[01:18] <micahg> gah sorry, forgot to upload, doign so now
[03:52] <OvenWerks> micahg: that was two hours ago now but thank you if you are still up. (The branches don't show the release yet, so I am not sure if it is finished)
[03:57] <OvenWerks> Yahoo, new libagv-extras are out. Maybe our ISO will build now.
[06:22] <smartboyhw> zequence, back from Switzerland?
[07:01] <smartboyhw> Hey cub
[07:01] <cub> Good morning smartboyhw ;)
[07:06] <cub> I'm reading up on seeds so I can try to include gnome-orca in US before FF. Big breakthrough. :P
[07:07] <cub> Also got some good feedback from the ubuntu-accessibility maillist from visually impaired people on how the get Orca to work in Xfce.I haven't had time to test the different suggestions yet though.
[07:07] <smartboyhw> cub, sure:)
[08:20] <smartboyhw> hey DarkEra
[08:27] <DarkEra> hi smartboyhw 
[11:21] <zequence_> hi. Did you know Brussels airport is so cheap with electricity you have to cykle to ccharge your laptop
[11:21] <cub> haha
[11:22] <zequence_> I forgot to bring my sweat pants
[11:22] <zequence_> Probaby got a big wet stain in the back of my pants now :P
[11:22] <cub> to keep all thos EU lobbyists fit.
[11:23] <zequence_> free ethernet, so at least thats smetthing
[11:24] <zequence_> cub: The actual applications go into the seeds, but settings go elsewherre
[11:24] <zequence_> Right now we have ubuntustudio-default-setttings for that
[11:24] <cub> I'm not following..?
[11:24] <zequence_> so, if you know which settings need to be changed, we could help out in adding them
[11:24] <cub> ah yeah sure
[11:24] <zequence_> cub: about Orca
[11:25] <cub> first I need to get it to work on my laptops
[11:25] <cub> so I know what the fixes are
[11:25] <zequence_> adding orca is as simple as adding the package name to the correctt seed file
[11:25] <zequence_> ok
[11:25] <cub> yes, I have read the documentation but not downloaded the seed yet
[11:26] <cub> I'm getting there slowly in between work and family
[11:27] <cub> but from what I understand Germinate will take care of any dependencies?
[11:28] <zequence_> Yes. Just like installing with apt in that regard
[11:33] <cub> hmm my shirts are being held by DHL?? "Due to a surcharge, the shipment could not be delivered and is being stored. The recipient has been informed."
[11:36] <zequence_> someone didnt pay their bills to DHL?
[11:36] <cub> I payed when I ordered...calling them now
[11:37] <cub> adn I haven't been informed at all, I just saw this since I traced my package
[11:39] <zequence_> Im thinking the company who pays DHL
[11:40] <zequence_> i.e. spreadshirt
[11:40] <zequence_> What a contrast to how fast I got my stuff
[11:41] <cub> Weird. According to DHL sweden they can't even track it because HDL Germany has different codes.
[11:41] <cub> And on top of that DHL DE hand the shipment over to Posten in Sweden to deliver, not to DHL SE.
[11:42] <cub> And voila, the say it's being held while it's actually delivered to Posten. DHL SE apparently get lots of calls about this. The sad part is that I now have no valid tracking number. 
[11:43] <cub> DHL SE didn't there was any extra charge but that Posten would deliver it and the DE system has a crappy status put in. :D
[11:43] <zequence_> how ungerman of them
[11:44] <cub> I want my cup dammit.
[11:44] <zequence_> yerr cub-cup
[11:44] <cub> hehe
[11:45] <cub> Yet another tech at work reinstalled his Ubuntu with Fedora. They are mocking my eee pc with US saucy. The mug will bring back balance.
[11:49] <zequence_> it will change everything!
[11:50] <cub> oh yeah. The girls will hang at my office, Sales will bring me gifts. It will be awesome.
[11:51] <cub> right, so Posten has actually got my package which was delivered last Friday. But it seems they notice to me has disappeared. But I got a new tracking number which I can use to collect it tonight. #win
[11:53] <zequence_> That happens aaall the tie
[11:53] <zequence_> and they always blame you
[11:53] <zequence_> at least at my local store
[11:54] <zequence_> good to hear your stuff has arrived saffely
[11:56] <cub> yeah, I just love when my phone bill doesn't arrive and then I get a penalty a week after for not paying it. "But I didn't get it?!" "YHes you did, pay up."
[11:57] <cub> but cool, I ordered the other mug and a couple of different colors so it will be fun to check them out later today
[13:40] <cub> smartboyhw, any news on 12.04.3?
[13:40] <smartboyhw> cub, NO.
[13:41] <smartboyhw> The release team are still preparing the tracker:O
[13:41] <cub> and we can't test until that's done?
[13:41] <smartboyhw> cub, yep
[13:41] <cub> hehe ok
[13:42] <cub> good thing we are spread out around the globe to be able to work 24/7. :D
[13:42] <smartboyhw> cub, :D
[14:42] <OvenWerks> cub: I am wondering how a blind or nearly blind person works.
[14:42] <OvenWerks> What applications do they use?
[14:45] <OvenWerks> For example, if I was blind and wanted to create a document or a book, I would think using a text editor and something like TeX or even html for formating would make more sense than using libreoffice with some kind of support.
[14:46] <OvenWerks> a mouse would not be much use in the normal way and in factmight get in the way.
[14:49] <OvenWerks> My opinion (how much is that worth when I am sighted?) is that it might be easier to use a server install rather than a gui session at all.
[14:51] <OvenWerks> Any blind people I know (all two and a half that I "see" in person and two I have talked with via email) are much better with the keyboard than I am.
[14:52] <OvenWerks> They seem also to have a much better memory for commands.
[14:56] <cub> yeah, I've seen mostly three types of work flows or rather tools
[14:57] <cub> Visually impaired who is not blind might use screen enhancements and a big screen. Other I worked with used speech (which was quite impressive when jumping around within a program) or braille readers
[14:57] <OvenWerks> So my question becomes: if I was a blind musician, would I be better starting with studio and adding things to help me work with it, or start with a distro that worked for me and add the tools to that for audio?
[14:57] <cub> At the visually impaired centre where I worked everyone used the same office applications
[14:58] <cub> yeah I talked some to Josh Kennedy who emailed the list about that. Since there is Vinux aimed for the visually impaired and it's based on Ubuntu 12.04, why not just add a low-latency kernel to it?
[14:59] <cub> Instead of installing Ubuntu Studio and hope everything else works
[14:59] <cub> Then again, there seem to be a small community who would like to use Ubuntu Studio anyway, so why not.
[15:00] <OvenWerks> The two people on LAU who are blind, use nama and midish instead of ardour.
[15:00] <cub> Josh, in this case has already got hydrogen and the apps he wanted up and running in Vinux, seems he was not about to do like live audio recordings.
[15:00] <OvenWerks> we do not ship nama (or it's depends)
[15:01] <cub> no I took a look at them wehn you mentioned them before.
[15:01] <OvenWerks> midish has no real depends.
[15:03] <OvenWerks> nama is I think using git now and I know many people use it with ardour as well.
[15:03] <cub> But yeah, like I wrote before. Am I doing a lot of testing for something noone will actually use? :D
[15:03] <OvenWerks> zequence: maybe we should add git or something like it.
[15:03] <cub> you can use nama with Ardour?
[15:04] <OvenWerks> one or the other
[15:04]  * smartboyhw likes git;P
[15:04] <smartboyhw> And bzr out of the most
[15:05] <smartboyhw> Just PLZ, no SVN..
[15:05] <cub> Haha on Nama Screenshot page: "Nama's GUI is ugly. There, I've said it."
[15:06] <OvenWerks> nobody uses the gui.
[15:06] <cub> I like the idea to do recording without a gui and the be able to import it to Ardour on a workstation for mixing
[15:07] <OvenWerks> The reason nama works for the blind person is the CLI.
[15:07] <cub> yes
[15:08] <cub> Would the low-latency kernel work on any ubuntu based distro?
[15:09] <OvenWerks> yes
[15:09] <cub> just like the wiki "how to make your vanilla Ubuntu = Ubuntu Studio"
[15:09] <cub> so perhaps I should make a wiki of "How to make Vinux -> Vinux Studio" instead. :P
[15:10] <OvenWerks> I don't think I would add ubuntustudio-audio though
[15:10] <cub> why not?
[15:10] <OvenWerks> too many extra apps that would never be used :)
[15:10] <OvenWerks> and others that need to be added.
[15:11] <cub> ok
[15:11] <OvenWerks> maybe that doesn't matter.
[15:11] <OvenWerks> most of the plugins work for a blind pperson with nama.
[15:12] <cub> on another note, I saw a thread in the forums on why an installation of VLC would uninstall a couple of ubuntustudio- on saucy, any idea why?
[15:12] <OvenWerks> but they still require X.
[15:13] <OvenWerks> VLC uninstalls some of the libav things we use.
[15:13] <cub> was it like before as well? I don't remember removing anything when I installed vlc
[15:13] <cub> then again, it was some time ago
[15:14] <OvenWerks> It may be that VLC has switched to using some of the ffmpeg libs which conflict.
[15:15] <cub> aha
[15:15] <OvenWerks> It may be instructive to read up on ffmpeg vs. avlib...
[15:16] <OvenWerks> And other similar messes like cdrecord vs: wodim
[15:16] <cub> crap I'm late again. Gotta go! =)
[15:16] <OvenWerks> bye
[17:00] <zequence> OvenWerks: I know there are git based backup applications. If there's something specific for multimedia, or used for that, I see no problem in adding it
[17:00] <zequence> Back home, finally
[17:00] <zequence> On a Swedish keyboard :P
[17:04] <OvenWerks> zequence: I am not sure about git or how to add it in a useful manner. I just know that there are a number of people on LAU who have mentioned that use git to store ardour snapshots.
[17:05] <OvenWerks> ardour is supposed to be able to store it's own snapshots too, but I guess (at least in the past) that has be probematic
[17:05] <OvenWerks> s/be/been
[17:08] <OvenWerks> nama now (or will soon) use git natively as it's backup/snapshot option.
[17:08]  * OvenWerks seems to be in broken english mode today :P
[17:10] <zequence> There's one that deals with backing up the /etc directory
[17:10] <zequence> etckeeper
[17:10] <zequence> it can do multiple, git, and others
[17:11] <zequence> automatic backup of any changes
[17:11] <zequence> I'm sure that should be possible to adapt to any application
[17:15] <OvenWerks> That might work then. I just don't want to add something without knowing how it works. Without knowing it adds something worth while.
[17:15] <OvenWerks> Going on some people have meantioned they use it is not enough to make me comfortable.
[17:20] <zequence> I dont think etckeeper as it is would work, I dont really know, but the concept - and using something like git
[17:27] <nickgbro> holy, ive been away a while...
[17:27] <nickgbro> what's new?
[20:36] <cub> OvenWerks, are you around?
[20:37] <cub> never mind, catch you tomorrow. :)