[02:22] <Noskcaj> Can we get one of the xubuntu members as an admin on the xubuntu sub-reddit? Then we could get a flair like the ubuntu subrddit
[02:23] <pleia2> I won't go near reddit, so if someone else wants to they are welcome to
[02:24] <GridCube> i don't understand reddit
[02:24] <GridCube> it makes no friggin sense
[02:25] <Unit193> Man that site can be funnah. :D
[02:26] <Unit193> Not looked at any subs on there for a while though.
[02:27] <Noskcaj> GridCube, It's one of the best (and if well used, best for promotion) websites. It is difficult to learn though
[02:27] <Noskcaj> pleia2, I could try and contact the mods. I'm looking into a similar thing for kubuntu and lubuntu
[03:46]  * skellat notes far too late that he outright abandoned reddit as he found little use for it in the end game as it was full of...nothing...
=== brainwash_ is now known as brainwash
[11:11] <brainwash> ochosi: regarding the greeter -> xfce transition, http://git.xfce.org/xfce/xfwm4/tree/src/compositor.c#n806
[11:12] <brainwash> ochosi: you can build xfwm4 with MONITOR_ROOT_PIXMAP defined
[11:12] <brainwash> ochosi: I'll test it and report any drawbacks 
[12:17] <brainwash> the xfce4-panel app menu is able to scale pixmap icon files properly (now), but the xfdesktop app menu still isn't
[12:18] <brainwash> it also does not display the missing-icon-file symbol
[12:19] <brainwash> strnage inconsistency
[12:39] <ochosi> yeah, separate menus
[12:40] <ochosi> brainwash: i'm very interested to hear about that xfwm4 thingy
[13:41] <brainwash> ochosi: I don't notice any change
[13:43] <brainwash> ochosi: I even compiled it a second time after editing the source file directly
[14:28] <ochosi> brainwash: hm, right, well xfdesktop's maintainer is aware of the issue
[14:33] <brainwash> ochosi: of what? the general issue?
[14:34] <ochosi> the slow startup of xfdesktop
[14:34] <brainwash> and the missing pixmap scaling?
[14:34] <brainwash> did you talk to him/her?
[14:36] <brainwash> (you can test it with gcolor2 for example)
[14:39] <ochosi> missing pixmap scaling?
[14:40] <ochosi> (there's just been the first 4.11 release of the desktop today, btw)
[14:44] <brainwash> install gcolor2, right-click the desktop > app menu > graphics
[14:46] <ochosi> that menu is gone in 4.11
[14:47] <ochosi> (which is what i'm using atm)
[14:47] <ochosi> so you have to be more concrete with the pixmap scaling issue
[14:47] <brainwash> gone?!
[14:47] <ochosi> yeah, there's only the app-menu
[14:48] <brainwash> what I'm trying to tell you is, that xfdesktop is still affected by bug 1061037
[14:48] <ubottu> bug 1061037 in gdk-pixbuf (Ubuntu) "Using .xpm icons on desktop may draw huge icon" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1061037
[14:48] <ochosi> aha
[14:49] <brainwash> the normal panel menu isn't anymore
[14:49] <ochosi> true
[14:50] <brainwash> I guess we simply ignore this :)
[14:50] <ochosi> well xpm icons are very retro ;)
[14:50] <ochosi> but yeah, it should be fixed at some point
[14:50] <ochosi> ideally for 4.12
[14:51] <brainwash> and only few apps ship a launcher with full path xpm icon specified in their .desktop file
[14:51] <brainwash> IDLE, gcolor2, gnome disk analyzer
[14:52] <ochosi> are there bugreports for those apps upstream?
[14:52] <ochosi> (or are all of them still maintained?)
[14:55] <brainwash> don't fix the apps, fix the broken app menu :D
[14:55] <brainwash> which will be gone soon anyway :/
[14:56] <ochosi> no, that app-menu is still there
[14:57] <ochosi> there were 2 variants in the 4.10 desktop-menu
[14:58] <brainwash> ah, so 1 menu implementation remains
[14:58] <brainwash> for both
[14:58] <ochosi> one that was solely for apps and one that had some desktop-specific stuff
[14:58] <ochosi> now there's only the one for apps
[14:58] <ochosi> at least as far as i can say
[15:16] <brainwash> ochosi: should I file the bug report about the non smooth greeter -> desktop transition against xfwm4, xfdesktop, xfce4-session or xubuntu-meta?
[15:17] <ochosi> i'm not sure :}
[15:26] <Pwnna> it must be said
[15:26] <Pwnna> ubuntu 13.10 is stil lreally unstable :P
[15:50] <brainwash> Pwnna: what exactly is unstable?
[15:51] <Pwnna> everything
[15:51] <elfy> nope
[15:51] <elfy> not so here
[15:51] <Pwnna> cannot go to sleep. if i play video games for a while (couple minutes), my computer will slow down and frame rate drops by about 60%. 
[15:51] <Pwnna> no reason either, there's no overheating and such
[15:52] <elfy> I assume you've posted bugs where appropriate
[15:52] <Pwnna> not a lot of logs. the only thing i can see is this: https://bugzilla.kernel.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53571 but that's related to lock up
[15:52] <ubottu> bugzilla.kernel.org bug 53571 in Video(DRI - Intel) "[fdo:54226] stale bcs->rcs semaphore" [Normal,New]
[15:52] <Pwnna> elfy: i don't have logs..
[15:52] <Pwnna> like. nothing in the logs
[15:53] <Pwnna> bluetooth mouse does not reconnect like it did in 13.04
[15:53] <elfy> ubuntu-bug blueman
[15:54] <Pwnna> but i don't have logs.. so like it's like saying.  hey my bluetooth requires me to manually reconnect sometimes, not all the time. also i don't have logs
[15:54] <Pwnna> in 13.04 it worked! 
[15:54] <Pwnna> that kinda bug report is not really useful :3
[15:54] <elfy> ubuntu-bug blueman
[15:55] <elfy> and saying 'everything is unstable' is useful?
[15:55] <Pwnna> it's not
[15:55] <Pwnna> i was hoping someone can help me get logs
[15:55] <Pwnna> the graphics/processing issue is the critical one
[15:55] <Pwnna> but i can't get any logs
[15:56] <Pwnna> i can reproduce everytime
[15:58] <elfy> then report it - use ubuntu-bug and it'll grab what it needs afaik - then watch the bug and see if anything else is required
[16:03] <Pwnna> well for the graphics one idk what the component maybe
[16:03] <Pwnna> it might be the kernel, mesa, idk
[16:03] <brainwash> there are plenty of log files located in /var/log
[16:03] <Pwnna> nothing relating to the grapics issue.
[16:04] <Pwnna> other than that bug that i found upstream, but that one is a) relating to lockups (which it did on my system) and b) present for a long time, but didn't show before. so i doubt that whatever is happening now is related to that..?
[16:06] <elfy> Pwnna: so what grpahics card is it 
[16:06] <Pwnna> happens on both my intel HD 3000 and the nvidia card
[16:07] <Pwnna> i think that one is quadro 4200
[16:07] <elfy> so how long has this been going on then with saucy?
[16:07] <Pwnna> ever since i upgraded to it
[16:07] <elfy> right 
[16:08] <elfy> I'm not psychic enough to be able to guess when that was
[16:08] <Pwnna> oh. 4 days ago
[16:08] <brainwash> can you still boot one of the raring kernels or are they gone already?
[16:08] <Pwnna> i see stack traces... probably relating to the sleep issue
[16:08] <Pwnna> brainwash: gone
[16:10] <brainwash> not sure, if this is the right channel for this kind of issue
[16:10] <brainwash> does not seem to be xubuntu specific
[16:11] <brainwash> did you already ask in #ubuntu+1?
[16:11] <elfy> Pwnna: you might well find someone who can help in #ubuntu+1
[16:12] <Pwnna> yeah
[16:12] <Pwnna> maybe
[16:44] <brainwash> Notice(queuebot): Unapproved: rejected libxfce4ui [sync] (saucy-proposed) [4.10.0-4]
[16:48] <elfy> saw that ... 
[16:50] <elfy> brainwash: confirmed thge xfwm4 bug
[16:51] <ochosi> what xfwm4 bug?
[16:51] <brainwash> more like a wishlist thingy
[16:51] <elfy> the one you two were talking about earlier - "If the built-in compositor is enabled, xfwm4 will draw a plain grey background over the lightdm greeter background on session login"
[16:52] <brainwash> bug 1232804
[16:52] <ubottu> bug 1232804 in xfwm4 (Ubuntu) "[compositing] improve login greeter -> desktop transition" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1232804
[16:53] <ochosi> ah ok
[16:54] <ochosi> yeah, as i said, not sure what component this bug should actually be filed against
[16:54] <brainwash> did some more code hacking, but no success so far
[16:54] <ochosi> have you tried enabling the splash-screen?
[16:54] <ochosi> i mean the xfce-splash-screen
[16:54] <brainwash> no, isn't that some ancient stuff?
[16:55] <brainwash> and could it help?
[16:55] <ochosi> well, it might still help to create a custom splash-screen that shows the user's wallpaper
[16:55] <ochosi> for me it's hard to test anyway, the ssd makes the session load very quickly, so i don't see your bug
[16:56] <brainwash> compositing enabled?
[16:56] <ochosi> yup
[16:56] <ochosi> i also use autologin
[16:56] <ochosi> that might contribute
[16:56] <brainwash> yea
[16:58] <brainwash> it's just an idea for the next milestone
[16:59] <elfy> maybe tag it brainwash 
[16:59] <elfy> though it might be useful to sort out an official xubuntu tag of some sort
[16:59] <brainwash> don't know how
[17:00] <brainwash> or which tag
[17:02] <elfy> no idea how to create a new one - we were talking about this the other day 
[17:02] <elfy> or at least someone and me was lol
[17:03] <skellat> We got libxfce4ui rejected in queue.  Somebody may need to pop over to #ubuntu-release to discuss that.
[17:13] <ochosi> what version of libxfce4ui is that and why was it uploaded?
[17:13] <ochosi> connected to a bugreport?
[17:13] <ochosi> brainwash: just to add that, xfwm4 is not currently in active development
[17:13] <ochosi> at least not really
[17:15] <brainwash> bug 1228731
[17:15] <ubottu> bug 1228731 in libxfce4ui (Ubuntu) "[FFe] Sync libxfce4ui 4.10.0-4 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1228731
[17:15] <elfy> ochosi:  connected with bug 1055407 and bug 1198746
[17:15] <ubottu> bug 346386 in apt (Ubuntu Precise) "duplicate for #1055407 [MASTER] Update fails with invalid package files with "Encountered a section with no Package: header"" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/346386
[17:15] <ubottu> bug 1198746 in libxfce4ui (Ubuntu) "Drop /usr/share/xfce4/vendorinfo" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1198746
[17:16] <elfy> bug 1054407 
[17:16] <ubottu> bug 1054407 in xfce4-screenshooter (Ubuntu) "xfhelp4 is not installed" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1054407
[17:16] <elfy> I mean :)
[17:16] <ochosi> ah right
[17:16] <ochosi> xfhelp stuff
[17:16] <elfy> yup
[19:41] <Unit193> xnox: Howdy.  Do you know where I should go for questions with ubiquiry and casper?
[20:12] <Noskcaj> hey mr_pouit 
[20:19] <mr_pouit> hey Noskcaj 
[20:20] <Noskcaj> xfwm4 just got merged and libxfce4ui will be synced very soon
[22:05] <xnox> Unit193: #ubuntu-installer
[22:32] <brainwash> any idea, how I could debug bug 1206739 ?
[22:32] <ubottu> bug 1206739 in xfce4-terminal (Ubuntu) "xfce4-terminal crashed with SIGSEGV in magazine_chain_pop_head()" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1206739
[22:36] <Noskcaj> brainwash, install the -dev and -dbg packages for it if they exist, then run it from a terminal (with debug enabled, if possible). That's at least where to start
[22:38] <brainwash> sadly no debug mode available, and running it from another terminal window will instantly crash both when the bug gets triggered
[22:39] <brainwash> running it from a different terminal app will freeze the session (partially)
[22:40] <Noskcaj> brainwash, maybe add "| tee FILENAME" at the end to get the logs (where FILENAME is whatever you want), but i assume the logs get recorded anyway
[22:40] <brainwash> well, actually it does freeze the session completely, a working cursor does not help that much :)
[22:42] <brainwash> tee redirects only stdout
[22:42] <brainwash> I'll try it
[23:00] <ochosi> brainwash: i think the most effective thing you can do is file a bug upstream
[23:00] <ochosi> or check whether there's already one
[23:01] <ochosi> and as soon as NSchermer is around again, you can ask him whether he can reproduce it
[23:01] <ochosi> but it's possibly ubuntu-specific
[23:02] <brainwash> maybe it needs to be rebuilt against a recent version of glib
[23:03] <brainwash> I want to improve my debugging skills... but thus particular bug is strange
[23:03] <brainwash> this
[23:11] <brainwash> ochosi: are there any Xfce (core) developers which are also members of the Xubuntu team?
[23:17] <ochosi> not really
[23:17] <ochosi> bluesabre, mr_pouit and me contributed a bit to the display settings
[23:18] <ochosi> but at the moment there aren't even that many core devs of xfce
[23:22] <brainwash> ok :/
[23:22] <brainwash> I guess they could need some man power for the gtk3 transition
[23:23] <brainwash> and wayland support
[23:24] <ochosi> indeed
[23:24] <ochosi> feel free to start contributing!
[23:25] <ochosi> or even start to motivate/recruit others ;)
[23:26] <brainwash> I'm trying to get started, but the source code seems be quite complex and it's not easy to understand what's going on :)
[23:27] <brainwash> and the whole api mess
[23:27] <brainwash> hundreds of different apis
[23:30] <ochosi> trying to fix bugs is always a good start