/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/09/13/#ubuntu-gnome.txt

u-k-i-tI apologise if I ask hard questions and seem a bit rough. I only want the best for ubuntu-gnome, but I will stick the boot in and ask when not sure.00:05
bjsnideryou sound sure00:06
u-k-i-tWhen it comes to xterm I am fairly sure. Should we ask of anyone who has ever needed or been dropped  back too it?00:08
jbichaI wanted to not include evolution by default since that's at least 10MB I believe but I wasn't able to get enough people to support that bold of a move00:11
u-k-i-tIf xterm was so important it would b a dep of X, which it isn't and easy to remove. Would it?00:12
u-k-i-tjbicha: Evolution is an basic app off a basic business system. Lets look at dropping more sh*t as in emapthy?00:13
u-k-i-tMany tyos, but you get it.00:14
u-k-i-tNeed new fingers. ;-)00:14
u-k-i-tjbicha: Drop games and social not a basic email / pim app.00:15
u-k-i-tjbicha: Are you attempting to get down to CD size? If you are don't bother these days. These days it's always about correct default install choices; and they can be hard. :-D00:19
jbichauh, you're the one complaining about 1 MB00:22
bjsniderxterm seems to be personally offensive to him00:23
u-k-i-tjbicha: That is a bad 1MB. Don't dop evolution as that kills a basic os install for business. Look at games and other things please.00:24
jbichaUbuntu GNOME is a general purpose OS00:25
jbichawhile it can be be used for business, I recommend serious businesses use a custom image00:26
bjsniderthey should use centos i suppose00:26
bjsnideror rhel if they can afford it00:26
u-k-i-tbjsnider: I like apps I am looking at what is best os wide. Please don't make it personal as it is not.00:27
u-k-i-tjbicha: If general purpose. That's a wide scope. Is it to be stable or  play OS. Does the group have a goal?00:29
u-k-i-t13.10 is stable now. As that what I am chatting too you off. :-)00:30
u-k-i-tbjsnider: Should that be use centos id that cannot afford rhel.. Look I use and promote a deian base these days. I want a decent desktop to promote to customers, but the one is ubuntu gnome but the project will not LTS yet.00:44
u-k-i-ts/id/if00:45
u-k-i-tjbicha: Rather than dealing with evolution. How about this one bug 121881800:52
ubot5bug 1218818 in cheese (Ubuntu) "ubuntu gnome - cheese-common - attempt to purge tries pulling out gnome-contacts etc." [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/121881800:52
u-k-i-t:-)00:52
jbichalibcheese is a base GNOME library; you can't remove it without rebuilding several apps to not have webcam support00:54
u-k-i-tjbicha: Why though. It is rubbish that some crap webacam app that should that dep'ed up?00:59
u-k-i-tUnder my thinking it should not be default installed.01:00
u-k-i-tWe are not catering to geeks like me. ;-) This is business. To get a distro known give people the basic and let them add on.01:02
jbichalibcheese (or cheese-common) is not a webcam app; it's a library that webcam apps can use01:03
jbichayou can uninstall cheese01:03
u-k-i-tjbicha: You said about removing evolution. I would agree with that IF ther was a email app selection screen at install.01:04
jbichaUbuntu GNOME is not a business - we have no income01:04
jbichaif you want to run a business based on Ubuntu GNOME, you're welcome to recompile apps for your own purposes01:05
u-k-i-tjbicha: Who actually heads ubuntu gnome?01:06
jbichawe're a community project01:07
u-k-i-tMr Riddell heads Kubuntu. Who is the last stand for this one?01:08
jbichadarkxst is technical lead but there are other people with other responsibilities01:08
u-k-i-tTechnical maybe. Who has lead of how the OS evolves and how it looks etc. ?01:11
jbichathat's what 'technical lead' means; there's a different guy that's artwork lead though01:12
u-k-i-tDo I have to really ask it -Who's the project boss?01:14
u-k-i-tjbicha: Don't ever invalidate a bug of mine again!01:15
u-k-i-tThey are valid for a reason Ok.01:17
jbichathe bug is invalid, I just marked it as such01:18
micahgu-k-i-t: developers are allowed to invalidate bugs that are such, he did give the reason why it wasn't valid01:19
u-k-i-tmicahg: I just un invalidated it. ;-)01:19
* micahg knows what the next step for the bug is ;)01:20
bjsnidermicahg, how you doing?01:20
micahgbjsnider: fine, thanks, been a bit busy01:20
bjsnidercoolio. how's firefox?01:20
micahghrm, needs help01:21
micahgI wish I had more time01:21
jbichau-k-i-t: would you prefer I mark the bug "Won't Fix" ?01:21
bjsnidereverything seems to need more help01:21
u-k-i-tjbicha: I see I am being I am being ganged up on for a valid bug. Ubuntu does not allow a dev to report bugs I assume.01:23
micahgu-k-i-t: you should be able to purge the app "cheese", the library is another isue01:23
u-k-i-tmicahg: Look at the bug report01:24
micahgwhat did you purge?  it says cheese-common which is again, not cheese01:24
u-k-i-tmicahg: By usage 'cheese-common' supplies function and api to 'cheese'. So why are other  apps deps of it?01:25
micahgit's arch:all files for the cheese binary as well as the library01:26
micahgthis is common in Debian packaging01:27
bjsniderthought it was -data that held arch-indep files?01:27
micahgdepends on what's inside, both are common names01:27
bjsnideranything in /usr/share01:28
u-k-i-tmicahg: Its an app that nobody wants, it;s crap.01:28
micahgthe app is cheese, the library and other files provide webcam functionality to other apps01:28
u-k-i-tYou assume people have or want webcam. Big F*ckup.01:30
jbichau-k-i-t: please stop. Your language is getting very irritating and is not respectful01:30
micahgthat's how upstream expects the app to be built, if they wanted it runtime detectable, they'd use dlopen01:30
u-k-i-tjbicha: I have not used bad language, but maybe asked hard questions ... Thats Ok isn't it?01:32
jbichayour previous two statements had extra commentary at the end that I found rude01:34
u-k-i-tI got multiple answers and a member threatening the next status on a bug report. How should I react?01:35
micahgI wasn't threatening, just informing01:35
micahgsorry if you felt threatened01:35
u-k-i-tmicahg: it came across as "what you do next we revert".01:36
jbichau-k-i-t: you have a right to file bugs and express opinions, but bugs that cannot be fixed have to be closed so that we can see which bugs are left that can be fixed01:37
jbichaanyway, I'm logging off01:38
Zoiaguyvertake care jbicha01:39
u-k-i-tYou have been a part of intimidated a user.; Actually a developer. Not nice!01:40
u-k-i-tBye jbicha01:40
u-k-i-tYou guys really need to learn how to deal with people.01:41
ZoiaguyverWell it depends on what it is in relation to I guess.01:44
u-k-i-tThis project willnot suport 14.04 LTS. Let me know if you can help.01:44
bjsnideri don't know that i've seen a good cop/bad cop routine with one person playing both parts before01:44
micahgit's a trap!01:45
ZoiaguyverUbuntu gnome doesn't have LTS releases at the moment, 13.10 is only the second official release, they have very few testers and even less maintainers01:45
Zoiaguyveror will be the second sorry..01:45
u-k-i-tHow do I reply now. People have a go about me as a person but not dealt with my question.01:51
micahgthe bug is invalid, it cannot be fixed in Debian or Ubuntu, you could petition the GNOME project to dlopen libcheese01:52
micahghttps://bugzilla.gnome.org you can file the issue against whichever product builds with webcam support01:53
u-k-i-tmicahg: It can be fixed. Ok I will fixx it and allow it to not pull out the main apps.01:53
micahgu-k-i-t: I'm saying from an archive perspective it can't be unless it uses dlopen (then it can be moved to a recommends)01:54
micahghrm, I should've checked first, looks like there is some dlopen support, I'm not sure for what01:55
* micahg will leave someone more GNOMEish to answer now01:56
u-k-i-tmicahg: Don't worry about it. It's already dealt with in my respin.01:56
u-k-i-tSorry all for using the 'f' word last night. I used it in context and it just flowed when I probably should have thought more before typing. Apologies.12:36
docstrhi13:11
docstris there a lts version of ubuntu gnome?13:11
davidbrookeUbuntu gnome started with release 13.04...so I don't think so14:27
ricotzdarkxst, ping17:22
ricotzdarkxst, the e-d-s package is pretty broken :\17:24
ricotzthere are several soname bumps not considered17:24
ricotzthis a real problem, but i can't deal with it right now17:26
bjsniderlook how many packages it builds. the control file must be 500 lines18:10

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