infinitydoko: While you're uploading FTBFS compilers, you've noticed that gcc-4.8 can't migrate because you dropped a library that all the olders ones depend on, right?00:02
dokoinfinity, I know, I should have gone to bed00:03
infinitydoko: Yeah, my late night uploads usually aren't much better. :)00:03
dokoinfinity, feel free to merge the older ones. I wanted to delay that until alioth is up again00:05
infinitydoko: Oh, if you already have the older ones fixed in Debian or a VCS, that's cool.00:06
dokoinfinity, feel free to fix 4.400:07
infinitydoko: I'm in no huge rush to see it all fixed migrate, just wanted to make sure it was happening some day. :)00:07
infinitydoko: I can replicate your 4.6/4.7 fix to 4.4 if you haven't, sure.00:07
infinitydoko: (After I fly across an ocean and such, so... Later)00:07
dokodo you work somtimes too? ;-P00:08
infinitydoko: Every second Thursday.00:08
infinity(Hey, I worked all day while I was doing laundry!... And most of the long weekend I just had)00:08
infinityI suck at long weekends.00:08
bdmurrayslangasek: I'm not sure we are collecting everything we need00:10
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pittistgraber: 1211514> as the changelog says, version 4 fixes half of the problem, but I just figured out the other half last night (way after uploading the SRU)04:19
pittistgraber: but that bug is much less critical than the suspend failure, so I wanted to get this out ASAP04:20
pittistgraber: that bug is indeed not yet fixed in trusty04:20
pittiGood morning04:20
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pitti@pilot in06:40
=== udevbot changed the topic of #ubuntu-devel to: Ubuntu 13.10 released! | Archive: open | Devel of Ubuntu (not support or app devel) | build failures -> http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/ftbfs/ | #ubuntu for support and discussion of lucid -> saucy | #ubuntu-app-devel for app development on Ubuntu http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment | See #ubuntu-bugs for http://bit.ly/lv8soi | Patch Pilots: pitti
dholbachgood morning06:55
pittihey dholbach06:56
dholbachhey pitti06:56
arun_Hello guys, I didn't get any feedbacks from the glibc maintainers, I was wanting to add a new language suppport(language package) having iso code ="the" ; please  helpme !!!07:30
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pittidholbach: happier with the sponsoring queue now? :-)08:16
dholbachpitti, a bit, yes ;-)08:16
* dholbach hugs pitti08:16
* pitti hugs dholback08:18
arun_Hello guys, I didn't get any feedbacks from the glibc maintainers, I was wanting to add a new language suppport(language package) having iso code ="the" ; please  helpme !!!08:33
dholbachseb128, didrocks: salut mes amis! comment ça va? could you add something to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TimoJyrinki/DeveloperApplication-PPU when you have time? :)08:42
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arun_Hello guys, I didn't get any feedbacks from the glibc maintainers, I was wanting to add a new language suppport(language package) having iso code ="the" ; please  helpme !!!08:43
dholbacharun_, maybe you bring it up on the mailing list instead?08:45
didrocksdholbach: oh, with great pleasure!08:45
seb128dholbach, salut, c'était bien l'Inde ? sure, can do, adding to my list for today (in fact it was already in my tomboy todo note)08:45
dholbacharun_, instead of posting this every couple of hour/half hour08:45
dholbachdidrocks, seb128: très bien, merci beaucoup08:46
didrocksMirv: you didn't add qtcore itself and all qt plugins?08:46
seb128dholbach, nice to have you back ;-)08:46
dholbachseb128, c'était fantastique - j'au aucun idée pourquoi je suis retourné :)08:46
didrocksMirv: I think you can add what we are upstream for (what's in cu2d)08:46
seb128dholbach, don't forget to hug Laney for doing sponsoring reminder08:46
* dholbach hugs Laney08:46
dholbachthat's right! :)08:47
penghuanHello, anyone knows how the package‘s "Task" tag comes, if i want to set a package's "Task" tag, what should i do?08:49
Mirvdidrocks: can you be more specific? by qtcore do you mean qtcreator? it rarely needs updating other than new upstream version since now our stuff is separated from there. the qtcreator-plugin-ubuntu includes both plugins we have.08:52
didrocksMirv: Source: qtbase-opensource-src08:53
didrocksMirv: I don't see it in the first sentence :)08:53
didrocks(also, we do have way more Qt components than what is listed)08:54
Mirvdidrocks: which sentence, and which list. since this is a different channel too, I don't have the context :) the upstream Qt modules are not suitable for daily release as is.08:55
Mirvdidrocks: the PPU page!08:55
Mirvdidrocks: right, now I understand what on earth you're talking about :)08:55
Mirvdidrocks: so... I thought I'd start with those special modules and QtC. I'm part of the pkg-kde team in Debian, so the official Qt modules can be easily added afterwards, while I'd certainly want to go through them with someone else for the next big 5.2 upload still.08:56
didrocksMirv: that was just 10 lines before I pinged you ;)08:56
Mirvdidrocks: yeah, there just wasn't highlight above that and I thought this was some sort of continuation from CI channel :)08:57
didrocksMirv: I think you are suited to have all Qt modules at least (I would add daily packages, but if you want to do that later on, I'm fine)08:57
Mirvdidrocks: ok08:57
didrocksMirv: you did all the packaging and we just sponsor you, so it's a strong suggestion :)08:57
didrocksMirv: I trust you to ask us if you have any question anyway08:58
didrocks(which are what the upload rights are really about)08:58
pittijodh: is https://code.launchpad.net/~jamesodhunt/ubuntu/saucy/sysvinit/force-reload-configuration-for-broken-inotify/+merge/180690 still relevant? (I'd upload it to trusty instead)09:09
* Mirv added the rest of the Qt modules and most of cu2d packages that provide Qt modules09:17
didrocksMirv: great!09:20
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jodhpitti: yes, it very much is. I believe slangasek is going to merge it when he gets a chance.09:28
pittijodh: it looks fine to me, so if you want I can merge it now09:28
jodhpitti: oh - sorry, wrong branch. one sec...09:29
pittijodh: (being patch pilot today)09:29
xnoxpenghuan: tasks come from seeds in ubuntu, see http://pad.lv/p/ubuntu-seeds https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SeedManagement . So it's done post-upload, on the archive side.09:29
jodhpitti: I've commented on the MP. Essentially, it's fine, but we might want to call on system actually using overlayfs.09:36
Riddelldholbach: George Merkel on ubuntu-motu list being a bit non-CoC?09:43
dholbachRiddell, I just replied to the mail09:43
RiddellI wonder what's going on in his head09:44
dholbach(but everybody else could have reminded him of the fact too :))09:44
dholbachno idea - I assume somebody who signed up for the list at some stage, forgot about it and is now surprised about the traffic happening today09:44
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arun Hello guys, excuse me !!!! I had some questions about the adding of new language having ISO Code = "the" , please help me anyone there !!!10:02
pittijodh: is that for the live session? I. e. could we just guard that with 'grep -q '^/cow / overlayfs' /proc/mounts ?10:09
pittijodh: (asked the same on the MP)10:10
xnoxpitti: live session, persistent usb, cloud-images with overlayfs. Or any other file system that happens to not support inotify, or have non-notifying inotify support as the case is with overlayfs.10:11
pittixnox: right, but that sounds like a rather similar check (just perhaps not with /cow)10:11
pittibut we shouldn't make it too complicated; if it takes lots of grepping, stat'ing, and guessing, we might just as well do the reload :)10:12
xnoxpitti: similarly session-init is also affected, thus we maybe also should make all session init's reload configs, and that's a few paths /etc/xdg/, /etc/ubuntu-xdg/, /usr/share/upstart/session10:13
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pittijodh, xnox: proposed a more generic solution on the MP10:21
pittiI tested this on a live CD (says "overlayfs") and on my desktop (says "ext4")10:22
xnoxpitti: there is no inotify over NFS, when in root over NFS configuration - is /etc mounted local, or is that remote as well?10:25
pittixnox: as I said, I'm not trying to deal with each and every broken configuration, just with overlayfs :)10:26
xnoxi'm guessing in fully disk-less configurations it's remote.10:26
pittibut then / would be remote, too10:26
pittiso it could be extended to check for overlayfs or nfs10:27
jodhxnox: re session init, maybe we should consider adding a ConfigurationReloaded signal that they can all react to. Depends how quickly the kernel team fix the overlayfs issue though :)10:28
xnoxpitti: in a way I agree with you. Polluting each invoke-rc.d call with reload-configuration is expensive and needless. And the actual usability bug in question is "i've installed $daemon package, it didn't start" and most commonly that's on overlayfs (live desktop iso / cloud image).10:30
pitti@pilot out10:31
=== udevbot changed the topic of #ubuntu-devel to: Ubuntu 13.10 released! | Archive: open | Devel of Ubuntu (not support or app devel) | build failures -> http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/ftbfs/ | #ubuntu for support and discussion of lucid -> saucy | #ubuntu-app-devel for app development on Ubuntu http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment | See #ubuntu-bugs for http://bit.ly/lv8soi | Patch Pilots:
asaccyphermox: i still roam to a 40/70 AP while there is a 61/70 AP available (on trusty)10:44
asaccyphermox: you said that NM is the one deciding on such "policy"?10:45
ari-tczewhallyn_: you've added 2 changes on package syslog-ng (https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/syslog-ng/3.3.1.dfsg-1ubuntu1) but there is no explanation what do these changes. are they still needed? are they Debian-related, as well?10:49
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asaccyphermox: checking a bit on code there seem to be bgscan_simple and learn ... i only found that NM tweaks the simple parameters for the wpa_eap case, do you know where the "real" defaults used for wpa_psk are?10:59
dholbachRiddell, he apologised in private and I took him off the list11:05
pittidiwic: I read through bug 1197395 and the corresponding Fedora bug (I linked that now); I'd rather fix this in libpam-systemd, so that we don't have to apply the workaround in ubuntu's pulse, if that's ok with you?11:05
ubottubug 1197395 in systemd (Ubuntu) "/run/user/$ID/pulse owned by root and not by the user" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/119739511:05
pittidiwic: it might still make sense to apply it upstream of course, if the pam fix gets rejected upstream11:05
diwicpitti, sure, go ahead and fix in systemd, I too think that's better11:06
pittidiwic: we'd otherwise need the same fix in dconf, dbus, and whatnot11:06
pittiupstart, gvfs too11:06
Riddelldholbach: win :)11:06
diwicpitti, I was hoping that my "blame systemd developers" patch would persuade Lennart to fix the bug upstream, but so far no response. Only been one day though.11:09
seb128ev, hey, there is something weird with e.u.c11:36
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ari-tczewinfinity: I was looking on the package source-highlight. (http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/trusty/source-highlight/trusty/revision/21) debian has adopted similiar patch like yours. however, sequence in debian/rules is reversed. (http://paste.ubuntu.com/6410267/) anyhow package from Debian builds fine (tested only i386). is it OK and can be synced?11:36
seb128ev, https://errors.ubuntu.com/problem/eac5049914041dcb1e77bd2c6437da8fa9eca096 has a total of 116 reports in that page, but it has more reports than that on the index (e.g https://errors.ubuntu.com/?release=Ubuntu%2013.10)11:37
Mirvdidrocks: could you push a button to rebuild qtcreator-plugin-ubuntu 2.8.1-0ubuntu1 on armhf? its build dep was an arch-independent package that depended on arch specific package which hadn't yet built at the time of the first try.11:39
seb128ev, e.g "https://errors.ubuntu.com/?release=Ubuntu%2013.10&from=2013-11-10&to=2013-11-13" has that report with a count=303 which is > 116 total for the detail view11:40
didrocksMirv: done11:40
xnoxcjwatson: libwebp has moved to main (MIR approved), is ok to upload imagemagick with webp enabled?11:46
cjwatsonxnox: Any chance of getting Debian to enable it first?  It's not something we currently disable in an Ubuntu delta, as far as I can see.11:48
xnoxcjwatson: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/imagemagick/+bug/1117481/comments/311:48
ubottuUbuntu bug 1117481 in imagemagick (Ubuntu) "Imagemagick lacks support for webp" [Undecided,Opinion]11:48
cjwatsonxnox: Right - I'd be more comfortable if it had reached the point where Debian was prepared to support it11:49
cjwatsonxnox: I'm absolutely not going to overrule an "OMG this is a security nightmare" from the Debian maintainer who knows imagemagick much better than I do - persuade *them* :-011:50
arun_Hello excuse me guys , please help me add a new language11:51
xnoxcjwatson: not sure where "5" is taken from, given that public CVEs turned up only 3 in 2012 (as part of MIR). Unless it's part of imagemagick's CVEs of which there are more.....11:52
xnoxright, will talk with debain maintainer11:52
knocteCimi: ping11:55
Cimiknocte, pong11:59
knocteCimi: hey, can you have a look at https://code.launchpad.net/~knocte/ubuntu-themes/fix-Radiance-CSS-precedence-of-state-pseudoclasses/+merge/194678 when you have time?11:59
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CimiI approved, looks the same12:00
knocteCimi: cool thanks!12:01
xnoxknocte: omg! i wonder if that's the root cause behind "continue button is insensitive" if any class is applied to GtkEventBox by the application.12:03
xnox(thus preventing the user to finish the installation)12:03
knoctexnox: we're talking about CSS here, it shouldn't change behaviour in any way12:04
xnoxknocte: hm. the button did go from (default, sensitive, active) -> (insensitive). Sure but GTK does hook in functionality to css classes. The button was loosing sensitive css class, and ability to be clickable as well upon CSS change.12:05
xnox(all of us were mind boggled by it)12:06
knoctea CSS change cannot cause an element lose its classs, if anything, it can change some atributes that are applied to that class in a rule12:06
xnoxi think ubuntu-themes are missing a few other bug-fixes that were applied in Adwaita (ordering, properties, etc)12:06
seb128right, styling for some of the new widgets also12:07
seb128e.g the nautilus cog menu12:07
knocteprobably, I already applied one of the fixes that gtk3 upstream is including12:07
pittidiwic: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6410377/ does the trick for me12:08
xnoxseb128: knocte: so the GtkEventBox.fancy style and "style.add_class('fancy') had to be reverted in http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-installer/ubiquity/trunk/revision/6033 because otherwise it was causing https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bug/124053212:09
ubottuUbuntu bug 1240532 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "side by side install mode had disable back and install buttons" [Critical,Fix released]12:09
xnoxis there anything wrong that you can see with fancy class?12:09
pittidiwic: doing final build/test now, and then I'll send that to the RH bug12:10
xnox(it's done in application, so it would be after the theme is loaded)12:10
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diwicpitti, thanks. Feel free to add a pointer to my patch as well if you like (I don't think I have an account on fedora's bug tracker)12:10
ogra_ScottK, i just saw your comment about qreal/double on the blueprint, that seems to have been decided upstream already (there is a discussion on the debian-arm ML about this http://lists.debian.org/debian-arm/2013/11/msg00015.html)12:10
pittidiwic: already done in my reply from an hour ago12:10
knoctexnox: does this involve any pseudo-class (states)?12:10
pittidiwic: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=753882#c5712:11
ubottubugzilla.redhat.com bug 753882 in systemd "pam_systemd should not use loginuid (at least not when used by su)" [Medium,Assigned]12:11
seb128we should probably fix bugs like https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-themes/+bug/1186633 for the LTS12:11
ubottuUbuntu bug 1186633 in ubuntu-themes (Ubuntu) "gedit find box background should turn red when text is not found" [Undecided,New]12:11
seb128(if somebody feels like doing some theme hacking/refresh)12:11
pittiseb128: oh, that reminds me..12:12
pittiseb128: we got gnome-icon-theme-symbolic 3.10 autosynced into proposed, but we still have gnome-icon-theme 3.8 in trusty12:13
pittiseb128: this causes both packages to be uninstallable and e. g. breaks the deja-dup test12:13
pittiseb128: do we want to merge g-i-t 3.10 as well, or stay at 3.8 and remove the 3.10 -symbolic sync?12:13
seb128pitti, I've not looked at what change in g-i-t, updating to 3.10 seems fine in principle ... let me have a look12:14
knoctexnox: by looking at it I don't think it's related, take in account that the Ambiance fix ( http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-art-pkg/ubuntu-themes/trunk/revision/311 ) is only changing affecting elements that have insensitive, selected, focused or backdrop state12:14
pittiseb128: AFAIR we wanted to by and large stay at 3.8 for trusty, didn't we?12:14
knoctexnox: but the best way to know is if you test without that change12:15
seb128pitti, yes, but icons should be on the safe side...12:15
pittiseb128: certainly safe, yes; and we have our ubuntu icon themes anyway, so probably mostly relevant for ubuntu gnome12:15
pittiand they certainly want 3.1012:15
seb128pitti, 3.8 -> 3.10 is 4 commits12:16
seb1282 being a commit and revert12:17
seb128pitti, there is actually 1 commit between those12:17
pittic'est facile12:17
seb128pitti, do you want to do the update?12:17
xnoxknocte: right, so we did button.set_sensitive(false) -> add_class(fancy) to gtk_eventbox elsewhere on the gtkwindow -> button.set_sensitive(true) no longer worked, well it no longer made button sensitive nor made it accept any click / actions / signals12:18
xnoxknocte: with knowledge of subclasses and unbroken glade, let me experiment =)12:18
pittiseb128: can't do right now (only shoestring/yoghurt can internet in the train), but later12:19
seb128pitti, ok, thanks12:19
ogra_pitti, i just heard you have a blueprint planned about TRIM support, will you include MMC TRIM too (for arm) ?12:27
ogra_(got an url for me to subscribe ?)12:28
pittiogra_: is that any different than just calling fstrim on their mounts?12:28
pittiogra_: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/core-1311-ssd-trimming12:28
ogra_pitti, well, you want the discard option in fstab12:28
pittiogra_: if it's any different, can you please make a note in the whiteboard?12:28
ogra_(does fstrim set that)12:28
pittiogra_: I don't think we actually want that by default12:28
pittiogra_: I personally lean towards calling fstrim from cron instead of adding synchronous delays12:29
pittibut deciding between discard and cron'ed fstrim is the main meat of that discussion12:29
ogra_well, if it adds the same IO speedup as the fstab option i dont mind12:29
pittiogra_: but it sounds like you actually talk about the exact same thing; so yes, it'll be fixed one way or the other12:30
ogra_yeah, there shouldnt be much difference in functionality, but the device naming will be mmc specific12:30
ogra_(/dev/mmcblkXpY and such)12:30
pittiogra_: it doesn't care about device name; you run fstrim on mount points12:31
xnoxpitti: i'm also for cron option. Or anacron.12:31
pittiogra_: device names come into play if we want to set the discard option by default, though (but then we shouldn't look at device names but their properties, like "SSD?"/"can trim"?12:31
pittixnox: I just stuffed into cron.weekly; that should be anacron12:32
ogra_pitti, xnox ... well, the question is, do we want to run cron by default on phones (and preiodically wake them up)12:32
pittiogra_: well, one less often deletes many files on the phone12:33
pittiso perhaps we want discard on phone and cron on desktop/server12:33
ogra_right, i added a topic to the whiteboard12:33
ogra_(and subscribed)12:33
pittiogra_: heh, "performance boost" is a nice understatement12:34
pittiat least on an SSD, not doing any trimming is outright broken12:34
pittiafter a few months my SSD went from 250 to 5 (!) MB/s write speed12:35
ogra_MMCs usually work fine without but get a lot faster if the MMC supports it and you turn it on12:35
pittiogra_: do you have such a device at hand by chance?12:36
pittiogra_: can you confirm that "sudo hdparm -I /dev/mmcWHATEVER |grep -i trim" gives you something?12:36
ogra_the ac100 has such MMCs12:36
* ogra_ hasnt booted any ac100 in a year or two though ... 12:36
ogra_i'll make sure i have one working for next week12:37
pittiogra_: ah, so it's not for Panda/mako/maguro/etc?12:37
ogra_pitti, i havent checked on the phones yet12:37
pittiogra_: ok, thanks12:37
ogra_and panda uses SD cards ... that would have to be checked individually for each SD12:38
pittimy cron job just calls fstrim /mount/point, that'll just fail on devices which don't support it12:38
ogra_well, we should only enable it on devices where we know it works12:38
pitticalling lots of hdparm/sysfs poking isn't any faster really12:38
ogra_to not waste cycles12:38
pittibut we need these checks if we want to set the discard option on devices12:39
ogra_(on the phne thats easy to know in advance and just flick a switch)12:39
ogra_(based on the device)12:39
Cimiknocte, I noticed that we're missing menu separators, when this started happening?12:45
knocteCimi: in what theme?12:46
CimiI don't have them12:46
knocteI have them, and I have my patch applied, so I don't think my patches are related12:46
Cimiknocte, I have trusty though12:47
knocteok, my only change that could have affected Ambiance in trusty is the removal of empty rules, which I consider very unlikely to be the culprit12:48
rbasakogra_: on a phone, how about doing stuff when (say) the phone is charging and hits 100%? Then there shouldn't be a power issue. I imagine there's other maintenance stuff that might be useful here, too. So no cron, then, but you do get reasonably regular maintenance12:49
knocteCimi: I have only requested "safe" patches for now, I was going to start with the risky ones now but I guess I'll wait a bit :)12:49
rbasakI'm sure I read somewhere that dealing with trim works out better if you do it periodically from userspace rather than with discard12:50
rbasakhttp://opensuse.14.x6.nabble.com/SSD-detection-when-creating-first-time-fstab-td3313048.html and http://en.opensuse.org/SDB:SSD_discard_%28trim%29_support may be useful to read.12:51
ScottKogra_: Upstream has a view, but we have an option about whether or not to follow the switch or how to do it.  I'm aware of the Debian discussion.  They are interested in what Ubuntu decides to do.12:52
ogra_rbasak, well, lets discuss it at the vUDS session i'd say ;)12:53
ogra_rbasak, but indeed triggering something on 100% battery would be possible12:53
rbasakogra_: just a suggestion and fuel for discussion. It's not my area.12:54
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Cimithis is the broken commit http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-art-pkg/ubuntu-themes/trunk/revision/31513:20
knoctexnox: that is you? ^13:22
xnoxCimi: knocte: yeap, also regression spotted on the bug report https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-themes/+bug/118166113:26
ubottuUbuntu bug 1181661 in ubuntu-themes (Ubuntu) "Ugly separator in toolbar and Nautilus - Ambiance - 13.04" [Medium,Fix released]13:26
xnoxcomment 7-813:26
pittirbasak: "discard" will always keep your drive fast/clean, but it slows down file deletion quite a bit13:26
Cimixnox, there's also another bug13:26
Cimixnox, it removes separators13:27
Cimifrom the menu13:27
xnoxright, the bogus *v* got later reverted.13:28
xnoxCimi: horizontal separators that is?13:28
pittiwhat's wrong with horizontal menu separators?13:29
pitti(I have them in saucy/trusty)13:29
Cimixnox, yes13:29
Cimipitti, ambiance13:29
pittioh, that's the wrong^Wdark theme, right?13:30
Cimiif it's possible, I'd like to be asked to review all branches we get13:30
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CimiI know it's my fault I let this one, and many others, pass...13:30
CimiI worked on unity8 and thought nothing was touched on light-themes13:31
xnoxCimi: right, so stuff from #1181661 should be reverted as it "blackens" _all_ menuitem separators, not just the vertical ones in inline toolbars.13:31
knoctepitti: ambiance is the default theme13:31
xnoxCimi: i'll make a merge proposal and ask you to review.13:31
Cimixnox, thanks13:31
Cimixnox, the bug should be fixed differently13:32
Cimixnox, adding a css rule for menuitems in toolbars13:32
xnoxCimi: light-themes still have bugs and still need maintenance though to matches changes in gtk+ et.al. =/ e.g.13:32
Cimixnox, which is bad13:32
xnoxCimi: yeap, i'm got that now.13:32
Cimixnox, because gtk should not break13:32
Cimibut apparently gtk doesn't care of that13:33
xnoxCimi: gtk is also "fixing bugs" =/13:33
xnoxi know. that's why i can't wait to ditch gtk =)13:33
Cimievery new gtk release something related to theming changes13:33
Cimiit's ridiculous13:33
xnoxalso https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-themes/+bug/1053986 has been "fixed" by patching Adwaita to generate buttons the right way around. And i don't think i've managed to distill those Adwaita patches back for lighting-themes.13:34
ubottuUbuntu bug 1053986 in ubuntu-themes (Ubuntu) "GtkMenuToolButton looks odd with inline toolbar style" [High,Triaged]13:34
seb128speaking of annoying bug13:34
ubottuUbuntu bug 1018718 in ubuntu-themes (Ubuntu) "columns width redrawn by multiple events" [Low,Triaged]13:35
seb128Cimi, ^ could you look at that one, one of the recent comment explain the issue13:35
seb128with our theme the columns change size on focus in/out13:35
seb128easy to reproduce, go to e.g /etc with nautilus in list view mode13:36
seb128and focus/unfocus nautilus13:36
seb128the name column jump around while doing that13:36
rbasakpitti: right, and AIUI if you do it less often, there shouldn't be any perf degradation unless you actually run out of free blocks, which is unlikely in a week of churn on a normal system.13:37
pittirbasak: exactly13:37
pittirbasak: and then it's running async in the bg instead of blocking your UI13:38
pittirbasak: so we mainly need to define sensible conditions when to run it13:38
rbasakpitti: going from the SuSE pages, I'd go with 1) when power conditions are good (eg. 100% battery and on charge) and 2) if it hasn't been run in a week13:39
pittirbasak: mind to add that to the whiteboard of https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/core-1311-ssd-trimming ?13:41
pittiit's good to collect this kind of links and experiences13:41
rbasakpitti: done13:48
pittirbasak: cheers13:59
hallyn_arti-tczew is gone, but in case he checks the online logs, the changes are still needed in precise since the libsystemd-daemon-dev pkg does not exist there.14:25
hallyn_oh, hm14:25
hallyn_i mis-spelled :)14:25
hallyn_ari-tczew: syslog-ng change is needed in precise and quantal.  in raring, libsystemd-daemon-dev is present so the changes can be undone.14:26
=== greyback is now known as greyback|away
ari-tczewhallyn_: ok, so I'm going to sync it in trusty. thank you very much for help!14:55
hallyn_ari-tczew: awesome, thanks14:56
=== corvolino is now known as corvolino[AFK]
gQuigshi there, can I get this meeting scheduled?  http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1311/meeting/22016/limiting-surveillance/15:11
dholbachcjwatson, xnox: thanks a bunch!15:14
=== greyback|away is now known as greyback
evseb128: sometimes the counters over/under count for the front page. The canonical count should be the number of reports you see on the problem page itself.16:44
arun_guys, is the glibc responsible for the language option ??16:44
ev(counters in Cassandra are not idempotent)16:45
seb128ev, what does it mean if the report is way off the frontpage index?16:45
evMoving to Acunu Analytics for the front page counts will fix this16:45
seb128ev, does it mean we can't trust the bucket/trend since it's loosing/not collecting most of the issues?16:45
evthis happens rarely, I don't think it means we cannot trust the data16:45
evit's also something we can repair16:45
seb128well, it makes difficult to trust the datas16:46
evsince we just need to count the number of columns in the Bucket Column Family (each column is an instance of the problem)16:46
seb128since I don't know if we drop is because we fixed the bug16:46
seb128or because we are failing to collect the reports under the bucket16:46
evseb128: the bucket page itself should give you the confidence that you fixed the bug16:47
seb128well, the number goes down there16:47
evbecause it's not appearing in high numbers on the newly released version16:47
seb128but the summary page disagrees with that16:47
seb128so what is creating the delta?16:47
ev^ bdmurray would you mind looking into this on your next Errors day?16:47
seb128ev, bdmurray: thanks16:48
bdmurrayev: looking into the bucket count being different on the index page compared to the bucket page?16:49
evbdmurray: yeah, ensuring that seb128 has something he can look at as the canonical source for knowing whether a problem still exists in new versions16:52
evand then why we're seeing discrepancies in the counters in the example he raises - though this one might be best fixed by bringing up Acunu Analytics if it's a problem with the counters themselves16:53
evI suspect it'll be easier now that we have the read-only access :)16:53
evyou can just dig at the problemid in the database16:54
evand see what the real count should be16:54
bdmurrayseb128: do you have an example?16:55
evbdmurray:  there's one in the asana task I just created16:57
pittibrainwash: hey, how are you? would you have some time to test systemd-shim 4 in my PPA? in theory that should work better than the fixed 10 min timeout17:01
pittibrainwash: I'm now also able to reproduce that bug, with the instructions I put into the bug17:02
arun_guys, is the glibc responsible for the language option ??17:02
seb128bdmurray, http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/11/13/%23ubuntu-devel.html#t11:3617:05
brainwashpitti: sure, I can test the new package, but it will take some time until I'm able to report back. my system goes into sleep mode much faster at the momment, because I changed my gpu setup17:12
pittibrainwash: ah, "it doesn't regress" is also worthwhile; but suspend/resume is also way below 1 s for me, I can only reproduce it with the 00break pm-utils script17:12
brainwashpitti: did you test with an artificial delay of 30 or more seconds?17:15
pittibrainwash: no, so far just with 1517:16
pitti30 seconds to suspend? wow, that sounds really broken17:16
brainwashpitti: in this case the dbus connection did timeout, but the prepareforsleep flag got reset17:17
brainwashhibernation probably17:18
pittibrainwash: ah, that would be a different spot in the code, though17:19
pittibut that would explain why some people still see this happening17:19
brainwashpitti: I guess we need to wait for the new test results17:21
brainwashoh wait, the latest comment does not look promising =S17:22
pittibrainwash: well, neither did the first one after the first version :)17:22
pittiso here's hope17:22
seb128jodh, slangasek, xnox, stgraber: hey upstart friends ... "sudo restart networking" seems to take the system dbus bus down, is that a known issue? how would you go about debugging that? (as you can image it makes things really unhappy, including upstart)17:55
seb128jcastro, ^ (that's looking at the email you sent me)17:56
stgraberseb128: not really a known issue, it's a known consequence17:56
cjwatsonI thought "restart networking" was a "you get to keep both pieces" kind of thing17:56
xnoxseb128: is "sudo restart networking" at all supported?17:56
cjwatsonWhy is anything doing that?17:56
stgraberseb128: dbus is stop on deconfiguring-networking which is emitted by networking when going down, so that's indeed to be expected17:57
stgraberseb128: you probably want: ifdown -a --exclude=lo && ifup -a --exclude=lo17:57
stgraberthough even that one isn't necessarily a good idea on systems that require event based network bring up (systems with complex bridges, bonds, ...)17:58
ogra_couldnt we split networking and loopback-networking ?17:58
ogra_in two separate jobs17:58
xnoxogra_: we already do. networking is a dummy job, and you have network-interface* job instance per interface.17:59
xnoxogra_: look at $ sudo initctl list17:59
seb128stgraber, xnox, cjwatson: I don't know why people to restart networking, but they do17:59
ubottuUbuntu bug 1072518 in gnome-settings-daemon (Ubuntu) "Restarting network crashes (apparently) the desktop manager" [High,Confirmed]17:59
seb128jcastro, ^ do you know why user do network restart?17:59
ogra_xnox, then dbus should probably depends on the loopback one18:00
seb128why do we ever need to stop dbus?18:00
stgraberogra_: we could but that still wouldn't solve the other half of the problem (virtual interfaces ordering), so we'd just trade one bug for another. I think the real problem here is people recommending to use restart networking at all18:00
seb128that should go away on shutdown with the system18:00
xnoxseb128: at shutdown for example =)18:00
seb128do we need to stop it cleanly?18:00
seb128rather than just going down?18:00
stgraberseb128: apparently this was made so dbus would be stopped before the loopback interface actually goes away. I'm not sure there was a reason to do that though (like dbus crashing if the loopback interface disappears under its feet)18:01
arun_guys, is the glibc responsible for the language option ??18:02
stgraberif we had such a thing as a restart statement in upstart, I think it'd be reasonable to skip emitting that signal and have ifup/ifdown run with --exclude=lo, but since we don't, I think our best option is to make sure people don't do things we don't support18:02
seb128stgraber, in any case it's not a g-s-d issue, where do you suggest reassigning?18:02
stgraberseb128: to whatever documentation told the user to do that. Or mark it invalid as an unsupported user action.18:03
seb128stgraber, well, why do we provide a "networking restart" if that's not supported? can't we just make that display a big warning with a type "yes I'm sure"?18:03
stgraberseb128: because it's not possible not to provide it18:03
cjwatsonRight, we don't deliberately provide it, it's an emergent consequence18:03
stgraberseb128: "restart networking" is just a standard upstart command18:03
seb128well, can we make the "networking" job to not do what it's asked18:04
seb128or ask for confirmation?18:04
stgraberupstart jobs can't interact with the console18:04
cjwatsonThe only way to do that would be to break "stop networking", which would break shutdown18:05
seb128can we fix the web to stop suggesting stupid commands to users? ;-)18:05
stgraberwe sure can try ;)18:05
cjwatsonrestart is just stop then start as far as the job is concerned18:05
xnoxstgraber: cjwatson: well, we can do a pre-stop script, that will check upstart events. If there is none, it means user invoked it directly. And we can bail out. And we can check goal, if goal is to restart, we can again do nothing.18:05
xnoxor indeed execute ifdown / ifup sequences.18:06
cjwatsonthat's true, although there's no such thing as a restart goal18:06
cjwatsonthe goal is set to stop and then to start18:06
stgraberand I'd rather not break "stop networking" since it's at least used in testing (by people who know what's going to happen when they do so)18:06
seb128stgraber, how is that ever useful for testing?18:07
seb128I don't want to screw my system, but I tried a bit earlier it took dbus's system bus down18:08
gQuigswe specifically need a way to restart networking for enterprises, it's part of how to set up bonded interfaces in the server guide18:08
seb128which made upstart enable to work properly18:08
cjwatsonupstart uses a private connection, surely18:08
seb128e.g I couldn't even use "status"18:09
slangasekseb128: argh don't manually stop networking (i.e., what everyone else said)18:09
stgraberseb128: it's useful when I test a new ifupdown as my test systems are simple containers that don't have anything to bring up/down when networking restarts18:09
stgraberseb128: that lets me make sure all the network-interface instances get properly created/destroy and that all the events are emitted as expected18:09
slangasekseb128: you should have been able to run 'status' still as root18:10
gQuigsit's currently completely broken in 12.04;  there is a private escalation for it18:10
stgraberif the server guide recommends restarting networking, then it's wrong and needs to be fixed18:10
cjwatsonstatus> won't work as a user if dbus is stopped, but should still work as root or with --system18:10
cjwatsoner, I may not mean --system18:11
stgraberright, upstart as root always uses the private socket and doesn't depend on dbus at all18:11
seb128cjwatson, I might have forgotten the sudo18:11
slangasekcjwatson: AFAIK not with system because upstart only accepts connections from root on the private bus18:11
stgraberseb128: I posted a comment on that askubuntu question, maybe jcastro can make sure it's more visible and that the current "good" answer is marked as being wrong somehow.18:11
cjwatsonyeah, that was a brainfart18:11
slangasekgQuigs: can you give us a specific reference into the server guide?  the server guide should be fixed18:11
seb128cjwatson, thanks ;-)18:11
cjwatsonbut it should be fine with sudo, anyway18:11
seb128google return lot of "/etc/init.d/networking restart" from the old times18:11
slangasekwe can file off some of the sharp points here, but fundamentally, "networking restart" was /never/ the correct interface18:12
gQuigsslangasek: I detail it here: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-advantage/+bug/1210277  we through users for a loop and don't actually have a way that works...18:12
ubottuError: ubuntu bug 1210277 not found18:12
seb128it's just that it bites users really since it takes the desktop fully down18:12
jcastroseb128, I don't know why people do it, they apparently do it enough to bother people18:13
jcastrostgraber, can you link me to the AU question with the wrong info? we can fix that.18:13
stgraberjcastro: http://askubuntu.com/questions/98201/whats-the-right-way-to-restart-services-in-11-1018:13
gQuigsslangasek: https://help.ubuntu.com/12.04/serverguide/network-configuration.html and in https://help.ubuntu.com/13.10/serverguide/network-configuration.html18:13
stgraberhmm, that last one should just be "ifup br0"...18:14
cjwatsonyeah, trying to restart the entire networking stack seems like an unnecessarily gigantic hammer there18:15
jcastrostgraber, ok so that's a duplicate, I can have the answer removed18:15
jcastrobut we need the proper way someplace on: http://askubuntu.com/questions/19320/what-is-the-recommended-way-to-enable-disable-services18:15
ogra_but its a very common answer in debian and ubuntu forums18:15
ogra_as wrong as it is, it is very wide spread18:16
jcastroI think the issue is people don't expect their desktop to stop working when you restart networking18:16
stgraberjcastro: look at my comment on the link I gave you, that should cover what people should be doing18:16
slangasekenable/disable services> that seems unrelated to restarting the networking stack18:16
xnoxarges: ^^^^^^^ (Re: networking, one shouldn't do "restart networking", instead one should ifdown/ifup individual interfaces as needed)18:16
stgraberwell, also, "restart networking" won't actually restart anything on a desktop, it'll just break your machine :)18:16
stgraber"restart network-manager" would be vaguely more correct :)18:17
xnoxstokachu: ^^^^^^18:17
jcastrohere we go18:18
jcastrook so I added a link from the main "services" question, and I've flagged all the incorrect answers18:20
jcastroso they will be removed shortly18:20
gQuigsin any case; we do have enterprise customers that want to restart all of networking to updating multiple bonded configurations at once18:20
gQuigsthey can also use out of band management, so it does actually make sense to restart networking and not the entire machine18:21
jcastroalso there's plenty of old people like me who just grew up with "/etc/init.d/networking restart" as the hammer for everything network related18:21
seb128yeah, same here, I used to use that before the n-m times18:23
gQuigschaining ifupdowns for 8 physical interfaces and several bonded interfaces is not usable18:24
xnoxstgraber: stop --all-instances job (or just stop --all job)18:25
xnox(which doesn't exist at the moment)18:25
stgraberxnox: sure but I usually want to make sure that they all stop on the expected events, remember, I'm testing ifupdown, not upstart ;)18:26
argesxnox: yup that was my understanding. I think the only thing is we should probably fix the 'stop: Unknown instance' not defined in precise.18:26
argesanyway half at lunch need to read the backlog...18:27
xnoxarges: that can be done. But i'm not sure if we have any ways to notify user though.18:27
xnoxarges: start with seb128 at 5 minutes to.18:28
stgraberslangasek: I sent a MP to the serverguide, replacing the two instances of restart networking by the proper ifup/ifdown command18:28
slangasekstgraber: cheers18:29
stgrabergQuigs: in such case, you probably want: "ifdown --exclude=lo --exclude=... -a && ifup -a" where you list all interfaces that aren't affected (such as monitoring interfaces, ...) as excludes, then you bring the rest down and everything back up18:30
stgraberthough note that bonds specifically rely on the event based bring up, so this will only work if you /etc/network/interfaces has been written in the right order, if you didn't, it'll deadlock18:30
stgraber(ifupdown itself is sequential, that's why we try never to use the -a option as it'll just hang if any dependency isn't there)18:31
gQuigsstgraber: so how do I bring a bond up?? or reconfigure it?18:31
stgraberifdown bond0 && ifup bond018:32
argesstgraber: on a side note: bug 1065077 affects p/q and I'll be SRUing that. using ifup/ifdown on bonded interfaces take 1.5m before that patch and 5s after18:32
ubottubug 1065077 in ifenslave-2.6 (Ubuntu Quantal) "Ifenslave pre-up doesn't wait for slaves when usr is a seperate partition" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/106507718:32
argeswhich causes some reboots to have the 'waiting for network configuration' upon boot18:32
stgraberarges: yeah, I saw that, thanks18:32
jcastrostgraber, seb128: ok I've corrected nearly all the mentions of restarting networking on AU, here's the only one I am unsure about: http://askubuntu.com/questions/347687/how-can-i-enable-and-keep-wifi-without-restart-networking-service-in-ubuntu-serv18:34
jcastro`ifdown --exclude=lo -a && ifup --exclude=lo -a` <-- nobody is ever going to remember that btw18:35
slangasekhonestly, it can probably just be 'ifdown -a && ifup -a'18:36
slangasekstgraber: is there a specific reason to worry about lo?18:36
argesis there a risk of loopback is brought up/down18:37
gQuigshow is that better than just making that be what restart does?18:37
stgraberI think newer ifupdown won't ever touch lo even if you tell it to (it even no longer needs to be in /e/n/i) but on older version, -a may bring lo down18:37
stgrabergQuigs: because as we said above, there's no such thing as "restart" in upstart, we can't make restart do something different than stop+start18:38
slangasekjcastro: the problem statement on http://askubuntu.com/questions/347687/how-can-i-enable-and-keep-wifi-without-restart-networking-service-in-ubuntu-serv implies he has some serious misconfiguration going on, I wouldn't hazard an answer without a clearer problem description18:38
stgraberslangasek: the recommendation for that --exclude is that at least dbus seems to be specifically designed to shutdown before lo goes away, so I suspect it does something bad if lo just vanishes18:38
argesstgraber: what usecase is there for doing 'service networking restart' ?18:39
stgraberarges: none18:39
argesor is there none ?18:39
slangasekstgraber: no, dbus is 'stop on deconfiguring-networking' because that's the /latest/ we can shut dbus down18:40
slangaseknot because taking out lo will break it18:40
slangasekanyway, /etc/init/networking.conf doesn't take down lo at all, not sure why that is18:40
gQuigsstgraber: umm.. so?  I'm happy with restart = stop + start... in fact isn't that the definition?18:41
jcastrostgraber, ok, so I searched the site for networking restarting and all the answers now point to that question, so we should be set pending some flags getting actioned by the community18:41
seb128slangasek, why do we need to stop dbus?18:41
mdeslaurtjaalton: what's mod_revocator, and is the ubuntu change to nss still necessary?18:41
slangasekseb128: because that's the trigger for other services like network-manager being stopped18:42
stgraberslangasek: ok, then ifdown -a && ifup -a may be safe. I guess the other reason is to keep "something" around so that we don't get weird behavior from software binding to :: suddenly noticing that there's really nothing to bind at all18:42
seb128hum, k18:43
slangasekstgraber: well, but so what? :)  things trying to bind while you're in the process of making administrative network changes are undefined18:43
slangasekseb128: if you think we should keep dbus running and stop the individual services instead, it's possible we could do that, but someone would need to double-check that dbus wouldn't hold any files open under /usr or /var18:44
stgraberslangasek: anyway, the way ifup/ifdown work nowadays, -a is indeed "safe" for both as lo is now special cased in ifupdown, so I guess telling people to do ifdown -a && ifup -a is fine18:44
slangasek(so that we can cleanly unmount)18:44
stgraber(with the usual warning about event based bring up and the fact that if their /e/n/i isn't properly ordered, it'll just hang there)18:45
slangasekstgraber: I don't believe there was ever a reason that it was unsafe even when it did handle lo18:45
slangasekif you think there is one, let's figure out, concretely, what it is :)18:45
seb128slangasek, I've no strong opinion, dbus is a core component and it feels like that's not something we would need to take down "that easily"18:45
arun_adam_g: are u the maintainer of glibc for Ubuntu?18:46
slangasekseb128: it's not "easily", it's only supposed to be stopped at shutdown, because *networking* is only supposed to be stopped at shutdown18:46
sarnoldarges: I've done 'sudo restart networking' before when network-mangler was Very Unhappy and I wanted a quick way to kill it and force my network configuration to happen completely fresh. I got that chance when I had to reboot. :/ I was very unhappy.18:47
seb128slangasek, well, reality is that user memory/internet/old habits makes that command to be run more that it should ... and it's hard to fix the internet/old habits18:47
argesstgraber: so the upstart networking script is just used/useful during boot and shutdown then?18:47
slangasekseb128: and if we need to make it possible to keep dbus alive in spite of misuse of /etc/init/networking.conf, we can do that; let's not conflate that with the shutdown problem18:47
seb128slangasek, you are right18:47
ogra_dont we have something like "stop on stopping filesystem" ?18:47
ogra_that dbus could use instead18:47
slangaseknor should there be one18:48
stgraberslangasek: well, I just tried on my laptop for fun, no service appear to have crashed, however for whatever reason wpa_supplicant or NM became deeply unhappy and I lost my wifi connection. Had to re-initialize it entirely after lo came back up.18:48
slangasekstgraber: interesting18:48
ogra_slangasek, well, it swwms likw a workaround to make dbus depend on networking while we need it stopped for unmounting18:48
stgraberogra_: I think the reason was because of network filesystems on desktop machines18:49
stgraberogra_: basically for those you need NM to be running, for NM to run, you need dbus18:49
slangasekit's 'stop on deconfiguring-networking' -> dbus -> N-M18:50
ogra_yeah, understood18:50
ogra_slangaseks statement above sounded like it would only be filesystem related18:50
slangasekseb128: incidentally, dbus shows open FDs for /var/run/[...]; those should be fixed to reference /run instead18:51
stgraberit's, we want NM to go away very late to avoid hanging on network filesystems but we also need NM to really go away instead of keep on running till the end as it has a bunch of files opened which prevent the remount of /18:51
slangasek(not sure if following the /var/run symlink would hold /var open)18:51
seb128stgraber, I'm surprised that NM copes well with the system bus going down18:51
slangasekit doesn't18:52
ogra_hmm, intresting ... so i upgrade my new XPS13 to 12.10 and update-mananger asks me if i want to replace /etc/init.d/casper ...18:52
stgraberseb128: it doesn't18:52
stgraberseb128: when we stop dbus, NM goes away, that's why we're shutting down dbus so late so we can keep NM around till as late as possible18:52
ogra_i wasnt aware casper ever had a sysvinit script18:52
seb128I see18:52
stgraberogra_: well, I guess the question mostly is, why is casper installed on your system? :)18:53
ogra_stgraber, ask dell ... the device runs only as long as i needed to have u-m do the upgrade and to install xchat18:53
ogra_like 1.5h or so18:53
ogra_i havent installed any SW except xchat yet18:54
ogra_(or removed)18:54
xnoxogra_: do you have "dell-recovery" installed? or oem-config?18:54
ogra_xnox, i think oemßconfig uninstalled itself, but yeah, dell-recovery is indeed there18:54
* ogra_ allows it to replace ... 18:55
ogra_i still have more upgrades to do tonight ...18:56
tjaaltonmdeslaur: an apache module needed by dogtag pki, although neither of those have made it to debian/ubuntu yet..18:56
ogra_it repopulated the launcher with all the default crap :(18:57
mdeslaurtjaalton: is it worth me still merging those changes? I'll do what you think is best18:57
* ogra_ reboots 18:58
tjaaltonmdeslaur: hmm looks like dogtag 10 doesn't need it anymore, I'll double check to be sure18:58
tjaaltonmdeslaur: nah it still does, but maybe best to get that from debian along with the other pending changes I need.. so feel free to drop the diff19:04
mdeslaurtjaalton: cool, thanks for checking19:04
mdeslaurinfinity: hi! libimobiledevice has an ICE on arm64...do I mash retry or do you still push it on a specific builder?19:59
xnoxmdeslaur: mash retry until it hits b*20:02
mdeslaurxnox: thank20:02
argesstgraber: hi.20:22
argesin bug 1065077 you changed (seq 600) to a while loop that only counts to 50. is this a typo or deliberate?20:23
ubottubug 1065077 in ifenslave-2.6 (Ubuntu Quantal) "Ifenslave pre-up doesn't wait for slaves when usr is a seperate partition" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/106507720:23
=== salem_ is now known as _salem
stgraberarges: good catch. typo. I'll upload ifenslave-2.6 with a 60s timeout to trusty20:37
argesstgraber: before you do, I'd like to discuss the further implications of it20:37
argesstgraber: so we're seeing a bug where bringing a bonded interface using ' sudo service network-interface start INTERFACE=bond0' takes most of the timeout (60s) and obviously with this shortened timeout it doesn't delay as quickly20:38
argesstgraber: this bug causes issues when booting with bonds where we are more likely to hit the 'waiting on networking' message during boot20:39
stgraberwell, that message in itself isn't a problem20:39
stgraberso long as the network is up by the time the 3min timeout hits (otherwise services may start before the networking is ready)20:40
argesso why does it take such a long time to bring up bonded interfaces?20:40
stgraberit doesn't take time to bring them up, but it can take a lot of time for the kernel to detect them20:40
stgraberI've seen bug reports of some systems where it'd take minutes for the kernel and udev to be done processing all the interfaces20:40
stgraberonce the interface is ready to be bonded, ifenslave and ifupdown need less than a second to configure it20:41
argesstgraber: so in the ifenslave pre-up script there are two waits... one for the bonding module which is 5s and the other is for the slave interfaces to join the master20:41
argesdoes the later wait make sense to be 60s?20:42
argesstgraber: anyway. if it makes sense for the delay to be 60s, then the SRUs for P/Q i'll make sure are 60s, are you going to push a fix for R/S as well? or should i take care of that20:43
stgraberarges: I'm just pushing to trusty, the actual waiting time is completely arbitrary so 50s vs 60s isn't really going to make a huge difference :)20:44
argeswell in this case it is 5s vs 60s20:44
stgraberoh indeed it's... yeah, that may fix some bugs ;)20:45
stgrabernot that I actually saw any report that could be tracked down to that20:45
stgraberit'll also make things worse for someone who would configure a bond but not any member (or make a typo in the bridge name) as it'll now take longer before ifupdown gives up (though that'll at least match what ifupdown prints)20:46
argesstgraber: yea if 5s works for people, then why the long delay in the first place?20:47
stgraberbecause of those few weird systems where it can take minutes for hardware to be done initializing20:48
stgraber(blade systems with dozen of network cards is one known case)20:48
argesstgraber: it takes long times for bonding to get set up for me even in virtual machines20:49
argesso i run into the 'waiting on network configruation' pretty often with basic bonded setups20:49
stgraberarges: hmm, that's odd, can you pastebin your /etc/network/interfaces ?20:49
argesstgraber: yea booting up the vm right  now...20:50
argesso this is the original bug i was looking at, then i essentially found that raring fixed it, and found this bug... then as I was formatting the debdiff for the SRU i noticed the descrepancy20:50
stgraberyeah, looks like I copy/pasted the first loop without bumping the wait time20:51
argesstgraber: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/6412656/ this is the bare-bones interfaces file i was using to reproduce20:53
argesnote that it reproduces intermittently (at least on kvm) for me.21:04
argesanyway, i can file another bug for this one. For now how should I fix bug 1065077?21:04
ubottubug 1065077 in ifenslave-2.6 (Ubuntu Quantal) "Ifenslave pre-up doesn't wait for slaves when usr is a seperate partition" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/106507721:04
stgraberarges: wow, that config is pretty wrong ;)21:06
stgraberarges: try that one instead: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6412714/21:07
argesstgraber: why wouldn't the bond-slaves contain eth0?21:08
stgraberbasic changes are, ordering (so that ifup -a would work), emptying bond-slaves as it's meaningless on Ubuntu, moving IP configuration from the slave up to the bond as otherwise you're in undefined behavior21:08
stgraberbecause we're doing event based networking on Ubuntu, we can't guarantee all the slaves will be present at the time you try to bring up the master, so that's why ifenslave ignores bond-slaves and instead has the master wait for a slave to appear, the slave -> master relation being done through bond-master on the slave21:09
stgraberthat's also why slaves should always be listed before the master in the config21:09
stgraberso that ifup -a will bring up a slave which will in turn bring up the master, doing it the other way around will give you the 60s timeout21:10
argesstgraber: so the interfaces file is followed sequentially?21:10
stgraberwhen calling ifup -a, yes21:10
argeswhich is called by the upstart scripts21:10
stgraberwhen booting Ubuntu, interfaces are brought up independently when receiving kernel events21:11
stgraberso if your interfaces file ordering is wrong, it'll likely still work at boot time so long as udev emits net-device-added21:11
stgraberbut if it hits the fallback (networking.conf), then it'll hang21:11
stgraber(networking.conf works as a fallback in the boot sequence, calling ifup -a to bring up anything that wasn't brought up through events)21:12
argesstgraber: ok more complex example here: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6412731/21:12
argeswith what i think it should be after my review and your comments21:12
stgraberhmm, I'm not sure the mtu stanza is allowed on manual interfaces, if it's not, then you'll need to use a pre-up instead21:13
stgraberbut the ordering is indeed correct. I'm also not sure whether anything expect bond-slaves to be set, if so, you'll have to set it to none21:14
argesstgraber: ok i'll test with that.  Is the interface ordering for /etc/networking/interface documented somewhere?21:14
argesstgraber: nm man 5 interfaces, shows ifup brings the named interffaces up in the order listed21:15
argesstgraber: thanks for your help!21:16
stgraberright. I don't think it's actually written anywhere that ifup isn't doing parallel bring up but it can be assumed21:16
stgraberarges: also, the examples in the ifenslave-2.6 packages should be correct21:16
stgraberarges: https://www.stgraber.org/2012/01/04/networking-in-ubuntu-12-04-lts/ may also be ueful21:16
argescool thanks21:17
orbisvicishow do I find out which version of ubuntu a particular versioned package belonged to?21:32
slangasekorbisvicis: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/$package (for example)21:35
orbisvicisi need to go further back than supported releases21:57
orbisvicisis there an index in a repository (http://old-releases.ubuntu.com) that could help?21:57
tarpmanorbisvicis: the21:58
* tarpman sigh21:58
tarpmanorbisvicis: the "View full publishing history" link on the package page should have the complete history21:59
tarpmanorbisvicis: or, if you're wondering about a particular version, you can go straight to https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/$package/$version and it has a publishing summary21:59
orbisvicistarpman: perfect, thank you22:00
orbisvicis(I was wondering about a particular version)22:00
slangasekor, if you have that version of the package available, you can just look at the top of the changelog included in the package22:00
=== doko_ is now known as doko
dokozul: simplejson should not build for pypy (universe). at least barry did that for beautilsoup422:09
dokojamespage, there are some java sources ready for demotion. were these intended? http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/component-mismatches-proposed.txt22:24
zuldoko:  ack22:25
dokowell, barry didn't do it yet for bs4 :-/22:25
bdmurrayslangasek: regarding the already installed and configured bugs I've seen some cases like bug 1250951 where one package operation crashes and then the next one runs into the already installed and configured error22:29
ubottubug 1250951 in dpkg (Ubuntu) "package linux-image-generic failed to install/upgrade: package linux-image-generic is already installed and configured" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/125095122:29
slangasekbdmurray: right, historically this kind of problem only shows up if something goes wrong with an earlier package operation22:30
slangasekbut something is sending the wrong request to dpkg in these scenarios... and it's not apt22:30
bdmurrayin the log files all we have is "Commandline: aptdaemon role='role-commit-packages' sender=':1.73'" which doesn't specify a version of aptdaemon22:32
bdmurrayslangasek: Do you think gathering information about the aptdaemon version would help or is there something else we would need?22:47
slangasekbdmurray: I think that's the place to start22:48
slangasekxnox: hmm, "not booting flipped"?23:12
slangasekxnox: N7> AUUUUGH NOO :)23:12
xnoxslangasek: yes, i'm booting a tarball from system-image.ubuntu.com not from cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-touch/)23:13
slangasekxnox: the N7 is absolutely not the template for android partitioning23:13
xnoxslangasek: sure, but i don't want to brick my N4 =)23:13
slangasekthe N7 is the device we can't get rid of the loop mount on, because it has broken firmware that causes its GPT to be broken in three different ways23:13
xnoxslangasek: what's wrong with N7? N4 partitions are semi ok.23:13
slangasekall of which are N7-specific23:13
xnoxslangasek: ok.23:14
xnoxslangasek: and N4 GPT? any better?23:14
xnoxslangasek: so I call cdimage.u.c/ubuntu-touch-preview/ - unflipped, /ubuntu-touch/ - flipped, system-image.u.c - systemimage23:14
slangasekxnox: the N4 GPT should be fine23:14
slangasekxnox: right - and 'flipped' should be the current baseline23:15
xnoxin flipped, indeed android's system partition is mounted direct from the system one.23:15
slangasekbut the difference between flipped and unflipped is whether Android is in a container, or Ubuntu is23:15
xnoxslangasek: i don't think so. given that (a) system-image is easier to boot and port to new devices. (*) as long as one touches /userdata/.writable_image ;-)23:16
xnoxand system-image is better tested model =) and boots more reliably.23:16
slangasekoh, so you mean system-image rather than flipped23:16
slangasekyeah, that's what I mean by 'flipped should be the current baseline' - because calling it "flipped" implies the question, "flipped wrt what" :)23:17
xnoxcurrently it was agreed that emulator should look more like system-image. And it does mimic it rather well, the final booted state. There is no way to actually apply delta updates.23:17
xnoxslangasek: ok. so it is flipped+optionally-ro23:17
* ogra_ still disagrees with that decision 23:19
ogra_(going for system-image immediately)23:20
xnoxogra_: (a) final phones will be system-image (b) will-not have android sized partitions (c) we need to get there somehow23:22
xnoxogra_: what do you think about bypassing CM and rebasing on top of kitkat/AOSP ?23:22
ogra_right, but we dont help porters with that23:22
ogra_i wish we had gone the same way we had to go for our phones and which porters have to go as well23:23
slangasekwe're not doing all this work on the emulator to help porters23:23
xnoxogra_: phonedations can help porters ;-)23:23
xnoxif there is any spare time23:23
ogra_not really anymore ... i have not the slightest clue about the current probs that show up when porting23:23
xnoxogra_: i'll just post how to start a port direct from system-image, how about that?23:24
ogra_going the same path would have helped23:24
ogra_and we could have updated the docs alongside23:24
slangasekno, going the same path would have just slowed us down23:24
ogra_anyway, its to late now23:24
ogra_we're simply leaving the community behind23:24
ogra_(none of the ports is even near to functional, we gave up on them and they gave up on us)23:25
ogra_i wish we had sent a sign to them with the emulator work (and updated the porting docs)23:26
=== freeflying is now known as freeflying_away
xnoxwell emulator is not functional yet - it doesn't read kernel/initramfs of the hard-drive, nor has unity painting anything on the screen.23:30
slangasekany minute now :)23:31
ogra_rsalveti rocks ... only minor details left :)23:31
=== freeflying_away is now known as freeflying
barrydoko: i might get to it tomorrow23:55

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