <daftykins> each year? :D
[20:04] <MartijnVdS> Myrtti: you're not a smoker, are you? Smokers' PCs gunk up *bad*
[20:04] <Myrtti> well I've changed the keyboard this spring, and I think last year too
[20:04] <Myrtti> nope
[20:04] <daftykins> hardware ECC, doesn't sound good
[20:04] <Myrtti> never even tried
[20:04] <MartijnVdS> Myrtti: excellent ;)
[20:04] <daftykins> i guess you're beyond just wanting to do a drive swap though?
[20:05] <Myrtti> I could go that route, as getting a new laptop is always a hassle
[20:05] <Myrtti> but the screen is really a gonner too
[20:05] <daftykins> also, wow @ 80GB
[20:05] <daftykins> the encryption use probably finished that sucker off
[20:05] <daftykins> :>
[20:05] <Myrtti> it's always been encrypted...
[20:05] <Myrtti> *shrug*
[20:05] <daftykins> sometimes panel swaps are cheap too?
[20:06] <daftykins> yeah it would've made it work harder
[20:06] <daftykins> contributing to the heat though eh
[20:07] <ali1234> does full drive encryption increase fragmentation?
[20:08] <daftykins> why do i feel like that question is rhetorical? :D
[20:08] <mungbean> its a 5400rpm drive too
[20:08] <mungbean> badblocks might tell you some stuff
[20:08] <ali1234> i wouldn't be surprised if it did, but i have no idea
[20:09] <mungbean> 4gb is a luxury, i have 2gb in my d630
[20:09] <Myrtti> yeah I had it upgraded when I still used this at work
[20:10] <Myrtti> LaTeX was a bit sluggish with massive pdf's
[20:10] <ali1234> 4gb is entry level now
[20:10] <Myrtti> I know
[20:10] <Myrtti> ridiculous
[20:11] <Myrtti> I don't know what's so funny about 80gig tho
[20:11] <daftykins> though your thing is likely PC2-5300, old school
[20:11] <mungbean> my work PC (i5) struggles on 4gb
[20:11] <Myrtti> I use only about 16 of it
[20:11] <daftykins> just an indication of age
[20:11] <Myrtti> I'd probably get 80g replacement :-D
[20:11] <ali1234> my / is 12gb
[20:11] <daftykins> i got a £250 for someone the other day that was shocking to have a 320GB
[20:11] <daftykins> heh i doubt you'd be able to get an 80
[20:11] <Myrtti> if they sell them
[20:12] <daftykins> also you want to go higher capacity for performance
[20:12] <mungbean> and cheaper
[20:12] <mungbean> the RAM is pricey too at that age
[20:13] <ali1234> just get a new one
[20:13] <daftykins> yeah i priced up £41 for some PC2-6400 just last night, 2 x 2GB for a very similar spec machine
[20:13] <daftykins> from crucial
[20:14] <mungbean> did a deal with my wife, i will read the book she just finished and she'll read mine
[20:14] <daftykins> :>
[20:15] <mungbean> both nonfiction thouh
[20:15] <mungbean> good compromise
[20:15] <daftykins> i need to carry on with Robinson Crusoe
[20:15] <mungbean> di you wnat to:
[20:16] <mungbean> argh
[20:16] <daftykins> but my word he blabs on
[20:16] <ali1234> boooooooring
[20:16] <ali1234> yeah really
[20:16] <mungbean> i decided life's too short to read books i dont enjoy
[20:16] <daftykins> hehe
[20:16] <ali1234> spoiler: nothing interesting happens
[20:17] <mungbean> did someone say that horizon yesterday was rubbish?
[20:17] <Myrtti> there we go: http://www.verkkokauppa.com/fi/product/6668/djrfr/Kingston-SSDNow-V300-60-GB-SSD-2-5-kovalevy
[20:20] <daftykins> sandforce controller based drives tend to be the less reliable kind, if you want rock-solid reliability you can't go wrong with crucial's offerings
[20:25] <mungbean> man i forgot how much little babies smile
[20:25] <zleap> lol
[20:25] <mungbean> my 5 month old smiles and laughs most of the day when you just look at her
[20:25] <zleap> not to mention dribble on people
[20:26] <zleap> awww
[20:28] <mungbean> happy face: http://i.imgur.com/vaPC1uo.jpg
[20:29] <daftykins> :)
[20:29] <mungbean> need to find the tux babygro
[20:29] <daftykins> :O
[20:30] <mungbean> every parent has one, right?
[20:30] <zleap> dunno try cafepress
[20:30] <zleap> oh u need a toy stuffed tux too
[20:31] <zleap> if u don't mind em ending up soggy of course
[20:33] <mungbean> i have one :)
[20:33] <mungbean> also the babygro ...http://i.imgur.com/DgCXjD2.jpg
[20:33] <mungbean> seems to have gone missing since though
[20:34] <daftykins> babies always remind me of how weird our society is
[20:34] <daftykins> how defenseless we are back then, but how far we climb by being nurtured
[20:37] <mungbean> Received disconnect from 192.168.1.8: 2: Too many authentication failures
[20:37] <mungbean> weird. thats on my headless debian box
[20:38] <mungbean> first time logging in since boot
[20:39] <daftykins> ooh-err
[20:39] <mungbean> aha, it was rejecting after trying keys only
[20:39] <mungbean> su - mrsmungbean and work ok
[20:46] <mungbean>  ssh -o PubKeyAuthentication=no 192.168.1.8
[20:46] <daftykins> D:
[20:48] <mungbean> wonder why
[20:52] <mungbean> works now
[21:38] <Monotoko> is there a nice local mail reader in the console?
[21:38] <Monotoko> so I can read and respond from the server itself?
[21:38] <Myrtti> mutt
[21:38] <Myrtti> alpine
[21:39]  * Monotoko goes to Google those
[21:39] <Monotoko> I've heard of Mutt actually, never used it though
[21:53] <Monotoko> asass
[21:53] <Monotoko> oops
[22:07] <popey> yay, still killing my microserver nicely
[22:08] <popey> top - 23:08:01 up  4:36,  1 user,  load average: 14.98, 14.07, 11.98