[00:00] ScottK: kde bug 326170, kde bug 326172, kde bug 326173, kde bug 326175 [00:00] KDE bug 326170 in muon "releasechecker forked more than once" [Normal,Unconfirmed] http://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=326170 [00:00] KDE bug 326172 in muon "releasechecker uses busy wait" [Normal,Unconfirmed] http://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=326172 [00:01] KDE bug 326173 in notifier "statusnotifier disappears too soon" [Normal,Unconfirmed] http://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=326173 [00:01] KDE bug 326175 in misc "releasechecker should be called WAY less" [Normal,Unconfirmed] http://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=326175 [00:01] oh actually I think I know why discover is not used for update management [00:02] it probably has no support for release updates :P [00:03] of course now is a bad time to check because there is no dev series ^^ [01:56] gosh, ubuntu is still refusing connections on the torrents page [01:56] picky picky picky [02:04] apachelogger: But wait. There's more: KDE Bug 326176, KDE Bug 326177, KDE Bug 326178 [02:04] KDE bug 326176 in updater "After checking updates, display is not updated to show package availability of revised last checked time" [Major,Unconfirmed] http://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=326176 [02:04] KDE bug 326177 in updater "U/I to update sources missing" [Normal,Unconfirmed] http://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=326177 [02:04] KDE bug 326178 in discover "No feedback provided when retrieving updated sources after sources change" [Major,Unconfirmed] http://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=326178 [03:08] howdy [04:14] any idea about https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=306344 ? [04:14] KDE bug 306344 in installer "KNSBackend crash when switching views in MSC" [Crash,Reopened] [04:20] Jekyll: jontheechidna hasn't been around much in IRC recently [04:20] I assume he'll respond on the bug [04:33] ScottK: when you were getting those problems with muon did you check if there was a lock file in place, can't remember the location but the generic one that also stops apt-get. That turned out to be why muon wasn't appearing to do anything for me, apart from making the system tray icon appear [05:05] seaLne: There are times where it is, in fact updating, so it's not locked. [05:11] ok, just thought i'd say incase it was related. mine most likely just got upset at some point [05:16] * valorie shares the Hennessey around the channel [05:18] buntu torrent server still refusing connections === jalcine_ is now known as jalcine [08:38] ScottK: bug 1240951 for sru review [08:38] bug 1240951 in kubuntu-docs (Ubuntu Saucy) "installation pages should be removed from kubuntu-docs" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1240951 === Blizzzek is now known as Blizzz [09:36] ScottK: you make it look as if the updater was entirely broken :P [09:36] good morning [10:10] there's a new plasma-nm, do we do an SRU which might fix our crash on upgrade or not bother since it's faffy to upgrade back to the old kded and plasmoid names [10:10] bug 1231360 [10:10] bug 1231360 in plasma-nm (Ubuntu) "crash on upgrade from networkmanagement to plasma-nm" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1231360 [10:12] hmm muon upgrader says my system is up to date when I know there's new stuff that could be installed === jalcine is now known as jalcine_ [10:41] Riddell: we went on abug reprot spree on updater yesterday [10:41] there's quite some issues [10:42] and as for plasma-nm, I'd look into how reliably we can roll users to the new names [10:42] if there is a tiny chance it can go wrong I'd use a different approach [10:43] Riddell: what I have been thinking about... if the plasma-nm people planon doing another release before the end of the year we may want to SRU that as well, so to enable that I'd pick the new plasma-nm and patch it the other way around (i.e. lower version and patch names of kded/applet to match what we have) [10:44] s/planon/planing on/ [10:44] apachelogger meant: "Riddell: what I have been thinking about... if the plasma-nm people planing on doing another release before the end of the year we may want to SRU that as well, so to enable that I'd pick the new plasma-nm and patch it the other way around (i.e. lower version and patch names of kded/applet to match what we have)" [11:51] apachelogger: why would we want to patch names to what we currently have? [12:02] shadeslayer_: Quintasan: did either of you look at the telepathy PPA? david queries it a while ago and I don't know if anyone got back to him [12:06] !newversion calligra 2.7.4 [12:06] Riddell: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :) [12:06] hmm [12:06] kubotu: newversion calligra 2.7.4 [12:06] ... [12:06] https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1241536 [12:06] yay :) === jalcine_ is now known as jalcine [12:27] ahoneybun is applying for Kubuntu membership, nice [12:28] awooga [12:31] He will probably get a cleaner vote than mine:P [12:34] I think we were all happy to have you as a member [12:35] Riddell, I don't know why, but everytime I apply for such membership/developer stuff it doesn't go as good as I wished (LOL) [12:42] smartboyhw: well we're very glad to have you! [12:44] Riddell, I know, just hoping that ahoneybun gets the application very good;P [12:58] Riddell: I have a fix for the "back-button-of-death" bug in Ubiquity. Have you filed a bug on LP? [12:59] agateau: oh cool, yeah hang on [12:59] bug 1240859 [12:59] bug 1240859 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "if wireless step is skipped impossible to go back a step" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1240859 [12:59] agateau: ↑ [13:00] Riddell: ok, thanks [13:02] the bug was not related to wireless, it just happens that (I guess) wireless is the first time we have a skippable page in the kde ui [13:02] yeah [13:03] my fix is similar to a fix done in 2007(!) on the GTK frontend [13:03] back in the day [13:05] https://code.launchpad.net/~agateau/ubiquity/kde-fix-going-back/+merge/191806 === rdieter_ is now known as rdieter [13:12] BBoD; sounds like a band [13:12] agateau: looks simple enough, I'll upload it, thanks [13:13] Riddell: great [13:27] Riddell, BTW is ahoneycutt's vote in UTC or own timezone when viewed in Doodle? [13:27] I'm not a KC member, but really would like to support him === jalcine is now known as jalcine_ [13:28] smartboyhw: I assumed it was UTC [13:28] but you'd need to ask him [13:36] Riddell, sure [14:02] apachelogger: re the updater - I'm sure it's OK if you wait for it to d it's automatice check for new packages and let you know, however if you try to manually check for udpates, yeah, it's pretty broken. Certainly a substantial regression from what was there before. [14:03] Trusty Tahr -- The new T codename http://www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/1295 === smartboyhw changed the topic of #kubuntu-devel to: Kubuntu | https://trello.com/kubuntu | 4.11.2 notes.kde.org/p/kubuntu-ninjas | bugs http://goo.gl/vHRjj | build status http://goo.gl/cjEFkO | 13.10 released | Shirts! https://holvi.com/shop/Kubuntu/ | T cycle codename is Trusty Tahr, see http://www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/1295 === smartboyhw changed the topic of #kubuntu-devel to: Kubuntu | https://trello.com/kubuntu | 4.11.2 notes.kde.org/p/kubuntu-ninjas | bugs http://goo.gl/vHRjj | build status http://goo.gl/cjEFkO | 13.10 released | Shirts! https://holvi.com/shop/Kubuntu/ | T cycle codename is Trusty Tahr, see http://goo.gl/sf3YXa [14:08] Hiyas all === jono is now known as Guest69907 [14:14] Riddell: apachelogger http://i.imgur.com/WMWd7Bm.png [14:15] shadeslayer_: ooh! [14:15] shadeslayer_: could do with a vertical spacer at the bottom though :) [14:15] heh yeah [14:26] Riddell: The kubuntu-doc package itself looks fine, but the bug needs the usual SRU stuff added to it. [14:31] ScottK: test case added [14:31] Riddell: http://i.imgur.com/1eMWf19.png [14:34] shadeslayer_: lovely :) [14:35] Good afternoon. [15:17] Hi Kubuntu people. I have a question that I think one of you packagers might know the answer to. [15:17] The question is this: when statically linking, how do CFLAGS of different static libraries affect each other? [15:17] for instance, if one libary is built with -O2 and your executable is built with -O3, is this an issue? [15:17] I imagine it isn't because static linking still has those libraries as distinct entities so CFLAGS don't really bug each other [15:17] but I'm not sure and figure someone else might know better [15:17] (I'm also interested in whether these days you still get a noticeable boost from static linking. Reading around suggests that yes, you do, but that it depends on how many shared library calls you're making) [15:20] I don't think it makes a difference, but I have very little experience with static linking [15:22] jefferai: we don't use static libraries so I guess there's not much experience here [15:22] Riddell: Sure. But packagers tend to know more about the linking process than I do in general :-) [15:22] jefferai: I suspect that dynamic loading still takes a long time but haven't tested [15:23] dynamic loading isn't a huge concern for me; if it takes a few extra seconds to load and will run for 6 months I don't really care [15:24] I saw an IBM article which said that the extra translation causes a performance degredation when calling shared library routines; at the same time dynamic linking, because it shares copies in memory, reduces the risk of expensive page faults [15:24] but no indication which one is likely to trump the other :-) [15:26] Riddell: can you fire up a python3 shell [15:27] Riddell: and run these 3 lines http://pastebin.kde.org/puushiub2 [15:27] and then pastebin the result [15:32] shadeslayer_: http://pastebin.kde.org/p64gcqqpd [15:32] oh [15:33] but I have a nice thinkpad without evil hardware in it [15:34] They've certainly gone downhill since IBM stopped making them. [15:34] ^^ [15:34] anyway [15:34] anyone with evil hardware [15:35] with evil proprietary drivers installed [15:35] shadeslayer_, not here, I ran it and same result (and please, no evil proprietary drivers>_> [15:35] shadeslayer_: I'm using nvidia [15:35] genii: could you run these 3 lines http://pastebin.kde.org/puushiub2 [15:38] shadeslayer_: OK, hang on a bit [15:41] shadeslayer_: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6257975/ [15:41] o_O [15:41] genii, use usr/bin/python3 instead? [15:42] do you have python3-apt [15:42] smartboyhw: no that's fine, I have python3.3 [15:42] and it works [15:42] I think he's missing python3-apt : ImportError: No module named apt_pkg [15:43] shadeslayer_: apt-cache policy python3-apt: Installed: 0.8.9.1ubuntu1 [15:43] huh [15:43] shadeslayer_: I have evil hardware, but not with me. I can do it tonight or tomorrow if no one else does. [15:43] ack [15:45] Same exact error if I use the /usr/bin/python3.2 ( there is also just python3 there, should i try that? ) [15:45] IIRC python3 is just a symlink [15:46] shadeslayer_: http://pastebin.kde.org/parc7eaok [15:46] Riddell: Accepted into proposed. [15:46] ok so not limited to my machine then [15:47] Ubuntu Drivers should return a 'selected' key for the currently selected driver [15:47] except that it does not [15:47] also not very efficient, taking nearly 48s [15:48] well, can be improved, those 2 commands recreate the cache [15:49] dkms status will show the graphics driver in use [15:49] if it's the non default [15:49] BluesKaj: Ideally UbuntuDrivers would provide the information [15:49] I've emailed Albert about it [15:50] Ah, I didn't notice that python3 links to python3.3 . When I use that instead, it just churns for a bit with no output whatsoever and returns to command prompt after about 30 seconds [15:50] wow, really? works with python3.3? [15:50] and doesn't with 3.2 [15:50] shadeslayer_: Correct, yes [15:51] python3.2 isn't in the archive anymore since raring so it's not surprising that it's broken [15:52] shadeslayer_: Here, the python3.2 links to python3.2mu if it makes any difference [15:54] debfx: this is also fun http://pastebin.kde.org/pridgdsbp [15:58] shadeslayer_ and genii: Makes complete sense because Python extensions are only built for supported python vresions. [15:58] It's no surprise at all that python3-apt doesn't support it. [15:59] This is a feature, not a bug. [16:04] apachelogger: ping [16:15] afiestas: pong [16:16] ScottK: it also failed with auto detected updates... alas I got a notification but muon-updater then said there are no updates until I did a manual check [16:17] apachelogger: Fun. Perhaps I was being too kind in my bug reports. [16:17] *shrug* [16:17] I am not too happy about the premature inclusion of pre-release muon for the sake of getting discover [16:20] wohoo [16:20] http://i.imgur.com/eWmniKq.png [16:21] Hm. Jockey reports that no proprietary drivers are in use on this sytem, however, lsmod begs to differ. [16:21] want to try my app ? :P [16:22] shadeslayer_: I think you neesd someone with UI knowledge to make that more pleasing to the eye :P [16:22] shadeslayer_: Do i need to be running drivers from stock repos for this stuff to work properly? Because I'm actually running xorg-edgers for my nvidia [16:23] genii: no [16:23] genii: Jockey has suffered from some bit rot since only Kubuntu is still using it. I fixed it to support install for saucy release, but other problems don't particularly surprise me. [16:23] apachelogger: so, not you? :D [16:23] I am better at writing perl than I am at making UIs not suck donkey balls [16:24] shadeslayer_: I'll give whatever you got a go and report back if you like [16:24] shadeslayer_: I do think we have widgets for that though [16:24] based of qframe [16:25] would at least provide continuity [16:25] genii: lp:~rohangarg/+junk/driver-manager-kde [16:25] shadeslayer_: and I think the window size is off :P [16:25] genii: you'll need to edit driver-manager-kde.py to fix the path [16:25] for the designer file [16:25] shadeslayer_: OK [16:26] the buttons don't work ofcourse ^_^ [16:26] huh [16:26] how can the buttons not work? [16:26] by not doing anything [16:27] that's two connects [16:27] in fact you can even connect it to the qdialog via designer [16:27] heh [16:27] shadeslayer_: Doesn't like me trying to get into the +junk directory [16:27] it's da first thing I do when I put a button somewhere :P [16:28] I need to look at muon api first :) [16:29] the shining is a very weird movie [16:30] hmm not sure how to make this integrated into muon [16:30] drop it [16:30] rewrite in c++ [16:31] actually I do strongly believe that what you need to do is python bind libmuon/libqapt [16:32] I have no idea what python bind libmuon/libqapt is [16:32] generate a python binding module for the libraries [16:32] a la pykde [16:32] bah [16:32] otherwise you cannot access muon [16:33] and as I said the other way is to write in c++ and then use cpython to access the python bits inside the c++ code (which is more of a pain than getting bindings generated) [16:34] ... at least cpython was rather painful last I looked at it which was a while ago but I doubt anyone wrote a more usable API yet :P [16:36] shadeslayer_: http://pythonqt.sourceforge.net/ [16:37] oh [16:37] fun [16:38] It's already packaged, FYI. [16:38] yeah [16:38] lets rewrite this in C++! [16:38] question is which way is the better [16:39] apachelogger: well, we get Muon integration the other way around [16:39] because IMO python bindings may be useful in the long run [16:39] so I'd talk with JT about this [16:39] see what he thinks [16:42] Getting a standalone move from jockey to ubuntu-drivers would be a big win. So don't stop while youre getting the integration sorted. [16:43] well, all I need to sort out is the installation part [16:43] and I'll have a basic prototype which works [16:44] I suppose I could just use the apt bindings for now [16:44] and show a dialog [16:45] Ah, nvm, was code.launchpad.net :) , I'm there now [16:45] :) [17:27] wth [17:29] apachelogger: could you have a look at lp:~rohangarg/+junk/driver-manager-kde [17:29] and tell me why the hell is it not running? [17:30] oh [17:30] ohhh [17:30] nvm nvm [18:00] are daily builds for packages in kubuntu updates ppa the norm now? [18:16] Riddell: http://i.imgur.com/VsAcSHu.png [18:16] apachelogger: ^^ [18:23] * ScottK waves to claydoh. [18:23] (no idea about your question) [18:23] claydoh: might want to ask yofel [18:25] hi shadeslayer_ and ScottK, A forum user was wondering about all the daily packages he has been getting since upgrading to saucy, he has the updates ppa enabled [18:27] the "git" in the versioning is the concern I guess :) [18:32] ScottK: claydoh how do you guys like http://i.imgur.com/VsAcSHu.png [18:35] shadeslayer_: nice [18:41] shadeslayer_: Looks nice. I think it'll be much better than the current Jocky U/I. [18:41] Jockey ... [18:54] :) [18:56] shadeslayer_: What's the maximum height your U/I will need? Please keep it un 550 pixels. [18:56] s//un/under/ [18:56] ScottK meant: "unshadeslayer_: What's the maximum height your U/I will need? Please keep it un 550 pixels." [18:56] ScottK: me and afiestas just discussed some issues about width [18:56] No, I didn't. [18:56] and height [18:56] OK. [18:56] for eg. the Device text might get too wide [18:57] or we might have a bazillion drivers needed [18:57] ( The most proprietary laptop in the world ) [18:57] We should support a 576 x 800 netbook and with a 24 px panel, that leaves ~500. [18:57] ack [18:57] I'll fix that tomorrow [18:57] need to head back home now [18:57] K [18:58] shadeslayer_: I'd also ask Pitt and tseliot for thoughts on U/I. [18:58] err pitti === cmagina_ is now known as cmagina [21:04] hey [21:04] hi guys [21:14] soee: Great job on all the ISO testing. Thanks. [21:15] best distro deserved that :] [21:19] ScottK: can you vote on the doodle for my membership meeting> [21:20] ? === jalcine_ is now known as jalcine [22:47] ::qt-bugs:: [1241859] package libqtgui4 4:4.8.1-0ubuntu4 failed to install/upgrade: lectura insuficiente en buff... @ https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1241859 (by Lucas Germán Burgos) === ximion1 is now known as ximion === jalcine is now known as jalcine_ [23:13] hey valorie [23:13] hi ahoneybun [23:13] it seems that the installation page was inclued [23:14] included [23:14] :( [23:14] damn it, I asked over and over for that to be removed [23:14] grrrr [23:14] for two weeks [23:15] I talked to lordievader about it he did remove it from the package just someone needed to upload it or build it [23:15] something like that [23:16] I guess people who have already installed won't bother to look at the install section [23:16] but still, it looks BAD [23:16] there are notes in there, and it just plain isn't finishe [23:16] d [23:16] anyway we got the docs on there [23:16] fine for a wiki [23:17] filing bugs helps with getting issues resolved :P [23:17] nothing else === jalcine_ is now known as jalcine [23:17] afaik, a bug was filed [23:17] only seen one from JR filed on release day or something like that [23:17] I was asked, and I gave an answer [23:17] anyway [23:17] had I been asked to file a bug, I would have done so [23:17] yeah [23:17] too late now [23:18] since you need to look into l10n ... I guess it would be worthwhile to also work out a way to get certain pages not exported [23:18] next time we'll have it done [23:18] and ultimately not by having a manual balcklist in whatever creates the package export [23:18] e.g. a special category or something (kinda depends on the wiki sofwtare I guess ^^) [23:18] I think we need to clear that lp for the package as those bugs are all old [23:19] well, ultimately we want to ship only the mini-doc package, in docbook [23:19] docbook? [23:19] wut? [23:19] huh? :P [23:19] the wiki -> website is fine, for the website [23:19] valorie: lordievader is moving a test page to MediaWiki [23:19] yes, good old xml [23:19] to see how the export works there [23:19] valorie: so what's on the CD? [23:19] apachelogger: afaik, the website [23:19] ahoneybun, lordievader: talk to upstream first [23:20] valorie: so what's docbook used for then? I am confused :/ [23:20] apachelogger: they use MediaWiki [23:20] apachelogger: it will not work for us to use the KDE infra for our wiki [23:20] ahoneybun: I mean if they ever looked into export etc. [23:20] we either use the Ubuntu wiki, or our own install of mediawiki [23:20] apachelogger: true [23:20] sure, they export all the time [23:20] valorie: yes [23:21] valorie: I did not say we should use their infrasturcutre, I said we shoudl talk to them [23:21] that's how the Amarok Handbook is made [23:21] because doing research our friends at KDE did already is kind of a waste of time :P [23:21] sure [23:21] I agree [23:21] I'm just looking for what gives us the best docs [23:21] and I've talked to them [23:21] and does not waste time like apachelogger said [23:21] of course [23:22] we're raking over ground we covered while starting this up [23:22] Yea we talked about MediaWiki before === jalcine is now known as jalcine_ [23:23] the problem I have with installing our own wiki is 1. upkeep and 2. abandoning the great Ubuntu wiki stuff [23:23] but damn, moinmoin sucks [23:23] valorie: agreed in areas [23:23] there is no perfect answer [23:24] we just have to choose a path and move ahead [23:24] valorie: amarok uses mediawiki right? [23:24] yes [23:24] and they use docbook. [23:25] we don't use our own wiki any more because upkeep is hell [23:25] right [23:25] that script is available to us [23:25] claydoh: oh, btw, saucy subforums on kf.net could need fiddling with, there's still only pre-release apparently [23:25] the translation tools are available to us [23:25] etc. [23:25] what about making a odf, a text file [23:25] that is also possible [23:26] when enabled [23:26] I like that idea Mint does that I believe [23:26] so that it can be easily read on devices [23:26] I think html is more accessible on devices than odf [23:26] I have an old copy of the handbook on my kindle [23:26] :-) [23:26] yea we could have both [23:26] well, you can do all kinds of output [23:26] I mean it is for the mini docs [23:27] what are mini docs? [23:27] only do this for the mini docs the main will be the site [23:27] apachelogger: we want to have a small subset of the docs which are well translated [23:27] apachelogger: basic starter things [23:27] the parts that rarely change [23:28] shouldn't that be all the docs? [23:28] apachelogger: too much for a small team [23:28] i.e. everythign else ought to be covered by help.ubuntu.com [23:29] so IMO docs.kubuntu == what we ship in the package and what is well translated; help.ubuntu all the other rubbish (like how do I set up an openconnect vpn or whatnot) [23:29] apachelogger: would be great to get them all translated, but where are the people to do that? [23:29] valorie: ubuntu l10n team, who you probably also should talk to [23:30] that is a good idea, yes [23:30] at least german kubuntu stuff is being translated ;) [23:30] and polish [23:30] but I believe they also work from the docbook [23:30] though the polish one has 3 untranslated strings in ubiquity (what a shame :() [23:30] valorie: maybe work on the mini docs mostly and then try to expand with the help of the l10n team> [23:31] valorie: not entirely... it's a paragraph export from docbook to launchpad, so you have docbook markup and each paragraph as one translation unit [23:32] so I guess you should poke them about what they think about translating inside a wiki, if that would work for them, concerns etc. [23:32] translating inside a wiki sounds like a nightmare [23:32] outside of the tools for mediawiki [23:32] actually launchpad sounds worse [23:32] moinmoin is already a nightmare..... [23:32] valorie: even more in moinmoin lol [23:32] valorie: moinmoin is a nightmare no matter waht [23:32] some how ahoneybun manages to make it behave [23:32] it's just not a good wiki IMO [23:32] but that's another story [23:32] agreed [23:32] horrible [23:33] valorie: point is...if they think translating inside a wiki given appropriate tooling is something they see themselfs doing and enjoying then that should be the added to the equation [23:33] apachelogger: thanks for the help [23:34] if they are indifferent it doesn't matter, and if they absolutely want launchpad then having sane docbook export must be a selection criteria for the wiki [23:34] valorie: off-topic seems that the 25 of this month is a good meeting time [23:34] apachelogger: thank you for that [23:34] ahoneybun: works for me [23:34] 24 [23:35] I'm just waiting to see if anymore council vote in [23:35] ohoh [23:35] ScottK: seems muon is still crashing despite last minute fixery -.- [23:35] valorie: looks like we need to talk to more people [23:35] you don't need the council for membership, I think? [23:35] just other kub. members [23:35] I could be wrong [23:35] ScottK: I really do question the entire pre-release testing process by now [23:35] valorie: I need a meeting at the least [23:35] of course [23:36] work on your page! [23:36] I did a but [23:36] bit [23:36] just don't know when I should close the poll [23:36] ScottK: like how does it go unnoticed that the thing is entirely broken for like 2 months until I accidentially stumble upon it because I didn't even know it was still installed... [23:36] ahoneybun: when you close it you close it :P [23:37] ok, I have to get away from this computer for now [23:37] ttyl peeps [23:39] ohohoho [23:40] ScottK: seems apol's fix was no good [23:40] or incomplete