[05:50] Where's the logout bug? Someone reported a dupe at bug 1247337 [05:50] bug 1247337 in xfce4-session (Ubuntu) "Xfce Restart button logs me out but does not reboot" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1247337 [10:35] ali1234: https://launchpad.net/~thad-fisch/+archive/rand [11:39] slickymaster, jjfrv8; this channel is too long... where is the page with the theme definition on my wiki? [11:46] micahg: If you get a chance, could you approve this and merge it so we can fix two very simple bugs? https://code.launchpad.net/~smd-seandavis/xubuntu-default-settings/b2_fixes [11:47] I've had the merge request available for it since beta 2 [12:11] archlinux-offtopic [12:12] ugh woops to out of it this morning... [12:44] bluesabre, you mean this one? http://smdavis.us/doku/doku.php?id=playground:sceenshot-stds [12:44] yes, thanks! [12:44] welcome [12:51] brainwash: yeah it doesn't build [13:09] bluesabre, all the data on that page were current but my screenshots weren't. I just corrected that. [13:11] I've also updated the screenshots on the pages I've been working on: http://smdavis.us/doku/doku.php?id=playground:playground [13:33] jjfrv8: nice work! [13:33] looks pretty [13:35] ochosi, so you think I'm on the right track? It's not too basic and stating the obvious? [13:36] no, to me this looks very god [13:36] good [13:36] :) [13:36] cool [13:37] indeed, if bluesabre is around while i am, we can discuss what parts we can copy over to docs.xfce and when [13:38] ochosi: with the exception of my screenshot on introduction, I think everything we've got so far is in great condition [13:38] ok. I think the overview is pretty much done. I'm not sure yet how we will link to the menu pages that slickymaster has started... [13:38] and I have yet to start on. [13:39] bluesabre: yeah, i agree. that's why i thought we can start to migrate some pages even today if you want [13:39] bluesabre: it's not like it has to be there in one go [13:39] true [13:39] I'd say go for it [13:39] btw, i'm not sure we've changed the report-bugs link in 0.5 [13:39] cause we should probably do that [13:40] and also change the help-link [13:40] right now I am starting to work on an mpris plugin [13:40] might take a while for parole 0.6 to spread (mainly because of libxfce4ui) [13:40] sweet! [13:40] does the dbus-stuff we already have help? [13:40] not sure yet [13:41] but yeah, go ahead and start moving some of the docs over [13:42] alright, i'll start with something easy (commandline-opts) [13:43] I'm jealous of totem's python plugin interface [13:43] mmm, i figured :) [13:44] jjfrv8: are you fine with me copying the prefs next or is there any blocker from your perspective? [13:45] ochosi, nothing that I know of [13:45] afternoon [13:46] hey, elfy [13:46] jjfrv8 - cracking job you and slick have done :) [13:46] thanks :) [13:46] elfy: +1 [13:47] I hope you all read this bit of my mailng " Can the team please comment on the pads where applicable and here." :) [13:51] jjfrv8: great, now since you've set everything up already at your end, would you mind re-taking the screenshot from the introduction page? then i could copy that one over as well [13:51] and then only the usage page is missing, but that one seemed to be pretty ready as well, no? (despite being in the playground-section for no obvious reason :p) [13:52] ochosi: I added that screenshot, but anybody can replace it with anything [13:52] ah [13:53] hm, i like video-position for the screenshot a lot btw :) [13:53] ochosi, I started with Usage in playground because I was waiting for a review before moving it. [13:53] jjfrv8: alrighty. but this is really just the staging site, so feel free to play ;) [13:53] alright, I'll move it over now. [13:53] cool, thanks! [13:54] I'll also see if I can reproduce bluesabre's opening screenshot and put that in. [13:55] thanks, that's great [13:55] it's looking a bit like we might get the docs moved over completely today \o/ [13:56] well, we're still missing some menu items. the ones I'm supposed to do :( [13:56] ah, well no worries [13:56] i'm even pretty happy with the status quo: http://docs.xfce.org/apps/parole/start [13:57] +1 [13:59] i still love our bug-page [13:59] we should propose this layout to more xfce-components [13:59] although few have such a clean bugzilla as parole :p [14:02] this is true [14:03] the mpris stuff seems like it might take a while [14:04] bluesabre: well if it isn't straightforward we can also do something else before that [14:04] right [14:04] i thought it would've been nice, cause it'd have qualified parole as a basic music player as well [14:04] I just thought it might be a bit more accessible :) [14:04] in modern desktops [14:04] yeah, that's certainly true [14:04] right, hence my interest in it. [14:05] in fact, the xfce-deps are a bit of a bummer now [14:05] I'll see what I can do with it today [14:05] cause xfce4.12 will delay the spread of 0.6 [14:05] that just means more time to fix bugs and improve stability [14:05] and it makes it harder to use parole in e.g. gnome3 [14:06] sure, true [14:06] and maybe crank some plugins out [14:06] making parole youtube-enabled would be probably on top of my list [14:07] but even using that grillo framework might be a lot of work [14:07] yeah [14:08] there might be an easier way [14:08] an it's a source for another gazillion new bugs [14:08] might look into youtube-dl [14:08] mhmmmm [14:08] http://rg3.github.io/youtube-dl/ [14:08] might be some handy info in there [14:10] holy moly, that one has quite a few options [14:10] seems like it's already quite complex [14:10] yeah, we might be able to convert some small part of that to get our stream url [14:11] you can never make youtube work in a third party player [14:11] at best it will work only for 30% of videos [14:11] ali1234: minitube seems to do ok [14:11] and after about two months it will stop working because they redesigned the website [14:11] still works pretty well for totem [14:11] well true, a stable api is something else [14:12] but we don't *have to* provide browsing of youtube in the player [14:12] all I'm interested in is pasting the youtube url in the open network location and it streaming something [14:12] exactly [14:21] holy moly, they say it works on youtube "and a few other sites", then look at this impressive list: https://github.com/rg3/youtube-dl/tree/master/youtube_dl/extractor [14:29] :D [14:29] btw ochosi, I saw that light-locker is now in trusty [14:29] yup :) [14:29] I think there needs to be a minimal configuration tool for it [14:29] and we finally managed to set up translation stuff [14:29] to enable/disable/set the timeout [14:30] hm, not sure, usually you'd either have the timeout or not [14:30] It's all xset stuff, right? [14:30] yup [14:30] should be easy to make a simple gui for that, even in C to ship as part of the light-locker package [14:31] yeah [14:31] i mean the timeout is just an addon to the xset stuff [14:31] just a thought, since ubuntu is very interested in using it, and so are we and possibly lubuntu [14:32] yeah, i mean the thing is that even if we designed such an app, i'm not sure ubuntu wouldn't simply include a single checkbox or whatever in their powermanager-settings [14:32] ah [14:32] i think a more integrated solution would be better [14:32] thats a good point [14:33] so e.g. you could have a compile-time check in xfce4-powerman to see whether light-locker is there [14:33] then just add a few settings [14:33] a separate thingy could be an ok-fallback-solution though for people that don't use proper DEs [14:34] what's more important, we've finally set up our translations in transifex.com, so it'll be easier for ppl to add/update the translations [14:35] sweet [14:36] actually, if you make a simple config for light-locker, the desktop entry could be set to OnlyShowIn=Xfce;LXDE etc [14:37] sure [14:37] but i think before we do that, it'd be nicer to get support into xfce4-powerman [14:38] the main issue with that at the moment is anyway that lightdm would have to support the feature [14:38] at the moment, the screen unblanks when light-locker starts the locking [14:38] (because you get redirected to the unlock-screen) [14:38] (and that spawns a new x-session, hence the dpms timeout is reset) [14:39] makes sense [14:40] so lightdm would have to be called with some additional parameter or something to keep the screen blanked [14:40] but for that, wouldn't that be an ubuntu-specific patch for powerman since lightdm is not an xfce project? [14:40] at least that'd be my approach [14:40] if ubuntu takes light-locker, they'll add that to lightdm for sure [14:40] well hopefully [14:41] not sure i got that, what ubuntu-specific patch do you mean? [14:41] ... and then break it for us potentially :) [14:41] there'd not be a patch in the powermanager, but in lightdm [14:41] and light-locker would keep its behavior as is [14:41] for xfce4-powerman to control light-locker timeout, enabled [14:41] hence things should work on all distros shipping lightdm and light-locker [14:41] xfce4-powerman would only control xset [14:41] nothing else [14:42] and probably the additional timeout, but that's over-the-top imo [14:42] oh! [14:42] hmmm [14:42] 3-5secs should be fine from screen-blanking to screen-locking [14:43] so, the way things work now: [14:43] you set your "screensaver" with xset s $timeout [14:44] then you start light-locker with the additional timeout parameter [14:44] (as it is autostarted in the session, the distributor will usually set that one) [14:44] and then after xset kicks in + light-locker-timeout, you get redirected to the login-screen [14:45] right [14:45] makes sense to me [14:45] so all that needs to be added is for lightdm to keep the screen blanked in this case [14:45] awesome [14:46] and an option in xfce4-powerman's UI to set the X-screensaver timeout [14:47] bluesabre, ochosi, I've replaced the opening screenshot: http://smdavis.us/doku/doku.php?id=introduction [14:47] jjfrv8: sweet! nice work [14:47] i'll copy that over then [14:47] the playback control bar turned light gray as soon as the video started playing, is that normal? [14:47] fantastic! [14:47] yeah, it is [14:48] ok, good. [14:48] the bar should be transparent, but due to gstreamer, it isn't in windowed-mode [14:48] ah [14:48] so the transparency of the bar gets interpreted as being on a white background [14:48] hence the brighter bg-color [14:49] (the default screen has black bg, so the bg of the overlay is darker) [14:51] jjfrv8: thanks a lot! done: http://docs.xfce.org/apps/parole/introduction [14:52] ochosi: on -offtopic, know what package he should report that bug for? [14:52] :) [14:52] Morning ochosi [14:53] I just got my first xubuntu-devel mailing list digest, and it had like one request from an apparent outsider, and no other messages... is this correct or have I got something wrong? [14:54] PhilDick: you can always check in the web-version of the ML archive [14:54] PhilDick: hi there - there's not been much on the list this week - the digest probably missed the long one I sent earlier :) [14:54] PhilDick: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/xubuntu-devel [14:54] Good reminder thanks, just thought I'd shout out and be seen ;) [14:54] thanks for the quick link! [14:56] bluesabre: problem is xfce4-powerman's lack of logind-support. not sure this'll get fixed in time before 14.04, so we'll be stuck with half-broken powermanagement [14:57] don't think anyone in xfce-core will work on it [14:58] not too many powerman-users there afaik [15:06] jjfrv8: would you rather finish the usage page or shall i copy over what we have now? [15:07] (totally up to you, i don't think either is a problem) [15:07] jjfrv8: also, small feedback, i think instead of " [15:07] "Removes all selections at once" it could be "Removes all items in the playlist at once." [15:09] bluesabre: hm, we also need a part on keyboard-shortcuts in parole. would you rather put that in usage or on a separate page? [15:10] probably in usage [15:10] and should we mention in the docs where the auto-saved playlist is stored? [15:10] yeah, probably a good idea [15:11] also document the right-click menu [15:11] hmm, true [15:11] which I updated today [15:11] so be sure to pull the latest git [15:11] you did? oh, haven't seen [15:11] I'll document the plugins [15:13] cool [15:17] noted the todo-stuff in your wiki, just not to forget it [15:17] thanks [15:20] ochosi, good feedback. I made the change. [15:20] I was going to do some more work on the Usage page... [15:20] maybe try to link slickymaster's stuff into it... [15:20] don't know how far I'll get today, though [15:22] I was also thinking of putting in a section on kb shortcuts and will add bluesabre's suggestion about auto-saved location. [15:22] great! [15:23] bluesabre, I will run updates. What should I look for with the right-click menu? [15:24] The order, previous should come before next track [15:29] bluesabre, got the update but I don't think it changed. http://imagebin.org/275535 [15:31] yeah, looks like the package hasn't rebuilt yet [15:31] I'll try to force it [15:34] ok, launchpad estimates the package should be rebuilt and available in around an hour [15:35] sounds like lunchtime then :) [15:36] bbiab [15:43] jjfrv8: sweet! and bon appetit :) [15:45] bluesabre: so you're still working on mpris2? [15:45] got distracted [15:45] if you want, i can try to dig up some more example code, or something that's closer to what we need [15:45] :D [15:45] hehe, nvm [15:45] I found some example code [15:45] inside of bluez [15:46] unfortunately, it seems to be registered as an active application with mpris, you have to use dbus-service [15:46] which makes for a lot of code [15:47] so I might put this off for now [15:48] sure, no worries [15:48] i added a plugin-part to the wiki [15:48] is it as you'd expect? [15:48] (staging site, ofc) [15:48] alternatively we could have the plugins all on one page [15:49] I think it'd be best to have them on a single page [15:49] yeah, with the amount of plugins we have now they can easily fit on one page [15:49] since they don't have many features [15:51] ok, converted [15:51] think I might try to get some work done for menulibre now [15:54] you mean the classical menu-editing stuff? [15:54] yeah [15:54] wasn't that very messy and frustrating? :) [15:55] I've been doing a little bit at a time and thinking about how to best go about it [15:55] I think I've got a pretty clear idea of what to do now [15:55] and UI wise? [15:56] for the classic view, I'm going for two panes [15:56] the left pane will be a folding applications view with DnD [15:56] the right pane will be the standard menulibre editor [15:57] just not the iconview [15:57] the modern view will stay the same [15:57] or I can get rid of the modern view and just go full-classic [15:57] since the editor is the good part [15:58] either way, the new design will make it a lot more modular [15:58] and easier to hack on [15:58] folding applications? [15:59] a listview with extenders? [15:59] a multi-level treeview [15:59] yeah, that [15:59] for the categories? [15:59] yup [15:59] i see [15:59] think xfce menu inside of a treeview [16:00] sure sure [16:00] or combining the two panes from alacarte [16:00] the extenders would show what? apps or just subfolders? [16:00] both [16:00] so the right pane would only be in use for the details/editing [16:00] yes [16:01] not bad, but imagine you have tons of apps [16:01] the left side will get pretty... long [16:01] it will be completed folder by default, just showing the categories [16:01] and search will still work [16:01] s/folder/folded [16:02] sure, i'm just imagining extending a category and ending up with a really long list :) [16:02] it could happen :) [16:02] but otoh i don't think there's a much better way [16:02] and it does even with the xfce menu [16:04] I'll try to have something working this/next weekend [16:07] wow, sounds nice [16:08] emphasis on try [16:09] :) [17:12] jjfrv8: i added in a placeholder for the kb-shortcuts, do you want me to keep the autosaved-playlist-location on the todo-list on the first page for you? [17:13] anyway, if you don't need that reminder, just feel free to drop it from the frontpage :) [17:14] ochosi, it's okay to leave the reminder there. [17:14] I'm having some issues, though, with dokuwiki... [17:14] yes? [17:15] I was trying to figure out how to integrate all the menu pages... [17:15] it seemed like it was going to create a very large single page but I could not figure out how to break it up... [17:15] without creating sub-namespaces on the main wiki page... [17:16] go ahead and create sub-namespaces [17:16] i don't see any issues with that [17:16] so I wanted to see if just the TOC on the top right of the page would be enough... [17:16] e.g. parole:menu:* [17:16] that's when I got into trouble with formatting [17:17] i mean to the worst the TOC helps ppl to navigate [17:18] just a sec, I'll show you what I mean [17:19] sure, thanks [17:19] as the TOC got longer, it pushed my first screenshot down the page and there was a big gap. So I pasted another image in without the "Figure" [17:20] and now I any new text wants to flow around the screenshots. So here's my current workaround: http://smdavis.us/doku/doku.php?id=playground:playground [17:23] why the first screenshot is not centered like the others, I don't know [17:23] hmm strange [17:24] looks like a bug in the dokuwiki theme [17:24] Yeah, in bluesabre's intro page, the first line of text went under the screenshot just fine. It doesn't work that way in my page... [17:24] it will flow around the first screenshot, unless I make it a "figure" [17:25] you have to tell the image to be centered [17:25] I don't remember how to at this point though [17:25] you have to add spaces [17:26] instead of {{wiki:usage-intro:intro-main-window-plain.png?nolink |}} [17:26] use {{ wiki:usage-intro:intro-main-window-plain.png?nolink |}} [17:26] the space after {{ means left-aligned, the one before |}} means right-aligned [17:26] both together mean centered [17:27] but i'm not sure that really solves your problem [17:27] ooh, let me try that. [17:27] problem is anyway that the TOC takes away some precious width for the first few paragraphs... [17:28] ristretto worked around it by adding some text-only stuff on the top of the page: http://docs.xfce.org/apps/ristretto/preferences [17:29] badda bing! I think that might just do it. [17:29] cool [17:30] although i have to admit the text in ristretto is a bit superfluous, duplicating the TOC :) [17:31] they perhaps had the same discussion - just had it first :) [17:31] hehe, possible [17:32] shame you can't have to TOC 'floating' so it is always visible and the doc itself fits in the rest of the pane [17:33] does this look all right? http://smdavis.us/doku/doku.php?id=playground:playground [17:33] it repeats the main window shot but I thought it might be weird to show it with the highlights right off the bat anyway [17:36] hm, yeah it's a bit repetetive [17:36] as we have a very similar screenshot in "intro" [17:36] i don't have a problem with showing the highlights directly, i think that is very nice and useful [17:37] (but ideally that screener wouldn't be scaled down) [17:37] okay, I can left-align it without using 'figure' and that should do it. [17:38] righty, go ahead [17:38] also, we can figure out these formatting issues when the page is kinda finished [17:38] who knows, maybe more notes in the beginning will become necessary [17:38] ok [17:45] shall we leave it like this for now? http://smdavis.us/doku/doku.php?id=playground:playground [17:46] jjfrv8: you can put the text "The three main parts..." above the screenshot, that might help with the alignment [17:47] just replace "above" with "below" in the text ;) [17:47] k [17:47] oh, and you could actually link those 3 headlines to parts of the page [17:48] ! [18:00] jjfrv8: alright, i think i gotta leave for tonight [18:00] feel free to ping me whenever problems occur or when you've finished another part that i can copy over to docs.xfce [18:00] I think I do too. Thanks for your help. I might be able to finish enough to copy it over tomorrow. [18:00] thanks again for your efforts, really great! [18:01] sounds good [18:01] will do. [18:01] have a nice evening everyone [19:40] Does anyone know why xubuntu-bugs is subscribed to convertall ? [19:41] I don't [19:47] It would be a good thing to include in xubuntu, but since it's not, i don't see why -bugs is subscribed [19:48] the only idea I have is that it was done before I got mails re that bug [19:48] no idea what it even is [19:53] It's a really powerful unit converter, that i now maintain in debian [19:54] unit converter? [19:54] e.g. meters to feet [19:54] oic [19:55] I can't see any reason to have that in Xubuntu [19:55] not sure why we'd be subscribed to it either, given what it is :) [19:57] Noskcaj: I can't even see how we're subscribed to it [19:58] nvm - yes I can lol - time to turn it off and go sit elsewhere ... [20:33] bluesabre, Why does the build.py for catfish import so many unused modules? is it just to check that all dependencies are installed? [20:48] I'm trying to get up-to-speed on testing for 14.04. I'm looking here: http://packages.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/306/builds/55995/testcases, but I don't see any download instructions that describe what environment/setup I need to have in place before testing. I know I'm newb, any advice appreciated. [20:49] I mean the link to "install instructions" links to a page with no apparent instructions... [20:53] PhilDick, Are you trying to use a VM or install on actual hardware? [20:54] I could go down either path, I was thinking about setting up a new partition on my actual hardware [20:54] Easiest that gets me going is probably best [20:55] How much RAM do you have? [20:55] I have older hardware currently, AMD X2 + 4Gb RAM [20:55] I've ran VirtualBox on this box on the past, was usable, but haven't used it lately [20:56] for a VM, install the program testdrive-gtk. For real hardware, put the iso on a usb or dvd and install it with manual partitioning [20:56] Where do I find xubuntu 14.04 iso? [20:58] http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/xubuntu/daily-live/20131102/ or in testdrive [20:58] Thank you. I need to figure out testdrive more, but I might start with the iso for now... guess that changes daily though. [20:58] I'm just trying to keep at it for now, keep moving forward and take notes. [21:18] bluesabre, I've made a start at pep8 conversion for catfish at lp:~noskcaj/catfish-search/pep8 . Would you like all changes in the one branch? [21:48] Noskcaj: Your awesomeness never ends, does it? [21:48] By all means, one branch would be fine. [21:56] bluesabre, thanks, i should have all the pep8/flake8 fixes by the end of the day (australia time). [21:56] fantastic, thanks a lot! [21:59] in case you get excited, don't worry about doing that for menulibre yet, I'm currently rewriting it :) [22:07] bluesabre: idea (menulibre): use the traditional view for normal editing, use the "new/current view" for search-results [22:08] ochosi: just curious, wouldn't it be possible to fork gnome-screensaver and copy the interface of lightd-gtk-greeter? [22:09] I still dislike the vt switching :( [22:09] that was our initial idea before creating light-locker [22:09] but it makes user-switching more cumbersome [22:09] and the cleanest approach is to use lightdm [22:09] vt-switching has one very annoying drawback [22:09] audio [22:10] (in fact we started out with that, a gnome-screensaver using the .ui file of the gtk-greeter) [22:10] well, it would still use lightdm for this [22:10] mmh [22:10] ochosi: not sure if that would be a good thing for menulibre or not, but I can definitely experiment with it :) [22:11] bluesabre: well it's such a pity to see the current view going away... i really like it and think it's easy to use and simple [22:12] bluesabre: all for editing the traditional menu, when we might switch to something like whiskermenu (which uses categories as well, not a fixed menu-file afaik) [22:12] and then who else uses fixed menus like xfce/xubuntu does atm? [22:13] lxde [22:13] oh, we don't use a single fixed file [22:13] if that was the case it would be easy [22:13] brainwash: my hope is that the lightdm guys will figure out taking away the pain of vt-switching [22:13] brainwash: e.g. with fading or some Mir-trick, who knows [22:15] mir trick? xfce won't support mir any time soon [22:15] i guess not, but maybe wayland will help [22:16] anyway, stripping out the gnome-components isnt that hard, and you can pick up from a commit where we did that with light-locker and then implement the gtk-greeter UI ;) [22:17] sounds interesting [22:19] btw I was about to create a PPA for xfce4-panel with support gtk3 indicators, but gave up after like 1 minute.. "how the heck do I build the packages?!" [22:19] :) [22:20] local I assume, or? [22:20] building locally should work fine with the instructions in the wiki [22:21] and how do I upload the packages? [22:21] dput? [22:22] ok, looks like need to read some more tutorials [22:22] I [22:22] so far I've only uploaded the changes files and the packages have been built remotely [22:23] that's the only way i've done it either [22:23] micahg might know more about that [22:24] still waiting for someone to create a PPA for the panel, but nothing so far, so why not try it myself :) [22:25] yeah, sounds good [22:26] btw bug 1205384 [22:26] bug 1205384 in lxsession (Ubuntu) "Lock can be circumvented by switching to console" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1205384 [22:26] still not fixed [22:26] only way to fix it is by using gnome-screensaver or light-locker or something like that [22:26] or switch back to xscreensaver [22:28] brainwash, You need to use dput, with the target as your ppa and this input as a .changes file made by debuild -S [22:32] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Roadmap/Specifications/Saucy/Gtk3Indicators [22:33] what about the dependencies? [22:34] brainwash, Are they in the ubuntu repositories? (if so, just make them build-dependancies) [22:35] If not, find a way to link PPAs or upload them [22:35] most are, but newer versions are needed also [22:35] Maybe upload the stuff from the pkg-xfce debian SVN? [22:36] I don't really know, ask micahg or mr_pouit [22:36] micahg was trying to package the indicator stuff, but got problems [22:36] the problem is mainly that we need to package from a random arbitrary git commit, not a real release [22:36] maybe it's a bit too complicated for me at this point, started to learn how to build packages for a PPA just yesterday [22:38] tweaking something that is already packaged is much easier [22:39] actually the branch is mergeable [22:39] i hope it will happen soon [22:40] ochosi: i found the appindicator problem, and a couple more bugs in the process [22:41] ali1234: right, so what's going on there? [22:41] well it looks like some gtk3 changes got backported to gtk2, but the special case code in appindicator was not removed [22:42] hmpf [22:42] i asked tedg about it, but he couldn't remember anything useful [22:42] lordy [22:42] it's actually in libdbusmenu, not libappindicator [22:42] so was he at least interesetd in the fix? [22:42] hard to say. i only got a 1 line reply [22:43] annoyingly, libdbusmenu cannot be built in a ppa because one of the tests fails only in a ppa - where you cannot get the log to find out why [22:44] all this is reported on the relevant bugs, which have been met with stony silence [22:44] email to ayatana ML? [22:44] i guess so. that ML looks dead tbh... only a couple of posts per week [22:45] last time i tried to post my message never got through the moderation queue [22:46] there's a moderation queue even if you're subscribed? [22:46] i don't think you can post at all if you're not subscribed [22:46] hmm [22:49] ochosi: bug 1247470 [22:49] bug 1247470 in firefox (Ubuntu) "firefox tooltip sometimes too big" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1247470 [22:49] looks like greybird [22:49] see the attached screenshot [22:52] i might just hit the "request merge" button on my libdbusmenu branch... at least then someone might look at it [22:53] correction: the ayatana design list is now known as unity-design and hasn't had a post in over a month [22:56] ali1234: yeah, try with a merge-request [22:56] can't hurt [22:57] but also be sure to ping someone about it [22:58] brainwash: i'm not sure there's much i can do about it, ff isn't even gtk [22:58] i've never seen this so far [22:59] greybird is most likely not even the cause [22:59] so ff is not gtk.. how do you theme it then? o.o [23:00] firefox uses XUL and with some black magic it tries to resemble gtk [23:00] but some stuff almost always looks different, like tabs [23:01] not very noticeable, but also because i decided not to do anything crazy with greybird [23:01] tooltips are always square [23:01] and more stuff i guess [23:02] maybe the next ff release will fix it [23:02] that particular bug? yeah, maybe [23:02] or are you referring to the UI changes in firefox that are coming up sometime later this year? [23:03] (iirc i read something like that a while ago) [23:03] the tooltip one [23:07] night everyone [23:07] ochosi: good night [23:31] https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-datetime/+bug/1228360 sounds like the same thing we've seen with xfce4-panel [23:31] Ubuntu bug 1228360 in indicator-datetime (Ubuntu) "No clock in menu bar and can't edit Clock settings" [Undecided,Confirmed] [23:35] If there's somewhere else I should ask, please point me there... #ubuntu-quality? [23:36] I'm trying to get testdrive-gtk working... 1) It has two identical looking entries for xubuntu Trusty Tahr 2) When I "launch" either one, nothing happens... is there an environment needed that the package doesn't check for? [23:40] yeah #ubuntu-quality is your best bet [23:40] thx [23:40] but there won't be anyone there on a saturday night [23:40] what kind of geeks are these??? ;) [23:40] paid ones [23:40] LOL [23:40] also, i have to day, we know plenty of bugs in xubuntu already [23:40] day = say? [23:40] *say [23:41] I just want to get in the loop early so I'm able to get involved... [23:41] I think I can download an iso and point it at that... [23:41] this is just my opinion, but i am not really impressed by the iso testing stuff. it appears to be just another step to make bug reporting harder [23:42] Yah, I'm a little ... challenged by the lack of a "just get started testing" howto [23:42] not giving up yet, but only have so much time... [23:43] ali1234: Make sure you attend the virtual session at Ubuntu Developer Summit in three weeks or so. Bug Reporting & Quality Assurance will have a panel going on. [23:44] skellat: i did all that SRU stuff [23:44] i have no idea if i did it right though [23:44] Someone will comment on the bug if you didn't [23:45] The current vUDS-1311 panels list is here: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1311/all/ [23:45] i never know what to do at vUDS [23:46] ali1234: From the Xubuntu perspective, mostly observe [23:46] If you can chime in via IRC, try [23:46] But mostly observe [23:46] skellat, excellent, I was wondering about those workshops... I'll have to check the UTC it's going on at [23:46] they're not workshops - we do do those though [23:46] UDS is like planning meetings [23:47] I heard balloons say something about upcoming QA workshops [23:47] yeah, that will probably be after UDS [23:47] PhilDick, Yeah, we've got logs of old ones if you wanted a look [23:48] The more community-related matters that fall under LoCo Council's remit are being separated to a different summit if we manage to pull things together in time. Tentatively that's supposed to be scheduled for November 23rd so that'll leave vUDS-1311 a lot more focused on tech & planning. [23:48] lol, forking UDS? [23:48] ali1234: Yep [23:48] The QA workshops might be different since phill has left most of ubuntu and we think good wiki pages and videos would be more useful [23:49] lordy. things are getting weird [23:49] Noskcaj sounds useful, can you point me towards them? IRC logs I guess? [23:50] ali1234: It more comes down to a time factor. For LoCo Council it is easier for the others to participate on the weekend. The vUDS-1308 schedule was a little too jam packed so taking stuff that would be under our remit out should balance nicely. [23:50] PhilDick: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom [23:50] skellat: i never really understood what the council does anyway [23:50] except for "free PR" [23:51] ali1234: Equip, Advise, Mentor for local communities. Help them keep going, intervene with Canonical if they need help, and otherwise serve as back-end support. [23:52] All of this being said, I'm probably going to have to give thought to Three Nights of Xubuntu appearing again [23:52] but what do LoCos actually do? [23:53] ali1234, translations, support, mirror hosting, installfests, release partys [23:55] To a certain extent, this session on testing the upgrade path from 12.04 to 14.04 makes me nervous: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1311/meeting/21973/core-1311-lts-upgrade-testing/ [23:56] thanks for the link ali1234. Also, I've moved to only running LTS's so I'm... wondering what makes you nervous? I have to reboot to another partition, brb [23:56] there's different types of LTS now too, with enablement or without... [23:57] Generally we don't have hardware enablement stacks in Xubuntu so that's not an issue [23:57] Ubuntu gets those but we don't [23:57] hmmm, tell me more when I come back... [23:57] automated anything makes me nervous [23:58] if the developer remembered to write a test, they probably remembered not to cause the bug in the first place