NoskcajWhere's the logout bug? Someone reported a dupe at bug 124733705:50
ubottubug 1247337 in xfce4-session (Ubuntu) "Xfce Restart button logs me out but does not reboot" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/124733705:50
brainwashali1234: https://launchpad.net/~thad-fisch/+archive/rand10:35
bluesabreslickymaster, jjfrv8; this channel is too long... where is the page with the theme definition on my wiki?11:39
bluesabremicahg: If you get a chance, could you approve this and merge it so we can fix two very simple bugs? https://code.launchpad.net/~smd-seandavis/xubuntu-default-settings/b2_fixes11:46
bluesabreI've had the merge request available for it since beta 211:47
sadinugh woops to out of it this morning...12:12
jjfrv8bluesabre, you mean this one? http://smdavis.us/doku/doku.php?id=playground:sceenshot-stds12:44
bluesabreyes, thanks!12:44
ali1234brainwash: yeah it doesn't build12:51
jjfrv8bluesabre, all the data on that page were current but my screenshots weren't. I just corrected that.13:09
jjfrv8I've also updated the screenshots on the pages I've been working on: http://smdavis.us/doku/doku.php?id=playground:playground13:11
ochosijjfrv8: nice work!13:33
ochosilooks pretty13:33
jjfrv8ochosi, so you think I'm on the right track? It's not too basic and stating the obvious?13:35
ochosino, to me this looks very god13:36
ochosiindeed, if bluesabre is around while i am, we can discuss what parts we can copy over to docs.xfce and when13:37
bluesabreochosi: with the exception of my screenshot on introduction, I think everything we've got so far is in great condition13:38
jjfrv8ok. I think the overview is pretty much done. I'm not sure yet how we will link to the menu pages that slickymaster has started...13:38
jjfrv8and I have yet to start on.13:38
ochosibluesabre: yeah, i agree. that's why i thought we can start to migrate some pages even today if you want13:39
ochosibluesabre: it's not like it has to be there in one go13:39
bluesabreI'd say go for it13:39
ochosibtw, i'm not sure we've changed the report-bugs link in 0.513:39
ochosicause we should probably do that13:39
ochosiand also change the help-link13:40
bluesabreright now I am starting to work on an mpris plugin13:40
ochosimight take a while for parole 0.6 to spread (mainly because of libxfce4ui)13:40
ochosidoes the dbus-stuff we already have help?13:40
bluesabrenot sure yet13:40
bluesabrebut yeah, go ahead and start moving some of the docs over13:41
ochosialright, i'll start with something easy (commandline-opts)13:42
bluesabreI'm jealous of totem's python plugin interface13:43
ochosimmm, i figured :)13:43
ochosijjfrv8: are you fine with me copying the prefs next or is there any blocker from your perspective?13:44
jjfrv8ochosi, nothing that I know of13:45
elfyafternoon 13:45
jjfrv8hey, elfy 13:46
elfyjjfrv8 - cracking job you and slick have done :)13:46
jjfrv8thanks :)13:46
ochosielfy: +113:46
elfyI hope you all read this bit of my mailng " Can the team please comment on the pads where applicable and here." :)13:47
ochosijjfrv8: great, now since you've set everything up already at your end, would you mind re-taking the screenshot from the introduction page? then i could copy that one over as well13:51
ochosiand then only the usage page is missing, but that one seemed to be pretty ready as well, no? (despite being in the playground-section for no obvious reason :p)13:51
bluesabreochosi: I added that screenshot, but anybody can replace it with anything13:52
ochosihm, i like video-position for the screenshot a lot btw :)13:53
jjfrv8ochosi, I started with Usage in playground because I was waiting for a review before moving it.13:53
ochosijjfrv8: alrighty. but this is really just the staging site, so feel free to play ;)13:53
jjfrv8alright, I'll move it over now.13:53
ochosicool, thanks!13:53
jjfrv8I'll also see if I can reproduce bluesabre's opening screenshot and put that in.13:54
ochosithanks, that's great13:55
ochosiit's looking a bit like we might get the docs moved over completely today \o/13:55
jjfrv8well, we're still missing some menu items. the ones I'm supposed to do :(13:56
ochosiah, well no worries13:56
ochosii'm even pretty happy with the status quo: http://docs.xfce.org/apps/parole/start13:56
ochosii still love our bug-page13:59
ochosiwe should propose this layout to more xfce-components13:59
ochosialthough few have such a clean bugzilla as parole :p13:59
bluesabrethis is true14:02
bluesabrethe mpris stuff seems like it might take a while14:03
ochosibluesabre: well if it isn't straightforward we can also do something else before that14:04
ochosii thought it would've been nice, cause it'd have qualified parole as a basic music player as well14:04
bluesabreI just thought it might be a bit more accessible :)14:04
ochosiin modern desktops14:04
ochosiyeah, that's certainly true14:04
bluesabreright, hence my interest in it.14:04
ochosiin fact, the xfce-deps are a bit of a bummer now14:05
bluesabreI'll see what I can do with it today14:05
ochosicause xfce4.12 will delay the spread of 0.614:05
bluesabrethat just means more time to fix bugs and improve stability14:05
ochosiand it makes it harder to use parole in e.g. gnome314:05
ochosisure, true14:06
bluesabreand maybe crank some plugins out14:06
ochosimaking parole youtube-enabled would be probably on top of my list14:06
ochosibut even using that grillo framework might be a lot of work14:07
bluesabrethere might be an easier way14:08
ochosian it's a source for another gazillion new bugs14:08
bluesabremight look into youtube-dl14:08
bluesabremight be some handy info in there14:08
ochosiholy moly, that one has quite a few options14:10
ochosiseems like it's already quite complex14:10
bluesabreyeah, we might be able to convert some small part of that to get our stream url14:10
ali1234you can never make youtube work in a third party player14:11
ali1234at best it will work only for 30% of videos14:11
ochosiali1234: minitube seems to do ok14:11
ali1234and after about two months it will stop working because they redesigned the website14:11
bluesabrestill works pretty well for totem14:11
ochosiwell true, a stable api is something else14:11
ochosibut we don't *have to* provide browsing of youtube in the player14:12
bluesabreall I'm interested in is pasting the youtube url in the open network location and it streaming something14:12
ochosiholy moly, they say it works on youtube "and a few other sites", then look at this impressive list: https://github.com/rg3/youtube-dl/tree/master/youtube_dl/extractor14:21
bluesabrebtw ochosi, I saw that light-locker is now in trusty14:29
ochosiyup :)14:29
bluesabreI think there needs to be a minimal configuration tool for it14:29
ochosiand we finally managed to set up translation stuff14:29
bluesabreto enable/disable/set the timeout14:29
ochosihm, not sure, usually you'd either have the timeout or not14:30
bluesabreIt's all xset stuff, right?14:30
bluesabreshould be easy to make a simple gui for that, even in C to ship as part of the light-locker package14:30
ochosii mean the timeout is just an addon to the xset stuff14:31
bluesabrejust a thought, since ubuntu is very interested in using it, and so are we and possibly lubuntu14:31
ochosiyeah, i mean the thing is that even if we designed such an app, i'm not sure ubuntu wouldn't simply include a single checkbox or whatever in their powermanager-settings14:32
ochosii think a more integrated solution would be better14:32
bluesabrethats a good point14:32
ochosiso e.g. you could have a compile-time check in xfce4-powerman to see whether light-locker is there14:33
ochosithen just add a few settings14:33
ochosia separate thingy could be an ok-fallback-solution though for people that don't use proper DEs14:33
ochosiwhat's more important, we've finally set up our translations in transifex.com, so it'll be easier for ppl to add/update the translations14:34
bluesabreactually, if you make a simple config for light-locker, the desktop entry could be set to OnlyShowIn=Xfce;LXDE etc14:36
ochosibut i think before we do that, it'd be nicer to get support into xfce4-powerman14:37
ochosithe main issue with that at the moment is anyway that lightdm would have to support the feature14:38
ochosiat the moment, the screen unblanks when light-locker starts the locking14:38
ochosi(because you get redirected to the unlock-screen)14:38
ochosi(and that spawns a new x-session, hence the dpms timeout is reset)14:38
bluesabremakes sense14:39
ochosiso lightdm would have to be called with some additional parameter or something to keep the screen blanked14:40
bluesabrebut for that, wouldn't that be an ubuntu-specific patch for powerman since lightdm is not an xfce project?14:40
ochosiat least that'd be my approach14:40
bluesabreif ubuntu takes light-locker, they'll add that to lightdm for sure14:40
ochosiwell hopefully14:40
ochosinot sure i got that, what ubuntu-specific patch do you mean?14:41
bluesabre... and then break it for us potentially :)14:41
ochosithere'd not be a patch in the powermanager, but in lightdm14:41
ochosiand light-locker would keep its behavior as is14:41
bluesabrefor xfce4-powerman to control light-locker timeout, enabled14:41
ochosihence things should work on all distros shipping lightdm and light-locker14:41
ochosixfce4-powerman would only control xset14:41
ochosinothing else14:41
ochosiand probably the additional timeout, but that's over-the-top imo14:42
ochosi3-5secs should be fine from screen-blanking to screen-locking14:42
ochosiso, the way things work now:14:43
ochosiyou set your "screensaver" with xset s $timeout14:43
ochosithen you start light-locker with the additional timeout parameter14:44
ochosi(as it is autostarted in the session, the distributor will usually set that one)14:44
ochosiand then after xset kicks in + light-locker-timeout, you get redirected to the login-screen14:44
bluesabremakes sense to me14:45
ochosiso all that needs to be added is for lightdm to keep the screen blanked in this case14:45
ochosiand an option in xfce4-powerman's UI to set the X-screensaver timeout14:46
jjfrv8bluesabre, ochosi, I've replaced the opening screenshot: http://smdavis.us/doku/doku.php?id=introduction14:47
ochosijjfrv8: sweet! nice work14:47
ochosii'll copy that over then14:47
jjfrv8the playback control bar turned light gray as soon as the video started playing, is that normal?14:47
ochosiyeah, it is14:47
jjfrv8ok, good.14:48
ochosithe bar should be transparent, but due to gstreamer, it isn't in windowed-mode14:48
ochosiso the transparency of the bar gets interpreted as being on a white background14:48
ochosihence the brighter bg-color14:48
ochosi(the default screen has black bg, so the bg of the overlay is darker)14:49
ochosijjfrv8: thanks a lot! done: http://docs.xfce.org/apps/parole/introduction14:51
bluesabreochosi: on -offtopic, know what package he should report that bug for?14:52
PhilDickMorning ochosi14:52
PhilDickI just got my first xubuntu-devel mailing list digest, and it had like one request from an apparent outsider, and no other messages... is this correct or have I got something wrong?14:53
ochosiPhilDick: you can always check in the web-version of the ML archive14:54
elfyPhilDick: hi there - there's not been much on the list this week - the digest probably missed the long one I sent earlier :)14:54
ochosiPhilDick: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/xubuntu-devel14:54
PhilDickGood reminder thanks, just thought I'd shout out and be seen ;)14:54
PhilDickthanks for the quick link!14:54
ochosibluesabre: problem is xfce4-powerman's lack of logind-support. not sure this'll get fixed in time before 14.04, so we'll be stuck with half-broken powermanagement14:56
ochosidon't think anyone in xfce-core will work on it14:57
ochosinot too many powerman-users there afaik14:58
ochosijjfrv8: would you rather finish the usage page or shall i copy over what we have now?15:06
ochosi(totally up to you, i don't think either is a problem)15:07
ochosijjfrv8: also, small feedback, i think instead of "15:07
ochosi"Removes all selections at once" it could be "Removes all items in the playlist at once."15:07
ochosibluesabre: hm, we also need a part on keyboard-shortcuts in parole. would you rather put that in usage or on a separate page?15:09
bluesabreprobably in usage15:10
bluesabreand should we mention in the docs where the auto-saved playlist is stored?15:10
ochosiyeah, probably a good idea15:10
bluesabrealso document the right-click menu15:11
ochosihmm, true15:11
bluesabrewhich I updated today15:11
bluesabreso be sure to pull the latest git15:11
ochosiyou did? oh, haven't seen15:11
bluesabreI'll document the plugins15:11
ochosinoted the todo-stuff in your wiki, just not to forget it15:17
jjfrv8ochosi, good feedback. I made the change.15:20
jjfrv8I was going to do some more work on the Usage page...15:20
jjfrv8maybe try to link slickymaster's stuff into it...15:20
jjfrv8don't know how far I'll get today, though15:20
jjfrv8I was also thinking of putting in a section on kb shortcuts and will add bluesabre's suggestion about auto-saved location.15:22
jjfrv8bluesabre, I will run updates. What should I look for with the right-click menu?15:23
bluesabreThe order, previous should come before next track15:24
jjfrv8bluesabre, got the update but I don't think it changed. http://imagebin.org/27553515:29
bluesabreyeah, looks like the package hasn't rebuilt yet15:31
bluesabreI'll try to force it15:31
bluesabreok, launchpad estimates the package should be rebuilt and available in around an hour15:34
jjfrv8sounds like lunchtime then :)15:35
ochosijjfrv8: sweet! and bon appetit :)15:43
ochosibluesabre: so you're still working on mpris2?15:45
bluesabregot distracted15:45
ochosiif you want, i can try to dig up some more example code, or something that's closer to what we need15:45
ochosihehe, nvm15:45
bluesabreI found some example code15:45
bluesabreinside of bluez15:45
bluesabreunfortunately, it seems to be registered as an active application with mpris, you have to use dbus-service15:46
bluesabrewhich makes for a lot of code15:46
bluesabreso I might put this off for now15:47
ochosisure, no worries15:48
ochosii added a plugin-part to the wiki15:48
ochosiis it as you'd expect?15:48
ochosi(staging site, ofc)15:48
ochosialternatively we could have the plugins all on one page15:48
bluesabreI think it'd be best to have them on a single page15:49
ochosiyeah, with the amount of plugins we have now they can easily fit on one page15:49
bluesabresince they don't have many features15:49
ochosiok, converted15:51
bluesabrethink I might try to get some work done for menulibre now15:51
ochosiyou mean the classical menu-editing stuff?15:54
ochosiwasn't that very messy and frustrating? :)15:54
bluesabreI've been doing a little bit at a time and thinking about how to best go about it15:55
bluesabreI think I've got a pretty clear idea of what to do now15:55
ochosiand UI wise?15:55
bluesabrefor the classic view, I'm going for two panes15:56
bluesabrethe left pane will be a folding applications view with DnD15:56
bluesabrethe right pane will be the standard menulibre editor15:56
bluesabrejust not the iconview15:57
bluesabrethe modern view will stay the same15:57
bluesabreor I can get rid of the modern view and just go full-classic15:57
bluesabresince the editor is the good part15:57
bluesabreeither way, the new design will make it a lot more modular15:58
bluesabreand easier to hack on15:58
ochosifolding applications?15:58
ochosia listview with extenders?15:59
bluesabrea multi-level treeview15:59
bluesabreyeah, that15:59
ochosifor the categories?15:59
ochosii see15:59
bluesabrethink xfce menu inside of a treeview15:59
ochosisure sure16:00
bluesabreor combining the two panes from alacarte16:00
ochosithe extenders would show what? apps or just subfolders?16:00
ochosiso the right pane would only be in use for the details/editing16:00
ochosinot bad, but imagine you have tons of apps16:01
ochosithe left side will get pretty... long16:01
bluesabreit will be completed folder by default, just showing the categories16:01
bluesabreand search will still work16:01
ochosisure, i'm just imagining extending a category and ending up with a really long list :)16:02
bluesabreit could happen :)16:02
ochosibut otoh i don't think there's a much better way16:02
bluesabreand it does even with the xfce menu16:02
bluesabreI'll try to have something working this/next weekend16:04
ochosiwow, sounds nice16:07
bluesabreemphasis on try16:08
ochosijjfrv8: i added in a placeholder for the kb-shortcuts, do you want me to keep the autosaved-playlist-location on the todo-list on the first page for you?17:12
ochosianyway, if you don't need that reminder, just feel free to drop it from the frontpage :)17:13
jjfrv8ochosi, it's okay to leave the reminder there.17:14
jjfrv8I'm having some issues, though, with dokuwiki...17:14
jjfrv8I was trying to figure out how to integrate all the menu pages...17:15
jjfrv8it seemed like it was going to create a very large single page but I could not figure out how to break it up...17:15
jjfrv8without creating sub-namespaces on the main wiki page...17:15
ochosigo ahead and create sub-namespaces17:16
ochosii don't see any issues with that17:16
jjfrv8so I wanted to see if just the TOC on the top right of the page would be enough...17:16
ochosie.g. parole:menu:*17:16
jjfrv8that's when I got into trouble with formatting17:16
ochosii mean to the worst the TOC helps ppl to navigate17:17
jjfrv8just a sec, I'll show you what I mean17:18
ochosisure, thanks17:19
jjfrv8as the TOC got longer, it pushed my first screenshot down the page and there was a big gap. So I pasted another image in without the "Figure"17:19
jjfrv8and now I any new text wants to flow around the screenshots. So here's my current workaround: http://smdavis.us/doku/doku.php?id=playground:playground17:20
jjfrv8why the first screenshot is not centered like the others, I don't know17:23
ochosihmm strange17:23
ochosilooks like a bug in the dokuwiki theme17:24
jjfrv8Yeah, in bluesabre's intro page, the first line of text went under the screenshot just fine. It doesn't work that way in my page...17:24
jjfrv8it will flow around the first screenshot, unless I make it a "figure"17:24
bluesabreyou have to tell the image to be centered17:25
bluesabreI don't remember how to at this point though17:25
ochosiyou have to add spaces17:25
ochosiinstead of {{wiki:usage-intro:intro-main-window-plain.png?nolink |}}17:26
ochosiuse {{ wiki:usage-intro:intro-main-window-plain.png?nolink |}}17:26
ochosithe space after {{ means left-aligned, the one before |}} means right-aligned17:26
ochosiboth together mean centered17:26
ochosibut i'm not sure that really solves your problem17:27
jjfrv8ooh, let me try that.17:27
ochosiproblem is anyway that the TOC takes away some precious width for the first few paragraphs...17:27
ochosiristretto worked around it by adding some text-only stuff on the top of the page: http://docs.xfce.org/apps/ristretto/preferences17:28
jjfrv8badda bing! I think that might just do it.17:29
ochosialthough i have to admit the text in ristretto is a bit superfluous, duplicating the TOC :)17:30
elfythey perhaps had the same discussion - just had it first :)17:31
ochosihehe, possible17:31
elfyshame you can't have to TOC 'floating' so it is always visible and the doc itself fits in the rest of the pane17:32
jjfrv8does this look all right? http://smdavis.us/doku/doku.php?id=playground:playground17:33
jjfrv8it repeats the main window shot but I thought it might be weird to show it with the highlights right off the bat anyway17:33
ochosihm, yeah it's a bit repetetive17:36
ochosias we have a very similar screenshot in "intro"17:36
ochosii don't have a problem with showing the highlights directly, i think that is very nice and useful17:36
ochosi(but ideally that screener wouldn't be scaled down)17:37
jjfrv8okay, I can left-align it without using 'figure' and that should do it.17:37
ochosirighty, go ahead17:38
ochosialso, we can figure out these formatting issues when the page is kinda finished17:38
ochosiwho knows, maybe more notes in the beginning will become necessary17:38
jjfrv8shall we leave it like this for now? http://smdavis.us/doku/doku.php?id=playground:playground17:45
ochosijjfrv8: you can put the text "The three main parts..." above the screenshot, that might help with the alignment17:46
ochosijust replace "above" with "below" in the text ;)17:47
ochosioh, and you could actually link those 3 headlines to parts of the page17:47
ochosijjfrv8: alright, i think i gotta leave for tonight18:00
ochosifeel free to ping me whenever problems occur or when you've finished another part that i can copy over to docs.xfce18:00
jjfrv8I think I do too.  Thanks for your help. I might be able to finish enough to copy it over tomorrow.18:00
ochosithanks again for your efforts, really great!18:00
ochosisounds good18:01
jjfrv8will do.18:01
ochosihave a nice evening everyone18:01
NoskcajDoes anyone know why xubuntu-bugs is subscribed to convertall ?19:40
elfyI don't19:41
NoskcajIt would be a good thing to include in xubuntu, but since it's not, i don't see why -bugs is subscribed19:47
elfythe only idea I have is that it was done before I got mails re that bug19:48
elfyno idea what it even is 19:48
NoskcajIt's a really powerful unit converter, that i now maintain in debian19:53
elfyunit converter?19:54
Noskcaje.g. meters to feet19:54
elfyoic 19:54
elfyI can't see any reason to have that in Xubuntu 19:55
elfynot sure why we'd be subscribed to it either, given what it is :)19:55
elfyNoskcaj: I can't even see how we're subscribed to it19:57
elfynvm - yes I can lol - time to turn it off and go sit elsewhere ... 19:58
Noskcajbluesabre, Why does the build.py for catfish import so many unused modules? is it just to check that all dependencies are installed?20:33
PhilDickI'm trying to get up-to-speed on testing for 14.04.  I'm looking here: http://packages.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/306/builds/55995/testcases, but I don't see any download instructions that describe what environment/setup I need to have in place before testing.  I know I'm newb, any advice appreciated.20:48
PhilDickI mean the link to "install instructions" links to a page with no apparent instructions...20:49
NoskcajPhilDick, Are you trying to use a VM or install on actual hardware?20:53
PhilDickI could go down either path, I was thinking about setting up a new partition on my actual hardware20:54
PhilDickEasiest that gets me going is probably best20:54
NoskcajHow much RAM do you have?20:55
PhilDickI have older hardware currently, AMD X2 + 4Gb RAM20:55
PhilDickI've ran VirtualBox on this box on the past, was usable, but haven't used it lately20:55
Noskcajfor a VM, install the program testdrive-gtk. For real hardware, put the iso on a usb or dvd and install it with manual partitioning20:56
PhilDickWhere do I find xubuntu 14.04 iso?20:56
Noskcajhttp://cdimage.ubuntu.com/xubuntu/daily-live/20131102/ or in testdrive20:58
PhilDickThank you.  I need to figure out testdrive more, but I might start with the iso for now... guess that changes daily though.20:58
PhilDickI'm just trying to keep at it for now, keep moving forward and take notes.20:58
Noskcajbluesabre, I've made a start at pep8 conversion for catfish at lp:~noskcaj/catfish-search/pep8 . Would you like all changes in the one branch?21:18
bluesabreNoskcaj: Your awesomeness never ends, does it?21:48
bluesabreBy all means, one branch would be fine.21:48
Noskcajbluesabre, thanks, i should have all the pep8/flake8 fixes by the end of the day (australia time).21:56
bluesabrefantastic, thanks a lot!21:56
bluesabrein case you get excited, don't worry about doing that for menulibre yet, I'm currently rewriting it :)21:59
ochosibluesabre: idea (menulibre): use the traditional view for normal editing, use the "new/current view" for search-results22:07
brainwashochosi: just curious, wouldn't it be possible to fork gnome-screensaver and copy the interface of lightd-gtk-greeter?22:08
brainwashI still dislike the vt switching :(22:09
ochosithat was our initial idea before creating light-locker22:09
ochosibut it makes user-switching more cumbersome22:09
ochosiand the cleanest approach is to use lightdm22:09
bluesabrevt-switching has one very annoying drawback22:09
ochosi(in fact we started out with that, a gnome-screensaver using the .ui file of the gtk-greeter)22:10
brainwashwell, it would still use lightdm for this22:10
bluesabreochosi: not sure if that would be a good thing for menulibre or not, but I can definitely experiment with it :)22:10
ochosibluesabre: well it's such a pity to see the current view going away... i really like it and think it's easy to use and simple22:11
ochosibluesabre: all for editing the traditional menu, when we might switch to something like whiskermenu (which uses categories as well, not a fixed menu-file afaik)22:12
ochosiand then who else uses fixed menus like xfce/xubuntu does atm?22:12
bluesabreoh, we don't use a single fixed file22:13
bluesabreif that was the case it would be easy22:13
ochosibrainwash: my hope is that the lightdm guys will figure out taking away the pain of vt-switching22:13
ochosibrainwash: e.g. with fading or some Mir-trick, who knows22:13
brainwashmir trick? xfce won't support mir any time soon22:15
ochosii guess not, but maybe wayland will help22:15
ochosianyway, stripping out the gnome-components isnt that hard, and you can pick up from a commit where we did that with light-locker and then implement the gtk-greeter UI ;)22:16
brainwashsounds interesting22:17
brainwashbtw I was about to create a PPA for xfce4-panel with support gtk3 indicators, but gave up after like 1 minute.. "how the heck do I build the packages?!"22:19
brainwashlocal I assume, or?22:20
ochosibuilding locally should work fine with the instructions in the wiki22:20
brainwashand how do I upload the packages?22:21
brainwashok, looks like need to read some more tutorials22:22
brainwashso far I've only uploaded the changes files and the packages have been built remotely22:22
ochosithat's the only way i've done it either22:23
ochosimicahg might know more about that22:23
brainwashstill waiting for someone to create a PPA for the panel, but nothing so far, so why not try it myself :)22:24
ochosiyeah, sounds good22:25
brainwashbtw bug 120538422:26
ubottubug 1205384 in lxsession (Ubuntu) "Lock can be circumvented by switching to console" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/120538422:26
brainwashstill not fixed22:26
ochosionly way to fix it is by using gnome-screensaver or light-locker or something like that22:26
brainwashor switch back to xscreensaver22:26
Noskcajbrainwash, You need to use dput, with the target as your ppa and this input as a .changes file made by debuild -S22:28
brainwashwhat about the dependencies?22:33
Noskcajbrainwash, Are they in the ubuntu repositories? (if so, just make them build-dependancies)22:34
NoskcajIf not, find a way to link PPAs or upload them22:35
brainwashmost are, but newer versions are needed also22:35
NoskcajMaybe upload the stuff from the pkg-xfce debian SVN?22:35
NoskcajI don't really know, ask micahg or mr_pouit 22:36
ali1234micahg was trying to package the indicator stuff, but got problems22:36
ali1234the problem is mainly that we need to package from a random arbitrary git commit, not a real release22:36
brainwashmaybe it's a bit too complicated for me at this point, started to learn how to build packages for a PPA just yesterday22:36
ali1234tweaking something that is already packaged is much easier22:38
ochosiactually the branch is mergeable22:39
ochosii hope it will happen soon22:39
ali1234ochosi: i found the appindicator problem, and a couple more bugs in the process22:40
ochosiali1234: right, so what's going on there?22:41
ali1234well it looks like some gtk3 changes got backported to gtk2, but the special case code in appindicator was not removed22:41
ali1234i asked tedg about it, but he couldn't remember anything useful22:42
ali1234it's actually in libdbusmenu, not libappindicator22:42
ochosiso was he at least interesetd in the fix?22:42
ali1234hard to say. i only got a 1 line reply22:42
ali1234annoyingly, libdbusmenu cannot be built in a ppa because one of the tests fails only in a ppa - where you cannot get the log to find out why22:43
ali1234all this is reported on the relevant bugs, which have been met with stony silence22:44
ochosiemail to ayatana ML?22:44
ali1234i guess so. that ML looks dead tbh... only a couple of posts per week22:44
ali1234last time i tried to post my message never got through the moderation queue22:45
ochosithere's a moderation queue even if you're subscribed?22:46
ali1234i don't think you can post at all if you're not subscribed22:46
brainwashochosi: bug 124747022:49
ubottubug 1247470 in firefox (Ubuntu) "firefox tooltip sometimes too big" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/124747022:49
brainwashlooks like greybird22:49
brainwashsee the attached screenshot22:49
ali1234i might just hit the "request merge" button on my libdbusmenu branch... at least then someone might look at it22:52
ali1234correction: the ayatana design list is now known as unity-design and hasn't had a post in over a month22:53
ochosiali1234: yeah, try with a merge-request22:56
ochosican't hurt22:56
ochosibut also be sure to ping someone about it22:57
ochosibrainwash: i'm not sure there's much i can do about it, ff isn't even gtk22:58
ochosii've never seen this so far22:58
brainwashgreybird is most likely not even the cause22:59
brainwashso ff is not gtk.. how do you theme it then? o.o22:59
ochosifirefox uses XUL and with some black magic it tries to resemble gtk23:00
ochosibut some stuff almost always looks different, like tabs23:00
ochosinot very noticeable, but also because i decided not to do anything crazy with greybird23:01
ochositooltips are always square23:01
ochosiand more stuff i guess23:01
brainwashmaybe the next ff release will fix it23:02
ochosithat particular bug? yeah, maybe23:02
ochosior are you referring to the UI changes in firefox that are coming up sometime later this year?23:02
ochosi(iirc i read something like that a while ago)23:03
brainwashthe tooltip one23:03
ochosinight everyone23:07
brainwashochosi: good night23:07
ali1234https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-datetime/+bug/1228360 sounds like the same thing we've seen with xfce4-panel23:31
ubottuUbuntu bug 1228360 in indicator-datetime (Ubuntu) "No clock in menu bar and can't edit Clock settings" [Undecided,Confirmed]23:31
PhilDickIf there's somewhere else I should ask, please point me there... #ubuntu-quality?23:35
PhilDickI'm trying to get testdrive-gtk working... 1) It has two identical looking entries for xubuntu Trusty Tahr 2) When I "launch" either one, nothing happens... is there an environment needed that the package doesn't check for?23:36
ali1234yeah #ubuntu-quality is your best bet23:40
ali1234but there won't be anyone there on a saturday night23:40
PhilDickwhat kind of geeks are these??? ;)23:40
ali1234paid ones23:40
ali1234also, i have to day, we know plenty of bugs in xubuntu already23:40
PhilDickday = say?23:40
PhilDickI just want to get in the loop early so I'm able to get involved...23:41
PhilDickI think I can download an iso and point it at that...23:41
ali1234this is just my opinion, but i am not really impressed by the iso testing stuff. it appears to be just another step to make bug reporting harder23:41
PhilDickYah, I'm a little ... challenged by the lack of a "just get started testing" howto23:42
PhilDicknot giving up yet, but only have so much time...23:42
skellatali1234: Make sure you attend the virtual session at Ubuntu Developer Summit in three weeks or so.  Bug Reporting & Quality Assurance will have a panel going on.23:43
ali1234skellat: i did all that SRU stuff23:44
ali1234i have no idea if i did it right though23:44
skellatSomeone will comment on the bug if you didn't23:44
skellatThe current vUDS-1311 panels list is here: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1311/all/23:45
ali1234i never know what to do at vUDS23:45
skellatali1234: From the Xubuntu perspective, mostly observe23:46
skellatIf you can chime in via IRC, try23:46
skellatBut mostly observe23:46
PhilDickskellat, excellent, I was wondering about those workshops... I'll have to check the UTC it's going on at23:46
ali1234they're not workshops - we do do those though23:46
ali1234UDS is like planning meetings23:46
PhilDickI heard balloons say something about upcoming QA workshops23:47
ali1234yeah, that will probably be after UDS23:47
NoskcajPhilDick, Yeah, we've got logs of old ones if you wanted a look23:47
skellatThe more community-related matters that fall under LoCo Council's remit are being separated to a different summit if we manage to pull things together in time.  Tentatively that's supposed to be scheduled for November 23rd so that'll leave vUDS-1311 a lot more focused on tech & planning.23:48
ali1234lol, forking UDS?23:48
skellatali1234: Yep23:48
NoskcajThe QA workshops might be different since phill has left most of ubuntu and we think good wiki pages and videos would be more useful23:48
ali1234lordy. things are getting weird23:49
PhilDickNoskcaj sounds useful, can you point me towards them? IRC logs I guess?23:49
skellatali1234: It more comes down to a time factor.  For LoCo Council it is easier for the others to participate on the weekend.  The vUDS-1308 schedule was a little too jam packed so taking stuff that would be under our remit out should balance nicely.23:50
ali1234PhilDick: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom23:50
ali1234skellat: i never really understood what the council does anyway23:50
ali1234except for "free PR"23:50
skellatali1234: Equip, Advise, Mentor for local communities.  Help them keep going, intervene with Canonical if they need help, and otherwise serve as back-end support.23:51
skellatAll of this being said, I'm probably going to have to give thought to Three Nights of Xubuntu appearing again23:52
ali1234but what do LoCos actually do?23:52
Noskcajali1234, translations, support, mirror hosting, installfests, release partys23:53
skellatTo a certain extent, this session on testing the upgrade path from 12.04 to 14.04 makes me nervous: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1311/meeting/21973/core-1311-lts-upgrade-testing/23:55
PhilDickthanks for the link ali1234. Also, I've moved to only running LTS's so I'm... wondering what makes you nervous?  I have to reboot to another partition, brb23:56
ali1234there's different types of LTS now too, with enablement or without...23:56
skellatGenerally we don't have hardware enablement stacks in Xubuntu so that's not an issue23:57
skellatUbuntu gets those but we don't23:57
PhilDickhmmm, tell me more when I come back...23:57
ali1234automated anything makes me nervous23:57
ali1234if the developer remembered to write a test, they probably remembered not to cause the bug in the first place23:58

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