=== Lcawte is now known as Lcawte|Away [02:08] hello [02:10] I have a question, can I set the location of a wine emulated desktop? Like automagicly move it to the center as soon as it starts up [02:25] depends [02:27] predator8bit: yes [02:27] predator8bit: you can use devilspie to do it [02:28] you can also do it with window manager rules, if your window manager supports it. that is slightly less likely to explode [02:28] tried that [02:29] but I have more games that are running in wine and only one that requires this thing [02:29] you can set the name of the wine desktop per game [02:30] then you can write different rules based on that name (probably) [02:30] yup [02:30] Im using Kwin [02:30] in the end, the size of the window is up to the app, but where it ends up on screen is entirely controlled by the window manager [02:30] if you run wine explorer/desktop=,1920x1080 [02:30] then it will give the desktop a unique title, which you can match with devilspie [02:30] KDE can do window rules [02:30] KDE does everything [02:30] I know [02:30] or KDE, or whatever. [02:31] yes Im on Kde, its quite confty :) [02:31] personally i like the compiz feature that zooms a window to fit the screen [02:31] well, actually it zooms the screen to the window [02:32] it's handy when you have a game that won't run at native resolution [02:32] and it doesn't matter where the window actually is on screen [02:32] kwin cannot do this [02:32] at least, i couldn't figure out how to do it [02:32] it probably can though, it does everything [02:32] I could run this game on native resolution but that brings me other problems [02:32] ali1234: yea, I love that feature too [02:32] yeah, like the game runs super slow [02:32] ali1234: does kwin have a cube? :P [02:33] i heard somewhere arma 2 does this natively - instead of changing screenmode it renders to texture and then scales it up [02:33] all games should do this, it's much faster and better than any other method [02:33] no, if I switch to desktop 2 and back to 1, the game minimizes [02:33] and if I try to restore it [02:33] well then you're not running it in a wine desktop [02:33] it will restore but the panel will overlay it [02:33] or you haven't turned on the option that hides mouse events if you leave the window [02:34] ah the panel overlay bug [02:34] there's nothing you can do about that one [02:34] when that happens under compiz, clicking the window brings it back to the front [02:34] yes I know, thats why I play it in a smaller window [02:34] setting the window "always on top" might help [02:34] ali1234: you sound like you're a KDE man now :P [02:34] hmm, ill give it a try [02:34] why not make the window exactly the size of the area between the panels [02:35] Azelphur: when i say KDE does everything, i mean it in a bad way [02:35] like the library that contains all books, actually contains no books [02:35] o.O [02:35] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Library_of_Babel [02:36] predator8bit: you could also make an activity for playing the game, which has no panels [02:37] keeping above helped, the panel overlay bug haunts me no more! thank you! [02:37] :) [02:37] fun [02:38] predator8bit: check for the option about mouse and virtual desktops, it's in winesettings [02:38] it might help too [02:39] wine is set to steal focus (not letting the window manager to set its focus) so the mouse is trapped inside the game [02:39] yeah you don't want that [02:40] you want the mode where it tells the game it has exclusive control of the mouse and then just doesn't tell it if the mouse leaves the window [02:40] thus the game will not minimize itself or any other funny stuff [02:40] if you switch to another desktop [02:40] i can't exactly remember how you set that up but i remember doing it, last time i used wine was ages ago though [02:40] i want it to trap my mouse, because if I start to right click on the desktop while in a fight in DotA I'm screwed [02:40] lol [02:41] :) [02:41] you're like the fourth person i've seen asking this exact question in the past week [02:42] this DotA game was a recent release for linux? [02:42] that was Dota2 [02:42] the original game is just a map for the game Warcraft 3 [02:42] ah yeah - the other people weren't using wine, now i think about it [02:43] well, just so you know, people playing DotA2 don't have it any better [02:43] natively i mean [02:43] and as Valve stated, they like to hire modders and perfect their mods into standalone games [02:43] like with Team Fortress and Counter-Strike [02:44] i've never even heard of it until about a week ago [02:44] I've been playing it for years (and still suck at it x)) [02:48] One fun thing about Dota2 is that it's still behind the original, because they haven't ported all the playable characters yet, and some NPC's are missing too. [02:50] i think anyone who plays MMOs should read the player of games, use of weapons, and surface detail, in that order [02:52] maybe, but DotA isn't a classic MMO, it is a session based arena style one with a bunch of characters (heroes) to choose from [02:53] still applies [02:53] mostly [02:54] i would include FPS games too, really, in MMO definition [02:55] anything where you're playing directly against random people on the internet [02:57] but in DotA reading it all won't help that much, because there are over 110 heroes to choose from and over 120 items also 4 or more spells per hero, there are many combinations, noone can memorize all of them [02:58] oh the books won't help you to play better :) [02:59] not much, this one requires experience, learning the players instead of the game [03:03] of course there is a lot to learn about the game too, but after the basics there is no tutorial to guide you (of course there are some generic tutorials which are trying to be flexible and apply to all sorts of situations, but there are always unpredictable things in this game) [07:27] hi [07:29] ...? [07:53] Morning [07:53] \o popey [07:57] Morning all [07:57] * MartijnVdS just ordered: http://shop.lego.com/en-GB/The-DeLorean-time-machine-21103 [07:59] g'day === dave is now known as Guest56992 [08:08] morning all === schwuk_away is now known as schwuk === Lcawte|Away is now known as Lcawte [08:23] Good morning peeps :) [08:30] Morning all [08:32] Yo [08:33] Ho ho [08:36] o/ TheOpenSourcerer [08:36] yo AlanBell [08:38] Aren't you two in the same office? [08:41] not this morning [08:42] Fair enough :) [08:47] popey: Did you do any further research into using a Nexus 4 as a iPod Touch alternative? [08:47] TheOpenSourcerer: I did, however it seems Sophie specifically wants FaceTime [08:47] well, that's one thing she wants [08:47] Google Hangouts? [08:47] lol [08:47] Skype [08:47] dwatkins: google hangouts isn't facetime [08:48] and neither is skype [08:48] :) [08:48] I showed it to Monty last night and he seems keen. [08:48] Many of her friends in her class use facetime. [08:48] Network effect. [08:48] popey: fair enough, I gather it can use video, however, not sure how good it is, and clearly it's a separate system, yes. [08:48] Vendor lock-in etc. [08:48] I use hangouts daily, I know of them ☻ [08:49] how's the video quality, popey? [08:49] they are all much the same for me [08:49] is facetime point to point or multiplayer? [08:49] One of our friends is getting rid of her iPhone 4, so we got that as it's in very good condition [08:49] p2p [08:49] Don't forget she "can't" use hangouts [08:49] she's 10 [08:50] Anyone here got a Nexus 4? [08:50] probably can't use skype either [08:50] I do ☻ [08:50] Any good as a general device? [08:50] No. I don't like it. [08:50] For many reasons. [08:50] Care to mention any of them? [08:51] Low build quality, too big, poor camera, poor audio, micro-usb, stupid button placement [08:52] TheOpenSourcerer: I like it :) [08:52] But i've never been spoiled by expensive iThings ;) [08:52] So we'll probably go with iphone 4 for now and if she wants/needs a phone I'll chuck a sim in it [08:52] oh, and one more. It's android. I don't like android. [08:53] k [08:53] Do you like Ubuntu Touch? [08:54] its okay ☻ [08:55] HEh [08:55] its not finished though, so.. [08:55] TheOpenSourcerer: Ive N4, S3 and Note 2. if you want opinions, I will share... [08:55] i have a nexus 4 [08:55] (oh and an S2, but thats not relevant) [08:55] it's my new phone, replacing the wp8 lumia [08:56] if my phone broke today i'd buy a n4 [08:56] mungbean: not I... [08:56] directhex: you didnt have that long [08:56] mungbean, it's obscene value, yes. there's no reason to buy any other phone in the £150-£200 price bracket [08:56] directhex: found a buyer for your firefox os phone? [08:56] popey, yeah [08:56] directhex: correct. [08:56] My 9yr old wants a bit of tech for his birthday in 2 weeks. iPod Touch kind of thing. Thought the N4 might be a good alternative. He's not locked into the iWorld (yet) [08:57] popey, i got the lumia in january, so it's done better than some other phones [08:57] TheOpenSourcerer: for that, absolutely [08:57] directhex: as long as that.. time flies [08:57] what happened to the lumia? [08:57] died? [08:57] popey, the lumia 820 is just worse for my use cases than the 800 (wp7) was [08:57] you had a firefox os phone directhex? [08:57] TheOpenSourcerer: so you'll be locked into the google world instead? [08:57] TheOpenSourcerer: but buy the protective rubber/plastic thing [08:57] AlanBell, to play with. am blogging about it, but have been swamped so unable to do so [08:57] I have one on order [08:57] popey: "locked into google" allows a whole range of vendors and value [08:57] nope [08:57] one [08:57] google [08:57] mungbean, got sick of it. now it belongs to fonebank.com [08:58] hardware vendors [08:58] doesn't matter who makes the handset, it's still the play store [08:58] really? [08:58] never installed an apk from elsewhere? [08:58] or the amazon store, or one of several others... [08:58] with apple you are locked into both, and locked hard [08:58] I'd rather be dependent on G than A [08:58] e.g. amazon, humble, etc? [08:58] yes, but not proportionally a significant amount [08:58] and not core apps [08:58] last time i bought htc, next time i am also free to choose from a dizzying array of hpones [08:58] wife got an iphone the week before i got my nexus [08:58] popey: define core apps? [08:59] so i have now experienced an iphone, from the word go [08:59] the ones you use all the time, the ones that everyone uses daily [08:59] i feel much much much better discussing them, now i know they suck just as much as any other phone [08:59] the first-run wizard is broken, just as with any android phone [08:59] how so? [08:59] registering an apple account? [08:59] setting up an apple account is broken. very broken. [09:00] not tried that, will do with sophies [09:00] lots of people manage to get through those wizards [09:00] To be honest, no matter who you go with, one way or another you're locked in to that manufacturer/os provider, you should just what what suits you and not worry about what other people use [09:00] AlanBell, somehow, yes [09:00] However if you get a Blackberry, then a plague upon you! [09:00] maybe apple just haven't tested their account creation process for a few years, since they expect everyone to have an account already [09:01] the gnex... "log in to your google account!" "okay." "we've SMS'd you your 2-factor auth code!" "um... i can't see my sms yet, not until i enter the code....." [09:02] morning [09:02] iphone "create apple account!" "okay" "log in to apple account!" "okay" "PASSWORD NOT RECOGNISED!" "erm... reset password" "sorry, that password's been used! use another" "er...ENTERPASSWORDNOWPOPUPOUTTANOWHERE" [09:02] basically they're all terrible [09:03] except for the pre3. first-run was great on webos <3 [09:03] First run on Ubuntu Touch is awesome [09:03] Mostly because it mostly doesn't exist yet. [09:04] mostly [09:05] gnex4 certainly isn't a great sales pitch for LG build quality [09:06] Oh, another good reason for me using iphone and not android.. support. [09:06] phoning google and LG to get a repair was a lesson in how not to do support [09:06] but few phones nowadays really feel properly "well built" [09:06] popey: you are confusing the OS and the hardware interchangeably [09:07] indeed, most feel like plastic crap in the hand [09:07] i'd say samsung has lead the way on making cheap plasticky crap be considered premium [09:07] mungbean: I'm properly not [09:07] I'm talking about the entire experience [09:07] the motorola droid was nice [09:07] if ubuntu don't release a hardware phone then all your "android" criticism of the hardware will just be applicable [09:07] (for build quality that is) [09:08] aluminium makes a phone feel premium. e.g. iphone 5, htc one [09:08] hence why I wanted the edge! [09:08] = non removable battery directhex [09:08] the lumia 800/n9 felt rock solid too [09:08] mungbean, yes. [09:08] yeah, love the feel of nokia phones like the n9 [09:08] battery wins vs alum [09:08] popey: why didn't the edge get more traditional funding as well as the crowdsourced element? [09:08] mungbean, you could persuade me with SD card slots more than removable batteries [09:09] or why was it exclusive to indiegogo? [09:09] dunno. ask mark [09:09] my htc battery has lasted well, but i sometimes swap battery with my wife if she is low on charge and is leaving the house [09:10] i saw daviey swap battery last friday on his galaxy nexus or whatever device it was [09:11] never really been fussed about swappable batteries [09:11] all things told though... i don't think the iphone 5 is worth £400 more than the gnex4. i mean, it's not perfect, but it's *incredible* value [09:11] good morning everyone. [09:11] is it more premium, yes, clearly [09:11] bought a laptop once which had swappable batteries and never ended up swapping [09:11] but is it £400 more? nein [09:11] i'm on my 3rd battery on my laptop [09:11] oh I have replaced them, just not swapped during use [09:11] then again, i'm more make do and mend ratehr than buy new stuff, different stroke... [09:12] i rarely buy my own laptop [09:12] haven't for years [09:12] smartphones have an expected lifespan of 2 years, so as long as a battery can cope with 2 years of use, for 99% of people, it doesn't need replacement [09:12] i guess my 4s is 2 now [09:13] bought my htc desire in may 2010 [09:13] thanks cyanogen [09:14] nothing like cyanogenmod to make a phone feel mostly new, and also require daily reboots due to some random bug which is essentially unfixable because SOC vendors are assholes and the phone needs to run a 2 year old kernel to have any drivers at all [09:15] mungbean: Why is it that wife's (not to stereotype or anything) seem to have problems with mobile phone battery lives, just swapped phones with my wife, my S3 that used to drop to about 75% in normal use for me, drops to about 20% by teatime for her, the Desire HD she was using that had to be charged during the day for her, only drops to 50% by the end of the day for me [09:15] why is this phone 299? http://www.buymobiles.net/mobile-phones/lg/lg-nexus-4/nosim/sim-free/15009373 [09:15] oh, yes, big shiny glowing gold star of the ages to apple for giving OS updates past the 6 months most android vendors do [09:15] mungbean, because LG charge a LOT more for the phones wholesale than google do [09:15] DJones: its the opposite for my wife [09:16] i use my phone on the train though [09:16] whats the "right" way to search for apps on android devices? [09:16] I mean, ones that are already installed [09:17] popey: to launch it? [09:17] popey: I use Settings -> Apps [09:17] settings / apps / [09:17] no, not browse, search [09:17] as in, type the name of the app [09:17] to launch, yes [09:18] the search widget does that I belive [09:18] although I never search so I dont know :) [09:18] if you set it to, yes. [09:18] the iphone 3gs will be finally denied OS updates when ios 7 ships later this year. the iphone 3gs released in june 2009, and can run march 2013's ios version, officially [09:18] google search? [09:18] the on device search. [09:18] whats the widget called? [09:19] the iphone 3gs shipped with iphone os 3, before the term "ios" was even in use. it's seen 3 major version updates, and all the incrementals [09:19] this defines "how to do it" [09:19] * AlanBell thinks searching for apps by name isn't what people want to do [09:19] go into google now, hit setting, hit tablet search, you should be able to anebale it to search on device apps. [09:19] which happens to be exactly what the Unity dash does [09:19] popey, it's not technically a widget, as you can't remove it from your home screens, on gnex4 [09:20] iOS does it [09:20] popey: On my N7, I have a Google icon search bar at the top of the screen [09:20] and does it well [09:20] popey, but yes, just type app name into google search box and it'll show installed apps, like on unity [09:21] i have to type the entire app name? [09:21] who actually searches for apps? typing on phones is a pain [09:21] me, I do it _all_ the time on ios [09:21] i choose them from a list on teh launcher screen [09:21] popey, no. you're being a bit of a douche & making up fake reasons to complain, fyi [09:21] I just tested typing "FB" to look for FBReader and it brought FBReader up by the 2nd letter [09:21] no I'm not directhex [09:21] I do this all the time on IOS and wondered how android did it [09:22] DJones, 1 letter is enough [09:22] its because I had web highlighted [09:22] popey, you've invented that it can't, and are saying "yay ios can do it, better than stinky android" [09:22] directhex: Quite probably [09:22] no [09:22] seriously, I'm asking how you do it [09:22] because I never found a way to do what I do all the time on ios [09:23] popey, tap the giant google search box at the top of every goddamn home screen page [09:23] stop trying to portray this as anything other than it is [09:23] then press letters on the lettermotron [09:23] i didnt have a search box [09:23] had to add the widget [09:23] hence asking [09:23] hit search, press f = facebook [09:23] jeez [09:23] i have a hardware button [09:24] it offers me facebook/ some contacts and a bookmark [09:24] as resuklts of the search [09:24] People get used to doing things in a particular way, they're just different, what works for one, doesn't work for somebody else, next thing we'll be arguing over whether to top/bottom post in emails :) [09:24] indeed [09:24] this is, of course, all a rip off of webos, which had "just type" before the rest of 'em [09:24] characterising me as a douche because I can't figure out how to do something I do with one swipe daily aint exactly helpful, thanks [09:25] i like hardware keys [09:25] ditto [09:26] I'm confused going back the Desire with hardware keys after the S3, I keep trying to find them on the screen [09:26] search widget won't add to a screen for me [09:27] popey, it's on the stock home screen. try a search for "nexus 4 home screen" on the search engine of your choice [09:27] popey: curious, have you tried this on ios7? (not trying to throw fuel on the fire; genuinely curious if I'm the only one that took 2 weeks to figure out where they'd moved it) [09:27] directhex: this isnt a nexus 4 [09:27] its a nexus 7 [09:27] shauno: nope [09:28] I won't ruin the surprise then :) [09:28] hah [09:28] the big search box on http://www.abc.net.au/reslib/201206/r964550_10403468.jpg ? [09:28] just looked at some screenshots [09:29] directhex: mine's rotated on my desk [09:29] popey: Is that with 4.3? Mine seems to have it by default with no option to remove [09:29] Thats what I've got on mine [09:29] it disappears when rotated on the desk it seems [09:29] popey, G logo at the top left? [09:29] there's a g logo which takes you to the search thingy [09:29] So it does [09:30] Google Now from the G logo [09:30] but the keyboard conveniently obscures the results [09:30] so I hit G, type E, click soft button to hide kb, press 'search tablet' and see the results. [09:30] Heh, thats not to useful [09:31] shauno: the ios7 version looks very familiar! :D [09:31] oh it looks fine. I just had no clue what gesture summons it [09:32] the reason I want to search is the same reason I use search on iOS, OSX, Windows 7 and Unity, I don't care where the icons are, i know the name of the app. This may be unusual or wierd but it's the way I've used windows/ubuntu for quite a while now so it works for me. [09:32] your way works exactly like that on my android too [09:32] I got the search widget running now [09:32] hit search , press f. done [09:33] shauno: swipe down http://ios.wonderhowto.com/how-to/open-spotlight-search-ios-7-find-apps-contacts-music-and-more-0147422/ [09:33] well it doesn't work here [09:33] hey ho [09:33] oh I have it now. it just took me a good 2 weeks (and the first few times were accidents I couldn't figure out how to replicate) [09:33] oic [09:34] you've just ruined the surprise, and will miss out on that egghunt :( [09:35] i think the people that make beautiful widgets for android, have made a searchable launcher aswell. not tried it though, but sound like it might help. [09:36] http://i.imgur.com/8OH9yPe.png [09:36] hit search, press a [09:36] results [09:36] 2 recent google searches and a selection of bookmarks and apps [09:36] popey: Have you worked out how to create "app drawers" on the N7? I'd like to have some to group together certain apps (eg Kindle, FBReader, Kobo, Reader) etc [09:36] DJones, drop one app on another app [09:37] circle appears around target app = will create a folder [09:37] what the heck. i just got spammed by a recruiter that i've never heard of before to ask for sponsorpship for some event [09:37] Oh, that easy, I'd been googling for it and hadn't found any mention of how to create them [09:39] I can see the point of a smartphone that works like a desktop OS, we might figure out how to use it [09:39] http://imgur.com/5Ods6IE [09:39] hit search, press e [09:39] you're holding it wrong ;_ [09:39] ;) [09:39] hah [09:40] that is the search thing I get, can't get apps in it [09:40] which widget? search or google search? [09:40] you want one called search [09:40] if I go to settings on that screen, I can configure phone search, and I can see it should be indexing apps, but they don't turn up in search results [09:40] directhex: Thank you for that tip, thats saved me a lot of screen space [09:41] hit search, press e, press hide keyboard, scroll past contacts, press 'SEARCH TABLET', scroll up past contacts again, http://imgur.com/GWj3dZf [09:41] so yeah, all my fault. [09:42] searchable items: apps, browser, contacts [09:42] I do that too, but it still only searches contacts [09:42] ooh, and google music, i'll add that [09:42] popey, think you've just broken it somehow. which is an entirely different android issue [09:42] reformat! [09:43] i have never used search so fail to see how I broke it [09:43] only found out it can search for apps when brobostigon mentioned it earlier. i thought it was just google (web) search, didn't realise it locally searched too.. so yay, TIL etc [09:44] :) [09:44] popey: you can select which local apps it searches inside of too [09:44] nice [09:45] so everyone is happy now except for AlanBell ? [09:45] FSVO "happy" [09:45] popey: open the blue "Google" app (Google Now), then menu -> settings -> search on phone [09:47] tbh it's rare I want to search inside of apps, other than contacts. i mostly just want to find my apps in amongst a hundred or more icons all over the device [09:47] popey: I like finding music through spotify using that bar [09:47] yeah, I use that for music/audiobooks too. and contacts. but rarely apps [09:48] I am fine mungbean, I will just go back to leaving my phone off at the bottom of my bag [09:49] old man [09:49] AlanBell: Technophobe :) [09:50] so has anyone tried the gone calendar app? [09:50] gnome [09:51] i will go back to leaving my phone where it belongs - plugged into the wall [09:51] with a rotary dial, for the lulz [09:51] directhex: http://www.dialgizmo.com/ [09:52] I don't think my phoneline supports rotary dial :( [09:52] shauno: click that link [09:52] shauno: it's a converter box ;) [09:52] this gnome cal app: http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2013/08/gnome-core-app-project-make-me-excited-for-desktop-linux [09:53] mungbean: With a rotary dial? [09:53] Oh cal, not call 8-) [09:53] our rotary dial phones were wired directly to the wall, not via a plug [09:54] heh http://www.cityam.com/article/1378091289/exclusive-walkie-scorchie-melted-my-jag [09:54] Elevensies! [09:58] anyone tried a device like this to allow you to plug separate mic/headphones into a laptop? http://www.amazon.co.uk/Headset-Buddy-Computer-Adapter-01-PC35-PH25/dp/B002D41HKS/ref=pd_rhf_se_p_t_2_NZ1X [09:58]