[05:17] <pitti> Good morning
[08:04] <Laney> goooooooood morning
[08:06] <sil2100> Morning Laney, larsu, seb128!
[08:08] <seb128> good morning desktopers
[08:08] <seb128> hey sil2100
[08:09] <Laney> hey
[08:09] <seb128> Laney, hey, how are you?
[08:09] <larsu> sil2100: morning!
[08:10] <Laney> seb128: yeah not bad thanks, quiet evening last night
[08:10] <Laney> you?
[08:10] <Laney> hey larsu sil2100
[08:10]  * larsu waves to Laney 
[08:16] <seb128> Laney, I'm good thanks, I did some sport in the evening and had a good night of sleep then ;-)
[08:17] <mlankhorst> morning
[08:24] <Laney> mlankhorst!
[08:26] <mlankhorst> laney!
[08:26]  * Laney flashes some gang signs
[08:26] <Laney> what up homie
[08:27] <Laney> (so urban)
[08:27] <mlankhorst> not bad
[08:27] <mlankhorst> played too much gta5? :P
[08:28] <Laney> haha, I don't have a console :(
[08:28] <Laney> maybe it's because I want to play it badly
[08:28] <mlankhorst> ofc you do
[08:28] <Laney> preordered a ps4 though
[08:31] <Laney> seb128: so I got asked to make sure that removing eds-uoa is OK for touch
[08:31] <baptistem_> heya
[08:32] <mlankhorst> I'm waiting for the steam thing :P
[08:32] <Laney> seb128: I'm guessing so because they never installed -goa without which the stuff is broken anyway
[08:32] <Laney> is that fair to say?
[08:34] <seb128> Laney, yes
[08:35] <Laney> cool
[08:35] <Laney> stgraber: ^^^^
[08:35] <seb128> Laney, as Ken said last week during the meeting, e-d-s is not doing calendar sync anyway, you need evosync for that
[08:35] <seb128> so you would need data all the time to use the calendar, even if it was working
[08:35] <seb128> Laney, you scared him away :p
[08:35] <Laney> haha
[08:36] <Laney> yeah they use syncevolution I think
[08:37] <Laney> stgraber: ^ in case you didn't get the previous ping
[08:39] <Laney> wait what
[08:39] <Laney> damn, doesn't reproduce
[08:39] <seb128> Laney, reproduce what?
[08:39] <Laney> I just saw www-data on my lightdm user list
[08:40] <seb128> Laney, is it showing up in the session indicator or the g-c-c panel?
[08:40] <seb128> they all use accountsservices to get the users' list I think
[08:40] <Laney> nope
[08:40] <seb128> weird
[08:40] <Laney> some transient thing, weird
[08:40] <Laney> also do you get a bug sometimes where you have no mouse cursor?
[08:40] <seb128> I don't
[08:41] <Laney> i get it maybe 5% of the time
[08:41] <seb128> weird
[08:41] <seb128> is it showing on some apps and not others?
[08:41] <seb128> or just missing?
[08:41] <Laney> no
[08:41] <seb128> is that after a vt switch?
[08:41] <Laney> well, let me try firefox or something
[08:41] <Laney> just invisible
[08:41] <Laney> it's straight after logging in
[08:41] <seb128> I never saw that then...
[08:42] <Laney> hmm
[08:50] <seb128> Laney, how did you create the tzdata tarball? I looked at that update some days ago but I decided to skip it because I was not sure I wouldn't end up with an orig.tar.gz different from Debian
[08:50] <Laney> uscan
[08:50] <seb128> oh, ok
[08:50] <seb128> I manually download, untared and got a flat list of files
[08:51] <seb128> which made me go "ok, let's wait for Debian"
[08:51] <Laney> haha
[08:51] <seb128> Laney, thanks for doing the update btw ;-)
[08:51] <Laney> dpkg-source or whatever it is takes care of putting it in a directory for you
[08:51] <Laney> I don't know how/when we decide to SRU those updates though
[08:51] <seb128> Laney, did you look at the diff? is there any fix that we should try to get in stable series?
[08:52] <seb128> well, ideally we would just update
[08:52] <Laney> some of the changes are for quite near future things
[08:52] <seb128> especially if there is a change that impacts a coming DST rule
[08:52] <seb128> yeah, would be good to SRU on all series then
[08:52] <seb128> that has a standing exception for SRUs
[08:53] <Laney> e.g. http://mm.icann.org/pipermail/tz-announce/2013-September/000013.html http://mm.icann.org/pipermail/tz-announce/2013-October/000015.html
[08:54] <seb128> Laney, the second one seems to suggest we are already off for Morocco?
[08:54] <seb128> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/tzdata/+bug/1233054
[08:54] <ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1233054 in tzdata (Ubuntu) "Moroccan DST time change needs upgrade after being extended" [Undecided,New]
[08:54] <Laney> could well be
[08:55] <Laney> I can do that SRU
[09:19] <Riddell> what's the ubuntu desktop programme to set up user accounts these days?
[09:29] <seb128> Riddell, gnome-control-center
[10:21] <seb128> Laney, so I just had an UI review of settings with the UI designers and they asked to drop the colon from section headers ... do you have an opinion on whether we should do it or push back for translation reasons?
[10:30] <Laney> seb128: will we get fuzzy strings and are those still displayed?
[10:30] <Laney> also I just noticed we have an empty Security section in Security & Privacy
[10:30] <seb128> Laney, yes, it's my list as well
[10:31] <Laney> I think we should breaking translations unnecessarily as not a "fix" at this point
[10:32] <Laney> do it next cycle, assuming it does break them
[10:32] <Laney> s/should/should count/
[10:33] <seb128> Laney, fuzzy are not used indeed
[10:33] <seb128> Laney, http://paste.ubuntu.com/6208778/
[10:33] <seb128> Laney, that's my notes from that hangout I just had
[10:34] <seb128> Laney, I'm working on doing the "use headers rather than single list item" atm, I'm a bit unsure about the rounded optionselector stuff, I'm going to give that a try next
[10:34] <seb128> Laney, btw, http://ubuntuone.com/1DapfTL5unqLohs7hTQAqv for playing with it
[10:34] <seb128> Laney, they like the middle one better but it makes the headers not aligned, I'm going to ping them again about that
[10:35] <Laney> what does that one use?
[10:35] <seb128> the middle one?
[10:35] <Laney> yeah
[10:35] <seb128> OptionSelector rather than ListItem.ItemSelector
[10:35] <Laney> does that have a header thing?
[10:35] <seb128> they are basically the same widget
[10:35] <seb128> yes, the middle version is using the OptionSelector text:
[10:35] <Laney> I see
[10:36] <Laney> I'm confused about the role of design
[10:36] <seb128> the right one is using a ListItem.Header and then an OptionSelector without text
[10:36] <Laney> was this with mpt or someone else?
[10:36] <seb128> it was the guys who sent me the visual assets
[10:36] <seb128> Laney, Jouni Helminen and Matt Stevens
[10:37] <Laney> some overlap in responsibilities?
[10:37] <seb128> Laney, I think mpt is doing interaction design and those guys do visual design
[10:37] <seb128> e.g they are the one telling about pixels and stuff looking right
[10:37] <seb128> mpt, ^ is that true?
[10:38] <Laney> where you have "Use headers from SDK" in sound - what does that mean? And that should apply to all panels presumably
[10:38] <Laney> I guess ListItem.Header but I thought we didn't use that deliberately
[10:38] <seb128> it means using ListItem.Header for the titles
[10:38] <seb128> and yes
[10:39] <seb128> Laney, right, seems there is argument between designers...
[10:42] <Laney> mmm, sounds like fun
[10:44] <seb128> Laney, yeah :/
[10:49] <seb128> Laney, which one do you like better in those 4?
[10:49] <seb128> http://ubuntuone.com/1DapfTL5unqLohs7hTQAqv
[10:49] <seb128> http://ubuntuone.com/2ztVRx0uaM67gKAZl8jmKd
[10:50] <Laney> what does Header look like for TimeZone?
[10:50] <Laney> does that line up with the header of the OptionSelector?
[10:51] <Laney> I mean "Time zone:"
[10:51] <seb128> Laney, you mean?
[10:51] <seb128> you have the screenshots
[10:51] <Laney> or is that what it is?
[10:52] <Laney> did you change that one already?
[10:52] <seb128> well, we have those 4 screenshots basically
[10:52] <seb128> I've the 4 versions that are displayed in those urls I just gave you
[10:52] <seb128> http://ubuntuone.com/2ztVRx0uaM67gKAZl8jmKd seems best to me
[10:52] <Laney> yes
[10:52] <seb128> design seems fine with that ... does it work for you?
[10:52] <Laney> I'm wondering if the "Time zone:" text is a Header there
[10:52] <seb128> I'm not sure what you are asking
[10:52] <seb128> yes
[10:53] <seb128> "Time zone:" and "Set the time and date:" both are headers in that version
[10:53] <seb128> I moved the optionselector title out of the selector to a separate ListItem.Header
[10:54] <Laney> I like the ones with the OptionSelector
[10:54] <Laney> can you do showDivider: false on the header to make it look like #2 but aligned?
[10:55] <Laney> maybe that doesn't exist for Header
[10:55] <Laney> otherwise your preferred one looks ok but we should change all headers at the same time
[10:55] <davmor2> seb128: can I just say 2 things,  1-2 with the spacing are way nicer,  why isn't all of the page translated to french it seems odd to me that only sections are :)
[10:56] <seb128> Laney, we can't turn off the divider for header I think, I tried, it doesn't work (raise an error)
[10:56] <Laney> I like the extra spacing too
[10:56] <seb128> Laney, http://developer.ubuntu.com/api/ubuntu-12.10/qml/mobile/qml-ubuntu-components-listitems0-header-members.html
[10:56] <Laney> but that's what the SDK headers are like
[10:56] <Laney> so ...
[10:56] <seb128> yeah
[10:57] <Laney> Could make the same argument in favour of #2 though really
[10:57] <seb128> davmor2, I took a english screenshot, but setting LANG just made the strings be english not the values returned
[10:57] <Laney> Although it does affect the last Standard
[10:57] <Laney> so maybe it's a bit different
[10:57] <seb128> Laney, well, 2 has the issue that the headers are not aligned
[10:58] <davmor2> seb128: oh interesting :)
[10:58] <seb128> Laney, davmor2: the design guys to use headers, because we want a headers to look different, and they have a point, some of the flat lists are a bit non trivial to parse
[10:58] <seb128> they said that if Headers look wrong we should fix them in the SDK
[10:58] <seb128> which is going to make the app look fine then
[10:58] <Laney> sure
[10:58] <seb128> which makes sense
[10:59] <Laney> The question is if "Set time and date:" is a header because it affects sensitivity of the last item or if it just refers to the OptionSelector in which case maybe it doesn't matter that it's not aligned
[11:00] <seb128> well, I think that the issue, with the middle option, is that it looks like the optionselector is part of the "Time zone:" section
[11:00] <seb128> and that there is only one section
[11:01] <seb128> when it's not... and it's weird to have "Time zone:" if it's the only section
[11:01] <Laney> yeah, so maybe have another section called "Time and Date:"
[11:01] <seb128> that starts being lot of change for the day before the freeze
[11:01] <Laney> sure is
[11:01] <Laney> I do like using the OptionSelector though
[11:01] <Laney> what's wrong with #3?
[11:02] <davmor2> seb128: I know what the issue is with 3-4.  Because the header is Off set I think I expect the text to be bigger or bolder like it would be on a wiki/web page for example.  Because it isn't the page just looks cramped
[11:02] <seb128> I'm not sure, the "Set the time and date:" with the divider looks a bit weird
[11:02] <seb128> davmor2, right, they need to fix the look of headers in the sdk...
[11:04] <Laney> Well, your call
[11:04] <Laney> I prefer 3 but 4 is also OK
[11:04] <Laney> in either case let's be consistent and do everywhere at once
[11:05] <seb128> Laney, hum, at this point I'm pondering just not changing anything for v1, we still have some bugs and I'm not sure rushing those UI changes is a win
[11:06] <Laney> oh, these aren't changes to be done now?
[11:06] <seb128> Laney, "to be done" ... I'm sure the design guys would like to see those stuff fixed
[11:06] <seb128> it doesn't mean we "have to" do it
[11:06] <Laney> ok
[11:07] <Laney> I thought it was "you should make it look like this for 13.10"
[11:07] <seb128> well, rick&co said to focus on quality and functional for the end of the design
[11:07] <Laney> those guys should learn some qml ;-)
[11:07] <seb128> design pointed what they see wrong/to fix
[11:07] <seb128> it doesn't mean it's important enough to get in this week
[11:08] <seb128> e.g I'm fine pushing back
[11:08] <seb128> they said ok for the "we are not going to drop the ':' because of translations"
[11:08] <davmor2> seb128: I like the box around automatic/manual  I think the issue is you then expect a box to be around europe/paris too if that makes sense,  which is why my head prefers the non box version, but my eyes like the box version :)
[11:09] <seb128> davmor2, the europe/paris is not an option selector though, it's a 1 line indicating the current value and linking to a subpage
[11:09] <Laney> I'm surprised they didn't have any suggestions about the choose tz page
[11:11] <davmor2> seb128: indeed and I get that there is a difference there and that is great.  But it looks odd having one bit, seemingly, randomly boxed but not the rest of the sections if that make sense.
[11:11] <seb128> Laney, they mostly looked at the use of non standard elements I think
[11:12] <seb128> davmor2, right, which is what makes we think we are going to stay out of the rounded business for v1
[11:12] <seb128> because it's going to start raising such comments
[11:12] <seb128> then we need to address those
[11:12] <seb128> it seems like we better stay on the current UI with its known issues
[11:16] <seb128> Laney, davmor2: that's on screenshot I had at the start of the cycle using headers in the about dialog, https://launchpadlibrarian.net/142246654/grouped.png
[11:16] <seb128> I don't like it, the software and legal entry look weird
[11:16] <Laney> Agreed
[11:16] <Laney> We could file an SDK bug and wait for it to be fixed before doing anything with headers
[11:17] <seb128> Laney, like https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-ui-toolkit/+bug/1190234 ? ;-)
[11:17] <ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1190234 in Ubuntu UX "[toolkit] ListItem.Header should be horizontally aligned with standard elements" [Undecided,New]
[11:18] <seb128> Laney, but yeah, to me it looks like we should change to change header, and get the header look improved in the uitk
[11:18] <seb128> but I guess the second is not going to happen for v1
[11:18] <seb128> so we better stay on what we current got
[11:19] <davmor2> seb128: see I don't mind it being stagger but again I expect the text to be bigger and bolder to make it easier to identify
[11:19] <Laney> ah, there's the reference for not using headers
[11:19] <seb128> Laney, yeah, but seems the other design guys don't agree with that...
[11:19] <Laney> not a fight for us :-)
[11:19]  * seb128 wishes they would agree between them and just tell us what to do
[11:20] <seb128> pitti, yeah langpack master, I've a question for you ;-)
[11:20] <pitti> seb128: salut, quoi de neuf ?
[11:21] <seb128> pitti, what would be the right way to list "the available locales"?
[11:21] <pitti> seb128: call "locale -a"
[11:21] <seb128> pitti, could you have a look to what attente did in https://code.launchpad.net/~attente/ubuntu-system-settings/filter-unsupported-languages/+merge/189757
[11:21] <pitti> and perhaps filter out C and POSIX
[11:21] <seb128> he lists stuff in /usr/share/locale-langpack
[11:21] <seb128> which I guess work, but I'm not sure is the best way
[11:22] <pitti> that ought to be an implementation detail indeed
[11:23] <pitti> also, those are not actual locales
[11:24] <seb128> pitti, yeah, the issue we have currently is that the UI lists everything
[11:24] <seb128> but we can't install langpacks on the touch ro image
[11:24] <pitti> so what is that supposed to show, languages or locales?
[11:24] <seb128> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LanguageAndText#phone-language
[11:24] <seb128> languages
[11:24] <pitti> ah, ok
[11:25] <seb128> pitti, the goal of that merge is basically to limit the list to the stuff that work
[11:25] <seb128> pitti, atm you can pick e.g russian in the list, but the accountsservice helper is going to bail out because the locale is not generated
[11:25] <seb128> so the option doesn't work
[11:26] <seb128> we basically want to go down to listing zh/es/pt/de/fr (which are the langpacks installed)
[11:27] <pitti> oh, we install the gnome langpacks on the phone
[11:28] <seb128> pitti, yes, as a workaround, since we don't have touch langpacks yet
[11:28] <seb128> pitti, space was not too much of an issue and the gnome ones have the indicators' translations
[11:29] <seb128> pitti, we decided to install a bunch to have the language setting to work, and to be able to easily demo in some of the most common languages
[11:31] <pitti> seb128: I commented on the MP
[11:31] <seb128> pitti, danke
[11:37] <attente> seb128, pitti, i was thinking about that, but if we use locale -a, we end up getting a tonne of regional variants on languages like english which are effectively just plain english
[11:37] <seb128> attente, hey
[11:37] <pitti> attente: right, but that's the same with parsing /usr/share/locale*
[11:38] <pitti> attente: you need to filter those by language and perhaps somem particular variants anyway
[11:38] <seb128> pitti, /usr/share/locale-langpacks has less entries than locale -a here
[11:38] <pitti> yes, but not "fewer enough"
[11:38] <attente> each entry in locale-langpack corresponds to an actual translation pack, no?
[11:38] <pitti> we can't/don't want to show any country/variant *except* Portugese and Chinese
[11:39] <pitti> sorry, scratch the portugese, we only need to show zh-hans/zh-hant, and otherwise just the language
[11:39] <pitti> attente: no, see above
[11:39] <pitti> attente: each entry in /var/lib/locales/supported.d/ corresponds to one langpack (see my MP comment)
[11:40] <pitti> and that also takes care of the special-case of the zh split
[11:41] <attente> pitti, on the device i see zh_CN and zh_SG
[11:42] <attente> oh, ok, sorry, i misunderstood
[11:43] <pitti> yes, but the langpacks are called zh-hans (simplified, like for China) and -hant (traditional, like in Taiwan)
[11:43] <attente> pitti, does that mean we don't have for example US english vs GB english?
[11:43] <pitti> attente: we do, but they all come in language-pack-en
[11:44] <pitti> it doesn't make sense to split those
[11:44] <pitti> (because en_GB is just a small delta on top of en_US)
[11:44] <attente> so how do we ensure that these appear as distinct languages in the list?
[11:44] <pitti> similarly, de_AU is just a few special exceptions over de_DE, so we don't build an Austrian langpack
[11:45] <pitti> attente: well, that's what I asked above -- what do you want to show, locales or languages
[11:45] <pitti> a locale is a language plus country and also defines other bits than just the language (like currency, date format, etc.)
[11:45] <seb128> language it seems, from the design
[11:45] <pitti> if you want to install langpacks, then the language is enough
[11:46] <pitti> for defining the full UI experience you need country as well, and you really want locale -a
[11:46] <Laney> yes, we probably do want that
[11:46] <pitti> for the latter case, /usr/share/langpack-locale/ is *not* sufficient
[11:46] <Laney> that's what o gra bugged about today
[11:46] <seb128> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-system-settings/+bug/1236772
[11:46] <ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1236772 in ubuntu-system-settings (Ubuntu) "while setting language works in ubuntu touch, currency and date settings are still en_us.UTF-8" [Undecided,New]
[11:46] <seb128> right, that one ^
[11:46] <pitti> otherwise you could never say you are in e. g. Austria or Brazil
[11:47] <pitti> attente: so yes, it seems you really want locale -a
[11:47] <attente> right, ok
[11:47] <attente> thanks pitti
[11:48] <seb128> attente, pitti: thanks
[11:48] <seb128> attente, can you update the mr to do that?
[11:50] <attente> seb128, yep
[11:50] <seb128> attente, thanks
[13:04] <Riddell> seb128: sorry only just tried gnome-control-centre and it's empty, presumably I need a module to do anything, do you know which package the user setup module is in?
[13:06] <seb128> Riddell, hum, are you speaking online accounts or local users?
[13:06] <Riddell> seb128: local user
[13:08] <seb128> Riddell, XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP=Unity gnome-control-center?
[13:09] <seb128> Riddell, the panels have .desktop which are not listing KDE
[13:09] <seb128> in their OnlyShowIn
[13:10] <Riddell> seb128: ah hah, thanks
[13:11] <Riddell> seb128: I don't suppose you know where the user avatar is saved to?
[13:13] <seb128> Riddell, let me check
[13:15] <seb128> Riddell, it used to be ~/.face but they use accountsservice nowadays so I wonder if it's just stored in there
[13:19] <Riddell> seb128: but in where? :)
[13:20] <seb128> Riddell, in accountsservice, which is a dbus service
[13:20] <seb128> Riddell, it stores those in /var/lib/AccountsService/icons/<user> it seems
[13:21] <Riddell> seb128: aaah, interesting, thanks
[13:22] <seb128> Riddell, google found https://git.reviewboard.kde.org/r/110875/
[13:23] <seb128> Riddell, the bug linked has some details/discussion on the topic
[13:24] <Riddell> seb128: interesting, thanks more
[13:24] <seb128> Riddell, yw!
[13:47] <seb128> attente, do you know how to test the osk text completion? I tried to enable it and enter some words in the messaging app using the osk but it doesn't complete anything that I can tell
[13:47] <seb128> or I misunderstand the feature/how it's supposed to work
[13:49] <seb128> attente, oh, it works after a reboot, I guess the osk still doesn't dynamically update its config
[13:56] <attente> seb128, it should work without rebooting
[13:57] <attente> from what i tested
[13:59] <seb128> attente, turning off seems to work without reboot but I had issues turning it on again, I'm going to do a bit more testing
[14:05] <Laney> stgraber: did you see my ping earlier about e-d-s?
[14:06] <stgraber> Laney: nope
[14:06] <Laney> ok, well we discussed it a bit and came to the conclusion that it couldn't work on touch anyway
[14:06] <Laney> because they didn't install -goa which is required for it
[14:06] <stgraber> ok
[14:09] <stgraber> Laney: did you talk to the kylin guys too?
[14:13] <Laney> yeah, JackYu said it was ok in #ubuntu-release overnight
[14:14] <stgraber> Laney: cool, I'll drop the block then.
[14:14] <Laney> great, ta
[14:15] <seb128> happyaron, is there any new feature in the new libchewing? you only need a ffe for features, not bug fixes
[15:22] <happyaron> seb128: I don't think there is big features, but contains quite a bunch of bug fixes.
[15:23] <seb128> happyaron, no need of a ffe then, just upload
[15:24] <Laney> I didn't find anything that wasn't a bug fix yet
[15:24] <Laney> ah, there's a NEWS
[15:25] <happyaron> but I cannot sync directly, do I need to upload it manually?
[15:26] <Laney> huh?
[15:26] <Laney> it's already in UNAPPROVED
[15:26] <Laney> so you or someone did sync it
[15:26] <happyaron> I synced it, but getting no email
[15:26] <Laney> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/saucy/+queue?queue_state=1&queue_text=
[15:26] <happyaron> so I thought it may need to be an FFe, but not subscribed anyone because I'm still not sure..
[15:26] <happyaron> ah, thanks
[15:30] <seb128> hey
[15:30] <seb128> it's meeting time
[15:31] <seb128> qengho, Sweetshark_, mlankhorst, Laney, tkamppeter, attente, desrt, larsu: hey
[15:31]  * kenvandine waves
[15:31] <seb128> kenvandine, hey, how are you? ;-)
[15:31] <kenvandine> great!
[15:31] <larsu> meeting \o/
[15:32] <Laney> hallo
[15:32] <Laney> see, it *is* a happy Tuesday
[15:33] <seb128> Laney, it is ;-)
[15:33] <seb128> let's get started
[15:33] <seb128> qengho, hey
[15:34] <seb128> hum, no qengho today?
[15:34] <seb128> ok...
[15:34] <seb128> Sweetshark_, hey
[15:35] <Sweetshark_> seb128: nothing to report -- conference wrapup, travel planning, bits and pieces
[15:35] <seb128> Sweetshark_, ok ... what's the status of libreoffice in saucy? you are happy about it?
[15:35] <qengho> seb128: I'm here. Network lag.
[15:35] <Sweetshark_> seb128: yes. currently no fires burning there \o/
[15:36] <seb128> ok, great
[15:36] <seb128> Sweetshark_, thanks
[15:36] <seb128> qengho, hey, ok
[15:36] <qengho> - Preparing 30.0.1599.66 for testing.  Release to P,Q,R,S if LP#1235490, #1236613, #1226143 not regression, and if ARMHF works well.
[15:36] <qengho> - Tracking a bug that concerns me, LP#1235490.  Seems to be new.  Could be compositing-stack bug.  May need help.
[15:36] <qengho> - New-tab page search, if I can get to it.
[15:36] <qengho> EOL
[15:36] <mlankhorst> heya
[15:36] <Laney> you mean we'll lose the cool grid thing?
[15:36] <qengho> Laney: No.
[15:37] <qengho> Laney: additional line for search.  Replacement of start.ubuntu.com search as Firefox uses.
[15:37] <Laney> I see
[15:37] <qengho> Laney: Chromebooks already have something like it, actually.
[15:38] <seb128> qengho, I saw you closed the autopkgtest bug, are those running and green now?
[15:38] <qengho> seb128: yes.  Green for about a month.
[15:38] <seb128> \o/
[15:38] <seb128> indeed, I can see that, great
[15:38] <qengho> :)
[15:38] <seb128> qengho, thanks
[15:38] <seb128> mlankhorst, hey
[15:39] <mlankhorst> working on some kernel bugs, mesa 9.2 updates
[15:39] <mlankhorst> 9.1 preparation for raring
[15:39] <mlankhorst> and applied for nm, haven't heard back yet
[15:40] <seb128> ok, good luck with that
[15:40] <seb128> mlankhorst, thanks
[15:40] <seb128> Laney, hey
[15:40] <Laney> o h ai
[15:40] <Laney> • system-settings bugfixes
[15:40] <Laney> ∘ A critical in storage glib usage
[15:40] <Laney> ∘ Design update for choosing timezone
[15:40] <Laney> ∘ Size/layout fixes landed
[15:40] <Laney> ∘ Use Qt for month names instead of translating them explicitly
[15:40] <Laney> ∘ Go up from directly launched panels to the main screen so you can't get trapped
[15:40] <Laney> • Bug fixes
[15:40] <Laney> ∘ Disable UOA in e-d-s
[15:40] <Laney> ∘ Update tzdata and SRU it for impending/overdue changes
[15:40] <Laney> ∘ Review g-s-d patches to fix media keys
[15:40] <Laney> ∘ Fix nm-applet autolaunching
[15:40] <Laney> ∘ Investigate g-session update; blocked on g-desktop3 being updated which we can't do IIRC.
[15:40] <Laney> ∘ Take a look at some non-fatal (maybe should be) errors in glib-networking's testsuite; upstream bugs.
[15:41] <Laney> • Many queue reviews, FFes, accepts/rejects, discussions and sponsorships. Final freeze in two days people!
[15:41] <desrt> Laney: 'storage glib usage'?
[15:41] <Laney> • Start looking at errors/rls-s for bugs to fix before release.
[15:41] <Laney> • DMB meeting, arges is now a core-dev
[15:41] <Laney> • codesearch: cron update it every day so it's more useful
[15:41] <Laney> • Will be on holiday on Friday
[15:41] <Laney> F I N
[15:41]  * desrt notes Laney worked over the weekend :)
[15:41] <Laney> yeah we were passing null into something or other
[15:41] <kenvandine> Laney, disabling UOA in e-d-s, is that going to affect the calendar-app stuff on the phone?
[15:41] <Laney> seb said not
[15:41] <kenvandine> ok
[15:41] <Laney> and he cited you!
[15:41] <kenvandine> hehe
[15:42] <kenvandine> well i told them it wasn't a good solution, since it required online access
[15:42] <kenvandine> same for contacts
[15:42] <Laney> anyway that can come back with 3.10
[15:42] <Laney> so the phone doesn't have to be without it for very long
[15:42] <kenvandine> but i haven't synced up with them in a while, my suggestion for them was syncevolution
[15:42] <kenvandine> which isn't quite ready
[15:42] <seb128> kenvandine, uoa is what makes you need to reauth several times a day ...
[15:42] <Laney> yeah they advise that on the DailyDriver page
[15:42] <kenvandine> seb128, yeah
[15:43] <Laney> they use oauth properly in the new series apparently
[15:43] <kenvandine> Laney, upstream added support for single signon that should work with UOA, just not in master yet
[15:43] <kenvandine> seb128, that is annoying! glad to see that go away :)
[15:44] <seb128> kenvandine, can you double check that the e-d-s update doesn't create issue?
[15:44] <kenvandine> sure
[15:44] <seb128> thanks
[15:44] <seb128> Laney, thanks
[15:44] <seb128> tkamppeter, hey
[15:45] <tkamppeter> - cups-filters: Applied some fixes from Tim Waugh from Red Hat, released 1.0.39
[15:45] <tkamppeter> - Mainly Bugs
[15:45] <desrt> tkamppeter: how's the brother situation going?
[15:47] <desrt> tkamppeter: we can talk about it later
[15:47] <tkamppeter> desrt, the admin from the Linux Foundation and the Brother people are looking into how this has to be done legally correctly.
[15:47] <desrt> oh.  i love it when it comes down to legality :)
[15:47] <desrt> good luck :)
[15:48] <seb128> tkamppeter, thanks
[15:48] <seb128> attente, hey
[15:48] <tjaalton> oh, cups support for brother printers? that would save me some effort the next time I (re)install the machine for my mum :)
[15:48] <attente> seb128, hi
[15:48] <attente> i-keyboard under unity-greeter default layout bug
[15:48] <attente> non-latin media keys and application shortcuts bug(s), stuck on these and on-going
[15:48] <attente> also stuck on unity-gtk-module mnemonics bug
[15:48] <attente> system-settings language/locale changes
[15:48] <attente> eof
[15:49] <tkamppeter> desrt, once there is the question on who get made responsible if Brother's drivers cause any system damage, and then there is the thing that Brother wants to have this click-through license.
[15:49] <desrt> attente: i suspect it may not be worth putting too much effort into the u-gtk-m bug if our mir plans are still on track for LTS
[15:49] <desrt> since the difficulty there is entirely owing to the oddities of input handling in X
[15:50] <seb128> desrt, I doubt we are going to have the LTS on Mir
[15:50] <desrt> attente: disregard, then :)
[15:50]  * larsu is shocked.
[15:50] <seb128> attente, thanks, did you update the language/locale to use "locale" rather than the directory?
[15:50] <desrt> larsu: play nice :p
[15:50] <attente> seb128, yep, that should be fixed now
[15:50] <attente> although
[15:50] <larsu> desrt: couldn't resist
[15:50] <seb128> great, I'm going to review that again
[15:50] <attente> it kind of sucks at the moment since it calls synchronously
[15:51] <attente> althought for a call like locale it might not matter much
[15:52] <desrt> attente: i want to pick your brains in montreal about the keyboard stuff, so i hope you'll have time
[15:52] <seb128> right, don't worry too mych about
[15:52] <desrt> it's a shame we don't share the train ride there -- i'll be on my own
[15:52] <attente> desrt, yeah. well, we have the weekend :)
[15:52] <desrt> yup
[15:52] <desrt> hopefully we don't get too hung over from all the bagels and smoked meat
[15:53] <Laney> oh man
[15:53] <Laney> now I want to come
[15:53] <seb128> attente, thanks for the effort on those keyboard bugs, they are really no fun... I still plan to try to help narrowing down a bit more the media key issue
[15:54] <attente> seb128, is there some way i can binary search the changes in X that might've caused this?
[15:55] <seb128> attente, well, my idea is to start from a raring install, see if it works, and if it does do "install <binary>, restart session, see if it still works" until it stops working
[15:55] <desrt> seb128: great... send attente into the graveyard just before halloween
[15:56] <seb128> where <binary> is whatever is in the dist-upgrade raring->saucy list
[15:56] <seb128> desrt, I was going to say that I plan to do that after the meeting
[15:56] <desrt> :)
[15:56] <seb128> it's not that difficult, there is only a couple of candidate that would make sense
[15:56] <seb128> e.g I'm going to start by xorg
[15:56] <Laney> * mlankhorst runs
[15:56] <seb128> since I ruled out g-s-d/indicators/ibus/gtk already
[15:56] <seb128> haha
[15:57] <desrt> after you find the upgrade, though, it's time to bisect the git changelog :/
[15:57] <seb128> attente, wait to get news from me before spending more time on this one
[15:57] <attente> seb128, ok
[15:57] <seb128> desrt, well, nailing down to one component is going to a be a big step in the right direction
[15:57] <seb128> attente, thanks
[15:57] <desrt> right
[15:57] <seb128> desrt, ok, your turn ;-)
[15:57] <desrt> i didn't get as much work done on the desktop file index as i expected because i got sidetracked by a lot of random bugs
[15:58] <desrt> tracked down two issues/crashers in indicator-messages (argh...) and one in the hud due to a weird use of a hacked-up version of the action muxer
[15:58] <desrt> also found the mother of all threading issues in pygobject...
[15:58] <desrt> pitti: would be great if we could get https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=709223 into the release, subject to reviews (possibly as an update) since this is hitting lots of gsettings users
[15:58] <ubot2`> Gnome bug 709223 in general "problem with toggleref thread-safety" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
[15:59] <desrt> also tracked down some g-s-d/upower issues
[15:59] <desrt> as for the index, i did manage to get about half of the commits on the branch landed to glib master and started writing a testsuite... and fixed a few bugs uncovered by the testing
[15:59] <desrt> and on the compiler side, i have a branch of desktop-file-utils that has the compiler fully-integrated into update-desktop-database, using your (seb128) idea for handling the timestamps instead of what i proposed to the list (for now)
[16:00] <desrt> i also ported the compiler from using gsequence to ghashtable for building the string lists and the text indexes... which was like a 20x speedup
[16:00] <desrt> gsequence is nice and all but for performance you just can't beat a hashtable
[16:00] <desrt> that's about all, i think
[16:01] <seb128> great work ;-)
[16:01] <seb128> desrt, desrt, speaking of gsettings, we started received https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-settings-daemon/+bug/1235982 and duplicate this week ... did you see that before?
[16:01] <ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1235982 in gnome-settings-daemon (Ubuntu) "gnome-settings-daemon crashed with SIGSEGV in g_settings_backend_dispatch_signal()" [Medium,Confirmed]
[16:01] <desrt> i've seen bugs around this area before, but this one looks new to me
[16:01] <desrt> i'll take a peek at it today
[16:01] <seb128> thanks
[16:01] <desrt> are we up to date with all the latest changes upstream?
[16:01] <seb128> I'm just pointing it because we got the first reply sunday and 3 dups since
[16:02] <seb128> well, we are on dconf 0.16
[16:02] <desrt> why not 0.18?
[16:02] <seb128> because nobody asked to update
[16:02] <desrt> heh
[16:02] <desrt> there were a couple of fixes that were probably quite related to this on 0.17
[16:02] <seb128> and it looked like nothing interested/stalled on a 0.17.1 for most of the cycle
[16:02] <desrt> but i suspect you may already have vendor-picked those?
[16:03] <seb128> you backport that to 0.16.1 for me iirc
[16:03] <desrt> these ones
[16:03] <desrt>     engine: seal changesets on changes
[16:03] <desrt>     DConfChangeset: expose concept of "sealing"
[16:03] <seb128> backported
[16:03] <seb128> oh
[16:03] <desrt> if you already have those then this is probably something else...
[16:03] <seb128> no, I don't
[16:03] <desrt> oh
[16:03] <desrt> well, that's probably the issue then
[16:04] <seb128> hum, k
[16:04] <desrt> those were on the dconf 0.16.1 as released upstream, though
[16:04] <desrt> so if you have that, then you do have them
[16:04] <seb128> they are?
[16:04] <desrt> yes
[16:04] <seb128> we have 0.16.1
[16:04] <seb128> https://git.gnome.org/browse/dconf/log/?h=dconf-0.16
[16:04] <Laney> yeah we have them
[16:04] <seb128> ok
[16:04] <desrt> https://git.gnome.org/browse/dconf/commit/?id=a6faeb18741d789f9c148392ed288be0667d4760
[16:05] <desrt> includes this https://git.gnome.org/browse/dconf/commit/?id=0b1b70a53da918b579d55d927c6d019bebe7ecc9
[16:05] <seb128> oh, you merged them in one commit
[16:05] <seb128> gotcha
[16:05] <desrt> ya
[16:05] <seb128> that's what I though first (that we had that fix)
[16:05] <seb128> but I saw only one commit in the git log
[16:05] <seb128> ok, anyway, if you could have a look I would appreciate it
[16:05] <seb128> desrt, thanks
[16:05] <desrt> will do
[16:05] <seb128> larsu, your turn
[16:05] <larsu> - show notify-osd when scrolling over the sound indicator (working on disabling that on the phone)
[16:05] <larsu> - fix issues with the messaging menu turning blue (it wouldn't turn blue sometimes, and would stay blue after clearing messages other times)
[16:05]  * desrt bets that it's a refcounting bug in g-s-d
[16:05] <larsu> - some additional small fixes in messages
[16:06] <larsu> - investigated the unity-panel-service resync issue, sadly not much progress yet
[16:06] <larsu> - system-settings: don't animate action-group-widgets when opening a panel (not pushed yet)
[16:06] <larsu> oh, and: made sure Germany is still unified
[16:06] <larsu> eow
[16:06] <desrt> larsu: damn you for that, btw
[16:06] <larsu> desrt: for having a holiday?
[16:06] <desrt> while you were ensuring the unity of germany we (me, ted, charles) were tracking down a bug in indicator-messages that you had already fixed :p
[16:07] <larsu> desrt: how on earth is that my fault?
[16:07] <seb128> blame thostr for pinging other people during his day off :p
[16:07] <larsu> ya
[16:07] <desrt> larsu: it's not really
[16:07] <seb128> while he should have waited friday when larsu was back
[16:07] <larsu> or you know, look at open merges on the project
[16:07] <desrt> larsu: but seriously man... how DARE you take time off
[16:07] <seb128> desrt, stop trolling larsu, it's not friday :p
[16:07] <larsu> desrt: ;)
[16:07]  * larsu doesn't feel trolled. Had a day off.
[16:08] <seb128> larsu, thanks ;-)
[16:08] <desrt> larsu: what solution did you settle on for the animation thing?
[16:08] <seb128> desrt, @re gsd bug, I uploaded that before the report started, http://launchpadlibrarian.net/152527048/gnome-settings-daemon_3.8.5-0ubuntu5_3.8.5-0ubuntu6.diff.gz ... so might be it
[16:08] <larsu> desrt: don't load the widget until the action appears
[16:08] <larsu> desrt: which turns out to be a very small fix (which took a long time because qml)
[16:09] <desrt> seb128: ya... i'm getting more and more suspect...
[16:09] <desrt> seb128: many users of gsettings do this:
[16:09] <desrt> x = g_settings_new();
[16:09] <desrt> g_signal_connect (x, ...);
[16:09] <desrt> ...
[16:09] <desrt> g_object_unref (x);
[16:09] <desrt> without the disconnect
[16:09] <seb128> right
[16:09] <desrt> this is a bug but _usually_ you get away with it
[16:09] <larsu> we need gobject lint...
[16:09] <desrt> but if some changes come just around the time of the unref() you can have problems
[16:09] <desrt> and if they are now doing some extra _set() then this could cause the changes to come at the bad time
[16:10] <seb128> right
[16:10] <seb128> well, anyway, you have all the info
[16:10] <desrt> yup
[16:10] <seb128> larsu, danke
[16:10] <seb128> so my turn
[16:10]  * desrt is good buddies with hadess today :)
[16:10] <seb128> * refreshed translations, with export from launchpad, for the packages not using langpacks
[16:10] <seb128> * looked at some translation bugs (outdated templates, non translatable strings, ...) and fixes some
[16:10] <seb128> * sponsored some desktop fixes and updates for others
[16:10] <seb128> * saucy bug fixes:
[16:10] <seb128>  - backported a g-s-d fix to do less IOs in the housekeeping code
[16:10] <seb128>  - updated g-c-c to hide zoom controls under unity since those don't work
[16:10] <seb128>  - e-d-s bug fix update and ftbfs fix
[16:10] <seb128>  - updated gvfs to fix a regression from the previous version
[16:10] <seb128> * went through launchpad/email/errors.ubuntu.com to build a list of issues we should fix
[16:10] <seb128> * spent some hours trying to help with the keyboard/non-latin-layout/media-key issues, without too much luck (out of figuring that the issue is not due to ibus/g-s-s/indicator-keyboard/gtk... which means it might be X...)
[16:10] <seb128> * ubuntu-system-settings
[16:10] <seb128>  - reviewed current UIs with some of the visual designers
[16:10] <seb128>  - bugs triage
[16:10] <seb128>  - debugged issue with the "check for update" code
[16:10] <seb128>  - fixed a small issue with the battery panel/full charge report
[16:10] <seb128>  - some small UI tweaks
[16:10] <seb128> * quite some Ubuntu Touch testing on the device

[16:12] <seb128> .
[16:12] <seb128> is there any other topic/questions/...?
[16:12] <kenvandine> some great fixes for signon-ui are landing in trunk
[16:12] <desrt> seb128: how was the wedding?
[16:12] <kenvandine> all the handling of failures and allowing canceling, etc
[16:12] <seb128> desrt, everything was great and we have quite some fun
[16:12] <seb128> desrt, did you see the picture on g+? ;-)
[16:12] <desrt> awesome :)
[16:13] <kenvandine> seb128, i saw some pictures on facebook :)
[16:13] <desrt> no
[16:13]  * desrt is not a social butterfly
[16:13] <kenvandine> looked like fun
[16:13] <desrt> seb128: sure enough there is some unsafe use of gsettings here....
[16:13] <desrt> seb128: i think i will add a patch to glib to g_warning() if i see a gsettings getting destroyed with signals still connected
[16:14]  * desrt has a feeling that we will see lots and lots and lots of warnings
[16:15] <seb128> desrt, https://plus.google.com/u/0/107564545827215425270/posts
[16:15] <seb128> kenvandine, great, I hope those land on the image before release
[16:15] <kenvandine> seb128 and i'm testing the fix in unity-mir for the blackscreen bug on background change, i'll let you know in a few minutes if it fixes it
[16:15] <seb128> kenvandine, I had an UI review of the touch settings today, with visual design guys, they tried to add an account and only got the cancel button, never got anything else
[16:15] <seb128> they though the panel was buster
[16:15] <kenvandine> :(
[16:16] <seb128> kenvandine, where it was that they not online on the device
[16:16] <desrt> aw
[16:16] <kenvandine> well what is in trunk now does add a cancel button in the login page
[16:16] <seb128> kenvandine, oh, in what component was the issue?
[16:16] <desrt> looks like i missed a great party :(
[16:16] <kenvandine> and if the page fails to load, it fails it
[16:16] <kenvandine> signon-ui
[16:16]  * desrt wishes he could have made it
[16:16] <seb128> desrt, yeah... :-(
[16:16] <kenvandine> seb128, also uss-oa and accounts-qml-module
[16:16] <seb128> kenvandine, ok
[16:16] <kenvandine> what's in trunk as of 30m ago works, if the page fails to load it fails it
[16:17] <kenvandine> only missing piece is the error handling in accounts-qml-module
[16:17] <kenvandine> so cancel in uss-oa itself doesn't work yet and if the login page fails it doesn't tell the user it failed
[16:17] <kenvandine> mardy is working on that
[16:17] <kenvandine> but it won't hang forever anymore
[16:17] <seb128> \o/
[16:18] <jose> hey guys! sorry to interrupt, but, on behalf of the News Team we're making a Fridge Calendar update, just wanted to know if your meeting is due in ~12mins
[16:18] <Laney> no
[16:18] <Laney> -48 minutes
[16:18] <kenvandine> jose, it was 48m ago
[16:18] <Laney> :-)
[16:18] <seb128> what they said
[16:18] <seb128> just wrapping it now
[16:18] <seb128> thanks everyone!
[16:18] <seb128> ;-)
[16:19] <jose> oops, then the calendar needs updating
[16:19] <kenvandine> jose, thx for fixing that :)
[16:19] <jose> sure
[16:25] <happyaron> would be great if anyone can sponsor scim-chewing for bug #1220224, which I don't have PPU.
[16:25] <ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1220224 in scim-chewing (Ubuntu) "Sync libchewing 0.3.5-2 (main) from Debian unstable (main)" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1220224
[16:28] <seb128> happyaron, doing
[16:34] <happyaron> seb128: thanks
[16:34] <seb128> happyaron, yw
[16:34] <seb128> happyaron, I've uploaded it, do you need sponsoring for the other one as well?
[16:35] <happyaron> I don't need sponsoring for libchewing, but it was rejected by stgraber cuz he thinks the diff is too large
[16:35] <seb128> stgraber, :-(
[16:36] <seb128> I read the comment on -release
[16:36] <seb128> he has a good point, I didn't know there was that much diff when you said it was a bug fix version
[16:37] <happyaron> it is indeed a bug fix version. bug just because libchewing is a bit too buggy
[16:38] <happyaron> the sync requester appears to active on chewing related stuff for not a too long time, but committed many changes for fixes or workarounds.
[16:43] <stgraber> seb128: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6210067/
[16:44] <stgraber> I was expecting massive changes to data/ which is fine given the scope of the package, the rest is what scared me
[16:45] <seb128> stgraber, yeah, as said " he has a good point, I didn't know there was that much diff when you said it was a bug fix version"
[16:45] <seb128> stgraber, well, I don't know how much the code is buggy/useful/useless in its current version, the bug report seemed to suggest it was pretty much buggy and not usable
[16:47] <happyaron> think about there are very few people actually using chewing in Traditional Chinese comuunity, and they prompt Cangjie to primary school students when spreading Linux to them...
[16:55] <happyaron> seb128: go for FFe or leave it as it?
[16:56] <seb128> happyaron, what do you think? I would just leave it, as stgraber pointed out, the diff is non trivial, and it seems the update is not that important...
[16:58] <happyaron> I am okay for both, and I see there is extensive code changes (mostly clean ups for bad usages) and reviewing it one by one would take quite some time.
[17:00] <happyaron> upstream is active, I think v0.3.4 to v0.3.5 has 900+ commits, and post-0.3.5 commits are 100+ (not included here, though).
[17:00] <happyaron> seb128: better to leave it, then.
[17:10] <seb128> happyaron, ok, let's update next cycle then
[17:10] <happyaron> ok
[17:41] <seb128> attente, ok, I was wrong when I said the issue was not g-s-d
[17:42] <attente> seb128, it is g-s-d?
[17:42] <robru> anybody else having issues connecting to bazaar.launchpad.net? rest of launchpad is fine, but can't get to bazaar
[17:42] <seb128> attente, g-s-d 3.6 keyboard's plugin is doing something that makes the thing work
[17:42] <seb128> attente, if I start an unity session with g-s-d from raring,  it works, if I disable keyboard it stops working
[17:42] <seb128> attente, so they have some code doing some init there that got dropped in 3.8
[17:43] <seb128> attente, btw I test "ctrl-C" in gedit, ctrl-alt-<letter> never worked on other keymaps
[17:43] <seb128> attente, raring has the same issue, if you change to russian and do ctrl-alt-C (for calculator) it doesn't work
[17:44] <attente> seb128, you mean reverting g-s-d corrected the application shortcuts?
[17:44] <seb128> attente, define "application shortcuts" (there is too many variable in that equation)
[17:44] <seb128> attente, but to summarize
[17:45] <seb128> Test case:
[17:45] <seb128> - start unity
[17:45] <seb128> - run gedit
[17:45] <seb128> - do "setxkbmap ru"
[17:45] <seb128> - type something in gedit, try to ctrl-X (or ctrl-C/ctrl-V)
[17:45] <seb128> that:
[17:45] <seb128> - doesn't work with g-s-d 3.8
[17:45] <seb128> - doesn't work with g-s-d downgraded to 3.6 from raring
[17:46] <seb128> ups
[17:46] <seb128> - does work with g-s-d downgraded to 3.6 from raring
[17:46] <seb128> - doesn't work with g-s-d downgraded to 3.6 from raring and the keyboard plugin turned off
[17:46] <seb128> (delete the line before "ups")
[17:46] <seb128> attente, ^ my conclusion is that the g-s-d "keyboard" plugin in 3.6 does some magic
[17:46] <seb128> one init of something
[17:47] <attente> seb128, ah. ok
[17:47] <seb128> attente, I can start the session with gsd 3.6 and no keyboard plugin, re-enable the plugin, restart gsd (without restarting the session) and it starts working
[17:47] <attente> seb128, so there's one specific patch we dropped that ended up causing the regression?
[17:47] <seb128> attente, either that
[17:48] <seb128> attente, or upstream dropped "the magic" between 3.6 and 3.8 because they e.g moved it to gnome-shell
[17:48] <attente> ok, thanks for figuring that out, i can look at the rest
[17:48] <seb128> attente, I guess next is to read the code of the keyboard's plugin from raring
[17:49] <seb128> attente, e.g maybe turn that whole code in a standalone .c, run it and see if that fixes thing
[17:49] <seb128> if that does, clean up until finding what in it does it
[17:49] <seb128> attente, thanks
[17:49] <attente> i'm a bit puzzled why ctrl+alt+<whatever> doesn't work though
[17:50] <seb128> right, but that's orthogonal
[17:50] <seb128> xfce has the same issue, and raring as well
[17:50] <attente> right, those are the real media-keys plugins problem
[17:50] <attente> ok
[17:50] <attente> well
[17:50] <attente> those shortcuts (ctrl+x, etc)
[17:50] <attente> those work in gnome-shell, so maybe they were moved into the shell code
[17:51] <seb128> right, that's what I think
[17:52] <seb128> attente, and the media key problem is another issue and a minor one (and maybe not a new one as well)
[18:02] <seb128> attente, some context on how that's supposed to work: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=162726#c20
[18:02] <ubot2`> Gnome bug 162726 in menu "Multiple Latin layouts in XKB break keyboard shortcuts" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
[18:04] <attente> that seems to be a really old bug report
[18:04] <attente> oh.
[18:04] <attente> sorry
[18:04] <seb128> yeah, it has been running for years
[18:04] <attente> missed that that was the context
[18:05] <attente> seb128, is there another report from raring about the media keys problem?
[18:05] <seb128> attente, gtk is doing that it seems, checking if the physical key is available in one of the configured keymaps
[18:06] <seb128> attente, I wonder if the issue is that we currently only have 1 active keymap at the time
[18:06] <seb128> attente, rather than having a list of keymaps
[18:06] <seb128> (not sure what "active keymap" means on the xorg side/how you configure several)
[18:06] <attente> that could be it
[18:06]  * seb128 plays with xprop
[18:07] <attente> i only have a limited understanding of it, but i believe you can have at most 4 groups to a keyboard layout
[18:07] <kenvandine> q
[18:07] <attente> well, i guess "group" is the keyboard layout..
[18:09] <attente> http://www.x.org/archive/X11R7.5/doc/input/XKB-Config.html#AEN12
[18:12] <seb128> attente, yeah, there was a long standing bug open for ever in GNOME about that but they went to ibus
[18:16] <seb128> attente, if you do "xprop -root | grep XKB" you get the config
[18:17] <seb128> attente, when I'm in a buggy situation it lists
[18:17] <seb128> _XKB_RULES_NAMES(STRING) = "evdev", "pc105", "ru", "", "grp:shift_caps_toggle"
[18:17] <seb128> when it works
[18:17] <seb128> _XKB_RULES_NAMES(STRING) = "evdev", "pc105", "fr,gb,ru", "oss,,", "grp:shift_caps_toggle"
[18:17] <seb128> attente, so I think we somewhat end up with only 1 layout which makes the gtk trickery to look in "other configured keymaps" not work
[18:18] <attente> interesting..
[18:18] <attente> was it possible to have more than four keyboard layouts configured in the past?
[18:19] <seb128> no
[18:19] <attente> so all of this input source switching to fix that problem ended up causing this one, huh
[18:19] <seb128> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=640774
[18:19] <ubot2`> Gnome bug 640774 in Region & Language "For some reason I can't add more than 4 layouts" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
[18:21] <seb128> attente, well, somewhat you said they don't have problem
[18:21] <attente> yeah, this is what rtcm told me when i asked him about it
[18:21] <seb128> desrt, you have a fedora install handy I guess, could you add a russian keyboard layout, and run "xprop -root | grep XKB" (with "ru" active)
[18:21] <attente> i'm not sure what the other distros are doing to fix it
[18:22] <seb128> attente, if you ping him again maybe you ask what layouts are "active" with their setup and if that's only 1 what they do to have the gtk hackery of "look in other keymaps for the char" work
[18:22] <seb128> attente, I think you said you didn't have enough details to ask specifics before?
[18:23] <desrt> _XKB_RULES_NAMES(STRING) = "evdev", "pc104", "ru,us", ",", "compose:caps,lv3:ralt_switch,esperanto:qwerty"
[18:23] <seb128> attente, so they have several active layouts
[18:23] <seb128> desrt, thanks
[18:23] <desrt> with english active (but russian configured): _XKB_RULES_NAMES(STRING) = "evdev", "pc104", "us", "", "compose:caps,lv3:ralt_switch,esperanto:qwerty"
[18:23] <seb128> attente, can you join #control-center or the GNOME IRC?
[18:23] <desrt> ie: the list is not just the list of layouts configured, but a fallback list
[18:24] <seb128> desrt, if you add de is it added to the list?
[18:24] <desrt> maybe only if i also remove us
[18:24] <desrt> lemme see
[18:24] <desrt> curious
[18:25] <desrt> for de i have "de,us"
[18:25] <desrt> and even if i have ru and de as the configured layouts (with no us), when i select ru, i get "ru,us" still
[18:25] <desrt> it seems like "us" is some universal fallback which must always be there or something
[18:26] <desrt> seb128: btw: this gsettings bug: i doubt i will fix this soon (read: next few days)
[18:26] <desrt> i have an idea for how to fix this, but it involves API changes
[18:26] <desrt> so you might want to vendor-pick it from the master branch as a SRU early in the cycle or something
[18:26] <desrt> API changes = an API addition
[18:26] <seb128> desrt, ok
[18:26] <seb128> attente, they might just workaround it by always adding "us" :p
[18:27] <attente> lol
[18:27] <kenvandine> seb128, a dist-upgrade on my phone wants to install evolution-data-server-goa
[18:28] <seb128> seems so...
[18:28] <seb128> kenvandine, that's correct, we went back to what raring had
[18:28] <seb128> kenvandine, does that brings anything else in?
[18:28] <kenvandine> actually, it doesn't
[18:28] <kenvandine> i figured it would
[18:28] <kenvandine> cool
[18:29] <seb128> kenvandine, great
[18:29] <kenvandine> feels very weird though :)
[18:29] <seb128> attente, \o/ we went to the bottom of it
[18:29] <seb128> attente, just always add "us" as a fallback
[18:31] <attente> seb128, good detective work
[18:31] <attente> :)
[18:31] <seb128> attente, thanks ;-)
[18:31] <seb128> attente, can you pick it from there?
[18:31] <attente> yep, you did the hard work :P
[18:32] <seb128> attente, I'm glad we have a solution for the release, and that you get unblocked
[18:42] <seb128> attente, I'm rejecting https://code.launchpad.net/~attente/gnome-settings-daemon/non-latin-media-keys/+merge/189369
[18:43] <seb128> attente, we might still want to debug the multimedia key stuff one day, but that's much lower on the todo
[18:43] <attente> seb128, sure
[19:17] <ritz> Sweetshark_ hi, wrt https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice/+bug/628105
[19:17] <ubot2`> Launchpad bug 628105 in libreoffice (Ubuntu Precise) "[Upstream] Text not black in LibreOffice" [Undecided,In progress]
[19:17] <ritz> I have added ubuntu-sponsor to this for precise
[19:17] <ritz> is there anything else I am missing out on ?
[19:23] <Sweetshark_> ritz: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise/+queue?queue_state=1&queue_text=libreoffice <- its already waiting in unapproved for two months
[19:24] <ritz> How do I push this out for approval ?
[19:26] <ritz> Sweetshark_  nm, this is waiting on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-advantage/+bug/1176923
[19:26] <ubot2`> ritz: Error: malone bug 1176923 not found
[19:27] <ritz> this still hangs X
[19:35] <ritz> my bad, should have read this . thanks