| Noskcaj | Where's the logout bug? Someone reported a dupe at bug 1247337 | 05:50 |
|---|---|---|
| ubottu | bug 1247337 in xfce4-session (Ubuntu) "Xfce Restart button logs me out but does not reboot" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1247337 | 05:50 |
| brainwash | ali1234: https://launchpad.net/~thad-fisch/+archive/rand | 10:35 |
| bluesabre | slickymaster, jjfrv8; this channel is too long... where is the page with the theme definition on my wiki? | 11:39 |
| bluesabre | micahg: If you get a chance, could you approve this and merge it so we can fix two very simple bugs? https://code.launchpad.net/~smd-seandavis/xubuntu-default-settings/b2_fixes | 11:46 |
| bluesabre | I've had the merge request available for it since beta 2 | 11:47 |
| sadin | archlinux-offtopic | 12:11 |
| sadin | ugh woops to out of it this morning... | 12:12 |
| jjfrv8 | bluesabre, you mean this one? http://smdavis.us/doku/doku.php?id=playground:sceenshot-stds | 12:44 |
| bluesabre | yes, thanks! | 12:44 |
| jjfrv8 | welcome | 12:44 |
| ali1234 | brainwash: yeah it doesn't build | 12:51 |
| jjfrv8 | bluesabre, all the data on that page were current but my screenshots weren't. I just corrected that. | 13:09 |
| jjfrv8 | I've also updated the screenshots on the pages I've been working on: http://smdavis.us/doku/doku.php?id=playground:playground | 13:11 |
| ochosi | jjfrv8: nice work! | 13:33 |
| ochosi | looks pretty | 13:33 |
| jjfrv8 | ochosi, so you think I'm on the right track? It's not too basic and stating the obvious? | 13:35 |
| ochosi | no, to me this looks very god | 13:36 |
| ochosi | good | 13:36 |
| ochosi | :) | 13:36 |
| jjfrv8 | cool | 13:36 |
| ochosi | indeed, if bluesabre is around while i am, we can discuss what parts we can copy over to docs.xfce and when | 13:37 |
| bluesabre | ochosi: with the exception of my screenshot on introduction, I think everything we've got so far is in great condition | 13:38 |
| jjfrv8 | ok. I think the overview is pretty much done. I'm not sure yet how we will link to the menu pages that slickymaster has started... | 13:38 |
| jjfrv8 | and I have yet to start on. | 13:38 |
| ochosi | bluesabre: yeah, i agree. that's why i thought we can start to migrate some pages even today if you want | 13:39 |
| ochosi | bluesabre: it's not like it has to be there in one go | 13:39 |
| bluesabre | true | 13:39 |
| bluesabre | I'd say go for it | 13:39 |
| ochosi | btw, i'm not sure we've changed the report-bugs link in 0.5 | 13:39 |
| ochosi | cause we should probably do that | 13:39 |
| ochosi | and also change the help-link | 13:40 |
| bluesabre | right now I am starting to work on an mpris plugin | 13:40 |
| ochosi | might take a while for parole 0.6 to spread (mainly because of libxfce4ui) | 13:40 |
| ochosi | sweet! | 13:40 |
| ochosi | does the dbus-stuff we already have help? | 13:40 |
| bluesabre | not sure yet | 13:40 |
| bluesabre | but yeah, go ahead and start moving some of the docs over | 13:41 |
| ochosi | alright, i'll start with something easy (commandline-opts) | 13:42 |
| bluesabre | I'm jealous of totem's python plugin interface | 13:43 |
| ochosi | mmm, i figured :) | 13:43 |
| ochosi | jjfrv8: are you fine with me copying the prefs next or is there any blocker from your perspective? | 13:44 |
| jjfrv8 | ochosi, nothing that I know of | 13:45 |
| elfy | afternoon | 13:45 |
| jjfrv8 | hey, elfy | 13:46 |
| elfy | jjfrv8 - cracking job you and slick have done :) | 13:46 |
| jjfrv8 | thanks :) | 13:46 |
| ochosi | elfy: +1 | 13:46 |
| elfy | I hope you all read this bit of my mailng " Can the team please comment on the pads where applicable and here." :) | 13:47 |
| ochosi | jjfrv8: great, now since you've set everything up already at your end, would you mind re-taking the screenshot from the introduction page? then i could copy that one over as well | 13:51 |
| ochosi | and then only the usage page is missing, but that one seemed to be pretty ready as well, no? (despite being in the playground-section for no obvious reason :p) | 13:51 |
| bluesabre | ochosi: I added that screenshot, but anybody can replace it with anything | 13:52 |
| ochosi | ah | 13:52 |
| ochosi | hm, i like video-position for the screenshot a lot btw :) | 13:53 |
| jjfrv8 | ochosi, I started with Usage in playground because I was waiting for a review before moving it. | 13:53 |
| ochosi | jjfrv8: alrighty. but this is really just the staging site, so feel free to play ;) | 13:53 |
| jjfrv8 | alright, I'll move it over now. | 13:53 |
| ochosi | cool, thanks! | 13:53 |
| jjfrv8 | I'll also see if I can reproduce bluesabre's opening screenshot and put that in. | 13:54 |
| ochosi | thanks, that's great | 13:55 |
| ochosi | it's looking a bit like we might get the docs moved over completely today \o/ | 13:55 |
| jjfrv8 | well, we're still missing some menu items. the ones I'm supposed to do :( | 13:56 |
| ochosi | ah, well no worries | 13:56 |
| ochosi | i'm even pretty happy with the status quo: http://docs.xfce.org/apps/parole/start | 13:56 |
| bluesabre | +1 | 13:57 |
| ochosi | i still love our bug-page | 13:59 |
| ochosi | we should propose this layout to more xfce-components | 13:59 |
| ochosi | although few have such a clean bugzilla as parole :p | 13:59 |
| bluesabre | this is true | 14:02 |
| bluesabre | the mpris stuff seems like it might take a while | 14:03 |
| ochosi | bluesabre: well if it isn't straightforward we can also do something else before that | 14:04 |
| bluesabre | right | 14:04 |
| ochosi | i thought it would've been nice, cause it'd have qualified parole as a basic music player as well | 14:04 |
| bluesabre | I just thought it might be a bit more accessible :) | 14:04 |
| ochosi | in modern desktops | 14:04 |
| ochosi | yeah, that's certainly true | 14:04 |
| bluesabre | right, hence my interest in it. | 14:04 |
| ochosi | in fact, the xfce-deps are a bit of a bummer now | 14:05 |
| bluesabre | I'll see what I can do with it today | 14:05 |
| ochosi | cause xfce4.12 will delay the spread of 0.6 | 14:05 |
| bluesabre | that just means more time to fix bugs and improve stability | 14:05 |
| ochosi | and it makes it harder to use parole in e.g. gnome3 | 14:05 |
| ochosi | sure, true | 14:06 |
| bluesabre | and maybe crank some plugins out | 14:06 |
| ochosi | making parole youtube-enabled would be probably on top of my list | 14:06 |
| ochosi | but even using that grillo framework might be a lot of work | 14:07 |
| bluesabre | yeah | 14:07 |
| bluesabre | there might be an easier way | 14:08 |
| ochosi | an it's a source for another gazillion new bugs | 14:08 |
| bluesabre | might look into youtube-dl | 14:08 |
| ochosi | mhmmmm | 14:08 |
| bluesabre | http://rg3.github.io/youtube-dl/ | 14:08 |
| bluesabre | might be some handy info in there | 14:08 |
| ochosi | holy moly, that one has quite a few options | 14:10 |
| ochosi | seems like it's already quite complex | 14:10 |
| bluesabre | yeah, we might be able to convert some small part of that to get our stream url | 14:10 |
| ali1234 | you can never make youtube work in a third party player | 14:11 |
| ali1234 | at best it will work only for 30% of videos | 14:11 |
| ochosi | ali1234: minitube seems to do ok | 14:11 |
| ali1234 | and after about two months it will stop working because they redesigned the website | 14:11 |
| bluesabre | still works pretty well for totem | 14:11 |
| ochosi | well true, a stable api is something else | 14:11 |
| ochosi | but we don't *have to* provide browsing of youtube in the player | 14:12 |
| bluesabre | all I'm interested in is pasting the youtube url in the open network location and it streaming something | 14:12 |
| ochosi | exactly | 14:12 |
| ochosi | holy moly, they say it works on youtube "and a few other sites", then look at this impressive list: https://github.com/rg3/youtube-dl/tree/master/youtube_dl/extractor | 14:21 |
| bluesabre | :D | 14:29 |
| bluesabre | btw ochosi, I saw that light-locker is now in trusty | 14:29 |
| ochosi | yup :) | 14:29 |
| bluesabre | I think there needs to be a minimal configuration tool for it | 14:29 |
| ochosi | and we finally managed to set up translation stuff | 14:29 |
| bluesabre | to enable/disable/set the timeout | 14:29 |
| ochosi | hm, not sure, usually you'd either have the timeout or not | 14:30 |
| bluesabre | It's all xset stuff, right? | 14:30 |
| ochosi | yup | 14:30 |
| bluesabre | should be easy to make a simple gui for that, even in C to ship as part of the light-locker package | 14:30 |
| ochosi | yeah | 14:31 |
| ochosi | i mean the timeout is just an addon to the xset stuff | 14:31 |
| bluesabre | just a thought, since ubuntu is very interested in using it, and so are we and possibly lubuntu | 14:31 |
| ochosi | yeah, i mean the thing is that even if we designed such an app, i'm not sure ubuntu wouldn't simply include a single checkbox or whatever in their powermanager-settings | 14:32 |
| bluesabre | ah | 14:32 |
| ochosi | i think a more integrated solution would be better | 14:32 |
| bluesabre | thats a good point | 14:32 |
| ochosi | so e.g. you could have a compile-time check in xfce4-powerman to see whether light-locker is there | 14:33 |
| ochosi | then just add a few settings | 14:33 |
| ochosi | a separate thingy could be an ok-fallback-solution though for people that don't use proper DEs | 14:33 |
| ochosi | what's more important, we've finally set up our translations in transifex.com, so it'll be easier for ppl to add/update the translations | 14:34 |
| bluesabre | sweet | 14:35 |
| bluesabre | actually, if you make a simple config for light-locker, the desktop entry could be set to OnlyShowIn=Xfce;LXDE etc | 14:36 |
| ochosi | sure | 14:37 |
| ochosi | but i think before we do that, it'd be nicer to get support into xfce4-powerman | 14:37 |
| ochosi | the main issue with that at the moment is anyway that lightdm would have to support the feature | 14:38 |
| ochosi | at the moment, the screen unblanks when light-locker starts the locking | 14:38 |
| ochosi | (because you get redirected to the unlock-screen) | 14:38 |
| ochosi | (and that spawns a new x-session, hence the dpms timeout is reset) | 14:38 |
| bluesabre | makes sense | 14:39 |
| ochosi | so lightdm would have to be called with some additional parameter or something to keep the screen blanked | 14:40 |
| bluesabre | but for that, wouldn't that be an ubuntu-specific patch for powerman since lightdm is not an xfce project? | 14:40 |
| ochosi | at least that'd be my approach | 14:40 |
| bluesabre | if ubuntu takes light-locker, they'll add that to lightdm for sure | 14:40 |
| ochosi | well hopefully | 14:40 |
| ochosi | not sure i got that, what ubuntu-specific patch do you mean? | 14:41 |
| bluesabre | ... and then break it for us potentially :) | 14:41 |
| ochosi | there'd not be a patch in the powermanager, but in lightdm | 14:41 |
| ochosi | and light-locker would keep its behavior as is | 14:41 |
| bluesabre | for xfce4-powerman to control light-locker timeout, enabled | 14:41 |
| ochosi | hence things should work on all distros shipping lightdm and light-locker | 14:41 |
| ochosi | xfce4-powerman would only control xset | 14:41 |
| ochosi | nothing else | 14:41 |
| ochosi | and probably the additional timeout, but that's over-the-top imo | 14:42 |
| bluesabre | oh! | 14:42 |
| bluesabre | hmmm | 14:42 |
| ochosi | 3-5secs should be fine from screen-blanking to screen-locking | 14:42 |
| ochosi | so, the way things work now: | 14:43 |
| ochosi | you set your "screensaver" with xset s $timeout | 14:43 |
| ochosi | then you start light-locker with the additional timeout parameter | 14:44 |
| ochosi | (as it is autostarted in the session, the distributor will usually set that one) | 14:44 |
| ochosi | and then after xset kicks in + light-locker-timeout, you get redirected to the login-screen | 14:44 |
| bluesabre | right | 14:45 |
| bluesabre | makes sense to me | 14:45 |
| ochosi | so all that needs to be added is for lightdm to keep the screen blanked in this case | 14:45 |
| bluesabre | awesome | 14:45 |
| ochosi | and an option in xfce4-powerman's UI to set the X-screensaver timeout | 14:46 |
| jjfrv8 | bluesabre, ochosi, I've replaced the opening screenshot: http://smdavis.us/doku/doku.php?id=introduction | 14:47 |
| ochosi | jjfrv8: sweet! nice work | 14:47 |
| ochosi | i'll copy that over then | 14:47 |
| jjfrv8 | the playback control bar turned light gray as soon as the video started playing, is that normal? | 14:47 |
| bluesabre | fantastic! | 14:47 |
| ochosi | yeah, it is | 14:47 |
| jjfrv8 | ok, good. | 14:48 |
| ochosi | the bar should be transparent, but due to gstreamer, it isn't in windowed-mode | 14:48 |
| jjfrv8 | ah | 14:48 |
| ochosi | so the transparency of the bar gets interpreted as being on a white background | 14:48 |
| ochosi | hence the brighter bg-color | 14:48 |
| ochosi | (the default screen has black bg, so the bg of the overlay is darker) | 14:49 |
| ochosi | jjfrv8: thanks a lot! done: http://docs.xfce.org/apps/parole/introduction | 14:51 |
| bluesabre | ochosi: on -offtopic, know what package he should report that bug for? | 14:52 |
| jjfrv8 | :) | 14:52 |
| PhilDick | Morning ochosi | 14:52 |
| PhilDick | I just got my first xubuntu-devel mailing list digest, and it had like one request from an apparent outsider, and no other messages... is this correct or have I got something wrong? | 14:53 |
| ochosi | PhilDick: you can always check in the web-version of the ML archive | 14:54 |
| elfy | PhilDick: hi there - there's not been much on the list this week - the digest probably missed the long one I sent earlier :) | 14:54 |
| ochosi | PhilDick: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/xubuntu-devel | 14:54 |
| PhilDick | Good reminder thanks, just thought I'd shout out and be seen ;) | 14:54 |
| PhilDick | thanks for the quick link! | 14:54 |
| ochosi | bluesabre: problem is xfce4-powerman's lack of logind-support. not sure this'll get fixed in time before 14.04, so we'll be stuck with half-broken powermanagement | 14:56 |
| ochosi | don't think anyone in xfce-core will work on it | 14:57 |
| ochosi | not too many powerman-users there afaik | 14:58 |
| ochosi | jjfrv8: would you rather finish the usage page or shall i copy over what we have now? | 15:06 |
| ochosi | (totally up to you, i don't think either is a problem) | 15:07 |
| ochosi | jjfrv8: also, small feedback, i think instead of " | 15:07 |
| ochosi | "Removes all selections at once" it could be "Removes all items in the playlist at once." | 15:07 |
| ochosi | bluesabre: hm, we also need a part on keyboard-shortcuts in parole. would you rather put that in usage or on a separate page? | 15:09 |
| bluesabre | probably in usage | 15:10 |
| bluesabre | and should we mention in the docs where the auto-saved playlist is stored? | 15:10 |
| ochosi | yeah, probably a good idea | 15:10 |
| bluesabre | also document the right-click menu | 15:11 |
| ochosi | hmm, true | 15:11 |
| bluesabre | which I updated today | 15:11 |
| bluesabre | so be sure to pull the latest git | 15:11 |
| ochosi | you did? oh, haven't seen | 15:11 |
| bluesabre | I'll document the plugins | 15:11 |
| ochosi | cool | 15:13 |
| ochosi | noted the todo-stuff in your wiki, just not to forget it | 15:17 |
| bluesabre | thanks | 15:17 |
| jjfrv8 | ochosi, good feedback. I made the change. | 15:20 |
| jjfrv8 | I was going to do some more work on the Usage page... | 15:20 |
| jjfrv8 | maybe try to link slickymaster's stuff into it... | 15:20 |
| jjfrv8 | don't know how far I'll get today, though | 15:20 |
| jjfrv8 | I was also thinking of putting in a section on kb shortcuts and will add bluesabre's suggestion about auto-saved location. | 15:22 |
| bluesabre | great! | 15:22 |
| jjfrv8 | bluesabre, I will run updates. What should I look for with the right-click menu? | 15:23 |
| bluesabre | The order, previous should come before next track | 15:24 |
| jjfrv8 | bluesabre, got the update but I don't think it changed. http://imagebin.org/275535 | 15:29 |
| bluesabre | yeah, looks like the package hasn't rebuilt yet | 15:31 |
| bluesabre | I'll try to force it | 15:31 |
| bluesabre | ok, launchpad estimates the package should be rebuilt and available in around an hour | 15:34 |
| jjfrv8 | sounds like lunchtime then :) | 15:35 |
| jjfrv8 | bbiab | 15:36 |
| ochosi | jjfrv8: sweet! and bon appetit :) | 15:43 |
| ochosi | bluesabre: so you're still working on mpris2? | 15:45 |
| bluesabre | got distracted | 15:45 |
| ochosi | if you want, i can try to dig up some more example code, or something that's closer to what we need | 15:45 |
| bluesabre | :D | 15:45 |
| ochosi | hehe, nvm | 15:45 |
| bluesabre | I found some example code | 15:45 |
| bluesabre | inside of bluez | 15:45 |
| bluesabre | unfortunately, it seems to be registered as an active application with mpris, you have to use dbus-service | 15:46 |
| bluesabre | which makes for a lot of code | 15:46 |
| bluesabre | so I might put this off for now | 15:47 |
| ochosi | sure, no worries | 15:48 |
| ochosi | i added a plugin-part to the wiki | 15:48 |
| ochosi | is it as you'd expect? | 15:48 |
| ochosi | (staging site, ofc) | 15:48 |
| ochosi | alternatively we could have the plugins all on one page | 15:48 |
| bluesabre | I think it'd be best to have them on a single page | 15:49 |
| ochosi | yeah, with the amount of plugins we have now they can easily fit on one page | 15:49 |
| bluesabre | since they don't have many features | 15:49 |
| ochosi | ok, converted | 15:51 |
| bluesabre | think I might try to get some work done for menulibre now | 15:51 |
| ochosi | you mean the classical menu-editing stuff? | 15:54 |
| bluesabre | yeah | 15:54 |
| ochosi | wasn't that very messy and frustrating? :) | 15:54 |
| bluesabre | I've been doing a little bit at a time and thinking about how to best go about it | 15:55 |
| bluesabre | I think I've got a pretty clear idea of what to do now | 15:55 |
| ochosi | and UI wise? | 15:55 |
| bluesabre | for the classic view, I'm going for two panes | 15:56 |
| bluesabre | the left pane will be a folding applications view with DnD | 15:56 |
| bluesabre | the right pane will be the standard menulibre editor | 15:56 |
| bluesabre | just not the iconview | 15:57 |
| bluesabre | the modern view will stay the same | 15:57 |
| bluesabre | or I can get rid of the modern view and just go full-classic | 15:57 |
| bluesabre | since the editor is the good part | 15:57 |
| bluesabre | either way, the new design will make it a lot more modular | 15:58 |
| bluesabre | and easier to hack on | 15:58 |
| ochosi | folding applications? | 15:58 |
| ochosi | a listview with extenders? | 15:59 |
| bluesabre | a multi-level treeview | 15:59 |
| bluesabre | yeah, that | 15:59 |
| ochosi | for the categories? | 15:59 |
| bluesabre | yup | 15:59 |
| ochosi | i see | 15:59 |
| bluesabre | think xfce menu inside of a treeview | 15:59 |
| ochosi | sure sure | 16:00 |
| bluesabre | or combining the two panes from alacarte | 16:00 |
| ochosi | the extenders would show what? apps or just subfolders? | 16:00 |
| bluesabre | both | 16:00 |
| ochosi | so the right pane would only be in use for the details/editing | 16:00 |
| bluesabre | yes | 16:00 |
| ochosi | not bad, but imagine you have tons of apps | 16:01 |
| ochosi | the left side will get pretty... long | 16:01 |
| bluesabre | it will be completed folder by default, just showing the categories | 16:01 |
| bluesabre | and search will still work | 16:01 |
| bluesabre | s/folder/folded | 16:01 |
| ochosi | sure, i'm just imagining extending a category and ending up with a really long list :) | 16:02 |
| bluesabre | it could happen :) | 16:02 |
| ochosi | but otoh i don't think there's a much better way | 16:02 |
| bluesabre | and it does even with the xfce menu | 16:02 |
| bluesabre | I'll try to have something working this/next weekend | 16:04 |
| ochosi | wow, sounds nice | 16:07 |
| bluesabre | emphasis on try | 16:08 |
| ochosi | :) | 16:09 |
| ochosi | jjfrv8: i added in a placeholder for the kb-shortcuts, do you want me to keep the autosaved-playlist-location on the todo-list on the first page for you? | 17:12 |
| ochosi | anyway, if you don't need that reminder, just feel free to drop it from the frontpage :) | 17:13 |
| jjfrv8 | ochosi, it's okay to leave the reminder there. | 17:14 |
| jjfrv8 | I'm having some issues, though, with dokuwiki... | 17:14 |
| ochosi | yes? | 17:14 |
| jjfrv8 | I was trying to figure out how to integrate all the menu pages... | 17:15 |
| jjfrv8 | it seemed like it was going to create a very large single page but I could not figure out how to break it up... | 17:15 |
| jjfrv8 | without creating sub-namespaces on the main wiki page... | 17:15 |
| ochosi | go ahead and create sub-namespaces | 17:16 |
| ochosi | i don't see any issues with that | 17:16 |
| jjfrv8 | so I wanted to see if just the TOC on the top right of the page would be enough... | 17:16 |
| ochosi | e.g. parole:menu:* | 17:16 |
| jjfrv8 | that's when I got into trouble with formatting | 17:16 |
| ochosi | i mean to the worst the TOC helps ppl to navigate | 17:17 |
| jjfrv8 | just a sec, I'll show you what I mean | 17:18 |
| ochosi | sure, thanks | 17:19 |
| jjfrv8 | as the TOC got longer, it pushed my first screenshot down the page and there was a big gap. So I pasted another image in without the "Figure" | 17:19 |
| jjfrv8 | and now I any new text wants to flow around the screenshots. So here's my current workaround: http://smdavis.us/doku/doku.php?id=playground:playground | 17:20 |
| jjfrv8 | why the first screenshot is not centered like the others, I don't know | 17:23 |
| ochosi | hmm strange | 17:23 |
| ochosi | looks like a bug in the dokuwiki theme | 17:24 |
| jjfrv8 | Yeah, in bluesabre's intro page, the first line of text went under the screenshot just fine. It doesn't work that way in my page... | 17:24 |
| jjfrv8 | it will flow around the first screenshot, unless I make it a "figure" | 17:24 |
| bluesabre | you have to tell the image to be centered | 17:25 |
| bluesabre | I don't remember how to at this point though | 17:25 |
| ochosi | you have to add spaces | 17:25 |
| ochosi | instead of {{wiki:usage-intro:intro-main-window-plain.png?nolink |}} | 17:26 |
| ochosi | use {{ wiki:usage-intro:intro-main-window-plain.png?nolink |}} | 17:26 |
| ochosi | the space after {{ means left-aligned, the one before |}} means right-aligned | 17:26 |
| ochosi | both together mean centered | 17:26 |
| ochosi | but i'm not sure that really solves your problem | 17:27 |
| jjfrv8 | ooh, let me try that. | 17:27 |
| ochosi | problem is anyway that the TOC takes away some precious width for the first few paragraphs... | 17:27 |
| ochosi | ristretto worked around it by adding some text-only stuff on the top of the page: http://docs.xfce.org/apps/ristretto/preferences | 17:28 |
| jjfrv8 | badda bing! I think that might just do it. | 17:29 |
| ochosi | cool | 17:29 |
| ochosi | although i have to admit the text in ristretto is a bit superfluous, duplicating the TOC :) | 17:30 |
| elfy | they perhaps had the same discussion - just had it first :) | 17:31 |
| ochosi | hehe, possible | 17:31 |
| elfy | shame you can't have to TOC 'floating' so it is always visible and the doc itself fits in the rest of the pane | 17:32 |
| jjfrv8 | does this look all right? http://smdavis.us/doku/doku.php?id=playground:playground | 17:33 |
| jjfrv8 | it repeats the main window shot but I thought it might be weird to show it with the highlights right off the bat anyway | 17:33 |
| ochosi | hm, yeah it's a bit repetetive | 17:36 |
| ochosi | as we have a very similar screenshot in "intro" | 17:36 |
| ochosi | i don't have a problem with showing the highlights directly, i think that is very nice and useful | 17:36 |
| ochosi | (but ideally that screener wouldn't be scaled down) | 17:37 |
| jjfrv8 | okay, I can left-align it without using 'figure' and that should do it. | 17:37 |
| ochosi | righty, go ahead | 17:38 |
| ochosi | also, we can figure out these formatting issues when the page is kinda finished | 17:38 |
| ochosi | who knows, maybe more notes in the beginning will become necessary | 17:38 |
| jjfrv8 | ok | 17:38 |
| jjfrv8 | shall we leave it like this for now? http://smdavis.us/doku/doku.php?id=playground:playground | 17:45 |
| ochosi | jjfrv8: you can put the text "The three main parts..." above the screenshot, that might help with the alignment | 17:46 |
| ochosi | just replace "above" with "below" in the text ;) | 17:47 |
| jjfrv8 | k | 17:47 |
| ochosi | oh, and you could actually link those 3 headlines to parts of the page | 17:47 |
| jjfrv8 | ! | 17:48 |
| ochosi | jjfrv8: alright, i think i gotta leave for tonight | 18:00 |
| ochosi | feel free to ping me whenever problems occur or when you've finished another part that i can copy over to docs.xfce | 18:00 |
| jjfrv8 | I think I do too. Thanks for your help. I might be able to finish enough to copy it over tomorrow. | 18:00 |
| ochosi | thanks again for your efforts, really great! | 18:00 |
| ochosi | sounds good | 18:01 |
| jjfrv8 | will do. | 18:01 |
| ochosi | have a nice evening everyone | 18:01 |
| Noskcaj | Does anyone know why xubuntu-bugs is subscribed to convertall ? | 19:40 |
| elfy | I don't | 19:41 |
| Noskcaj | It would be a good thing to include in xubuntu, but since it's not, i don't see why -bugs is subscribed | 19:47 |
| elfy | the only idea I have is that it was done before I got mails re that bug | 19:48 |
| elfy | no idea what it even is | 19:48 |
| Noskcaj | It's a really powerful unit converter, that i now maintain in debian | 19:53 |
| elfy | unit converter? | 19:54 |
| Noskcaj | e.g. meters to feet | 19:54 |
| elfy | oic | 19:54 |
| elfy | I can't see any reason to have that in Xubuntu | 19:55 |
| elfy | not sure why we'd be subscribed to it either, given what it is :) | 19:55 |
| elfy | Noskcaj: I can't even see how we're subscribed to it | 19:57 |
| elfy | nvm - yes I can lol - time to turn it off and go sit elsewhere ... | 19:58 |
| Noskcaj | bluesabre, Why does the build.py for catfish import so many unused modules? is it just to check that all dependencies are installed? | 20:33 |
| PhilDick | I'm trying to get up-to-speed on testing for 14.04. I'm looking here: http://packages.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/306/builds/55995/testcases, but I don't see any download instructions that describe what environment/setup I need to have in place before testing. I know I'm newb, any advice appreciated. | 20:48 |
| PhilDick | I mean the link to "install instructions" links to a page with no apparent instructions... | 20:49 |
| Noskcaj | PhilDick, Are you trying to use a VM or install on actual hardware? | 20:53 |
| PhilDick | I could go down either path, I was thinking about setting up a new partition on my actual hardware | 20:54 |
| PhilDick | Easiest that gets me going is probably best | 20:54 |
| Noskcaj | How much RAM do you have? | 20:55 |
| PhilDick | I have older hardware currently, AMD X2 + 4Gb RAM | 20:55 |
| PhilDick | I've ran VirtualBox on this box on the past, was usable, but haven't used it lately | 20:55 |
| Noskcaj | for a VM, install the program testdrive-gtk. For real hardware, put the iso on a usb or dvd and install it with manual partitioning | 20:56 |
| PhilDick | Where do I find xubuntu 14.04 iso? | 20:56 |
| Noskcaj | http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/xubuntu/daily-live/20131102/ or in testdrive | 20:58 |
| PhilDick | Thank you. I need to figure out testdrive more, but I might start with the iso for now... guess that changes daily though. | 20:58 |
| PhilDick | I'm just trying to keep at it for now, keep moving forward and take notes. | 20:58 |
| Noskcaj | bluesabre, I've made a start at pep8 conversion for catfish at lp:~noskcaj/catfish-search/pep8 . Would you like all changes in the one branch? | 21:18 |
| bluesabre | Noskcaj: Your awesomeness never ends, does it? | 21:48 |
| bluesabre | By all means, one branch would be fine. | 21:48 |
| Noskcaj | bluesabre, thanks, i should have all the pep8/flake8 fixes by the end of the day (australia time). | 21:56 |
| bluesabre | fantastic, thanks a lot! | 21:56 |
| bluesabre | in case you get excited, don't worry about doing that for menulibre yet, I'm currently rewriting it :) | 21:59 |
| ochosi | bluesabre: idea (menulibre): use the traditional view for normal editing, use the "new/current view" for search-results | 22:07 |
| brainwash | ochosi: just curious, wouldn't it be possible to fork gnome-screensaver and copy the interface of lightd-gtk-greeter? | 22:08 |
| brainwash | I still dislike the vt switching :( | 22:09 |
| ochosi | that was our initial idea before creating light-locker | 22:09 |
| ochosi | but it makes user-switching more cumbersome | 22:09 |
| ochosi | and the cleanest approach is to use lightdm | 22:09 |
| bluesabre | vt-switching has one very annoying drawback | 22:09 |
| bluesabre | audio | 22:09 |
| ochosi | (in fact we started out with that, a gnome-screensaver using the .ui file of the gtk-greeter) | 22:10 |
| brainwash | well, it would still use lightdm for this | 22:10 |
| brainwash | mmh | 22:10 |
| bluesabre | ochosi: not sure if that would be a good thing for menulibre or not, but I can definitely experiment with it :) | 22:10 |
| ochosi | bluesabre: well it's such a pity to see the current view going away... i really like it and think it's easy to use and simple | 22:11 |
| ochosi | bluesabre: all for editing the traditional menu, when we might switch to something like whiskermenu (which uses categories as well, not a fixed menu-file afaik) | 22:12 |
| ochosi | and then who else uses fixed menus like xfce/xubuntu does atm? | 22:12 |
| brainwash | lxde | 22:13 |
| bluesabre | oh, we don't use a single fixed file | 22:13 |
| bluesabre | if that was the case it would be easy | 22:13 |
| ochosi | brainwash: my hope is that the lightdm guys will figure out taking away the pain of vt-switching | 22:13 |
| ochosi | brainwash: e.g. with fading or some Mir-trick, who knows | 22:13 |
| brainwash | mir trick? xfce won't support mir any time soon | 22:15 |
| ochosi | i guess not, but maybe wayland will help | 22:15 |
| ochosi | anyway, stripping out the gnome-components isnt that hard, and you can pick up from a commit where we did that with light-locker and then implement the gtk-greeter UI ;) | 22:16 |
| brainwash | sounds interesting | 22:17 |
| brainwash | btw I was about to create a PPA for xfce4-panel with support gtk3 indicators, but gave up after like 1 minute.. "how the heck do I build the packages?!" | 22:19 |
| brainwash | :) | 22:19 |
| brainwash | local I assume, or? | 22:20 |
| ochosi | building locally should work fine with the instructions in the wiki | 22:20 |
| brainwash | and how do I upload the packages? | 22:21 |
| ochosi | dput? | 22:21 |
| brainwash | ok, looks like need to read some more tutorials | 22:22 |
| brainwash | I | 22:22 |
| brainwash | so far I've only uploaded the changes files and the packages have been built remotely | 22:22 |
| ochosi | that's the only way i've done it either | 22:23 |
| ochosi | micahg might know more about that | 22:23 |
| brainwash | still waiting for someone to create a PPA for the panel, but nothing so far, so why not try it myself :) | 22:24 |
| ochosi | yeah, sounds good | 22:25 |
| brainwash | btw bug 1205384 | 22:26 |
| ubottu | bug 1205384 in lxsession (Ubuntu) "Lock can be circumvented by switching to console" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1205384 | 22:26 |
| brainwash | still not fixed | 22:26 |
| ochosi | only way to fix it is by using gnome-screensaver or light-locker or something like that | 22:26 |
| brainwash | or switch back to xscreensaver | 22:26 |
| Noskcaj | brainwash, You need to use dput, with the target as your ppa and this input as a .changes file made by debuild -S | 22:28 |
| brainwash | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Roadmap/Specifications/Saucy/Gtk3Indicators | 22:32 |
| brainwash | what about the dependencies? | 22:33 |
| Noskcaj | brainwash, Are they in the ubuntu repositories? (if so, just make them build-dependancies) | 22:34 |
| Noskcaj | If not, find a way to link PPAs or upload them | 22:35 |
| brainwash | most are, but newer versions are needed also | 22:35 |
| Noskcaj | Maybe upload the stuff from the pkg-xfce debian SVN? | 22:35 |
| Noskcaj | I don't really know, ask micahg or mr_pouit | 22:36 |
| ali1234 | micahg was trying to package the indicator stuff, but got problems | 22:36 |
| ali1234 | the problem is mainly that we need to package from a random arbitrary git commit, not a real release | 22:36 |
| brainwash | maybe it's a bit too complicated for me at this point, started to learn how to build packages for a PPA just yesterday | 22:36 |
| ali1234 | tweaking something that is already packaged is much easier | 22:38 |
| ochosi | actually the branch is mergeable | 22:39 |
| ochosi | i hope it will happen soon | 22:39 |
| ali1234 | ochosi: i found the appindicator problem, and a couple more bugs in the process | 22:40 |
| ochosi | ali1234: right, so what's going on there? | 22:41 |
| ali1234 | well it looks like some gtk3 changes got backported to gtk2, but the special case code in appindicator was not removed | 22:41 |
| ochosi | hmpf | 22:42 |
| ali1234 | i asked tedg about it, but he couldn't remember anything useful | 22:42 |
| ochosi | lordy | 22:42 |
| ali1234 | it's actually in libdbusmenu, not libappindicator | 22:42 |
| ochosi | so was he at least interesetd in the fix? | 22:42 |
| ali1234 | hard to say. i only got a 1 line reply | 22:42 |
| ali1234 | annoyingly, libdbusmenu cannot be built in a ppa because one of the tests fails only in a ppa - where you cannot get the log to find out why | 22:43 |
| ali1234 | all this is reported on the relevant bugs, which have been met with stony silence | 22:44 |
| ochosi | email to ayatana ML? | 22:44 |
| ali1234 | i guess so. that ML looks dead tbh... only a couple of posts per week | 22:44 |
| ali1234 | last time i tried to post my message never got through the moderation queue | 22:45 |
| ochosi | there's a moderation queue even if you're subscribed? | 22:46 |
| ali1234 | i don't think you can post at all if you're not subscribed | 22:46 |
| ochosi | hmm | 22:46 |
| brainwash | ochosi: bug 1247470 | 22:49 |
| ubottu | bug 1247470 in firefox (Ubuntu) "firefox tooltip sometimes too big" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1247470 | 22:49 |
| brainwash | looks like greybird | 22:49 |
| brainwash | see the attached screenshot | 22:49 |
| ali1234 | i might just hit the "request merge" button on my libdbusmenu branch... at least then someone might look at it | 22:52 |
| ali1234 | correction: the ayatana design list is now known as unity-design and hasn't had a post in over a month | 22:53 |
| ochosi | ali1234: yeah, try with a merge-request | 22:56 |
| ochosi | can't hurt | 22:56 |
| ochosi | but also be sure to ping someone about it | 22:57 |
| ochosi | brainwash: i'm not sure there's much i can do about it, ff isn't even gtk | 22:58 |
| ochosi | i've never seen this so far | 22:58 |
| brainwash | greybird is most likely not even the cause | 22:59 |
| brainwash | so ff is not gtk.. how do you theme it then? o.o | 22:59 |
| ochosi | firefox uses XUL and with some black magic it tries to resemble gtk | 23:00 |
| ochosi | but some stuff almost always looks different, like tabs | 23:00 |
| ochosi | not very noticeable, but also because i decided not to do anything crazy with greybird | 23:01 |
| ochosi | tooltips are always square | 23:01 |
| ochosi | and more stuff i guess | 23:01 |
| brainwash | maybe the next ff release will fix it | 23:02 |
| ochosi | that particular bug? yeah, maybe | 23:02 |
| ochosi | or are you referring to the UI changes in firefox that are coming up sometime later this year? | 23:02 |
| ochosi | (iirc i read something like that a while ago) | 23:03 |
| brainwash | the tooltip one | 23:03 |
| ochosi | night everyone | 23:07 |
| brainwash | ochosi: good night | 23:07 |
| ali1234 | https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-datetime/+bug/1228360 sounds like the same thing we've seen with xfce4-panel | 23:31 |
| ubottu | Ubuntu bug 1228360 in indicator-datetime (Ubuntu) "No clock in menu bar and can't edit Clock settings" [Undecided,Confirmed] | 23:31 |
| PhilDick | If there's somewhere else I should ask, please point me there... #ubuntu-quality? | 23:35 |
| PhilDick | I'm trying to get testdrive-gtk working... 1) It has two identical looking entries for xubuntu Trusty Tahr 2) When I "launch" either one, nothing happens... is there an environment needed that the package doesn't check for? | 23:36 |
| ali1234 | yeah #ubuntu-quality is your best bet | 23:40 |
| PhilDick | thx | 23:40 |
| ali1234 | but there won't be anyone there on a saturday night | 23:40 |
| PhilDick | what kind of geeks are these??? ;) | 23:40 |
| ali1234 | paid ones | 23:40 |
| PhilDick | LOL | 23:40 |
| ali1234 | also, i have to day, we know plenty of bugs in xubuntu already | 23:40 |
| PhilDick | day = say? | 23:40 |
| ali1234 | *say | 23:40 |
| PhilDick | I just want to get in the loop early so I'm able to get involved... | 23:41 |
| PhilDick | I think I can download an iso and point it at that... | 23:41 |
| ali1234 | this is just my opinion, but i am not really impressed by the iso testing stuff. it appears to be just another step to make bug reporting harder | 23:41 |
| PhilDick | Yah, I'm a little ... challenged by the lack of a "just get started testing" howto | 23:42 |
| PhilDick | not giving up yet, but only have so much time... | 23:42 |
| skellat | ali1234: Make sure you attend the virtual session at Ubuntu Developer Summit in three weeks or so. Bug Reporting & Quality Assurance will have a panel going on. | 23:43 |
| ali1234 | skellat: i did all that SRU stuff | 23:44 |
| ali1234 | i have no idea if i did it right though | 23:44 |
| skellat | Someone will comment on the bug if you didn't | 23:44 |
| skellat | The current vUDS-1311 panels list is here: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1311/all/ | 23:45 |
| ali1234 | i never know what to do at vUDS | 23:45 |
| skellat | ali1234: From the Xubuntu perspective, mostly observe | 23:46 |
| skellat | If you can chime in via IRC, try | 23:46 |
| skellat | But mostly observe | 23:46 |
| PhilDick | skellat, excellent, I was wondering about those workshops... I'll have to check the UTC it's going on at | 23:46 |
| ali1234 | they're not workshops - we do do those though | 23:46 |
| ali1234 | UDS is like planning meetings | 23:46 |
| PhilDick | I heard balloons say something about upcoming QA workshops | 23:47 |
| ali1234 | yeah, that will probably be after UDS | 23:47 |
| Noskcaj | PhilDick, Yeah, we've got logs of old ones if you wanted a look | 23:47 |
| skellat | The more community-related matters that fall under LoCo Council's remit are being separated to a different summit if we manage to pull things together in time. Tentatively that's supposed to be scheduled for November 23rd so that'll leave vUDS-1311 a lot more focused on tech & planning. | 23:48 |
| ali1234 | lol, forking UDS? | 23:48 |
| skellat | ali1234: Yep | 23:48 |
| Noskcaj | The QA workshops might be different since phill has left most of ubuntu and we think good wiki pages and videos would be more useful | 23:48 |
| ali1234 | lordy. things are getting weird | 23:49 |
| PhilDick | Noskcaj sounds useful, can you point me towards them? IRC logs I guess? | 23:49 |
| skellat | ali1234: It more comes down to a time factor. For LoCo Council it is easier for the others to participate on the weekend. The vUDS-1308 schedule was a little too jam packed so taking stuff that would be under our remit out should balance nicely. | 23:50 |
| ali1234 | PhilDick: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom | 23:50 |
| ali1234 | skellat: i never really understood what the council does anyway | 23:50 |
| ali1234 | except for "free PR" | 23:50 |
| skellat | ali1234: Equip, Advise, Mentor for local communities. Help them keep going, intervene with Canonical if they need help, and otherwise serve as back-end support. | 23:51 |
| skellat | All of this being said, I'm probably going to have to give thought to Three Nights of Xubuntu appearing again | 23:52 |
| ali1234 | but what do LoCos actually do? | 23:52 |
| Noskcaj | ali1234, translations, support, mirror hosting, installfests, release partys | 23:53 |
| skellat | To a certain extent, this session on testing the upgrade path from 12.04 to 14.04 makes me nervous: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1311/meeting/21973/core-1311-lts-upgrade-testing/ | 23:55 |
| PhilDick | thanks for the link ali1234. Also, I've moved to only running LTS's so I'm... wondering what makes you nervous? I have to reboot to another partition, brb | 23:56 |
| ali1234 | there's different types of LTS now too, with enablement or without... | 23:56 |
| skellat | Generally we don't have hardware enablement stacks in Xubuntu so that's not an issue | 23:57 |
| skellat | Ubuntu gets those but we don't | 23:57 |
| PhilDick | hmmm, tell me more when I come back... | 23:57 |
| ali1234 | automated anything makes me nervous | 23:57 |
| ali1234 | if the developer remembered to write a test, they probably remembered not to cause the bug in the first place | 23:58 |
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