=== GentileBen is now known as Armarand === Armarand is now known as RaycisCharles [00:09] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taumatawhakatangihangakoauauotamateapokaiwhenuakitanatahu === Lcawte is now known as Lcawte|Away [00:29] .who [00:30] .me [00:30] wait [00:30] what? [00:30] where? [00:31] when? [00:32] oh why [00:32] AlanBell: Why have all the eggs in your G+ picture got small holes/dimples in [00:35] I have a little tool for poking holes in them, it lets the steam out of the bubble of air that sits on the fat end of the egg [00:35] stops them cracking while they boil [00:35] well, there you go [00:35] the thing that they are sitting in is a water bath boiler [00:35] basically steam cooks them [00:36] is this good? [00:37] well it can do boiled eggs to various consistencies, so if you want the yolk to be a tiny little bit runny in the centre then I can do that [00:40] hmm ok [00:40] * penguin42 guesses AlanBell must eat a lot of eggs [00:40] eggs++ [00:41] not masses, production is very low at the moment === iahmad is now known as iahmad|afk [08:25] meh. [08:27] that good eh Myrtti [08:27] yeah. [08:27] hugs [08:28] I flashed the Galaxy Nexus I have my Finnish sim in with Ubuntu Touch last week, woke up to my bluetooth speaker going all rattattatta, saw a tiny flash of something and it was gone on the phone [08:28] spent some few minutes wondering where the hell the call log was (popey told me) - turns out it was of course [08:28] a telemarketer. [08:29] sigh [08:29] popey is going to be busy when they release that thing for real [08:29] and I was getting all panicky about it being a phone call from a hospital that my sisters house had burnt down or something [08:29] (I rarely get any phonecalls) [08:31] saucy upgrade time. [08:32] has anyone tried KDE connect? [08:32] i kinda want to use their backend to run an indicator [08:33] I might be 8 years out of date, but .. they spelt it with a C? [08:33] KDE is all like, business-y now [08:33] which means they had to stop using K everywhere [08:34] that's just wrong [08:34] also, Konnect was probably already taken [08:35] http://kde-apps.org/content/show.php?content=16663 [08:35] anywhoooo [08:39] Morning earthlings [08:40] Pip pip [08:41] Nice curry on Saturday? [08:41] Very! [08:41] I had a 'special' which had chicken pieces in a sauce mostly made of minced lamb. Was very nice [08:42] lots of red wine etc [08:42] Not been to We. Been to the little Thai place on the corner which was nice recently. [08:42] Claire driving then ;-) [08:42] no, one of the other mums came and picked us up! [08:42] then taxi back [08:42] \o/ [08:42] Cool. [08:48] * AlanBell had a naga chicken curry on saturday [08:48] yum [08:48] it was very yum [08:48] I love naga chillies [08:48] Me too :-) [08:49] AlanBell: Thing 1 has a weird inset day today. He's going in for 1 class from 9 - 9:50 then I need to pick him up... So will be at home today. [08:49] I always think of Naga as being snake related [08:49] TheOpenSourcerer: ok, I will plug raspberry pi things into your monitor :) [08:50] DJones: lots of chillies have fearsome names like that [08:50] Heh, yeah I've noticed that trend [08:50] I don't know how people who work in "normal" jobs (9-5) manage. [08:51] * TheOpenSourcerer grew Naga Viper this year - An awesomely hot chilli [08:56] Morning all [09:02] TheOpenSourcerer: I have similar issues, I work through my lunches to cover the weird times that school seem to be imposing just so I have 'flex' time [09:02] Even though my company doesn't offer flexi time === schwuk_away is now known as schwuk === alexis is now known as Guest27625 [09:13] AlanBell: Have you seen this http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/11/11/personal_web_and_mail_server_for_raspberry_pi_seeks_cash/ [09:15] diplo: there's 2 types of flexi time though [09:16] "flexible working hours" and "i'll be in late this morning guys but i'll work a bit late too" [09:17] and "I am off to lunch, might not be back" [09:18] yeah, pretty much the latter one for me. [09:18] what about "i'll be in later" - shows up at 4.55pm, starts meeting (reserved for management) [09:20] DJones: that looks like a problem that's already been repeatedly solved with differing degrees of completeness [09:20] ok, saucy. [09:22] running a mailserver on a pi does not sound fun :/ [09:23] Good morning all; happy Origami Day! :-D [09:24] DJones: interesting, I can't quite see the attraction of a non-diy solution when you are using a pi as the platform [09:24] shauno: if you can find a static IP address to plug it into then it should be fine [09:24] aside from mail generally not being fun :) [09:25] a static ip that has sane rdns and isn't blocked by half the planet simply for being a residential line [09:28] Urgh, it comes to something when you have to go to work for a rest [09:31] If that Raspberry Pi installation DJones mentioned runs an open proxy, most IRC networks won't allow you on from it. [09:31] why would you be irc'ing from your web/email server? [09:31] (please ignore the fact that I do this) [09:32] ali1234: as do I :) [09:32] why would you be running an open proxy? [09:33] mungbean: I wouldn't (mine is only open to specific IP addresses) [09:33] i think the point here is, nobody is going to have a raspberry pi hosted in a datacentre, it will be in their house. therefore there's no benefit to IRC'ing from it [09:34] I consider it good practice to IRC from your most important production machine [09:34] it does mean that i know instantly if there's a problem [09:34] ^ this. best uptime monitor there is [09:34] (I am not as it happens) [09:34] ali1234: if someone doesn't have a hosted server, but they do run a Pi at home that's always on, they might use it as an IRC server/bouncer [09:34] ah, i don't actually use a bouncer [09:34] I use irssi in a screen session, but I know people who use bouncers. [09:34] i use ssh socks proxy purely to avoid firewalls [09:35] i actually just run pidgin on my desktop through it [09:35] Yeah, that's also useful, as it having an external machine I can shell to to do hostname lookups from the outside. [09:35] There are also web-based IRC clients, of course, but for that you may as well use mibbit, I guess. [09:36] I think if he really wants to wrest control from google, he'd be better served trying to create a webmail client that can at least match it [09:36] yes, absolutely [09:36] or a native one for that matter [09:36] There are already a number of solutions for that sort of thing, but I guess he's bringing them toether in a preconfigured image. [09:36] along with the search / spam control behind it that actually works [09:37] gmail's spam control seems to be pretty effective [09:37] it's damn near bulletproof [09:37] right, which is why he'd need to come anywhere close to it [09:37] i don't even care about hiding my email address from spammers [09:37] sticking it on a pi rates high on the trendy factor, but doesn't actually answer why people are using google in the first place [09:38] * dwatkins ponders getting a flu jab [09:39] My Raspberry Pi does one thing, and it does it very well. If I want to quickly check something is registered correctly in DNS from another machine, it's also useful, but I prefer the idea of having discrete devices for simple tasks. [09:39] anecdotally i've heard of a lot of people getting a cold for 5 days after the4 flu jab [09:39] (granted, that one thing involves a number of components, but it's not running at 100% CPU usage all day long) [09:39] dwatkins: no, you're supposed to want a single device that does everything, in mobile form factor [09:39] mungbean: yeah, I was told it's not worth the potential risk if you're not already at risk. [09:40] ali1234: but I have a laptop for that ;) [09:40] mobile phone [09:40] ah yes, the Edge [09:40] My phone gets hot enough listening to the radio. [09:40] which reminds me of what i was doing an hour ago [09:42] my little mifi lives at work. comes in handy for things like poking dns externally, wasting 7hrs55m a day on reddit, etc [09:43] gnome system monitor takes 20% of CPU , doesn't that rather skew the results ? [09:43] I think I have my reddit traffic proxied via home, it's a while since I set foxyproxy up. [09:43] yes, yes it does [09:43] mungbean: indeed, as with most task manager type apps [09:43] why so intensive ? [09:43] it's all those svg graphs, they are rendered as vector curves [09:43] its not hard to make a lightweight cpu monitior? [09:43] if you have 4x CPU, it uses 4x as much CPU to render [09:44] xload :D [09:44] I eventually gave up fighting with proxies at work. seems the easiest way to obey the network rules, is to not use their network [09:44] that, + a 4G mifi = win :) [09:45] I live in 1987land, I'm happy 3g works [09:45] I was hesitant to get a phone without a numberpad. [09:46] shauno: 1987land? [09:46] dwatkins: ♥ my nexus 5 [09:47] MartijnVdS: I have an HTC Desire HD ;) [09:47] my they have big screens [09:47] yeah, but not quite "Note"-esque [09:47] "all the better to see you with"? [09:47] shauno: that's cameras [09:47] I don't think I have big enough pockets for modern phones. [09:49] yeah, that's starting to become a problem [09:50] this is my favourite solution to modern phones not having a keypad: http://static.freeware4android.net/data/programs/images/Rotary-Dialer-Android_1_28612.png [09:50] dwatkins: does it also make the noises? [09:51] dwatkins: surely https://www.sparkfun.com/products/retired/8929 ? [09:51] MartijnVdS: yeah, that's what I use it for (or one of these) [09:51] shauno: I have one of those at home ;) [09:51] oh, not the portable one [09:51] but this one's bluetooth so you can throw it in your manbag with your tabletphone : [09:52] I do have a wireless bluetooth thing that looks like a handset from a rotary phone, and an actual 1950s GPO telephone, though [09:52] nice, shauno [09:52] yeah I've seen a few of those. cabled 'n all. sticking the dialer in there is a neat trick through [09:53] my main problem with touchscreens is that they're near-useless in the rain. novelty apps become just as frustrating at that point [09:58] also useless for the blind, or near-as, I assume [09:58] not at all [09:59] loads of blind people have iphones [09:59] I guess the voice feedback might be handy [09:59] it is absolute positioning, so something in the top left, is in the top left [10:00] with a mouse that doesn't work if you don't know where the pointer is starting from [10:02] I gotta say, fanboy aside, apple seem to have the hang of accessibility [10:02] I was very impressed with the quality of the text-to-speech voice on my Mac. [10:03] gnome 2 was getting quite good [10:03] ...and then unity ;) [10:03] indeed [10:04] or a general focus on visual design at all costs [10:04] I'm confused by the current debate about Mir versus its rival, but need to read-up on it to know more. [10:04] I was upset you couldn't move the taskbar. [10:04] visual design :) [10:04] I assume it's all related to Ubuntu phone somehow. [10:04] I haven't been paying a whole lot of attention, but that debate appears to be more politics than anything else [10:05] shauno: yeah, I think I'd rather just switch to Gnome 3. [10:05] I think they call it the unity bar, and I think the idea is that it's always supposed to be in a consistent place across devices [10:05] regardless of user preferences [10:05] well, I mean mir vs wayland vs X vs whatever else [10:05] Wayland vs Mir is an odd thing, everyone has an opinion, but there has been practically no information that end users understand to give an informed opinion [10:06] everything I've heard so far sounds like parents bickering at a beauty pageant for 4yos [10:06] indeed, I agree X is old and crusty, but I gather there have been certain decisions surrounding Mir which were made without involving the community. [10:06] So Wayland sounds to me like the better option because it's actually been made with collaboration, but I might be missing something. [10:06] with Mir vs Wayland I think the main beef was just duplication of effort. It would have been nice if everyone was pulling in the same direction [10:07] As for the unity bar, bashrc - I can see the point, but when I have two monitors, I don't want it cluttering up the middle, I just want to be able to change stuff. [10:07] which one gets me wobbly windows? [10:07] or a cube of desktops? [10:07] ali1234: that's one of the reasons I want Gnome 3 ;) [10:07] and that's the other ;) [10:07] I used to love drawing fire on the screen [10:08] simple little things... [10:08] happy days [10:08] fire on the screen is cool too, I like the stars that orbit the mouse [10:08] but neither the wayland people or the Mir people say anything about bling [10:08] wat [10:09] you've just made a pretty good case against displays in general [10:09] it is all about rendering flat windows onto a flat screen [10:09] where is my 3d desktop that was in Jurassic Park? [10:09] "hmm we need to render some 2d rectangles onto a 2d display. i know, let's use incredibly expensive hardware designed for rendering 3d graphics." [10:10] AlanBell: http://fsv.sourceforge.net/ [10:10] the 3d hardware is incredibly fast, so it is a good thing to use it [10:11] I used to run the app they used in Jurassic Park on an Indy, it was hilarious [10:11] FSV is a port of the IRIX app they used in the film. [10:11] yup [10:11] AlanBell: the thing is, it's not [10:11] the 3d hardware only wins if you are doing animation, effects, transparency [10:11] nostalgia: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zaRHU1XxMJQ [10:11] I'm not sure "use it because it's there" is always a good thing. eg, I have a battery. I believe they're expecting Mir to show up in ubuntu phone too [10:12] if you are doing simple windowing, painter's algorithm and dirty rectangles on the CPU absoluely blows away anything you can do with a GPU [10:12] ali1234: yes, so using it and then having a flat desktop with no animation, effects or transparency is a bit of a waste [10:13] yes [10:13] I agree effects are a waste, but it makes dealing with some boring applications just that little bit more fun. [10:13] another way of looking at it is that if you don't need effects, not using the GPU will give you a better experience, if you are using a desktop that supports that [10:13] that reminds me, I need to renew my parking permit [10:13] they are not saying "this will fix window shadows and make them awsome" or even the top bar shadow, or some cool thing with the dash or launcher [10:14] I thought Mir was all about rewriting the graphical stack to be all modern and portable to phones. [10:14] yes, I think that's the idea [10:15] yup, with server allocated buffers which is apparently a good thing for small arm devices [10:15] but I am not sure why I should care [10:15] dwatkins: it is. unfortunately the modern ideas on how to do graphics = "you must have lots of animation, and you must use the GPU" [10:16] I do think it's part of why linux can't even spell power management on my laptop :/ [10:18] shauno: mir is already in ubuntu phone [10:19] Leapmotion is in Amazon offers of the day at 11 [10:19] if anyone is interested [10:19] hwo much? [10:19] dunno yet [10:19] it's 69 now [10:19] I don't think there's necessarily anything wrong with making use of the GPU - so long as it's not vendor specific [10:20] well, 70 [10:21] I just don't trust linux desktops to do it well, unfortunately. my laptop gets 8-9 hours under OSX, ~4 hours under XP, and about 90 minutes with ubuntu 12.04. something is horribly wrong. [10:22] http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2013/09/leap-motion-desktop-control-on-linu that is kinda cool [10:28] hp chromebooks are cheapycheap [10:30] hey guys - what's the best way to setup a port forward on a linux box? [10:30] i.e. I've got a box setup as a dmz, but i'd like to forward just for 1194 to a different machine? [10:31] how permanent do you want it, and do you want encryption on the link between the dmz box and the other machine? [10:32] iptables is one answer, ssh -L is the other answer [10:32] shorewall aint too shabby neither [10:32] does ufw do port forwarding? [10:33] they are all frontends to iptables I think? [10:33] yup [10:37] I don't think ufw does forwarding. just allow/deny/limit [10:37] hey Alan, I want a permanent solution [10:37] you may be right [10:37] I'd normally do an SSH tunnel [10:37] andylockran: you're going to want to look at shorewall then [10:37] I've got ufw setup. [10:37] I'd switch to shorewall [10:37] UFW doesn't do what you need it to do [10:37] http://www.shorewall.net/FAQ.htm#PortForwarding [10:38] can I edit /etc/ufw/before.rules to add a forward using iptables syntax? [10:39] oooh, good question [10:39] I was just writing something like that, yeah. you can add iptables rules to before.rules or after.rules, rather than ditching ufw completely [10:39] just note the 'custom rules should be added to ..' comments so you don't get in an arguement with it [10:40] I think you might want a MASQUERADE rule [10:40] good morning everyone. [10:40] I've got a non-standard setup already. eth0 is the internet device, and eth1 is the internal lan [10:41] eth2 are the virtual machines on the box, and that's all setup and working [10:44] I want to port forward to a different IP. i think that's why it's got complicated [10:44] maybe ssh -L is the best bet [10:49] * brobostigon reckons he needs to trim the moustache, it is getting coffee stains. [10:49] eww [10:49] I nearly shaved mine off by accident yesterday. [10:49] moustaches are wrong [10:50] :( [10:51] I don't think they're for everyone [10:51] agreed. [10:52] if you have to have a special sponsored month for anyone to grow them... [10:52] http://www.weebls-stuff.com/songs/moustaches/ [10:52] I tried, it looks like a 70s flashback. except it's grey on the left side and brown on the other. [10:53] I'm only 30. nowhere near ready to rock a grey tache :/ [10:55] so dye it [10:55] Go for the Billy Connolly - purple tache [10:56] I'm not sure I have the big yin's self-confidence [10:56] hehe [10:57] I mean, I'm pretty sure I've seen his backside more times than my own. red flag right there [10:57] haha [10:58] a friend of mine, has his dyed like that, make me laugh everytime i see it. [10:58] Morning all [10:59] morning davmor2 [11:00] meh £49.99 [11:05] bloody customers, I know lets phone up support during the 2mins silnce. [11:07] oh dear [11:07] idiots [11:08] is it not at 11.11? [11:08] woops [11:08] bloody ubuntu [11:08] shipping a new kernel ABI every 2 weeks is *hell* for sysadmins [11:08] yay security fixes [11:09] especially if you need that one feature Ubuntu has disabled in their stock kernels, so every ABI bump = recompile ALL the things [11:09] directhex: Most of the security fixes shouldn't be ABI changers [11:09] actually I'd be surprised any are [11:09] andylockran: Sounds like stunnel could be your friend. [11:09] penguin42: they all are [11:09] penguin42: hence 3.2.0-56 on precise atm [11:10] MartijnVdS: Right but they don't actually change the ABI [11:10] anyone good with twiki? [11:11] bleepy-bleepy-bleep? [11:11] none of the security fixes are ABI bumps ubuntu puts out *feature* updates every 2 weeks [11:11] also, have the missing carriage return from above: [11:12] BIDIBIDIBIDI what's up doc [11:12] adding support for newer hardware is neato and all, but a) broadly useless unless it's in an install image, and b) every 2 weeks!!?!?! [11:13] directhex: don't they do new hardware in the "LTS Enablement" bits only? The ABI changes are for security-only fixes. [11:13] directhex: Curious; I thought the whole purpose of the hardware enablement packages in LTS was to avoid this [11:13] MartijnVdS, security fixes don't break ABI [11:13] MartijnVdS, except for under extreme circumstances [11:14] directhex: Point to an ABI breaking update? [11:14] directhex: then why did last weekend's security update bump it from -55 to -56 [11:14] penguin42, any time the kernel changes from -X- to -X+1- it's due to an ABI break [11:16] marlinc, point to a security fix in -55 compared to -54 [11:16] MartijnVdS, ^^ [11:17] directhex: OK hang on - what's this actually breaking for you - you're not actually hitting a missing symbol/function that's changed in the ABI are you? [11:17] penguin42, i have users literally running out of disk space from having 20 kernels installed [11:18] directhex: Oh! [11:18] directhex: Right, that problem - that's not the ABI changing that's the problem; the problem is Ubuntu's inability to clean out old kernels! [11:18] penguin42, it's both [11:18] That is fixed nowadays [11:18] I don't remember if it's in 12.04 though [11:18] penguin42, debian 7 is on -4- [11:18] but old kernels are marked for autoremoval [11:18] directhex: Yeh but debian is hopelessly broken [11:19] penguin42: NO FIRMWAREZ!! [11:19] directhex: I thought you were actually complaining about an ABI break.... [11:19] penguin42, the package name changes to *force* an ABI break [11:19] /etc/kernel/postinst.d/apt-auto-removal [11:19] (Although looking at 3.2.0-56.86's changelog I don't see why it got inc'd) [11:20] directhex: Sorry by 'ABI break' I took that to mean a binary-interface that actually changed (which should be the reason for that!) [11:20] directhex: But yeh, fundamentally you're problem is a lot simpler - it's just the /boot mess on Ubuntu [11:21] penguin42, plenty of kernel modules will actually fail to load if the kernel's full version number (which is bumped here) does not match [11:21] penguin42, it *is* ABI broken. intentionally. [11:21] directhex: shrug [11:21] not a *big* break, maybe, probably. but broken nonetheless [11:22] directhex: Pretty much everything (even the closed stuff) uses build-at-boot for wrappers, so as long as the actual things you call didnd't change it works [11:22] as long as you don't have a /boot partition smaller than a few gig [11:22] i.e. as long as you don't use full disk encryption [11:22] directhex: see Laney's comment about cleanup [11:23] know just how bad it is when your upgrade fails due to ENOSPC on /boot, when your have an encrypted root disk? [11:23] directhex: That's fundamentally the problem - and yes I've hit exactly this junk on FDE [11:23] I've had it happen with "plain" (unencrypted) LVM installs [11:23] it's a LOT of work to fix [11:26] it seems like autoprune would be fairly easy to fix? [11:26] shauno: Should be - the challenge is making sure it doesn't go nuts and take out the kernel you're using [11:27] shauno: Actually it's a little more complex than that - if you don't actually reboot for a few upgrades then the challenge is what to keep; so you have to keep the one you're currently booted in and at least one you're going to boot into [11:28] There's some comments in the file that says what it tries to do [11:28] make a daily task that 'votes' for the current kernel, and expires any 'vote' over n days old. then whenever you want to stick a new kernel in, tally the votes and kick the bottom 1 or 2. sorted? [11:29] make age the tie-breaker, and it'll prefer kernels it can suppose work over something that installed and didn't workout so well [11:53] meshlab could really do with using multiple cores [12:59] just chomped on my ulcer on my lip :( === alan_g is now known as alan_g|lunch === schwuk is now known as schwuk_away [13:28] Whelp, my first foray into Sony devices since the PS3 debatable has left me once again hating Sony xD [13:29] bought the Smartwatch 2, they have since pulled 2/3 of the features that are printed on the box, along with a bunch of other features. [13:29] Yaaaaaay Sony. [13:29] * Azelphur returns [13:29] smart watches aren't a smart investment imho [13:29] MartijnVdS: I'd be happy with it if it functioned as advertised, i really wanted wrist controls for my media player. [13:32] I think if I was spending multiple hundreds of pounds on a watch I would want it to have an expected lifetime of quite a bit more than a phone [13:34] well, mine was £125.70 [13:34] still too much ihmo :) [13:35] hehe [13:35] well, getting a refund anyway [13:35] It's pretty bad when you have 3 features printed on the products box, and the device can only actually perform one of them [13:36] >.< [13:36] this is actually the one and only device I've ever returned under distance selling for just being bad [13:37] hotglue your phone to your arm [13:37] xD [13:37] (don't actually do this) [13:38] not even a little bit? [13:38] yeah, hot glue will burn [13:38] use super glue instead [13:38] I see [13:38] I got a Pebble watch, really like it. [13:39] ducttape would seem more watchstraplike? [13:39] dwatkins: I was so tempted, but I went with the Sony because it has a touchscreen and color display [13:40] I wasn't concerned about touchscreen nor colour, it is nice that I can control my music, see e-mails and calls etc. [13:42] * Azelphur shrugs [13:42] I think I might wait on the new google one that is supposed to be arriving [13:44] I'm gonna keep hoping the apple rumours come through [13:44] I was tempted to buy a 5th gen iPod nano because it can be worn as a watch. [13:44] That would be perfect with bluetooth. === schwuk_away is now known as schwuk [14:14] http://www.indiegogo.com/projects/linux-voice [14:16] almost got kicked out from Linus Torvalds house for using an iPhone xD [14:17] who did? [14:17] mgdm: the Linux Voice people, in the video popey just linked [14:17] oh [14:18] really? I thought he was a bit more sane than that [14:19] do you think it's a joke to try and ask for a partial refund of your monthly ISP fee, when they remotely reset your router whilst you're off-island, stopping you getting access to your own gear? === alan_g|lunch is now known as alan_g [14:20] if you don't have an SLA, I'm not sure I'd waste my time, personally [14:20] well i went so far as to pester them about it, they claim they reconfigured peoples routers to change encapsulation from ATM to PPPoE [14:21] why didn't yours come back up then? [14:21] it did, but i reconfigure them to use a different subnet [14:21] so although it came back, it was factory reset [14:22] that's sub-optimal, to say the least [14:22] *nod* [14:22] everything i like to gain access to remotely / leave running was dead [14:22] they claim they won't be doing it again [14:23] this is why you have oob administration [14:24] ? [14:25] £44.98 a month for line rental and 40/2 VDSL2 [14:25] i wish i didn't have to have the phone :D [14:26] if they have a backdoor to be able to factory reset then I'd posit they needn't factory reset just to update the encapsulation - they can get their script to just change the relevant settings [14:26] not really [14:26] they likely had to push out a new firmware [14:26] for GCHQ, of course [14:27] i bet the firmware didn't change. i asked about getting a new one in my original email [14:27] yeah same version [14:28] just a single parameter change on the 'dial up' profile [14:28] what router is it? [14:30] http://www.technicolorgateways.nl/Producten/Advanced/TG789vnv3/TG789vnv3Datasheet.pdf [14:30] Technicolor TG789vn v3 [14:31] ah [14:32] wow with that PDF open, Firefox 25 won't let me edit the address bar [14:34]