[00:01] <rafaelo> i tried before 10 years to experiment with linux OSes  but the most common problem that i havent managed after much much reading is to install a programm.....  i.e. .tar.gr
[00:02] <rafaelo> it is really pain..........
[00:02] <daftykins> that's why you're not meant to install things that way ;)
[00:02] <rafaelo> .deb  files are super
[00:02] <rafaelo> one click
[00:03] <daftykins> no that's wrong as well, they need to be repos else they'll get stuck
[00:04] <rafaelo> for a newbe yes....  but i want to work permanent with ubuntu , so i must install programs, and i dont want to use wine
[00:05] <rafaelo> btw i havent installed wine yet, but i have read so much for it
[00:06] <rafaelo> do you thing that is better to use the last version of ubuntu>
[00:07] <daftykins> surely you'd want to stick to a distributions best practices?
[00:08] <rafaelo> 12.04 LTS i thought that is better for me
[00:09] <rafaelo> do you know how disable the alternate sampling rate in  configuration?
[00:09] <rafaelo> this is what is asking
[00:15] <ali1234> you edit /etc/pulse/daemon.conf and comment out the line that says "alternate-sampling-rate"
[00:15] <ali1234> then run pulseaudio -k
[00:16] <ali1234> i bet it won't help though - it is probably already commented out anyway
[00:18] <rafaelo> i will try
[00:19] <ali1234> have you tried a different video player? such as totem or mplayer?
[00:19] <rafaelo> no.   whichone to try?
[00:22] <ali1234> both of them
[00:22] <rafaelo> ok i try them
[00:22] <ali1234> totem is the default one in ubuntu
[00:22] <daftykins> hey guys, the silly form is down when i was attempting to help someone with a package to install to get wireless going
[00:22] <daftykins> would it be linux-firmware-nonfree that might contain wireless drivers?
[00:23] <daftykins> *forum
[00:23] <ali1234> firmwares, yes
[00:23] <ali1234> got a dmesg?
[00:24] <ali1234> there will be an error about missing firmware, if that is the problem
[00:24] <daftykins> it's the one where someone has no wireless with a broadcom 4311
[00:24] <daftykins> there's a thread i keep going to to link people to but as the forum is down i can't cheat :(
[00:25] <ali1234> yeah that has the b43 firmwares in it
[00:25] <ali1234> /lib/firmware/b43/*
[00:25] <daftykins> excellent :) thanks ali1234
[00:26] <daftykins> i have sent the user to install + reboot
[00:26] <ali1234> actually there is also linux-wlan-ng-firmware
[00:26] <daftykins> hopefully having wired connected doesn't stop network manager from showing networks
[00:26] <ali1234> it doesn't
[00:26] <daftykins> good good :>
[00:26] <ali1234> ah wlan-ng is for a bunch of different cards
[00:54] <shauno> oh man.  gnome-shell on debian, in vmware.  for some reason the screen has picked 5120x3200.  obviously my laptop doesn't do this.  but vmware helpfully decided to scale it instead of refusing it
[00:55] <shauno> the systems settings dialog is about the size of my thumbprint, and I look like a moleman trying to read it
[01:01] <daftykins> shauno: is that down to not specifying a max monitor res in the VM's settings?
[01:01] <shauno> I don't have such a setting
[01:02] <shauno> I'm not complaining really, that's my fault for firing up gnome before the guest additions.  just not used to it going to that extreme.  usually you login and find yourself in 800x600 or something silly
[01:03] <daftykins> :D
[01:03] <daftykins> ah in vmware workstation on Windows i get that beside the 'enable 3D' option in the VM config
[01:06] <shauno> I just get a tick-box for whether or not it should lie to the guest about a 'retina' display (which I don't have)
[01:06] <daftykins> ah, fusion?
[01:06] <shauno> yeah
[01:07] <daftykins> hmm that'd be pretty sweet, you could probably have lots of 1:1 VMs up beside one another at once on a retina display
[01:07] <daftykins> well you know, a grid of 2x2 instead of 1
[01:09] <shauno> I think I'll have to keep on fighting with that tomorrow.  it's way too late for this
[01:09] <shauno> for some reason, the guest just won't receive a v4 address from my router
[01:09] <shauno> which leaves me with a very, very small internet
[01:09] <daftykins> attached to the bridge adapter?
[01:10] <shauno> yeah
[01:10] <daftykins> how quirky
[01:10] <shauno> it's reaching the router fine because it's getting a v6 route through it
[01:10] <shauno> I mean, I can get to google, facebook, etc
[01:11] <shauno> but ipv4 still comes in handy, to put it mildly
[01:12] <daftykins> :>
[01:13] <daftykins> that's very funky
[01:15] <shauno> it is.  I have another debian VM that's having no problems at all
[01:23] <shauno> oh well.  I finished what I came for.  I have a program that runs under osx & linux.  but the osx version has an unfortunate bug that breaks a couple of laws :/
[01:24] <daftykins> :O breakin' the law, breakin' the law
[01:24] <shauno> a small program to program to program frequencies into a 2m handheld.  for some reason, when I attach the cable to an osx host, it holds down the send key.  under a linux VM, it's fine.  and I'm not licenced, so going anywhere near the send key is a no-no
[01:25] <daftykins> what's said device?
[01:26] <shauno> baofeng something or other.  cheap as dirt, but it's fine for listening
[01:26] <daftykins> i mean is it a radio of some form?
[01:26] <shauno> oh, yeah, 2m/70cm amateur bands
[01:26] <daftykins> ah :)
[01:27] <shauno> which is why it's a pain to troubleshoot.  I can't just leave it jammed on send while I mess around.  the only reaction to seeing the light go red is to turn it off
[01:28] <daftykins> hehe
[01:28] <shauno> so I don't know if it's me, the cable, the software, etc.
[01:28] <shauno> anyhow.  'night
[01:28] <daftykins> nn sir o/
[04:24] <MartijnVdS> Morning everyone!
[04:28] <shauno> I Think that's still debatable at this point
[04:43] <shauno> (and yes, I may have just given away the reason I'm a caffeine fiend)
[04:48] <MartijnVdS> I just woke up at 6:01
[04:48] <MartijnVdS> no caffeine required
[05:16] <shauno> 5:30 after ~3 hours sleep, takes just a little coercion
[07:11] <moodoo> morning all
[07:13] <Myrtti> meh
[07:13] <moodoo> wassup Myrtti
[07:13] <Myrtti> nokia mobiles sold to ms. the other shoe fell.
[07:13] <Myrtti> https://twitter.com/ericjackson/statuses/374737636990001152
[07:19] <moodoo> a few billion dollars
[07:23] <Myrtti> today is a good day for me to stay out of Facebook
[07:23] <MartijnVdS> How unexpected.
[07:23] <Myrtti> yeah.
[07:23] <MartijnVdS> Myrtti: you know Nokia people who won't like working for MS?
[07:23] <Myrtti> couldn't see that coming in a billion years.
[07:24] <Myrtti> MartijnVdS: I bloody hope so ;-)
[07:26] <MartijnVdS> Time to boil some water.
[07:41] <popey> oof.. http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=MTQ1MTU  didn't expect that
[07:42] <Myrtti> what did you expect then
[07:42] <Myrtti> that they'll write about your kitten :-P
[07:43] <popey> expected my friends on G+ to go "oh, thanks for writing that blog post you promised a year ago" :D
[07:43] <Myrtti> you're Internet Ubuntu famous
[07:43] <Myrtti> tsk.
[07:43] <Myrtti> they'll latch into anything
[07:44] <shauno> it's a bit weird seeing them use your full name
[07:47] <popey> it is
[07:50] <popey> that made yesterday my busiest blog day for months, maybe years
[07:56] <MartijnVdS> *drool* http://shop.lego.com/en-NL/Sopwith-Camel-10226
[07:56] <dwatkins> Don't tempt me with such things, you evil user, MartijnVdS ;)
[07:56] <shauno> that esata tower looks pretty swish
[07:57] <MartijnVdS> dwatkins: but.. lego!
[07:59] <dwatkins> MartijnVdS: precisely, I'm trying to cut down (for financial reasons, nothing more)
[08:00] <AlanBell> dwatkins: I have a friend who is into lego, he wrote this http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/184533812X/ref=as_li_qf_sp_asin_til?tag=elsmorenet-21&camp=1406&creative=6394&linkCode=as1&creativeASIN=184533812X&adid=0YF7DVG4NEHZTJVRV4DH&&ref-refURL=http%3A%2F%2Fwarrenelsmore.com%2Fbrick-city%2F
[08:01] <MartijnVdS> AlanBell: I have this one: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Forbidden-LEGO-Models-Parents-Against/dp/1593271379
[08:10] <mungbean> MartijnVdS: i've made a sopwith: http://i.imgur.com/hA7X4a9.jpg
[08:10] <MartijnVdS> mungbean: sopwith - port of the 1980's side-scrolling WWI dogfighting game
[08:10] <MartijnVdS> apt-get install sopwith \o/
[08:10] <dwatkins> AlanBell: ooh, neat
[08:11] <MartijnVdS> mungbean: cool, how big is that IRL?
[08:11] <mungbean> tiny...
[08:11] <mungbean> 1/72 scale, let me find a matching pic
[08:12] <mungbean> do you know how big these paint tinlets are? http://i.imgur.com/X4lkZxR.jpg
[08:13] <dwatkins> AlanBell: I suspect my brother will get that, he really likes St Pancras station and Lego ;)
[08:18] <SuperMatt> st pancras in lego form? are you people mad?
[08:21] <MartijnVdS> SuperMatt: http://now-here-this.timeout.com/2013/05/08/in-pictures-the-incredible-lego-st-pancras-international-station/ ?
[08:21] <SuperMatt> MADNESS!
[08:22] <SuperMatt> I can't even find my way around inside, how the hell has he managed it in lego?!?
[08:22] <AlanBell> yeah, that is Warren
[08:23] <AlanBell> http://warrenelsmore.com/blog/ mixture of Lotus Notes stuff and bricks
[08:23] <SuperMatt> oh I see
[08:23] <SuperMatt> he likes lotus notes
[08:23] <SuperMatt> that explains everything
[08:23] <MartijnVdS> this explains everything
[08:23] <moodoo> MartijnVdS: some people have too much time on their hands
[08:23]  * AlanBell used to be a notes developer
[08:23] <mungbean> lol
[08:24] <mungbean> have you recovered?
[08:24] <SuperMatt> pervert
[08:24] <AlanBell> it is good stuff, it is NoSQL, like couchdb and mongodb before they invented the term
[08:24] <mungbean> nurse, more pills
[08:24] <AlanBell> and it is a rubbish email client, and people for some weird reason think it is an email program
[08:26] <MartijnVdS> AlanBell: a bit like people think Emacs is an editor.
[08:26] <MartijnVdS> +how
[08:26] <AlanBell> yeah, kinda :)
[08:26] <AlanBell> well, actually probably more like if everyone thought emacs was a mail client
[08:27] <MartijnVdS> AlanBell: I give you gnus.
[08:28] <AlanBell> and flamed emacs for not being as good as thunderbird as a mail client
[08:28] <MartijnVdS> AlanBell: I give you mutt users
[08:28] <shauno> oi, what about mutt users?
[08:29] <AlanBell> eventually IBM destroyed the partner ecosystem and community around it
[08:30] <MartijnVdS> shauno: they complain a lot :P
[08:30] <mungbean> isn't (al)pine better than mutt?
[08:30] <dwatkins> that depends who you ask, mungbean ;)
[08:30] <mungbean> yes, religious wars etc
[08:30] <dwatkins> I used pine for years, really liked it, but later on I tried to use mutt and couldn't get to grips with it.
[08:30] <shauno> we still use Notes.  I hear it's going to be phased out.  can't come soon enough
[08:31] <dwatkins> on the flipside, I had a colleague who really liked mutt and used it all the time.
[08:31] <mungbean> i know about 50 pine users
[08:31] <dwatkins> We sometimes get issues reported by customers using Notes, mainly large corporations though.
[08:31] <mungbean> they funny thing is, a few of them still login to a server and run it, rather than run it on their desktop, because thats what you had to do in the 80s
[08:32] <shauno> I think we count as large now; somewhere between 160-180,000 heads, give or take an acquisition or two
[08:34] <shauno> but Notes has grown into a monster.  no-one knows what's in which database anymore.  the only way to track down what you're looking for is to find someone over the age of 40 and rob their bookmarks
[08:34] <AlanBell> yeah, that is how it is supposed to be used :)
[08:37] <shauno> and this silly naming convention where everything I need should be on one of the servers that are named after fishes.  so you get strange conversations where people will be standing around asking if a galdr is a type of fish or not
[08:47] <Myrtti> gah selective eyesight
[08:49] <JamesTait> Good morning all, happy Welsh Rarebit Day! :-D
[08:49] <Laney> posh cheese on toast
[08:50] <SuperMatt> is it really?
[08:50] <SuperMatt> source!
[08:50] <SuperMatt> (or sauce)
[08:50] <moodoo> yummy
[08:52] <dwatkins> I never understood the name, perhaps it's Welsh.
[08:54] <MartijnVdS> Were-rabbit Day?
[08:54] <brobostigon> good morning everyone.
[09:25] <bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
[09:25] <popey> Yo!
[09:25] <bigcalm> Ahoy!
[09:26] <bigcalm> czajkowski: thanks for the card :)
[09:26] <czajkowski> bigcalm: np sorry we cannot make it also, cant get the site to work :/
[09:27] <bigcalm> Oh poo, means the db is down AGAIN!
[09:27] <bigcalm> Why does mysql keep falling over on that server? :(
[09:28] <hoover> Morning
[09:28] <moodoo> morning morning
[09:28]  * bigcalm installs supervisor
[09:29] <popey> http://cdn.arstechnica.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/22.png illustrates nicely what I was getting at about being locked into google.
[09:29] <popey> from http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2013/09/balky-carriers-and-slow-oems-step-aside-google-is-defragging-android/
[09:31] <mungbean> did canonical launchpad ever take off
[09:31] <czajkowski> popey: aye tisannoying and when you uninstall some of those apps if you dont use them on each update they get reinstalled again
[09:31] <czajkowski> mungbean: what do you mean ?
[09:31] <mungbean> having serious discussions about which linux distro to roll out, resulting in around 500+ desktops
[09:31] <TheOpenSourcerer> "Google has purposefully made every effort to make Android OS updates as boring as possible" << That's an assumption. Where's the evidence?
[09:32] <mungbean> RPM based distros are v good for running spacewalk/satellite etc for deployment
[09:32] <mungbean> unsure about enterprise level deployment of ubuntu and ongoing management
[09:34] <mungbean> czajkowski: sorry i mean landscape, not launchpad
[09:34] <czajkowski> :)
[09:35] <czajkowski> popey: Laney I'm getting a PUG!!!!!!!
[09:35] <AlanBell> gosh
[09:35] <popey> oh dead
[09:35] <popey> Look out chickens
[09:35] <bigcalm> Oh my
[09:35] <czajkowski> hopefully the pug wil get on with the hens
[09:35] <AlanBell> chickens won't be bothered by a pug
[09:35] <popey> mungbean: landscape is part of the support offering, so people automatically get it at some levels I believe
[09:35] <czajkowski> and the hens have their nice run
[09:35] <mungbean> i wonder what the pricing model is like for ubuntu advantage
[09:35] <czajkowski> AlanBell: keep telling Jon that :)
[09:36] <TheOpenSourcerer> Will look a bit like filace then I'm sure ;-)
[09:36] <czajkowski> TheOpenSourcerer: LOL!
[09:36] <popey> mungbean: http://shop.canonical.com/index.php?cPath=41_38
[09:36] <czajkowski> not getting the pug till nov till after the next 9 weeks travel where I'm on the road most weeks
[09:36] <popey> "Looking for business volume licensing? Request a call.
[09:36] <popey> "
[09:37] <mungbean> wowzers. not gonna be cheap just to get lanscape
[09:37] <Laney> czajkowski: nice!
[09:37] <mungbean> considering we have experts  in house
[09:37] <Laney> got pics?
[09:38] <Laney> do the head and body belong to the same species?
[09:38] <Laney> if not, not trying hard enough
[09:38] <czajkowski> Laney: not getting it till november till I come back from NYC
[09:39] <Laney> still enough time to do the splicing then
[09:39] <czajkowski> wouldn't be fair to get  a puppy as september nad october I'm going to live at an airport
[09:39] <czajkowski> Laney: you are not being let near the pug!
[09:39] <czajkowski> puppy pug :D
[09:40] <popey> mungbean: call and find out
[09:41] <mungbean> it seems that way. then i get on a sales person's christmas card list :(
[09:51] <bigcalm> Where are upstart scripts kept?
[09:51] <Laney> brief scraping noise that sounded like it came from inside my laptop
[09:51] <Laney> probably alright...
[09:51] <Laney> bigcalm: /etc/init
[09:51] <bigcalm> Oh
[09:51] <mungbean> i've found foreman which looks like a good replacement for spacewalk
[09:52] <bigcalm> Laney: thank you :)
[09:52] <Laney> np
[09:57] <bigcalm> My tv dongle didn't arrive in the post today :'(
[09:58] <bigcalm> Woe is me
[10:00] <dwatkins> I bought a TV dongle a while back, couldn't get it to work for ages, then I found a different app for OS X which Just Worked.
[10:01] <bigcalm> Oh, this is an Android stick to plug into my TV
[10:02] <brobostigon> chromecast ?
[10:02] <dwatkins> ooh
[10:02] <Myrtti> chromecast should come to Europe sooner
[10:03] <Myrtti> I can't wait to throw my money at it
[10:03] <brobostigon> its dead cheap aswell, i could find a few useful things to do with it.
[10:04] <popey> http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00B0FV4FE
[10:04] <popey> sam would love one of them
[10:04] <mungbean> 30 quid :-|
[10:05] <popey> yeah, all minecraft merch is a bit spendy
[10:05] <mungbean> minecraft lego must be ££
[10:05] <bigcalm> brobostigon: no, http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00B18K4T2
[10:06] <mungbean> http://shop.lego.com/en-US/Minecraft-21102
[10:07] <brobostigon> bigcalm: i will point out, that is not chromecast, but yes, it does looks interesting.
[10:07] <mungbean> $35 = £55
[10:07] <bigcalm> brobostigon: I did say that it wasn't chrome cast
[10:08] <mungbean> ah..."This is a very nice little set for all LEGO / Minecraft fans but do not get ripped off but paying well over the odds. This set is on sale at £34.99 at the LEGO Shop, "
[10:08] <bigcalm> mungbean: that's an interesting exchange rate you have there
[10:08] <brobostigon> bigcalm: ok sorry, i am not fully awake yet.
[10:08] <mungbean> just amazon 3rd party thieves
[10:09] <dwatkins> also, you get it from Lego in an awesome box, I'd wager (their plastic bags look ace, so I assume this is the case if you order from leco.com too)
[10:09] <dwatkins> *lego.com
[10:09] <mungbean> also lego shop at westfield stratford
[10:10]  * dwatkins may have a bit of a reputation for being the local Lego expert in the office from having two phone cradles on his desk made from it
[10:10] <dwatkins> yeah, there's one in Glasgow too, I think they sell individual parts (so you don't have to faff around on bricklink)
[10:12] <popey> "There is a widely held belief in the wireless business that there will and should be a third option to Google and Apple." - http://gigaom.com/2013/09/03/why-i-think-the-7-2-billion-microsoft-nokia-deal-is-a-terrible-idea/
[10:12] <popey> don't agree with his next conclusion of course ㋛
[10:19] <davmor2> Morning all
[10:21]  * czajkowski hugs davmor2 
[10:23] <davmor2> czajkowski: thanks I needed that what the hell possessed me to have a week off :D
[10:26] <Myrtti> oh man, play.spotify.com doesn't work :-(
[10:26] <Laney> Myrtti: I found that
[10:26] <Laney> clearing all of its cookies worked, at least for now
[10:26] <czajkowski> davmor2: fun inbox and queues eh :)
[10:27] <davmor2> czajkowski: yeah fun that's the word
[10:28] <mungbean> why does 10.04 on this old pc work smoother and nicer than any release since?
[10:33] <davmor2> mungbean: is it i386 or amd 64
[10:39] <mungbean> davmor2: 32bit
[10:39] <mungbean> running gnome2
[10:39] <Myrtti> Laney: yeah, didn't work :-(
[10:40] <Laney> :(
[10:40] <Laney> I was considering cancelling when it broke for me
[10:40] <Laney> the client has been busted for months too
[10:40] <bigcalm> davmor2: you won't be coming to the LUG this weekend?
[10:44] <davmor2> bigcalm: possibly not on Wednesday either
[10:47] <bigcalm> Erm, week :)
[10:48] <bigcalm> davmor2: didn't think so
[11:02] <xnox> popey: i was trying to be subtle ;-) now it's all over G+ again =)
[11:03] <dwatkins> having a vibrating watch makes it seem like I keep hitting thins when I move my arm every time I get an e-mail
[11:05]  * bigcalm wonders if tv dongle will come via courier. Seems doubtful as I have no tracking information :/
[11:06] <popey> \o/
[11:06] <popey> xnox: Happy Birthday! :D
[11:06] <popey> think of it as my little present to you
[11:07] <Laney> the crushing weight of internet fame
[11:07] <xnox> \o/ thanks =)
[11:08] <davmor2> mungbean: right so part of the reason is might be the newer pae kernel on i386, another might be the graphics updates are stressing it more, or it is dropping to unity 2d which I found much slower, you might want to see if 64bit can run on it an if it can try the 64bit live cd and see if it runs any better
[11:08] <xnox> Laney: i'm not crazy, I just perform this way ?! http://youtu.be/ss_BmTGv43M
[11:08] <mungbean> davmor2: i think the reason is just that 10.04 didn't have bloat
[11:09] <mungbean> and gnome was mature by then
[11:09] <davmor2> mungbean: the other thing you can do is try xubuntu
[11:09] <AlanBell> 13.10 is going to be a good release
[11:10] <AlanBell> possibly if you turn off xmir
[11:10] <mungbean> $release+1 is always going to be good
[11:10] <davmor2> AlanBell: from what I've seen it is :)  even with xmir
[11:10] <mungbean> after a couple of days on 12.04 with an uber fast PC i run out of RAM and CPU in no time
[11:10] <mungbean> uptime 12:10:46 up 515 days, 20:58,  6 users,  load average: 0.46, 0.33, 0.35
[11:11] <AlanBell> yeah, I am running xmir at the moment, it barfs frames in random order to the screen on secondary monitor
[11:11] <davmor2> AlanBell: I'm about to start stress testing xmir bypass by migrating 900+ apps to saucy :D
[11:11] <AlanBell> the best xmir can hope for is to be nearly as good as not running xmir
[11:11] <AlanBell> davmor2: single screen or multi monitor?
[11:12] <davmor2> AlanBell: single I have too many pcs to have more screens
[11:12] <mungbean> i might revert to single monitor
[11:12] <popey> mungbean: what insecure machine is that uptime from?
[11:13] <mungbean> i thin kdouble monitor ssetup = resource intensive
[11:13] <mungbean> popey: a desktop PC
[11:13] <mungbean> all updates applied except kernel. would need to prove that 2.6.32-38 has remote exploits
[11:13] <AlanBell> davmor2: yeah, single screen works fine, it is pretty much as good as not running it
[11:14] <drussell> mungbean: if you're really struggling to get something smooth, I migrated all my older desktop/laptop machines to http://www.bodhilinux.com/
[11:14] <drussell> mungbean: lowest of all resource consumption for a basic desktop (lower than xfce or lxde)
[11:15] <drussell> mungbean: nice thing is that it's ubuntu based at the backend
[11:15] <mungbean> maybe its just chrome and firefox are RAM beasts
[11:15] <mungbean> i use elementary now in my quest for simple and fast OS
[11:17] <davmor2> mungbean: all browser are ram beasts
[11:17] <mungbean> since 2010 :(
[11:17] <mungbean> used to be ok
[11:18] <mungbean> or maybe it's the websites?
[11:18] <mgdm> a bit of both
[11:18] <directhex> aggressive caching
[11:18] <mgdm> the average page size across a bunch of popular websites is of the order of a meg and a half
[11:18] <mungbean> mgdm: you sure about that?
[11:18] <mgdm> with loads of ad calls and AJAXy widgets and all that nonsense
[11:19] <mgdm> mungbean: pretty sure, but that is the average. Some are lots bigger
[11:19] <davmor2> mungbean: your firefox and chrome will auto update to newer versions so I doubt they are the original 2010 versions
[11:19] <directhex> there's a good blog post on this, hang on
[11:19] <directhex> http://vincentsanders.blogspot.co.uk/2013/06/a-picture-is-worth-thousand-words.html
[11:19] <mungbean> maybe wobbly windows make my pc *feel* faster... :P
[11:20] <directhex> they do.
[11:20] <mungbean> but there's no lag here
[11:20] <mungbean> on my i5 i get chug chug grind splutter
[11:20] <directhex> your system feels fastest when it's most responsive, and it feels responsive when there's a tangible response to your actions, with minimal delay
[11:20] <mungbean> something has changed in recent kernel or DEs.
[11:20] <directhex> generally an app which takes longer to finish, but has some kind of progress bar, is considered faster by the casual observer
[11:25] <davmor2> mungbean: on the i5 what version are you running i386 or amd64
[11:26] <mungbean> 64bit, with more RAM and better video card
[11:32] <davmor2> mungbean: then I have no idea what you do then, if you are running bittorrent try turning it off, try not opening a million tabs, run some tests on a known lite site like duckduckgo/google/bing search pages
[11:32] <mungbean> the fix is to install 10.04 :( i've had it on multiple machines. linux/ubuntu is getting hugely slow
[11:33] <mungbean> could be a kernel scheduler problem
[11:35] <davmor2> mungbean: no idea what you are on about for me unity is getting lighter and faster with each release, I can't wait for 14.10 when unity8 lands then it will be blistering quick
[11:40] <AlanBell> is unity8 the mir native version?
[11:48] <davmor2> AlanBell: it is, it is also the converged version so is the one under development on the phone currently so is really light
[11:51] <AlanBell> cool, it would be nice to have some convergence of the marketing and the reality around the converged unity
[11:52] <czajkowski> popey: davmor2 any idea why the EN is appearing up there on the right, it's for the keyboard I know, but no idea why or how it appeared and no idea how to remove it https://twitter.com/czajkowski/status/374858681415786497/photo/1
[11:52] <popey> you can disable that
[11:52] <popey> click it, choose last option, then in the dialog there's a tickbox
[11:53] <czajkowski> ohhh
[11:53] <czajkowski> no idea how it got there
[11:53] <czajkowski> thanks
[11:53] <czajkowski> :)
[11:53] <Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-keyboard/+bug/1217240
[11:53] <davmor2> czajkowski: ah popey beat me to it
[11:53] <czajkowski> been bugging me
[11:53] <czajkowski> thanks :)
[11:54] <funkyHat> The gui that allowed for some remapping of keys seems to have disappeared
[11:54] <czajkowski> The downside to adding ones phone number to a signature means I'm getting random calls going hi laura and I've zero context and all from withheld numnbers
[11:54] <popey> heh, mine has been in my sig for years, never got a call as a result
[11:55] <davmor2> funkyHat: System settings→keyboard→shorcuts tab?
[11:55] <czajkowski> I've had 3 today alone
[11:55] <czajkowski> it's handy just a bit odd - new :)
[11:56] <czajkowski> shall be in london this week wed- friday if anyone is about
[11:56] <funkyHat> davmor2: actually I'm at work so I can't check til later, but I did look at that last time and didn't spot it :()
[11:56] <funkyHat> last night*
[11:57]  * davmor2 reminds himself to stop giving czajkowski  number out instead of his own when he is asked for it :D
[11:57] <czajkowski> davmor2: LOL
[11:57] <funkyHat> davmor2: do you also introduce yourself as Laura?
[11:59] <davmor2> funkyHat: no but I bet most of the calls czajkowski gets start is Dave there
[11:59] <funkyHat> hahaha
[12:01] <diddledan> gruff voice: "Dave? Hello Dave?" </league of gentlemen>
[12:03] <davmor2> popey: Why do I get a dialogue for shutdown when I selected restart from the system menu why not just restart or cancel?
[12:03] <funkyHat> Actually I prefer that
[12:05] <davmor2> funkyHat: I like the confirmation, but why in this context driven world is the confirmation box not
[12:10] <AlanBell> what do we all think about middle click paste? (which might be going at some point)
[12:11] <diddledan> AlanBell: I love it
[12:11] <diddledan> I don't want it to go anywhere!
[12:11] <AlanBell> me too
[12:11] <AlanBell> apparently there is a plan to change it so that it pops up a bubble with copy/paste options or something
[12:12] <AlanBell> which means it will use the main clipboard I think
[12:12] <diddledan> fudge
[12:12] <diddledan> that sucks
[12:13] <diddledan> I use it many times daily
[12:13] <AlanBell> me too
[12:14] <mungbean> mmm fudge
[12:15] <diddledan> mungbean: if only your last name was "packer", I'd offer you some. </lame associative humour referencing cannibal the musical>
[12:15] <davmor2> AlanBell: depends if I select paste and it pastes I'd be happy with that,  ie highlight text goto where I want to paste it middle click and press paste and it pastes.  Not ideal but would cork if I have to use the copy and paste options then they may as well do away with the option all together and just allow the right click to deal with it
[12:28] <AlanBell> davmor2: as far as I can tell, you would have to highlight text, middle click on it, press the copy bubble (overwriting clipboard contents) then go where you want it to be, middle click and click the paste bubble
[12:28] <AlanBell> which would paste with formatting rather than a text only paste
[12:29] <davmor2> AlanBell: then that sucks
[12:34] <TheOpenSourcerer> What is the rationale behind changing something that has worked since the year dot?
[12:34] <mungbean> thanks youtube. massive pciture of miley cyrs makes my boss think i'm looking at smut
[12:34] <mungbean> on my homepage no less
[12:35] <popey> davmor2: ask mpt
[12:37] <AlanBell> TheOpenSourcerer: because it is a feature that other operating systems don't have, so to catch up, Gnome want to go back
[12:38] <AlanBell> as far as I can tell. Anyhow, they rolled back the commit for Gnome 3.10, and will ponder it for the next Gnome
[12:38] <TheOpenSourcerer> So we lose the great feature if having 2 paste buffers
[12:38] <TheOpenSourcerer> s\if\of
[12:38] <MartijnVdS> Time to check out KDE I guess
[12:38] <AlanBell> yeah, I think it is great having a text only secondary paste buffer
[12:39] <popey> Well, there are apps that can make multiple paste buffers work
[12:39] <diddledan> yeah, but it's built-in right now
[12:39] <diddledan> making it optional means more hoops to jump
[12:40] <AlanBell> and more inconsistency as different apps do different things with middle click
[12:40] <TheOpenSourcerer> It's great the way it is. Unless you *know* how to use it it doesn't get in anyone's way...
[12:40] <AlanBell> well apparently it does get in the way of people from windows who use middle click to scroll things
[12:40] <diddledan> TheOpenSourcerer: exactly, and if you accidentally "discover" it by clicking the middle button you think to yourself "oh, that's cool, I'll remember that"
[12:40] <MartijnVdS> AlanBell: Well, Windows gets in my way when I use middle click to paste
[12:41] <MartijnVdS> with its "scroll" thing
[12:41] <TheOpenSourcerer> But Windows sucks and is on a downward spiral anyway. Who cares?
[12:41] <MartijnVdS> TheOpenSourcerer: Nokia cares.
[12:41] <AlanBell> dunno what the mac does
[12:41] <AlanBell> they do have more than one mouse button these days don't they?
[12:42] <TheOpenSourcerer> Doesn't have a "middle" button.
[12:42] <TheOpenSourcerer> Only has one doesn't it?
[12:42] <diddledan> we (as in the community) should not be bending over to accommodate paradigms that we've superceded
[12:42] <TheOpenSourcerer> Archaic
[12:42] <MartijnVdS> AlanBell: officially they still only have the one
[12:42] <diddledan> I use multibuttons on my mac
[12:43] <TheOpenSourcerer> I've been able to configure & use Logitec mice with > 10 buttons for years and years without needed any new drivers or other apps.
[12:43] <diddledan> but I'm missing middle-click-paste :-p
[12:43] <TheOpenSourcerer> When evdev first appeared it was just full of awsomeness.
[12:45] <TheOpenSourcerer> I saw a very interesting comment regarding MS/Nokia this morning. Who on earth is going to make WP devices now? Other than MS/Nokia of course?
[12:47] <AlanBell> the phone market is too much "winner takes all" at the moment
[12:47] <TheOpenSourcerer> Google/Android is a *very* different proposition. Apple know how to make stuff work and market it properly. MS is just a bag of fail outside of Enterprise.
[12:48] <TheOpenSourcerer> Ahh maybe that's it.
[12:48] <TheOpenSourcerer> They become the new RIM ;-)
[12:48] <AlanBell> someone could be the new RIM
[12:48] <AlanBell> (that is the new, old RIM)
[12:48] <diddledan> has rim been bought yet?
[12:49] <mungbean> how can i reply to a gumtree mail?
[12:49] <mungbean> doesn't seem to have a mail facvility like ebay
[12:49] <AlanBell> Ubuntu Touch could be the new RIM, but I don't think they want that market
[12:52] <davmor2> popey: I did :)
[12:52] <diddledan> whatever ubuntu touch becomes, it'ld better not do a rimshot and bounce back :-p
[12:52] <diddledan> ba dum tsh
[12:52] <diddledan> :-p
[13:00] <MartijnVdS> diddledan: joke.popey.com?
[13:01] <diddledan> :-)
[13:01] <MartijnVdS> they used to have http://rim.jobs/
[13:01] <mungbean> ewwwwwwwwwww
[13:01] <diddledan> is that sfw?
[13:01] <diddledan> aah, phew
[13:02] <mgdm> I don't believe it resolves any more, but it used to go to their jobs site
[13:02] <diddledan> it can't find the server :-p
[13:02] <MartijnVdS> diddledan: "This page is not available", but it used to link to the "Open positions" page on RIM's web site
[13:02] <diddledan> lol
[13:02] <mungbean> you guys are risky
[13:02] <MartijnVdS> mungbean: that's what you get for living on the bleeding edge 8-)
[13:03] <diddledan> when you refer to rim jobs and bleeding edge in the same sentence you're really risking it :-p
[13:03] <diddledan> obviously I'm referring to RIMs lack of innovation <.<   >.>
[13:03] <mungbean> argh
[13:04] <MartijnVdS> diddledan: but.. businesses love it!
[13:04] <MartijnVdS> or something
[13:05] <diddledan> MartijnVdS: I guess it takes a certain sort ;-)
[13:05] <MartijnVdS> diddledan: *something about a brown nose*
[13:05] <diddledan> lol
[13:05] <diddledan> you _had_ to go there! :-p
[13:06] <MartijnVdS> diddledan: it's the only reason I can think of for RIM to be popular in "the enterprise"
[13:07] <diddledan> until NSA/Snowdon debacle businesses believed that their communications were encrypted on RIM's servers
[13:07] <diddledan> same with the terrorists
[13:07] <MartijnVdS> Didn't the deals with Saudi Arabia and the like disprove that theory?
[13:08] <diddledan> yeah, good point. head-in-the-sand?
[13:08] <diddledan> the saudi sand
[13:24] <mungbean> lol http://i.imgur.com/JHgtVbp.jpg
[13:24] <mungbean> dad birthdays
[13:24] <mgdm> haha
[13:25] <mungbean> note: i've never said this out loud at home
[13:26] <MartijnVdS> mungbean: you can do that once they've moved out :P
[13:26] <mungbean> what about the wife?
[13:26] <MartijnVdS> mungbean: same.
[13:26] <diddledan> lol
[13:27] <mungbean> whats even more funny is the tradition i have with my brothers and sisters of buying birthday presents, now that its just degnereated into amazon voucher exchange
[13:27] <mungbean> bit pointless
[13:27] <diddledan> yup, same
[13:27] <MartijnVdS> oh we just buy each other exotic beers
[13:27] <mungbean> when do you stop?
[13:27] <TheOpenSourcerer> In 2 days time I will have been married for 15 years!!!
[13:27] <diddledan> although this year they clubbed together and bought me an "extreme rib experience"
[13:27] <mungbean> anyone in guildford area this is an awesome deal http://www.gumtree.com/p/for-sale/doctor-who-daleks-in-manhattan-airfix/1029962073#photo-content
[13:27] <mgdm> o_O
[13:28] <mungbean> TheOpenSourcerer: happily?
[13:28] <TheOpenSourcerer> mungbean: Yeah mostly.
[13:28] <mungbean> \o/
[13:28] <TheOpenSourcerer> If I said *every* day I'd be lying
[13:28] <mungbean> my wife wants a 2 storey extension :S
[13:29] <MartijnVdS> mungbean: tell her "But you said size doesn't matter!"
[13:29] <TheOpenSourcerer> I've had a few moments where I just wanted to "get off the planet" and disappear for ever but they pass.
[13:30] <mungbean> everybody wants to get off the planet for some space and lack of responsibility occiasionally
[13:30] <diddledan> mungbean: 2 stories upwards or sidewards? :-p
[13:30] <MartijnVdS> Isn't that what homesickness is? :P
[13:31] <mungbean> an extension on the back
[13:33] <mungbean> great. the doctor said the results have come back and there's no infection found. certainly doesn't look normal...
[13:34] <mungbean> stupid toe
[13:35] <diddledan> I've got a tooth that doesn't feel normal. it was fine until I had a filling at the weekend
[13:35] <diddledan> now it hurts
[13:35] <mungbean> sucks
[13:36] <mungbean> had the same problem , used sensitive toothpaste and it sort of went away
[13:36] <MartijnVdS> diddledan: new fillings can be weird for a while, but if it still hurts after several days, I'd call the dentist
[13:36] <mungbean> still feels "different" but the dentist said the only way to find out is to take it out and look at it lol
[13:36] <MartijnVdS> Mine uses some kind of plastic/epoxy/magic stuff now
[13:36] <diddledan> I went NHS
[13:37] <diddledan> can't afford fancy fillings
[13:37] <diddledan> :-p
[13:37] <MartijnVdS> diddledan: these are the only ones he uses, he never worked with the old metal ones
[13:37]  * mungbean has  a gold crown
[13:37] <MartijnVdS> mungbean: front tooth?
[13:37] <mungbean> right at the back
[13:38] <diddledan> mungbean: can I punch you and keep the profit?
[13:38] <mungbean> its my favourite tooth now
[13:38] <mungbean> she almost dropped it down my throat. would have been interetseting
[13:38] <diddledan> lol
[13:38] <mungbean> gold is a very warm and smooth metal
[13:38] <diddledan> gold teeth rock
[13:38] <mungbean> that tooth always feels smooth
[13:39] <diddledan> when I win several meelion (either through the lottery or some kind of ransom) I'm going to replace all my teeth with gold ones :-p
[13:40] <diddledan> then I'll be like JAWS in the bond movies
[13:40] <diddledan> and I'll be able to bite through thick cables
[13:42] <mungbean> anyone used foreman to deploy ubuntu?
[13:43] <diddledan> nupe
[13:44] <mungbean> essex shark :-\ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jGGoOKjtQ5A
[13:49] <directhex> headington shark :-\ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fo5s1AwDqzA
[14:03] <bigcalm> Hi peeps :)
[14:03] <bigcalm> In QueryBuilder, how do I correctly have more than one select statement?
[14:04] <bigcalm> Arse
[14:04] <diddledan> o_O
[14:04] <bigcalm> Wrong window :)
[14:04] <mungbean> wrong life
[14:04] <bigcalm> mungbean: what?
[14:04] <MartijnVdS> wrong language
[14:04] <diddledan> wrong multiverse
[14:04] <mungbean> diddledan wins
[14:05] <diddledan> :-D
[14:06] <diddledan> who's going to bash.org that then? :-p
[14:06] <mgdm> I'll bash YOUR org. </dave2>
[14:06] <diddledan> (yes, really, it's still on the net)
[14:07] <mungbean> http://bash.org/?6951
[14:11] <directhex> hm, press release
[14:11] <MartijnVdS> directhex: where? what? how?
[14:11] <mgdm> directhex: are you still at Collabora or are you elsewhere now?
[14:11] <directhex> mgdm, i am still at collabora
[14:12] <directhex> MartijnVdS, http://www.collabora.com/press/2013/09/collabora-productivity-targets-a-marketplace-of-one-billion-desktops.html
[14:12] <mgdm> directhex: I think I'm mixing you up with resiak, then, who I think was and is no more?
[14:12] <directhex> mgdm, yeah, resiak quit to do boring closed source rubbish for a big evil corp
[14:12] <mungbean> dont say hackers in a press release!
[14:12] <MartijnVdS> h4x0rs
[14:12] <mgdm> directhex: booo
[14:14] <bubu> hey guys, I have "0 clients:"
[14:15] <bubu> how can I grep is for just the first number, so the 0
[14:15] <diddledan> bubu: you need to advertise better
[14:15] <bubu> hah
[14:15] <bubu> ;)
[14:15] <diddledan> it's a tough marketplace
[14:15] <MartijnVdS> bubu: is it always a number? or do you only want the 0?
[14:15] <bubu> i want just the number
[14:15] <bubu> so the number before the clients:
[14:15] <mgdm> bubu: echo '0 clients' | egrep -o '[0-9]+'
[14:16] <mgdm> or something like that
[14:16] <diddledan> \d+ clients
[14:16] <bubu> even better would be 'unless number is 0, do bla'
[14:16] <awilkins> Not sure \d works even in egrep
[14:16] <bubu> great thanks
[14:16] <MartijnVdS> pgrep \o/
[14:16] <diddledan> who said it had to work in egrep? :-p
[14:16] <MartijnVdS> Perl compatible regexes
[14:16] <awilkins> Regex are great, but the lack of convergence is horrible
[14:16] <diddledan> awilkins: much like javascript then
[14:16] <awilkins> pgrep is for processes
[14:17] <mgdm> diddledan: JS isn't that bad nowadays. Though the DOM and CSS are 'orrible abominations
[14:17] <MartijnVdS> awilkins: ah, sorry. grep -P
[14:17] <MartijnVdS> awilkins:   -P, --perl-regexp         PATROON is een reguliere Perl-expressie
[14:17] <MartijnVdS> sorry for the Dutchness ;)
[14:17] <dutchie> PATROOOOOOOOOOOOON
[14:18] <diddledan> mgdm: yeah, I quite like javascript
[14:18] <mungbean> argh i lost my epic bash history
[14:18] <MartijnVdS> diddledan: the thing I hate most about js is that you can't add a trailing comma in a data structure
[14:18] <directhex> patron? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YYxO3Y-wOrM
[14:18] <MartijnVdS> diddledan: so var x = { foo: 'bar', baz: 'quux', }; is not allowed
[14:18] <diddledan> MartijnVdS: yeah, that's bitten me many times
[14:19] <awilkins> Even worse, in IE that crashes but in everything else it just works silently
[14:19] <awilkins> Hooray for JSlint / JShint
[14:19] <mgdm> yes, eactly
[14:19] <mgdm> drives me nuts because every other language is fine with it
[14:19] <awilkins> huh?
[14:19] <diddledan> really the only reason we complain about anything on the web is because of IE
[14:19] <awilkins> Java ; no
[14:19] <awilkins> Dunno about Pythin
[14:20] <mgdm> s/language/language I use/
[14:20] <dutchie> fine in py
[14:20] <awilkins> But I'd expect C languages, C# etc, to have a shitfit
[14:20] <MartijnVdS> mgdm: except SQL
[14:20] <awilkins> Pardon my channel-inappropriate French
[14:20] <MartijnVdS> mgdm: but you fix that by using prefixed commas
[14:20] <diddledan> awilkins: poopfit?
[14:20] <awilkins> Yes, I use prefix commas
[14:20] <awilkins> In variable length lists
[14:21] <mgdm> awilkins: C is fine with it
[14:21] <mgdm> and prefixed commas look terrible, though I can understand why you'd use them
[14:21] <mgdm> awilkins: (tested in gcc and clang)
[14:22] <awilkins> I use prefixed commas mostly because the most common edit you do to a list like that then only generates a 1 line patch rather than a 2 line patch
[14:23] <awilkins> Which makes for better behaviour WRT merges in VCS systems
[14:23] <awilkins> I suppose for languages that imply a non-element when you terminate the list with a comma that's a moot point
[14:33] <bubu> guys, in a bash script how could I do something like, wait until this command: "passenger-status --show=requests | grep clients | egrep -o '[0-9]+'" returns a 0, then move onto the next step
[14:33] <bubu> not a 0 exit code, an actual 0
[14:35] <diddledan> while command; do echo "useless echo which can be omitted, but shows each time the loop runs"; done
[14:35] <diddledan> you might want while ! command; do
[14:35] <diddledan> oh, not an exit code
[14:36] <bubu> ja, not an exit code, it's actually a 0
[14:37] <diddledan> in that case then you want `VAR=1; while [ $VAR != 0 ]; do VAR=$(command); done`
[14:37] <diddledan> where command is the entirety of your passenger status line above
[14:38] <bubu> thanks diddledan
[14:39] <diddledan> I sense a disturbance in the foo - as if someone used bash on a million voices at once
[14:40] <bubu> heh
[14:40] <diddledan> oh god
[14:40] <diddledan> I just caught myself doing the stereotypical video meme from several years ago of a kid dancing in his chair
[14:41] <diddledan> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=60og9gwKh1o
[14:42] <diddledan> yeah, so that video was me just 5 minutes ago
[14:43] <diddledan> complete with obesity <-- I'm a fatty!
[14:46] <mungbean> that was ...
[14:46] <mungbean> interesting
[14:46] <mungbean> he is spitting image of our resident neckbeard
[14:47] <diddledan> :-)
[14:47] <diddledan> perhaps he _is_ your resident neckbeard
[15:03] <bubu> diddledan: I have one more huge question favour to ask :D
[15:04] <bubu> I need to run 'passenger-status --show=pool' until I can't grep 'spawning' from it's output i.e. it has stopped spawning
[15:05] <mungbean> i've tried to be a fatty but find it impossible to gain weight
[15:06] <mungbean> wii fit reckons my BMI is ideal but everyone else says i'm too thin :S
[15:06] <diddledan> that one should be simpler - `while ! bash -c "passenger-status --show=pool | grep -e spawning"; do true; done`
[15:07] <diddledan> where I've replaced the echo from the preivous while loop I gave you with "true" which just returns 0 and doesn't output anything
[15:08] <bubu> awesome :D
[15:08] <bubu> thanks!
[15:09] <diddledan> these while loops are "tight loops" in that they'll use up all available processing power to run if allowed to. I forget whether bash has a sleep command but if it does it might be worth sleeping in the loop to ease the power requirements
[15:09] <mgdm> sleep 1 = sleep for one second
[15:09] <diddledan> thanks, mgdm
[15:09] <bubu> jup
[15:09] <bubu> I like that idea
[15:09] <bubu> thanks guys :D
[15:09] <diddledan> so yeah, just plop sleep 1 in the loop between do and done
[15:10] <diddledan> dammit, I'm dancing again!
[15:11] <bubu> lol
[15:12] <bubu> diddledan: passenger-status --show=pool | grep -e spawning returns nothing at the moment as there is no 'spawning' being output
[15:13] <bubu> so I would expect `while ! bash -c "passenger-status --show=pool | grep spawning"; do true; done`
[15:13] <bubu> to return nothing too but it just hangs..
[15:13] <bubu> is it in the loop I guess
[15:13] <bubu> sorry to be a PITA :/
[15:13] <diddledan> yeah, sounds like I got something wrong :-p
[15:13] <bubu> my bash is aweful, better in ruby tbh
[15:13] <bubu> lol
[15:15] <bashrc> I'm not much of a bash wizard
[15:15] <diddledan> ok, try without the bash -c "" wrapper around the if
[15:15] <mgdm> interesting choice of nick, then :)
[15:16] <diddledan> while ! passenger-status --show=pool | grep spawning
[15:18] <bubu> hmmm
[15:18] <diddledan> any joy?
[15:19] <bubu> nope :(
[15:19] <diddledan> rats
[15:19] <bubu> it gives me a >
[15:19] <bubu> as if the command isn't finished
[15:19] <bubu> lol
[15:20] <diddledan> aah
[15:20] <mgdm> the ! will be a history thing, I suspect
[15:20] <mgdm> which will confuse the issue
[15:20] <diddledan> while ! passenger-status --show=pool | grep spawning; do echo I'm looping; sleep 1; done
[15:21] <diddledan> that'll at least tell you it's looping rather than just breaking entirely
[15:21] <bubu> gives me > still ...
[15:21] <bubu> hmm
[15:22] <diddledan> so it does
[15:22] <diddledan> why is that I wonder
[15:22] <diddledan> maybe mgdm is right
[15:23] <bubu> how could I get around that?
[15:25] <diddledan> aah
[15:25] <diddledan> I'm <-- opens a quote that isn't closed again
[15:25] <mungbean> also the pipe
[15:25] <diddledan> while ! passenger-status --show=pool | grep spawning; do echo "I'm looping";sleep 1; done
[15:25] <mungbean> is causing issues
[15:26] <mgdm> also shouldn't passenger-status --showpool be in $() or at least `` ?
[15:26] <diddledan> I've tested that and it definitely works locally
[15:26] <mungbean> yep
[15:26] <diddledan> mgdm: it doesn't need to be
[15:27] <bubu> excellent, works thanks diddledan mgdm mungbean & co :)
[15:28] <diddledan> do I get consultancy fees? :-p
[15:29] <diddledan> is passenger the ruby-on-rails runner?
[15:29] <mgdm> well, Ruby, yes, not specifically rails
[15:29] <diddledan> aah
[15:30] <diddledan> wait, microsoft have completely bought nokia's phone business?!
[15:31] <diddledan> that's an interesting move
[15:31] <diddledan> does that make them microkia?
[15:32] <awilkins> Let's face it, they owned it the moment Elop sacked off the Linux phones
[15:32] <diddledan> true
[15:33] <shauno> I think it's quite funny.  Elop is ex-msft.  he's gone out, beat nokia to death, and now he's dragging the corpse back to the lion's den
[15:33] <diddledan> lmao
[15:33] <diddledan> that's a different slant on things :-p
[15:34] <mungbean> burning platform was a lie
[15:35] <diddledan> nokia had a good thing in owning qt but still they sold it off
[15:35] <mungbean> nok ia value dropped 85% and they got it for half of the current value anyway
[15:35] <mungbean> shareholders should be v angry
[15:35] <mungbean> not after elopalypse came
[15:35] <mungbean> then nothing non MS was worth having
[15:36] <diddledan> indeed, it's a good ploy as shauno pointed out
[15:36] <mungbean> surely not allowed though
[15:37] <shauno> I'm curious who's move it was.  whether balmer's as crazy as we like to think, or if elop said he'd only come back if he could bring his new toys with him
[15:37] <mungbean> after elop then it was always gonna happen
[15:37] <diddledan> developers developers developers .. and phones
[15:38] <mungbean> ballmer heard about banana phones
[15:38] <diddledan> wait, the banana phone is real?!
[15:38] <mungbean> i had one
[15:38] <diddledan> what about the batphone?
[15:38] <mungbean> shh
[15:39] <diddledan> why did skippy the bush kangaroo just hop into my heaD?!
[15:40]  * daftykins calls the RSPCA on diddledan 
[15:40] <daftykins> put the wallaby down...
[15:40] <directhex> pfft. nokia news is boring. what about the libreoffice news?
[15:40] <daftykins> there's libre office news!?
[15:40] <mungbean> to be fair, that PR had no discernible content
[15:41] <mungbean> coll* are making some LO tools but you don't need to know details.
[15:43] <directhex> basically selling enterprise support for LO to corps. suse technically were in that business - hence buying their team - but didn't really accept many contracts on it due to it not fitting their corporate model
[15:44] <ig_sss> popey: how may i help you
[15:44]  * Seeker` blinks
[15:44] <diddledan> what exactly is suse/attachmate's business model these days?!
[15:44] <ig_sss> popey: needed something in #design?
[15:44] <directhex> diddledan, attachmate's model is selling an inferior putty to giant corps for infinity money
[15:45] <directhex> diddledan, suse's is to sell SLES
[15:45] <popey> ig_sss: heh, thats service!
[15:45] <popey> chasing people down to other irc channels to see if they need something ☻
[15:45] <diddledan> putty as in a gooey substance or putty as in the ssh client?
[15:45] <popey> ig_sss: nah, I joined #design on the wrong irc network, sorry ☻
[15:45] <directhex> diddledan, the latter
[15:45] <ig_sss> ooh
[15:45] <diddledan> aha
[15:45] <davmor2> daftykins: I think you were going for <rolf> hu ha hu ha tie me kangaroo down sport </rolf>
[15:45] <ig_sss> which other network has one?
[15:46] <directhex> diddledan, attachmate's core business is terminal emulators
[15:46] <popey> ig_sss: internal company one ☻
[15:46] <mungbean> rolf is off the menu now..
[15:46] <awilkins> https://twitter.com/ltm/status/374750282460061696/photo/1
[15:46] <diddledan> yeah, aparently rolf is a sexual predator now
[15:46] <ig_sss> popey: ah ok
[15:47] <ig_sss> alright later
[15:47] <mungbean> alleged indecent assult
[15:47] <popey> that twitter picture is ridiculous
[15:48] <popey> totally US biassed
[15:48] <mungbean> however, in terms of smartphones...
[15:48] <diddledan> popey, still funny :-p
[15:49] <mungbean> nokia don't have many loyal customers of high end devices
[15:49] <diddledan> nokia don't have many^H^H^H^Hany high end devices period.
[15:49] <popey> I have seen to nokia handsets in the wild in the last few months
[15:49] <popey> one was owned by a nokia employee
[15:49] <awilkins> My N900 was teh awesomes
[15:49] <popey> the other was owned by a microsoft employee
[15:49] <mungbean> awilkins: but they lost you as a customer right?
[15:49] <popey> *two
[15:49] <awilkins> My mum and my sister have Lumisa
[15:50] <popey> I think my nephew has a nokia thing
[15:50] <shauno> we have a bunch of them.  but they're the 5-10 "when it all goes wrong, it'll be cockroaches, twinkies and nokia handsets" variety.  for just that reason
[15:50] <MartijnVdS> http://arstechnica.com/business/2013/09/paper-book-owners-can-soon-pick-up-e-book-versions-at-heavy-discount/
[15:50] <shauno> er, 5-10yo
[15:50] <awilkins> mungbean, Yeah, I kept using it long after it's deprecation and then got a Nexus 4
[15:50] <diddledan> an ex colleague used to have one - she loved it
[15:50] <mungbean> MartijnVdS: happy days
[15:51] <mungbean> however, with autorip, *all* prices have gone up
[15:51] <diddledan> autorip for books?>
[15:51] <awilkins> MartijnVdS, I'd prefer it if you got a free ebook of every paper book you bought
[15:51] <shauno> honestly, if nokia had gone android, I'd probably have gone that way.  they were the only brand I ever owned until smartphones
[15:51] <MartijnVdS> awilkins: yeah, but this might be a step in the right direction
[15:51] <awilkins> But some publishers have soo got their head up their butt about ebooks
[15:52] <awilkins> Like Neal Stephenson's publisher
[15:52] <awilkins> Took me a while when reading Anathem to work out that what I thought was techno-nuspeak was actually just OCR errors
[15:52] <bigcalm> MySQL help needed again :) http://paste.ubuntu.com/6059327/ - this is returning the data I need, except I need meter_reading to be the most recent record, not the 1st created
[15:52] <MartijnVdS> awilkins: it's a mix of both :)
[15:52] <awilkins> And then I thought "WTH? They're OCRing paper books to make the eBook?!? Did they lose the source code?"
[15:53] <ali1234> oh did microsoft FINALLY buy nokia then?
[15:53] <shauno> bigcalm: then don't use "order by id", use order by .. reading_snap_shot_time ?
[15:53] <ali1234> next: elop to replace ballmer
[15:53] <awilkins> A bit like one of our data suppliers who maintain their enormous 1,100 page reference manual as Word and transcribe the changes manually to their data maintenance system :-S
[15:53] <ali1234> this is the exact same trick he pulled with adobe and macromedia
[15:53] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: and then? run that into the ground?
[15:54] <mungbean> nobody in europe will ever hire a trojan CEO again.
[15:54] <mungbean> if they have any balls
[15:54] <ali1234> MartijnVdS: yes, he ran macromedia into theground so adobe could buy it
[15:54] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: sure but who will buy MS
[15:54] <mungbean> sounds like he's good at his job
[15:54] <bigcalm> shauno: that only orders the result once it's been grouped
[15:54] <popey> well nokia are allowed to make smartphones again in 2015
[15:54] <popey> but not before
[15:54] <mungbean> huh?
[15:55] <popey> the agreement stops them making smartphones under the nokia name till then
[15:55] <mungbean> a windows only deal?
[15:55] <awilkins> bigcalm, ORDER BY id DESC
[15:55] <dwatkins> a CEO with people hidden inside him? sounds cramped.
[15:55] <popey> them being nokia
[15:55] <mungbean> wow thats crazy
[15:55] <MartijnVdS> oh the not-bought part of Nokia
[15:55] <mgdm> awilkins: won't work
[15:55] <awilkins> bigcalm, Presuming id is an incrementing autonumbered field
[15:55] <mungbean> which bit?
[15:55] <popey> they still get to make S30 and S40 phones (dumb/feature phones)
[15:55] <mgdm> bigcalm: you probably need a self join
[15:55] <awilkins> mgdm, Why not?
[15:55] <popey> which Microsoft clearly aren't interested in
[15:56] <awilkins> Ah, the meter reading time
[15:56] <mgdm> awilkins: order by doesn't work on groups
[15:56] <awilkins> mgdm, Curses
[15:56] <popey> or Nokia could make smartphones based on some as yet decided software platform... .....
[15:56] <ali1234> wasn't "microsoft buys nokia" on my list of 12 predications i did at new years?
[15:56] <mgdm> awilkins: and by groups I mean joins with group by, etc
[15:56] <popey> everyone predicted it
[15:56] <mgdm> awilkins: been a pain in my side for about 3 months :)
[15:56] <bigcalm> awilkins: the id is incrementing, but the reading_snap_shot_time is the field of interest. It may not relate to the order in which the records were created
[15:56] <ali1234> no they didn't, actually
[15:56] <ali1234> several mobile industry analysts told me it wouldn't happen
[15:56] <mungbean> most people predicted as soon as they eloped
[15:56] <ali1234> they also told mean valve would never make a console too
[15:56] <shauno> I didn't expect something like this mid-ceo-transition
[15:56] <ali1234> *me
[15:57] <mgdm> bigcalm: you'll need a subselect, I think
[15:57] <mungbean> what is the latest onthe valve console?
[15:57] <bigcalm> mgdm: I did wonder, just not sure how
[15:57] <mgdm> bigcalm: select ... left join (select thing from meter m)
[15:57] <bigcalm> mgdm: and once I have the SQL working, I need to translate it into QueryBuilder :)
[15:57] <popey> Jul 20 10:28:14 <ali1234>microsoft should have teamed up with RIM instead of nokia
[15:57] <mgdm> bigcalm: blech
[15:57] <diddledan> it seems pretty obvious that elop is headed into ballmer's chair once the big dude leaves
[15:57] <bigcalm> Oh, okay
[15:57] <popey> ☻
[15:57] <popey> thats the only line I found from last year
[15:58] <ali1234> popey: no on g+
[15:58] <popey> ah ok
[15:58] <ali1234> popey: you did that "what are your predictions for 2013" post as uuk-podcast
[15:58] <popey> ah yeah
[15:59] <shauno> almost completely unrelated, I noticed the bbc use the term 'monkey boy' in a headline re: balmar.  didn't expect that
[15:59] <diddledan> wait, what?!
[15:59] <diddledan> citation totally required
[15:59] <awilkins> Fair journalism, he's been called that by the tech community for ages
[15:59] <shauno> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-23815316
[15:59] <bigcalm> LOL
[16:00] <popey> just checked, none of us said it on the show
[16:00] <awilkins> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-23815316
[16:00] <popey> haha tony said "Nokia will ditch Windows or go bust.
[16:00] <awilkins> I'd say being bought out is akin to going bust
[16:00] <shauno> just .. I remember the beeb being a bit more like my grandfather, not a bit more like me.  so it raised an eyebrow
[16:00] <ali1234> i can't find that post now :(
[16:00] <popey> I said "There will be an Ubuntu phone available to buy in shops in at least one large western country
[16:00] <popey> hehe
[16:01] <awilkins> There was the *promise* of one available to pre-order on the internet
[16:01] <bigcalm> Insider knowledge (just not yet)
[16:01] <awilkins> I'm not sure they ever realistically expected the Edge to get backed it's full quote
[16:01] <awilkins> But it sure did make a point
[16:01] <popey> we did hope it would
[16:02] <awilkins> "Hey look, $14M dollars worth of people like the idea of a deskphonetab"
[16:03] <Darael> awilkins: fourteen million dollars dollars worth?
[16:03] <diddledan> I think that needs more clarification: "hey look, $14M dollars worth of people are willing to pay up-front for an unknown and unproven product because they like the idea of a deskphonetab, so imagine what that value will raise to once the product is proven!!!!!"
[16:03] <awilkins> Darael, Was it more?
[16:03] <awilkins> Can't recall
[16:04] <popey> awilkins: pedant alert
[16:04] <diddledan> ergh, and I did dollars dollars, too
[16:04] <Darael> awilkins: I was more referring to the inclusion of both the dollar-sign and the word "dollars" because I'm a pedantic git.
[16:04] <diddledan> I was copy+typing
[16:04] <ali1234> https://plus.google.com/u/0/107381207738558467919/posts/8UULeoNsqkL <- found it
[16:04] <shauno> the first step is being able to admit it
[16:04] <ali1234> "July - Nokia finally gives up after consistently terrible Winows Phone  sales. Branding and patents sold to Microsoft. Everything else sold to  Huawei. Elop returns to Microsoft to head Windows Phone division."
[16:04] <Darael> shauno: The second step is amplifying it to the point of self-parody.
[16:04] <awilkins> Darael, pedantic git from the dept. of redundancy dept.
[16:05] <Darael> That's the *redundant* dept. of redundancy dept., thankyouverymuch!
[16:05] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: you missed at least one (there hasn't been a  Secure Boot key revocation, has there?) ;)
[16:05] <bigcalm> mgdm: this is my non-working attempt: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6059365/
[16:06] <ali1234> sure, most of them turned out to be wrong
[16:06] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: though you did predict a phone for September :)
[16:06] <awilkins> " As a result of getting ubuntu devs to port to nexus 7 with relatively less ram, cpu and storage, Raring will absolutely zoom along on a fast pc.﻿"
[16:06] <mungbean> will it?
[16:06] <awilkins> What actually happened : Google released a Nexus 7 with more RAM and CPU
[16:08] <Azelphur> and a better screen
[16:08] <Azelphur> and qi charging
[16:08] <diddledan> why do I feel a pang of sadness about microsoft being in the dulldrums?
[16:08] <diddledan> that article shauno linked made me feel :-(
[16:08] <awilkins> Because it's nice to have an enemy?
[16:09] <shauno> because it makes you feel old.  back in my day, etc etc
[16:09] <awilkins> Quickens the blood and sharpens the nerves
[16:09] <diddledan> I almost want to defend monkeyboy
[16:09] <diddledan> but then I realise I've called him monkeyboy again
[16:09] <awilkins> We have a project manager at work we call that
[16:09] <awilkins> Quite independently evolved
[16:09] <shauno> the term, or the species?
[16:09] <awilkins> The term
[16:10] <awilkins> I'm not sure how he evolved though
[16:10] <awilkins> This is a man who's phone wallpaper is a finger pointing out with the caption "Who's the most awesome today then?"
[16:11] <shauno> heh.  that reminds me of of when we found out our bosses' password hint was whos$product.  and his password, my$product
[16:11] <diddledan> lol
[16:12] <diddledan> that's a good hint then
[16:12] <awilkins> My favourite memory of bosses and passwords was the boss having his Administrator account on Windows have a blank password
[16:12] <diddledan> aah joy
[16:12] <shauno> that made the whole "no, they haven't fixed the password exposure bug at all .." conversation just that bit more cringeworthy
[16:12] <awilkins> He caught CodeRed and saturated our entire outgoing bandwidth (dual-link ISDN) with spam
[16:13] <awilkins> When he claimed his machine was secure I put a text file on the root of his C:\ drive that said "Bet you're glad I'm not a REAL hacker then"
[16:13] <diddledan> I wonder if Sony UK have changed their network-wide admin password from <insert really simple one-word password that you only get in the daytime> yet?
[16:13] <awilkins> We used to host our own CRM system as well so that little episode put it offline for a day
[16:13] <shauno> this was the most sunday school of bugs.  a password field that was sent back to the browser as input value=therealpassword
[16:14] <awilkins> Hahahahahah
[16:14] <shauno> we told them, they disabled right click.  so then we started mailing people their passwords until it stopped being an issue
[16:14] <awilkins> I think Huawei's router web UI does that, sends WPA keys to the page as plaintext
[16:15] <diddledan> I think a lot of router web uis do that
[16:15] <awilkins> For which I'm grateful when I visit Mum and need the wifi password
[16:15] <diddledan> lol
[16:15] <awilkins> They're in a password box though, so they are plaintext that appears as a line of ******
[16:15] <awilkins> Quaint notions of security
[16:16] <dwatkins> some VoiP systems which have a java-based front-end will only let you login to a page that uses HTTPS
[16:16] <dwatkins> I mean only uses HTTP
[16:16] <shauno> that reminds me of the "disabled" features on the model upc sent me.  they've just commented the fields out of the webui
[16:16] <shauno> throw up web inspector, uncomment them, and they work just fine
[16:16] <diddledan> my dad's wifi password is easily googleable
[16:16] <popey> KiB Mem:   8056964 total,  6894708 used,  1162256 free,     6984 buffers
[16:16] <popey> KiB Swap:  8267772 total,  5662956 used,  2604816 free,   876896 cached
[16:16] <popey> Thanks chromium.
[16:16] <dwatkins> I'm sure a lot of people don't bother changing their wifi router password
[16:16] <awilkins> My old employer had their catalog web app running as the root account on the database server
[16:17] <awilkins> And it was vulnerable to SQL injection
[16:17] <awilkins> Was soo tempted to reset the prices on an nvidia card and buy opne
[16:17]  * dwatkins shudders at the memories of SQL injections
[16:18] <awilkins> popey, That bug where your Google account auth times out and if chromium is your default browser it keeps spamming about:blank pages is v.annoying
[16:18] <popey> heh
[16:18] <popey> yes
[16:18] <popey> worse if you have 2fa
[16:18] <diddledan> an in-house product at work uses \ to separate tag-type\tag-name - htere are several places where escaping goes 8 or more deep
[16:20] <diddledan> so you've got SYSTAG\\\\\\\\tag-name
[16:20] <diddledan> it can't be changed now without a lot of pain
[16:21] <diddledan> so it's a case of which pain is worse?
[16:30] <bigcalm> mgdm: thanks for the pointer on left join (select ...). I _think_ I have what I need now: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6059435/
[16:31] <bigcalm> Next challange is to translate it into QueryBuilder :)
[16:32] <mgdm> have fun with that :-)
[16:32] <mgdm> that's part of the reason I don't use query builders, they're another syntax to learn on top of SQL
[16:35] <bigcalm> mgdm: I like the abstraction
[16:35] <shauno> is it really abstracted if you already wrote the SQL?
[16:36] <shauno> at college I used to get told off for writing my code before my pseudocode.  it feels like you're doing the same thing
[16:36] <diddledan> shauno: that's assbackwars
[16:37] <diddledan> +d
[16:37] <shauno> it works in my head though.  make it work, and then fill in the fluff
[16:37] <diddledan> shauno: but technically when you're the developer and the analyst who cares when the pseudo code gets done?!
[16:38] <diddledan> I never understood the point of pseudo code anyway
[16:38] <awilkins> You should just replace pseudocode anyway
[16:38] <awilkins> If your real code gets changed are you going to change the pseudocode to match it? no
[16:38] <diddledan> surely it's up to the developer how to implement it, and not some idiot in an office who has no clue about programming
[16:38] <davmor2> popey: you could always change back to firefox :D
[16:39] <mgdm> pseudocode is pointless
[16:39] <mgdm> writing tests first however is not
[16:39] <awilkins> Indeed
[16:39] <gordonjcp> pseudocode is just a wanky ressurection of flowcharts
[16:39] <awilkins> That's the habit many of us need to cultivate better, self included
[16:39] <mgdm> Argh! UML!
[16:39] <shauno> well, in my mind, it was so the people that couldn't actually make it work, could still get some marks for showing where their head was.  like showing your "working out" in maths
[16:39] <awilkins> "I need to do this... I need to write this test to prove it works... first"
[16:39] <ali1234> gordonjcp: no, that is flowcharts
[16:40] <ali1234> er, UML
[16:40] <diddledan> TDD can be faked - if you want a certain response given certain input. just return that response to all input. done. the test passes :-)
[16:40] <mgdm> diddledan: well yes, but if you do that, you deserve everything you get
[16:40] <diddledan> lol
[16:40] <awilkins> That's how you start anyway
[16:40] <awilkins> You're supposed to just write something that passes the test
[16:41] <awilkins> But then you make the test more interesting
[16:41] <shauno> I really fail at design.  I tend to just write a bunch of empty functions with convincing looking names, and call that my design.  and then fill in the gaps until it stops breaking
[16:42] <diddledan> shauno: I don't even do that :-)
[16:42] <diddledan> I just make it stop breaking period.
[16:42] <shauno> well you're a web developer.  you're special :p
[16:42] <diddledan> who cares about function naming :-p
[16:43] <bashrc> Design never survives contact with users.  You can start out with a very elegant looking system and have it turn into a hairball once it meets the real world.
[16:43] <awilkins> Yeah, let's all just write things in Brainf**k
[16:43] <diddledan> awilkins: now you're getting the idea!
[16:43] <awilkins> Or even better M / MUMPS
[16:43] <diddledan> bashrc: indeed
[16:44] <awilkins> Oh, wait, they already did that with the most successful OSS electronic healthcare record in the USA :-S
[16:44] <diddledan> the usa has a successful oss electronic healthcare record at all?
[16:44] <diddledan> o_O
[16:45] <awilkins> Well, VistA
[16:45] <awilkins> If that counts
[16:46] <diddledan> oooh, so that's why microsoft failed. they took an electronic healthcare record and rebranded it an operating system.
[16:46] <awilkins> THey probably did write the Window 8 UI in MUMPS
[16:47] <awilkins> http://thedailywtf.com/Articles/A_Case_of_the_MUMPS.aspx
[16:47] <awilkins> http://thedailywtf.com/Articles/MUMPS-Madness.aspx
[16:47] <awilkins> http://thedailywtf.com/Articles/Revenge-of-MUMPS-Madness!.aspx
[16:47] <awilkins> http://thedailywtf.com/Articles/Avoiding-MUMPS--Arcadius.aspx
[16:47] <awilkins> http://thedailywtf.com/Articles/Diseased.aspx
[16:48] <awilkins> I think I encountered MUMPS in one of my previous jobs and was lucky to escape alive
[16:58] <shauno> I've had an odd 'career' path.  I encountered a rubber Nixon mask and a bullwhip in a previous job
[16:59] <diddledan> wtf?!
[16:59] <shauno> hotels.
[16:59] <diddledan> that's some serious bongade
[16:59] <diddledan> erm
[16:59] <diddledan> bondage
[17:00] <shauno> nah.  it wouldn't have been weird, but for the Nixon mask
[17:02] <diddledan> you mean bullwhips are an every day occurrance?
[17:03] <shauno> not everyday, just an eventuality
[17:03] <diddledan> serialz?
[17:05] <shauno> every job has these.  if you stay here long enough, you will run into ...
[17:06] <shauno> eg, if you work in web dev long enough, you will run into someone who doesn't understand the difference between hiring you, and hiring his 12yo nephew
[17:07] <diddledan> to be fair, there isn't much difference :-p
[17:09] <shauno> anyway, back later.  I appear to have shrank my sofa covers, and now need a plan B
[17:09] <diddledan> there's a big difference between hiring me and outsourcing to india, however
[17:10] <diddledan> tata
[17:28] <xnox> popey: look what you have done, everyone is now quoting the messenger (me) rather the slangasek who actually turned the question around at vUDS.... =)
[17:33] <diddledan> I need to pull an "x locator" using google maps out of my bottom by tomorrow
[17:33] <diddledan> annoyingly it needs to be in drupal which I know very little about
[17:38] <ali1234> x locator?
[17:38] <ali1234> i did a kml integration from a web service into google maps once
[17:41] <diddledan> ali1234: in this case it's stores
[17:41] <ali1234> hmm, that's a little more complex
[17:42] <diddledan> I have zero data to work from, 'cos it's a POC
[17:42] <ali1234> now i think about it i did google earth integration, not google maps
[17:43] <diddledan> this looks promising, though I don't know how easy it'll be to theme: https://drupal.org/project/google_store_locator
[17:45] <popey> xnox: yay, you're internet famous!
[17:45] <diddledan> how does someone become "internet famous"?
[17:45] <mgdm> become famous, on the internet.
[17:45] <diddledan> i.e. how do I.. become internet famous
[17:46] <diddledan> and will I get money from it?
[17:51] <daftykins> diddledan: you might if you were a youtube sensation that got ad revenue
[17:51] <xnox> popey: does that make you, my producer?!
[17:51] <diddledan> I've got as much charisma as mark zuckerberg tho
[17:57] <MartijnVdS> diddledan: so.. enough to get millions of people to use your website?
[17:57] <MartijnVdS> diddledan: even though it's privacy hell?
[18:03] <ali1234> xnox: publicist
[18:26] <daftykins> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OKOrkLxOBoY
[18:26] <daftykins> mmm, android 4.4 - kitkat, guaranteed 4 bars
[18:26] <daftykins> aww yeah
[18:26] <mgdm> daftykins: /o\
[18:26] <mgdm> daftykins: *slow clap*
[18:27] <daftykins> ty sir
[18:27] <diddledan> kitkat?
[18:27] <MartijnVdS> yeah
[18:27] <diddledan> lmao
[18:28] <diddledan> lol  @ mega bites and chunky bite
[18:28] <diddledan> that's actually awesome!
[18:29] <daftykins> ;)
[18:29] <daftykins> props to them i say
[18:58] <ali1234> i tried to convince mer project they should name each release after a seafood dish eg fish fingers, prawn cocktail etc
[18:58] <ali1234> but they wouldn't have it
[18:59] <daftykins> killjoys :(
[20:00] <diddledan> \o/ I got macports running on 10.9 mavericks
[20:07] <mungbean> guys.
[20:07] <mungbean> since upgrading from precise kernel to 12.04 and raring kernel , when i resume from suspend i don't get the lock screen, and wifi takes longer to resume. any ideas?