/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/09/24/#ubuntu-uk.txt

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Myrttiaw yisss, new socks have been dispatched05:03
MooDoomorning all06:59
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TheOpenSourcererJust in case anyone uses TB, Lightning & CalDAV I have just discovered that you must change the URL of your calendars in Lightning: https://developers.google.com/google-apps/calendar/caldav/v2/guide#connecting_to_googles_caldav_server07:35
Myrttiawwwwwww07:55
MyrttiI was told "no XPS 13 for yooo"07:55
TheOpenSourcererFascinating stuff about Valve: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-2420549707:55
TheOpenSourcererOh wow - I'm not a gamer but *this* is very surprising: http://gamingonlinux.com/articles/how-does-left-4-dead-2-perform-on-ubuntu-1304-compared-to-windows-8.245707:59
nigelb4708:03
nigelb(gah)08:03
TheOpenSourcerer5308:03
MartijnVdS32908:03
TheOpenSourcererMornington Crescent!08:04
directhexnumberwang!08:06
MartijnVdSlet's rotate the board!08:06
bigcalmGood morning peeps :)08:15
mungbeaninteresting. doctors surgery is on the phone to discuss a post she wrote on a mums facebook page08:19
* popey wonders why his printer doesn't default to "reverse, collate" when printing multiple page documents08:19
MartijnVdSpopey: what does it default to?08:19
popeyneither08:19
popeyso you end up with everything in the wrong order08:19
popeyi.e. face up, last page on top08:20
MartijnVdSpopey: you should be able to set the defaults for that in the system-config-printer settings thingy08:20
popeysure08:20
popeybut it should be default for multi-page docs08:20
MartijnVdSis yours an inkjet printer?08:21
TheOpenSourcererFile a bug08:21
popeyyes08:21
MartijnVdSI'd agree with TheOpenSourcerer then, file a bug on the PPD08:21
popeyok, good, consensus ☻08:21
popeynot sure the ppd is right08:22
popeymaybe on cups itself08:22
MartijnVdSpopey: cups knows all it knows about the printer from the ppd08:22
AlanBellnot all printers put the paper face up in the output tray08:22
popeytrue08:22
MartijnVdSpopey: you should be able to find a copy of /etc/cups/ppd/yourprinter.ppd in /usr/share/ppd somewhere08:22
MartijnVdShmm08:23
MartijnVdSmaybe they're installed on demand these days08:23
MartijnVdSthe PPD is probably downloaded as needed from openprinting, unless the printer is HP?08:24
popeyyeah, HP08:25
MartijnVdSI'd file the bug on cups. I can't find where/how PPDs are created/retrieved.08:25
* popey adds to to-do08:26
MartijnVdSmaybe hplip then08:26
AlanBellanyone understand the fedora/redhat merger thing?08:28
popeythe what?08:28
AlanBellah, hang on08:28
popeyhttp://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-devel-list/2003-September/msg00137.html08:28
popeylooks like a piss take08:28
AlanBellyeah, I failed to spot the year08:28
popeyalso, 10 years ☻08:29
AlanBellI fail08:29
JamesTaitGood morning all, happy Punctuation Day! :-D08:32
MartijnVdSJamesTait: @&(*!$(&&!$&^&@08:32
JamesTaitMartijnVdS, you were waiting for that, weren't you? :-P08:32
MartijnVdSJamesTait: maybe..08:32
mungbean))08:33
mungbeandidn't like to see those brackets hanging08:33
MartijnVdSmungbean: nah, it was valid Perl code before08:34
Myrttihuh08:39
Myrttigoogle+ is confusing08:39
MooDoowhy?08:39
Myrttiediting a post turns the reference to a person into numbers?08:40
Myrtti*squint*08:40
MartijnVdSprobably their account id, maybe they deleted their account?08:40
popeyi think G+ is a bit broken today08:41
Myrttiwhat I don't also like is that the notificiations don't seem to change the title anymore08:43
Myrttiso if I get notifications, I don't notice it from the tab anymore08:43
directhexspotify.08:57
bigcalmIs wonderful?08:58
directhexit's the first ~confirmed part of the steamos "We’re working with many of the media services you know and love. Soon we will begin bringing them online, allowing you to access your favorite music and video with Steam and SteamOS." feature08:59
bigcalmOh09:01
mungbeanvideo?09:01
bigcalmUsing the unofficial official 'Linux Preview'?09:01
mungbeanis steamos just gonna turn into a media centre?09:01
TheOpenSourcererIt could do to the home/living room tech what Android has done to mobile.09:02
mungbeanwireless streaming to various rooms09:03
popeyi suspect the spotify will be the web based one09:03
mungbeanof games and video09:03
popeynot the fat client09:03
mungbeani'd liek to fast forward 2-3 years and see what will happen09:04
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TheOpenSourcererGiving the OS away "potentially" offers device makers a platform similar the way Andriod is used. Lots of innovation possible in the home without having to re-invent the wheel for an OS...09:05
TheOpenSourcererOf course there are lots of unknowns right now but if Valve get this right it could be very disruptive.09:06
MooDoolove the link you posted about their work ethic TheOpenSourcerer very interesting....no managers09:06
TheOpenSourcererYeah - was interesting.09:06
directhexpopey, there's a load of spotify-related functions built into the beta steam client's libsteam09:07
MooDooloved reading the handbook :) lo09:07
popeyah of course, they can use the libs09:07
directhexhttp://marlamin.com/u/2013-09-22_15-43-29_13421753.png09:08
directhexTheOpenSourcerer, in the short term, i think the most "at risk" competition is things like Ouya, depending on price point09:08
directhexandroid home consoles with ARM, or steamos home consoles with x86...09:09
MooDoowhat's steamos going to be based on?  won't it have to be some windows variant if it wants to run all the games or am I missing something?09:09
* directhex grumbles about NOBODY KNOWING HOW TO READ09:10
TheOpenSourcererIt's Linux09:10
shaunolooks like 12.04.2 so far09:10
directhexsteamos is a linux system, probably a debbuntu derivative given current data09:10
MooDooTheOpenSourcerer: so it's going to limited to not that many games then?09:10
* directhex grumbles about NOBODY KNOWING HOW TO READ again09:10
TheOpenSourcererMooDoo: http://store.steampowered.com/livingroom/SteamOS/09:10
MooDooah ok thanks09:10
directhexMooDoo, linux-only games, OR can play windows games if a windows-based pc is booted on the same network09:10
MooDoodirecthex: stop grumbling ;)09:10
directhexand apparently AAA games on linux are being announced "in the coming weeks"09:11
TheOpenSourcerer"With SteamOS, “openness” means that the hardware industry can iterate in  the living room at a much faster pace than they’ve been able to.  Content creators can connect directly to their customers. Users can  alter or replace any part of the software or hardware they want."09:11
MooDooAAA games?    they premum titles09:12
shaunoit's a bit more of an incentive for content providers to get their ducks in a row too09:12
directhexMooDoo, AAA is an industry term for "games with an expensive advertising budget"09:12
directhexMooDoo, which typically means "games we spent a lot of money on, so we are funding them to do well"09:12
directhexif you see a TV advert and a bus advert for a game, it's AAA09:13
directhexthe term has leaked a bit and is used by non-industry people to mean "a really well-polished game", but this is a frequent correlation, not the actual meaning09:14
directhexthe idea being, game shops have limited shelf space, so they only want to stock games that will sell well. more ads = sell better, so industry magazine adverts are targeted at shops - "our game has an AAA £20m advertising budget across cinema, TV, and print"09:15
directhexmany excellent games are not AAA, and many AAA games are terrible - but they're always the "big name" games everyone knows about. the grand theft autos, etc09:16
MooDooso hopefully that's bioshock infinitethen09:20
directhexMooDoo, that sort of game. although i deeply deeply doubt it at this point.09:21
MooDooah well lol09:21
directhexMooDoo, it is reasonable to speculate about which wealthy publisher is on board (only the well-off publishers can afford AAA advertising budgets)09:21
mungbeanall wealthy publishers should be investing 10% in risky but potentially explosive markets09:22
mungbeani don't even think steamos is risky09:22
directhexMooDoo, i think 2K are unlikely, as they *mostly* don't do their own mac ports, especially of the bioshock series. they sell the rights to make a port to third parties (aspyr media, feral interactive), who do the port themselves & sell through their own networks (i.e. not steam)09:22
MooDooI think unless they get all titles working on it, it's just going to be a glorified media server which there are plenty of them already09:22
directhexa publisher without in-house mac ports is not a good bet for a producer of steamos ports, imho09:23
popeyI need to learn the basics of git/github09:23
AlanBellgithub has good tutorials09:24
popeyI just need to submit a few lines of change to an existing project09:24
directhexi think koch media (deep silver) is on board, but i don't know how far they'll go09:24
directhexi.e. metro last light is coming, but is only one game. can they port saint's row 4, or is there too much legacy windows-only tech in that engine?09:25
mungbeani wish this actually happened http://imgur.com/gallery/Y3dfB5l09:26
brobostigongood morning everyone.09:26
TheOpenSourcerermorning brobostigon09:28
brobostigonmorning TheOpenSourcerer09:28
mungbeanalways more productive working from home09:38
directhexWFH is hard.09:40
TheOpenSourcererIt is when the kids are at home.09:41
TheOpenSourcererAnd the wife for that matter09:41
directhexor generally. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cabin_fever09:42
mungbeanoh yeah, wife is out this morning09:42
mungbeanwill be different later09:42
TheOpenSourcererGosh: http://www.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/innovate/developers/minecraft-map-britain.html09:42
TheOpenSourcererThink my kids will be interested in this. ^--^09:43
directhexthe baby gave the ps3 remote a swim. do i buy a replacement, or just put up with using a joypad for navigating blu-rays?09:45
MartijnVdSdirecthex: how often do you do it?09:46
MartijnVdSI mean, if you use it once a month, don't bother buying a new remote09:46
mungbeandirecthex: what's cheaper, ps3 remote or blue ray player?09:47
mungbeanyou don't play games on it then?09:48
directhexum, £20 versus more than £20?09:48
directhexand yes, i play games with it, but a joypad is a terrible input mechanism for many tasks09:48
mungbeanah, i misunderstood, there's a ps3 remote control dooberie09:49
mungbeani had one for the ps2 but didn't really work for me09:49
mungbeanhad to press buttons too hard09:49
MartijnVdSI have a "converter box" for my Logitech Harmony09:49
MartijnVdSHarmony (IR) -> Box (IR) -> PS3 (BT)09:50
mungbeani've got a multifunction remote that i've never used cos it drinks batteries09:50
popeyTheOpenSourcerer: i have that minecraft map on my home server ☻09:52
TheOpenSourcererNow why does that not surprise me in the slightest popey?09:55
TheOpenSourcererHave just mailed that link to my kids - no doubt I will be recruited later to get in on their server...09:55
ali1234i take it that isn't to scale09:56
MooDooo/ minecraft :)09:56
popeyhttp://popey.com/~alan/2013-09-24_10.55.53.png09:56
popeycowes, isle of wight09:56
mungbeanmincecraft is still $2009:57
ali1234i only paid $15 for it09:57
MooDoomy son is just getting into it :)  I've set up a feed the beast server for him :)09:57
mungbeanthought they were gonna make it free at some point09:57
mungbeanacording to an AMA i read09:57
ali1234no.09:57
ali1234they are making it more expensive over time09:57
mungbeansux09:58
mungbeanwhat about the rpi minecraft?09:59
ali1234yeah that is free09:59
MartijnVdSpinecraft!09:59
mungbeanwhats the difference between rpi and full fat MC?09:59
Laneymmm picraft09:59
Laneychicken and leek please09:59
directhexsupported world size & complexity09:59
ali1234minecraft is still way too flat10:00
directhexit's cut down from the smartphone version10:01
ali1234lol10:01
ali1234the smartphone version is a tiny world tho10:01
directhexsince the pi is a cut down smartphone...10:01
directhex"Minecraft Pi Edition is very similar to Pocket Edition in many ways. Like Pocket Edition, there are still barrier walls, the player skin is always the default skin, but you can change this by replacing the char.png photo in the games files, and the title screen and the world selection screen were the same until Minecraft Pocket Edition updated to 0.7.0. There are also Cyan Flowers like in Pocket Edition. So far there is only Creative mode10:02
directhex available. The player has various blocks and items only seen in Pocket Edition, like, The Nether Reactor Core, and the Stone Cutter.10:02
directhexThe player has the ability to sneak, but not sprint. Currently, there is no mob spawning, even though the player starts with an Iron Sword in hand. The Bow is also available, but when used, the player will hold the Bow back infinitely until the player selects another item or logs off."10:02
ali1234is there PvP?10:03
ali1234because that would be funny to start the kids out with swords and nothing to kill but each other10:03
ali1234in a supposedly educational game10:03
popeyhttp://popey.com/~alan/2013-09-24_11.04.05.png farnborough10:05
mungbeani thought i read something about it being educational10:05
davmor2Morning all10:05
ali1234ok by my reckoning it's 25:1 scale10:05
popeyhttps://www.google.co.uk/maps/preview#!q=farnborough&data=!1m4!1m3!1d49175!2d-0.7366553!3d51.2903499!4m10!1m9!4m8!1m3!1d790997!2d-1.3433106!3d51.0448291!3m2!1i1871!2i946!4f13.110:06
popeylooks about right10:06
ali1234anyone seen that game that turns google earth data into a first person exploration game?10:06
ali1234in 1:1 scale. and it looks like skyrim quality graphics10:07
ali1234let me try to find it...10:07
directhex"everquest next" is basically minecraft with high-end graphics10:11
ali1234http://www.outerra.com/index.html10:12
ali1234(not really a game but an engine)10:12
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brobostigonthis is weird, in the play store under ingress it says the versio nis 1.35.1, however in the 'whats new' it says the most recent versio nis 1.36.0, and no update option, very weird.10:37
popeyit updates internally doesn't it?10:47
brobostigoningress's boot screen says 1.35.110:55
ali1234"just because I don't like it, it doesn't mean I will refuse to use it or buy it." - an apple user10:57
ali1234lol10:57
mungbeanintegrity FTW11:02
MartijnVdSwhoa11:50
MartijnVdShttp://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/nouveau/2013-September/014480.html11:50
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mgdmMartijnVdS: nice!12:13
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mungbeanso, my mrs has a generic rant about doctors surgery on facebook, no names mentioned. gets a call from the practice because a doctor had flagged it up with the practice. isn't there some data protection issue there?12:55
mungbeanshe didn't identify the practice12:56
popeyhow is there?12:56
daftykinsDP doesn't come into it12:56
daftykinsthis is why i keep trying to tell my mother not to comment on businesses etc. on facebook12:57
daftykinsshe's fallen for that illusion of anonymity =/12:57
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mungbeanbecause how do you make the connection between the person and the particular doctors practice?13:03
mungbeanthere are 10s of surgeries in our local area13:03
daftykinsstill, i'd call issue with your Mrs before trying to see who on the other side did something wrong13:04
daftykinsbbl13:05
mungbeanits nothing she wouldn't have said in a direct complaint, just intrigued that somebody joined the dots using private patient data13:06
popeymaybe her generic rant wasn't as generic as you think13:07
popeyand people in the industry can connect the dots13:07
mungbeanhttp://www.kickstarter.com/projects/508681281/dcs-wwii-europe-194413:10
SuperMattI wouldn't be surprised if a GP or whatever looked to see if there was anything interesting on people's facebook profiles13:10
SuperMattafter all, Dr. House told us everybody lies13:11
SuperMattand maybe the GP wanted to check something out13:11
mungbeanit was in a closed group, but yes, i think a GP saw it and wanted to get to the bottom of the story13:12
mungbeanhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-1dv28W9KFs13:12
mungbeanget excited by these games but too foten they are too boring/hard13:12
Myrttimaybe it's lupus13:12
mungbeanlooking at you il-213:12
mungbean$5K to have your voice in the game as a pilot13:16
diddledanyou know what the "ubuntu ecosystem" is missing? movies! we need proprietary ubuntu drm :-p13:49
mgdmJust use Ogg. Few enough things play that it's basically DRM... </troll>13:52
mungbeansucks that you can't choose safesearch for youtube videos, but keep comments13:52
mungbeanspooky, checking my google dashboard and i was a member of one group only - some dodgy islamist site that had been banned. not the sort of thing you accidentally click on14:02
diddledanmungbean: are you planning a jihad against dodgy islamist sites?14:09
diddledanif not then I'm assuming you're what "the west" is fighting against :-p14:09
mungbeani'm wondering if i got added to the group14:09
mungbeani get a lot of misaddressed email14:10
diddledan"misaddressed" can still be cause for police investigations :-p14:10
diddledan"so then mr... 'achmed'" .. "no, I'm not mr achmed, it's misaddressed. I'm mr mungbean.. honest guv"14:11
diddledanosama is still alive and is hiding in mungbean 's cellar :-p14:12
diddledanhence all the misaddressed mail14:12
mungbeani didn't even know i had a cellar14:14
diddledanthat's what the bad people _want_ you to think14:18
mungbeanwho are the bad people, again?14:27
diddledangood question.14:28
diddledanbad invariably refers to those that the establishment doesn't like14:28
diddledane.g. the bad people in syria are the rebellious mob14:29
mungbean"let's arm them all" :)14:29
mungbeanthat bin laden fella, he's against the russians, let give him all the guns he needs.14:30
diddledanthe bad people in syria from our perspective is the establishment14:30
mungbeantbh i haven't followed syria at all, gave up watching news on account of it permanently being depressing and/or talking about politic(ian)s14:31
diddledan:-)14:31
diddledansyria has told everyone it has WMDs now (chemical variety) and even showed them off to the UN14:31
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diddledanblocked ear sucks14:58
mungbeantoo scared to put olive oil in my ear when it does that15:04
mungbeanWFH def means more irc chat for me..:S15:04
diddledanI keep forgetting but I've got some of that fancy otex stuff15:05
diddledanditto15:05
mungbeanisn't that just saline?15:05
kecskebakOtex is really just Hydrogen Peroxide.15:05
mungbeanso don't get it on your hair?15:05
kecskebakWhite ear hair - very fashionable :)15:05
diddledan\o/15:06
diddledandoes it make it grow, too :-p15:06
kecskebakWhy, do you want to do a comb-over?15:06
mungbeanhttp://www.forbes.com/sites/terokuittinen/2013/09/24/nokia-admits-giving-misleading-information-about-elops-compensation/15:07
diddledan*click*15:07
mungbeanwho would be a shareholder in nokia post elop?15:08
Myrttiwell15:11
MyrttiAFAIK NSN was and is the breadwinner anyway15:11
Myrttiwhich is funny because not so long ago it was the moneyhole15:11
Myrttiyou pick is it because mobiles went down, or networks went up15:12
diddledanNSN?15:12
Myrttiformer Nokia Siemens Networks15:12
diddledanI don't know all these acronyms15:12
diddledanaaha15:12
MyrttiNokia Solutions and Networks nowadays when Siemens was bought out15:12
diddledaneven systems are undewr pressure from huawei though15:13
Myrttisure15:13
diddledanyey for the british infrastructure being run by communist hardware15:14
Myrttibut then again Huawei will not be getting big (or any) orders from USA etc.15:14
Myrttiif I've understood things right15:14
diddledanI think you're right there15:15
diddledanthough britain seems in entirely the opposite boat15:15
diddledanlarge contracts are being handed to huawei for core systems15:15
Myrttithat's just mad15:15
diddledanchinaland knows more about our internet and backend infrastructure than the people that run the stuff15:16
mungbeanallegedly15:17
Myrttiand people still are in a huff because NSN gear and solutions allow law enforcement to get information about people15:17
diddledanallegedly15:18
Myrttiof course they can15:18
diddledan:-p15:18
Myrttihaven't you seen CSI?15:18
Myrttitriangulation location etc15:18
diddledanwait, CSI is reals?15:18
diddledanare the fancy graphics they use for visualisation real too? :-p15:19
mgdmI thought the fact people triangulated off cell towers was common knowledge and farily obvious15:19
diddledanmgdm: if they didn't then the mobile network wouldn't work15:19
Myrttiit's not even a secret it's possible. People were told here only this week that the elderly should have a mobile phone with them so if they get lost it's easier to find it15:19
Myrttithem15:19
Myrttieven15:19
Myrttimgdm: so did I15:19
diddledandid anybody see the CSI where they used "photosynth" from microsoft to recreate a walkthroughable image of a crime scene based on photos downloaded off mobile phones from the time of the murd0r?15:21
mgdmsomewhat related: https://twitter.com/medialab/status/38251320194840576015:22
diddledanthat .. blew .. my .. mind15:22
diddledan:-p15:22
mgdmdiddledan: I don't watch CSI due to how wrong they are :P (Photosynth is pretty cool though)15:22
diddledanhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0suot89qXY415:23
mungbeanMS get in so many programmes15:23
mungbean(US ones)15:23
mungbeanas "sponsors"15:23
mungbeani hate product placement15:23
mungbeanwatching under the dome, and i'm saying "ok, enough MS advertising, please get on with the programme". mrs mungbean says, oh i didn't notice15:25
davmor2mgdm: oh so you watch no tv then, they are all wrong :P15:25
mgdmdavmor2: that's almost true :-) But there are degrees of wrong, and then there's "not even wrong" :)15:25
davmor2mgdm: :D15:26
diddledanI call shenanigans :-p15:26
mungbeanmade my GPG key password when my child was 2 months old. not a good idea. can't remember it15:49
SuperMattkeepassx ftw15:53
diddledanapple keyboards are awesomesauce if you don't mind the non-standard uk layout15:54
diddledanSuperMatt: I use lastpass15:54
diddledanalthough keepass sounds friendlier to my sensibilities as a FOSS advocate15:55
diddledanFOSS advocate who is currently on an OS X system15:56
mungbeani use keeppassx15:56
diddledanfull disclosure and all that15:56
mungbeanbut lack of sleep prevented me from doing the right thing15:56
diddledan>.<15:56
diddledanyeah, a 2month-old would likely cause those symptoms15:57
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mungbeanhttp://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/advice/10323191/Can-I-install-Windows-XP-on-a-new-PC.html16:05
mungbeanterrible advice16:05
SuperMattvery very bad advice16:05
mungbeanIT advice columns in the mass media are usually terrible16:06
=== alan_g|tea is now known as alan_g
mungbeanMS says: "Support for Windows XP is ending on April 8, 2014. There's no better time than now to get a new Windows 8 PC"16:06
mungbeanand post a link to buy a PC16:07
diddledan"your pc won't stop working in april" but it will stop being secure, however who cares about such trivialities as security on a home pc?!16:10
diddledan</troll?16:10
popey.. running a 13 year old OS...16:10
SuperMattfeature request: when changing the desktop background, all apps should fade out so you can see it, then fade back in for a second, or maybe a "quick hide" button which, with a single click, hides all desktop stuff and then shows everything after a couple of seconds16:11
popeyXP wasn't too bad16:11
SuperMatt7 is definitely where it's at right now16:11
mungbeanOS with compliant web browsers are where its at16:12
mungbeanfortunately16:12
SuperMatthah, very true16:12
mungbeanthanks android16:12
SuperMattwhich is basically anything with the latest firefox16:12
SuperMattbecause firefox is where it's at16:12
diddledanI'm an IE fanboi16:13
diddledanIE FTW!!16:13
diddledanmy job is >50% working on IE which means it's by far the most important browser in the world16:13
SuperMattI saw an IE video the other day, trying to get people to fall back in love with it. None of the features they showed were either 1) related to IE, or 2) IE only16:14
diddledanIE6 no more16:14
diddledanIE6 is totally gonna take over the world16:15
diddledanIE6 is teh skynets16:15
diddledan\o/16:15
diddledanI <3 IE616:15
diddledanI *stab stab* <3 IE616:16
MartijnVdSIE6? IT BURNS IT BURNS16:24
diddledananybody see this yet? http://store.steampowered.com/livingroom/SteamOS/16:36
directhexdiddledan, has anyone *not* seen it yet?16:36
diddledanI hadn't until about 10 minutes ago :-p16:36
=== MattJ100 is now known as MattJ
diddledanso what's tomorrow's announcement gonna be then? a hardware partner or two? or maybe entering the hardware ecosystem themselves?!16:41
directhexdiddledan, tomorrow is definitely talking hardware. i don't know for sure if they'll announce partners or their "own" box, but it'll definitely be announcing some specific details, not just a general "hardware will exist"16:44
popeysee the 4chan thread?16:49
popeyhttps://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-y1Q_Ww4nqyw/UkGmqcnTqfI/AAAAAAAAF4s/eHzeuymqVC4/w1549-h802-no/13+-+116:50
popeynsfw16:50
popey(if someone is reading over your shoulder)16:50
Azelphurthat first post sounds stupid16:54
Azelphur#4 is pretty wrong sounding too16:57
Azelphurpopey: yeeea, that's mostly a load of bull. :)16:58
diddledandon't you love how 4chaners try to make themselves sound all big and clever by swearing all the time like an official leak would17:02
Azelphurlol17:02
diddledanlol @ quit message over on #wordpress: Quit: There are two major products that come out of Berkeley: LSD and UNIX. We don't believe this to be a coincidence.17:03
=== schwuk is now known as schwuk_away
daftykinswhat's the cause when a system will just boot to GRUB and sit there without selecting anything? is it almost a boot failure response?17:13
daftykinsit's ruining the user experience for some HTPC setups i have in several places17:13
diddledandaftykins: I've only ever noticed it after interrupting the previous boot17:13
daftykinsyeah, it didn't come up on my clients TV so i told him to pull the power17:14
diddledandaftykins: I don't know whether it's intended behaviour or not17:14
daftykinsseems like new behaviour compared with in the past though? this is a 12.10 install *kind of*17:14
diddledanyeah it seemed to appear (anecdotal!) around the same time the menu got hidden by default17:15
daftykinshrmm17:16
daftykinsmaybe i shall try the main channel too to see if anyone knows why17:16
daftykinsi'd rather it were oblivious to prior failures so the HTPC can continue to operate in an appliance style, of course17:16
daftykinshttp://www.freshleafmedia.co.uk/blog/ubuntu-server-12-stuck-at-the-grub-boot-menu-waiting-for-key-press/2013/05/17:18
daftykinsah-har17:18
AlanBelldaftykins: that really should be a default on the server shouldn't it!17:22
daftykinsAlanBell: server?17:22
daftykinsoh for that guy's setup17:22
daftykinsindeed!17:22
AlanBellif you are installing Ubuntu Server then you want it to always reliably boot headless to networking + SSH, whatever the problem17:25
daftykinsyip17:25
daftykinsin my case it's an HTPC though, but same intention17:26
daftykinsthis could almost be considered a default configuration 'bug17:26
daftykins'17:26
AlanBellprobably17:26
AlanBellI think it is a more useful difference than the kernel clock tick speed17:27
jpdsAlanBell / daftykins: GRUB is configured to halt if the kernel failed for whatever reason beforehand.17:28
daftykinsjpds: yeah, we got that. hence the link17:29
daftykinsbut that's not really a good choice imo17:29
jpdsWhy not?17:29
jpdsWhat if the default kernel keeps panicking on boot?17:29
daftykinswhat if it doesn't :D17:30
jpdsGRUB → kernel → panic → reboot → GRUB → kernel → panic → reboot → ∞17:30
ali1234whye xactly is that a problem?17:30
daftykinsyep but in which case you know to interact with the system don't you17:30
jpdsdaftykins: Then GRUB should never appear.17:30
daftykinsbecause it's never coming up17:30
daftykinsali1234: HTPCs i have setup for clients, if the interrupt is booted, end up sat on GRUB waiting for enter to be pressed on the default kernel - it's a bit of a pain :)17:31
AlanBellpicking a different kernel would be a plausible course of action17:31
ali1234you sell linux HTPCs?17:32
AlanBellanything without a keyboard that will wait on bootup for a keypress is going to be waiting a long time17:32
ali1234the sensible thing to do would be to *check for a keyboard*17:33
directhexpress f1 to continue!17:35
daftykinsali1234: no, not sell17:35
daftykinsbut i set up a discless film collection setup for a client with 1,000+ films on DVD and otherwise17:36
AzelphurAnyone familiar with how to set up chrooted SFTP only accounts?17:36
AzelphurI'm looking at http://www.techrepublic.com/blog/linux-and-open-source/chroot-users-with-openssh-an-easier-way-to-confine-users-to-their-home-directories/ but worried it might be outdated17:36
Azelphurif I mess my SSH server up, I loose access to my box (dedicated server that I have no physical access to), so need to get it right.17:36
daftykinsi played with scponly once? didn't go as far as the chroot though17:36
daftykinstest in a VM? :)17:37
Azelphurah, I need chroot so they can only access certain areas17:37
Azelphurmaybe17:37
ali1234Azelphur: chroot has not changed17:37
Azelphurali1234: well one thing I notice is that in my /etc/ssh/sshd_config I already have a subsystem sftp line17:37
ali1234yes of course you do17:37
ali1234you have to make a new one inside the chroot17:38
Azelphurso I add a second one?17:38
ali1234actually that's not true17:38
Azelphurali1234: care to elaborate?17:41
ali1234the line tells which command to use for sftp17:41
ali1234using the internal one presumably means you don;t need to set up a real chroot17:42
AzelphurI see17:42
Azelphurali1234: so I do need to replace the existing subsystem sftp line?17:42
Azelphursince it's using /usr/lib/openssh/ftp-server17:42
ali1234this is actually what the instructions say17:42
AzelphurI'm not really understanding what they are saying, hense asking17:44
Azelphurit says either, so I guess it's either or17:44
Azelphuras I said, I'm asking because I want to be sure, rather than guess and loose access to my box.17:44
daftykinsif only you had an ace VPS like bigv.io where you can get in remotely even if networking is snafu'd17:47
Azelphurdaftykins: indeed, then I could have nowhere near enough CPU time to do what I want! :P17:47
Azelphurbut yea it'd help if we were less vague, as I say this isn't a scenario where I can learn from my mistakes.17:48
daftykinsyaaaay17:48
daftykinswell why is trialling a VM impossible to start with? then taking the lessons learnt there to the live system?17:48
Azelphurdaftykins: I guess I could, would have to install a vm software, and then a full OS, just to get an answer to a yes/no question though :p17:49
daftykinsisn't there that funky free VM spinup service online 0o17:52
daftykinsi remember the Linux Action Show talking about it17:52
* Azelphur shrugs17:52
AzelphurI guess I'll take a stab and see what happens, I have a rather ugly way of getting back in if push comes to shove.17:53
daftykins^_^17:53
ali1234dedicated servers without remote console?17:54
Azelphurali1234: yup, no remote console, if I loose access it's remote hands.17:55
ali1234that's really bad17:56
diddledanmy dedicated server (at hetzner) has a weird vkvm system that you can use to boot the installed os via a kvm layer17:56
diddledan(in case you locked yourself out)17:56
diddledanalternatively they provide time-shared console-over-ip called LARA17:57
ali1234yeah17:57
diddledanI can't complain though.. they're well priced for what theuy offer17:57
diddledangoogle+ just popped up an article by stuff mag that says : Warning: your smartphone is about to explode – scattering its parts all over you, in the form of wearable tech: http://bit.ly/1alyH7e17:59
diddledanso what do ya'll think of the galaxy gear?17:59
ali1234trans-humanism ftw18:01
diddledanyey for google undercutting itunes18:04
quantumpantsHi guys18:13
daftykinshi18:18
Azelphurhow do I set a folder such that when you create a file in it, it's automatically owned by a specific user/group?18:41
directhexAzelphur, mode +s18:42
directhexAzelphur, so g+s for files in a folder to inherit group permissions on creation18:42
Azelphurcool18:42
Azelphurdirecthex: for bonus points, writable by group?18:50
directhexAzelphur, if it's g+w and g+s, then g+w is carried18:58
Azelphurdirecthex: nope19:06
Azelphurhttp://pastebin.com/iXAQPc9f19:06
diddledanAzelphur: the file can't preexist19:09
Azelphurit doesn't, I created it on line 219:10
diddledanoic, it's the lack of +w that's the problem19:10
diddledanyour umask still applies to created files19:11
AzelphurI see, recommended way of fixing?19:11
diddledanalthough afaik that is wrong - it _should_ behave as directhex suggests19:11
diddledanyou can try setting `umask 004` (I think that's the right number19:12
Azelphurisn't 004 read, other?19:13
diddledanit's a mask, not a permission19:13
Azelphuroh ok then19:13
diddledanso you subtract from 7 to get the final value19:13
diddledanso I'm wrong - 00219:14
diddledan777 - 002 = 77519:14
Azelphurno luck :(19:15
diddledanso with that umask the file should be created with permissions 77519:15
diddledanor 664 - I'm unclear what necessitates subtracting the execute bit on files vs folders19:15
mungbeanwatching a programme that looks like its a vhs recording :-|19:29
diddledanmungbean: awesome!19:31
diddledanmungbean: livestream? :-p19:31
diddledanlet us all revel in the awesomeness that is VHS19:31
popeyI dug out my VHS player recently19:32
MartijnVdShelical tape!19:32
popeywatched an entire film on it ☻19:32
diddledanspeaking of which. I wired up my super-duper sky+HD box into my super-not-so-duper SD CRT TV19:32
diddledanI CAN HAZ TV IN BED NOW! :-p19:33
popeyWe haz no TV in bed here19:34
mungbeanah cos mt tv was in auto aspect mode19:34
popeyUnless one of us takes ipad to bed19:34
mungbeanneed to borrow a remote control with a button to revert the aspect to widescreen premananetly19:34
diddledanipad tv ftw19:34
diddledanI like that ipad was used in noun form there, popey .. not THE ipad, but ipad as an entity19:35
mgdmwe have a variety of iPads at work for testing on19:36
mgdmone of them is known as 'iGor'19:36
mgdmeg. "have you seen iGor?" "He's over there, charging" etc19:36
mungbeanwonder if my multifunction remote can emulate the aspect ratio key on an old telly..19:36
popeydiddledan: it's the correct way to refer to idevices :þ19:38
diddledan:-)19:38
daftykinsmgdm: :D19:41
daftykinsiGor has developed a hunch :(19:41
diddledanis that pronounced eye-gore or eeee-gore?19:42
mgdmeeee-gorr19:42
daftykinsAsus missed a trick there, with their Eee PC line19:45
MartijnVdSdaftykins: you know what they were made of?19:47
MartijnVdSdaftykins: Eee-ore.,19:47
diddledan*groan*19:47
diddledanpoor pooh19:47
daftykins;)19:47
popeyhmm... they don't recommend installing both disks of GTA5 on the xbox because it can't stream the textures quickly enough..20:08
popeybut my xbox360 has an SSD not spinning rust, wonder if that makes it okay.20:08
MartijnVdSpopey: I guess you could try.. but I don't know if you can uninstall just one disk?20:10
MartijnVdSPS3 \o/20:11
popeyi suspect you can uninstall it entirely20:11
MartijnVdSand then re-install just the first disk?20:11
directhexpopey, how did you get an ssd into it?20:12
popeyat the back20:13
popeythere's a drive bay20:13
directhexMartijnVdS, erm, the PSN version of gta5 is significantly worse than the blu-ray version, for exactly the same reason, showing exactly the same symptoms20:13
popeyor am I on crack?20:13
MartijnVdSdirecthex: I have the disk version20:13
popeypretty sure my 360 has an ssd in it ☻20:13
directhexMartijnVdS, point is, this isn't something the ps3 avoids20:14
MartijnVdSdirecthex: I don't have 2 disks to jockey ;)20:14
directhex360 version should probably be a bit smoother, in fact - dvd drive in 360 has higher bandwidth than blu-ray drive in ps320:14
mungbeanplaythrough of first mission in gta5 loks amazing20:14
MartijnVdSdirecthex: It's good enough for me -- finished the game a few days ago :)20:15
mungbeanwat?20:15
MartijnVdS(not 100%, but the story missions)20:15
mungbeanwow20:15
mungbeantook time off work/sleep?20:15
MartijnVdSmungbean: no, just played evenings after work from tue-fri, then all of sat, sun20:15
MartijnVdSthen I was done ;)20:15
popeyI dreamed of these kinds of games when I was a kid20:15
popeynot the violence but the freedom20:16
MartijnVdSThe very first time I saw GTA 1 in the computer game store (We had one! :)) I wanted it20:16
mgdmwhen I played GTA2 before I didn't bother with the missions, much20:16
mgdmI just toured about and occasionally wreaked havoc20:16
directhex(72 Mbit/s for 2x BD-ROM, 132.96 Mbit/s for 12x DVD)20:17
mgdmthere was a quite cool game called Armadillo Run on the PC I had, but I found it more interesting to just play with the physics than to actually complete the levels20:17
mungbeani quite enjoyed galloping around in that elder scroll game20:17
directhex(this is why in most cases, ps3 games have mandatory installs and 360 games do not)20:17
popeyyeah, i just run around being mental20:17
popeyi rarely do the missions20:17
popeyprobably why I like minecraft20:18
MartijnVdSyou'll love Trevor then ;)20:19
daftykinsheh switching into Trevor is a rollercoaster in its' own right20:19
MartijnVdSalso, the missions aren't as annoying anymore, they have checkpoints at sane intevals20:19
MartijnVdS+r20:19
daftykinsand they're fun too!20:19
MartijnVdSdaftykins: well, some are less fun than others (*cough*Chop*cough*)20:20
daftykinshah20:20
daftykinsi don't own an Apple device to get at it so far =/20:20
daftykinswaiting for the Android release20:20
popeytrevor?20:20
MartijnVdSneither do I, and I hate dogs IRL too :P20:20
popeyoh, one of the characters20:20
daftykinsyes sir20:21
daftykinsMartijnVdS: oh? bitten as a child? :)20:21
popeygotcha20:21
popeyi have been watching "lets play" videos of GTA520:21
popeyso I don't need to do the missions ☻20:21
MartijnVdSdaftykins: Nah, dogs are too needy imho.20:21
MartijnVdSpopey: you do, to unlock stuff :)20:21
daftykinsagreed20:22
MartijnVdSpopey: yes you can cheat, but where's the fun in that20:22
daftykins^ yeah you need to make some progress so you get access to cool things20:22
MartijnVdSpopey: also, you need to play missions to be able to play as all characters20:22
popeydifferent people have different ideas of what "fun" means20:22
mungbeanmowed the lawn for autumn today. hope i don't have to go out there again20:22
daftykinsi'd say planes are always fun20:22
mungbeani find missions quite stressful20:23
MartijnVdSmungbean: they're better than in older GTAs, the checkpoints (and 3 fails = skippable checkpoint) make it work20:24
daftykinsor you could get good :(20:24
MartijnVdSdaftykins: I haven't skipped a checkpoint yet, just noticed the option20:25
mungbeani haven't played since i sold my ps2 (hence vice city)20:25
daftykinsyeah i'm just commenting on the way the games are holding hands more20:25
MartijnVdSvice city was the worst20:25
mungbeani had gta3 and nice city20:25
daftykinsMartijnVdS: what makes you say that?20:25
MartijnVdS"Drive across 3 islands and kill this man. Now drive across 3 more islands kill another man and lose the police"20:26
popeyPrincess Robot Bubblegum20:26
MartijnVdSOh with a time limit20:26
daftykinspopey: :D perversion extreme \o/20:26
mungbeanthe time limits are the stress20:26
mungbeanon the ds its crazy20:26
popeywhich ds game?20:27
daftykinsthere have always been two major things i detest in gaming20:27
daftykins1) time limits20:27
daftykins2) protection missions20:27
daftykinsChinatown Wars i expect20:27
daftykins(GTA)20:27
mungbeanyep20:27
popeyi think i have that20:27
daftykinsmungbean: are you liking it aside from that?20:27
mungbeanhelp charlie chan win the race by blocking hte other cars20:27
MartijnVdSracing missions *urgh*20:27
mungbeani do like it but its stressy20:27
daftykinshaha20:28
shaunoescort missions wouldn't big me so much, if the dummy made any effort to stay close / keep up / act like its on my side20:28
shaunoer, *bug20:28
daftykinsthat's where lies the rub :D20:28
shaunoreformed WoW addict.  escorts were one of those things that make collecting spiders legs look fun20:29
mungbeanthere's blokes playing football on the field every night on te field outside..its pitch dark out20:30
MartijnVdSfootball pitch dark!20:30
daftykinsXD20:31
mungbeani was lying in bed hearing thump thump20:32
mungbeansaid to missis, thats football being kicked20:32
mungbeanshe's like naaah20:32
directhexthere are worse things than racing missions20:32
directhexthere are worse things than escort quests20:32
directhexand there are worse things than time limits20:32
directhexthere is... mandatory in-game poker20:32
mungbean?20:33
mungbeanredhot poker?20:33
directhexstory mission: win at poker20:33
MartijnVdSdirecthex: police quest 120:33
directhexsee also: dead rising 2, red dead redemption, far cry 320:33
mungbeaniron lord20:34
mungbeanhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WLe5mxCdGZc20:36
daftykinsdirecthex: that must've been rigged to be easy though because i passed the RDR one first time20:38
daftykins>:D20:38
=== o_0 is now known as Guest28410
directhexdaftykins, rdr one?21:29
daftykinspoker game21:31
bigcalmCat has found my pack of Tesco "Ultimate Granola" and wants in. What a strange cat I have21:39
daftykins:D21:43
bigcalmAnybody here successfully running CM on their Xoom?21:43
popeypeople bought xooms? ☻21:44
* bigcalm kippers popey :P21:45
diddledan:-p21:48
popeywish I knew why my windows pc wont sleep21:48
bigcalmpopey: too much coffee21:49
bigcalmIs it its birthday tomorrow? Might be too excited to sleep21:49
bigcalmI know I would be (if I cared about such events)21:49
diddledanso.. the question which I seem to ask myself every 3 months or so, I'm asking yet again.. do I go wholesale ubuntu on eeveerything to the extent of removing os x from my macbook and so forth?! obviously I'm staying android on my galaxynexus/nexus7 and ios on my iphone/ipad because the alternatives either don't exist (ios) or aren't ready yet (nexae)21:52
daftykinsit's always handy to keep OS X on for firmware updates though21:53
diddledantrue dat21:53
* popey stabs windows21:56
daftykinspopey: maybe you set it up wrong :(21:59
popeyriiiight21:59
diddledandaftykins: of course he did, it's windows21:59
daftykins:D21:59
popeyhow exactly does one setup suspend wrong21:59
daftykinsthe OS not the function21:59
daftykinsday-um21:59
daftykinsbut i jested from the outset, so no need to be all srs bsns22:00
popeywell, I couldn't tell that could I22:00
daftykinsguess not :(22:00
popeywas hoping for some help22:00
popeynever mind22:00
daftykinsoh right22:00
daftykinsso what's it doing?22:00
diddledanpopey: fwiw I've never had windows work properly with suspenders22:00
daftykinsgoes away and doesn't come back? or fails to stay down?22:01
popeypress suspend button, screen goes dark, then logon screen comes back22:01
popeydoesn't actually suspend22:01
daftykinsany messages in the event log?22:01
diddledanwhy can't microsoft use text files for the event log - much easier than trying to figure out their antiquated search system22:01
popeynope22:02
popeydiddledan: see systemd and the new world order on linux22:02
daftykinshmm, odd to not have gotten a power management entry22:02
diddledanpopey: don't tell me even linux is moving away from flat text files?!22:02
daftykinsi'd ignore any hardware buttons and use the start menu function to be sure?22:02
popeytried that too22:02
popeydaftykins: for system log, yes22:03
diddledanoh ffs22:03
diddledanWHY?!22:03
popeyhttps://docs.google.com/a/popey.com/document/pub?id=1IC9yOXj7j6cdLLxWEBAGRL6wl97tFxgjLUEHIX3MSTs&pli=122:03
popeyits already done on fedora22:03
daftykinsis this 7?22:04
popeyyes22:04
directhexAzelphur, Asicminer block erupter USB - useful for anything?22:04
Azelphurdirecthex: I wouldn't buy one right now22:04
daftykinspopey: hmmph, did you wipe the factory install so this is a custom one? no manufacturer power management related gubbins to install?22:05
popeyits a pretty clean install yeah22:06
popeyno factory gubbins22:06
popeywonder if it needs some chipset driver from the mobo vendor22:06
daftykinsnot if it's intel based22:06
daftykinsintel INFs don't tend to do too much other than rename components in device manager22:06
daftykinsalthough, i've noticed modern ultrabooks that make use of the Intel RST (rapid storage tech.) drivers sometimes use a dedicated hibernation (i know you're suspending not hibernating) partition to write the RAM contents to22:08
* popey installs cpu-z to find out what mobo is in this22:08
popeywould be faster to reboot to linux ☻22:08
directhexAzelphur, for free?22:09
Azelphurdirecthex: for free, dunno, what's the hashrate on those again?22:09
directhexum, 366?22:09
popeyaha, MSI H61M22:09
daftykinspopey: the intel installer is one for all these days22:09
popeyooh, bios updates too22:10
popeylots of stuff to download22:10
daftykins;)22:10
daftykinsah desktop?22:11
popeyya22:11
directhexi wish i had beelions of pounds. i could afford a new pc!22:11
popeymy "gaming" machine22:11
daftykins:>22:11
daftykinsi nearly upgraded, decided to delay again22:11
popeycan't see myself buying anything new22:11
popeymaybe new GPU if the one I have isn't up to GTAV22:12
directhexi guess this system isn't quite as i originally built it22:12
daftykinsyeah nothing is really worth going up to for me, from a core 2 quad22:12
directhexgeforce 260 -> 660, +ssd22:12
directhex6 -> 12 GB ram22:12
popeyooh, ram yes22:12
directhexcpu is oooold though22:12
popeythats a good point22:12
popey8-> 16GB22:12
* daftykins pats his DDR2 systems22:13
directhexi7 920. it was high end when i got it!22:13
popeyooh, bios update from A.80 to C.3022:13
popeyMust be good!22:13
directhexbut to date the system... vista cd key stuck to the case22:13
daftykinsmy file server has a funky board with DDR2 and 3 slots, but you could fit only as much in DDR3 as currently is in as DDR222:13
daftykinspopey: that's quite the code change D:22:13
daftykinsis it really the one?22:13
popeyya22:14
popeyhttp://uk.msi.com/product/mb/H61M-E33--B3-.html#/?div=BIOS22:14
popeyhmm22:15
popeyit's rebooted 4 times now22:15
popeyphew, bios update screen22:15
daftykins:D22:15
popeywonder what magic this brings, maybe suspend will work :D22:15
daftykins\o/22:15
* daftykins has a peruse through the downloads page22:15
popeyhaha, new bootsplash22:16
daftykins^_^ i disable those22:16
popeyMSI - TOP QUALITY & STABILITY22:16
popey    MAINBOARD22:17
daftykinsbtw any devices in device manager lacking their drivers?22:17
popeyah excellent. Boot error22:17
popeyprobably the usb key22:17
daftykinsor it probably reset SATA mode22:17
daftykinsi'd definitely load defaults after an update, old school style22:17
popey\o/ grub22:17
popeypffft22:17
popeystraight to windows!22:17
popeywell, it boots, so that's a start :D22:18
daftykins^_^22:18
popeyooh, windows wants to change (probably driver detection I imagine)22:19
popeythis is all very exciting22:19
popeyyeah, 4th time seeing that bootsplash. needs to go ☻22:20
popeygosh lots of driver updates on the msi website22:20
daftykinsi tend to get things straight from the manufacturer, they're always so out of date on mobo sites22:21
popeythese aren't too bad22:21
popey2013-08-1922:21
popeyfor the VGA driver22:21
popeythats probably newer than the linux one ㋛22:21
daftykinshehe22:21
popey(which is shit)22:21
* popey tests suspend first22:21
popeybah22:22
daftykinsis anything lacking drivers in device manager though? the intel management engine is a common one22:22
popeyno, they're there22:23
popeyjust 2 years old ☻22:23
daftykinshrmmz22:23
popeywell this isnt right22:23
popeythe vga driver it offered me to download is ivy bridge22:24
daftykinsi think they're all in one too22:24
daftykinsat least, from intel22:24
* popey installs22:25
AlanBellhttp://www.bbc.co.uk/newsbeat/24220206 the news that matters22:33
daftykinsindeed22:34
daftykinsthankfully i have yet to spend my virtual moneys on virtual cars22:34
daftykins:>22:34
popeytwo more drivers to do22:37
popeyaudio and lan22:37
popeywould be funny to buy a steambox in pcworld or currys22:38
popeyassuming top 5 hw manufacturers make them22:39
popeybah, still no suspend22:42
popey~130 quid for 16GB RAM22:45
popeywat! you can buy 960GB SSDs now!22:46
popey~450 quid22:46
popeydirecthex: oi oi. are there many games in steam which still use air?22:55
popeyI'm sure I bought one from the humble bundle a while back22:55
bigcalmNice23:11
* popey suspends the same desktop under linux.. no problem ☹23:26
daftykins:(23:27
daftykinsin fairness it's usually the other way around :D23:31
* bigcalm slithers off to sleep23:32
bigcalmToodles23:32
* bigcalm tries sleeping this machine for a giggle23:32
shaunoI had a laptop that did that for a while.  it'd suspend-to-disk but wouldn't resume-from-disk.  ugh.23:32
popeydaftykins: well exactly!23:32
* popey sleeps this one too23:33
popeynn all23:33
popeywonder if mosh will carry on in the morning23:33
popeywe'll see23:33
daftykinsyep i'm off too23:35
daftykinsnn all o/23:35
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