[01:27] <Azelphur> Low: $267.21, High: $352.12, Bitcoin market volatility at its finest (3 hour time frame)
[01:28] <daftykins> i had a message from my brother asking if i did anything with bitcoin today
[01:28] <daftykins> i lawl'd 'cause i don't understand it at all
[01:28] <daftykins> he alluded to that common idea of leaving a box crunching away mining
[01:28] <Azelphur> hehe
[01:28] <daftykins> but i said that from what i had heard that tends to just offset against your electricity bill :D
[01:29] <Azelphur> daftykins: that means that the value of 1 bitcoin has fluctuated between $267.21 and $352.12 over the past 3 hours
[01:29] <Azelphur> almost $100 price fluctuation xD
[01:30] <daftykins> oh i more meant the entire bitcoin phenomena
[01:30] <daftykins> but ja, that's pretty mad
[01:30] <Azelphur> which means my BTC holdings have fluctuated between $30729 and $40493
[01:30] <Azelphur> ergo, I just lost, and regained, $10k value
[01:30] <Azelphur> bitcoin is a fun little rollercoaster.
[01:31] <daftykins> could you pull the trigger and cash-out instantly though? taxman aside
[01:31] <Azelphur> yea
[01:31] <Azelphur> well not super instantly, I'd have to boot up my laptop with the encrypted drive
[01:31] <Azelphur> and transfer the funds into an exchange
[02:32] <ali1234> what exchange was at $267??
[02:32] <Azelphur> ali1234: bitstamp
[02:33] <Azelphur> ali1234: http://bitcoinity.org/markets/bitstamp/USD
[02:33] <ali1234> gox was at $381 earlier
[02:33] <Azelphur> ali1234: yea, it's pre-crashing :)
[02:33] <ali1234> i should add bitstamp to my thing
[02:34] <ali1234> daftykins: mining was really profitable if you did it two years ago
[02:34] <ali1234> it's impossible now
[02:35] <ali1234> unless you have specialist hardware, which is almost impossible to buy
[02:35] <Azelphur> unless you're me
[02:35] <Azelphur> ali1234: part of me wonders if I should go lawsuit BFL for late shipping
[02:35] <Azelphur> they cost me a boatload
[02:35] <ali1234> you're lucky to even get anything
[02:35] <Azelphur> true
[02:36] <ali1234> you won't get anything from suing them, due to everyone else doing the same thing
[02:36] <ali1234> so i'd say it's a waste of time
[02:36] <Azelphur> amazingly, nobody else seems to be doing it
[02:37] <Azelphur> ali1234: in other news, my channel has been taking great amusement at https://github.com/search?q=exec+sudo+%24_GET&type=Code
[02:37] <Azelphur> I'm sure you'll enjoy it too xD
[02:38] <ali1234> i don't get it
[02:38] <Azelphur> ali1234: don't know PHP?
[02:38] <ali1234> well obviously php cannot into sudo
[02:38] <ali1234> if it's not interactive
[02:38] <ali1234> unless the host is really badly configured
[02:38] <ali1234> but other than that i don't get it
[02:38] <Azelphur> ali1234: they probably nosudo'd it to get that code to work, I'd guess
[02:39] <ali1234> wait
[02:39] <ali1234> sudo $_GET
[02:40] <ali1234> noooooooo
[02:40] <ali1234> noooooooooooooooooooo
[02:40] <ali1234>  /o\
[02:41] <ali1234> exec anything with $_GET is bad enough, you can just inject your own sudo if you want
[02:55] <Azelphur> ali1234: hahaha
[02:55] <Azelphur> ali1234: you figured it out gz
[02:55] <Azelphur> :P
[09:38] <ali1234> hmm... it's now possible to have two gmail accounts open in tabs without one getting booted out
[09:38] <ali1234> this is cool
[09:38] <jussi> ali1234: welcome to 2011
[09:38] <jussi> :P
[09:38] <ali1234> well it never worked for me as recently as ... about 2 months ago
[09:39] <jussi> ali1234: you just have to enable it
[09:39] <jussi> up to 4 accounts at once
[09:39] <ali1234> i did
[09:39] <ali1234> it seems to have started working when they changed the login screen recently
[09:39] <jussi> and then dont log out of the first one, you click the corner and click "add account"
[09:40] <ali1234> yes, that
[09:40] <ali1234> i was doing that months ago
[09:40] <ali1234> if i had two gmail tabs open on the same account, and then clicked that to open a different one, the other tab would also be booted out
[09:45] <popey> I'm still keeping separate browser windows for separate accounts
[09:46] <MartijnVdS> I've started doing that as well
[09:52] <Myrtti> need to do hangouts for work, so I've got them on a separate profile in chromium and my own stuff in firefox
[09:52] <MartijnVdS> you can have 2 profiles inside chrom(e|ium), running at the same time (in different windows, like private mode)
[09:56] <brobostigon> good morning everyone.
[10:03] <Myrtti> Yeah
[10:03] <Myrtti> I did use separate profiles on Firefox first
[10:04] <nigelb> ali1234: Oh, yeah. It stopped working for me recently too.
[10:05]  * nigelb needs to try again.
[10:05] <Myrtti> but gdocs and hangouts work better on chromium, so I made a new profile for my work persona for chromium
[10:06] <popey> I have 14 chromium personas
[10:06] <popey> probably should shrink that a bit
[10:09] <popey> mostly for separate random twitter accounts
[10:18] <AlanBell> morning
[10:18]  * AlanBell upgraded the home always-on server to 13.10
[10:19] <AlanBell> and couldn't get it to boot with the new kernel, so is now using a raspberry pi instead :)
[10:20] <brobostigon> i am an rpi doing loads of stuff, radvd, dlna, webcam server, get-iplayer repo.
[10:22] <AlanBell> http://hencam.libertus.co.uk/video is now back up (the server does the html page around the image, and reverse proxies the image)
[10:22] <brobostigon> cool.
[10:31] <ali1234> i've probably asked this before, but is there any way to make xterm cat it's stdin?
[10:35] <ali1234> eg to watch stderr on an interactive command: somecommand 2> $(xterm cat)
[10:36] <AlanBell> why xterm?
[10:36] <AlanBell> and not the tty device?
[10:37] <ali1234> i dunno, just seemed logical
[10:39] <AlanBell> if you do tty in the target xterm, then echo "foo" > /dev/pts/9   (or whatever) then it comes up
[10:40] <ali1234> i could also use a named pipe, or a logfile and tail, but that's messy
[10:40] <AlanBell> but that does require you to launch the target xterm and find the tty number
[13:46] <dwatkins> AlanBell: I like your cluster idea, makes me wish I had the cash to burn so I could have you name it flibbertygibbet or something ;)
[13:47] <AlanBell> :)
[13:47] <MartijnVdS> dwatkins: try ssh'ing into "supercalifragilisticexpialidocious"
[13:47] <MartijnVdS> without tab-completion
[13:50] <dwatkins> Host supercalifragilisticexpialidocious not found: 3(NXDOMAIN) ;)
[13:50] <dwatkins> I was thinking more the name of the "let's compile Ubuntu for the ARM processor in the Raspberry Pi", but that would also be amusing.
[13:51] <dwatkins> We used to have a mailserver called Sagittarius, but no-one knew how to spell it.
[13:52] <MartijnVdS> "I name it `pwgen -sy 30 1`"
[13:52] <AlanBell> 50 character limit :)
[13:52] <MartijnVdS> AlanBell: pwgen -sy 50 1 then
[13:52] <AlanBell> yay
[13:53] <penguin42> dwatkins: You're not trying if you don't get unicode into the hostname
[13:54] <MartijnVdS> penguin42: ooh, Punycode :)
[14:07] <dwatkins> Can you use unicode in DNS names?
[14:08] <dwatkins> I vaguely remember reading it used to be allowed, but isn't any more, suggesting you can only use letters from "our" 26-letter alphabet.
[14:08] <penguin42> I thought there were top level internationals?
[14:09] <AlanBell> you can probably use it in a hostname
[14:09]  * penguin42 boots a VM to try
[14:10] <ali1234> reddit is letting gold buyers name servers now
[14:10] <ali1234> one of them got named localhost
[14:10] <penguin42> ouch
[14:11] <penguin42> hmm hostname didn't like the fliptext I gave it
[14:13] <penguin42> hmm, hostnamectl will set it
[14:15] <penguin42> haha - but sethostname does !
[14:17] <penguin42> as does avahi-set-host-name
[14:24] <penguin42> MartijnVdS: Oh I hadn't read about punycode before - very neat
[14:35] <shauno> there's sort of unicode dns names .. they get translated into ascii for lookups, which is a little mind bending
[14:37] <shauno> eg, http://💩.l
[14:38] <shauno> or not.  ate that one bad lol
[14:40] <penguin42> shauno: Yeh that's apparently the Punycode
[14:43] <shauno> ah, I didn't know it had a name.  the only rfc I've seen it in just calls it ToAscii.  and then proceeds to warp your mind trying to explain how it works
[14:49] <shauno> absolutely miserable here today, but I fear rain isn't going to be an acceptable excuse for avoiding the cinema :/
[14:50] <penguin42> it's ok here today, yesterday was biblical - thunder, hail, localised flooding etc
[14:52] <shauno> oh this isn't that bad, just "blah".  nonstop rain for the last 8 hours
[14:53] <shauno> combined with sunday busses being run apparently by lottery, and my motivation to get into town is destroyed
[14:53] <penguin42> http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/flooding-after-hail-rain-thunder-6288101
[14:55] <shauno> heh, fun
[14:55] <shauno> I haven't actually seen lightning since I moved here (2006).  strange place
[14:55] <penguin42> blue skies today
[14:55] <penguin42> where?
[14:56] <shauno> west coast of ireland
[14:58] <penguin42> so you watch the storms roll in off the atlantic, go past and dump it on us?
[14:58] <shauno> when I was in the states, it seemed to be lightning all autumn.  sun all summer, and snow all winter.  all three are incredibly rare here
[15:00] <penguin42> generally we don't get much extreme weather - it's all kind of meh
[15:02] <shauno> I used to live in barrow (south lakes) .. I assume it's much of the same there
[15:03] <penguin42> well, they don't call it lakes for nothing
[15:03] <shauno> they call it lakes because it sounds much prettier than what it actually is ;)
[15:04] <penguin42> barrow is the industrially bit isn't/wasn't it?
[15:05] <shauno> it was.  it's now the unemployed bit.  built on ironworks & shipbuilding - neither of which are particularly strong industries anymore
[15:06] <penguin42> nod
[15:07] <shauno> about the only thing they have left is that we can't outsource the military, so they still build submarines
[15:08] <penguin42> nod, I know someone who is an admin at a small ISP somewhere around there as well
[15:09] <shauno> although last I heard, they still had europe's largest door.  which is a claim to fame I guess
[15:09] <penguin42> ? Something for a submarine shed?
[15:09] <shauno> yeah.  they're built indoors
[15:09] <penguin42> wouldn't want them to get wet
[15:11] <shauno> I Think it's kinda neat.  it's nice to think that our nuclear deterent is built by some northern lads in a shed
[15:12] <penguin42> haha well if you put it like that
[16:40] <dwatkins> I just broke my Windows 8 installation (deleted the D: drive whilst changing the linux swap partition size) - good job I don't really use nor care about it :)
[16:41] <daftykins> D:
[16:41] <daftykins> whoops
[16:41] <dwatkins> Yeah, that was my reaction, followed by a shrug. I can't remember the last time I used it for anything but games.
[16:42] <dwatkins> Time to move Ubuntu onto the SSD :D
[16:42] <daftykins> i've still not even used 8 native - though i'd want to acquire an 8.1 ISO now
[16:44] <dwatkins> I played Borderlands 2 and Homeworld 2 on it a bit, but they are easily reinstalled.
[16:44] <dwatkins> My only dilemma now is whether Windows 8 can exist on the 2nd physical disk, which isn't an SSD.
[16:45] <dwatkins> I'll either use this HOWTO or just reinstall 13.10 - https://help.ubuntu.com/community/MovingLinuxPartition
[16:47] <daftykins> ah the ol' juggling fun :)
[16:48] <dwatkins> Yeah, probably easier to just reinstall - might give Debian a try...
[16:49]  * penguin42 is running Fedora/KDE on his main machine now - its' interesting, from a KDE perspective mostly the same, some places work better some worse
[16:53] <dwatkins> I'd like to give Gnome 3 a try.
[16:53] <penguin42> dwatkins: Well you can do that on any of them
[16:54] <dwatkins> Yeah, it's the default on recent Debians, I gather, and I'm curious to see how well Steam runs on Debian, too.
[16:54] <ali1234> how recent?
[16:55] <dwatkins> Wheezy, I guess, ali1234.
[16:56] <dwatkins> turns out the reason for all this is that I left my USB stick connected, so sda became the stick, and sdb and sdc are the new sda and sdb
[16:56] <daftykins> erk
[16:57] <penguin42> dwatkins: Yeh well the sd* naming is unspecified - you're not supposed to rely on them!
[16:57] <dwatkins> Just goes to show you should always check before doing mkswap /dev/sdb2
[16:57] <dwatkins> yeah, I remembered that afterwards, penguin42 ...
[16:57] <penguin42> dwatkins: I just wanted to rub it in
[16:58] <dwatkins> hehe
[16:59] <dwatkins> all this was probably pointless, and I'll most likely discover that hibernation isn't working for some other reason, but at least I havn't lost anything important.
[17:17] <daftykins> how might i recursively grep a folder of .php configs and other files for "10.10.10.10" appearing somewhere therein?
[17:17] <daftykins> grep -r <string> * <-- is what i tried
[17:19] <penguin42> grep -r '10[.]10[.]10[.]10' .
[17:20] <daftykins> ah, the periods had to be escaped?
[17:20] <penguin42> yeh because they'll match on anything
[17:20] <daftykins> ah :) i just got nothing from either
[17:20] <daftykins> ty though!
[17:21] <penguin42> try it on a dummy text file first
[17:21] <daftykins> i've just manually updated a wordpress site to the latest version but it still has issues connecting out
[17:25] <dwatkins> Interestingly, Windows 8 recovered from my running mkswap on its C: drive, I guess it only wrote to the start of the partition.
[17:25] <ali1234> mkswap doesn't do very much at all unless you actually mount the swap
[17:26] <dwatkins> I added it, realised it was 10 times too big, then swapoff'ed it.
[17:26] <dwatkins> s/added/mounted/
[17:26] <dwatkins> Having 8 GB of RAM is kinda useful.
[17:28] <thatgreenguy> admin python
[17:35] <daftykins> ooh i finally have more error detail
[17:38] <thatgreenguy> #python
[17:39] <penguin42> thatgreenguy: You need to do   /join #python
[17:49] <daftykins> [Sun Nov 10 17:42:32 2013] [error] [client 80.73.221.144] PHP Warning:  An unexpected error occurred. Something may be wrong with WordPress.org or this server's configuration. If you continue to have problems, please try the <a href="http://wordpress.org/support/">support forums</a>. (WordPress could not establish a secure connection to WordPress.org. Please contact your server administrator.) in .../wp-admin/includes/plugin-install
[17:49] <daftykins> that's what i'm getting on my VPS
[17:50] <daftykins> very, very odd
[17:50] <penguin42> can it resolve wordpress.org?
[17:50] <daftykins> yep, wget files, connect with both SSL and without
[17:52] <daftykins> echo $http_proxy returns a blank line, so no proxy is set i assume
[17:52]  * penguin42 knows neither wordpress or php, but is there any way to trace what it's doing - if all else fails tcpdump or strace?
[17:53] <daftykins> that's an idea
[17:53] <daftykins> not used tcpdump before mind you
[17:54] <penguin42> daftykins: IMHO probably your easiest way if it's on a remote server is to use tcpdump to a file and then pull the file back to a local machine and poke at it with wireshark
[17:54] <daftykins> sounds good
[18:04] <daftykins> penguin42: hrmm i can see DNS queries in my captures to api.wordpress.org but after that i can't tell what's going on
[18:07] <daftykins> i think it gets the DNS response but then i have no record of it communicating with it
[18:22] <penguin42> daftykins: So you don't see it trying to open a connection to the IP it gets back?
[18:22] <daftykins> no :S
[18:23] <penguin42> hmm, can you open a connection to api.wordpress.org?
[18:23] <daftykins> yeah i used wget to grab its' index before
[18:23] <daftykins> via https
[18:24] <daftykins> there was an odd packet immediately after the DNS queries though
[18:25] <penguin42> do you see the DNS reply?
[18:25] <daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/3cloqlhxdw6z8r6/cap.png
[18:25] <daftykins> penguin42: what do you make of that?
[18:28] <penguin42> daftykins: What's that 80.73.221.144 address - bbdhome2-221-144.network.sure.com ?
[18:28] <daftykins> mine
[18:28] <daftykins> i'm SSH'd in
[18:29] <penguin42> ok, so did you have a web browser open and got an internal server error back?
[18:29] <daftykins> yep
[18:30] <daftykins> i performed my test action which errors, to try and get it to show packets of what it's up to
[18:30] <daftykins> (in this case, searching for plugins - which goes off to the wordpress API site for results)
[18:30] <penguin42> that I think is just part of that reply which you see in the full packet on the next line, it didn't fit in one ether (TCP?) packet
[18:31] <daftykins> hrmm
[18:32] <penguin42> daftykins: I don't see anything wrong there - maybe the AAAA lookups aren't helping, but I doubt it
[18:32] <daftykins> hmm an IPv4 vs. v6 quirk?
[18:33] <penguin42> maybe, but I doubt it - you can see it's doing IPv4 DNS lookups for both the IPv4 and IPv6 addresses, and only getting an IPv4 address back (is my reading) - so that should be OK?
[18:33] <penguin42> daftykins: But it doesn't look like it's then trying to open any connection
[18:33] <daftykins> indeed, it's like it gives up
[18:33] <daftykins> thanks penguin42 - i've no idea who to ask this of next :S
[18:33] <daftykins> actually maybe if i create a test site
[18:34] <penguin42> a php person I think
[18:34] <daftykins> i can see if a stock one works
[18:34] <daftykins> hehe
[19:51] <MartijnVdS> Yay!
[19:52] <MartijnVdS> Just ordered some EP I've wanted for *years*
[19:52] <MartijnVdS> (but that wasn't available)
[19:55] <penguin42> you mean one of those vinyl things?
[19:55] <MartijnVdS> penguin42: no, a CD (the digital edition exists, but is missing a track)
[19:55] <penguin42> oh, that's ok then - of what?
[19:55] <MartijnVdS> penguin42: http://www.nerinapallot.com/shop2/?productDetails.cfm?Basket=1@,&ProductID=1500
[19:56] <MartijnVdS> that one :)
[19:58] <penguin42> MartijnVdS: Never heard of her - but ... Buckminster fuller as a song....
[19:59] <MartijnVdS> penguin42: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C7eclTcAht0
[19:59] <shauno> what's that 500 Server Error on the line below the one highlighted?
[19:59] <MartijnVdS> shauno: which one?
[20:00] <MartijnVdS> shauno: oh you're reading backlog
[20:00] <shauno> sorry, the screencap of wireshark
[20:00] <shauno> ah yeah, didn't notice that was 90 mins ago
[20:00] <penguin42> MartijnVdS: How bizarre
[20:00] <penguin42> shauno: I think that's the result of the reassembly of the one that's highlighted ?
[20:01] <MartijnVdS> penguin42: I drove to Cornwall to see her last May. She's great :)
[20:06] <penguin42> from where?
[20:07] <MartijnVdS> penguin42: from my place in the Netherlands
[20:07] <MartijnVdS> penguin42: so.. here to Rotterdam, then Harwich to Land's End
[20:08] <penguin42> wow
[20:08] <daftykins> shauno: are you good with wordpress and related shenanigans?
[20:08] <MartijnVdS> penguin42: I needed a few days off anyway, drove down (and back up) over 3-4 days :)
[20:08] <shauno> not particularly  lol
[20:08] <MartijnVdS> penguin42: (so a week total)
[20:08] <daftykins> shauno: the next packet was just the web server coming back with the error page that it can't contact wordpress' API domain
[20:08] <popey> Evening.
[20:08] <shauno> I was just curious where the 500 was coming from, because there'd be more logged on the server for that
[20:08] <shauno> ah
[20:09] <daftykins> shauno: this is the issue i've been fighting with tonight, both the real site and a test wordpress site can't talk to wordpress.org on my bigv VPS
[20:09] <daftykins> i've asked the web dev that made the site but he's stumped
[20:11] <shauno> it almost looks like 'happy eyeballs' going wrong
[20:11] <daftykins> huh? :)
[20:12] <shauno> this practice of sending A & AAAA requests together instead of sequentially
[20:12] <daftykins> hmm
[20:12] <daftykins> any thoughts on how to rule that out from testing?
[20:13] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: disable IPv4 xor IPv6
[20:13] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: if that makes it work, you've found the problem
[20:13] <shauno> pretty much, yeah :/
[20:13] <daftykins> ooh - can i stop apache running on IPv6 0o
[20:13] <daftykins> would that work maybe? or does the PHP code being system level still see interfaces and get results etc.
[20:13] <shauno> (or making it try to hit a host that does have an AAAA record)
[20:14] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: you need to deconfigure the address, or libc will magically send AAAA and A requests
[20:16] <shauno> the crashcourse on 'happy eyeballs' is that originally the RFCs said you queried AAAA first and A if it returned negative, if you have a native (not-teredo, etc) v6 route.
[20:16] <shauno> which was a great plan until real life showed up, and sticking that delay on every single v4 query sucked.  so now they have a scheme where they send them in parallel
[20:17] <daftykins> :>
[20:17] <daftykins> perhaps it not getting an answer for both is indeed, why it seems to give up trying
[20:17] <shauno> well, I'm not getting a v6 for wordpress.org either
[20:18] <daftykins> and api.wordpress.org ?
[20:18] <shauno> is just a cname to wordpress.org
[20:19] <shauno> I gotta pop out :/  but on that, it is the dns I'd be looking at, because there's no outgoing connections after the response
[20:20] <shauno> it gets the dns response, and then complains.  rather than trying to connect to anything at all, and then complaining
[20:20] <daftykins> *nod*
[20:21] <daftykins> thanks shauno
[20:23] <daftykins> i echo'd 1 to /proc/sys/net/ipv6/conf/eth0/disable_ipv6
[20:23] <daftykins> the interface lost its' v6 config
[20:24] <daftykins> but no change has been had
[20:24] <penguin42> that's not the problem you had - the problem was it was doing an IPv4 lookup for IPv6 addresses
[20:24] <penguin42> so that's DNS config - although I actually doubt it's the problem you had
[20:24] <daftykins> oh?
[20:24] <penguin42> daftykins: Yeh all the packets were on IPv4 addresses, but it was sending a AAAA DNS lookup which is for IPv6 addresses
[20:25] <penguin42> (but since it got a reply to the A query, that's why I'm saying I doubt it's the problem - but it's possible)
[20:25] <daftykins> sorry i must be being daft here, i see it sent both queries then it got the v4 replies - isn't that normal?
[20:25] <MartijnVdS> it is
[20:26] <daftykins> MartijnVdS: have you seen the pic in question?
[20:26] <daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/3cloqlhxdw6z8r6/cap.png
[20:26] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: yes, the server replies "500" which means something on the server doesn't like the request
[20:26] <MartijnVdS> the request is sent, and is responded to
[20:26] <daftykins> nah that's the error page saying it was unable to contact the API at wordpress
[20:27] <daftykins> the thing i'm doing on the site (searching for a plugin) trips out
[20:27] <daftykins> "WordPress could not establish a secure connection to WordPress.org. Please contact your server administrator."
[20:27] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: it doesn't do anything but a DNS request, before it determines it can't connect to WP?
[20:27] <daftykins> correct
[20:28] <daftykins> highly suspicious isn't it?
[20:28] <MartijnVdS> maybe you don't have php-ssl installed? :)
[20:28] <MartijnVdS> or whatever PHP uses to talk SSL
[20:28] <MartijnVdS> ("secure connection")
[20:28] <daftykins> i can't see a relevant package
[20:28] <MartijnVdS> because it's not even sending a SYN to open a connection to one of the IPs it receives from the DNS lookup
[20:29] <daftykins> indeed
[20:29] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: the openssl-module is included with php, but your extensions.ini might have it disabled
[20:30] <MartijnVdS> can you ping the address? (api.wordpress.org)
[20:30] <MartijnVdS> 66.155.30.{249,250}
[20:30] <daftykins> yep and wget the index
[20:30] <MartijnVdS> using https?
[20:30] <daftykins> yep
[20:30] <MartijnVdS> or plain old http
[20:31] <daftykins> wget https://api.wordpress.org
[20:31] <daftykins> 2013-11-10 20:31:00 (108 MB/s) - `index.html' saved [442]
[20:31] <MartijnVdS> I think it's suspicious that you get the 500 error before it even *tries* to connect (i.e. send a SYN packet) to those addresses
[20:31] <MartijnVdS> unless you filtered those from the capture
[20:31] <MartijnVdS> I have a bigv.io VM, let me try.
[20:31] <daftykins> ty :)
[20:32] <daftykins> i created a fresh 3.7.1 wordpress instance which still has the same issue
[20:32] <MartijnVdS> ah wait
[20:32] <MartijnVdS> I'd need to set up mysql and everything for that wouldn't I
[20:32] <daftykins> yeah :(
[20:33] <daftykins> i chose debian for mine - is there a wise meta package i can install that might cover any potential deps?
[20:33] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: wordpress? 8-)
[20:33] <daftykins> haha
[20:33] <MartijnVdS> $ apt-cache show wordpress
[20:33] <MartijnVdS> Package: wordpress
[20:33] <MartijnVdS> Priority: optional
[20:33] <daftykins> well no i'm using their auto management thing
[20:33] <daftykins> so things would no doubt berak
[20:33] <daftykins> *break
[20:34] <MartijnVdS> sure but apt-cache show shows you what the Debian dev thinks are the dependencies
[20:34] <daftykins> *nod* i just ran:  apt-cache showpkg wordpress
[20:34] <MartijnVdS> just use "show", showpkg is unreadable ;)
[20:36] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: is that wireshark dump filtered at all?
[20:36] <daftykins> no, but i'm a newbie when it comes to the tcpdump command i used to create it
[20:36] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: tcpdump -i eth0 -w dumpfile
[20:36] <MartijnVdS> should be enough
[20:36] <daftykins> tcpdump -nnvvw capture3.cap i ran
[20:37] <MartijnVdS> that's extra verbose and no DNS lookups by tcpdump itself
[20:37] <daftykins> *nod*
[20:37] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: you could write a small PHP program and run it on the cli
[20:37] <daftykins> The following extra packages will be installed: libjs-prototype libjs-scriptaculous
[20:37] <daftykins> The following NEW packages will be installed: libjs-cropper libjs-prototype libjs-scriptaculous libphp-phpmailer libphp-snoopy
[20:37] <daftykins> those were missing but nothing has changed as a result
[20:38] <MartijnVdS>  Some of Snoopy's features:
[20:38] <MartijnVdS>  .
[20:38] <MartijnVdS>   * easily fetch the contents of a web page
[20:38] <daftykins> :D
[20:38] <daftykins> classic
[20:39] <daftykins> same issue even now
[20:40] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: do you get "An unexpected error occurred. Something may be wrong with WordPress.org or this server's configuration"
[20:40] <daftykins> yep
[20:40] <daftykins> i've poured over the results in google regarding it
[20:40] <daftykins> nothing seems relevant
[20:41] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: This might be the culprit:
[20:41] <MartijnVdS>                         'sslcertificates' => ABSPATH . WPINC . '/certificates/ca-bundle.crt',
[20:41] <MartijnVdS> does that exist?
[20:42] <MartijnVdS> it should..
[20:42] <daftykins> whereabouts are you looking?
[20:42] <MartijnVdS> wordpress/ root
[20:42] <MartijnVdS> just downloaded the tarball
[20:42] <daftykins> there are no certs at all, no
[20:43] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: you could put a "strace -f -p xxx -p yyy" on all your httpd processes (xxx, yyy are the PIDs, add more as needed)
[20:43] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: uh
[20:43] <MartijnVdS> strace -f -o outputfile
[20:43] <daftykins> hang on it's meant to be in /wp-includes/
[20:43] <MartijnVdS> -p xxx -p yyy
[20:43] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: it is: ABSPATH is the absolute path to wordpress/, WPINC is the wp-includes dir
[20:44] <MartijnVdS> the strace might contain useful information (what it tries/gets back) for API access
[20:44] <MartijnVdS> it's a bit low-level
[20:45] <daftykins> what's the location of that path reference for me to check?
[20:45] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: wordpress/wp-includes/certificates/ca-bundle.crt
[20:45] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: should all be readable (not writable!) by the user php runs as (www-data?)
[20:46] <daftykins> ah-haaaa permissions, let's give that a whirl
[20:47] <daftykins> my site is actually in /srv/domain.com/public/htdocs/
[20:48] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: though it's not even trying to create a connection (let alone an SSL connection), so either it aborts before trying (because it can't find the file) or something weird is going on
[20:49] <daftykins> *nod*
[20:49] <daftykins> so the strace plan could be a good one
[20:50] <daftykins> ok i'll give that one a whirl after i make some food
[20:50] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: it might be overkill, is there anything in your errorlog? (httpd)
[20:51] <daftykins> [Sun Nov 10 20:48:02 2013] [warn] RSA server certificate is a CA certificate (BasicConstraints: CA == TRUE !?)
[20:51] <daftykins> that crops up
[20:51] <MartijnVdS> is that *your* https cert, or the remote end?
[20:52] <daftykins> none of my domains possess certs as far as i know
[20:52] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: but apache is still instructed to load one.. maybe the snakeoil one
[20:52] <MartijnVdS> the default always-installed one
[20:52] <daftykins> i wonder if i can justk ill it
[20:53] <MartijnVdS> a2dismod ssl
[20:55] <popey> I pulled a tenner out of my pocket and noticed some scribbles all over it...
[20:55] <popey> http://i.imgur.com/ra8r3Ka.jpg
[20:55] <daftykins> MartijnVdS: bytemark's symbiosis thing, has SSLEngine enabled within its' sites-available config
[20:55] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: ah you use that? :)
[20:55] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: I just installed Ubuntu server on mine ;)
[20:55] <daftykins> yeah atop debian
[20:58] <daftykins> alright i'm really burnt out on this now
[20:58] <daftykins> time for food
[20:58] <daftykins> MartijnVdS: thanks for your help thus far - if you have any further ideas i'd be pleased :>
[21:00] <daftykins> popey: how rude
[21:03] <daftykins> sidenote: do any clothes shops in London stay open late on a Sunday night? 0o
[21:04] <penguin42> are they allowed to?
[21:05] <popey> unlikely
[21:05] <popey> most places close at 4pm
[21:11] <diddledan> daftykins: just a wild guess, is php5-curl installed?
[21:12] <diddledan> however, php errors should be logged somewhere, so a 500 error should have something in a logfile to explain why wordpress failed
[21:46] <daftykins> diddledan: yep it is - i enabled PHP logging to file, but didn't get anything produced when repeating the action
[21:48] <daftykins> which i found very odd :S
[21:49] <diddledan> daftykins: you could try editing your wp-config.php and add `define('WP_DEBUG', true); define('WP_DEBUG_LOG', true); define('WP_DEBUG_DISPLAY', false);` and rerun. the debug log is in "wordpress/wp-content/debug.log" <-- remember to delete it once done because it can leak information
[21:51] <daftykins> diddledan: roger that! i'll do it on my test site, i had seen that idea but hadn't gotten around to it for whatever reason
[21:55] <daftykins> diddledan: it's not writing anything new compared with the apache error log :(
[21:55] <daftykins> still just: "WordPress could not establish a secure connection to WordPress.org. Please contact your server administrator."
[21:55] <diddledan> hmm
[21:56] <diddledan> is there nothing preceeding that statement?
[21:57] <daftykins> [10-Nov-2013 21:54:07] PHP Warning:  An unexpected error occurred. Something may be wrong with WordPress.org or this server&#8217;s configuration. If you continue to have problems, please try the <a href="http://wordpress.org/support/">support forums</a>. (WordPress could not establish a secure connection to WordPress.org. Please contact your server administrator.) in /srv/test.com/public/htdocs/wp-admin/includes/plugin-install.php 
[21:57] <daftykins> that's the full sucker
[22:04] <diddledan> daftykins: can you try running http://pastebin.com/SERmAPbF which should output the full headers in addition to the html from a connection to wordpress.org
[22:04] <diddledan> if that fails but still doesn't telll us why, we can amend it to add some more error reporting
[22:04] <daftykins> would i just put that in a file and run "php file" ?
[22:04] <diddledan> yes please :-)
[22:05] <diddledan> it'll make a nice mess in your terminal - I've written it to be runnable in a browser, too
[22:06] <daftykins> not sure if this is an issue but i re-ran it outputting to a file
[22:06] <daftykins> PHP Warning:  Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at /srv/test.com/public/htdocs/file:3) in /srv/test.com/public/htdocs/file on line 12
[22:06] <daftykins> and got told that
[22:06] <diddledan> that's fine
[22:07] <diddledan> that's because I used header() in the php file
[22:07] <daftykins> http://pastebin.com/WSFq6UCN
[22:08] <daftykins> diddledan: there she be ^
[22:08] <diddledan> ok, that says that php can successfullly connect to wordpress.org - it gets weirderer
[22:08] <daftykins> ^_^
[22:09] <diddledan> try plopping it on your test site and running it via the browser to confirm whether it's able to do it when run through apache
[22:10] <daftykins> was naming it file.php and visiting path/file.php correct?
[22:10] <diddledan> yup
[22:10] <daftykins> as i just get a blank page
[22:11] <daubers> Evening
[22:11] <diddledan> aha, that's interesting
[22:12] <diddledan> I've written a two-line modification to force it to output errors to the browser: http://pastebin.com/q6kUzWDt do the same as before to run it via a browser
[22:13] <daftykins> i'm pasting into nano over SSH with KiTTY and getting a lot of green squares - that likely to be a problem?
[22:13] <diddledan> ooh
[22:13] <diddledan> erm
[22:13] <diddledan> that doesn't sound right
[22:15] <daftykins> i manually typed it out and still get blank :O
[22:16] <diddledan> hmm
[22:17] <diddledan> try putting a "print 'finished';" at the bottom underneath the print $output line
[22:17] <diddledan> that was we can tell whether I've messed up my code :-p
[22:17] <diddledan> way*
[22:17] <daftykins> yep it returned 'finished'
[22:17] <daftykins> :S
[22:19] <daftykins> what is it doing D:
[22:22] <daftykins> diddledan: any further thoughts :)
[22:22] <daftykins> +?
[22:22] <diddledan> I'm just gonna do a bit of experimentation on my vps
[22:22] <daftykins> is it the content type throwing it?
[22:25] <diddledan> nope, it works fine on my ubuntu 12.04 virtual machine
[22:25] <daftykins> are you expecting to see the HTML text or will it show the actual page?
[22:25] <diddledan> the text
[22:25] <diddledan> along with headers at the top
[22:25] <daftykins> yeah it works at command line but apache2 is doing something
[22:25] <daftykins> could a funky php-suhosin status be causing it?
[22:26] <diddledan> it might be an issue with suhosin
[22:26] <daftykins> (i'm unsure whether it's on, off, or partially there at the moment)
[22:26] <diddledan> alternatively apache may not have been restarted since php5-curl was installed?
[22:26] <daftykins> it was definitely already installed
[22:27] <diddledan> or alternatively there might be php.ini differences between the apache2 and cli iterations
[22:28] <daftykins> my /etc/php5/apache2/php.ini is actually autocreated by the bytemark symbiosis system i'm using
[22:28] <diddledan> dang
[22:28] <daftykins> but it's there and readable
[22:28] <daftykins> shall i pastebin it?
[22:28] <diddledan> worth a try
[22:31] <daftykins> http://pastebin.com/KUt47XKS
[22:38] <diddledan> nothing seems out of the ordinary there
[22:39] <daftykins> hang on /usr/bin/php /usr/bin/php5
[22:40] <daftykins> no difference with either 0o
[22:40] <daftykins> /usr/bin/php -> /etc/alternatives/php
[22:40] <daftykins> 0o
[22:41] <daftykins> symlink^
[22:41] <diddledan> `man update-alternatives` tells you about that mechanism
[22:42] <diddledan> on my ubuntu the /etc/alternatives/php points to /usr/bin/php5
[22:43] <daftykins> ah yes :)
[22:43] <daftykins> well i'm glad i don't seem to have done anything too stupid
[22:43] <daftykins> would it help if i let you have a look at my test domain at all?
[22:45] <diddledan> it might
[22:45] <daftykins> http://test.com.testing.togusa.default.kusanagi.uk0.bigv.io/file2.php
[22:45] <daftykins> there's where i created the file
[22:46] <diddledan> lurvely url :-p
[22:46] <daftykins> hah yeah, crazy bigv domains are soooo long
[22:46] <daftykins> then test.com.testing for my little fake domain
[22:47] <diddledan> ok, I've been reading up on suhosin - it might be logging to /var/log/messages
[22:48] <daftykins> i think i managed to fully remove it
[22:48] <daftykins> php5-suhosin got removed
[22:48] <diddledan> sorry, I mena /var/log/syslog
[22:48] <diddledan> hmm
[22:48] <diddledan> did you restart apache after?
[22:48] <daftykins> yep
[22:49] <diddledan> and yet it's still failing. I was working on the assumption that we'd proven that php itself can do the job
[22:49] <daftykins> *nod*
[22:49] <diddledan> it doeswn't make sense >.<
[22:49] <daftykins> something is highly screwy isn't it
[22:49] <daftykins> perhaps i should fire something off to bytemark and just see if i've done something stupid that their symbiosis system gets affected by?
[22:49] <diddledan> I don't suppose it can hurt
[22:50] <diddledan> they might be able to help
[22:50] <daftykins> is there any other form of test i can have php perform atop apache?
[22:54] <mgdm> what's going on, and did you turn selinux off?
[22:54] <mgdm> if indeed it's on...
[22:54] <daftykins> how would i tell on this debian VPS?
[22:54] <mgdm> ah, that's probably a no
[22:55] <daftykins> win \o/
[22:55] <mgdm> I don't have a page up button - can you explain (in PM if you like) what's up?
[22:55] <daftykins> basically wordpress isn't able to contact its' API address, in order to get some results
[22:55] <Azelphur> Seeker`: I got the arduino out...and I UNKILLED IT.
[22:55] <daftykins> (e.g. plugin searches)
[22:55] <daftykins> mgdm: diddledan kindly helped create a test PHP file that pulls the target page down, it works at CLI, but not from behind apache
[22:56] <mgdm> Oh, it's wordpress. hmmm. :-) So - do you know what mechanism it's using? curl? file_get_contents?
[22:56] <daftykins> https://github.com/WordPress/WordPress/blob/master/wp-admin/includes/plugin-install.php
[22:56] <daftykins> i believe that's the one in question
[22:57] <mgdm> holy moley
[22:57] <mgdm> it sends seriazed PHP to another host, which then unserializes it
[22:57] <daftykins> line 77 is what keeps getting flagged as the issue
[22:58] <daftykins> well you know, where it breaks from
[22:59] <mgdm> i'm trying to find the source of wp_http
[23:00] <diddledan> https://github.com/WordPress/WordPress/blob/master/wp-includes/http.php
[23:01] <diddledan> not sure where the calss is tho
[23:01] <diddledan> class*
[23:01] <mgdm> I found it
[23:01] <mgdm> https://github.com/WordPress/WordPress/blob/70fd806759b7a18d45950eb2c368e15949f1ef21/wp-includes/class-http.php
[23:02] <daftykins> ooh i'm getting more content in tcpdump now
[23:02] <mgdm> whaaat
[23:02] <mgdm> this impleents its own HTTP client using fsockopen()
[23:03] <mgdm> what the *hell* are these guys smoking?
[23:03] <daftykins> it appears to be getting TCP resets when awaiting its' reply
[23:03] <daftykins> maybe it is firewall after all...?
[23:03] <mgdm> seems that way
[23:03] <daftykins> omg.
[23:03] <daftykins> i just flushed iptables and it works
[23:03] <mgdm> heh
[23:03] <diddledan> >.<
[23:04] <diddledan> don't you hate that
[23:04] <daftykins> sorry about that guys, but earlier tcpdump wasn't even showing anything beyond the DNS queries
[23:04] <daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/3cloqlhxdw6z8r6/cap.png
[23:04] <daftykins> in my earlier capture ^
[23:05] <daftykins> ok so now i need to look into what's blocking the response :D
[23:08] <daftykins> diddledan + mgdm thanks guys, i think i'm going to call it a night there before i go crazier with it
[23:08] <diddledan> lol
[23:08] <mgdm> hehe, fair enough
[23:09] <daftykins> g'night everyone \o
[23:10] <daftykins> thank you to all those who helped
[23:14] <daftykins> dafty in mountain out of a molehill situation
[23:14] <daftykins> ^_^