=== Guest80089 is now known as RadiumCat === RadiumCat is now known as Guest78138 === Guest78138 is now known as RadiumCat [02:51] Is Mir a networked window system like X, or is it more of a graphics library for displays that are on the same host as the client programs? === Lcawte is now known as Lcawte|Away [03:06] I don't believe it's trying to do network transparency [03:11] Ah ok. [03:13] that's not to say it won't be there / won't be able, just that I don't believe it'll be baked-in. but I'm really the last person to ask (I just happen to be awake) [03:16] Perhaps that's its rationale then: to be a simple local graphics library. [03:16] * ball ponders [03:23] I think it's bed time. [03:23] Goodnight shauno [06:54] morning all [07:01] \o [07:01] on a mission to get an IP based webcam wireless.... [07:02] MooDoo: AlanBell can help you with that :) [07:02] MooDoo: or is it a wired webcam you want to *make* wireless? [07:02] no want a wireless webcam [07:03] the neighbour has a problem with a dog pooing on her garden everyday, I want to catch thm [07:04] MooDoo: you might want to consider one that's supported by http://www.openipcam.com/ -- but that's not actually required (as most IP webcams have a "proper"(ish) API) [07:04] was looking at this - http://www.amazon.co.uk/webcam-Internet-infrated-Nightview-Wireless/dp/B003VUY5PW [07:04] 300 kilopixel.. that's not very high-res [07:04] 640x480 [07:05] MooDoo: for only a bit more you get http://www.amazon.co.uk/Wireless-HD-IP-Security-Camera/dp/B009OX0BTY [07:05] ooo even better [07:12] AlanBell: what camera do you use for your chickens? [07:29] good morning everyone, [07:37] brobostigon: morning [07:37] morning MooDoo [08:17] * DJones finds a 3rd party website using photos from his own website without authorisation, actually copies of the photo's rather than just linking to the original photo [08:18] DJones: get onto them quickly and demand they remove them or pay you for their use. [08:19] POssibly may do that, but probably not, website looks ok and if anything would be free advertising [08:20] DJones: are you credited? === iahmad is now known as iahmad|lunch [08:20] Nope, thats one thing I may ask for [08:20] DJones: yeah do it, if they credit you then fair enough :D [08:21] Or more accurately, may ask them to credit the original professional photographer [09:00] Hey , I reinstalled windows 7 and Ubuntu 12.04 on my system 2 days back. Both OS were working fine . Yesterday I Installed Nvidia Graphic card on windows 7 and I switched to ubuntu after rebooting it , ubuntu did not boot ( it says nouvea i2wc faill .... ). I have installed ubuntu on a seperate partition [09:01] there ? [09:01] neetz_: interesting [09:01] you could install the nvidia driver on your ubuntu system [09:01] !nvidia [09:01] For Ati/NVidia/Matrox video cards, see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/VideoDriverHowto [09:01] I can't see why if you install the drivers on windows it would affect ubuntu? [09:01] i can ☻ [09:01] but its not booting only [09:02] can you boot to single user recovery mode? [09:02] popey: really? known issue? [09:02] i have seen similar [09:02] is my nvidea driver installation reflected in bios [09:03] neetz_: can you boot to recovery mode? [09:03] yea and i get a series of options [09:03] what next [09:04] can you enable network, i think thats one of the options? [09:04] thats there , but i dont have a wifi network here [09:04] plug a cable in? [09:06] ok fine , i'll go to college and have a lan plugged in , .. what next ? [09:06] after entering enable networking [09:06] well, there's a few things I'd do [09:06] first I'd be interested in knowing why it failed [09:06] so I'd want to look at /var/log/Xorg.0.log for example [09:07] ok how do i find if its failed and stuff like that [09:07] that log will tell you why x failed to start [09:08] whats the exact command ? [09:08] the other possible "quick fix" is to install the binary nvidia driver, assuming it isn't already installed === iahmad|lunch is now known as iahmad [09:08] can you get online from college and come back and we can walk you through it? [09:08] or is that not easy?> [09:09] its not easy , we dont have college today and idk how to come here through terminal and stuff [09:09] gotcha [09:10] can you me your emailid , so that i can contact you ? [09:10] so probably easier to reboot into ubuntu, get the exact error message and post it to http://askubuntu.com/ [09:13] ok, its officially time to remove the register from browser bookmarks having just read the Australian fork related story [09:13] @popey , have a look at this http://askubuntu.com/questions/221276/ubuntu-12-10-nvidia-driver-problems [09:14] does it work on mine if i follow [09:15] maybe /me looks [09:15] neetz_: what model of machine do you have? [09:16] neetz_: and what version of ubuntu? [09:16] dell n5110 [09:16] and ubuntu 12.04 [09:17] @popey , i had this issue 2 weeks back when i had ubuntu 12.10 also , 3 days back i reinstalled my windows and ubuntu .. [09:17] so it has optimus graphics? [09:18] yes [09:18] bummer [09:18] so disable the nvidia card in the bios settings, boot ubuntu, install the new optimus capable driver, then reenable it [09:18] popey what? [09:18] http://askubuntu.com/questions/202644/how-to-install-nvidia-optimus-driver-on-ubuntu-12-10 [09:19] idont think there's an option in the bios , coz i asked dell people today , they said they can only control the devices on motherboard [09:23] sudo apt-get purge nvidia* does this require internet ? [09:25] no [09:25] ok @popey i wll try this http://askubuntu.com/questions/221276/ubuntu-12-10-nvidia-driver-problems [09:26] and which mode do i enter first [09:43] Ubuntu updates to 13.04 are giving me kernel panic on boot. Sadly, grub doesn't seem to have kept previous kernel. What are my options? [09:57] isleofmandan: it keeps your old kernel in an option immediately below the most recent one [09:58] It's not there. Only one kernel is listed, (and again with a 'recovery' option) === Lcawte|Away is now known as Lcawte [10:01] well that's odd [10:01] whats the next option below that? [10:03] popey: nothing. Only two entries listed [10:03] this your xps? [10:03] luckily not :) [10:04] Acer revo [10:04] and this is a real ubuntu 13.04 install? [10:04] not mint or some other crap? [10:04] Yes, genuine 13.04 [10:04] hmmm [10:04] any usb devices attached you can unplug and boot? [10:04] Machine hasn't been used for a week or so. I booted it, and did sudo apt-get update, sudo apt-get upgrade [10:05] only keyboard and mouse are attached [10:05] hmm [10:05] can you boot to recovery [10:05] (you should dist-upgrade, not upgrade) [10:05] * isleofmandan wishes he'd not done full disk encryption now... [10:05] popey: I never knew that. So apt-get update, apt-get dist-upgrade [10:06] yes [10:06] I can boot to recovery so far... but then panic [10:06] but still, you shouldnt get a panic [10:06] how odd [10:08] It's pretty rare for updates to totally bork my machine too. Hopefully just me and nobody else. I couldn't see any new bugs filed anyway [10:08] any clues about the panic? [10:08] Oh now this is weird. Powered off at mains socket, and now can get into recovery... [10:08] can you take a photo or video of it? [10:08] ooh [10:09] new territory... I assume 'run in failsafe graphic mode' is best thing to try? [10:14] isleofmandan: well, as recovery works. try booting normally [10:15] ok [10:17] a few [fail] whizz by.... but I have a mouse cursor now... [10:17] ...and lightdm [10:17] and desktop :) [10:17] so I should apt-get dist-upgrade now? [10:19] yes [10:19] so, not an ubuntu problem \o/ [10:19] Morning all [10:19] something got wedged, and a full reboot fixed it, interesting [10:19] i see that sometimes [10:19] So what does 'update' do, that 'dist-upgrade' doesn't? [10:19] i think it is something to do with USB [10:20] sometimes the machine boots up with no working USB at all [10:20] I reckon Nvidia card is to blame. I saw a message about it 'tainiting' kernel at some point [10:20] it only happens on reboot, which i only do once a month anyway [10:20] turning it off fixes it [10:21] ali1234: And on my machine, I had to physically pull power rather than just turn it off, it seems [10:21] that's not unusual [10:21] USB devices stay powered when the machine is in sleep states [10:21] which is what happens unless you pull the power [10:22] dist-upgrade is pulling in some kernel sounding bits, so I'm hopeful it'll work next boot.... [10:22] ali1234: makes sense [10:22] so yeah i'm convinced there's a recent bug in linux USB which isn't initializing the USB chipset properly on warm reboot [10:22] to go along with the bug that makes it eat the CPU on large transfers [10:22] and gadgetfs being broken [10:23] oh and the IRQ thing [10:23] possibly these are all related [10:23] but linux USB has really gone downhill recently [10:23] isleofmandan: upgrade will upgrade the packages you currently have installed [10:23] but it will _not_ pull in any new packages that those packages require [10:23] dist-upgrade will [10:23] popey: Thanks. I'll remember to use dist-upgrade from now on then. [10:24] so if you are paranoid about new stuff appearing on your machine, you upgrade, because you will only ever get updates to stuff you already have [10:24] my revo (behind the telly) is set to auto update [10:24] Hi davmor2 [10:24] morning davmor2 [10:24] popey: I suppose it means I have to trust the boffins not to push out new dodgy packages though ;) [10:25] morning davmor2 and bigcalm [10:25] hey bigcalm going for steak tonight? [10:25] davmor2: who knows? :) [10:26] don't suppose anyone knows how I postmap everything in main.cf in order? [10:26] * isleofmandan reboots... [10:27] davmor2: I actually want pizza [10:28] bigcalm: You'll be lucky :D [10:30] davmor2: very, considering that the pub doesn't serve it [10:30] popey: All good now. Thanks. Next time you're in the IoM, I'll buy you a beer or two. That's two machines you've fixed for me. [10:30] heh, yay [10:32] hurrah, now I am crashing pitivi and openshot simultaneously. Seriously, I just want to glue a handful of video clips together and I've been going on this for days so far [10:34] yeah, crap isnt it? [10:34] I need to stop reading the mailing list. It's like reading youtube comments sometimes [10:34] kdenlive is apparently good [10:34] haha bigcalm ☻ [10:35] bigcalm: I just thought all the Sounder list users had moved to the uk list [10:36] popey: aptitude produces output longer than my terminal scrollback when I ask it to install kdenlive, so I'm trying to avoid that [10:37] hah [10:37] however the openshot devs are quite friendly [10:38] and i have found i can stop openshot crashing by deleting ~/.openshot before opening it [10:39] well I managed to get one clip into it and export it as video. But VLC is playing it back by jumping 5 seconds at a time as it goes along so I don't think this has quite worked [10:39] pitivi looks promising, and sometimes can output a video file. Just not always [10:40] delightful [10:40] Linux Video Editors in "Still crap in 2013" non-shocker. [10:41] lornajane: have you tried the "professional" alternative? [10:41] jussi: what's that? [10:41] ie. http://www.lwks.com/ [10:42] good luck with taht [10:42] it barely supports any codecs on linux [10:42] I'll just have to do this all in one take with loads of alt-tab showing I think [10:42] ahh, Ive not used it, just had people say try it. [10:42] i had success with openshot and a k* one [10:43] lornajane: latest openshot version? [10:43] Kazam used to be able to capture one monitor, so I just did that and flipped about between desktops, but the "upgraded" version can't do that [10:43] mungbean: whatever apt gave me, I'm on 13.04 [10:43] lornajane: also, have you tried the vlc editor? (one sec, let me look it up) [10:43] http://www.videolan.org/vlmc/ [10:44] "stable downloads are not available" [10:44] oh wait, seems its not quite ready for public [10:44] yeah [10:45] I'm not sure that would make it worse than the alternatives though, from the very frustrating issues I've had so far [10:45] openshot seems to be producing nonsense, I don't think it's VLC's playback that's the problem. [10:46] and I really don't know anything about video codecs, I just want to record my screen and then glue together some clips, maybe trim them, and play it back [10:46] does youtube let you do that? [10:46] post upload editing. [10:47] I'm just looking for some online tools, when I typed my requirements, they didn't seem complicated [10:48] lornajane: just to distract you for a moment. Do you know what the 3 columns of numbers mean when one uses gearadmin --status? [10:48] Buggered if I can find mention of the output of that command [10:49] bigcalm: sorry, no, I don't use it [10:50] lornajane: ho hum. Thought you were likely to do so due to your blog posts on gearman. No worries :) [10:52] bigcalm: usually I just throw things in it and expect them to come out again - persistent storage lets me see what's in there ... I don't really administer it, just run it under supervisord and expect them to work it out between themselves [10:52] lornajane: just as I have been using it all [10:52] lornajane: but something's gone weird in production that I think might be a back-log of commands [10:56] bigcalm: are you using persistent storage? Is that why you think there's a backlog? [10:56] lornajane: yep, via mysql [10:56] can you tell if a worker script has attempted to process the job, but failed? [10:57] I've never looked in the table to find out :) I'll do so now [10:58] Locally I use sqlite3 as it's available by default [10:58] Took a lot of messing around to get mysql support working on test and production [10:59] @popey , tried but still no booting dude [10:59] bummer [11:01] i had success with blender video editing recently [11:01] ali1234: do you think that might be complicated for a beginner though? [11:02] sure [11:02] * lornajane is currently wrestling the youtube editor [11:02] video editing is always going to be though [11:02] i still think kdenlive is worth a punt [11:02] it's really not [11:02] you can always sudo aptitude autoremove kdenlive after [11:02] popey: I was freaked out by the huge amount of required/clashing/updating packages that apt showed me [11:03] its kde ☻ [11:03] lornajane: there well over 2000 jobs in the queue table. I wish I could empty the jobs [11:04] try blender, it's not that hard [11:06] I actually think I should find out how to combine video clips from commandline :) [11:06] if I was smarter about capture, I really only need to glue [11:07] I need pandoc for video! [11:07] it's called ffmpeg [11:08] it's called avconv :) [11:10] * lornajane makes a list [11:14] not bummer , deleting some files [11:15] don't bother with avconv, it's just a fork of ffmpeg with more bugs [11:15] ffmpeg does say I should use avconv, weirdly [11:16] yes, the debian packagers inserted that message because they prefer avconv [11:16] lornajane: yeah, avconv is the new command-line tool for the same libraries as ffmpeg uses.. it's almost the same command-line too [11:16] ali1234: did they? Because upstream seems to prefer avconv too [11:16] upstream? [11:16] you mean libav? [11:17] which is also a fork of ffmpeg? [11:17] obviously they prefer their own fork [11:18] ah.. it's a schism within the ffmpeg community: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/9477115/who-can-tell-me-the-difference-and-relation-between-ffmpeg-libav-and-avconv [11:20] yes, on ubuntu you need to build ffmpeg manually, because ffmpeg package is just a wrapper around avconv [11:22] they seem like a muchness, at least to this beginner [11:22] yeah. ffmpeg supports more codecs [11:23] what are you actually tryng to do anyway? [11:23] a short screencast [11:24] kazam can capture an individual window, so I have bits of video captured from each of the windows that I wanted to show [11:24] ok well blender absolutely supports the mp4 output from kazam [11:25] you will have a problem if all the clips are different size though [11:25] that will be hard to fix [11:26] tbh that's probably why you keep getting crashes and nonsense [11:26] they are all the same size, I've resized my second monitor to 800x600, full-screened each window, and asked kazam to capture that [11:27] I was capturing in webm because that's what the pitivi channel recommended yesterday but it's not a big deal to recapture - getting the toolchain working is always the worst bit === alan_g is now known as alan_g|afk [11:27] lornajane: if you have a bunch of videos of the same format that you just want to put together just do "cat vid1.ogv vid2.ogv vid3.ogv > completevid.ogv" note no ability to edit but you can at least piece them together that way [11:28] yeah and then watch as it spectacularly fails to play in about 50% of players [11:28] there seem to be so many things that could go wrong here that I probably should know but don't :( [11:28] i suspect blender will work with ogg as it uses ffmpeg [11:30] ffmpeg, or libav? :P [11:31] ali1234: works for me when it is the same format/refresh and frame rate it is when it is different that it breaks horrendously :) [11:31] davmor2: I think you have to set the framerate of the video *before* importing [11:31] MartijnVdS: ffmpeg if you download it from blender.org [11:31] (in blender) [11:31] ali1234: ah.. probably [11:32] and they don't accept bug reports on anything else [11:32] MartijnVdS: sorry I was talking about just cating them together :0 [11:32] :) [11:33] the only thing i can't figure out in blender is how you export the final sequence :S [11:34] ali1234: there are HOWTOs for all of that on Youtube [11:34] i know [11:34] i'm trying to figure it out without reading any documentation though [11:35] lornajane: do gearman jobs have to return true? [11:37] bigcalm: that's a good question. I'd guess so, let me have a look [11:37] I have some returning an ID, which would be seen as a true if testing is loose [11:37] hmmm, it's not obvious, but my worker does if things go well [11:38] If things go wrong, I'm returning null. Maybe I'll just return true instead [11:38] No, I'm returning false if things go wrong [11:38] Ah well [11:39] bigcalm: I read that as "Do german jobs have to return true" I was thinking I know they are efficient but that is a little harsh :D [11:40] #postfix are as much help as a chocolate fireguard [11:40] davmor2: googling for information on gearman often tries to correct one with german [11:40] * MooDoo is looking into IP based wireless webcams :S [11:40] MooDoo: is this for the random dog nextdoor? [11:41] davmor2: yup. [11:42] MooDoo: speak to AlanBell popey and czajkowski I'm sure they can recommend some for you :) [11:42] AlanBell: popey czajkowski hello all, I'm after a wireless IP based webcam, do you have any recommendations :) [11:44] MooDoo: this is the one that a few of us own: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Wireless-camera-Pan-Tilt-2-ways/dp/B00432J56G/ [11:44] Though I still haven't used mine :S [11:45] bigcalm: that looks grand, thanks :D [11:47] http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00432J56G/ref=oh_details_o05_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 is the one I have [11:48] Jinx [11:48] yeah thanks, looks just the ticket. [11:51] done thanks all [11:58] popey: I've ordered a 2.1mm extention cable with it, but just read a review saying it's not actually 2.1mm, is this right? [11:58] great thinking there bigcalm now popey can't say anything till someone says his name, so you get to deal with all of his meetings for him, all the help he gives out on all the channels he is on and fill in the google docs we need to update daily :P [11:59] davmor2: what? [11:59] bigcalm: you Jinxed him [11:59] Oh. Snap would have been a better word [12:00] bigcalm: :D === alan_g|afk is now known as alan_g|lunch [12:07] MooDoo: no idea [12:09] popey: ok thanks [12:12] another episode of extreme support just occurred, 5 mile ride and back to swap a dead disk in a RAID setup ^_^ [12:13] lornajane: I changed all of my workers to return a true-ish value and the backlog appears to be reducing :D [12:15] Wii fit likes me today. 2lb down on last week's weigh-in [12:15] Will make up for it tonight [12:16] Large onion rings is a good place to start [12:16] Oh, maybe I'll have a large mixed grill ;) [12:16] how does it weigh you 0o [12:17] daftykins: how does Wii Fit weigh me? [12:17] ja [12:17] Via the balance board [12:18] oh ok, comes with gadgets [12:18] Yus [12:18] bigcalm: that's good news (about the backlog, although the onion rings sound like good news too) [12:18] Well, Wii Fit comes with the balance board. The board is then useable with other games [12:18] lornajane: :D [12:22] Can I cope with the 6.5 hours until the LUG? [12:22] i should move the wii and balance board to the den [12:22] popey: would it get used more in there? [12:22] yeah [12:22] Then it would be a good move ;) [12:23] this is making me realise how long it is since I used mine - not since I got the wii U I don't think [12:23] Humm, is the Wii U worth getting? [12:23] heh, i'm amazed they sell [12:23] ASDA have stopped selling them in some stores I think [12:24] hm, current telly in den only has one scart [12:24] might have to dig out the scart multiplexer thing [12:25] popey: does it have RGB component phono sockets? [12:25] That's how I have mine hooked up [12:25] nope, vga, dvi, hdmi only [12:25] er [12:25] nope [12:25] vga, hdmi, scart only [12:25] I like the wii U, but not too many games are really made for it yet. The super mario world has been huge fun [12:26] I might dig out my other old consoles too [12:26] :D [12:26] currently we're playing pikmin, that's fun too, I get to read the map and shout intructions while Kevin actually has to fight monsters and things [12:26] lornajane: I'm a sucker for Zelda games. It's why I bought a DS and the Wii :S [12:26] bigcalm: yep, that's my main motivator also [12:26] Just been informed that lunch is ready. I do like Hayley being at home recently :D [12:26] we do have a PS3 but I'm definitely a nintendo fan, even though I came to gaming rather later in life [12:26] * bigcalm toddles off [12:27] I don't like Nintendo. Their tech is too far behind the curve, and their games too childish. Imho. [12:28] depends what you're into I imagine - I'm endlessly enchanted by childish so it works really well for me [12:30] wii balance board is quite fun , but the ps/xbox of this world are a league above [12:31] there's a snowboarding game for it which is quite fun [12:33] just under 4 weeks for GTA V now [12:33] \o/ [12:36] mungbean: what nitendo got right was fun with their games, what xbox and PS got right was pretty and huge games, I remember the day when Nitendo was the place to go for huge rpg style games like final fantasy etc but now there are bigger games on android :) [12:37] Nintendo seemed to innovate with the hardware, but they just don't seem to really know what to do for software [12:37] "let's make another Mario!" [12:39] as opposed to... everyone else? [12:39] "let's make another fifa!" "let's make another CoD!" [12:39] yeah but that's not the full picture for those platforms [12:39] ali1234: Flower, Journey, Heavy Rain, ... [12:39] you're not even attempting to follow. [12:40] yeah because everyone knows that nintendo consoles only have one mario game and one zelda game, rght? [12:40] Nintendo just spams 20000 Mario games per console generation and hopes one or two stick [12:40] ali1234: CoD, Fifa exist for Nintendo systems as well [12:40] maybe not CoD [12:40] but fifa for sure. [12:41] sooooooo....... [12:41] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KG2M4ttzBnY [12:41] ! [12:41] nintendo. [12:41] sweet, silly nintendo [12:42] ^_^ [12:42] did it not ever occur to anyone to like, write numbers on the punch cards, so they would know what order they go in? [12:42] XD [12:42] i was pondering this [12:42] nintendo are, for want of a better explanation, experts in crafting the most beautiful sculptures they can, from the walls of their rut. [12:42] like after the third or fourth time you dropped a stack of them [12:43] they didn't understand the internet with the gamecube, they didn't understand the internet with the DS, they didn't understand the internet with the Wii, and they don't understand the internet with the Wii U or 3DS [12:44] "the internet" as far as consoles goes, is a load of 12 year old kids swearing at you... so there's that [12:44] to a degree they get away with it, because their MO for a long time now has been very much what japanese developers do - endless incremental refinement of existing formulae [12:44] it's very ironic that people say nintendo games are childish... when basically children would rather play shootan games and call each other names [12:44] yes, that's true [12:45] nintendo's games are the pinnacle of their respective genres, but they're not really a place for innovation [12:46] maybe that's why they keep coming up with fancy new controllers so it feels new [12:47] the wii introduced millions of non-gamers to games, which made the wii seem an appealing development target for developers, despite the crummy spec. however, those non-gamers didn' [12:47] didn't actually buy any games, they just racked up ten thousand hours of wii sports [12:47] i think they bought animal corssing and wii party etc [12:47] judging by the games that come up for sale on the chavvy local buy and sell groups on facebook [12:48] the attach rate on wii is terrible [12:48] :> [12:48] i bought bta3 and spent 100s of hours on that [12:48] so lots of developers lost money by making wii games nobody bought [12:48] so now they're scared of publishing on nintendo platforms [12:48] to a degree the same happened with the gamecube - nintendo games sold, third party didn't [12:49] and even the n64, to a lesser degree [12:49] the n64 was because of the expense of cartidges wasn't it? [12:49] is the sims on android full of paid DLC? [12:49] the wii u..... they're trying to sell them to wii owners, but have cocked up the marketing *so badly* that nobody's bought one, and no third party publishers want to waste time on a console with no users [12:49] i don't even know what a wii u is [12:49] is it a controller? [12:50] is it a tablet? [12:50] its like a wii with a tablet handheld controller [12:50] if they'd named it "wii 2", that would have cleared up *so much* [12:50] i don't even know what it looks like [12:50] i am a wii owner [12:50] like a fat wii [12:50] but have no interest in getting a new console for sequels of games i already got bored of [12:50] nintendo release new consoles in December, and I also have a birthday then. So if there's a new nintendo platform, I usually own it pretty quickly [12:50] it's a HD-capable games console, with lots more RAM than the other HD-capable games consoles [12:50] i still play my wii though [12:51]