[00:28] <jbicha> I don't see the point; for 3.10 the old ones don't exist any more so we're not keeping them around
[00:28] <jbicha> although maybe they should be added to the gnome-wallpapers package upstream
[01:00] <darkxst> jbicha, ok just replace them then
[01:04] <roasted> backport the wallpaper? I guess that means 3.10 won't land by default?
[01:24] <jbicha> no, and we can't land gnome-themes-standard 3.10 without at least GTK 3.10
[01:33] <jbicha> the games could be updated to 3.10 but since they need to be updated individually now, it will take someone a while to do it (and there will be a second beta, a RC, and a final build)
[01:33] <jbicha> many of the smaller utilities also require GTK 3.10 too so not much more can be updated for saucy directly
[01:53] <roasted> I assume a PPA will exist though?
[02:12] <darkxst> roasted, yes
[02:12] <darkxst> currently the core parts of 3.10 are on gnome3-staging
[02:12] <darkxst> they will be moved to a new gnome3-next ppa when they are ready
[02:14] <roasted> nice
[12:58] <jbicha> ricotz: do you know if wayland will be updated to 1.2 in saucy? because cogl needs it, right?
[15:52] <superdump> how does the ubuntu gnome project manage gnome updates?
[15:52] <superdump> it seems like ubuntugnome 13.10 will use gnome 3.8
[15:52] <superdump> but around that time, gnome 3.10 will be released
[15:54] <superdump> well, 3.10.0 is scheduled for september 25th currently
[15:54] <superdump> does ubuntu gnome then update the packages using the next gnome release and put them on a ppa? or how do you manage it?
[15:55] <smartboyhw> superdump, the problem is September 25th is WAY past FeatureFreeze
[15:55] <superdump> sure, i understand
[15:55] <smartboyhw> That's why Ubuntu GNOME can't include it
[15:55] <smartboyhw> It will probably be in 14.04
[15:55] <smartboyhw> And might appear in a PPA too
[15:55] <bjsnider> there's always a ppa
[15:57] <superdump> i see that there is always a ppa, i'm just wondering how long it will take to get 3.10 in some usable form
[15:58] <superdump> and in saying that, i'm not making any demands
[15:58] <superdump> just wondering how ubuntu gnome manage it :)
[15:59] <bjsnider> it's been explained
[16:01] <superdump> there's an upper bound of 14.04 but it hasn't been suggested how long it may normally take you guys to package up a new release after it's been made - is it closer to 13.10 or closer to 14.04?
[16:01] <superdump> for example
[16:03] <bjsnider> right away in the ppa
[16:03] <superdump> excellent
[16:03] <bjsnider> stable enough for a release would be 6 more months
[16:05] <superdump> thanks
[21:01] <jbicha> robert_ancell: hey, for bug 1212408 you added an extra line to the bottom of https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/gnome-session/ubuntu/view/head:/debian/patches/50_ubuntu_sessions.patch
[21:01] <jbicha> but maybe you could use https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/gnome-session/ubuntu/view/head:/debian/patches/52_xdg_current_desktop.patch instead?
[21:02] <jbicha> do we need X-LightDM-DesktopName= and DesktopName= ?
[21:02] <robert_ancell> jbicha, oh, I didn't notice that patch
[21:03] <robert_ancell> jbicha, is that patch obsolete now? I guess we need it for GDM
[21:03] <robert_ancell> I'd prefer to use the 50 patch, since otherwise both patches will try and modify the same file
[21:05] <jbicha> it's two different files, ubuntu.desktop and ubuntu.session.desktop
[21:05] <robert_ancell> yes
[21:06] <robert_ancell> if I put the change in 52_xdg_current_desktop.patch then both 50_ubuntu_sessions.patch and that would modify ubuntu.desktop
[21:06] <robert_ancell> Note that LightDM can't read ubuntu.session.desktop
[21:08] <jbicha> I don't know enough about what's going on to prefer any particular way
[21:09] <jbicha> but as you know we have lots of patches that tweak app behavior based on XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP so it at least needs to work under lightdm and gdm
[21:10] <jbicha> I didn't realize 'gnome' wasn't using upstart user sessions yet
[21:10] <robert_ancell> jbicha, right, as I understand it since gnome-session is not the first process in the session or will not be it has to be set before gnome-session starts
[21:10] <robert_ancell> jbicha, I'm also unsure what that email was referring to exactly, just wanted to make sure you don't hit that bug without knowing about it
[21:19] <jbicha> yeah I'm not sure what the risk is either but it looks simple enough to revert if it did cause problems, and we'll probably hit other bugs if Ubuntu GNOME *doesn't* use upstart use sessions
[21:32] <bjsnider> is it possible to use 100% systemd 0% upstart? or will it be in 3.10 i should clarify
[21:35] <jbicha> bjsnider: not with Ubuntu, you'll need to use Debian if you want systemd as init
[22:05] <bjsnider> it's outright impossible?
[22:08] <darkxst> bjsnider, why do you want to run 100% systemd?
[22:17] <bjsnider> i'd like to have 100% gnome is the main issue
[22:17] <bjsnider> especially with wayland and whatnot
[22:20] <darkxst> the init system has very little impact on gnome
[22:21] <darkxst> logind is the important bit, and we have that
[22:22] <bjsnider> even in 3.10
[22:34] <darkxst> bjsnider, yes even with 3.10
[22:56] <darkxst> Guest27918, http://pastebin.com/5yBvEEHx
[23:45] <nm_> hi